# Nardil



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Hi
I have struggled with depression for the past 2 years( my pdc call it resistant depression) I started Nardil and would like to hear
people good experience about this drug

thanks

Barak.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Come on guys PLEASE respond. I'm about to give up on Nardil.


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

why?


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## Dr Hobo Scratch MD (Jun 24, 2011)

how long have you been on it for? its usually a rocky start when first taking it. it all will smooth out shortly.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

thanks Dr Hobo Scratch MD.
i need these kind of encourages responses


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

2 weeks at 60mg is way to early to give up. Your need to give it a few months in my opinion and you may need to go higher. This med works, period


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Oioioi123
ive been on 60mg only 5 days not 2 weeks. I started taking Nardil 2 weeks ago.
thank you so much for your reply it helps!


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

Nardil worked incredibly well for my depression. Not well at all for my panic disorder.

It wasn't a light bulb feeling, it came gradually over 4-6 weeks.

You need to give the medicine 6-8 weeks. Then you can quit if you still have to question whether it has even worked. You should notice something, like you are thinking about killing yourself less, or you're angry way less or you're not as irritable.

Your mind wanders WAY less when it starts working, thats what I notice. Unless you're side effects are horrible, you should not be stopping your meds 5 days in. Just keep on it


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

wow! i woke up this morning took my 60mg dose and afrer 2 hours i felt less anxious!


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Gilmourr,
hi
did Nardil give you more energy ? it makes me tired but each time i upped the dose i got boost of energy which helped my depression a lot. this boost lasts only one day each time i upped the dose








will the energy come back ?


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## GregW (Jul 6, 2011)

Sorry to butt in when you are asking another member a question, but just wanted to say that MAOI antidepressants like Nardil can work for people when EVERYTHING else has failed. Like others say, give it a decent chance to help you, don't give up on it before it has had a chance to fully kick in. I am now trying to get a MAOI myself (Parnate or Nardil) because all the other antidepressants on the market have done jack s**t apart from causing side effects.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

GregW
good luck man! Nardil or parnate were design for people who suffer drom resistant depression. if you worry about weight gain go with Parnate if you need the weight(like me) go with Nardil


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i feel so fatigue. will this feeling turn into energy at some point with Nardil?


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

you should be getting more energy from it. are you sleeping at nights? the most common side effect is insomnia. i get fatigue from parnate, but energy from nardil, go figure


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jjyiss
are you on both parnate and Nardil? what dose of Nardil are you on?
if you are no longer on Nardil could you please tell me on what dose did you start to feel more energetic?


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

no no... i switched from parnate, after a few months, the day time tiredness didnt go away, and i would get dizzy and faint when i would stand up occasionally. so i switched back to nardil, im on 60mg of it, and my energy level is normal. years ago, i ttook up to 105mg (7pills), and that gave me a big boost of energy and motivation. 105mg is stupid insane, dont do it unless you really really need to.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jjyiss
thank you for your reply . when you started to take 60mg of nardil did you have a decrease in your energy level? always felt tired ? 
how long before you had more energy and felt less tired ?


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

i never had a decrease in energy from nardil.


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## spartan7 (Feb 25, 2011)

did u love the initial 'nardil high' u get the first week of taken it? feels like ur superman huh


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

konamitech said:


> Oioioi123
> ive been on 60mg only 5 days not 2 weeks. I started taking Nardil 2 weeks ago.
> thank you so much for your reply it helps!


No where near long enough. It took me a total of 7 weeks before it kicked in. The first two weeks were going up to 45mg, then 5 weeks on 60mg.

*The average time for nardil to kick in is 4 - 6 weeks once you reach 60mg. * Therefore, this could be an average of 6 - 8 weeks total, depending on how quickly you reach 60mg.

Once I hit the 4 week mark I nearly gave up because I thought it wouldn't work. Then over a period of a few days my anxiety started decreasing significantly. About a week later my depression also decreased a lot as well. Stay at 60mg for 8 weeks, if no result, bump it up to 75mg and try for another few weeks.

Good luck with the side effects, especially hypotension (low blood pressure) and insomnia, they were the worst. The good news is that the hypotension eventually goes away, and the insomnia eases (but never goes completely).

Nardil has been great for me. I have met so many people (including women) since being on it, and it gives me a lot more motivation and focus. I am now planning to travel and probably move overseas - something I would have never done without nardil.

You might find my nardil thread useful http://www.socialanxietysupport.com/forum/f30/just-managed-to-get-some-nardil-need-advice-127752/


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## spartan7 (Feb 25, 2011)

Ive taken nardil. Im anti nardil though. I'm pro nardil for depression only not for social anxiety due to the change in inactive ingredients phizer took away in 2003. But give nardil 2 months and decided then. It just made me more happier and content with myself. If you take nardil and take sleeping pills you will fall on your *** asleep in 25 seconds.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

konamitech said:


> i feel so fatigue. will this feeling turn into energy at some point with Nardil?


Nardil side effects are a *****. I really struggled with them to the point where I almost had to come off completely... especially when I started collapsing from hypotension.

I won't lie, it will be a rough ride at the start. But it WILL get better with time. At the start I was getting only 2 hours a sleep a night! Now I get about 6 - 7 on average. Also had daytime fatigue and could barely stay awake at work. Nardil is the only drug that has given me both insomnia and fatigue!

If you can make it through the initial side effects, you will be rewarded once it kicks in.


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

spartan7 said:


> did u love the initial 'nardil high' u get the first week of taken it? feels like ur superman huh


heheh, u mean hypomania.. heck yea. you feel like a god. probably an old thread i made about it, not too sure. i dont miss it enough to OD on my meds though, im satisfied where i am now.

and yea your sleeping will be way off. the way i see it is, with nardil acting like amphetamines, your body doesn't need the regular 7 or so hours of sleep per day.. if im wrong doesnt matter much, dont really have a choice


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

7 days on 60mg and the fatigue is so dam hard on me  i can barely move. 
everyone says that nardil gave them tome of energy...i need that energy! 
ohhh well....6 days on 60mg its too soon to give up on Nardil(as many people here advised me)


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

today i feel the Nardil very strong in my body\head. feels like i am stoned\druged


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> today i feel the Nardil very strong in my body\head. feels like i am stoned\druged


Don't worry bid that will go away and lessen I promise


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

thanks man! you give me hope. im serious! 
i feel so stoned like the whole planet is turning around me--- omg. nardil is a hard core drug!


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> thanks man! you give me hope. im serious!
> i feel so stoned like the whole planet is turning around me--- omg. nardil is a hard core drug!


Yea man theres no doubt it's a potent med I got that feeling when I went to 60 then again when I went to 75. Took a week or two to subside, then after it smooths right out, the odd thing is after a while you don't even feel the medication, you don't feel like your on anything unlike other anti-depressants I tried. You just feel like yourself minus depression/anxiety. Btw one thing I noticed is the med hits harder on an empty stomach it seems, so maybe try eating with it. Are you starting to smell the Nardil yet? When it really started working I could smell it in everything, my sweat my urine(and my number 2's lol)


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

omg yes i do smell it in my urine! i eat few cookies before i take Nardil(better than nothing)
i think that since i am a skinny guy the 60mg is hard for my body to digest. but as you said , it will lessen. 
i swear the god Oioioi123, sometimes during the day i feel like i am on meth. my head is sniping and running so fast but my body is so heavy.


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> omg yes i do smell it in my urine! i eat few cookies before i take Nardil(better than nothing)
> i think that since i am a skinny guy the 60mg is hard for my body to digest. but as you said , it will lessen.
> i swear the god Oioioi123, sometimes during the day i feel like i am on meth. my head is sniping and running so fast but my body is so heavy.


Yep I got that too man, felt so wired and my eyes would be wide eyed and open, I actually was grinding my teeth and clenching my jaw. Like you said I felt like I was on meth or something lol, I actually had to go out and buy a mouth guard. Something that helped me actually during that phase at the suggestion of someone here was magnesium, I bought a calcium/magnesium supplement, took high doses and it got rid of my jaw clenching and relaxed me. Maybe try that


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

Yep, at first you really notice it in your urine, and it goes a brighter yellow colour - this is normal. At the start it even gave me a burning sensation after urinating, but this went away after a while. For me it also made it so I don't have to urinate as frequently, which I consider to be a bonus. I think it must slow down your kidney's or something. 

Stay on 60mg until it kicks in, then hold it there for about a month. After that you can try dropping down to 45mg which will lessen the side effects. This is known as a "maintenance dose". I now only need 45mg, and the side effects are a lot less than on 60mg. I found 60mg hard to tolerate, my body felt really heavy, and my legs would get tired/sore after walking up a slight hill or stairs. 

With nardil, there is a very fine line between the effective dose vs side effects. As little as 15mg can make a huge difference. For me the sweet spot seems to be 45mg, any less and the depression/anxiety returns, any more and the side effects are too bad. You just have to play around and see what your optimal dose is (after it kicks in). If you're lucky, it might only be 45mg like me, but some do require higher. 

