# anti-therapy?



## ultrayellow (Sep 8, 2007)

After browsing around all the CBT experiences i'm just curious and feeling a bit baa baa black sheep.

Has nobody ever had a problem wherin therapy didn't work seemingly because (ironically?) it involves getting a little too one-on-one personal with another human?! I.e. that the therapy itself causes massive amounts of social anxiety because it is so ridiculously and socially intrusive?

I have had therapy and studied therapy after I found that even a variety of therapists resulted in the same consequence: For about a month after I have not physically been able to force myself to to therapy anymore (vomiting, stress illnesses or panic attacks upon attempting travel) I will invariably spend my time digging my way out of the tremendously WORSE hole of social anxiety that the therapy has lent me a shovel for.

The title of this post is a little aggressive maybe. I am not "anti-therapy". It just doesn't seem to work out for me.

What are you supposed to do then?!

Tiny note: I have a whole bunch of coping mechanisms, healthy and not so, to help me answer the above question, so it's less like an Advice Sort Of Thing and more of a Talk About You Please I Really Want To Hear What Other People Have To Think On This.


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## daaaaave (Jan 1, 2007)

Well I only went to my first therapy session yesterday and it was group therapy which would scare a lot of people and it scared me, but I think it will work. I didn't say much in the session, but I said a few things. The surprising thing is that it is not the social anxiety that kept me kinda quiet, but it was more like a huge emotional experience cause I was recalling all the **** I have been through and talking about how I feel for maybe the first time ever. I was teary-eyed basically the whole time. Of course I was embarassed to be that way, but I still want to go through with it. I'm willing to put myself through that temporary pain if I think it's beneficial in the long run. I have never vomited or had a panic attack though so I can see how that might be different.


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## arthur56 (Jul 31, 2005)

to ultra, a largish dose of benzos will get you to therapy, you also need to learn and practise new CBT relaxation skills at home
such as deep slow breathing and letting go of excess muscle tension

you can sometimes have a phone consultation with the therapist from home


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

arthur56 said:


> to ultra, a largish dose of benzos will get you to therapy, you also need to learn and practise new CBT relaxation skills at home
> such as deep slow breathing and letting go of excess muscle tension
> 
> you can sometimes have a phone consultation with the therapist from home


Not an attack on you Arthur56, but just because this is something that seems to come up a lot -

CBT IS NOT RELAXATION TECHNIQUES!!

Sometimes CBT therapists will teach it as an *extra bit of help*, or as an aid to using CBT techniques, but CBT is mood diaries, using techniques that challenge and modify thoughts and beliefs, and exposing yourself to situations that produce anxiety.

CBT is NOT breathing, doing 'body scans', imagining yourself in a calming place. That is meditation. If someone is teaching you 'CBT' and it does not include the above mentioned things (ESPECIALLY exposure experiments) - THEN YOU ARE NOT DOING CBT. Its a bit like someone telling you they are performing heart surgery on you, but all they do is give you the anaesthetic and then stop.

Sorry to be pushy but this is a misconception that seems to come up a lot, and its now known there are therapists who claim to 'be CBT' who in fact arent. The 'official' CBT (because it was invented and studied for decades by him and his institute) is laid out by Aaron T Beck at the Beck Institute . If you want to read on what constitutes modern CBT for anxiety, "When Panic Attacks" by David D Burns is very good and authoritative.

Ross


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## tomcoldaba (Jul 1, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> If you want to read on what constitutes modern CBT for anxiety, "When Panic Attacks" by David D Burns is very good and authoritative.
> 
> Ross


 :ditto I have read "When Panic Attacks" several times. David Burns talks about various coping strategies: self disclosure, acceptance, exposure therapy etc.


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## ultrayellow (Sep 8, 2007)

arthur56 said:


> to ultra, a largish dose of benzos will get you to therapy...
> 
> you can sometimes have a phone consultation with the therapist from home


Cheers for the input, guys.

To the above: I'm on the betablockers because my symptoms are a whole bunch of physiological... i've never even thought of benzos hmm.

Phones are not my friends either. =/

I tend to believe that everything is a evolutionary coping mechanism (pain to stop you hurting yourself more, panic attacks to keep you safe etc etc) so it seems like a lot of the time my body is totally out to get me... I just DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY. It's very frustrating. Am I just being weak-minded over here?


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Something I've learned lately is to put all the science and justification for why things are the way they are to one side.

*Hope* is THE single biggest thing that will help you begin to reduce anxiety and depression - not only because it gets you moving, but because belief is massively important to recovery.

Without it - I'm sorry to be bleak - you are screwed.

No one can do it for you. Find somethng to hang your hat on - CBT, meds, freudian therapy, exposure ... WHATEVER. You can be assured that if you spend the rest of your life telling yourself youre hopeless, and finding excellent scientific reasons to remain so, thats where you will remain.

Some people define depression as hopelessness. Finding some hope in SOMETHING - or even just giving something a chance - is one of the biggest steps you can take.

Ross


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## ultrayellow (Sep 8, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah:

Trying to get my head around that concept is suspiciously complicated.

The "science and justification" are my understanding. Before I understood why I couldn't make it down the road without bursting into tears I felt a lot worse about the whole thing. Understanding whys and hows make me feel like I have a whole bunch more control.

Understanding how to theoretically fix what I understand to be wrong (even if there's always the possibility that it's not the whole story i'm understanding: I have the belief and that's the important thing) is my hope. It puts me Somewhere and points me at figurative Somewhere Else and all I have to do is shuffle ways and means of getting there. Right? ... Right. You'd think.

I don't know where I was going with this post! Sorry for pressing 'submit' regardless.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

I can see what you're saying, ultra. I think the process is different for everyone, and people have different needs. I've been down the analysis and the CBT route and found that knowing why was kind of a relief, but I actually needed the CBT to help me make changes in the here and now, cos after all its what you do on a day to basis that keeps the problems going. So analysis was kind of "here's what went wrong and why you feel like you do", and CBT was "here's what to do about it.". As many find, I felt that insight alone wasn't enough to make changes. I wanted it, but when I got it that wasnt the full answer. I needed to do things differently to make it stick, but most importantly you need to do whats right for YOU. Hope and belief are the most powerful weapons you have.

You sound like you have given this a lot of thought, so I hope that you find your way and begin to feel better soon 

Ross


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## Strength (Aug 12, 2006)

Hope and Faith (not the TV show) are the only things you have when you are in the dumps. It is the only thing that gets you moving in the right direction, and combine that with some real world learning experiences, will give you success. Thoughts are very powerful things. I mean, even if you look at a cat-scan of your brain, I'm sure it can physically track down what parts of your brain are being activated by your thoughts.
I know with SA, it makes it such that the real world part is difficult. I remember before even if I was invited to a b-day party, I would feel very uneasy. I really didn't want to go. But if you have a positive attitude and are always willing to learn new things, it's not going to be bad.
It is the fear itself that people fear. There's no real logic behind it, but we're emotional creatures, so we are scared of the fear. The only way I've overcome that fear is by continuouly believing in myself and be willing to keep an open mind. If I'm with someone outgoing and confident, my mind subtlely picks up on what they are doing, and I learn it. It's almost like a toddler learning from observing other people and kind of mimicking their behaviour. The more time you spend with outgoing people, the less anxious it becomes. After awhile, it doesn't become scary anymore getting invited to a get together or anything else.


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