# How much do you want a partner who also has SA?



## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

This question is for guys and girls. 

Some people want someone that gets them from having similar experiences, while some people want someone normal to balance out their SA.

Some people who have SA are turned off by others with it. Some actually seek someone else with SA.

Even as I get more confident and comfortable with myself, it still lingers in the back of my mind that "Who's going to want to deal with my things?" What woman would want to be with someone that is nervous to go to events, needs to be alone to recharge from social interactions, and is tired more often than not /:

So I think, well, what about seeking a partner that is like me? But still, maybe she'd just want someone stronger to balance out her own problems.

I kwow this is a common topic, I guess I'm just confused as to who I'd want to pursue, also.

Which are you? How much do you want a partner who also has SA?


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## My Name Isnt Dave (Jun 23, 2015)

honestly, I wouldn't mind either way. But for the sake of the poll I voted without. Maybe my first girlfriend should be someone outgoing, or, more so then me. Get me to open up a bit and maybe challenge myself more than I would with someone who is also S.A.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

My Name Isnt Dave said:


> honestly, I wouldn't mind either way. But for the sake of the poll I voted without. Maybe my first girlfriend should be someone outgoing, or, more so then me. Get me to open up a bit and maybe challenge myself more than I would with someone who is also S.A.


My first girlfriend during and after high school was very outgoing. I couldn't keep up. She'd dive right into social situations, I wanted to run for the door. Needless to say, this led to a lot of stress and tension, and hurt the relationship.

So in hindsight, I would think someone else with SA would be good for a first girlfriend/boyfriend. Any relationships after that, and you would steadily branch out of your personal comfort zone as you also become more comfortable with dating, and yourself.


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

SA or not, we just need to be able to get along and have fun with each other. Though I've always been very attracted to shy girls, and I'd prefer a shy/SA girl if we were able to click, but I've almost exclusively dated outgoing girls due to the fact that they just put themselves out there more so people can have a chance to meet them. So I've slowly given up on the idea of dating a shy girl since I have a hard time putting myself out there and they do too, so odds are that I'm going to be with a more outgoing type of girl.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

crimeclub said:


> SA or not, we just need to be able to get along and have fun with each other. Though I've always been very attracted to shy girls, and I'd prefer a shy/SA girl if we were able to click, but I've almost exclusively dated outgoing girls due to the fact that they just put themselves out there more so people can have a chance to meet them. So I've slowly given up on the idea of dating a shy girl since I have a hard time putting myself out their and they do too, so odds are that I'm going to be with a more outgoing type of girl.


True, also, I notice I can hold a conversation with talkative girls so much better, you can respond so easily to what they are saying. Note that this does not apply to girls with tons of attitude/arrogance. Turn off! lol XD


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## saperson (Jun 28, 2015)

I would like a partner with SA (but anxiety in general is OK too, and depression as well). It just allows me to connect better. Plus I'm afraid with a "normal" partner she would drag me to a lot of stuff i hate like big parties or bars


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## acidicwithpanic (May 14, 2014)

Without - most of the time. If they have SA, they have to be willing to improve their condition. Most of my friends are the outgoing type which I've been accustomed to for so long, so it's hard for me to become friends with other quiet, reserved people. In my experience, it's hard for either of us to initiate contact which makes maintaining a friendship difficult.


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## My Name Isnt Dave (Jun 23, 2015)

Gojira said:


> My first girlfriend during and after high school was very outgoing. I couldn't keep up. She'd dive right into social situations, I wanted to run for the door. Needless to say, this led to a lot of stress and tension, and hurt the relationship.
> 
> So in hindsight, I would think someone else with SA would be good for a first girlfriend/boyfriend. Any relationships after that, and you would steadily branch out of your personal comfort zone as you also become more comfortable with dating, and yourself.


hmm, good point. Never really thought about it that way.
I do well being pushed to do things by others I find. So it's hard to say


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## Kevin001 (Jan 2, 2015)

It would help. She would be understanding of my situation and not judge since she is dealing with similar issues.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

saperson said:


> I would like a partner with SA (but anxiety in general is OK too, and depression as well). It just allows me to connect better. Plus I'm afraid with a "normal" partner she would drag me to a lot of stuff i hate like big parties or bars


Yes, that is my concern, your last sentence, that I won't be able to reciprocate, and that will just strain the relationship anyway.



acidicwithpanic said:


> Without - most of the time. If they have SA, they have to be willing to improve their condition. Most of my friends are the outgoing type which I've been accustomed to for so long, so it's hard for me to become friends with other quiet, reserved people. In my experience, it's hard for either of us to initiate contact which makes maintaining a friendship difficult.


Suppose with online dating and getting to know someone through messages and chats before meeting, does this change your opinion? This helps to alleviate the "Difficult to meet others with SA in the first place" problem.

And yes, I agree, showing the character of doing something about your SA is needed.


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## acidicwithpanic (May 14, 2014)

Gojira said:


> Suppose with online dating and getting to know someone through messages and chats before meeting, does this change your opinion? This helps to alleviate the "Difficult to meet others with SA in the first place" problem.
> 
> And yes, I agree, showing the character of doing something about your SA is needed.


I'm not a fan of online dating to begin with, but hypothetically speaking maybe. I've become friends with people online, mostly long-distance though, so there's that small possibility.


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## Genos (Dec 17, 2014)

don't care much but it seems like the personality traits i value the most are more common in non-sa people or people with mild sa so i voted that


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

It's not something I'd seek out. I mean, I don't want it in myself either. SA just makes things harder. If it doesn't get in the way of having a healthy relationship, then I'd be okay with it. But it is just an obstacle, nothing appealing about it.


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## Peighton (Jun 12, 2015)

I don't think it's as much of a black and white subject for me so much as a spectrum. I wouldn't mind either if they're at least willing to work things out between us but both sides do have their extremes in which I personally can't see things working out just because we'd be so different but you never know. Life's full of surprises.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

Touka said:


> don't care much but it seems like the personality traits i value the most are more common in non-sa people or people with mild sa so i voted that


Not that they are representative of all women, but what traits?



Peighton said:


> I don't think it's as much of a black and white subject for me so much as a spectrum. I wouldn't mind either if they're at least willing to work things out between us but both sides do have their extremes in which I personally can't see things working out just because we'd be so different but you never know. Life's full of surprises.


This is true, we all fall on a sliding scale, somewhere in the grey area.



scooby said:


> It's not something I'd seek out. I mean, I don't want it in myself either. SA just makes things harder. If it doesn't get in the way of having a healthy relationship, then I'd be okay with it. But it is just an obstacle, nothing appealing about it.


Hmm, maybe, but my concern stems from the tension between an outgoing gf and myself bc of SA actually WAS an obstacle in the relationship.


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

Been there, done that, never again. It just makes things more difficult and adds drama to the relationship and if I can avoid that then I will. 

I do however prefer the more introverted nature of a person though, but that's possible without them suffering SA or depression.


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## Scrub-Zero (Feb 9, 2004)

My best relationship was with someone shy like me.

10/10 would do again.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

AussiePea said:


> Been there, done that, never again. It just makes things more difficult and adds drama to the relationship and if I can avoid that then I will.
> 
> I do however prefer the more introverted nature of a person though, but that's possible without them suffering SA or depression.





Scrub-Zero said:


> My best relationship was with someone shy like me.
> 
> 10/10 would do again.


Hmm, ahh, ze duality of life XD :clap


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Gojira said:


> Hmm, maybe, but my concern stems from the tension between an outgoing gf and myself bc of SA actually WAS an obstacle in the relationship.


Like I said, SA is an obstacle. Whether you have it and they don't and it causes tension, or you both have it.


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## nubly (Nov 2, 2006)

Wouldn't care as long as she's attractive and able to hold down a job.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

So far, it is 4/1 in favor of an SA partner for men, and 1/3 opposed to an SA partner for woman. 

My theory is that SA traits are simply unattractive to most woman, unfortunately.

Though this does validate my initial concerns, a woman won't want to deal with my SA problems, and it will cause relationship issues.

