# Going To A Psychologist For The First Time...



## Rifa (Mar 2, 2018)

After aggressively ignoring my mental issues for years, my mom finally realized how much of a mess I feel inside. So now I have an appointment in 3 days and I am--as always--terrified. 

Can anyone tell me or give me a rough idea on how it'll be like and what to expect? My issues are social anxiety, depression and passive suicidal thoughts.


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## 629753 (Apr 7, 2015)

She\he will ask you questions and your job is to go deep in your traumas, understand them and find a solution on how to transcend them.


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## MadnessVertigo (Sep 26, 2016)

It depends, there are a lot of different kinds of psychologists. I would say just try to keep an open mind, and don't be afraid to say you want to try someone else if it's not a good fit. I've had both really good and really bad psychologists, it just depends on how your personalities fit.


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

I've been seeing a counselor but Friday I go to a psychologist for the first time too. 

I doubt he can help........


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

wmu'14 said:


> I've been seeing a counselor but Friday I go to a psychologist for the first time too.
> 
> I doubt he can help........


As predicted, it was a waste of time. I do not have a second meeting scheduled.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

Rifa said:


> After aggressively ignoring my mental issues for years, my mom finally realized how much of a mess I feel inside. So now I have an appointment in 3 days and I am--as always--terrified.
> 
> Can anyone tell me or give me a rough idea on how it'll be like and what to expect? My issues are social anxiety, depression and passive suicidal thoughts.


Depends on the psychologist. It should be gentle though and they should make you feel at ease and just try to find out about your problems. There shouldn't be anything difficult (other than the anxiety of going) in the first session.



impedido10 said:


> She\he will ask you questions and your job is to go deep in your traumas, understand them and find a solution on how to transcend them.


Erm no. If you don't understand something it is probably better you don't advise others.



wmu'14 said:


> As predicted, it was a waste of time. I do not have a second meeting scheduled.


Well I don't know what happened, but you did kinda go in there with the criteria of success being "make women find me attractive", so yeh, as predicted, the psychologist didn't deliver there. 1 session isn't going to cut it to judge the therapy (unless you really hated the psychologist on a personal level, in which case, you search for another one).

1 session != "I have tried psychologists, they don't work".

You are just ticking **** off so you can pretend you tried everything and can gobble down more red pills.


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## truant (Jul 4, 2014)

wmu'14 said:


> As predicted, it was a waste of time. I do not have a second meeting scheduled.


"I went to the gym once but I still don't have big muscles. Exercise is a waste of time."

"I had a salad instead of a cheeseburger once and I'm still overweight. Dieting is a waste of time."

Not trying to be mean, just pointing out what appears to be an unrealistic expectation.

Like @splendidbob said, if there was a problem with that _particular_ therapist or the therapy they offered, then find another therapist. Maybe you just got off on the wrong foot. You can't draw a conclusion about therapy in general based on a single visit with a single therapist.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

@truant much better put lol.

But yeh, I almost did _exactly this_ with my psychologist. She said one or two things I considered "wrong" re OCD on the first session, and almost didn't go back.

By the 4th session I was totally on board and willing to fully engage. And yeh, therapy is actually very much like building a physique, the changes are slow, take time and a lot of effort.


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

truant said:


> "I went to the gym once but I still don't have big muscles. Exercise is a waste of time."
> 
> "I had a salad instead of a cheeseburger once and I'm still overweight. Dieting is a waste of time."
> 
> ...





splendidbob said:


> Well I don't know what happened, but you did kinda go in there with the criteria of success being "make women find me attractive", so yeh, as predicted, the psychologist didn't deliver there. 1 session isn't going to cut it to judge the therapy (unless you really hated the psychologist on a personal level, in which case, you search for another one).
> 
> 1 session != "I have tried psychologists, they don't work".
> 
> You are just ticking **** off so you can pretend you tried everything and can gobble down more red pills.


Success would be working towards getting over my stereotypes. Success would be working towards finding ways to get women to want to date me. Success would be finding more ways to meet women.