When and how often do you dose? On 45mg I take two in the morning and one in the late afternoon. I have experimented with many different times and this seems to work best in terms of reducing insomnia and hypotension. On 60mg I would take two in the morning, one at midday, and one in the late afternoon.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Hi shy-one,
I take my dose all in the morning(as my dr instructed me) ive been on 60mg for 7 days.
so far i feel very weird. i get terrible insomnia and my body is so heavy and tired.
my dr bumped me up from 30mg to 60mg. he skipped 45 which i don't know why he did. he just told me that 60mg is the therapeutic dose and asked me to stay on that dose for at least a month.
i cant wait for Nardil to kick i have a faith on this drug i know it will work for me! 
thanks for your reply man i will keep you posted.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i feel so tired i have no motivation to get out of bed. is this normal?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i just emailed my pdc told him i am feeling so down and weak. he said stay on 60mg benefits will come at least in 6 weeks on that dose. omg...ive been on 60mg for 7 days i have no idea if i have the strength to go on i am so depressed


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## wxolue (Nov 26, 2008)

I could be completely wrong about this, but my understanding is that the faster you titrate up your dose on Nardil, the more beneficial it will be when it starts working. Unfortunately, this also makes the side effects worse in the beginning. Try to stick with it and tough it out.


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

Don't take it all at once. I tried this and found it made the side effects worse. 30 in the morning, 30 in the mid afternoon but not too late. Also I did get the tiredness and weakness, not as bad as you by the sounds of it but I went up slower and stayed on 45 for a few weeks


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

my dr instructed me to take it all at once.  5 more weeks to go...dam the time doesn't move!


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i just dont understand how in one day this depression will go way? people always say "be patient it takes 6 weeks to kick" what does "kick" mean?? will i wake up one day feeling normal? why it has to take 6 weeks? why ?


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> my dr instructed me to take it all at once.  5 more weeks to go...dam the time doesn't move!


Ya I found all at once in the morning really intensified the side effects during the day. Nardil is meant to be spread throughout the day, and I believe this is one of the reasons they are only made in 15mg amounts, you could even just take one pill at once 4 times a day to minimize side effects


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

konamitech said:


> i just dont understand how in one day this depression will go way? people always say "be patient it takes 6 weeks to kick" what does "kick" mean?? will i wake up one day feeling normal? why it has to take 6 weeks? why ?


I've never had some kind of flash bulb moment where my depression just would vanish. Usually for me, I start doing something I USED to enjoy. Like going out or playing a computer game for a bit. Then I realize I'm not thinking about death because like 1-2 days have gone by without thinking about it. Then I notice how when I see subways or busses that I don't think about throwing myself in front of them. This is when I notice the depression is getting much better.

Your mind just doesn't go to those dark places when it starts to work. It's honestly crazy now that I think about it.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

gilmourr
ive become less suicidal since i started Nardil. does that mean its working?


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> gilmourr
> ive become less suicidal since i started Nardil. does that mean its working?


I would say that's a great indication it's starting to work. It seems to work extremely well for depression, I've never really had a problem with depression so I can't comment on that aspect. I'm takeing it for anxiety and it works amazing for that.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

weird, 2 hours after i take my 60mg dose(around 8 am) i get tired with no motivation to do anything but stay in bed. around 3pm i suddenly get hyper. is this called "hypomania"?
how does it feel with Nardil when the antidepressant effect kicks?


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> weird, 2 hours after i take my 60mg dose(around 8 am) i get tired with no motivation to do anything but stay in bed. around 3pm i suddenly get hyper. is this called "hypomania"?
> how does it feel with Nardil when the antidepressant effect kicks?


No it's because 60mg is too much for your body at one time, your doctor should have never told you to take it all at once, that's not how it's meant to be taken.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i hope my body will adjust it in time.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

I would strongly suggest you divide your doses to at least 3 times a day for 60mg, or the side effects will be much worse.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Nardil is not giving me energy. 

3 days after i was on 15mg of Nardil i felt so energetic. i will remember this day for the rest of my life because it helped me understand something very important about my depression.

i understood that energy kills my depression. The days i was on 15mg i felt so damn happy. i felt socialable and my self esteem was for the first time in my life Normal! i felt motivated and wanted to do things i haven't done in years.(but this feeling last only for one day)

 i will continue to take Nardil for another 5 weeks(im not giving up yet) but if that doesn't give me boost i will change the medication.
i don't really care which formula Nardil would give me energy. whether it will comes from the stimulation of the medication itself or from its antidepressant effect that will kick some day. i need energy period! I am tired and depressed. i want to sleep all day. my body is heavy and i don't even have insomnia anymore. i completely lost my appetite and i have a metal taste in my mouth. i meet my pdc on Tuesday We have a lot to talk about.
I understand that 10 days on 60mg is too soon to talk about changing med. i understand that most people who take Nardil felt improvement after at least 8 weeks on 60mg or higher dose. but i need some answers from a professional which will be my pdc. i am not feeling well.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

If you wanted energy instead of sedation, Nardil wasn't the best choice to begin with. It acts on GABA, serotonin and reduces both adrenalines. Any action on dopamine or other chemicals is apparently not reverting this. 

Moclobemide is the most activating/least sedating MAOI. Parnate could have a bit less sedation but I wouldn't count on it, especially not in higher doses.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

most people on Nardil (i have read tons of their success stories in this forum ) they say nardil helped with there depression like no other drug they have tried. So am i correct to assume that when you feel less depressed you will have more energy ?
i don't really care about how Nardil works(GABA serotonin adrenalin dopamine etc) if its not meant to be for depression and only for SA then my pdc should not have put me on it.
but as i said. every way i go online i read that Nardil is a life saver for depression.
i am not looking to switch to a different drug at least not before i have been on 60mg for 8 weeks.
i am really curious how the tiredness, sleepiness, lack of motivation and damn fatigue will vanish (in an 8 week period) and when will i begin to live without all these symptoms.


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

Mate, nardil takes a massive amount of time to relies the real effect.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

konamitech said:


> most people on Nardil (i have read tons of their success stories in this forum ) they say nardil helped with there depression like no other drug they have tried. So am i correct to assume that when you feel less depressed you will have more energy ?
> i don't really care about how Nardil works(GABA serotonin adrenalin dopamine etc) if its not meant to be for depression and only for SA then my pdc should not have put me on it.
> but as i said. every way i go online i read that Nardil is a life saver for depression.
> i am not looking to switch to a different drug at least not before i have been on 60mg for 8 weeks.
> i am really curious how the tiredness, sleepiness, lack of motivation and damn fatigue will vanish (in an 8 week period) and when will i begin to live without all these symptoms.


You are incorrect to assume that hehe. I am 100% sure it works great for depression but that doesn't mean it will give you energy though. MAYBE (apparently not) indirectly because of the depression-relief it gives but directly, no. Like I said, neurochemically it does mostly things that will inevitably lead to lack of energy.

If you are the chronic sleeper like you say you are, Nardil is not a good choice. You would be better of with something activating, energizing.

But the sedation you are currently experiencing might be transitory so it might be best to sit it out for at least a month.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Inshallah
i am not a chronic sleeper. I've become like one since I've been on Nardil. i am able to fight the morning sleepiness(2 hours after i take nardil) and stay awake all day. the weird thing in the afternoon i become more awake and alert.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

Oh my bad, thought I read that. But seriously, a lot of people are not managing to get Nardil prescribed, on paper it should work great for depression, wait it out for X more weeks.

If you continue to stay tired and unenergized , Nardil out!


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Inshallah
have you been(are you) on Nardil


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

Nope. Why haven't I? Don't want to be on a maoi.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Inshallah
thank you for taking the time to respond to my posts i really appreciate it.
my few last posts were directed to all users who had\have experience with Nardil
good luck with your course of treatment!


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> Moclobemide is the most activating/least sedating MAOI.


Moclobemide is a reversible MAOI. Do not waste your time with it. It has shown to be no more effective than SSRI's. I have tried it and it did nothing for me.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

Konamitech what you were experiencing earlier is merely just a side effect, not the real deal. I also felt the same when increasing my dose each time and was hoping it was the real thing, but the effect only lasted a few days. 

When the real deal kicks in, you'll know. 

Don't worry about the lack of energy for now, same thing happened to me. Nardil can cause both daytime lethargy and sleep insomnia. The lethargy will eventually go away with time.


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

patience. everyone is different. give it a good 6 weeks if you can handle the side effects.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

shy-one , jjyiss thank you so much for your replies. i really appreciate it.
jjyiss, 6 weeks in total or 6 weeks since i started 60mg?(10 days ago)?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

I took my 60mg dose this morning at7am. its now 12noon and i feeling less tired.
still feeling depressed with zero motivation but at leasti am out of bed.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

wow. today i really feel the anti anxiety effect of Nardil. a nice smooth euphoria feeling
now its time for Mrs Nardil to give me some antidepressant effect.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Nardil is definelty a roller coaster ride .. one hour i am very calm and and happy then for 6 hours i feel very down and depressed .


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

konamitech said:


> Nardil is definelty a roller coaster ride .. one hour i am very calm and and happy then for 6 hours i feel very down and depressed .