The below poster basically sums this up.

Good times.


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## coeur_brise (Oct 7, 2004)

I do like people who are talkative and who actually take the time to talk to me even if I don't say a peep. Which is fairly unfair, but that's the struggle with SA. I'd probably prefer that they are more social than I am or at most, not nervous arround me at all. So.. Yeah. Extroverts do make me feel bubbly though. ^_^ probably because I'm deprived of bubbles.


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## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

I don't care. Where's the option for that?


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## CopadoMexicano (Aug 21, 2004)

I care. She be a nutcase and no way in hell id be ok with that. a lot of girls with sa are meanies. i dont need that chit


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## blue2 (May 20, 2013)

I don't really want anyone they'll expect me to shower, brush my teeth, get a haircut spend money on nice things for em do I look like superman I'm going more for hobo with a shotgun look ...?


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

It's important that they understand what anxiety and panic attacks feel like and that they know what it's like to be too scared to do fairly small social activities and what depression is like...but it's usually better if they don't have SA themselves, at least not so bad that it really keeps them from doing things in life. I don't want the pressure of never knowing when I have to be the strong brave one. Being in a relationship with someone who has SA too is like, "great, we're both scared to do it, let's just not do it, or let's argue about who has to, and this just sucks." And then we're both sad useless lump people sometimes. Ugh it's just the worst in my experience.


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## Evo1114 (Dec 9, 2012)

It would probably be better for me to be with somebody more extroverted, but I really don't care. My days of being picky are long passed.


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## blue2 (May 20, 2013)

gopherinferno said:


> ...but it's usually better if they don't have SA themselves, at least not so bad that it really keeps them from doing things in life.


True if 2 people are afraid of everything that's no fun thankfully I'm starting reach a stage where the fear is around 20% when it was more like 80% 10 years ago so I could quite possibly be a functional adult yet:yay


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

gopherinferno said:


> It's important that they understand what anxiety and panic attacks feel like and that they know what it's like to be too scared to do fairly small social activities and what depression is like...but it's usually better if they don't have SA themselves, at least not so bad that it really keeps them from doing things in life. I don't want the pressure of never knowing when I have to be the strong brave one. Being in a relationship with someone who has SA too is like, "great, we're both scared to do it, let's just not do it, or let's argue about who has to, and this just sucks." And then we're both sad useless lump people sometimes. Ugh it's just the worst in my experience.


I get what you are saying, but I dislike this because I would want to work through and have both people support each other through overcoming SA, while as you said, understanding what anxiety and panic attacks are like.

It bothers me that I have to be the strong one all of the time, or alone. Those are my choices? Not mutual? Hmm.

It's seems like this strategy is leading to a lot of lonely people 

I can understand wanting to be supported, but to me, it's a two way street /:

I'm just noting the disparity in the polling, just my opinion. I don't see why the man is expected do the bulk of supporting in the SA relationship, and receive less support, all SA and related problems being equal.

It's just odd a lot of men here would accept a girl with SA problems that accepts them too, but many woman are expressing the opposite /:


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## iCod (Feb 17, 2015)

I want a nice, quiet and shy girl with SA. She wouldn't want to leave the house a lot so we'd be able to just watch Netflix all day and eat ice cream. lol. That's seriously the dream relationship for me. Plus, I wouldn't be the only one who would be awkward and a bad conversationalist in the relationship. We could share our hate for normies and maybe play some video games too...Maybe even read together outside on occasion. 

Man, I want a person like this so badly it's not even funny...


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

Gojira said:


> I get what you are saying, but I dislike this because I would want to work through and have both people support each other through overcoming SA, while as you said, understanding what anxiety and panic attacks are like.
> 
> It bothers me that I have to be the strong one all of the time, or alone. Those are my choices? Not mutual? Hmm.
> 
> ...


"support" comes in many forms. and you can provide plenty of it even if you're the shy scared one. you can be the one doing the laundry and nursing them and taking care of them when they're sick or tired or just plain too lazy to get up. just because i don't want the pressure of having to talk to the sales person about returning this malfunctioning fan doesn't mean i'm some kind of drain and burden on my SO who is more able to do such things


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## silentstruggle (Jul 16, 2014)

The problem is, if you have a partner without SA they usually don't get it. I am always worrying that they are gonna leave and find someone "normal"


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

gopherinferno said:


> "support" comes in many forms. and you can provide plenty of it even if you're the shy scared one. you can be the one doing the laundry and nursing them and taking care of them when they're sick or tired or just plain too lazy to get up. just because i don't want the pressure of having to talk to the sales person about returning this malfunctioning fan doesn't mean i'm some kind of drain and burden on my SO who is more able to do such things


You are absolutely right.

Like I said before, this is the "complete me" option. It's probably the most difficult of the two to make work, also.

I just find it interesting, guys look for common ground and mutual support of their SA and mutual understanding of it. Girls want strength and to be supported in their SA and to be understood. Sigh.

At least we've pinned down the cause for all of this loneliness on SAS, even though someone managed to create a place where we all congregate, hahaha :clap

Ze two genders simply want two different things, who would have thought XD Thing is, it's easier to accept someone for their SA than it is to grow confidence from trees. Just my opinion.

Edit: And actually, I think a lot of women realize this during/after the "complete me" relationship, I've seen the "My boyfriend/husband just doesn't get my SA /: " posts.



silentstruggle said:


> The problem is, if you have a partner without SA they usually don't get it. I am always worrying that they are gonna leave and find someone "normal"


Ditto.


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## tea111red (Nov 8, 2005)

I would just like whoever I end up w/ to at least be understanding and balance me out. They don't need to have SA.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

tea111red said:


> I would just like whoever I end up w/ to at least be understanding and balance me out. They don't need to have SA.


Like I just said above, this is the "complete me" option.

While I think a lot of guys look for the "mutual support option". Yes, you can do what gophers aid, and take care of a normie guy when he's sick, tired, lazy or whatever else, but that's really not the same level as overcoming SA with someone.

Me thinks the lack of compromise leads to much loneliness for both parties on SAS, just saying.


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## girlafraid1991 (Jun 30, 2015)

I prefer to date people with SA simply because it is nice to have someone to talk to about SA that understands. I am currently married and my husband does not have SA and it is very difficult for him to understand, although he does try.


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## digmeup (Jul 8, 2015)

I guess it's only natural for women to want a strong man who will protect them. Having SA isn't exactly protector status.

I personally want someone like me, though. I want someone who can understand, someone who would rather stay home with me than go out. I don't want someone who's better off and too good for a shy girl like me. I'd never fully be able to believe that they would actually want me.


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

Gojira said:


> You are absolutely right.
> 
> Like I said before, this is the "complete me" option. It's probably the most difficult of the two to make work, also.
> 
> ...


where exactly are you getting this information/statistics? is it just this thread? is it just what you've decided is "usually the case"?

why are you so so _so_ strongly implying...well, flat-out saying that women need to just suck it up and date guys with SA even if they don't want to? or even vice-versa?

this opinion seems like it's based on: "I can't get dates, and I am not very picky, therefore other people shouldn't be picky, either"

there's no reason for anyone to just settle or "give someone a chance" if they are very apprehensive about it. hesitation is there for a reason. stop blaming people for not wanting to date you or others like you.


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## tea111red (Nov 8, 2005)

I dunno if I would be good w/ someone w/ SA if they were not the type of person that wanted to overcome their issues/were not into self-improvement. I could just see myself becoming very frustrated and lashing out at them. It might be to their benefit to not be w/ me, lol.

But, I guess I would be okay w/ someone w/ SA if they made an effort to improve or had a strong desire to.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

digmeup said:


> I guess it's only natural for women to want a strong man who will protect them. Having SA isn't exactly protector status.
> 
> I personally want someone like me, though. I want someone who can understand, someone who would rather stay home with me than go out. I don't want someone who's better off and too good for a shy girl like me. I'd never fully be able to believe that they would actually want me.