He didn't tell me anything new. His big points were: find hobbies, try dating sites, talk to them at work, have confidence.

Then he found out I like to exercise and learn about things and religion, that I have been involved in several social groups through my life, that my employer rarely hires unlike his that has high turnover, and my medication gives me a TON of confidence.

He did most of the talking. He talked about how he was shy in high school, how he found a girl in college and they married at 20. He talked about his sons and how they had success with online dating. He talked about how he went to a Christian high school and learned vulgarity there and his friend told him to have confidence in a vulgar way and he got it. He told me about how he likes to collect things and paddle board. TBH, I got the impression he just liked to hear himself talk.

He did say I look fine, it's obvious I lift weights, likes my smile, can tell I'm smart, don't need to gain any more weight.

He found out I'm on Paxil medication, and he started talking about how when women take Paxil, it affects their ability to orgasm, and I told him I didn't want to hear about that and that it doesn't matter to me because it seems useless for me to know that, but he told me anyways.

I need a psychologist who listens to me and hears my frustrations, that it's more then just 'oh I'm sad I've never had a girlfriend before.' I need a psychologist who knows what it's like to be in my position. I don't need a psychologist who was a tad shy in high school and got married during college. I need a psychologist who really help me work through my frustration.

If a psychologist is just going to tell me stuff I can read on Men's Fitness or whatever, that isn't going to help me.

TBH my Christian counselor has been more helpful then it appears this guy will. No offense to him, he was likable and made me laugh and smile, just don't think he's the right doc for me.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

@wmu'14 how are you finding these psychologists / counsellors?

Can I suggest a few things to ask them and consider:

1. A female psychologist will probably be much more beneficial to you than a male, for obvious reasons
2. Make sure to check their education and experience. You ideally want one with experience of BDD / OCD. I cant stress enough how important a high level of education is for a therapist, they need to have a lot of tools to draw from. What degree/s do they have? Where from? 
3. What are their specialisms? What type of therapy are they going to be giving you?
4. Did he even diagnose you with BDD? What were his diagnosis? What did he say about your mental health?
5. What education and qualifications did this guy have? What were his specialisms? What experience does he have?
6. What are you asking them for help with?

You need to do some research, draw up a shortlist and find one that looks the best on paper and more suited to your likely conditions.


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

splendidbob said:


> @wmu'14 how are you finding these psychologists / counsellors?


Hi Bob. Thanks for trying to help me with my shrinks. The Biblical counsellor, while not incredibly helpful, I feel is trying to be there for me, has worked with a friend of mine who was in a similar situation (this is that autistic friend with a gf), is showing he cares.

The shrink today gave me info I could find reading a Men's Fitness magazine.



splendidbob said:


> 1. A female psychologist will probably be much more beneficial to you than a male, for obvious reasons


IDK about this. I'm hesitant.



splendidbob said:


> 2. Make sure to check their education and experience. You ideally want one with experience of BDD / OCD. I cant stress enough how important a high level of education is for a therapist, they need to have a lot of tools to draw from. What degree/s do they have? Where from?


 Let me pull up his degree now: 30 years of experience, specialties include anxiety disorders and relationship struggles, degrees from Calvin College and Western University.



splendidbob said:


> 3. What are their specialisms? What type of therapy are they going to be giving you?


The shrink today's specialties does include anxiety disorders and relationship struggles. He did not talk about what kind of therapy he'd give me.



splendidbob said:


> 4. Did he even diagnose you with BDD? What were his diagnosis? What did he say about your mental health?


No, and I don't think BDD can be / should be diagnosed after one 'tell me why you're here meeting' / him talking about himself 3/4 of the time. He didn't diagnose me with anything. He didn't say anything about my mental health other then the advice he gave me.



splendidbob said:


> 5. What education and qualifications did this guy have? What were his specialisms? What experience does he have?


You asked this. 


splendidbob said:


> 6. What are you asking them for help with?


