# Interesting throughts on psychotherapy as a profound healing



## SorryForMyEnglish (Oct 9, 2014)

*thoughts (sorry)

Here's a video of Dr. Nancy McWilliams talking about psychotherapy and critisizing some contemporary tendences in mental health field.

I find that interesting and it reflects some of my concernes about therapy too. I think this ''manual'' approach wouldn't help me personally at all.


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## SwtSurrender (Nov 24, 2014)

Love this video and this woman. Really enjoy this video, thank you for sharing! I didn't know there was a difference between a psychologist being a psychologist or just a psychoanalyst, but would definitely like a psychologist that practices psychoanalysis for sure! I also always wondered why I am not asked to lay on the couch because it feels more natural for me and especially to not face the psychologist because of social anxiety. I felt like I would be able to talk if I lay down on the couch and close my eyes and relax y'know but no one ever provided me with this - but I know I would! My first psychologist seemed to be more of a psychoanalyst or might have taken me and my relationship with me towards that way. She never told me any of my diagnosis or labeled me in any way - so I was thinking wtf! She just focused on healing me! Yeah, more psychologists should be that way, focus on building a relationship based on psychoanalysis and not throwing you under a disorder category or labeling you - which would be an insult. The only people who ever labeled me was my dad saying I have social phobia and the psychiatrists with their medications.


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## SorryForMyEnglish (Oct 9, 2014)

SwtSurrender said:


> Love this video and this woman. Really enjoy this video, thank you for sharing! I didn't know there was a difference between a psychologist being a psychologist or just a psychoanalyst, but would definitely like a psychologist that practices psychoanalysis for sure! I also always wondered why I am not asked to lay on the couch because it feels more natural for me and especially to not face the psychologist because of social anxiety. I felt like I would be able to talk if I lay down on the couch and close my eyes and relax y'know but no one ever provided me with this - but I know I would! My first psychologist seemed to be more of a psychoanalyst or might have taken me and my relationship with me towards that way. She never told me any of my diagnosis or labeled me in any way - so I was thinking wtf! She just focused on healing me! Yeah, more psychologists should be that way, focus on building a relationship based on psychoanalysis and not throwing you under a disorder category or labeling you - which would be an insult. The only people who ever labeled me was my dad saying I have social phobia and the psychiatrists with their medications.


True! But I think she practices some kind of mixed therapy approach, not purely psychoanalysis. And she said that no matter what the school/approach is, what's the most important is these complex relationship and working towards mental health in general, in a complex way.

Glad to hear you had such positive experience! Wonder if you have someone like that as a therapist now.

I was always afraid that I'd find a wrong kind of person for me as a therapist. Besides, I don't have a broad choice because I live in a very small town and people usually don't go to psychotherapist here as much as they do in your countries so there's almost no demand for that, unfortunately. People are biased and they think that both psychotherapists and those who visit them do nothing, but waste their time and that it all is in their head, right (normal) people do right things. I mean it's still a common opinion here :frown2: But it's really inevitable for me in order to function. It's just way too complicated because my issues as a very schizoid person are still not acknowledged enough and there's so much misunderstanding among people. As she said, the same thing is among therapists so you kinda don't know what you go for at first. And what if this negative therapy experience will make me even more harm? That's something very possible and not a rare thing to happen.

Sorry for my English again.


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## SparklingWater (Jan 16, 2013)

Agree. This is so vital to understand.


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## Maslow (Dec 24, 2003)

She's 100% correct. The therapist/client relationship is the most important aspect of therapy -- especially for people who don't have any good relationships in their lives. 

If you're lonely and just want somebody to talk to, and your therapist just wants to feed you some information you could have gotten from a book, you're not going to be satisfied or happy.

Or if you've gone through some tough times and you need to talk about it, and your therapist makes you feel bad about what you've been through, you're going to get pissed or even more depressed. Sometimes, we need that unconditional love that parents are supposed to provide. We're looking for a bit of that from a therapist.

I have some behavioral issues that prevent me from forming healthy relationships, and no therapist has ever tried to help me with that. They act like they don't want to deal with me.

I have trust issues and have only had one therapist that I trusted enough to even get started talking about those issues, but then the insurance ran out.

On the other hand, if you spend too much time thinking about your problems, you're going to be miserable. You need to get to the point where you understand what's going on, change your maladaptive behavior, and then move on.


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## Maslow (Dec 24, 2003)

SwtSurrender said:


> I also always wondered why I am not asked to lay on the couch because it feels more natural for me and especially to not face the psychologist because of social anxiety. I felt like I would be able to talk if I lay down on the couch and close my eyes and relax y'know but no one ever provided me with this - but I know I would!


I've felt the same way. It would alleviate a lot of the anxiety if you didn't have to look at the therapist. And it could eliminate self-consciousness that prevents you from thinking clearly and saying what you mean.


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## SwtSurrender (Nov 24, 2014)

SorryForMyEnglish said:


> True! But I think she practices some kind of mixed therapy approach, not purely psychoanalysis. And she said that no matter what the school/approach is, what's the most important is these complex relationship and working towards mental health in general, in a complex way.
> 
> Glad to hear you had such positive experience! Wonder if you have someone like that as a therapist now.
> 
> ...