I think people are expecting it would be two SA people who just never get better... Is that possible? Sure. But to me, it's two people supporting each other through the nervousness, depression, anxiety, and all of the other crap that comes along. I really can't see this, "Who's going to answer the phone?!?!" battle happening if two people are committed to beating their SA. It would take just as much determination as the "complete me" relationship.

And ofc that's natural, but that's not everything. Oye. There's a lot of chicken **** normies, haven't you noticed? And I'm sure the typical SA man has more heart than you could pick out on the average city street, SA be damned.


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

Gojira said:


> Like I just said above, this is the "complete me" option.
> 
> While I think a lot of guys look for the "mutual support option". Yes, you can do what gophers aid, and take care of a normie guy when he's sick, tired, lazy or whatever else, but that's really not the same level as overcoming SA with someone.
> 
> Me thinks the lack of compromise leads to much loneliness for both parties on SAS, just saying.


you have a really nasty attitude about this. being so judgmental of anyone who says they don't want to/don't need to date someone who has SA, too.

don't spread your judgey hateyness on people who are making perfectly reasonable and healthy decisions in life. and you don't need to talk down to people for their totally benign opinions and logical dating preferences.


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## acidicwithpanic (May 14, 2014)

tea111red said:


> I dunno if I would be good w/ someone w/ SA if they were not the type of person that wanted to overcome their issues. I could just see myself becoming very frustrated and lashing out at them. It might be too their benefit to not be w/ me, lol.


Same. I get frustrated at myself, I don't know how I'd deal with someone else with SA on a daily basis. I'd feel like I would be taking care of multiple people. Gross.


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

Well having experienced this situation a couple of times, yeah it's nice when both parties are willing to put in a proper effort to overcome their SA but that has occurred a total 0 out of 2 times and it just led to me becoming incredibly frustrated and spending more time trying to comfort than actually enjoying the relationship. 

What I've found is that if someone isn't willing to overcome their SA on their own, they won't want to in a relationship. So people who would intend to use a relationship to overcome their SA are deluding themselves imo.

Mood swings, challenges to perform everyday social tasks, the inability to just go have an enjoyable night out. It's odd to me that people would actively wish to pursue this.


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

tea111red said:


> I dunno if I would be good w/ someone w/ SA if they were not the type of person that wanted to overcome their issues/were not into self-improvement. I could just see myself becoming very frustrated and lashing out at them. It might be to their benefit to not be w/ me, lol.
> 
> But, I guess I would be okay w/ someone w/ SA if they made an effort to improve or had a strong desire to.





acidicwithpanic said:


> Same. I get frustrated at myself, I don't know how I'd deal with someone else with SA on a daily basis. I'd feel like I would be taking care of multiple people. Gross.


yes, this is what i'm talking about. i've dealt with people who had SA and would always bury their head in the sand during stressful times, or make it so much worse by moaning about how sad and scared and hopeless they were, which forced me to be the one to maintain a positive outlook and make the plans and talk to the people and try to be all nice and encouraging. it's exhausting. and people with SA tend to be prone to depression and mood swings, so even if they are feeling dandy one day, they could be a basketcase the next. and i am already a basketcase myself a lot of the time, so it just seems like the blind leading the blind.


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## acidicwithpanic (May 14, 2014)

Gojira said:


> Like I just said above, this is the "complete me" option.
> 
> While I think a lot of guys look for the "mutual support option". Yes, you can do what gophers aid, and take care of a normie guy when he's sick, tired, lazy or whatever else, but that's really not the same level as overcoming SA with someone.
> 
> Me thinks the lack of compromise leads to much loneliness for both parties on SAS, just saying.


I've been involved with outgoing people without SA who actually were patient with me. Like you said, a lot of people without mental illnesses aren't going to be understanding and aren't willing to put up with your behavior in a long-term relationship. But there are good people out there. I've struggled to find them, but eventually they came to me.


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## islanders (Dec 15, 2014)

I've always preferred more outgoing and energetic girls but social anxiety isn't a turn off or anything to me. I do agree with those saying they'd have a hard time with someone not willing to at least try to overcome their issues.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

gopherinferno said:


> where exactly are you getting this information/statistics? is it just this thread? is it just what you've decided is "usually the case"?
> 
> why are you so so _so_ strongly implying...well, flat-out saying that women need to just suck it up and date guys with SA even if they don't want to? or even vice-versa?
> 
> ...





gopherinferno said:


> you have a really nasty attitude about this. being so judgmental of anyone who says they don't want to/don't need to date someone who has SA, too.
> 
> don't spread your judgey hateyness on people who are making perfectly reasonable and healthy decisions in life. and you don't need to talk down to people for their totally benign opinions and logical dating preferences.


Information? both. Obviously its not scientific, but you are not doubting the conclusion, just what it means.

Who said I'm not picky? I agree with another poster, someone who is not working on their SA already, likely won't in a relationship. So it won't work.

Obviously there are women who feel the opposite of you, and that's fine, but don't hate on me for expressing my opinion in support of mutual understanding. If you don't like it, DON'T DO IT.

And besides, saying that accepting SA is... LOWERING STANDARDS?? That is the statement that sounds awful hatey and judgmental.

And if I appeared condescending and talking down, I apologize. But that's really no different than when you get passionate on an issue, like you are right here, is it Gopher?

Either way, I apologize for anything that appeared condescending, but I still hold the same view, mutual SA support is better, and imo, would solve a lot of the loneliness and dating problems for a lot of people on SAS if they gave it a chance. But that doesn't mean you have to think it.

Jeesh.


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## jeanny (Apr 17, 2014)

digmeup said:


> *I guess it's only natural for women to want a strong man who will protect them.* Having SA isn't exactly protector status.


 Just like it's natural for men to want a weak woman so they can protect her and feel strong/dominant/more Alpha with her. That's probably the reason why most guys with SA want a girl with SA, not because...



Gojira said:


> ...guys look for common ground and mutual support of their SA and mutual understanding of it.


 Dem guyz...so deep.


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

Gojira said:


> Information? both. Obviously its not scientific, but you are not doubting the conclusion, just what it means.
> 
> Who said I'm not picky? I agree with another poster, someone who is not working on their SA already, likely won't in a relationship. So it won't work.
> 
> ...


haha what...are you saying that you know you tend to seem condescending and stuff all the time? like that's just a part of who you are? just like it's a part of who i am to be "passionate" about some issues? oh dear. (B

again, what you actually mean wasn't clear at first, and you said things that just sounded judgmental and whiny, so you came off as pretty douchey.










mutual SA support in a relationship can be a wonderful thing. it's a rare thing, though. but i guess so is a good relationship, period. but it's also hard for people with SA to just find someone like them irl. hard to find someone at all.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Gojira said:


> I get what you are saying, but I dislike this because I would want to work through and have both people support each other through overcoming SA
> ...
> I can understand wanting to be supported, but to me, it's a two way street


The 'supportive' option here is _"I want a partner with social anxiety"_. That's a strong statement. The results would probably be more favourable if the option was _"I wouldn't mind a partner with social anxiety"_.

Personally, I could say the latter statement is accurate for me, but not the first statement.

Building a relationship around a mental illness does not sound like a good idea. Do you want a partner, or do you want a therapist?



Gojira said:


> I'm just noting the disparity in the polling, just my opinion. I don't see why the man is expected do the bulk of supporting in the SA relationship, and receive less support, all SA and related problems being equal.
> 
> It's just odd a lot of men here would accept a girl with SA problems that accepts them too, but many woman are expressing the opposite /:


If there is a disparity between the number of guys and girls who "want a socially anxious partner", I'm thinking the 'desperation factor' may have something to do with it.

A number of guys here are very desperate for that connection (will make many concessions to make it happen), and they're desperate to feel a sense of security with that would-be connection, a need that is satisfied by the idea of a socially anxious girl who will understand him, support him, help him, etc. She would be viewed as reserved, withdrawn, and not likely to stray away -- the more flawed she is, the more appealing she seems in terms of security. This, compared to the non-SA girl who would be viewed as incapable of understanding, as brimming with self-confidence, and as someone who has 10 other options waiting in line to be with her (_"she'll stray the first chance she gets"_).