Getting over the Frustration / Obsession. General help with women. Help with the 'delusions.'



splendidbob said:


> You need to do some research, draw up a shortlist and find one that looks the best on paper and more suited to your likely conditions.


I think when I schedule my next appointment, I need to give a little more background on myself to the Appointment Setter. She might have a perfect match.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

@wmu'14 I am curious why you are hesitant about a female psychologist?

You actually would benefit from a young(ish) female psychologist. It seems like such an obvious benefit I can't see what I am missing here. You get to learn her insights on women from a female perspective, can practice conversation with a woman, learn first hand what kinds of things will put women off etc, and most importantly, who better to correct your assumptions about women than a female psychologist?


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

He shouldn't be talking about himself 3/4 of the time btw either. Find a different one imo. Oh, you didnt say how you found the psychologist (only the therapist)


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

splendidbob said:


> @wmu'14 I am curious why you are hesitant about a female psychologist?


I want a shrink who fully understands my situation. A female shrink _might_, but a guy's role and a woman's role into getting a relationship are _usually_ different.



splendidbob said:


> You actually would benefit from a young(ish) female psychologist. It seems like such an obvious benefit I can't see what I am missing here. You get to learn her insights on women from a female perspective,


I'm not sure. I'd be afraid of getting a woman shrink that put in little effort to get married / a boyfriend, that is dating / married to some hot guy, only reinforcing my opinions.



splendidbob said:


> can practice conversation with a woman,


I'm not sure. I might think she's not being genuine / faking it to make me feel better, kind of like what I (wrongly) thought Fathoms was doing.



splendidbob said:


> learn first hand what kinds of things will put women off etc,


This might be beneficial. What really does put a woman off (other then calling them shallow )? What would a woman consider ugly for a guy's looks?



splendidbob said:


> and most importantly, who better to correct your assumptions about women than a female psychologist?


Again, possible I would think she's just faking it.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

wmu'14 said:


> I want a shrink who fully understands my situation. A female shrink _might_, but a guy's role and a woman's role into getting a relationship are _usually_ different.
> 
> I'm not sure. I'd be afraid of getting a woman shrink that put in little effort to get married / a boyfriend, that is dating / married to some hot guy, only reinforcing my opinions.
> 
> ...


Well at least you're aware that your assumptions can be wrong. You're resisting finding one because of your preconceived notions of it not working. Just like you've done for countless other peoples advice in your threads. You either dismiss the advice that actually challenges you and your mindset, or you flat-out ignore it and try to find posts that agree with your own worldview to reassure yourself. Why don't you take this chance for actual change, and commit to this? Rather than doing a one and done just for the sake of saying you saw one. And btw, you should really consider whether they got a relationship/married easily as almost irrelevant. A psychologists job is to help you rewire your thought patterns through various forms of therapy to benefit your life, not to confirm your maladaptive thoughts.

Oh, and my current psychologist is a woman and understands me so much more than any other mental health carer I've had. She can express my thoughts better when I struggle to put them together, and proves she understands me when I speak my mind.


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

scooby said:


> Well at least you're aware that your assumptions can be wrong. You're resisting finding one because of your preconceived notions of it not working. Just like you've done for countless other peoples advice in your threads. You either dismiss the advice that actually challenges you and your mindset, or you flat-out ignore it and try to find posts that agree with your own worldview to reassure yourself. Why don't you take this chance for actual change, and commit to this? Rather than doing a one and done just for the sake of saying you saw one.


 Right. Bob and I (and you and anyone else if they'd like) are discussing what a good shrink for me would do, how it could be helpful, where this one doesn't seem so helpful, etc. I am by no means done with it, just not thrilled with the service I got today. 


scooby said:


> And btw, you should really consider whether they got a relationship/married easily as almost irrelevant. A psychologists job is to help you rewire your thought patterns through various forms of therapy to benefit your life, not to confirm your maladaptive thoughts.


Okay, good. I don't want one to confirm my maladaptive thoughts. But I do want one who understands the problem and doesn't seem to just wave it off by recommending me stuff I can easily look up in a Men's Fitness magazine.



scooby said:


> Oh, and my current psychologist is a woman and understands me so much more than any other mental health carer I've had. She can express my thoughts better when I struggle to put them together, and proves she understands me when I speak my mind.


