# Pre-workout



## LittleBearBrah (Feb 2, 2011)

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## LittleBearBrah (Feb 2, 2011)

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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

I didnt drink caffeine at all for 9 months before taking a pre workout sup. It works more. You will feel it for sure. I really enjoy working out with a pre workout sup. Have great motivation, great endurance. I feel really confident and happy. Dont know about doubling your reps, but will make a difference. If it is worth it for you is another thing. I will get it again when I run out. However I cycle off it every couple of weeks and only use half doses. 

I use one more rep.


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## 50piecesteve (Feb 28, 2012)

Yeah i take Jack 3d, I love the stuff but you build a tolerance to it pretty quickly. I heard from a TwinMuscleWorkout video (hodgetwins) about them nearly doubling their reps, but i didnt experience that much of an improvement a couple reps at the most


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

was thinking about it. but dont really need to. eating the rights foods plus being well hydrated is good enough for me.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

^reminder I need to get my hydration back in check.


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## Mahglazzies (Apr 14, 2012)

Been thinking about taking some before and after stuff as well to speed along results. If you don't end up doing it I'll let you know how it goes, because I plan to get SOMETHING. Just a little research and a few bucks away, I guess.


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## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

Jack3d has a horribly outdated formula with many underdosed ingredients hidden in a proprietary blend. There's no reason to buy it anymore with much more up to date, better dosed products.
A lot of people seem to gauge the effectiveness of a preworkout based on how much "It hypes me up for the gym bro!" rather than actually taking the time to do the research and learn about what ingredients truly act as ergogenic aids rather than just resorting to over-stimmed products (we call these guys/gals 'stim junkies') that mask the fact that most of the other ingredients are either completely bunk or just underdosed (as in the case of Jack3d and quite a few of the older preworkouts)

If you've only ever had sips of coffee, there's hardly any caffeine at all, like a few mgs which is going to do nothing regardless of someone's tolerance to stimulants.

Are preworkouts necessary? Definitely not
Can they help you break through plateaus, help you push harder and longer, maybe help increase focus? Definitely.
I'll get onto preworkout recommendations later though, tomorrow perhaps when I log on again.

I'll cover the point about steroids while I'm here.
You don't seem to list your age, but I imagine you're in your late teens or very early 20s judging by the fact you're a college student.
Hold off until : 
1. You're at least 24-25 years of age
2. Have done many many months of research before hand and know EXACTLY what you need to do.
3. Have had good amounts of bloodwork done to determine where your markers of health are at.

Until your endocrine system fully develops, you take the risk of causing yourself a decent amount of damage.
It doesn't happen to everyone under the age of 24-25, but there are plenty of people now on Testosterone Replacement Therapy (TRT) for the rest of their life because they weren't patient enough to wait until they were older. It's better to just be safe than to take that risk.
Running a cycle incorrectly and/or too long can also cause a good degree of harm.
Again many people have ended up on TRT for life at very young ages because of this. Many reports of teenagers on TRT because of running cycles simply because they had no freakin' clue what they were doing.
Again, better safe than sorry.

Don't be discouraged/put off by what I've said because, if used responsibly, many steroidal compounds have very minimal health risk (SIGNIFICANTLY less dangerous than the mainstream media makes them out to be) and in some cases can even improve health in some ways (again, something the mainstream media hides because they want to convince everyone that steroids are just pure evil with no benefit), but again I stress it's important to have a solid idea of what you're doing.

PM if you want good resources to read/want to ask me any questions, as I have a reasonable knowledge on this topic.


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## Nada (Dec 19, 2004)

I been doing alright without any supplements, just food all the way.


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## ssalamone (Sep 21, 2010)

I will have to disagree with the poster above. Jack3d is not overstimmed - it has roughly 65mg of caffeine. I know it has geranium root in it, but as long as you cycle correctly you're fine. 

The three things that make this product great is the quantity, price and ingredient list. You can read the whole ingredient list without getting tired! Every other pre workout product has 4,000 filler ingredients, in which they know they have a strong following of mindless pretties that will buy their products anyways.

At the end of the day - Jack3d is an awesome product BUT only use it when you REALLY need it.