That's why you need to spread your doses out. Nardil has a short half life. Not only would it be more effective to spread them out, it would also reduce the side effects.

On 60mg I would suggest taking two in the morning, one at midday, and one late afternoon.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

the first time i took nardil it took about 6 weeks to "kick in".. i got effects the first week but it wasn't the "full effect" so to speak  

there's two main things going on here (and god knows what else).. GABA transaminase inhibition and MAO inhibition. you should get the GABA transaminase inhibition pretty quickly.... as far as i can fathom, it's a reversible GABA-T inhibitor.. there is a group at the University of Alberta that has a lot of papers on Nardil's GABA transaminase inhibition, Baker is usually one of the authors. A lot of people get hypomania from the GABA-T inhibition. 

The MAO inhibition usually takes weeks (4-6) and that's when the annoying side effects like orthostatic hypotension and constipation kick in, but then you get the biggest benefits as well and possibly additional hypomania. 

i really don't think you should dose all 60mg at once. it's quite a burdon on the liver, it would make more sense to take the dose as 2 in the morning and 2 in the early afternoon and spread it out. also, taking all four at once can possibly overdo the GABA-T inhibition to cause too much fatigue at once and cause a "bumpy ride" so to speak


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

I have a few problems with splitting the nardil dosages. One is that in my country it is usually very hot (its 90 degrees already)and if I carry the pill either in my pocket or a box it might melt. The second problem is my memory isn't very good and I might forget to take the afternoon dosage on the right hour every day. As far as I know the nardil should be taken the same time everyday.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

does anyone know at what dose Nardil effect more serotonin and adrenalin than GABA?


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> most people on Nardil (i have read tons of their success stories in this forum ) they say nardil helped with there depression like no other drug they have tried. So am i correct to assume that when you feel less depressed you will have more energy ?
> i don't really care about how Nardil works(GABA serotonin adrenalin dopamine etc) if its not meant to be for depression and only for SA then my pdc should not have put me on it.
> but as i said. every way i go online i read that Nardil is a life saver for depression.
> i am not looking to switch to a different drug at least not before i have been on 60mg for 8 weeks.
> i am really curious how the tiredness, sleepiness, lack of motivation and damn fatigue will vanish (in an 8 week period) and when will i begin to live without all these symptoms.


It works primarily on all the neurotransmitters and it's great for both depression and SA and other anxiety-type things like agoraphobia and generalized anxiety. if you can't bring nardil with you to dose in the afternoons, you could possibly split yr dose 2 in the AM and 2 in the late PM. I really think this splitting the dose could be very beneficial, instead of taking it all at once.

you might experience insomnia but if you're saying you get tired after dosing then it might even help you sleep to take half the dose at night. besides, when you get insomnia from nardil it often has nothing to do with what time you took the dose. the MAO inhibition lasts for at least a week after your last dose due to the fact that the inhibition is irreversible and the body needs to generate new enzymes. i think trying 8 weeks at 60mg sounds like a great plan for giving the medication a fair shot. if you don't really benefit, at that point it totally makes sense to discontinue it.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

konamitech said:


> I have a few problems with splitting the nardil dosages. One is that in my country it is usually very hot (its 90 degrees already)and if I carry the pill either in my pocket or a box it might melt. The second problem is my memory isn't very good and I might forget to take the afternoon dosage on the right hour every day. As far as I know the nardil should be taken the same time everyday.


Then I would suggest taking twice a day. Two in the morning and two late afternoon. It will reduce the severity of side effects by doing this.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> does anyone know at what dose Nardil effect more serotonin and adrenalin than GABA?


at the higher doses, it inhibits more MAO and MAO is necessary to metabolize the parent compound into the GABA-T inhibitor PEH.. but I got pretty tired at the high doses just the same, perhaps more so than the lower doses that are probably hitting GABA more


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i upped the dose from 60 to 90. hope to feel better on 90mg


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

is anyone here (has been) on 90mg of Nardil?


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## GregW (Jul 6, 2011)

I haven't been able to convince my doctor to try me on a MAOI yet, but this is what the rxlist medication site says about dosage and response:

_Early phase treatment:_ _Dosage should be increased to at least 60 mg per day at a fairly rapid pace consistent with patient tolerance. It may be necessary to increase dosage up to 90 mg per day to obtain sufficient MAO inhibition. Many patients do not show a clinical response until treatment at 60 mg has been continued for at least 4 weeks._

I'm not sure how helpful that is, because everyone is different, but you may still have to give a 90 mg per day dose several weeks to fully work if 60 mg was ineffective.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

GregW thanks.
my pdc told me the same thing today. he said once i reach 90mg Nardil will kick in 8 weeks
he asked d me to be patient as it takes more time for Nardil(than other ADs) to kick.


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## GregW (Jul 6, 2011)

konamitech said:


> GregW thanks.
> my pdc told me the same thing today. he said once i reach 90mg Nardil will kick in 8 weeks
> he asked d me to be patient as it takes more time for Nardil(than other ADs) to kick.


Waiting for antidepressants to kick in is something that annoys me about all types, to be honest. These MAOIs still sound like they hit depression hard when they really do get to work though.

I just hope there are one or two medications that can help with sleep and be safely used at the same time if insomnia is a side effect for me, as I can't sleep properly now without taking something most nights...I'm trying to stay away from short-acting benzos right now so that rules out quite a few options too lol!


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

GregW
i take 5mg zyprexa to help me sleep. been on it for 2 years and it works like magic. sometimes i got up to 10mg depends on how bad the insomnia is.


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## GregW (Jul 6, 2011)

Thanks, I'll ask the doctor about that option. I have heard some antipsychotics can be useful for sleep.


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## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

Nardil has been quite effective for me at only 45mg, so the dosing is just a guideline and not written in stone.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> is anyone here (has been) on 90mg of Nardil?


yeah, it was terrible. couldnt get out of bed for days. and i had strange other things happen to me like swollen ankles, and also my hand went numb for over a month (almost like a carpal tunnel syndrome), that one might've had nothing to do with the nardil but it happened at the same time i was at that dose. it was completely worthless to me, i think 45-60mg is where it's at.


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

i'VE been on 90mg.. then been able to lower to maintain the same effect that it needed 90mg to create initially.... hence why nardil dosing can be very complex like that. Insomina is a ***** at 90mg also.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir,
when you were on 90mg, did you feel the antidepressant effect of Nardil? or it was more like fatigue feeling?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

after it take my 90mg dose of Nardil i get 3 hours of euphoria. then its gone...
will the antidepressant effect ever kick??


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

konamitech said:


> after it take my 90mg dose of Nardil i get 3 hours of euphoria. then its gone...
> will the antidepressant effect ever kick??


Please don't tell me you're taking all 90mg at once? You're going to kill your liver dude! Spread the doses out!

Also have patience, going up to 90mg now is far too soon. See if it works at 60mg first.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i see my pdc on Tuesday and ask his permission to split the dose.thanks shy-one i will mention the liver thing to my pdc as well.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> i see my pdc on Tuesday and ask his permission to split the dose.thanks shy-one i will mention the liver thing to my pdc as well.


here's some general guidelines from http://mental-health.emedtv.com/phenelzine/phenelzine-dosing.html :

"The recommended starting phenelzine dose when treating depression is 15 mg three times per day. In general, your healthcare provider will increase your dose very quickly up to at least 60 mg total per day (divided into smaller doses). Some people will need up to 90 mg of phenelzine per day. Once your depression is under control, your healthcare provider may decide to decrease your phenelzine dosage."

I'm pretty sure it is meant to be taken in divided doses as mentioned in that quote, taken either 2-3 times a day. the european PI sheet (which comes with the Nardil manufactured by Link pharmaceuticals in the UK) actually gives a 75mg maximum daily dose, and only recommends 90mg/day for hospitalized inpatients.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i don't understand , every time i go up the Nardil dose i feel so much energy and motivated but it lasts only for one day. why does Nardil energy effect doesn't last?? the fatigue has finally stopped. now i really hope Nardil will give my energy (just for the record ive been on 90mg for 3 days)
my pdc has told me that once nardil kicks and i feel less depressed i will have the energy and motivation that i need. is that true?


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

Hi all,

I took Nardil for over 20yrs and was on just 30mg a day it was amazing and changed my life. I suffered nausea etc when first starting it and I have now gone back on it been on it for nearly 5wks and am suffering the same symptoms I was put on 45mg a day but felt really sick so doc reduced me. I do get tired of an afternoon but never put on weight before and at the moment I would be glad of a few extra pounds lol. Really hope the tabs kick in soon even though I seem to be on a lower dose than most people.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

linmeme
when you were on Nardil(the first time) did nardil give you energy?


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> linmeme
> when you were on Nardil(the first time) did nardil give you energy?


lol ... come man... nardil is a little more complex then "it gave me energgy" have you tried \red bu\ll?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir
what do you mean "more complex"?
why does it sound so weird to you when a person who suffers from depression asks if a medication gives you energy or not ? Don't you know that the lack of energy and motivation are a huge symptom of depression ?