Happy to hear it's working for you (or that you're getting good service at least  ) Are you male or female (because I'm not saying a female psychologist is bad; I'm just not convinced a woman shrink would truly get the situation) (no offense tehuti. I get that women struggle with the dating game too; I'm saying usually the man's role in getting into a relationship and role in the relationship is different from the woman's role, so a male psychologist might be more beneficial)



splendidbob said:


> He shouldn't be talking about himself 3/4 of the time btw either. Find a different one imo. Oh, you didnt say how you found the psychologist (only the therapist)


I definitely didn't like how he was talking about himself 3/4 of the time. I mean, for a first time session shouldn't he be really trying to dig down? Ask me more questions. Not just me saying 'oh I've never even had a female friend.'

Maybe he didn't want to make me too 'anxious' the first meeting (Not saying I was anxious because I wasn't; I wanted to talk about my problems; I'm saying he might've not wanted to scare me away). Maybe he was trying to make me comfortable with him? Maybe he wanted me to know about him before we really get into me? IDK. He was relating (albeitely not very good) his 2 or 3 years of struggling with women with my lifetime of it.

This particular psychologist that I saw today is part of a big, well-known psychiatric hospital / behavioral health provider in my city. If you have a mental health problem, odds are you either have seen a psychologist from there or have heard of the place, (and you've probably heard of it even if you don't.)


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## hoodie (Jun 29, 2016)

wmu'14 said:


> Happy to hear it's working for you (or that you're getting good service at least  ) Are you male or female (because I'm not saying a female psychologist is bad; I'm just not convinced a woman shrink would truly get the situation) (no offense tehuti. I get that women struggle with the dating game too; I'm saying usually the man's role in getting into a relationship and role in the relationship is different from the woman's role, so a male psychologist might be more beneficial)


I definitely agree with what you're saying about a male therapist. I've seen 2 female therapists for probably about 6-8 sessions each and I would not say they gave me much valuable advice for dating. They said to do online dating and join a "video game club" to meet girls with similar interests. :blank Not sure if she was trying to be helpful, or saying I should try dudes. And, I don't think a lot of girls realize how fruitless online dating is for guys who are not exceptionally attractive. Like, if I asked a girl IRL how she thinks I do on online dating, she would probably think I could find a few dates easy, but it's really, really not the case. Those female therapists were both probably 45-55 years old, so maybe a younger one might offer a different perspective.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

Mildly frustrated that people seem to think therapy is about getting advice lol, but will make a proper post later. Also hope the OP isn't annoyed at the thread being taken over (should be a separate thread imo).


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

splendidbob said:


> Mildly frustrated that people seem to think therapy is about getting advice lol, but will make a proper post later. Also hope the OP isn't annoyed at the thread being taken over (should be a separate thread imo).


I don't see what's wrong with some advice, (dating advice really isn't that helpful TBH and isn't anything I haven't heard a thousand times) but if my shrink could help make me think more positively about my situation, that's what I'm looking for too.



hoodie said:


> I definitely agree with what you're saying about a male therapist. I've seen 2 female therapists for probably about 6-8 sessions each and I would not say they gave me much valuable advice for dating. They said to do online dating and join a "video game club" to meet girls with similar interests. :blank Not sure if she was trying to be helpful, or saying I should try dudes. And, I don't think a lot of girls realize how fruitless online dating is for guys who are not exceptionally attractive. Like, if I asked a girl IRL how she thinks I do on online dating, she would probably think I could find a few dates easy, but it's really, really not the case. Those female therapists were both probably 45-55 years old, so maybe a younger one might offer a different perspective.


Yep. TBH you should find hobbies women might be interested in too. (not saying women aren't interested in video games, just that the vast vast vast majority will be men at a video game club [which I don't even think exist at our age]) Then again, I've become more interested in things outside video games and interested in things that more women enjoy too but no luck for me.

