# I have low testosterone levels :( Only 26



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

I just got the results from my doc today from my appointment this morning. She says that I'm in the normal range so I'm "fine". But I noticed that I'm uncomfortably close to the minimum end of that "normal" range and I brought up this concern to her. The normal range is * 7.6-31.4* (or was it *33.4*) mg/L. My reading was *9.8*.

She said that testosterone is highest in the morning and lowest at night (I woke up 7:10 that morning, showered, ate, got ready and then waited 2 hours in the lab in line to get my test. Though it's entirely possible I didn't get enough sleep that night. I remember needing my alarm on my iPhone to wake me up) I told her that I took the blood test around *10:20-10:25 AM*. She says that maybe it would be different first thing in the morning after waking up (I do get morning wood often when I abstain from masturbation for awhile. I got one this morning).

I booked another blood test for next Friday in the evening based on her recommendation. I'll see how that goes. If it dips below 7.6, then I know that I really have a problem physiologically with getting/maintaining an erection. And if it's another normal but below average rating like that, I'll still have to have a discussion with my doctor and weigh my options. I thought it was purely psychological. But honestly there are times where I've wondered if it was physiological. I can be with a beautiful woman in bed and my mind wants sex. But often times nothing is flowing down there or it will but then I'll lose it later.

Being in this situation sucks because my mind wants it all the time (lol). But you can't just will your body to do what your mind wants sometimes. And for whatever reason I find that I almost always gravitate towards women with high sex drives. And I can't stand women who are more reserved when it comes to sex. I'm a certified pervert (but a sweetheart too. I was once called a perverted sweetheart once by a girl. lol) I'm not vanilla at all and I can't stand having nothing but vanilla. But yeah I can't keep up. lol.


----------



## ForeverStallone (Apr 4, 2011)

Definitely not normal for your age. My latest result was 9.3 which puts me below range here - 12-32. This was at about 9 am.

She's right that it might be slightly higher earlier in the morning and in a fasted state. I got 12 a few months ago at 8am fasted. So not much difference.

Here's a link of average levels with age groups
http://www.mens-hormonal-health.com/normal-testosterone-levels.html

Get LH and FSH levels checked too to see if the problem is with your your testes or the brain. And I'd start researching specialists, specifically who deal with TRT, because even most endocrinologists and urologists believe in the BS reference range and won't treat you.

I doubt that it is a purely psychological problem when you have levels of a 90+ year old.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

ForeverStallone said:


> Definitely not normal for your age. My latest result was 9.3 which puts me below range here - 12-32. This was at about 9 am.
> 
> She's right that it might be slightly higher earlier in the morning and in a fasted state. I got 12 a few months ago at 8am fasted. So not much difference.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice.

My doctor was practically sweeping it under the rug. I had to call in and ask when my results would come back and the secretary said "your results were normal so she didn't feel it was necessary to call you to inform you." I thought this was troubling since even if there wasn't a physiological problem, there IS some sort of problem! If an attractive naked woman is giving me oral sex and I'm not getting hard or if I get hard but then lose it during coitus, that's not right. So I asked to book an appointment to see the test results.

And then the doctor has the nerve to tell me my levels were "normal". It wasn't until I pointed out that 9.8 was very low on the acceptability range that she admitted that and suggested that i could take another test in the evening.

I hate it how these doctors are so useless and sweep this problem on the rug. They don't take it seriously with young men. I actually bought generic Cialis off-prescription from an online pharmacy awhile back. And I DID notice a difference but it's not quite the result I was hoping for. I've only tried Cialis twice though. The first time, I got an erection right in the public food court. lol. And then say 8 hours later, I had sex and I got hard but I lost my erection twice mid-coitus (to be honest though, I wasn't really attracted to that one). But I was going at it 15+ mins each time before I lost it. And I think it could have been lack of lubrication on her part since she mentioned being "dry" down there (we were using condoms. That doesn't help. I refuse to go bareback with anyone but a stable girlfriend on birth control though). The girl pointed out that "it was ok" because I lasted long anyway. The second girl (definitely attractive) I tried Cialis with, I took one about an hour before and we used lube and it worked out flawlessly pretty much.

Thing is I bet it would be pretty much impossible for my doc to prescribe me with Cialis or Viagra (I'd prefer Cialis for the 36 hour effect but Viagra is more potent for the 4 or so hours it lasts). I'd have to go through these shady gray market channels again. But the last time I used my credit card with that online pharmacy, my credit card company temporarily shut down my card because they pointed out that it was an insecure type of site. So I need to find one that takes PayPal maybe.

The best thing to do would be to find a specialist (preferaby male I guess?) who actually takes this problem seriously. Testosterone Replacement Therapy with a prescription at a legit local pharmacy is probably more suitable for me than getting generic Cialis from shady online pharmacies.

So yeah I'm going to test my testosterone at night.

Btw at 10:25 AM, I had fasted since 7:10 PM the night before. Fasting is supposed to raise your testosterone levels you say? :afr I got a 9.8 after fasting for 15 hours!

Also ForeverStallone, I know you've had testosterone therapy before. Do you find that it makes sense that a guy can want sex and think about sex a lot mentally but have problems down there? I find that the mental desire is there. But sometimes I'm just dead. I think my testosterone levels fluctuate though. My doctor pointed out that testosterone levels often fluctuate. This morning I had morning wood thinking about sex. Yesterday I had an erection in the morning and later at night thinking about sex. But there are times where I'm just dead down there.

Also since you have a history of taking TRT, should I abstain from masturbation before I take my testosterone test on Friday or should I do a certain amount of times a week or whatever?


----------



## ryobi (Jan 13, 2009)

Why don't you just get a prescription for cialis from your doctor?


----------



## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

I think you are putting way too muxch into this number.
You can produce testosterone and are in the normal range. Would you really want to overproduce?


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

Try taking Tribulus, its a natural testosterone booster. My sex drive went through the roof while i was on it.


----------



## Andre (Feb 27, 2004)

I've tried tribulus, but I don't recommend it. I think it produces too much of the negative type of testosterone. The kind that makes you more angry and irritable.

25 mg a day of DHEA can do wonders, but I am concerned about the long term effects even on that moderate dose.

Do you lift weights? I think squats are the safest and healthiest method of boosting testosterone quickly. I make sure to do squats regularly. It's something you notice immediately after you do them. Regular weightlifting in general will have a big impact on your testosterone level.


----------



## NateDEEzy (Feb 2, 2012)

The problem lies in 2 places.