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

konamitech said:


> linmeme
> when you were on Nardil(the first time) did nardil give you energy?


Yes I was able to do most things and got a job working in a school with over 1500 kids amazing as I had been afraid of even having family members coming to visit & terrified of going out. I also got divorced moved house and went on the dating scene with no worries. Reason I stopped Nardil!!! I could no longer get it but seems prescriptions for it now available again.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

linmeme said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I took Nardil for over 20yrs and was on just 30mg a day it was amazing and changed my life. I suffered nausea etc when first starting it and I have now gone back on it been on it for nearly 5wks and am suffering the same symptoms I was put on 45mg a day but felt really sick so doc reduced me. I do get tired of an afternoon but never put on weight before and at the moment I would be glad of a few extra pounds lol. Really hope the tabs kick in soon even though I seem to be on a lower dose than most people.


that sounds like a normal dose to me. i was at 90mg once but i eventually felt best at 30mg a day too and took that for about a year. i then ran out of pills (moved to a new country and had no doc anymore) and so I stopped the 30mg and ended up depressed again, so now i'm back on a prescription for 45mg a day. my current doctor actually just asked me what dose I wanted (since he knew I had been on the med for 2+ years) and so I asked for 45mg a day. i think there's less weight gain at 30mg for me, but for initial treatment a higher dose can make sense. good to hear someone else here has had a good experience with the 30mg/day dose of nardil.


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

robotaffliction said:


> that sounds like a normal dose to me. i was at 90mg once but i eventually felt best at 30mg a day too and took that for about a year. i then ran out of pills (moved to a new country and had no doc anymore) and so I stopped the 30mg and ended up depressed again, so now i'm back on a prescription for 45mg a day. my current doctor actually just asked me what dose I wanted (since he knew I had been on the med for 2+ years) and so I asked for 45mg a day. i think there's less weight gain at 30mg for me, but for initial treatment a higher dose can make sense. good to hear someone else here has had a good experience with the 30mg/day dose of nardil.


I seem to be the only person though that loses their appetite etc also developed IBS last wk so my doc has now put me on 10mg of propranolol a beta blocker to take first thing in the morning said it should help things also been told at that low dose it wont cause problems but should spur the nardil on only taken it 4mornings so far.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

linmeme
i too completely lost my appetite since i started Nardil


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

konamitech said:


> linmeme
> i too completely lost my appetite since i started Nardil


 How are you now? Have you got your appetite back? I think the propanolol is actually making me worse have been very depressed again of a morning and that side of things had eased.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i am still waiting for Nardil to kick(been on 90mg for 4 days). as for the appetite i still dont have any.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

how does it feel when Nardil kicks?


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> how does it feel when Nardil kicks?


I think that's part of the problem, I tried to explain this before. It didn't "kick" in, I think your expecting to feel different, and you won't. You will still feel like yourself just less anxious and depressed. It's not like an ssri/snri where you feel very different(for me). I didn't feel the Nardil kick in at all, I just suddenly started to realize I wasn't experiencing anxiety like I normally did and was suddenly talkative and wasn't hesitating to socialize, quite took me by surprise really. If your sitting waiting for it to all the sudden "hit you" you might be disappointed. It gradually started working better and better for me over time, it's not a quick acting medication, you need patience. And if you didn't already you need to split your dose up, your doctor is obviously uneducated in Nardil if he was telling you to take it all at once, it's common knowledge to split it up. Also if you are to impatient and keep pushing the dose cause you haven't felt it "kick" yet then your gonna end up experiencing too much side effects and discontinue the med before you get the results you want and possibly miss out on an amazing opportunity


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Oioioi123
thank you!
no more increasing dosage. 90mg is the dosage i am going to be for the next 2 months.


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

konamitech said:


> Oioioi123
> thank you!
> no more increasing dosage. 90mg is the dosage i am going to be for the next 2 months.


Anytime, I will admit Nardil is very frustrating. You see all these people having amazing results from it so you get on it, then you wait and wait thinking its never going to work. It's such a slow acting medication compared to any other med I've tried. It took a while to start seeing the benefits but the payoff has been well worth the wait


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

linmeme said:


> How are you now? Have you got your appetite back? I think the propanolol is actually making me worse have been very depressed again of a morning and that side of things had eased.


Yikes man, I wouldn't be takeing a beta blocker with Nardil. Bad idea, they are contradicted for good reason. Nardil is very bad for lowering blood pressure, to take a blood pressure med on top of that is both dangerous and I would say counter productive. Have you been keeping a very close eye on your blood pressure? When mine gets really low from Nardil I get really tired, lethargic moody and just not feeling good all around. Be carefull


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

linmeme said:


> I seem to be the only person though that loses their appetite etc also developed IBS last wk so my doc has now put me on 10mg of propranolol a beta blocker to take first thing in the morning said it should help things also been told at that low dose it wont cause problems but should spur the nardil on only taken it 4mornings so far.


I tend to get that appetite loss too until it kicks in. Then I start eating a lot.. it goes along with sleeping a little less too


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

Oioioi123 said:


> Yikes man, I wouldn't be takeing a beta blocker with Nardil. Bad idea, they are contradicted for good reason. Nardil is very bad for lowering blood pressure, to take a blood pressure med on top of that is both dangerous and I would say counter productive. Have you been keeping a very close eye on your blood pressure? When mine gets really low from Nardil I get really tired, lethargic moody and just not feeling good all around. Be carefull


 Have been extra tired since being on the Beta as I'm only on 10mg first thing in the morning I think I will give it a miss tomorrow as such a low dose n only been on for 4days can't see how I can reduce it any slower really.


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## Oioioi123 (Nov 1, 2011)

linmeme said:


> Have been extra tired since being on the Beta as I'm only on 10mg first thing in the morning I think I will give it a miss tomorrow as such a low dose n only been on for 4days can't see how I can reduce it any slower really.


Yea I would try going without it for a day or two and see how you feel. I have successfully battled pretty much every side effect of Nardil, why did he prescribe the beta blocker? Maybe I can help and provide and alternate option for you


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

I saw my pdc today. he said if i don't have any side effect from taking all 90mg at once(i have no SE whatsoever) then Nardil will work better taking all at once. he explained to me that splitting the dose will be wise thing to do in cases when the patient cannot tolerate the SEs


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

Oioioi123 said:


> Yea I would try going without it for a day or two and see how you feel. I have successfully battled pretty much every side effect of Nardil, why did he prescribe the beta blocker? Maybe I can help and provide and alternate option for you


Did'nt take Beta this morn not felt so depressed also trying to eat a bit more. Doc put me on Beta's because I started to get agitated and the nausea feeling lack of appetite had increased and when I did eat i suffered I B S so Doc thought a small dose would calm things. It didnt ease any of the probs and increased tiredness n depression came back NO tears as yet tho today


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## Payn (Sep 15, 2008)

Can anyone please tell me if there is any psychological study/research about possibility of treatment option with 120 mg dose of Nardil ? I would like to try and go on 90 and gradually up to 120 mg(I am now taking 75mg), but I need to get something( a real prove/evidence) to persuade my doctor to try to get me on higher dose of Nardil. Thanks.


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## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

Payn said:


> Can anyone please tell me if there is any psychological study/research about possibility of treatment option with 120 mg dose of Nardil ? I would like to try and go on 90 and gradually up to 120 mg(I am now taking 75mg), but I need to get something( a real prove/evidence) to persuade my doctor to try to get me on higher dose of Nardil. Thanks.


I've never heard of taking that much. Why don't you want to see if 90mg helps first?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

6 days on 90mg. my Dr said 8 weeks on this for Nardil to build up in my system


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

konamitech said:


> 6 days on 90mg. my Dr said 8 weeks on this for Nardil to build up in my system


 When I was on Nardil before ( 30mg) I was told it took 4-8wks for side effects to settle down n things to improve as far as I can remember it was about 8wks I never took any more stuck at just 30mg for over 20YEARS!!!


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## upndownboi (Oct 7, 2010)

linmeme said:


> When I was on Nardil before ( 30mg) I was told it took 4-8wks for side effects to settle down n things to improve as far as I can remember it was about 8wks I never took any more stuck at just 30mg for over 20YEARS!!!


how did you find it at 30mg? I take it you didn't feel the need to go any higher?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

upndownboi said:


> how did you find it at 30mg? I take it you didn't feel the need to go any higher?


i am curious too...