Do the girls here have the same level of desperation? Some of them are that way, but they are not represented here anywhere near the same level (in numbers) as the guys.

In the bigger picture, I doubt the average guy would not "want a socially anxious girl" any more than the other way around.

Going back to that again (_"I want someone with social anxiety"_)... It is a strong statement to suggest that the mental illness, itself, is an attractive trait. This would suggest some serious issues going on.


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## gopherinferno (Apr 7, 2009)

jeanny said:


> Just like it's natural for men to want a weak woman so they can protect her and feel strong/dominant/more Alpha with her. That's probably the reason why most guys with SA want a girl with SA, not because...
> 
> Dem guyz...so deep.


yeah i thought the same thing but i wasn't gonna bother bringing it up because gender wars and hideous feminists you know


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## Persephone The Dread (Aug 28, 2010)

These threads always end up with people questioning why anyone would want to date someone with SA if they had SA themselves because it's not for them, and other people claiming that people who don't want to date someone with SA are wrong/judgemental/'but what about *insert factor here?'

So annoying to read. 

Anyway, I don't mind dating someone with SA, but it's not an exclusive preference. I would strongly prefer to date someone as introverted or more introverted than me though, and someone understanding in general.


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

Persephone The Dread said:


> These threads always end up with people questioning why anyone would want to date someone with SA if they had SA themselves because it's not for them, and other people claiming that people who don't want to date someone with SA are wrong/judgemental/'but what about *insert factor here?'
> 
> So annoying to read.
> 
> Anyway, I don't mind dating someone with SA, but it's not an exclusive preference. *I would strongly prefer to date someone as introverted or more introverted than me though*, and someone understanding in general.


You just want them to be introverted so you can have dominance over them, you misandric female woman. And don't even bother with that BS others try to say about just wanting common ground on a major part of your life, or someone who will be understanding, blah blah. I see right through it.


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## andy0128 (Dec 19, 2003)

I never dated anyone with SA. I suppose it would've been good from the point of view they can understand better what you're going through, but on the other hand conversation may dry up.


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## Persephone The Dread (Aug 28, 2010)

crimeclub said:


> You just want them to be introverted so you can have dominance over them, you misandric female woman. And don't even bother with that BS others try to say about just wanting common ground on a major part of your life, or someone who will be understand, blah blah. I see right through it.


lol I guess I find introverted body language more attractive, and introverted guys are usually OK doing their own thing and being alone, tend to be more focussed on hobbies and interests. I think I like how introverted guys tend not to be as open straight away as well. There's other reasons too I guess but it's more just summed up like ':3 *mushy feels*' in my brain.

I have a mix of extroverted and introverted interests myself, and am probably somewhere in between if you remove SA/avoidance. I'd be open to going to a music festival with the right people, and alternative clubs now and then, but though I quite like the idea of 'experiences' I'm not really into hanging out with lots of random people, so there's a weird conflict there. Maybe that's part of why I enjoy going to concerts alone so much.


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

Persephone The Dread said:


> lol I guess I find introverted body language more attractive, and introverted guys are usually OK doing their own thing and being alone, tend to be more focussed on hobbies and interests. I think I like how introverted guys tend not to be as open straight away as well. There's other reasons too I guess but it's more just summed up like ':3 *mushy feels*' in my brain.
> 
> I have a mix of extroverted and introverted interests myself, and am probably somewhere in between if you remove SA/avoidance. I'd be open to going to a music festival with the right people, and alternative clubs now and then, but though I quite like the idea of 'experiences' I'm not really into hanging out with lots of random people, so there's a weird conflict there. Maybe that's part of why I enjoy going to concerts alone so much.


I totally agree, there are definitely some practical aspects of why I want to be with a shy, introverted (maybe SA depending on how it affects her) person, and that's the logical aspect of thinking about a relationship, but the emotional/feels aspect can totally be summed up with ':3 *mushy feels*' and that side of it is just more fun to talk about on here, but then that will of course be interpreted by others as things having to do with ulterior motives or "cute = puppy dog cute", dominance, yadda yadda. Anyway we all like what we like.


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## jeanny (Apr 17, 2014)

crimeclub said:


> I totally agree, there are definitely some practical aspects of why I want to be with a shy, introverted (maybe SA depending on how it affects her) person...but then that will of course be interpreted by others as things having to do with ulterior motives or "cute = puppy dog", dominance, yadda yadda. Anyway we all like what we like.


Of course there could be other reasons, but there is a larger number of guys who would want a shy/SA girl, than girls who would want a shy/SA guy. How come?


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

jeanny said:


> Of course there could be other reasons, but there is a larger number of guys who would want a shy/SA girl, than girls who would want a shy/SA guy. How come?


I can't speak for anybody, and neither can you. But I'm sure what you said does occur plenty. But when SA effects every aspect of your life, including things like being misunderstood by everyone on a daily basis, having a hard time keeping a relationship due to that major incompatibility, endless lonely nights, etc, then wanting to date someone who understands your situation clearly isn't far-fetched. It's absurd to know that but still try to peg people (that you don't know at all) with an ulterior motive.

Why do some guys prefer being dominant? Because some guys just do? I personally have never cared about dominance in any aspect of life, I find mutual respect to be much more appealing in a relationship.


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## Dre12 (Jul 25, 2014)

Persephone The Dread said:


> lol I guess I find introverted body language more attractive, and introverted guys are usually OK doing their own thing and being alone, tend to be more focussed on hobbies and interests. I think I like how introverted guys tend not to be as open straight away as well. There's other reasons too I guess but it's more just summed up like ':3 *mushy feels*' in my brain.
> 
> I have a mix of extroverted and introverted interests myself, and am probably somewhere in between if you remove SA/avoidance. I'd be open to going to a music festival with the right people, and alternative clubs now and then, but though I quite like the idea of 'experiences' I'm not really into hanging out with lots of random people, so there's a weird conflict there. Maybe that's part of why I enjoy going to concerts alone so much.


Same really.

I like doing things I guess. I really want to go to Glastonbury again one day and I like going to gigs, but I am not to keen on doing things alone so these days I only catch the odd blues gig if my parents ask me if I want to go! I am going to see Tool on my own if they ever tour again in the UK, that is a definite. I used to go to Man Utd on my own a few times a season too but got sick of the hiking ticket prices along with paying for Sky TV.

I don't fear superficial interactions with people it is more the focused kind of 'socialising' in groups. All that getting to know people and chumming up that freaks me out. My ex girlfriend dragged me along to a cocktail bar in the City once to meet up with some of her cosmopolitan girlfriends. It was like a poor mans version of Sex in the City. It was one of the most harrowing experiences of my life! I felt like a fish out of water to say the least.

I would like a partner who is a loner type but content with that. Just someone to do things with I suppose. Mooching round the City, art galleries and cinema etc. I am thinking of starting going to the cinema on my todd actually. I went to see Mad Max immediately after work one day and it was really quiet and pleasant in there.

I simply have no plans to expand my social horizons.

It is really about finding someone who fits in with my lifestyle I feel not some damaging patriarchal psychology.


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## jeanny (Apr 17, 2014)

crimeclub said:


> I can't speak for anybody, and neither can you. But I'm sure what you said does occur plenty. But when SA effects every aspect of your life, including things like being misunderstood by everyone on a daily basis, having a hard time keeping a relationship due to that major incompatibility, endless lonely nights, etc, then wanting to date someone who understands your situation clearly isn't far-fetched. It's absurd to know that but still try to peg people (that you don't know at all) with an ulterior motive.
> 
> Why do some guys prefer being dominant? Because some guys just do? I personally have never cared about dominance in any aspect of life, I find mutual respect to be much more appealing in a relationship.


Lol, I'm not accusing anyone for ''ulterior'' motives or that they want dominance, I'm just saying that guys with SA will be more inclined to date shy girls because shy girls are less of a threat to them (opposed to non-shy girls)...and it's not all because of ''mushy'' reasons as Gojira presents it, if that was the main reason more girls would prefer SA guys, since they are usually the ''mushy'' gender. No?