First, testosterone drops with age, but the range doesn't take this into consideration. Therefore, an 18 yo can have the testosterone level equal to his great grandpa who has testosterone consistent with others his age, and he's 90 years old. Which in itself is absurd. 
Second, testosterone is pretty misunderstood in the medical community, which is obvious based on not only your story, which isn't an uncommon story, but also with the treatment regimens most doctors prescribe. There's a reason why most doctors choose to prescribe androgel and testim, (because they give you a tube and don't have to worry about anything), however, as most people who've researched the subject know, injectables are by far the treatment option with best noted results. But I digress, the second point is testosterone is not well understood. And I predict, just as with many other hormone ranges such as thyroid, the ranges considered "normal" will change as it is better understood. Just because it is considered normal and acceptable practice today, doesn't mean it is correct or optimal. Remember, leaches were once common place in that periods "modern medicine", don't ever forget that when a doctor tells you something.

If you don't feel normal, odds are it's for a reason. Listen to your body, it is always looking out for your best interest.

Additionally, I'd like to quickly share an interesting link to prove that people who believe their problems might be linked to low testosterone, might not actually be crazy.
http://www.ourstolenfuture.org/newscience/reproduction/2006/2006-1210travisonetal.html


----------



## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

millenniumman75 said:


> I think you are putting way too muxch into this number.
> You can produce testosterone and are in the normal range. Would you really want to overproduce?


It is unlikely for a male to have have testosterone levels high enough to cause any detrimental long term effects without the use of exogenous steroids.
Have high levels of testosterone (at least, what the body will allow by endogenous means anyway) can only be a good thing for long term health.



nemesis1 said:


> Try taking Tribulus, its a natural testosterone booster. My sex drive went through the roof while i was on it.





Rufus said:


> I've tried tribulus, but I don't recommend it. I think it produces too much of the negative type of testosterone. The kind that makes you more angry and irritable.
> 
> 25 mg a day of DHEA can do wonders, but I am concerned about the long term effects even on that moderate dose.
> 
> Do you lift weights? I think squats are the safest and healthiest method of boosting testosterone quickly. I make sure to do squats regularly. It's something you notice immediately after you do them. Regular weightlifting in general will have a big impact on your testosterone level.


Tribulus is completely bunk for increasing testosterone levels. 
The increase in libido and aggression may be explained by increased androgen receptor activity and expression.
And come on now, it's 2012, the "Do compound lifts for testosterone boost!" myth is still going, really?
Hormonal changes need to be elevated/depression for longer periods of time to have any real world effect. Doing your 400lb squats in the gym is going to give you a transient increase at best before things return to baseline quite soon after. It's effectively meaningless in terms of body composition and overall hormonal levels.



NateDEEzy said:


> The problem lies in 2 places.
> 
> First, testosterone drops with age, but the range doesn't take this into consideration. Therefore, an 18 yo can have the testosterone level equal to his great grandpa who has testosterone consistent with others his age, and he's 90 years old. Which in itself is absurd.
> Second, testosterone is pretty misunderstood in the medical community, which is obvious based on not only your story, which isn't an uncommon story, but also with the treatment regimens most doctors prescribe. There's a reason why most doctors choose to prescribe androgel and testim, (because they give you a tube and don't have to worry about anything), however, as most people who've researched the subject know, injectables are by far the treatment option with best noted results. But I digress, the second point is testosterone is not well understood. And I predict, just as with many other hormone ranges such as thyroid, the ranges considered "normal" will change as it is better understood. Just because it is considered normal and acceptable practice today, doesn't mean it is correct or optimal. Remember, leaches were once common place in that periods "modern medicine", don't ever forget that when a doctor tells you something.
> ...


Very good post. It's absurd that males with quite clearly elevated levels of estrogen and fairly low levels of testosterone (for e.g) can be considered 'normal' and 'within acceptable range'



ForeverStallone said:


> Definitely not normal for your age. My latest result was 9.3 which puts me below range here - 12-32. This was at about 9 am.
> 
> She's right that it might be slightly higher earlier in the morning and in a fasted state. I got 12 a few months ago at 8am fasted. So not much difference.
> 
> ...


Quoted and bolded.
Estrogen, cortisol, prolactin, LH (luteinizing hormone) and FSH (follicle-stimulating hormone) are all important things to look at too.
In many cases as an example. some men may have high total testosterone levels on paper, but that's really not all that good if a significant amount of free test is aromatizing to estrogen


----------



## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

While I'm here, if you're not supplementing with the following, you should be doing so :

Zinc
Magnesium
Vitamin D

Being deficient in one of these three can cause a drop off in test levels.
It's no wonder some people that spend a big amount of time indoors begin to suddenly feel better when they start getting sunlight.
I tend to only really use Vit D in winter, as I get plenty of sun exposure during the summer, early/mid autumn and spring periods.

Vitamin B6 (I recommend the pyridoxal 5 phosphate form) can help to keep prolactin levels in check.

Good intake of Dietary cholesterol and saturated fat are also quite important.
Please bear in mind dietary cholesterol is not the same thing as serum cholesterol and it's entirely possible to have a relatively high dietary cholesterol intake while maintaining healthy serum levels.
I can say, at least anecdotally, that doing all those things made a world of difference for me in energy levels and overall feelings of motivation


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

So if I take a multi-vitamin I should be good or should I only be taking vitamin supplements for each of the three? (and possibly B6)

I find that I'm indoors a lot personally. I work full-time and I go out twice a week at least basically. But it's not like I'm absorbing sunlight at the office or at a bar. Unless you go for the patio seating at a bar. I do take walks during my lunch break at work though.


----------



## Andre (Feb 27, 2004)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> And come on now, it's 2012, the "Do compound lifts for testosterone boost!" myth is still going, really?
> Hormonal changes need to be elevated/depression for longer periods of time to have any real world effect. Doing your 400lb squats in the gym is going to give you a transient increase at best before things return to baseline quite soon after. It's effectively meaningless in terms of body composition and overall hormonal levels.


How is this a myth? I know how I feel when I exercise.


----------



## Andre (Feb 27, 2004)

Btw, zinc, magnesium and B6 are all great taken in combination.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

I read that depression is linked to low testosterone levels.

I don't know if I'd say that I qualify for Major Depression or even dysthmia. But I'm certainly not satisfied with my life. It's certainly getting better though.


----------



## Khantko (Apr 27, 2012)

Lifting heavy compounds do help in increased test and growth hormone levels. It worked for me at least. Give it a try for a month, if it doesn't work at least you'll build some muscle and strength.


----------



## ForeverStallone (Apr 4, 2011)

phoenixwright said:


> Thanks for the advice.
> 
> My doctor was practically sweeping it under the rug. I had to call in and ask when my results would come back and the secretary said "your results were normal so she didn't feel it was necessary to call you to inform you." I thought this was troubling since even if there wasn't a physiological problem, there IS some sort of problem! If an attractive naked woman is giving me oral sex and I'm not getting hard or if I get hard but then lose it during coitus, that's not right. So I asked to book an appointment to see the test results.
> 
> ...