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## Payn (Sep 15, 2008)

jeff almighty said:


> I've never heard of taking that much. Why don't you want to see if 90mg helps first?


of course, I will not raise my dose from 75 to 120 immediately, but gradually. Firstly i will go up-it to 90mg and if still not good then to 120 mg. My goal is try and go up to 120 mg, because at 75 my Nardil stopped working : / My friend has been taking it for a very long time(many years) and he has also advised me this idea:

Taking high dose of Nardil helps to keep the effect it should have, especially considering the formulation change in 2003 or 2002(or around these years). Before Nardil reformulation i only needed 60 mg to feel like a bird. Everybody now says(see dr.bob site, most information for Nardil you can find on the internet) you have to take double the dose to get the same effect as from original Nardil before the formulation change. I would raise the Nardil dose as high as needed to get the initial effect back and i will guarantee it will last.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

Payn said:


> of course, I will not raise my dose from 75 to 120 immediately, but gradually. Firstly i will go up-it to 90mg and if still not good then to 120 mg. My goal is try and go up to 120 mg, because at 75 my Nardil stopped working : / My friend has been taking it for a very long time(many years) and he has also advised me this idea:
> 
> Taking high dose of Nardil helps to keep the effect it should have, especially considering the formulation change in 2003 or 2002(or around these years). Before Nardil reformulation i only needed 60 mg to feel like a bird. Everybody now says(see dr.bob site, most information for Nardil you can find on the internet) you have to take double the dose to get the same effect as from original Nardil before the formulation change. I would raise the Nardil dose as high as needed to get the initial effect back and i will guarantee it will last.


i have heard anecdotally (i.e., this guy i know) who took both 105mg and 120mg and was fine, but i would proceed with caution. my liver function tests have always come back good and i dont have any liver disease, but at 90mg+ i felt some toxicity from phenelzine. there's good reason why they capped the dosage at 90mg, so proceed very cautiously with the physician's guidance. have you ever tried parnate (tranylcypromine)? that one has a lot more evidence for the possibility of very high dosages, and it's not a hydrazine derivative.


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## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

Yeah, I've been to that Dr Bob site. I was never on the "old" Nardil, so I can't really compare. I'm only on 45mg and I feel pretty good. Have been on this dose for around 4 months. I was less anxious during the initial eurphoria, but I'm still a lot less anxious than I was before Nardil. At least I don't have panic attacks anymore.


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

yea my liver was working hard at 90mg...


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

upndownboi said:


> how did you find it at 30mg? I take it you didn't feel the need to go any higher?


I took 45mg for a wk but then felt really ill so doc lowered dose because i still get racing heart n nausea afraid SE will increase if I take more must admit I am desperate to start feeling better now.


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## Payn (Sep 15, 2008)

robotaffliction said:


> i have heard anecdotally (i.e., this guy i know) who took both 105mg and 120mg and was fine, but i would proceed with caution. my liver function tests have always come back good and i dont have any liver disease, but at 90mg+ i felt some toxicity from phenelzine. there's good reason why they capped the dosage at 90mg, so proceed very cautiously with the physician's guidance. have you ever tried parnate (tranylcypromine)? that one has a lot more evidence for the possibility of very high dosages, and it's not a hydrazine derivative.


I havent tried Parnate before, because everyone(and also my doctor) says that the Nardil is better drug for social phobia and anxiety disorders (maybe is it worth trying after Nardil, i dont know)... Also, all pharmacies in the Europe offer Parnate for very high prices, so Parnate is much more expensive unlike the Nardil in all europeans countries. But my doctor has even mentioned about the possibility to get me on this combo: Nardil + Parnate.

Can you tell me again if there is any official study-research which does invalidate or prove success/effectiveness of this MAOIs (Nardil together with Parnate) treatment option ?


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## upndownboi (Oct 7, 2010)

robotaffliction said:


> i have heard anecdotally (i.e., this guy i know) who took both 105mg and 120mg and was fine, but i would proceed with caution. my liver function tests have always come back good and i dont have any liver disease, but at 90mg+ i felt some toxicity from phenelzine. there's good reason why they capped the dosage at 90mg, so proceed very cautiously with the physician's guidance. have you ever tried parnate (tranylcypromine)? that one has a lot more evidence for the possibility of very high dosages, and it's not a hydrazine derivative.


what was the toxicity you felt?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

day 7 on 90mg and i am feeling the Nardil antidepressant effect, finally! i woke up refreshed with a good mood, i took Nardil and had around 7 hours of better mood than i ever had in years. but unfortunately it didn't last more than few hours  --does that mean Nardil is starting to work?or i should go up to 120? i am very confused by this medicine


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> day 7 on 90mg and i am feeling the Nardil antidepressant effect, finally! i woke up refreshed with a good mood, i took Nardil and had around 7 hours of better mood than i ever had in years. but unfortunately it didn't last more than few hours  --does that mean Nardil is starting to work?or i should go up to 120? i am very confused by this medicine


how long have you been on nardil now?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir said:


> how long have you been on nardil now?


30 days. 7 days on 90mg.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> day 7 on 90mg and i am feeling the Nardil antidepressant effect, finally! i woke up refreshed with a good mood, i took Nardil and had around 7 hours of better mood than i ever had in years. but unfortunately it didn't last more than few hours  --does that mean Nardil is starting to work?or i should go up to 120? i am very confused by this medicine


i think you should try to split the dose (45mg AM, 45mg PM), that may very well help you get a consistent effect. if the doctor said it was ok to do that but that it only helps people with side effects, he could be wrong and people who have actually taken the medication are sometimes a better source for information. i think nearly everyone on this thread agrees with splitting the dose, and i think it makes the med work better for me


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

Oioioi123 said:


> Yea man theres no doubt it's a potent med I got that feeling when I went to 60 then again when I went to 75. Took a week or two to subside, then after it smooths right out, the odd thing is after a while you don't even feel the medication, you don't feel like your on anything unlike other anti-depressants I tried. You just feel like yourself minus depression/anxiety. Btw one thing I noticed is the med hits harder on an empty stomach it seems, so maybe try eating with it. Are you starting to smell the Nardil yet? When it really started working I could smell it in everything, my sweat my urine(and my number 2's lol)


Im only on 30mg nardil been on 5wks last few days have noticed fuzzy head & tiredness I lost my appetite almost completely have eaten bit more tho last couple of days did you suffer that too?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

day 8 on 90mg. depression is less. anxiety is almost zero. at the first 2 hours after taking Nardil i felt euphoria. then it subside and i got to feel the anti depressant for couple of hours.


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

konamitech said:


> day 8 on 90mg. depression is less. anxiety is almost zero. at the first 2 hours after taking Nardil i felt euphoria. then it subside and i got to feel the anti depressant for couple of hours.


 Glad you feeling an improvement! I could not imagine taking as much as most ppl do on here though.


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

ok let me break this down real quick...

1. you could be as far as 2 months away from the REAL effect nardil, in terms of what it will give you over a long term, assuming you're dosing as you should.

2. Yea, that the little "buzz" that you get for a few days, when you very first start taking.... That goes away quickly. 

3. I Can't recall 100% the correct timing, though around a month in, you get a significant high, feeling somewhat euphoric. This lasts around 3 days to a week. AGAIN.. this is not the real long term effect of nardil, an you'll initially feel a little down after that high goes away. Upping the dose will not cause it to return. A few weeks to a moth later on, after been somewhat down at the lack off euphoria I/you had just felt (ASSUMING YOU ARE ABLE TO GET ENOUGH SLEEP NOT TO FEEL LIKE ****) your mood an well been will level out, really well. This is the real effect of nardil. Boy it takes its time. Though is worth it. I used growth hormone peptides to allow me to sleep, helps, avoid wight again, and more improantantly, Nardil kills REM sleep, with in many ways reduces you're wellbeen. GH peptides give you an extremely deep REM sleep. Hence smashes that side. 

of course we often experience different things, though when I would read SAS user, SHYones reports, I would experience the same things a few week later, as had started a few weeks after him... ****...., I even made the mistake of coming off nardil a few weeks after him also. I'm now on parnate, just to see if is a better option, as will be on nardil along time other wise as I'd mentioned, as it became brutally apparent I need the medication after coming off. 

If anyone is having sleep issues, please consider imprmolin. It was a god sent, allowed me to sleep, improment my wellbeen allowing me to run an lower dose of nardil, show love to my liver, plus a massive list of other benefits. Sure it even made me more pro social. lol


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Thank you for taking the time to share with me your experiences.

Having you explain the way Nardil should be working from your experience gives me a positive feeling that I chose the right medication 

now i have a better understanding on the Nradil long run treatment .


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

boostinggtir said:


> ok let me break this down real quick...
> 
> 1. you could be as far as 2 months away from the REAL effect nardil, in terms of what it will give you over a long term, assuming you're dosing as you should.
> 
> ...


 That is really interesting! so how long would you say tabs take to fully get into system regardless of dosage?


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> Thank you for taking the time to share with me your experiences.
> 
> Having you explain the way Nardil should be working from your experience gives me a positive feeling that I chose the right medication
> 
> now i have a better understanding on the Nradil long run treatment .


Cool. At least half the users of nardil jump off before giving it the necessary time to work. Though the sides before it starts working can be, and are often massive. So I really can't blame them. It's a real shame, so it's important that the above be broken down for people. 



linmeme said:


> That is really interesting! so how long would you say tabs takes to fully get into system regardless of dosage?