But yes, I understand that part of the reason that SA guys want a girl with same issues are because they want someone who understands them, someone they can be open with, and show emotions, and all that crap they can't with others because they are supposed to be manly and all...sorry, I'm not into that mushy talk...


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

jeanny said:


> Lol, I'm not accusing anyone for ''ulterior'' motives or that they want dominance, I'm just saying that guys with SA will be more inclined to date shy girls because shy girls are less of a threat to them (opposed to non-shy girls)...and it's not all because of ''mushy'' reasons as Gojira presents it, if that was the main reason more girls would prefer SA guys, since they are usually the ''mushy'' gender. No?
> 
> But yes, I understand that part of the reason that SA guys want a girl with same issues are because they want someone who understands them, and they can be open with, and show emotions, and all that crap they can't with others because they are supposed to be manly and all...sorry, I'm not into that mushy talk...


I guess a lot of people are affected by societal conditioning/expectations, males and females equally.


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## jeanny (Apr 17, 2014)

crimeclub said:


> I guess a lot of people are affected by societal conditioning/expectations, males and females equally.


And one of the social conditioning/expectations for males is to be stronger/more confident/etc than females. That's why males with SA are more willing to date SA females, than it's other way around.


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

jeanny said:


> And one of the social conditioning/expectations for males is to be stronger/more confident/etc than females. That's why males with SA are more willing to date SA females, than it's other way around.


That definitely happens a lot, I just don't get why you're so preoccupied with this idea.


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## jeanny (Apr 17, 2014)

crimeclub said:


> That definitely happens a lot, I just don't get why you're so preoccupied with this idea.


 I'm not preoccupied. The difference between male and female votes is interesting. I just stated my opinion on why is that so.


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## Omoidekozo (May 27, 2012)

I wouldn't be put off at all by someone who suffers like I do. But if I can help it, I'd like someone that doesn't budge easily and is capable of pushing me when I need it. I know I'm going to do the same for them. Hell, someone with else with SA might be able to do that for me, but knowing that my partner doesn't have to suffer through their own mental hell would make me more confident in the relationship.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

I prefer if they don't. I've already got that aspect of the personality covered, they can be the outgoing one that pushes boundaries.


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

jeanny said:


> I'm not preoccupied. The difference between male and female votes is interesting. I just stated my opinion on why is that so.


Is it interesting though? I assumed it was just expected. The way society conditions us is obvious, as well as the fact that we're the product of millions and millions of years of humans being a certain way, something like that will have an affect even on things like preferences between males and females.


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## identificationunknown (Jan 23, 2014)

I don't care honestly..

but i think it is easier opening up to someone who's shy tho...

i don't know.. i just feel if u open up to someone confident they'd laugh at u or something..


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## SofaKing (May 9, 2014)

It depends on their level of functioning with SA. I like being with someone who understands, but also think two people should help each other grow and heal and hopefully not enable dysfunction.


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## minimized (Nov 17, 2007)

I would be lucky if anyone would accept me.

I can see both sides though: an SA girl would be more likely to understand, but a non-SA girl would be more likely to push me.

I'd like both.


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## Cenarius (Aug 2, 2014)

crimeclub said:


> You just want them to be introverted so you can have dominance over them


I'm mixed about this. On the one hand, yes, a socially anxious girl might be easier to control and more likely to cave to pressure, but she also might be more self-conscious and shy so she'd resist getting naked instead. I need that balance of meek and insecure, but comfortable with her body and not too scared of sex.


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## Ntln (Apr 27, 2012)

I've been thinking about this a lot, having had a lot of friends with anxiety through this site, and thinking over the reasons why I used to really want someone with similar issues to me.

I think, ultimately, I want someone who is introverted/a loner, most definitely. Going out with someone who just operates on a whole other social level as me, who has lots of friends, to whom being the life of the party, making new friends and going out every weekend is second nature........ frankly it just wouldn't work out. If they were introverted and/or a bit of a loner, it wouldn't make a difference whether they had SA or not, since even without all my anxiety I'd be a loner with a small circle of close friends. So, essentially, it's not a necessity


However, would it be an obstacle? That's a tougher question. I stand by that I don't feel you should demand anything from your partner that you either can't provide to them yourself, or at least can't compliment in some way, so me refusing to date someone with SA makes no sense. I feel, SA at the level I have it wouldn't be a big deal at all, if we were able to support each other and communicate effectively. But, it might be a problem if
a) It stops her from communicating with me or allowing herself to get as close to me as she'd like (this was a problem with my ex, whose SA was otherwise less severe than mine). This is something I can tolerate in friends, but not in a relationship, since I'm insecurely attached as it is.

b) Her SA is significantly worse than mine- let's face it, I'm in absolutely NO position to take care of someone with far worse issues than me, if I can't even handle my own life

So, I guess it's a pretty tough question for me :/


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## crimeclub (Nov 7, 2013)

Cenarius said:


> I'm mixed about this. On the one hand, yes, a socially anxious girl might be easier to control and more likely to cave to pressure, but she also might be more self-conscious and shy so she'd resist getting naked instead. I need that balance of meek and insecure, but comfortable with her body and not too scared of sex.


Sometimes you just speak my mind in a way I could never verbalize myself. Thank you.

You really hit me right here...right here in the feels.


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## JustThisGuy (Mar 24, 2012)

Mo option for 'don't care'?


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## LoneWolf14 (Dec 18, 2014)

I've done it, I think it could've worked well if we both would've talked about it. But no we kept to ourselves like most SA suffers and crashed and burned. Done ****ed up again


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## thomasjune (Apr 7, 2012)

JustThisGuy said:


> Mo option for 'don't care'?


This ^
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

crimeclub said:


> Is it interesting though? I assumed it was just expected. The way society conditions us is obvious, as well as the fact that we're the product of millions and millions of years of humans being a certain way, something like that will have an affect even on things like preferences between males and females.


What's attractive is subjective to cultures as well, so societal conditioning, yes. Biological component? Ofc there is. But we also have the ability to be shallow. Or not.

I could see if someone were self loathing and defeatist. But there are a lot of people putting forth a terrific effort, and it still falls short of societal expectations.

I do believe it is both interesting and of interest. Of interest, because it is a real phenomenon that affects people with SA. To me, interesting because it also has a psychological component, and Psychology is interesting to me.


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## Invisiblehandicap (Jul 31, 2011)

Id prefer someone with SA, even though I have minor SA now. I dont really like the stuff that extroverts do for fun.


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## Malek (Oct 4, 2012)

I wouldn't care as long as she shows she appreciates me and makes me feel loved. Everyone has their own problems, I don't expect her support to fix me, that is solely contingent on my actions alone.


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## Dre12 (Jul 25, 2014)

Cenarius said:


> I'm mixed about this. On the one hand, yes, a socially anxious girl might be easier to control and more likely to cave to pressure, but she also might be more self-conscious and shy so she'd resist getting naked instead. I need that balance of meek and insecure, but comfortable with her body and not too scared of sex.


You should put this on your dating profile. It's hot!


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

Invisiblehandicap said:


> Id prefer someone with SA, even though I have minor SA now. I dont really like the stuff that extroverts do for fun.


Introvert /= SA though.


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## visualkeirockstar (Aug 5, 2012)

It doesn't matter. I won't ever have a gf anyway.


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## Blue Dino (Aug 17, 2013)

I'm not sure. An outgoing guy, he can shoulder the load of being the outgoing one and spark in our social interactions, though I would be mentally drained overtime. Vice versa, a guy with SA, I would have to exhausted myself of being the outgoing one, but once I am not, our relationship would be of awkward silence. 

My bf now actually is more of an introvert, more than me, so the latter is true for me right now. Honestly it isn't too bad, once we trust each other and we're compatible with one another, to the point now that our awkward silences has long become comfort habitual silences. We talk and be outgoing when we feel like it. In the end, it's more about finding the right partner.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

Why do people think because you have SA or are introverted, you don't have a vibrant inner personality to share with someone the more and more comfortable you get. As you get to know each other.