Why does she want to take an evening sample? Its obviously going to be lowest at that time.

In your OP you said you woke up and had breakfast which would mean you had blood drawn in a non fasted state. Fasting doesn't raise testosterone (at least I don't think it does) but food does affect hormones, which is why you want to be fasted so that you get a clear baseline without interference from an outside source.

Btw I'm not on TRT and never was but am looking into it and trying to find a competent doc so I can't answer those questions.

Yes testosterone fluctuates, being highest in the morning and wanes down during the day. Diet affects it, stress affects it, as does sleep.

I don't think abstaining from fapping affects it other than on the 7th day after ejaculation where it rises by 150% or so. The first time I had mine tested I was 2 months into NoFap and the levels weren't much different than on any other occasion.

Also I agree with Petrovsks and Nates posts


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

ForeverStallone said:


> Why does she want to take an evening sample? Its obviously going to be lowest at that time.
> 
> In your OP you said you woke up and had breakfast which would mean you had blood drawn in a non fasted state. Fasting doesn't raise testosterone (at least I don't think it does) but food does affect hormones, which is why you want to be fasted so that you get a clear baseline without interference from an outside source.
> 
> ...


She suggested an evening sample because I took it in the morning and I was concerned my result was that low in the morning.

Btw I did not eat breakfast before I took the test. I fasted from 7:10 pm Friday up until after the blood test Saturday morning. For the evening test, I won't fast. But I'll save dinner for after the test so that food won't affect my results too much. I have to work that day so I can't be fasting 12 hours. The doc said that fasting isn't necessary for a testosterone test.

The diet, stress and sleep might all have an effect on my t results. Including depression and social anxiety (stress). I'm eating cleaner than I used to. But I dot stick to my diet. I cheat a lot. I don't always get a good 7 hours or so of sleep. And I get stressed out a lot.

So the t-level benefits of nofap are only visible at the 7 day mark. So I should aim to masturbate once a week then I guess?

I also find that I tend to be fatigued and have low energy. Maybe the me not getting it up thing is my body's way of telling me that something is wrong (as nate said) and I need to get the right vitamins and minerals.

I have the appointment with my doctor Friday night. In gonna have a long talk with her but I bet she will try to rush me out the door. It doesn't seem like she's taking the situation seriously.


----------



## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

nemesis1 said:


> Try taking Tribulus, its a natural testosterone booster. My sex drive went through the roof while i was on it.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15994038

The aphrodisiac herb Tribulus terrestris does not influence the androgen production in young men.

Onion juice maybe? Anyone try it?


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

scarpia said:


> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15994038
> 
> The aphrodisiac herb Tribulus terrestris does not influence the androgen production in young men.
> 
> Onion juice maybe? Anyone try it?


I thought it would be total bunk too, especially as i got the tribulus free with some protein i bought. But as i say, my sex drive went crazy on it. Too bad i dont have a girlfriend.


----------



## lonelyjew (Jan 20, 2010)

Is your doc an endocrinologist or is this your primary care doc? As much knowledgeable strangers as you'll find on the interwebs who'll tell you your docs doesn't know anything, you really should ask yourself why you think that joe internet user has a better grasp of your endocrine system (without even seeing what exactly was tested and how) then a person who spent 4 years at medical school, 3 years training as a resident (usually in internal medicine), and another 2 years as an endocrine fellow where they almost exclusively would have trained to work with hormonal pathology and management, not to mention any of endocrine research they probably would have done to get into that fellowship. I'm not saying you shouldn't question the results, but it's probably better to ask you doctor to thoroughly explain the results and whether being on the lower end of normal could be the cause of these problems. 

Anyways, you should be open to the possibility that your issue is not testosterone related. Did you get your appointment specifically to analyze your testosterone levels, or was the focus on your erectile dysfunction? Generally the way medicine works is doing a differential diagnosis on a problem, assessing all the possible things that could cause a problem, whether they fit, and testing to rule out things. You've mentioned anxiety and depression, both of which can affect your libido for instance. Are you open to the possibility that perhaps this happening before made you nervous that it would happen again, making you fixate on it more, until it happened again for instance (not saying that is it, but things like that could be)?


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

lonelyjew said:


> Is your doc an endocrinologist or is this your primary care doc? As much knowledgeable strangers as you'll find on the interwebs who'll tell you your docs doesn't know anything, you really should ask yourself why you think that joe internet user has a better grasp of your endocrine system (without even seeing what exactly was tested and how) then a person who spent 4 years at medical school, 3 years training as a resident (usually in internal medicine), and another 2 years as an endocrine fellow where they almost exclusively would have trained to work with hormonal pathology and management, not to mention any of endocrine research they probably would have done to get into that fellowship. I'm not saying you shouldn't question the results, but it's probably better to ask you doctor to thoroughly explain the results and whether being on the lower end of normal could be the cause of these problems.


General practioner. I didn't get a referral to an endocrinologist yet.



> Anyways, you should be open to the possibility that your issue is not testosterone related. Did you get your appointment specifically to analyze your testosterone levels, or was the focus on your erectile dysfunction? Generally the way medicine works is doing a differential diagnosis on a problem, assessing all the possible things that could cause a problem, whether they fit, and testing to rule out things. You've mentioned anxiety and depression, both of which can affect your libido for instance. Are you open to the possibility that perhaps this happening before made you nervous that it would happen again, making you fixate on it more, until it happened again for instance (not saying that is it, but things like that could be)?


My two previous appointments were focused on erectile dysfunction. This third will be to test my testosterone in the evening. At this stage she hasn't given me too much helpful knowledge about ED. Says that I need to be in the right mood. Maybe music would help. Change of scenery, etc. Honestly I think that's all BS. When a good looking woman gives you oral, that should be enough to get a young man excited don't you think?

And yeah my history of ED does make me anxious about it happening again. And that might have led to it. Though the second last time, I was perfectly fine and ready to go. It's inconsistent. Though I was on generic Cialis at the time. The last time I wasn't on anything except some maca extract (I barely used any though).


----------



## lonelyjew (Jan 20, 2010)

phoenixwright said:


> Says that I need to be in the right mood. Maybe music would help. Change of scenery, etc. Honestly I think that's all BS. When a good looking woman gives you oral, that should be enough to get a young man excited don't you think?


That is why it is called erectile dysfunction, because it should be enough but it isn't. Since you're dealing with your primary care doc, they should honestly be willing to make the time to explain ED and possible causes to you (make an appointment just for this if necessary, and voice your concerns about how this is personal and important to you), and take everything she says into consideration. You may think some of what she says is utter crap but it could potentially make the problem better, or fix it entirely. Again, I'm not dismissing that it could be testosterone related, but you shouldn't fixate on that being the only realistic possibility.