Yea I'd say up to three months. That's how long it took me. I mean, I really don't know jack, though we have 90 plus neurotransmitters... I think that the rate in which nardil affects them very interms of how they respond to the different levels of "monoamine oxidase inhibitor" And of course the various feedback systems regulating hemostats, this is I feel, what creates the ups and downs. After been on 60mg a few weeks, after having worked your way up to that dose, this is when the sleep can get bad. Another example of the rolla coaster ride before the real effect takes place, the great sleep I would have before the insomnia sides, see, again, with my theory, one could assume that's the gaba neurotransmitter effect taking place, now then when the insomnia kicks in, one wouldn't be blamed for guessing that this is the effect of dopamine, norepinphrine, PEA, among others. BTW, I did push it beyond 90mg a few times. I got massive urine retention. The most notable side.

" Typically, a therapeutic response to MAOIs is believed to be associated with an inhibition of at least 80-85% of monoamine oxidase activity. "

I think you can lower the dose to reduce sides once this is achieved. As just to maintain that effect, hence lowing the sides, and potentially improved wellbeen. Hopefully this helps you understand the complexity around the dosing.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

boostinggtir said:


> Cool. At least half the users of nardil jump off before giving it the necessary time to work. Though the sides before it starts working can be, and are often massive. So I really can't blame them. It's a real shame, so it's important that the above be broken down for people.
> 
> Yea I'd say up to three months. That's how long it took me. I mean, I really don't know jack, though we have 90 plus neurotransmitters... I think that the rate in which nardil affects them very interms of how they respond to the different levels of "monoamine oxidase inhibitor" And of course the various feedback systems regulating hemostats, this is I feel, what creates the ups and downs. After been on 60mg a few weeks, after having worked your way up to that dose, this is when the sleep can get bad. Another example of the rolla coaster ride before the real effect takes place, the great sleep I would have before the insomnia sides, see, again, with my theory, *one could assume that's the gaba neurotransmitter effect taking place, now then when the insomnia kicks in, one wouldn't be blamed for guessing that this is the effect of dopamine, norepinphrine, PEA, among others. *BTW, I did push it beyond 90mg a few times. I got massive urine retention. The most notable side.
> 
> ...


I would say you are right. I have actually noticed a correlation between depression and insomnia. When I have insomnia, I'm usually the least depressed and also have a lot of motivation/excitement for the future. In fact, sometimes when I have bad insomnia I don't think its always the just nardil itself, its the excitement of my plans for the future - moving abroad and starting a new life.

I cannot believe how much motivation, focus, and hope nardil has given me. Previously I was so depressed and couldn't see a way out - there was no light at the end of the tunnel. I had no hope for the future and couldn't be bothered doing anything. Now I want to move to the other side of the world and start a new life. I would have never dreamt of doing this before nardil, I just didn't have the motivation to set any goals for the future.

Has it been the same for you boostinggtir? Has it significantly increased your motivation levels?


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

shy-one said:


> I would say you are right. I have actually noticed a correlation between depression and insomnia. When I have insomnia, I'm usually the least depressed and also have a lot of motivation/excitement for the future. In fact, sometimes when I have bad insomnia I don't think its always the just nardil itself, its the excitement of my plans for the future - moving abroad and starting a new life.
> 
> I cannot believe how much motivation, focus, and hope nardil has given me. Previously I was so depressed and couldn't see a way out - there was no light at the end of the tunnel. I had no hope for the future and couldn't be bothered doing anything. Now I want to move to the other side of the world and start a new life. I would have never dreamt of doing this before nardil, I just didn't have the motivation to set any goals for the future.
> 
> Has it been the same for you boostinggtir? Has it significantly increased your motivation levels?


Yes most definitely. And example of this is I don't have much in terms of an education / skills, in order for obtaining a very lucrative job. Since been on nadil I've been hounding my employer to send me on various up skilling type training. I've since started other training out side of work also. I live in Australia, I'm looking to travel AU once I have some better quals, and go live interstater. On Nardil, I guess I feel like I wasted the last 6 years in depression. I feel a significant urgency around needing to get my life sorted. It's a good feeling.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir
you were right about " you'll initially feel a little down after that high goes away."
this is exactly how i feel. will it get better?


----------



## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

boostinggtir said:


> Yes most definitely. And example of this is I don't have much in terms of an education / skills, in order for obtaining a very lucrative job. Since been on nadil I've been hounding my employer to send me on various up skilling type training. I've since started other training out side of work also. I live in Australia, I'm looking to travel AU once I have some better quals, and go live interstater. *On Nardil, I guess I feel like I wasted the last 6 years in depression. I feel a significant urgency around needing to get my life sorted. It's a good feeling.*


I know exactly how that feels, except for me I've wasted 11 years of my life. Those 11 years were supposed to be the best years of my life which I will never get back  Now I just want to make up for lost time. I want to travel the world, see other cultures, and live overseas.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

ok guys here is the situation, i take Nardil at 7am in the morning i then get euphoria for 3 hours then i get down feeling. is this normal nardil behavior?


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

konamitech said:


> ok guys here is the situation, i take Nardil at 7am in the morning i then get euphoria for 3 hours then i get down feeling. is this normal nardil behavior?


I usually take my first dose just after 8am and have been getting very low around 3hrs after. The trouble is I think coz it happens a few times you then expect it so I have tried to keep myself occupied then (Thats not easy) I have spoke to my Doc today she was surprised how much weight I have lost due to loss of appetite (Do try to make myself eat now and record what I eat & drink each day) She said to try light exercise that may help. I will continue Nardil for 2 more wks will have been on them for 8 then and if No improvement I will have to wean myself off really hope that is not the case tho.


----------



## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

I've been on Nardil for several months now, so things have kind of stabilized. I don't get the euphoria anymore, and my mood is generally good. I still get anxiety here or there, but it feels more like normal anxiety someone would get instead of overbearing anxiety. I'm only on 45mg, which seems to have been plenty for me to limit most side effects while still getting the benefits.


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

shy-one said:


> Moclobemide is a reversible MAOI. Do not waste your time with it. It has shown to be no more effective than SSRI's. I have tried it and it did nothing for me.


 I tried it to was useless!!


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

jeff almighty said:


> I've been on Nardil for several months now, so things have kind of stabilized. I don't get the euphoria anymore, and my mood is generally good. I still get anxiety here or there, but it feels more like normal anxiety someone would get instead of overbearing anxiety. I'm only on 45mg, which seems to have been plenty for me to limit most side effects while still getting the benefits.


 Nice to find someone else on a lower dosage Im only on 30mg higher dose made me feel sick still dont have great appetite & lost quite a bit of weight but nearly 6wks on Nardil now hoping now things WILL improve tiredness varies from day to day been told by doc to try light exercise may help SE's If still same by 8wks then think I may have to give up on it despite it made such a difference to my life yrs ago and I was on it for over 20yrs till I could not get prescriptions (uk). What SE did you experience?


----------



## mr t (Jan 28, 2010)

Titrate up your dose slowly. Add 15mg per week till u get to 60mg. This gives ur body time to adjust.

Break the doses up, dont take all 60mg at once.

Ive been on nardil for about a year now. Im free of SA, no side effects, and loving life.

Give nardil a legit shot. Dont jump to 90mg. That will give u worse side effects. Nardil takes some time tl work but its an amazing drug. Im currently on 45mg as a maintainence dose.

Feel free to ask me questions or pm me!!


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

day 11th on 90mg. first 7 hours after taking Nardil i feel good then i crash
 will this ups and downs subside?


----------



## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

linmeme said:


> Nice to find someone else on a lower dosage Im only on 30mg higher dose made me feel sick still dont have great appetite & lost quite a bit of weight but nearly 6wks on Nardil now hoping now things WILL improve tiredness varies from day to day been told by doc to try light exercise may help SE's If still same by 8wks then think I may have to give up on it despite it made such a difference to my life yrs ago and I was on it for over 20yrs till I could not get prescriptions (uk). What SE did you experience?


Only remaining side effect is delayed ejaculation, which used to be complete inorgasmia. The first couple months, I had some tiredness but it was also due to restless sleep/insomnia. I also remember having a few bad headaches (not hypertension, though). The side effects I had weren't all that severe. I did get that initial high, which made me talk a TON. I still talk more than usual, but not as much as that initial rush nardil gives you.


----------



## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

linmeme said:


> I usually take my first dose just after 8am and have been getting very low around 3hrs after. The trouble is I think coz it happens a few times you then expect it so I have tried to keep myself occupied then (Thats not easy) I have spoke to my Doc today she was surprised how much weight I have lost due to loss of appetite (Do try to make myself eat now and record what I eat & drink each day) She said to try light exercise that may help. I will continue Nardil for 2 more wks will have been on them for 8 then and if No improvement I will have to wean myself off really hope that is not the case tho.


you're wasting your time. Nardil kicks in after weeks at 60mg. You're not gettin the relief at 30mg or 45mg. Not sure why it so specificity with everyone, though 60mg seems to been consistently the requirement. Own experience an research show this time an time again.


----------



## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

Hey boostinggti could you link me to any research showing you need at least 60mg? I would like to show that to my doctor.