Also, people on here, yetserday's shrink, my counselor, my friend, say my looks are fine so why is online dating not really working? I message girls pretty much every day, my response rate is one every few months (if that), and every time I do find a girl that I'm able to sustain a conversation with she stops responding (for a variety of reasons).

I'm not sure if a younger shrink would've been more helpful. Maybe worth trying?


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## hoodie (Jun 29, 2016)

splendidbob said:


> Mildly frustrated that people seem to think therapy is about getting advice lol, but will make a proper post later. Also hope the OP isn't annoyed at the thread being taken over (should be a separate thread imo).


It certainly can be a good sounding board to get feedback on your thoughts. I agree that ADVICE-ADVICE is more of a life coach thing. My underlying point was that those female therapists gave such poor advice that they are really out of touch with the struggles a male faces when it comes to dating. If those struggles are the biggest or one of the biggest things holding you back, why would you want to see someone who doesn't understand them?


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

splendidbob said:


> Also hope the OP isn't annoyed at the thread being taken over (should be a separate thread imo).


Yes! I was thinking this too. Sorry OP. I hope your first appointment went better then mine did. How did it go anyways?

(Also, Bob, do we really want another thread for me  ) Maybe we should have a whole sub-section on SAS for me?


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

hoodie said:


> It certainly can be a good sounding board to get feedback on your thoughts. I agree that ADVICE-ADVICE is more of a life coach thing. My underlying point was that those female therapists gave such poor advice that they are really out of touch with the struggles a male faces when it comes to dating. If those struggles are the biggest or one of the biggest things holding you back, why would you want to see someone who doesn't understand them?


Yep, that's exactly what I'm saying. I want/need a shrink who really understands the issue. The shrink I saw yesterday seems to think it's as simple as talking to female new hires at my employer (something that is incredibly incredibly rare at my employer). He seems to think it's as simple as trying online dating (am trying it and won't give up but it's not really working). He seems to think that it's as simple as getting hobbies and not playing video games all day. (I do have hobbies and have only recently picked up playing video games again and not all day neither)

Not saying he hasn't had success stories with his clients in similar situations, just felt like he was waving it off.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

@hoodie @wmu'14

6-8 sessions is short term CBT, this isn't the kind of therapy we are talking about here (though there might be CBT elements).

A woman likely doesn't have the understanding of what it is like to be a male dating, no, but here we have an opportunity to form _a relationship with a woman_ the therapist. Not a romantic relationship, not a friendship, but something. Also a relationship that is controlled, isn't going to end in rejection, its beneficial in its own right. You are interacting with a woman for an hour a week, can roleplay conversations with them and scenarios, there are a lot of advantages here.

1. Are you seeing psychologist for dating advice? (no)
2. Is there inherent benefit from the therapy if it's male or female? (no)
3. Are there other benefits from the psychologist being female? (yes).

Therefore female is the superior choice imo. But it doesn't matter _that_ much, its just imo a female psychologist might kill a few extra birds with one stone for wmu.

People say a lot on here "the therapist didn't tell me anything I didn't know". Well that isn't the point of therapy, so why would you expect them to? The point of therapy depends on the type of therapy and why you go in there, but getting advise, or magical wisdom that suddenly helps you fix your life isn't how it works, _ever_.

Something else also slightly grates at me here, but I wish people would stop equating 6-8 sessions of CBT (with a likely poorly trained CBT therapist) with long term psychodynamic (or other) therapy with a psychologist that has multiple degrees. "Therapy" isn't a "I have done 6 weeks of CBT, I can conclusively say therapy doesn't work" thing.

Rant over .

Yeh, wmu, OP has gone quiet so I guess it's ok. I will refrain from posting for a little bit, getting the damn pregabalin withdrawal again, so sorry folks if I am weirdly aggressive here.


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## Rifa (Mar 2, 2018)

oh wow that was a... Very long conversation, haha.



wmu'14 said:


> Yes! I was thinking this too. Sorry OP. I hope your first appointment went better then mine did. How did it go anyways?
> 
> (Also, Bob, do we really want another thread for me  ) Maybe we should have a whole sub-section on SAS for me?