This is odd, stereotyping people with SA on an SA website.


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## Darktower776 (Aug 16, 2013)

I've never dated a girl with SA before, they always seemed fine socially. I guess they were more toward the introverted scale though and not super social and outgoing- though one of them did ask me out first so there's that.

I think I wouldn't mind dating a girl with SA toward the milder spectrum like myself. I mean there are things I can't/don't do but I can still leave the house and go do things on a day to day basis most of the time. My ideal would probably be a rather introverted and understanding girl. She wouldn't necessarily have SA but I wouldn't rule her out if she did either. Though there are things about bubbly, extroverted girls I find appealing as well, it's just I don't think we would mesh in other areas.


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## millyxox (Dec 18, 2009)

I noticed that I keep attracting guys that don't have SA. I attract guys that are very confident, loud, social butterflies, aggressive...
It's sometimes difficult to be in a relationship with those guys, because they are my opposite. Our personalities often clash...I guess on the outside we _seemed _different (outgoing vs. introvert) however on the inside, we were alike (stubborn, passionate, argumentative). The biggest problem with going out with an extrovert was social situations. They have TONS of friends that constantly want to hang out and meet you.

But going out with mr popular & outgoing was actually a good thing for me. I learned how to be assertive, how to gain confidence & etc. Most of all, I think going out with someone who doesn't have SA...made me grow. I guess I get into challenging relationships because without challenge there is no growth. I noticed that I have become less shy because of my relationships with those guys.


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## indiscipline (May 24, 2015)

Anyone who can't give me enough space to silently dick around on my own with nothing in particular for hours on end isn't going to have a very good time being in a relationship with me. I don't really care what my partner has or does as long as she lets me be me, and I want a lot of space (especially the kind people travel to in funny white outfits)


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

millyxox said:


> I noticed that I keep attracting guys that don't have SA. I attract guys that are very confident, loud, social butterflies, aggressive...


I hate to say it but those guys will go after *anything and anyone*... The SA types are generally going to play it safe or not approach at all.


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## mjkittredge (Sep 8, 2012)

Either is okay, but I think I'd prefer someone without crippling SA. My last g/f was shy and quiet, but she'd still have no problem talking to strangers or being around people. She was brave and would go on adventures, traveling around the area and the world. I need someone like that to help me do more. With a trusted companion by my side, I become more brave, if not for myself, for them. Someone with SA, we'd just hide from the world together not really challenging each other to go out and do more.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

LoneWolf14 said:


> I've done it, I think it could've worked well if we both would've talked about it. But no we kept to ourselves like most SA suffers and crashed and burned. Done ****ed up again


I think this is going to be the main thing. 2 people with SA are going to have different challenges than one with/without and both without it. It can probably work either way but like all relationships are going to require the communication and understanding which unfortunately for SA people often means being more proactive and going outside our comfort more to make it work.


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## seeking777 (Oct 24, 2012)

crimeclub said:


> SA or not, we just need to be able to get along and have fun with each other. Though I've always been very attracted to shy girls, and I'd prefer a shy/SA girl if we were able to click, but I've almost exclusively dated outgoing girls due to the fact that they just put themselves out there more so people can have a chance to meet them. So I've slowly given up on the idea of dating a shy girl since I have a hard time putting myself out there and they do too, so odds are that I'm going to be with a more outgoing type of girl.


Ahh this. I think this is so true, for me at least, as a girl though. The outgoing guys are always the ones to approach. I could go either way although I'd prefer an introverted, reserved guy myself. I've never dated a guy w/o sa and would still need him to be introverted and compassionate/understanding of people with mental health disorders b/c some people struggle to understand our problem. And I am willing to face anxiety inducing situations. I'm finally at a point where I am not afraid to get out there and go places. I go places alone some of the time. I may be nervous but I'll still go if it's something I'm interested in and I have.



Gojira said:


> Why do people think because you have SA or are introverted, you don't have a vibrant inner personality to share with someone the more and more comfortable you get. As you get to know each other.
> 
> This is odd, stereotyping people with SA on an SA website.


I have noticed this a lot on sas. It's quite common. I think that some individuals here have low-self esteem/are insecure and believe they don't have good personalities. So they project that onto others with sa and just assume that the majority of us feel the same which is not the case necessarily. And also some individuals define themselves by sa when really they do have personalities and sa is not their identity. I struggled with the latter until I starting realizing that sa is not my identity, it's a part of me but I still am a whole person with other good qualities. More of us need to realize this.


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## Sean07 (May 9, 2014)

I'd much rather be with a girl who doesn't suffer from anxiety. If I'm ever going to get past this stage in my life then I'm sure it won't be with someone who enables my negative thought patterns and doesn't push me to go out and socialise/do things. 

I also don't understand the assumption that girls without SA aren't compassionate towards guys who are. Pretty much every girl I've been with has been extroverted/outgoing and they've all supported me as they could tell I tried my hardest to push myself into social situations. That said, they also helped to push me to do these things which for me is a much better form of support than just pure acceptance. This helped me to get passed many of my previous insecurities that I wouldn't have be able to tackle had I been with someone who enabled my previous way of life. It's good to get a push once in a while.


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## Countess (Nov 28, 2014)

I don't see how could I be with someone different or better than me. I won't be the kind of person to rely on their partner to be something else. "I want my partner to give me this, to give me that, to be something in order to make me feel like that"; that's the first mistake. If you are into a relationship in order to feel alive, the tendency is to get frustrated. You want someone to help you, to provide for you, but are you capable of filling their emotional gaps, too? You need someone who can push you to social conventions, but can you be the kind of person they would dream of hanging out with? So for me the big question is: can I be there for someone if I'm always falling apart? Could I apprehend other's needs while still trying to put back together my own shards?


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## bad baby (Jun 10, 2013)

i do not care honestly. having SA doesn't really tell me much about a person. someone can have SA and still be an arsehole. i like people who are not arseholes. i also like free-spirited, artsy kooks who are accepting of others' eccentricities and human failings (especially mine) (up to a reasonable extent though; i don't want a doormat ＠_＠). and if those two points happen to coincide, then SA or not, sparks will fly.


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## bluecrime (Jan 27, 2013)

I'd only be interested in someone introverted and shy, preferring there own company as opposed to the company of others. Extroversion and normality are massive turn offs for me. I find normality to be really ugly anyway.


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## LoneWolf14 (Dec 18, 2014)

knightofdespair said:


> I think this is going to be the main thing. 2 people with SA are going to have different challenges than one with/without and both without it. It can probably work either way but like all relationships are going to require the communication and understanding which unfortunately for SA people often means being more proactive and going outside our comfort more to make it work.


Yeah communication just wasnt't there unfortunetly. I honest don't think I'm in the mental state of being able to keep a girlfirend. I've come to realization I'm a piece of **** and not gonna manage to get a girlfriend because I'm not capable. Heck majority of my friends have already bailed, got almost nothing now.


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## kageri (Oct 2, 2014)

Did the SA relationship and a sorta not relationship. Utter failure. I'm not sure if the SA set the guys up to be the way they were or if it was a separate set of problems. The actual relationship we did less and less and less stuff until he couldn't go outside. He was doing random college classes online to say he was still working on college and eating pizza from places that would deliver from online ordering and credit cards. I had to take all trips to the store. He sat in his chair so much he went through 1 every 6 months no matter how expensive they were. He wouldn't walk across the street to the park much less anywhere else. I started going hiking alone around the lake. Finally I got so tired of pizza and being held back from doing anything that I left. Then came the whole threat to commit suicide, showing up where I was staying having over dosed on benzos and ambien, and when I found a house to rent breaking in to steal stuff. My mom called his family to come get him and a year later he stalked me everywhere online talking about how great he was, what all I missed out on, and all these computer programming languages he had accomplished learning in college. In 1 year.... Rolleyes and throw him on ignore/block across the whole of the internet I was using. 

