# GABA question, yes GABA, AGAIN



## Broshious (Dec 23, 2006)

I know that the GABA thing has been done to death, or at least I think it has =P It does not cross the BBB very much at all, but my question is what happens to it in the body? GABA is normally metabolized to succinic semialdehyde. Now succinic semialdehyde can be metabolized to GHB, or succinic acid. Does this happen outside the brain? And if so would orally ingested GABA raise GHB levels?


----------



## X33 (Feb 13, 2005)

-


----------



## Formerly Artie (Jun 26, 2007)

The only thing I can contribute is that GABA "needs" to cross the BBB to have any effect. GABA by itself doesn't. I don't know anything about succinic semialdehyde, but I would be interested in doing a little bit of research on that.

Picamilon has all the right ingredients for easy cross-over (GABA bonded to niacin), but for me personally, it doesn't seem to work, except perhaps on a minor scale. It's a bit of a shame, since I had high hopes for it.

As for GHB, I know OF it, but I've never taken it, being made illegal in '91 I believe. I don't want to get into the whole Phenibut thing again, but many people have compared it to GHB, or GBL - I forget. But anyway, when Phenibut works, it definitely works, but it certainly isn't for long-term treatment, even less so than benzos.


----------



## X33 (Feb 13, 2005)

-


----------



## Formerly Artie (Jun 26, 2007)

ag said:


> Btw about phenibut, what's the optimum dose to take and how many times a week to avoid building tolerance? Thanks.


Well, that's a bit of a tough question, since everyone reacts to it differently. The first couple times I took a standard dose (740 mg of pure powder I believe), all it did at first was make me a bit nauceous. The times after that, that's when the anxiolytic effects kicked in - but the anxiolytic feeling is a bit different than benzos. Whereas benzos are anxiolytic and sedative, Phenibut is anxiolytic and overstimulating. It's a bit hard to describe really, but I went into specifically in prior posts. All-in-all though, because it's not for long-term use, I can't really recommend it.

I'm not a doctor, but I would say that if you don't feel anything with a specific dosage, then increase it to 200mg each time. It'll take time to kick in though, if in fact it does. My mistake was that I got impatient one time, so I decided to take another dosage, and boy, I don't want to live through that experience again. That was the biggest mistake of my life.


----------



## Broshious (Dec 23, 2006)

ag said:


> Only thing I recognize from your post (apart from Gaba ofcourse) is succinic acid. It is an intermediate in the TCA cycle. So a wild guess, GABA goes to succinate, then it is broken down in the mito. to produce energy? So a dead end as far as anxiety relief is concerned.
> I am not sure about GHB.


From a paper:

"In mammalian brain, GHB is formed primarily by transamination of gammaaminobutyrate
to succinic semialdehyde that then is reduced by succinic semialdehyde reductase
(EC 1.1.1.2) using NADPH. It is degraded primarily to succinic semialdehyde by GHB
dehydrogenase (GHB-DH, EC 1.1.1.61) using NAD+. Succinic semialdehyde is further oxidized
to succinic acid that enters the Krebs cycle (3)."

My question is, if this happened in the body, then the GABA taken orally would partially be metabolized into GHB which could then cross the BBB.


----------



## X33 (Feb 13, 2005)

-


----------



## X33 (Feb 13, 2005)

-


----------



## X33 (Feb 13, 2005)

-


----------