Don't worry, I don't mind about the thread getting taken over, since I posted this thread mostly to calm down my anxiety rather than actually needing advice. You know, because it made me feel that I've done something to prevent negative things from happening? Yeah, something like that.

Also, the visit was great! The psychologist was very understanding and she helped me see the big picture of my issues. Wmu'14, best of luck in your next psychologist, hopefully you'll find one that can help you better.


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

splendidbob said:


> @hoodie @wmu'14
> 
> 6-8 sessions is short term CBT, this isn't the kind of therapy we are talking about here (though there might be CBT elements).
> 
> ...


1.) I actually work with all women. There's like 9 or so of them in the department. Get along with all of them. I don't think it's learning how to talk to women in general.

2.) I guess it wasn't so much I didn't get any new wisdom, just I don't need to go to a shrink for things I can look up in a magazine. Feels like I went there to give him a paycheck. Was hoping for a little more then 'try dating sites' or 'get a new hobby' or 'meet them at work.' If you think I'm going to go for a long period of time to hear that, eh...........

3.) I was talking to my friend and he worked in middle school with the same shrink I talked to the other day. (That was back when he was super-shy and dealing with the general crap that middle school offers) I asked if he found him helpful and he wasn't super clear.


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

Rifa said:


> oh wow that was a... Very long conversation, haha.
> 
> Don't worry, I don't mind about the thread getting taken over, since I posted this thread mostly to calm down my anxiety rather than actually needing advice. You know, because it made me feel that I've done something to prevent negative things from happening? Yeah, something like that.
> 
> Also, the visit was great! The psychologist was very understanding and she helped me see the big picture of my issues. Wmu'14, best of luck in your next psychologist, hopefully you'll find one that can help you better.


Hi Rifa. Good to hear that we didn't step on your toes. Sorry again if we really did. 
I vent all the time on these boards so I understand where you're coming form you just needed to get something off your chest.

Glad to hear that your shrink was helpful. I'm not sure if I'm done with him yet. My friend met with him a long time ago for some time.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

wmu'14 said:


> Yes! I was thinking this too. Sorry OP. I hope your first appointment went better then mine did. How did it go anyways?
> 
> (Also, Bob, do we really want another thread for me  ) Maybe we should have a whole sub-section on SAS for me?


Heh, I miss quite a lot of them as I have that relationships sub ignored. As you know, I am drawn to post angrily in those threads, but am also drawn to try to help you in these. It's quite confusing lol.

Anyway, yeh, I will say a few things in this one.

1. Don't sweat the male / female psychologist stuff too much, what is of primary importance is that you like the psychologist. A good relationship is half of the battle. Yeh, would be better imo with a female one imo, but a good relationship where you respect the psychologist is the most important.

2. I am very impressed with the way you haven't ruled it out and are considering going back (or finding a different psychologist). This kind of attitude demonstrates that you are heading in the right direction. And I don't mean this in a condescending way or anything, really. I only recently started to take this kind of attitude with things myself (it was / is one of my big problems, so I recognise what it actually represents, and yeh, it came from therapy for me lol).

3. This is similar to 2, but on a slightly different note (and it is something I am going to be doing myself, but on a different issue). Have you come up with a structured plan of things to try? It sounds obvious, but we don't actually tend to do this. We just go along trying stuff, but don't systematically exhaust all possible treatments and / or solutions. In fact (going off topic), it's quite strange that this site doesn't have a checklist for SA treatments to try (its something I was considering making for the site actually, treatments ranked in probable efficacy and ease of completing that people can check off).

The reasons for this are:

- It makes sure every realistic solution is tried
- You don't give up too early
- It keeps things grounded in reality
- When you have checked everything off the list, even if you don't reach your goals, you know for sure you have tried everything. No regrets, did all you could.
- It gives you a sense of control.
- You are directly taking responsibility for the things you can take responsibility for (taking this kind of attitude alone will make you more attractive). It's almost impossible to not like someone who just keeps ****ing trying with a relentless determination.