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

boostinggtir said:


> you're wasting your time. Nardil kicks in after weeks at 60mg. You're not gettin the relief at 30mg or 45mg. Not sure why it so specificity with everyone, though 60mg seems to been consistently the requirement. Own experience an research show this time an time again.


i was on (30mg) of nardil for over 20yrs they were amazing my life, my confidence was better than it had ever been but I then couldnt get Nardils anymore I have tried SRNI and numerous other tabs with no effect now I am able to get nardil again 45mg made me feel realy sick so doc said REDUCE dose. Yes they are taking a while to do anything am on 6wks now, still suffer nausea on n off n fuzzy head.


----------



## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

Did u stop before the reformulation? If so your body may be used to the older nardil, which from what I hear was more potent. That could mean you may need a higher dosage this time around.


----------



## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

ilusive said:


> Did u stop before the reformulation? If so your body may be used to the older nardil, which from what I hear was more potent. That could mean you may need a higher dosage this time around.


there's an even newer formulation now, the generic by Gavis pharmaceuticals. I've taken the reformulated Pfizer ("new nardil") as well as the UK nardil from Link pharmaceuticals, and now this new generic. I honestly couldn't tell you if there was any difference between any of them. They all have slightly different but orange coatings and slightly different inactive ingredients and that same smell at varying levels of intensity  Oh and btw the Link pharmaceuticals one recommended refrigerating it!!

In the absence of evidence otherwise I think nothing but the actual amount of phenelzine sulfate should really make too much of a difference, it's too bad they don't publish the lab test results such as the ones mandated by the FDA, but I think it has to contain between +-10% of the advertised 15mg.. you might want to check that though, the Gavis brand is an "AB rated generic" which all I know is that this means that it has been tested to address issues of bioequivalence


----------



## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

Ever since I have been on nardil I finally feel as if i'm going to make it in life, especially lately. For the past decade I have suffered crippling depression and anxiety and could never see myself getting better. At one point point I lived in total isolation for many years, I rarely left my room or saw another human being. Even getting out of bed each day was a struggle, I just wanted to sleep as much as possible so I didn't have to face life. Forget ever working, I didn't think I would ever be well enough to work again.

Now? I have a great job that pays well, and I'm also going to move abroad and start a new and exciting life. I cannot wait to see what the future holds. I would have never dreamed of doing this even 1 or 2 years ago. Previously the thought of moving to another country would be anxiety provoking, but now it just excites me.

Before I started nardil I hit a pretty low point. I often wonder where i'd be today if I never went on nardil. I might have lost my job, or worse - be dead. I believe nardil could have possibly saved my life.

I will say this again:

*Nardil. Saves. Lives.*

Whoever invented nardil deserves a nobel prize.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

shy-one said:


> Ever since I have been on nardil I finally feel as if i'm going to make it in life, especially lately. For the past decade I have suffered crippling depression and anxiety and could never see myself getting better. At one point point I lived in total isolation for many years, I rarely left my room or saw another human being. Even getting out of bed each day was a struggle, I just wanted to sleep as much as possible so I didn't have to face life. Forget ever working, I didn't think I would ever be well enough to work again.
> 
> Now? I have a great job that pays well, and I'm also going to move abroad and start a new and exciting life. I cannot wait to see what the future holds. I would have never dreamed of doing this even 1 or 2 years ago. Previously the thought of moving to another country would be anxiety provoking, but now it just excites me.
> 
> ...


what about the fatigue? does it go away at some point?


----------



## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

konamitech said:


> what about the fatigue? does it go away at some point?


It did for me.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jeff almighty said:


> It did for me.


on what dose? and how long did it take for the fatigue to subside?


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

shy-one said:


> Ever since I have been on nardil I finally feel as if i'm going to make it in life, especially lately. For the past decade I have suffered crippling depression and anxiety and could never see myself getting better. At one point point I lived in total isolation for many years, I rarely left my room or saw another human being. Even getting out of bed each day was a struggle, I just wanted to sleep as much as possible so I didn't have to face life. Forget ever working, I didn't think I would ever be well enough to work again.
> 
> Now? I have a great job that pays well, and I'm also going to move abroad and start a new and exciting life. I cannot wait to see what the future holds. I would have never dreamed of doing this even 1 or 2 years ago. Previously the thought of moving to another country would be anxiety provoking, but now it just excites me.
> 
> ...


Nardil made a massive difference to me to before but this morning I woke with my heart racing so much so the veins in my hands n arms were raised I was really quite scared surely if I increase dose that will increase because more drug in my body also have the dizzy head. been on 30mg 6wks today. Think I may stop 1 tab tonight.


----------



## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

konamitech said:


> what about the fatigue? does it go away at some point?


Yes it does! For the first few months the fatigue would hit me just after mid-day, and last most of the afternoon. The only thing which never goes away completely is the insomnia. But right now i'm not fully sure if that's the nardil, or just pure excitement from thinking about the future. I often wake up in the night and think about how great my life is going to be. I think its a combination of both.


----------



## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

linmeme said:


> Nardil made a massive difference to me to before but this morning I woke with my heart racing so much so the veins in my hands n arms were raised I was really quite scared surely if I increase dose that will increase because more drug in my body also have the dizzy head. been on 30mg 6wks today. Think I may stop 1 tab tonight.


Strange, are you sure you didn't eat anything that may have caused a hypertensive reaction? In most people nardil actually lowers your blood pressure normally. I would suggest buying a blood pressure machine so you can monitor it and see whats happening.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

shy-one said:


> Yes it does! For the first few months the fatigue would hit me just after mid-day, and last most of the afternoon. The only thing which never goes away completely is the insomnia. But right now i'm not fully sure if that's the nardil, or just pure excitement from thinking about the future. I often wake up in the night and think about how great my life is going to be. I think its a combination of both.


thank you


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## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

konamitech said:


> on what dose? and how long did it take for the fatigue to subside?


I'm only on 45mg. As far as I remember, it took about 8 weeks.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jeff almighty said:


> I'm only on 45mg. As far as I remember, it took about 8 weeks.


thank you


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i hate this euphoria and the down feeling that comes after.
i found this post::
*Nardil Update (after 3 months)*

> I've been taking Nardil for the last 3 months for social anxiety and depression. I started at 30 mgs for 1 week, 45 for 1 week, 60 for 6 weeks, and finally 75 mgs/daily.
> 
> My symptoms of SA and depression are in complete remission. I have never had such a rhobust response to any single med or combination of meds in my life--and i've been on virtually all of them over the last 10 years.
> 
> The side effects were pretty nasty at first. Once I moved up to 60 mgs I felt heavily drugged and euphoric (like a mild opiate/amphetamine buzz). I had balance issues and dizziness, and my eyelids sagged. I could hardly stay awake during the day, and at night I typically awoke after only 2 or 3 hours of sleep. I had severe constipation, urinary retention, impotence, and orosthatic hypotension so severe that at times my vision and hearing would become blurred and I would nearly pass out.
> 
> As for now:
> Orosthatic hypotension: completely gone
> Constipation: completely gone
> Urinary retention: much better
> Fatigue: only occurs for 1 or 2 hours after taking med, and only when I'm sitting idly alone or trying to read
> Sleep at night: 5-6 hours on average
> Dizziness: completely gone
> Drugged feeling: completely gone
> The only side effect that continues to be troublesome is my inability to ejaculate. I can get an erection and I have more sensation than I did on any SSRI, however I still can't climax. However, I've read countless posts in the psychobabble archives from people who say that this does effect DOES subside over time as well--however it can take upwards of 6 months in some cases. I am more than willing to wait.
> 
> The euphoria has given way to a milder state of constant well-being, increased energy levels, enthusiasm for life, increased drive and focus, increased follow-thru with mundane tasks. My thoughts are clearer. I have increased patience, heightened tolerance for frustration, and far less anger. I'm extremely optimistic about the future, and seldom does anything get to me. 
> 
> Prior to nardil I drank a liter of rum daily. I smoked marijuana heavily. I sat in my apartment in a state of severe depression, with suicidal thoughts, ruminations, and bouts of agitation, frustration and anger.
> 
> Now I have virtually no desire to drink. I still struggle with the urge to smoke pot, but when I do give in to this urge I find that the therapeutic effects of the drug are greatly diminished for days afterward--thus I have more than adequate incentive to quit smoking altogether.
> 
> I'm 25 years old and for the first time in my life I can look any girl in the eye without hesitation. I can approach people without fear. I went from having virtually no friends 3 months ago, to having more friends than I know what to do with these days. I'm no longer afraid to apply for jobs, speak up in class, take my shirt off at the pool, and eat in public.
> 
> The most incredible thing about Nardil is the effect it has on Rejection Sensitivity. All my life I've felt these unbearable sensations in my stomach in response to the slightest hint of rejection. Consequently I had few romantic encounters in spite of countless opportunities, and those I did have were unbearably painful. Now those sensations are completely GONE--it's as if the nerves that facilitate these sensations in my stomach have been numbed. No longer is my capacity for reasoning and sound decision-making warped by this terrible affliction of rejection sensitivity.
> 
> I never thought life could be so good. I strongly urge those who are taking Nardil to have patience with the side-effects. Further, DO NOT mistake the initial euphoria of Nardil for the actual longterm therapeutic effect of the drug--this is a huge mistake. If you are at all prone to addiction, as I am, you will likely be vulnerable to making this mistake, and might be tempted to up the dose too quickly or to assume that because you are no longer high the drug is no longer working, as I did. This is simply not case. The actual therapeutic effect and feel of the drug is deceptively subtle, such that when you are alone or idle you might find yourself questioning whether the drug is actually working once this euphoria has passed. NOT THE CASE.
> 
> Be patient folks. This is your life were talking about. Best of luck to all.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

today i took my 90mg Nardil dose and for the first time i didn't get the euphoria and down feelings.
does that mean that soon Nardils AD effect will kick?