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## LittleBearBrah (Feb 2, 2011)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> Jack3d has a horribly outdated formula with many underdosed ingredients hidden in a proprietary blend. There's no reason to buy it anymore with much more up to date, better dosed products.
> A lot of people seem to gauge the effectiveness of a preworkout based on how much "It hypes me up for the gym bro!" rather than actually taking the time to do the research and learn about what ingredients truly act as ergogenic aids rather than just resorting to over-stimmed products (we call these guys/gals 'stim junkies') that mask the fact that most of the other ingredients are either completely bunk or just underdosed (as in the case of Jack3d and quite a few of the older preworkouts)
> 
> If you've only ever had sips of coffee, there's hardly any caffeine at all, like a few mgs which is going to do nothing regardless of someone's tolerance to stimulants.
> ...


WOW, Thank you so much! Yes, please give some pre-workout recommendations! Yeah, and I'm 19.


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## hiimnotcool (Apr 28, 2009)

Pre-workout recommendations

Controlled Labs-White Flood
Driven Sports-Craze


I like those the most out of the ones I've tried.


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## 50piecesteve (Feb 28, 2012)

Nada said:


> I been doing alright without any supplements, just food all the way.


this is pretty much all you need to build muscle


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## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

ssalamone said:


> I will have to disagree with the poster above. Jack3d is not overstimmed - it has roughly 65mg of caffeine. I know it has geranium root in it, but as long as you cycle correctly you're fine.
> 
> The three things that make this product great is the quantity, price and ingredient list. You can read the whole ingredient list without getting tired! Every other pre workout product has 4,000 filler ingredients, in which they know they have a strong following of mindless pretties that will buy their products anyways.
> 
> At the end of the day - Jack3d is an awesome product BUT only use it when you REALLY need it.


I keep forgetting that Jack3d was slightly reformulated, my bad. Good to see they backed off on the stim content a bit, a lot of users complained of 'crashing' after the effects of the original formula wore off.
At the end of the day though, when products with far superior ingredient profiles, that are also much better value for money, are available, it's hard to recommend Jack3d nowadays.
In this day and age, preworkouts based around arginine for 'pumps' shouldn't even exist anymore. Arginine has been proven time and time again to not enhance Nitric Oxide levels, yet companies continue to put it in their products.

I myself like to do some research first before I buy any preworkout supplements.
Nothing wrong with more ingredients as long as they are well researched, proven ergogenic aids. Good products tend to not rely on a massive list of ingredients anyway, so it's no issue.
If people don't do their research first and buy stuff based purely on flashy labels and marketing hype, it's their loss really


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## paulyD (Feb 16, 2011)

GoldenBear said:


> Does anyone take a pre-workout supplement specifically for lifting weights? I don't feel I need the extra juice to get a good pump at the gym, but I hear pre-workouts do wonders for a lot of people. I'm very interested in the extra reps and weight pre-workout supplements like Jack3d an Craze can supposedly help with.
> 
> I'm a college student so I would only buy this stuff if it will help me substantially. For example, I've heard someone going from 10 reps on the bench press 225lbs to 20 reps just with the pre-workout. I am interested in hearing how pre-workout supplements have worked for people.
> 
> Also I know a lot of the pre-workout supplements have high doses of caffeine (thus the extra energy). I don't drink coffee or anything high in caffeine like ever, and when I do drink coffee I don't feel any different (but I've only taken a few sips). So does that mean the pre-workouts won't even work for me?


don't waste your money. you dont need pre workout supps. the only supplements that are essential are :

*multivitamin
*fish oil 
*creatine (if trying to gain muscle)
*protein powder e.g whey, meal replacement, weight gainer

everything else is a WASTE OF MONEY. the perfect pre workout meal 1 hour before the gym is whey, milk and oats blended (or a meal replacment shake or even a weight gainer shake). those things give you the energy for the workout plus protein to keep your body in an anobolic state during the workout.


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

#1 - make sure from the start of getting up you eat the majority of your carbs ( the good ones ) before your workout.

#2 - make sure your well hydrated by drinking alot of water. i find that hydration is the single most important factor next to the right foods that will determine your strength and energy output during your exercise. think iam b.s.ing? try it for yourself. one day drink alot of water then exercise then another day drink none then exercise.

#3 - stress, keep it down. walking about fuming over some thing that happened drains a hell of alot of energy from you that could be put to better use. spending a day stressing then trying to hit the weights your more than likely to hit the pillow and blanket.