So I guess there is a list of stuff you can try. Specific and measurable. Off the top of my head:

1. See psychologist for some form of long term therapy
2. Short term CBT and a few months of practice. This could help w.r.t. thought challenging and so forth. Try a few therapists.
3. Dating coach x 3 (short term, so try a few)
4. Life coach x 3
5. Honest appraisals of your performance in key areas (communication by text, conversation skills)
6. Set targets for having conversations with women per month
7. Source _high quality_ information about dating (be careful here, you don't want bad info).
8. Set targets for asking out x women per month
9. Get feedback on dating profiles, pictures
10. Optimise appearance (your looks aren't the problem btw, but if improvements can be made, they should be. There are lots of stuff pretty much every guy can do here).
11. Gain x number of female friends in 6 months
12. Gain x number of male friends in 6 months

This is off the top of my head so some of this might be stupid or not what you would want to do (and there might be a lot more things to try), but I would spend a little bit of time thinking about _all_ of the ways you could improve your chances with women, make a list, make it all quantifiable with goals and targets, and start attacking it all systematically (weight them in terms of likelihood of helping, and ease of doing them). A lot of them can be done alongside whatever form of therapy you are doing at the time.

This woman thing is obviously the most important thing in your life atm, you have (I think) a decent income, so perhaps its time to start investing serious time and money into this and start really going after it with brutal purpose. Not saying you aren't trying atm (you obviously are), but getting stuff on paper, developing a tight, measurable plan, and following it through like a deranged lunatic. And if you finish, and you still didn't get where you wanted, you know you have done everything.

Hope this is taken in the right way mate, not at all a criticism. Like I say, this is what I am about to do myself with my major problem.

I may be able to help you a bit with appearance stuff, not that I am an expert there either, but I improved mine a fair bit. I need to repeat here that your appearance isn't bad, you look like an average to slightly above average looking guy to me. Everyone can improve appearance though . I can even help you brainstorm things to try.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

wmu'14 said:


> 1.) I actually work with all women. There's like 9 or so of them in the department. Get along with all of them. I don't think it's learning how to talk to women in general.
> 
> 2.) I guess it wasn't so much I didn't get any new wisdom, just I don't need to go to a shrink for things I can look up in a magazine. Feels like I went there to give him a paycheck. Was hoping for a little more then 'try dating sites' or 'get a new hobby' or 'meet them at work.' If you think I'm going to go for a long period of time to hear that, eh...........
> 
> 3.) I was talking to my friend and he worked in middle school with the same shrink I talked to the other day. (That was back when he was super-shy and dealing with the general crap that middle school offers) I asked if he found him helpful and he wasn't super clear.


Yeh, I think look at this as interviewing an employee. So long as you have a decent choice, you can afford to be picky, though you don't want to waste a lot of cash doing 1 session trials with too many. I wonder if there is any way you can get information beforehand? (like getting a cv heh). I don't know how this stuff works over there w.r.t choice, payment, that kind of thing.

But if you get the sense he is just trying to get a paycheck then meh, another one imo (I actually once saw a private psychiatrist who did this, he ended up giving bull**** fake therapy in order to get his hours worth, he messed me up a bit because he was in no way qualified to do that kind of thing).

Is it possible to make a list of the ones available to you? Basically check them out on linkedin (most will be there), compile a doc with all of their experience and education, and see which ones seem the most promising on paper.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

@Rifa glad it went well . I hope it will help you with your problems. Might be obvious but I am a fan of therapy (used to think it was bs lol).


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## wmu'14 (Sep 17, 2010)

splendidbob said:


> Heh, I miss quite a lot of them as I have that relationships sub ignored. As you know, I am drawn to post angrily in those threads, but am also drawn to try to help you in these. It's quite confusing lol.