----------



## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

Can you possibly get testosterone pills or shots? Not sure about the situation here.


----------



## ForeverStallone (Apr 4, 2011)

phoenixwright said:


> She suggested an evening sample because I took it in the morning and I was concerned my result was that low in the morning.
> 
> Btw I did not eat breakfast before I took the test. I fasted from 7:10 pm Friday up until after the blood test Saturday morning. For the evening test, I won't fast. But I'll save dinner for after the test so that food won't affect my results too much. I have to work that day so I can't be fasting 12 hours. The doc said that fasting isn't necessary for a testosterone test.
> 
> ...


Fapping or not is up to you. I personally need about a week to recover. During that week I'm more tired, get moody, get depressed easier, even had my one and only panic attack a day after a fap. I find it easier to just abstain. And if I'm consistent with lifting weights, my libido dies down.

I agree with the second bold paragraph, if somethings not right within the body, its not going to function properly and you get symptoms such as fatigue or depression.

Let us know what result you get. I'm curious to know how much of a difference there is between a morning and evening sample.

And here's a link with different studies supporting TRT
http://www.pharmdjd.com/u/s_andropause/andropause_literature.htm


----------



## copper (Nov 10, 2003)

I should get mine tested due to being 41 and I am just short fused all of the time, also I am experiencing hot flashes. I read that men with low to get hot flashes too just like menopausal women.


----------



## e36guy (Oct 5, 2010)

You can try taking a tribulus/zma stack, I just started taking that and although I read studies that says it doesn't raise your testosterone, I definitely feel more aggressive/pumped up. Some other things you can do: drink 1/4 cup of olive oil a day, take a vitamin d, fish oil, red meats, cold showers, no fap. Be sure to get lots of sleep each night. Zma is meant to help you get a deep sleep and has been known to increase testosterone.


----------



## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

Rufus said:


> How is this a myth? I know how I feel when I exercise.


That's cool that you feel good, but it doesn't change the science.
I repeat, once again, you need to keep the elevation in hormones for an extended period of time for it to have a positive effect and the only way this is going to happen is via exogenous means.
An acute rise in GH and IGF-1 levels from exercise is NOT an extended period of time and has zero effects on muscle hypertrophy and strength. 
These levels return to baseline not long after you finish the workout and once again you're back to square zero (not like you ever really left with the transient spike in hormones anyway).
That feeling you get from a good workout is in all likelihood, just endorphins anyway.



Rufus said:


> Btw, zinc, magnesium and B6 are all great taken in combination.


I do however agree with this.



Khantko said:


> Lifting heavy compounds do help in increased test and growth hormone levels. It worked for me at least. Give it a try for a month, if it doesn't work at least you'll build some muscle and strength.


Read above.



scarpia said:


> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15994038
> 
> The aphrodisiac herb Tribulus terrestris does not influence the androgen production in young men.
> 
> Onion juice maybe? Anyone try it?


LOL some guy on bodybuilding.com actually tried the onion juice thing.
He just ended up smelling really horrible and gave up on it, so yeah, definitely not worthwhile :lol



e36guy said:


> You can try taking a tribulus/zma stack, I just started taking that and although I read studies that says it doesn't raise your testosterone, I definitely feel more aggressive/pumped up. Some other things you can do: drink 1/4 cup of olive oil a day, take a vitamin d, fish oil, red meats, cold showers, no fap. Be sure to get lots of sleep each night. Zma is meant to help you get a deep sleep and has been known to increase testosterone.


Testosterone levels will drop off a bit if you're deficient in zinc and magnesium, which is why it's important to supplement with both of these to keep them at optimal levels and to maximize testosterone output.
However, it wont boost test over what your body is capable of producing, you're just merely maximizing what it's capable of if you keep serum levels zinc, magnesium (and a few other vitamins and minerals) at an optimal range


----------



## Andre (Feb 27, 2004)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> That's cool that you feel good, but it doesn't change the science.
> I repeat, once again, you need to keep the elevation in hormones for an extended period of time for it to have a positive effect and the only way this is going to happen is via exogenous means.
> An acute rise in GH and IGF-1 levels from exercise is NOT an extended period of time and has zero effects on muscle hypertrophy and strength.
> These levels return to baseline not long after you finish the workout and once again you're back to square zero (not like you ever really left with the transient spike in hormones anyway).
> That feeling you get from a good workout is in all likelihood, just endorphins anyway.


I read you the first time. I was asking how you know what you're talking about. What I meant by "how I feel" is that I feel more like a man, like the feeling of testosterone, and it lasts as long as I am consistent in my exercise regimen, so I wondered if this process of regular exercise keeps testosterone up, because I get the feeling of "testosterone" when I do, and it lasts well after I have finished lifting. I wasn't talking about endorphins. Sorry for the cryptic post.

We'd be able to communicate more effectively without your snark, fyi.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

This family doctor just wasted a week of my time. I showed up for my appointment. And then she tells me that the lab is closed after 5 pm (I thought she said she was going to give me the blood test right at her office?) So now I have to go to the lab and WAIT IN LINE AGAIN. If I want to do an evening test, I have to wait until Monday evening. The lab closes at 2 on Saturday. Closed on Sunday.

This time she requested to test my LH and FSH in addition to my serum testosterone. Then she suggested to do it in the morning and then I'm like "wasn't the whole point of scheduling this appointment in the evening to do it in the evening?" It's like she has no recollection of what we talked about last week. So I'm going to do it in the evening. I don't want to do it in the morning because it's a long *** wait (especially on a saturday morning. Plus I have a volunteer commitment from 8 am - 12 pm tomorrow). In the evenings, theres less foot traffic. Plus I already did a testosterone test in the morning (but no LH or FSH last time).

ForeverStallone was right on the money suggesting the LH and FSH tests. The doctor recommended the exact same thing without me having to ask for them. Though I'm peeved at how much of my time is being wasted. I could have went out tonight and enjoyed a night out in downtown Toronto (it takes me 1 hour 30 minutes to go downtown by transit. I'm not comfortable enough driving to downtown Toronto because of the traffic volume) with friends. But no, I went to that doctor's appointment instead. For nothing.


----------



## theCARS1979 (Apr 26, 2010)

Rufus said:


> I've tried tribulus, but I don't recommend it. I think it produces too much of the negative type of testosterone. The kind that makes you more angry and irritable.
> 
> 25 mg a day of DHEA can do wonders, but I am concerned about the long term effects even on that moderate dose.
> 
> Do you lift weights? I think squats are the safest and healthiest method of boosting testosterone quickly. I make sure to do squats regularly. It's something you notice immediately after you do them. Regular weightlifting in general will have a big impact on your testosterone level.