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## THEuTASTEsOFeINKd (Apr 10, 2010)

I think noobs should focus more on nutrition and getting proper form on lifts and not so much on all the stupid supplements. Drink some green tea before working out or buy some caffeine pills but you honestly don't need those pre-work out drinks. They aren't worth the money. 

What paulyD said is all you need.

As for steroids, how about you do a couple solid years of lifting before you think about doing that. Body building takes years of dedication and there are no quick fixes.


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## westicle (Mar 27, 2012)

I fell for the pre wokout crap years ago, I only eat clean food now and lots of it, my favorite pre workout meal is yogurt mixed with granola and blueberries a hour before workout and a post workout meal with lots of veggies right after. Its all mind over matter that keeps you focused in the gym not some cheap pre workout sup. Now if you want to talk about the good sups that help you gain once you get diet and training down I'm a expert


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## LifeinAShell (Apr 12, 2012)

White Flood 
Jacked 
Craze 
Assault 

Those are the best preworkouts around they all work great none are better then the other cause were all different and from a 19 year old who tryed steroids and it wasnt worth it go with a preworkout and diet first you


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## slimm (Apr 13, 2012)

I use NO Xplode and I like it. I just take a scoop 1/2 hour before I hit the gym, no need to take everyday like the label says. But you should definitely research or just try different ones til you find one you like... I would stay away from the steroids, unless you plan on becoming professional, but even then, you should try to go natural IMO


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## Silent Image (Dec 22, 2010)

Never take steroids


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## Dystopia (Mar 20, 2012)

I tried a few pre work outs like, jack3d, razor and no shotgun. I built tolerance to Jack3d quickly, did not like it at all. Razor, I would not recommend, packed with caffeine...I toke half a scoop and felt nauseous. No Shotgun was my first and it worked.



hiimnotcool said:


> Pre-workout recommendations
> 
> Controlled Labs-White Flood
> Driven Sports-Craze
> ...


I'm having a dilemma between these two. Which one to buy ? I want something different.


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## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

Dystopia said:


> I'm having a dilemma between these two. Which one to buy ? I want something different.


Either one would be good.
Craze is more about focus, whereas Whiteflood would be better for pumps due to the nitrates in the beetroot promoting vasodilation. Both Driven Sports and Controlled Labs are among the best supplement companies out there and it's rarely ever that I don't have a Controlled Labs supp in my stash. 
Check out iForce Maximize Intense too. iForce is also great quality, highly respectable stuff.

For non stim options (if not now, but maybe in the future when you want to cycle off stims to allow tolerance to reset) :

iForce Hemavol
MAN Body Octane
Controlled Labs Whiteblood (latest version that came out)

I was stacking Hemavol and Body Octane for a while and the endurance and pumps were off the charts. I'd even be getting pumps on lower rep sets/exercises like deadlifts, absolutely crazy.


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

having never taken a pre workout supp before this thread sparked my interest. earlier at the local gnc and gasp !.....there was a guy behind the counter at a gnc who was actually in decent shape and actually knew what the hell he was talking about with supplements and didnt respond to every question with "just take it after a workout". from his own experience he told me about a product called platinum pump fuel. its a lil pricey and tastes like somebodies elses vomit but boy does it work. when eating the right diet with the right amount of daily healthy carbs along with plenty of water this stuff compliments it pretty darn good. i hit the weights alot later in the night than what i usually do so iam going to try it alot earlier next time. this might be a staple in my routine now.


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## hiimnotcool (Apr 28, 2009)

Dr Hobo Scratch MD said:


> having never taken a pre workout supp before this thread sparked my interest. earlier at the local gnc and gasp !.....there was a guy behind the counter at a gnc who was actually in decent shape and actually knew what the hell he was talking about with supplements and didnt respond to every question with "just take it after a workout". from his own experience he told me about a product called platinum pump fuel. its a lil pricey and tastes like somebodies elses vomit but boy does it work. when eating the right diet with the right amount of daily healthy carbs along with plenty of water this stuff compliments it pretty darn good. i hit the weights alot later in the night than what i usually do so iam going to try it alot earlier next time. this might be a staple in my routine now.


heh. looking at the ingredients of it...doesn't look much different then most other pre-workouts. how much did u pay for it? the website says 80 bucks????

the ingredients in white flood are much better and more highly dosed and it's only 39 dollars for 100 servings.