I do not mind when posters yell at me because it helps me challenge my beliefs. Sometimes a spanking will mature a child.  Also I have 3 threads going in that section ATM



splendidbob said:


> 1. Don't sweat the male / female psychologist stuff too much, what is of primary importance is that you like the psychologist. A good relationship is half of the battle. Yeh, would be better imo with a female one imo, but a good relationship where you respect the psychologist is the most important.
> 
> 2. I am very impressed with the way you haven't ruled it out and are considering going back (or finding a different psychologist). This kind of attitude demonstrates that you are heading in the right direction. And I don't mean this in a condescending way or anything, really. I only recently started to take this kind of attitude with things myself (it was / is one of my big problems, so I recognise what it actually represents, and yeh, it came from therapy for me lol).


 Not sure how I'll approach this issue, other then I must still go to a shrink.
Also thanks for the vote of confidence.



splendidbob said:


> So I guess there is a list of stuff you can try. Specific and measurable. Off the top of my head:


 Yes we learned about SMART goals in school. Seems like it'd help with getting a date.



splendidbob said:


> 1. See psychologist for some form of long term therapy


Working on it 



splendidbob said:


> 2. Short term CBT and a few months of practice. This could help w.r.t. thought challenging and so forth. Try a few therapists.


Same as 1. I don't know what CBT and wrt stand for tho.



splendidbob said:


> 3. Dating coach x 3 (short term, so try a few)
> 4. Life coach x 3


I need to have 3 dating coaches and 3 life coaches? :eek



splendidbob said:


> 5. Honest appraisals of your performance in key areas (communication by text, conversation skills)


 Shrink could help me w/ this


splendidbob said:


> 6. Set targets for having conversations with women per month


 Okay.


splendidbob said:


> 7. Source _high quality_ information about dating (be careful here, you don't want bad info).


Okay



splendidbob said:


> 8. Set targets for asking out x women per month


How do I go about asking a woman out?



splendidbob said:


> 9. Get feedback on dating profiles, pictures


Shrink could help with this. He'll probably just say it's fine though.


splendidbob said:


> 10. Optimise appearance (your looks aren't the problem btw, but if improvements can be made, they should be. There are lots of stuff pretty much every guy can do here).


This seems to be subjective. One of my friends told me I need to wear high-fashion stuff to get me a date. Another one of my friends says since I'm a nerd, I need to be wearing shirts that display my nerdiness.


splendidbob said:


> 11. Gain x number of female friends in 6 months


How do I do this?


splendidbob said:


> 12. Gain x number of male friends in 6 months


 My struggle is I don't really have any desire for more male friends. I am happy with the ones I have. I would like a couple to go out drinking once in a while though. My friends who enjoyed drinking moved away. (one to Florida, the other to the other side of the state)



splendidbob said:


> This woman thing is obviously the most important thing in your life atm, you have (I think) a decent income, so perhaps its time to start investing serious time and money into this and start really going after it with brutal purpose. Not saying you aren't trying atm (you obviously are), but getting stuff on paper, developing a tight, measurable plan, and following it through like a deranged lunatic. And if you finish, and you still didn't get where you wanted, you know you have done everything.


Yep


splendidbob said:


> Hope this is taken in the right way mate, not at all a criticism. Like I say, this is what I am about to do myself with my major problem.
> .


Nope this post is very positive. 


splendidbob said:


> I may be able to help you a bit with appearance stuff, not that I am an expert there either, but I improved mine a fair bit. I need to repeat here that your appearance isn't bad, you look like an average to slightly above average looking guy to me. Everyone can improve appearance though . I can even help you brainstorm things to try.


You're not an expert with appearance? Wow. I thought you might've been because you frequently post in the Fragrance thread.

Also my nose and my neck are hideous. My nose is too long/big (i have a pic of it on here) and my neck sticks out like a giraffe. I have a bird appearance. I am not above average I can tell you that otherwise I'd have more luck with dating sites.


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## SplendidBob (May 28, 2014)

@Rifa glad it went well . I hope it will help you with your problems. Might be obvious but I am a fan of therapy (used to think it was bs lol).


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