I know veromax , tried that, i should get more when i need it but not even with anyone and i havent gotten mine tested. Mine may be rather high, just ask my hair


----------



## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

Rufus said:


> I read you the first time. I was asking how you know what you're talking about. What I meant by "how I feel" is that I feel more like a man, like the feeling of testosterone, and it lasts as long as I am consistent in my exercise regimen, so I wondered if this process of regular exercise keeps testosterone up, because I get the feeling of "testosterone" when I do, and it lasts well after I have finished lifting. I wasn't talking about endorphins. Sorry for the cryptic post.
> 
> We'd be able to communicate more effectively without your snark, fyi.


I'd say it's most likely just placebo at play here. I definitely feel more aggressive in the gym. Placebo or not, I definitely think it helps when you're feeling psyched up and more 'alpha' like that in that kind of environment (a gym).
It's hard to say whether a transient, acute rise in GH and IGF-1 is going to have any real world effect on mood. I'd say it's unlikely and if there is any effect, it's not significant.
I really just think it comes down to the mindset you find yourself getting into when you walk into the gym,
I definitely know what you what you mean about feeling great after a workout and again, I don't think this is particularly related to transient, acute elevation in GH and IGF-1.

Can't exactly remember what to google now, but there are plenty of studies that show GH and IGF-1 increase during a workout have basically zero efficacy in increasing muscle hypertrophy and strength gains.

There are natural ways to boost testosterone (and even lower estrogen and cortisol) with various supplements using clinically validated ingredients.
These can be quite useful for retaining muscle mass and speeding up fat loss while on a caloric deficit/cut, however the increase in test is obviously not going to be anywhere near as exciting as what you'd get via exogenous means (AAS, Pro-Hormones etc)


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> While I'm here, if you're not supplementing with the following, you should be doing so :
> 
> Zinc
> Magnesium
> ...


I just started taking my multi-vitamin yesterday.

My multi-vitamin gives me:

7.5 mg Zinc
50 mg Magnesium
15 mcg/600 IU Vitamin D
5 mg Vitamin B6

Is that good enough for the daily intake of those four vitamins/minerals? Obviously my multi-vitamin includes a lot more vitamins and minerals. But I just listed the content of those four specific ones you listed being linked to testosterone. Do I have to actually go and buy individual supplements for each of the different vitamins/minerals?

I had about seven hours of sleep yesterday. And I plan on sleeping in tonight (I have an off-day tomorrow). I really need to get a handle on my sleep cycle. I admit that I haven't been getting too much sleep. I also picked up a bit of a tan since I'm always outdoors on my lunch breaks at work.


----------



## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

^Give me a link to the multi you're using and I advise you further. Doesn't sound like a particularly good multi though.
I tend to take at least 450mgs of magnesium per day, sometimes over a gram. You're not gonna see much benefit from 50mgs.
If you're getting a tan from the sun, you're easily getting enough sunlight that vitamin D intake isn't a big concern.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> ^Give me a link to the multi you're using and I advise you further. Doesn't sound like a particularly good multi though.
> I tend to take at least 450mgs of magnesium per day, sometimes over a gram. You're not gonna see much benefit from 50mgs.
> If you're getting a tan from the sun, you're easily getting enough sunlight that vitamin D intake isn't a big concern.


I'm taking this one https://centrum.ca/content/products/centrumForte.asp?section=adult&product=forte

I take it that taking the supplements individually (Magnesium, Zinc, Vitamin B12, Vitamin D, Vitamin B6, etc.) is gonna give you a greater serving than some all-in-one multi-vitamin.


----------



## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> LOL some guy on bodybuilding.com actually tried the onion juice thing.
> He just ended up smelling really horrible and gave up on it, so yeah, definitely not worthwhile :lol


Lol. I figured some of those crazed bodybuilder guys would have tried the onion juice.

Anyone try acetyl-L-Carnatine? From webmd:


> Treating symptoms of age-related testosterone deficiency ("male menopause"). Taking acetyl-L-carnitine by mouth along with propionyl-L-carnitine seems to help symptoms related to declining male hormone levels. This combination taken for 6 months seems to improve sexual dysfunction, depression, and fatigue in much the same way the male hormone testosterone does.


----------



## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

phoenixwright said:


> I'm taking this one https://centrum.ca/content/products/centrumForte.asp?section=adult&product=forte
> 
> I take it that taking the supplements individually (Magnesium, Zinc, Vitamin B12, Vitamin D, Vitamin B6, etc.) is gonna give you a greater serving than some all-in-one multi-vitamin.


I figured it was some kind of cheap multi you'd get at a supermarket like Swisse, Centrum etc
In order to make a cheap multivitamin, well, you gotta use cheap ingredients. 
The bioavailability of some of the vitamins and minerals in there is so poor that you'd better off not using one at all than a really cheap multivitamin.
Zinc and Magnesium Oxide are terrible forms of those minerals and have extremely poor rates of absorption, as just two examples of what's wrong with that multivitamin. Personally I'd chuck it in the bin, but up to you, you can keep using it, just don't expect much of that zinc and magnesium and a few of the other vitamins and minerals in there to absorb too well :lol

For the time being, you may as well grab a ZMA supplement (Zinc, magnesium and vitamin B6). They tend to use forms of zinc and magnesium that absorb quite well and they're also well dosed, typically about 30mgs of zinc and 400-450mgs of magnesium per serving.
Should be easy to find on ebay or whatever


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

I popped a generic Cialis today and it seems like the problems still persist. I managed to get an erection for penetration (rather than get nothing at all like last time). And I was getting into a good rhythm and everything. But then I was getting tired (I guess she might have been getting tired too) so she suggested we take a break. I wasn't the unstoppable force that I can be at times. I needed water and a breather. lol. After that I had inconsistencies with my erection. And the girl was frustrated that she couldn't make me orgasm. 

I have a theory that I need to practice the NoFap thing (I did NoFap for 12 days but then I fell off the wagon. lol) because it seems like masturbation is the only thing that can get me off. I had masturbated to completion 2 days prior. And had masturbated earlier in the day (without completion).


----------



## Noca (Jun 24, 2005)

phoenixwright said:


> I popped a generic Cialis today and it seems like the problems still persist. I managed to get an erection for penetration (rather than get nothing at all like last time). And I was getting into a good rhythm and everything. But then I was getting tired (I guess she might have been getting tired too) so she suggested we take a break. I wasn't the unstoppable force that I can be at times. I needed water and a breather. lol. After that I had inconsistencies with my erection. And the girl was frustrated that she couldn't make me orgasm.
> 
> I have a theory that I need to practice the NoFap thing (I did NoFap for 12 days but then I fell off the wagon. lol) because it seems like masturbation is the only thing that can get me off. I had masturbated to completion 2 days prior. And had masturbated earlier in the day (without completion).