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

hiimnotcool said:


> heh. looking at the ingredients of it...doesn't look much different then most other pre-workouts. how much did u pay for it? the website says 80 bucks????
> 
> the ingredients in white flood are much better and more highly dosed and it's only 39 dollars for 100 servings.


 i paid $50. i was looking for a product called clearshot at first. they didnt have it. i heard about white flood ill try that out next.


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## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

^Bro, did you not read my post earlier, post #14, about arginine?
I don't see why you didn't just get one of the products I suggested in the first place.
Sorry man, but the ingredient profile for the Platinum Pump Fuel is garbage.
The ingredients that do work are severely underdosed, meanwhile the vast majority of that 20039mg prop blend is useless ingredients/useless, cheap filler.


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## hiimnotcool (Apr 28, 2009)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> ^Bro, did you not read my post earlier, post #14, about arginine?
> I don't see why you didn't just get one of the products I suggested in the first place.
> Sorry man, but the ingredient profile for the Platinum Pump Fuel is garbage.
> The ingredients that do work are severely underdosed, meanwhile the vast majority of that 20039mg prop blend is useless ingredients/useless, cheap filler.


brb basically saying what i said


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

Petrovsk Mizinski said:


> ^Bro, did you not read my post earlier, post #14, about arginine?
> I don't see why you didn't just get one of the products I suggested in the first place.
> Sorry man, but the ingredient profile for the Platinum Pump Fuel is garbage.
> The ingredients that do work are severely underdosed, meanwhile the vast majority of that 20039mg prop blend is useless ingredients/useless, cheap filler.


nope. missed it completely. i already felt like a hypocrite coming into this thread saying the opposite of what i already posted earlier but this thread sparked my interest in pre workout supps so because of that i think i didnt even bother to look at the other posts. i was amped up about trying a pre workout supp out on that same exact day when i was going to be doing chest and triceps plus i had disposable money to burn. i meant pre workout supps in general might become a part of my routine not that particular brand since it wasnt what i was looking for in the 1st place. but hey iam open to suggestions especially from somebody like you.

question - do pre workouts lose there effectiveness the longer you take them?


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## scribe (Mar 8, 2011)

I got this stuff called Napalm last month. First time I used it, it gave me this outrageous rush, to the point where I felt buzzed. But I could lift much heavier and I felt like I could keep working out forever. But, after that first dose, I was never able to attain that same rush again. I built a tolerance to it incredibly quickly. Still use it, and it does give me a jump in energy. But overall I'd say it wasn't worth the money.


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## dk321 (Mar 11, 2012)

Just take caffeine.
Supps with DMAA are banned here and I have tried some but they seem to be just a bit
stronger than caffeine and beta alaninie (which is what most PWO supps contain)


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## LittleBearBrah (Feb 2, 2011)

brb haven't bought pre-workout yet. Still listening to chit like this to get pumped


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## MrWibblyWobbly (Mar 2, 2012)

I just drink about 1/3 of my protein shake before I lift (contains Optimum Nutrition brand whey protein, a banana, some frozen berries, Greek yogurt, honey, and milk). It's really helped me keep from losing steam towards the tail end up my workout.


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## Petrovsk Mizinski (Nov 29, 2011)

Dr Hobo Scratch MD said:


> nope. missed it completely. i already felt like a hypocrite coming into this thread saying the opposite of what i already posted earlier but this thread sparked my interest in pre workout supps so because of that i think i didnt even bother to look at the other posts. i was amped up about trying a pre workout supp out on that same exact day when i was going to be doing chest and triceps plus i had disposable money to burn. i meant pre workout supps in general might become a part of my routine not that particular brand since it wasnt what i was looking for in the 1st place. but hey iam open to suggestions especially from somebody like you.
> 
> question - do pre workouts lose there effectiveness the longer you take them?


Preworkouts that use stimulants can lose a bit of effectiveness as tolerance to stimulants increase. 
I prefer to not use any caffeine at all other than preworkouts with stims on workout days only, as to help minimize tolerance. This is no problem for me because I'm not a coffee drinker/fan of sodas with caffeine in it.
It's hard to say exactly how long it will take for someone to build tolerance, but after I finish a tub of preworkout product with stims, I'll take 3-4 weeks off stims entirely to let tolerance levels fall back to baseline.

However, if you're taking preworkout products with no stimulants, you wont ever have to worry about losing effectiveness. It will have the same effect every time you use it.


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