Stupidly I attempted doing things with a 2nd guy who also had high SA. He did have a job (minimal human interaction) and could drive even if he wasn't making much money and his car had to be started with pliers. Eh, the previous guy had tons of money and that relationship went horribly south so let's try this. I hadn't planned to call it really a relationship though. More FWB. I wanted someone to hang out with. He heard wedding bells. I tried to tell him I didn't want to be his gf. He didn't want to do anything around people but just show up at my house 2 hrs before I wanted to get up on the weekends (and ignored me insisting a different time) and end up playing what video games I had. Sometimes while I did something else. I never committed to this relationship and it was irritating so I started talking to someone else. It took 3 months to make him realize it was over when there wasn't really anything to be over. When he finally understood we were not living together forever in a fairytale I made a slight effort to maintain the friendship which was all I was after in the first place but he never answered me again.

Happily married 6 years to a guy who does not have SA but is somewhat antisocial. More schizoid type.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

kageri said:


> Did the SA relationship and a sorta not relationship. Utter failure.


 I'm sorry for your experiences /:

Unfortunately, this is the stereotype of what people think of when dating a guy with SA. My car/baby definitely doesn't need pliers to start XD:surprise:


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

seeking777 said:


> I have noticed this a lot on sas. It's quite common. I think that some individuals here have low-self esteem/are insecure and believe they don't have good personalities. So they project that onto others with sa and just assume that the majority of us feel the same which is not the case necessarily. *And also some individuals define themselves by sa when really they do have personalities and sa is not their identity. I struggled with the latter until I starting realizing that sa is not my identity, it's a part of me but I still am a whole person with other good qualities. More of us need to realize this.*


 I think it's also the thirty year old guy living in his mother's basement stereotype.

Quite a few of the SA men here are working, independent, or at least making gains getting there. Having or beginning to have the same material lives as anyone else. But the cloak of SA, that "normies" don't have, blocks our true selves from being able to communicate with the outside world, keeps us from fully realizing our lives, and having the relationships that come along with being an adult.

That said, we are all at different stages. 5 years ago I was isolated, jobless, I consciously decided to speak only when necessary, that was my way to cope.

But since then, I've made a lot of gains, gotten myself financially stable, able to have better conversations, and my phone skills have gotten tons better  Still work to do, but I feel I am about 85% over my SA.

What bothers me is, according to popular opinion, that's still not good enough... some days, being around people at work, I felt like an alien, especially in the beginning... so imagine the worst SA situations you've had, and then imagine doing it everyday anyway, to reach your goals.

That takes "logical confidence" and courage. But because my brain doesn't project "behavioral confidence" correctly 100% of the time, I am unattractive, ugly as far as women are concerned, and viewed as less than capable by all. Which will inevitably begin to chip away at your logical confidence, due to being viewed as less than acceptable, despite fighting through challenges to achieve things even normal people do not.

So for me, I've begun to do what you describe in the bold section, and I think that helps me to see others as I want to be seen... to look for the person beneath the SA.

But, if I were ever cured of my SA, I am still glad to have had it, even the bad, because it has shaped my personality in ways I wouldn't be otherwise. So yes, a part of me it is, but not my whole identity. And it does take some effort to realize this. Good points :clap

P.S. So I am a little discouraged that 2/3 of women (non-scientific polling mind you, haha XD ) do not see this, but I am encouraged that at least 1/3 seem to, which is significant  It means there is hope of having a pretty normal, adult life, with a dash of SA, lol


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## alienjunkie (Jul 11, 2015)

I think having one that doesn't have SA would be for the best since it would probably help me grow out of mine.


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## acidicwithpanic (May 14, 2014)

Gojira said:


> I think it's also the thirty year old guy living in his mother's basement stereotype.
> 
> Quite a few of the SA men here are working, independent, or at least making gains getting there. Having or beginning to have the same material lives as anyone else. But the cloak of SA, that "normies" don't have, blocks our true selves from being able to communicate with the outside world, keeps us from fully realizing our lives, and having the relationships that come along with being an adult.
> 
> ...


I've thought about it and you mentioned the low confidence a lot of us have to face. I can't speak for everyone on here who has stated that they'd rather date a normie, but personally I know I would be a terrible fit for someone with SA because I am far from being the emotional, nurturing type. People with SA especially those that suffer severely from it need constant affirmations and emotional support, something I am unable to give. The most I can lend for a frustrated, ranting friend is a listening ear and some advice, which unfortunately is not enough sometimes as some would need hugs and physical contact for comfort. Come to think of it, I don't say "I love you" that much and my style of communication when it comes to showing someone I care is by doing practical things for them, like buying them things that they need or doing all of their household chores for them. When someone with SA has impaired judgment from their condition then my actions might be difficult to pick up on and I'm afraid that they might demand more affection from me to show them that I'm on their side. People with SA can be sensitive, and I have a history of angry outbursts and expressing strong opinions in front of others which can potentially hurt my partner if they had SA.

So yeah, I think this is something I've been meaning to say earlier but didn't know how to put in words at the time.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

alienjunkie said:


> I think having one that doesn't have SA would be for the best since it would probably help me grow out of mine.


I'd like to quote Countess, I think she states it more eloquently than I can:



Countess said:


> I don't see how could I be with someone different or better than me. I won't be the kind of person to rely on their partner to be something else. "I want my partner to give me this, to give me that, to be something in order to make me feel like that"; that's the first mistake. If you are into a relationship in order to feel alive, the tendency is to get frustrated. You want someone to help you, to provide for you, but are you capable of filling their emotional gaps, too? You need someone who can push you to social conventions, but can you be the kind of person they would dream of hanging out with? So for me the big question is: can I be there for someone if I'm always falling apart? Could I apprehend other's needs while still trying to put back together my own shards?


... That said, I would say, imo, that relationships do make us feel alive, the problem stems from needing to be propped up by another to BE alive. To be mutually supported is great, but to me, it's to easy to turn a non SAer into a crutch.

However, does that mean you won't pick up social skills in the process, or potentially avoid dependency? Ofc not. So, to me, seeking both types of relationships, knowing their potential positives and negatives, is the best approach to becoming a balanced person.

So would I date a normal person? Yes. Do I also feel that I would prefer someone with SA? Yes. But because of who I am, and what I know I want for myself, a relationship with mutual support of one another's SA would be the one I desire more. This is what I seek in a partner.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

acidicwithpanic said:


> I've thought about it and you mentioned the low confidence a lot of us have to face. I can't speak for everyone on here who has stated that they'd rather date a normie, but personally I know I would be a terrible fit for someone with SA because I am far from being the emotional, nurturing type. People with SA especially those that suffer severely from it need constant affirmations and emotional support, something I am unable to give. The most I can lend for a frustrated, ranting friend is a listening ear and some advice, which unfortunately is not enough sometimes as some would need hugs and physical contact for comfort. Come to think of it, I don't say "I love you" that much and my style of communication when it comes to showing someone I care is by doing practical things for them, like buying them things that they need or doing all of their household chores for them. When someone with SA has impaired judgment from their condition then my actions might be difficult to pick up on and I'm afraid that they might demand more affection from me to show them that I'm on their side. People with SA can be sensitive, and I have a history of angry outbursts and expressing strong opinions in front of others which can potentially hurt my partner if they had SA.
> 
> So yeah, I think this is something I've been meaning to say earlier but didn't know how to put in words at the time.


Well first, I am glad that you found the words to say want you wanted to 

Second, it is good that you know yourself so well and are comfortable. If being more affectionate or warmer was something you ever wanted to develop in yourself, I'd bet some relationships with fellow SAers would be an experience and a learning process, in quite the same way people expect dating a normal or more outgoing person would bring you different experiences and skills to learn in the social department.

Finally, I am happy to see the consideration for the hypothetical potential SA partner lol. Actually, I think that shows more warmness in you than you think you have.

At the end of the day, everyone has to decide what is best for themselves, no one knows you better than you, but I think dismissing others like ourselves only gives us half of the puzzle, and really, separates us from knowing some really good, interesting people.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Shyness, introversion, being a loner... These are personality traits. Social Anxiety Disorder is as it says -- a disorder.