Cialis/Viagra do nothing to help someone orgasm, they just help you get and maintain an erection. If you were to put your trust in idiot doctors, they would tell you it does both, but that's clearly a lie. The receptors responsible for orgasms and erections are totally different.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

Dr House said:


> Cialis/Viagra do nothing to help someone orgasm, they just help you get and maintain an erection. If you were to put your trust in idiot doctors, they would tell you it does both, but that's clearly a lie. The receptors responsible for orgasms and erections are totally different.


I still had erectile difficulties though. But yeah the orgasm thing is a seperate issue. I've heard that this is a common issue for males that are so accustomed to masturbation as opposed to the "real thing" that they can't get off on anything else but masturbation. So I'm going to try the NoFap thing again (I was fine but then fell off the wagon).

I'm going to call my doctor today to demand an appointment for her to show me the serum testosterone and LH and FSH results. She said that she'll only call if there is something wrong. I'm not a fan of this doctor because she seems like she doesn't take my erectile dysfunction issue very seriously. I'm 26 almost 27. This should not be happening. I really want results NOW and it doesn't seem like she shows any urgency to push forward to give me the help that I need. She's an old Chinese immigrant lady in her 60s. I don't think she can relate to a young man. Sue Johansson (this sex show lady here in Canada) may be old and she's very comfortable talking about sex. But I doubt most older females can give good advice to young men in this area.

Apparently a lot of young men have problems in this area. But no one talks about it. And it really kills you whenever you see someone say, "I haven't met a young guy whose had this problem." It makes you feel like a freak.

Even though I feel that this topic is relevant to social anxiety (anxiety and depression can affect testosterone levels, libido, etc. and from what I've seen on SAS, I'm not the only guy in his twenties whose had this issue), I feel upset that I couldn't talk about this issue at my local social anxiety support group. They don't want to touch the subject of sex at all. They are prudes. They don't want to acknowledge that yes social anxiety disorder can harm your sex life and your sex life is a very important part of your quality of life. It's funny how say talking about a work issue is considered related to SAD. But god forbid you bring up anything sexual. Then it magically has nothing to do with SAD in their minds.


----------



## lonelyjew (Jan 20, 2010)

Dr House said:


> Cialis/Viagra do nothing to help someone orgasm, they just help you get and maintain an erection. If you were to put your trust in idiot doctors, they would tell you it does both, but that's clearly a lie. The receptors responsible for orgasms and erections are totally different.


I don't think any doctor would make that claim (if they know what they're talking about)... Viagra is pretty simple in how it functions (knocks out cGMP-phosphodiesterase, leaving more cGMP, which in turn causes vasodilation) and it isn't exactly accurate to say that viagra works on a receptor directly. Orgasm doesn't have a specific receptor either and is complicated in that a true orgasm (not simply ejaculation) involves complex higher level integration of various sexual stimuli.

Phoenix -

I'm sorry your doc sucks. They are old and probably are stuck with the old way of thinking that basically had doctors telling patients what to do without telling them why. "Stop being concerned, I'm telling you you shouldn't be, and I know way more than you so seriously, let me do the thinking for you," may be the way she thinks, which unfortunately does not work nowadays in our culture. Is there any possibility of you finding another primary care doc?


----------



## MobiusX (Nov 14, 2008)

maybe someone on this site with high testosterone should make a post complaining about it


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

My doc won't see me again until July 20 because she's on vacation. Fml. She had wasted 2 months of my time now (since I first sought help around may 20th).

I'm going to try nofap and see if that helps with the erectile issues. And I gotta get those vitamin/mineral supplements.

I have a theory that my penis is so accustomed to my hand that a mouth, a woman's hand or vagina can't arouse me consistentky


----------



## NateDEEzy (Feb 2, 2012)

While I do believe testosterone probably plays some role, it sounds to me that your problem might just be mental (especially since you can get off while masturbating), and likely rooted in depression.. imagine for a moment (I'm assuming you're married) your wife brought home a young lady that you found to be the most attractive girl on the planet and she agreed to do whatever your kinkiest desire was. Just a guess that you'd be in full salute and have no problem getting off. I'd suggest looking inward for the problem


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

It doesn't have to do with the attractiveness of the girl. I've had issues with unattractive and attractive girls alike. Those times where the equipment works also happen to be the instances where I'm most confident and immersed into the experience. So there's something to be said about the psychological.


----------



## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

phoenixwright said:


> It doesn't have to do with the attractiveness of the girl. I've had issues with unattractive and attractive girls alike. Those times where the equipment works also happen to be the instances where I'm most confident and immersed into the experience. So there's something to be said about the psychological.


 Did you get a referral to a psychologist?


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

Where you in love with any of these girls you've been having problems with, or where they just random meaningless hook-ups?

As ive had similar issues in the past, but only with women i wasnt really bothered about. I'm hoping that it wont be a problem with someone i am actually in love with, but i wont know until i ever get to that stage.


----------



## Knowbody (Jul 5, 2011)

wait, u can find out ur testosterone levels from a blood test?


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

scarpia said:


> Did you get a referral to a psychologist?


My GP is on vacation until July 19th. She is useless. I have sought help from her back in mid-late May and I'm still not getting the help I need from her.



nemesis1 said:


> Where you in love with any of these girls you've been having problems with, or where they just random meaningless hook-ups?
> 
> As ive had similar issues in the past, but only with women i wasnt really bothered about. I'm hoping that it wont be a problem with someone i am actually in love with, but i wont know until i ever get to that stage.


The first girl and I were in a relationship and we loved each other. Since then, I was better able to get outside of my own head. My erectile issues were at their peak then. Since then it's gotten better but I'm still inconsistent.


----------



## Brickbatstone (Jun 22, 2012)

phoenixwright said:


> My doc won't see me again until July 20 because she's on vacation. Fml. She had wasted 2 months of my time now (since I first sought help around may 20th).
> 
> I'm going to try nofap and see if that helps with the erectile issues. And I gotta get those vitamin/mineral supplements.
> 
> I have a theory that my penis is so accustomed to my hand that a mouth, a woman's hand or vagina can't arouse me consistentky


I'm in my mid 30s and I'm having the same problems. It sucks and at first I thought it was because I masturbate too much but I've tried not masturbating for 3-4 days and still have problems with getting and/or mainting an erection. I have tried Cialis though and that stuff works great for me.

Unlike you though, I haven't had any blood work. Maybe I'll do that.


----------



## ForeverStallone (Apr 4, 2011)

Can't you get the results faxed or mailed to you?



Knowbody said:


> wait, u can find out ur testosterone levels from a blood test?


Yes, that's the usual way it's tested.