Haha there's nothing wrong with your English - I understand you completely! It's refreshing to hear what approach Nancy McWilliams has coming from herself tho, gives me more options to think about. Nah, I don't have a therapist at the moment, or psychologist. Yeah, I think I understand about the wrong therapist thing, I mean when I went to my first psychologist - she didn't have the right tools to heal me from social anxiety at all. She did try tho, but I couldn't talk at all. So then she offered medications and that was kind of insulting but they did open me up, so I am thankful regardless.

So in a way, you have to find a therapist who is a psychoanalyst if you're leaning towards that kind more and I bet they will understand you more than a regular psychologist? I did go to a second psychologist - forced by my father again and even though I was on medication - I couldn't talk to him either, I would get stuck several times - selective mutism. So then he gave up on me and said I could come back when I feel like I can communicate. Haha! He surely does not understand social anxiety either!

You just need to find someone who understands you which is why a psychoanalyst/ or a specialized psychologist in certain disorders would understand us from a deeper level. These psychologists who terminate our sessions just because we cannot talk are not even psychologists to begin with!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And that hurts.


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## SwtSurrender (Nov 24, 2014)

Maslow said:


> I've felt the same way. It would alleviate a lot of the anxiety if you didn't have to look at the therapist. And it could eliminate self-consciousness that prevents you from thinking clearly and saying what you mean.


Only psychoanalysts do this couch thing.... Although there was a couch in my first psychologist's office so I could have tried it - but would be easier if they offer it for me first. All they have now-a-days is couch chairs - that could work too - just lean back and close your eyes and start talking.... :haha


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## SorryForMyEnglish (Oct 9, 2014)

Maslow said:


> Or if you've gone through some tough times and you need to talk about it, and your therapist makes you feel bad about what you've been through, you're going to get pissed or even more depressed. Sometimes, we need that unconditional love that parents are supposed to provide. We're looking for a bit of that from a therapist.


 Yeah, it's not only the fact that that'll make you more depressed and alienated, but also that it can distort your perception of self and cause more damage to your mental health. At least that's what I think would be in my case. Because people made me feel this way over and over again, throughout my life. I let them define me so their distorted perceptions of me combined (which were the result of their ignorance) became my own perception of myself. I mean it's been happening since my childhood because of my schizoid tendences which were developing since my childhood and people in surroudings had no clue why I was behaving certain way and that was just a natural way to behave for me and I just couldn't behave other way and I obviously didn't know why I was like that so I thought I was a defected person, and that somehow it was a mistake that I was born to this world. And I'm only now really discovering the reasons and what exactly is wrong about me etc. I think people with other problems could have similar experience with overinternalizing people's opinions about themselves. That's damaging.



Maslow said:


> I have some behavioral issues that prevent me from forming healthy relationships, and no therapist has ever tried to help me with that. They act like they don't want to deal with me.
> 
> I have trust issues and have only had one therapist that I trusted enough to even get started talking about those issues, but then the insurance ran out.


I'm so sorry to hear that :frown2:



Maslow said:


> On the other hand, if you spend too much time thinking about your problems, you're going to be miserable. You need to get to the point where you understand what's going on, change your maladaptive behavior, and then move on.


 Couldn't be more true. If only it was an easier thing to do...



SwtSurrender said:


> Haha there's nothing wrong with your English - I understand you completely! It's refreshing to hear what approach Nancy McWilliams has coming from herself tho, gives me more options to think about. Nah, I don't have a therapist at the moment, or psychologist. Yeah, I think I understand about the wrong therapist thing, I mean when I went to my first psychologist - she didn't have the right tools to heal me from social anxiety at all. She did try tho, but I couldn't talk at all. So then she offered medications and that was kind of insulting but they did open me up, so I am thankful regardless.


 Aw, I thought it was the opposite... Medications aren't good on their own in the long term perspective though :frown2:



SwtSurrender said:


> So in a way, you have to find a therapist who is a psychoanalyst if you're leaning towards that kind more and I bet they will understand you more than a regular psychologist? I did go to a second psychologist - forced by my father again and even though I was on medication - I couldn't talk to him either, I would get stuck several times - selective mutism. So then he gave up on me and said I could come back when I feel like I can communicate. Haha! He surely does not understand social anxiety either!


 Yeah, maybe it's the fact that he was just a psychologist who wasn't qualified to treat disorders or even simple anxieties. I don't know what psychologists are where you are, but here they only treat healthy people who come to them with some questions about their life and relationships and stuff, but nothing beyond that. When they are qualified to treat disorders then they're called therapists. Otherwise, he's just a really bad professional and doen't give a thing about his patients.



SwtSurrender said:


> You just need to find someone who understands you which is why a psychoanalyst/ or a specialized psychologist in certain disorders would understand us from a deeper level. These psychologists who terminate our sessions just because we cannot talk are not even psychologists to begin with!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And that hurts.


It's true, but ''people factor'' is still relevant, unfortunately



SwtSurrender said:


> Only psychoanalysts do this couch thing.... Although there was a couch in my first psychologist's office so I could have tried it - but would be easier if they offer it for me first. All they have now-a-days is couch chairs - that could work too - just lean back and close your eyes and start talking.... :haha


Haha! Yes, SA makes it even more dificult to look at them and being looked at by them and be open at the same time. Too much pressure


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