Some people are equating the two.

It would be just as questionable for someone suffering from Schizophrenia or Bipolar Disorder or Anorexia to actively seek out a similarly suffering partner. It's a recipe for enabling, transference, and some serious problems once one or the other's condition improves.

None of this is to say it can't work out, but you'd be so much better off concerning yourself with common personality traits, interests, lifestyles, goals... and working on your health issues independent of the relationship (where your partner is... "your partner"... supportive, but not your therapist or your sponsor or *your cure*).

If you base a relationship on your mental illness and you're fortunate enough that it works out anyway, it won't be for having used Social Anxiety as the catalyst -- it will be _in spite of it_ and because you were a match in the first place (regardless of the mental health issues).

*To be very clear, this isn't about "just dating someone with social anxiety"... It's about "basing the relationship on it and the therapy for it" ("using each other" for mutual support).*



Gojira said:


> But since then, I've made a lot of gains, gotten myself financially stable, able to have better conversations, and my phone skills have gotten tons better  Still work to do, but I feel I am about 85% over my SA.
> 
> What bothers me is, according to popular opinion, that's still not good enough...


Whatever 'popular opinion' you are listening to, is wrong. As long as you are moving forward in life and don't look like a 600-year-old frog, you are most certainly dateable. All the other problems only exist in your head.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

Just Lurking said:


> Shyness, introversion, being a loner... These are personality traits. Social Anxiety Disorder is as it says -- a disorder.
> 
> Some people are equating the two.
> 
> ...


I think you are equating "support" in a relationship with "therapy", or a "cure".

These are not nearly the same concepts.

Ofc a relationship solely based on having SA would not get off of the ground, common interests and mutual attraction are the cornerstone of any relationship. I wouldn't want SA to be the sole topic of conversation with my girlfriend! XD

But you forget that one of the problems in starting a relationship for someone with SA in the first place is... lack of understanding from others. Even in the other disorders you mention, a person working on themselves is still allowed relationships...

A person with SA should be working on themselves, for themselves, independently, regardless;* this is your therapy*. The relationship is a place to find companionship with another such as yourself.

And I agree that the popular opinion is wrong, but that doesn't mean it does not have real world consequences.

So to sum up, you mention that there could problems, I certainly don't see the likely hood of any more or worse than if a person with SA engaged in a relationship with a person who does not have it.

As I mentioned before, getting dependent on your normie partner for access to social interactions would strain a relationship, and be unhealthy for both people.


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## SkyLightning (Jun 28, 2015)

i would prefer someone with sa... cant rly get along with a loud guy


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

Being overly dependant on any partner is a problem, be it for their social support or anxiety support. If you require another person to function, it's an issue.

So many people here also need to realise that just because you don't have SA, doesn't mean you're going to be some loud extrovert. There are many introverted people who do not suffer SA.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Gojira said:


> I think you are equating "support" in a relationship with "therapy", or a "cure".
> 
> These are not nearly the same concepts.
> 
> Ofc a relationship solely based on having SA would not get off of the ground, common interests and mutual attraction are the cornerstone of any relationship. I wouldn't want SA to be the sole topic of conversation with my girlfriend! XD


It's been alluded to in here and it's talked about (a lot) elsewhere on this site... People figuring a romantic partner is going to be the answer to all their problems. Add to that having a mental illness as the driving force behind that relationship (being not so much the 'sole topic of conversation' as the 'primary ingredient'), and there's going to be a lot of volatility there.

If you're not holding each other down, then at some point, someone's condition is going to improve. What happens next?


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## identificationunknown (Jan 23, 2014)

AussiePea said:


> Being overly dependant on any partner is a problem, be it for their social support or anxiety support. If you require another person to function, it's an issue.


But sometimes in public u want to be seen with a girl tho.. no?


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

identificationunknown said:


> But sometimes in public u want to be seen with a girl tho.. no?


No, my self esteem isn't that low. I don't need society to see me in a relationship to feel validated.

This is the problem I see here a lot, people seeking a relationship for some kind of validation, it's a recipe for disaster.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

Just Lurking said:


> It's been alluded to in here and it's talked about (a lot) elsewhere on this site... People figuring a romantic partner is going to be the answer to all their problems. Add to that having a mental illness as the driving force behind that relationship (being not so much the 'sole topic of conversation' as the 'primary ingredient'), and there's going to be a lot of volatility there.


I've seen the threads, it is false logic that a partner will fix you.

But this isn't one of those threads.

And actually, I don't know where in this thread it was alluded to that a partner would fix all of a persons problems. Again, as far as this thread is concerned, you are confusing "support" with "therapy".

"Main Ingredient". As long as one person in the couple has SA, it WILL be a "main ingredient", regardless if one or both have it. So it is not really an argument against SA/SA relationships.



> If you're not holding each other down, then at some point, someone's condition is going to improve. What happens next?


Umm, help the other??


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

AussiePea said:


> No, my self esteem isn't that low. I don't need society to see me in a relationship to feel validated.
> 
> This is the problem I see here a lot, people seeking a relationship for some kind of validation, it's a recipe for disaster.


The way I see the validation, it's more like negative reinforcement... in other words, when someone can't get a relationship going, thoughts like "I'm worthless." become valid... in the mind of the person suffering from SA, and, let's face it, many people in a position to observe this person's life...

You know, remember all of those times (and if not you, I'm sure others can relate) relatives, family friends, etc asked "Where's your girlfriend/ Do you have a girlfriend?" when you were younger? Because, to society, it is a valid/important question in regards to ones value/standing.

Because society expects you to have someone, too.

But let's not get too sidetracked, the main point is, people want someone to share themselves with. That is the driving reason people get into long term relationships with a "partner".

Edit: It should be noted the societal pressure to have a bf/gf is something both sexes feel.


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## Fangirl96 (Apr 13, 2015)

I dont think i could date someone who's superconfident and and social. People like that makes me uncomfortable and i'm not even attracted to them no matter how hot they are. I dont think they would understand me. At the same time i would need someone more confident than me that actually gets s*** done and makes me do things with my life. But i think i have always like the idea of finding another loner like me. The most important thing would be that they understand my problems and wont make fun of them. Pfff good luck to me with finding a guy like that.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

Fangirl96 said:


> Pfff good luck to me with finding a guy like that.


Aye dios mio! :doh blame God, it's not that we don't exist, it's that we keep getting placed so far apart! Hahaha


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## seeking777 (Oct 24, 2012)

Gojira said:


> I think it's also the thirty year old guy living in his mother's basement stereotype.
> 
> Quite a few of the SA men here are working, independent, or at least making gains getting there. Having or beginning to have the same material lives as anyone else. But the cloak of SA, that "normies" don't have, blocks our true selves from being able to communicate with the outside world, keeps us from fully realizing our lives, and having the relationships that come along with being an adult.
> 
> ...


I think it's good that you are giving yourself credit and recognizing the benefits that this struggle has had on your development, that shows maturity. And anyone on SAS should do the same. Give yourself credit for any strides you've made in overcoming sa.


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## Gojira (Jun 1, 2015)

seeking777 said:


> I think it's good that you are giving yourself credit and recognizing the benefits that this struggle has had on your development, that shows maturity. And anyone on SAS should do the same. Give yourself credit for any strides you've made in overcoming sa.


Aww, thank you ma'am 

It's not always easy to see, especially on bad SA days. But just doing your best with it counts for a lot, and that goes for anybody.

I just think that if people at least made the attempt to find the people beneath the SA, SAS would be a less lonelier place. I'd love to be able to date normal woman too, but to me, someone with SA really appeals to me. Just talking with some of the people I have met here, I feel like I am more accepted and understood, irl, it's so much harder. But I also know now that there are a good number of us that feel the same way and I wish the same feelings of community could extend into offline, but I believe that the better I become at coping with my SA, and sharing and being shared with by others like myself, the better I will be irl too.

Thank you again!


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