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

This threads got me worrying a bit lol. I'm getting mine checked on Friday.

I actually had it checked years ago but they didnt give me the results either. When i phoned them to ask for the results they just fobbed me off with "your fine." This time ive told the doctor i want to see the numbers for myself.


----------



## Laith (Mar 20, 2009)

Did you guys just ask to have you hormone levels tested? I don't think I've ever had one done. I don't have any issues, I'm just curious what my levels are.
I suppose I'll have to say I'm havin trouble popping one just to get them to order it. insurance doesnt cover curiosity =]


----------



## kc1895 (Sep 4, 2009)

You should try becoming a transvestite


----------



## Ironpain (Aug 8, 2010)

Rob has a degree in Pervology so he's definitely certified, How are you health wise physically? At some stage of their lives most men have temporary difficulty getting and maintaining an erection. This is usually due to stress, alcohol, or tiredness. If you have something like hardening of the arteries or diabetes, As far as why you might have low testosterone levels here might be a number of reasons. 

If the testes fail to migrate from inside the abdomen into the scrotum during fetal development or in the first year or two of life, the testes may become damaged and unable to produce adequate amounts of testosterone.
If the testes are injured, they may not be able to produce adequate testosterone. You might have abnormal chromosome.

Also being Obese can cause problems with your testorone levels that's why I asked about your physical health overall, Excessive Stress will add to this, the more you worry about it the worse it becomes. I'm no expert but ask questions about these things, ask yourself have I ever been injured down there,look at your body are you obese, do you have any kidney issues? 

It's good that you feel comfortable enough to open yourself up like this and of course you know me personally so if you need someone to talk to about stuff you can always find me here or on FB and of course when we hang out so come talk to me bro. Yeah don't feel embarrassed.


----------



## Ironpain (Aug 8, 2010)

phoenixwright said:


> My doc won't see me again until July 20 because she's on vacation. Fml. She had wasted 2 months of my time now (since I first sought help around may 20th).
> 
> I'm going to try nofap and see if that helps with the erectile issues. And I gotta get those vitamin/mineral supplements.
> 
> I have a theory that my penis is so accustomed to my hand that a mouth, a woman's hand or vagina can't arouse me consistentky


It's funny you mention that and I don't mean funny as in a laughing sense but just ironic really because I worried about that with Lindsay, I would just last and last, she couldn't get me to ejaculate and I'd have this stinging sensation when she would go down on me, I also worried it was because maybe I was so use to masturbating that maybe I wasn't use to having a woman's mouth or hands on my genitles.


----------



## John316C (May 1, 2011)

maybe you could use weight lifting to strength you test levels, after the dip you should recover better like a muscle. try it and remember to take vitamin d and get sunlight. remember to raise testoterone by acting "manly" not supressing yourself, test will naturally rise.. and remember your circadian rythm, or go buy a book on the male cycle


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

For the evening test I came back with a 6.2 (ouch!) for serum testosterone and 2 for the other two (the normal range for one of them was 2-9. The other 2-11). She said that was an evening test so I shouldn't be alarmed. But I was concerned about my morning reading (9.8 ) and pointed out it was way below for my age group.

She offered to refer me to an endocrinologist and I took up her offer. But she feels that my test levels would improve if I exercise and weight train to build muscle mass. She doesn't want to put me on meds as she is concerned this will cause infertility.


----------



## Jollygoggles (Mar 3, 2011)

Do weight training man. I feel the test working its way through my body about an hour after. Let's just say, if I had a girlfriend, she would be in a whole heap of trouble after I got back from the gym.

It really will help matters, naturally.


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

I just got my results back today for my testosterone check. The normal range is *10-50* and i got *16* 

I told my doc that im not happy with those numbers and he told me that he wouldnt be taking any action as im 'within range'. I'm gonna order some super strength vitamin D3 as ive heard that boosts testosterone.


----------



## NateDEEzy (Feb 2, 2012)

nemesis1 said:


> I just got my results back today for my testosterone check. The normal range is *10-50* and i got *16*
> 
> I told my doc that im not happy with those numbers and he told me that he wouldnt be taking any action as im 'within range'. I'm gonna order some super strength vitamin D3 as ive heard that boosts testosterone.


I feel for you man. This to me is completely unacceptable. I'm assuming your testosterone levels were measured in nmol/L??

If so, take a look at this: http://www.mens-hormonal-health.com/normal-testosterone-levels.html

If I were you, I'd take that to your doctor and say, explain to me how you are satisfied with me having testosterone levels of a 75-84 yo man? And then ask, if testosterone levels decrease with age, why don't the ranges reflect this? Because they will have no answer. He/she obviously has no understanding of testosterone. And what boils my blood is how doctors say "it's in range, so you're fine", when they have absolutely no understanding of testosterone.

News flash, doctors have no understanding of testosterone or what the correct range is. Which is clearly made obvious in the fact that the testosterone range is not age specific, yet doctors still use it and implement it. Explain to me how an 18 yo with the testosterone level of a 90 year old is acceptable?? Well according to the normal range, it is. It's really quite laughable.

If I were you, I'd straight up ask your doctor how knowledgeable he/she is on the subject of testosterone (hoping they claim to have a solid understanding). And then after they answer, follow it up by showing them a print out of that website, followed by the questions I mentioned, and watch as it becomes evident that your hour worth of research demonstrates a more knowledgeable understanding than they have on the subject that they claim to understand.

Additionally point out the flaws in the range system simply based on the fact that it doesn't take age into consideration, and then point out that as the medically community better understands hormones, what was once considered "normal range" is then changed and considered out of date. Which is EXACTLY what happened with thyroid ranges. So, in reality your testosterone levels are likely quite a bit below the level that would make you feel better, and in time, doctors will realize this, but in the mean time are you supposed to suffer because of ignorance? So the question is, are you willing to let someone who clearly doesn't understand this subject, tell you what you can or can't do, and dictate your quality of life, just because they are called "doctor"?


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

NateDEEzy said:


> I feel for you man. This to me is completely unacceptable. I'm assuming your testosterone levels were measured in nmol/L??
> 
> If so, take a look at this: http://www.mens-hormonal-health.com/normal-testosterone-levels.html
> 
> ...


Yes my results are in nmol/L. And that link you posted was one of the first sites i came across when i got my results back.

And i hear what your saying about about going back to my doctor but there is no point, i know he wont do anything about it. He's just sticking to the rule book and playing it safe, which is understandable as gp's are under much scrutiny in the uk these days. So it looks like im on my own if i want to fix this problem.

Anyway, i read on some other forums that some guys were having success with Vitamin D3 for this problem so ive ordered some and i'll see what happens with it. If that doesnt work then i'll probably try some of those testosterone booster steroids for bodybuilders.

Screw having low testosterone. Thinking about it, this has probably been the root cause of most of the problems ive had in my adult life.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

Still have these issues. But I think I need to get more disciplined with the no masturbating/porn thing. I find it hard to abstain. Which makes this difficult. I find that going into a 69 and going down on her while she's down on me helps with the erection. I guess because my mind isn't focused on me so much. But moreso on the girl. The last time I didn't even notice I was hard until she pointed it out. lol. It's easier to get hard when you lose yourself mentally. But then I often times lose the erection when the condom comes on (the focus comes back on me I guess). And I can't exactly go without condoms unless I'm with a long-term girlfriend whose on birth control. Part of it is definitely psychological if performing cunnilingus or watching porn alone and jacking off turns me on.

My doctor has not gotten back to me btw. lol. It's been like what? Almost four weeks since she said that she'd refer me to an endocronologist. I also have to get on strength training (I have some weights at home I can use in the mean time). I went to register at Goodlife Fitness. But I guess they didn't get my application in the fax because they didn't process it. Now I have to wait until mid-September to join.


----------



## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

I can recommend Vitamin D3. I have no idea if if my testosterone levels have increased since I started taking it, but my sex drive has most definitely increased. I take the super strength stuff btw.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

I think it's probably a combination of psychological causes and being too accustomed to madturbation. I had those low testosterone readings. But if I can get hard madturbating to porn or fantasies and then ejaculate without much difficulty, how much of that can be blamed on low testosterone really? I notice that often times, even masturbating while I'm the presence of a woman doesn't work. But it does if I watch porn or fantasize. Though I managed to pop a little bit when masturbating to completion on a woman I saw with some regularity recently. So comfort level with the person seems to play a role. There's a definite difference between "regular" sex stimulation and masturbation in terms of sensitivity but there is a clear mental component to all this too. I have social and generalized anxiety so it probably shouldn't come as a surprise that casual sex might not be for me. That's not to say everyone with SA or generalized anxiety is in that boat. Anxiety effects different people in different ways.


----------



## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

millenniumman75 said:


> I think you are putting way too muxch into this number.
> You can produce testosterone and are in the normal range. Would you really want to overproduce?


I would (wood).


----------



## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

What's your diet like? Are you getting enough zinc?


----------



## Ven (Aug 20, 2012)

I must be like 28 on that list or something


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

srschirm said:


> What's your diet like? Are you getting enough zinc?


I don't have the most ideal diet (I was on a low carb, high protein diet but I felt miserable on that diet. Having to eat ****ing salad with my meat for dinner instead of rice or pasta. Not being able to have bread. Etc downing whey protein shakes three times a day to the point that you get sick of it.)

Besides there are plenty of fat out of shape slobs who can get hard at the sight of a hot woman they barely know or even like and cum in like 1 minute (ROFL). If I can jerk off to fantasy/porn, get hard and ejaculate, I don't think my issue is physiological. Or if it's even an issue at all. If a woman isn't comfortable with jumping into bed with a guy early, people think "I respect that". If a guy isn't comfortable with jumping into bed with a woman, he has ED. That's just something I gave thought to recently. Every girl I went to bed with at the time, was either someone I wasn't 100% comfortable with (I have SA, go figure. There are guys with SA who are comfortable with taking things fast. But I think after countless attempts, maybe I'm not) or someone I barely knew.


----------



## Noca (Jun 24, 2005)

phoenixwright said:


> I don't have the most ideal diet (I was on a low carb, high protein diet but I felt miserable on that diet. Having to eat ****ing salad with my meat for dinner instead of rice or pasta. Not being able to have bread. Etc downing whey protein shakes three times a day to the point that you get sick of it.)
> 
> Besides there are plenty of fat out of shape slobs who can get hard at the sight of a hot woman they barely know or even like and cum in like 1 minute (ROFL). If I can jerk off to fantasy/porn, get hard and ejaculate, I don't think my issue is physiological. Or if it's even an issue at all. If a woman isn't comfortable with jumping into bed with a guy early, people think "I respect that". If a guy isn't comfortable with jumping into bed with a woman, he has ED. That's just something I gave thought to recently. Every girl I went to bed with at the time, was either someone I wasn't 100% comfortable with (I have SA, go figure. There are guys with SA who are comfortable with taking things fast. But I think after countless attempts, maybe I'm not) or someone I barely knew.


Take some ZMA if you haven't already. It has all the precursors the body needs to create testosterone.


----------



## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Welcome back, Noca!!!


----------



## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

phoenixwright said:


> I don't have the most ideal diet (I was on a low carb, high protein diet but I felt miserable on that diet. Having to eat ****ing salad with my meat for dinner instead of rice or pasta. Not being able to have bread. Etc downing whey protein shakes three times a day to the point that you get sick of it.)
> 
> Besides there are plenty of fat out of shape slobs who can get hard at the sight of a hot woman they barely know or even like and cum in like 1 minute (ROFL). If I can jerk off to fantasy/porn, get hard and ejaculate, I don't think my issue is physiological. Or if it's even an issue at all. If a woman isn't comfortable with jumping into bed with a guy early, people think "I respect that". If a guy isn't comfortable with jumping into bed with a woman, he has ED. That's just something I gave thought to recently. Every girl I went to bed with at the time, was either someone I wasn't 100% comfortable with (I have SA, go figure. There are guys with SA who are comfortable with taking things fast. But I think after countless attempts, maybe I'm not) or someone I barely knew.


I'm with you on the low-carb crap, that is painful.

Do you think you can take a break from masturbating. That is painful too though, lol. The diet/exercise thing really helped me though. Although right now I'm off that wagon too. I'm not having sex though either.

I have to say I like to take things fast...I really know no other way. Sexual issues are to be expected when you first start a relationship...it's when you get more comfortable with the person that it starts to improve, in my experience.


----------



## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

Yea I can't imagine cutting out carbs. I went to a Greek restaurant today for lunch at work and for sides they give you the option of fries or salad. Guess which option I took? I ****ing hate salad. lol.

I should put more effort into quitting masturbating and porn. Porn is easier to quit. It's the no masturbating that is killer. lol.


----------



## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

phoenixwright said:


> Yea I can't imagine cutting out carbs. I went to a Greek restaurant today for lunch at work and for sides they give you the option of fries or salad. Guess which option I took? I ****ing hate salad. lol.
> 
> I should put more effort into quitting masturbating and porn. Porn is easier to quit. It's the no masturbating that is killer. lol.


Yeah I understand, both things are hard (no pun intended). One thing that helps me is using lube--I didn't do that for years. I now masturbate 3 times a week maybe-my drive to do it isn't that great I suppose.


----------



## Solomon's Tomb (Aug 14, 2012)

What exactly does testosterone do, again?


----------