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

shy-one said:


> Strange, are you sure you didn't eat anything that may have caused a hypertensive reaction? In most people nardil actually lowers your blood pressure normally. I would suggest buying a blood pressure machine so you can monitor it and see whats happening.


I hadnt eaten anything i shouldnt of. Having been on the tabs for so long before I got used to checking everything I ate or drank. Think I will try and get a blood pressure machine at least then I can keep a check. i have reduced tab to just 15mg a day see if things ease a bit if they do I can always increase again, really DO want these to work for me again.


----------



## upndownboi (Oct 7, 2010)

linmeme said:


> I hadnt eaten anything i shouldnt of. Having been on the tabs for so long before I got used to checking everything I ate or drank. Think I will try and get a blood pressure machine at least then I can keep a check. i have reduced tab to just 15mg a day see if things ease a bit if they do I can always increase again, really DO want these to work for me again.


you can get an omron m2 basic for like £15 online, i went into boots the other day and their cheapest (boots brand) was £50!!!


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

no more euphoria.


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

shy-one said:


> Yes it does! For the first few months the fatigue would hit me just after mid-day, and last most of the afternoon. The only thing which never goes away completely is the insomnia. But right now i'm not fully sure if that's the nardil, or just pure excitement from thinking about the future. I often wake up in the night and think about how great my life is going to be. I think its a combination of both.


Shy-one I thought that Nardil didn't work with you? Awesome to hear that it does work for you. I had to stop at 75 mg because I was too tired during the day and I could hardly pee. Do you think if I took 90-120 mg the tiredness might have subsided and the urinary retention would go away?

Did you ever have any urinary retention? Nardil never worked on my anxiety to a great degree, but it worked wonders for the depression.


----------



## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

gilmourr said:


> Shy-one I thought that Nardil didn't work with you? Awesome to hear that it does work for you. I had to stop at 75 mg because I was too tired during the day and I could hardly pee.* Do you think if I took 90-120 mg the tiredness might have subsided and the urinary retention would go away?*
> 
> Did you ever have any urinary retention? Nardil never worked on my anxiety to a great degree, but it worked wonders for the depression.


Yea mate, because the more drugs you take the less side effects you get right?:sus

NO!!!!! It was hard for me to take a piss at 90mg!!! I would stand at the toilets in the clubs for minutes... An I know people were thinking WTF is taking this guy so long. lol Don't strees about mild retention. I was to lower the dose to maintain the same effect after a short period at 90m, an the side effect subsided with this LOWERING, not INCREASING lol


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

5 weeks on Nardil(2 weeks on 90mg) with no improvement in depression. is it time to give up?
should i up the dose to 120?.


----------



## upndownboi (Oct 7, 2010)

konamitech said:


> 5 weeks on Nardil(2 weeks on 90mg) with no improvement in depression. is it time to give up?
> should i up the dose to 120?.


no i don't think you should do anything, which is what your pdoc said right? just hold there for a while and distract with job/studies/videogames/reading etc nardil seems to take an age to kick in for a lot.


----------



## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> 5 weeks on Nardil(2 weeks on 90mg) with no improvement in depression. is it time to give up?
> should i up the dose to 120?.


Took like 3 months to kick in for me and SO.. 5 weeks is only just over 1 month...


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir said:


> Took like 3 months to kick in for me and SO.. 5 weeks is only just over 1 month...


what dose were you on when Nardil kicked?


----------



## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

Stay with it. When I first to nardil it took 3-4 months to kick in for me. Around the 3 month mark I started feeling much less depressed and my thoughts were much more positive. Shortly after it worked wonders for SA. I was at a much lower dosage then you (45mg) but everyones chemistry is different. Boosting it up to 120mg may be good, I was that high and it worked good, but expect to see more side effects in particular the insomnia was pretty bad for me at that dose. Another option would be to augment Nardil with something. I would not give up on Nardil though, for some it take a long time to work, and youve only been on it for a short amount of time.


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

ilusive said:


> Stay with it. When I first to nardil it took 3-4 months to kick in for me. Around the 3 month mark I started feeling much less depressed and my thoughts were much more positive. Shortly after it worked wonders for SA. I was at a much lower dosage then you (45mg) but everyones chemistry is different. Boosting it up to 120mg may be good, I was that high and it worked good, but expect to see more side effects in particular the insomnia was pretty bad for me at that dose. Another option would be to augment Nardil with something. I would not give up on Nardil though, for some it take a long time to work, and youve only been on it for a short amount of time.


Thank you!


----------



## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

upndownboi said:


> you can get an omron m2 basic for like £15 online, i went into boots the other day and their cheapest (boots brand) was £50!!!


 Thank you for info I have ordered one now off ebay.


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

*Weight loss *

6half wks on Nardil because of loss of appetite my biggest prob I have had to reduce tabs to JUST 15mg a day I thought if I lowered dose maybe my body could calm down, get used to the drug and then I can either increase again or if not helping I will be able to stop sooner (Dont want to stop really want these to work!! I am only 5ft 2in height 50yr fm but now only weigh 8st (112lb) I really can't afford to lose any more weight not sure if vitamins or a tonic would help? Size of person must effect how much drug a person would need I would of thought?


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

linmeme said:


> 6half wks on Nardil because of loss of appetite my biggest prob I have had to reduce tabs to JUST 15mg a day I thought if I lowered dose maybe my body could calm down, get used to the drug and then I can either increase again or if not helping I will be able to stop sooner (Dont want to stop really want these to work!! I am only 5ft 2in height 50yr fm but now only weigh 8st (112lb) I really can't afford to lose any more weight not sure if vitamins or a tonic would help? Size of person must effect how much drug a person would need I would of thought?


i cant afford myself to lose weight either. my pdc put me on zyprexa and since then i have been eaten normally no matter what AD i take.


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## mr t (Jan 28, 2010)

konamitech said:


> 5 weeks on Nardil(2 weeks on 90mg) with no improvement in depression. is it time to give up?
> should i up the dose to 120?.


NOOO!!!

Back down your dose and titrate up slowly. Be patient on a lower dose

Jacking up dose every few weeks higher and higher without adequate time is crazy.

Back your dose down and then titrste up slowly to 60mg and stay there. It takes time to work. Geez..


----------



## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

mr t said:


> NOOO!!!
> 
> Back down your dose and titrate up slowly. Be patient on a lower dose
> 
> ...


HI
thank you for your advice! i really appreciate it.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

My dr upped the dose to 120 and told me that he thinks I was given a weaker version of Nardil he also said that there are many versions of Nardil on the market ( he didn't mean the one before 2003( that are stronger and weaker
he said that if I was on the stronger Nardil it would have
"kicked my *** on 60 mg "
Does anybody here know about that versions of Nardil?

Is the Pfizer brand of Nardil the best one to get ?


does anyone know which Brand of Nardil contains the most Phenelzine?


----------



## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

konamitech said:


> My dr upped the dose to 120 and told me that he thinks I was given a weaker version of Nardil he also said that there are many versions of Nardil on the market ( he didn't mean the one before 2003( that are stronger and weaker
> he said that if I was on the stronger Nardil it would have
> "kicked my *** on 60 mg "
> Does anybody here know about that versions of Nardil?
> ...


It may be the case that the formulations weaker, but body weight could factor into it too, if your on the heavier side you may need a higher dosage, if I recall correctly the average nardil dose is generally calculated on a mg per kg of body-weight ratio.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> It may be the case that the formulations weaker, but body weight could factor into it too, if your on the heavier side you may need a higher dosage, if I recall correctly the average nardil dose is generally calculated on a mg per kg of body-weight ratio.


im skinny i weight 80 kg(5"9 high). i think i am taking the weaker version of Nardil tho..


----------



## RenegadeReloaded (Mar 12, 2011)

Where can u order Nardil online or by phone ?

I'm in a country where MAOIs doesn't exist and docs don't prescribe it, but I heard this drug is very effective and I'm eager to try it.

You can PM me, tx in advance.

I started a thread too (http://www.socialanxietysupport.com...-buy-imao-online-from-other-countries-178459/), but I posted here too for more visibility and hoping for getting more answers.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

My dr upped the dose to 120 and told me that he thinks I was given a weaker version of Nardil he also said that there are many versions of Nardil on the market ( he didn't mean the one before 2003( that are stronger and weaker
he said that if I was on the stronger Nardil it would have
"kicked my *** on 60 mg "
Does anybody here know about that versions of Nardil?

Is the Pfizer brand of Nardil the best one to get ?


does anyone know which Brand of Nardil contains the most Phenelzine?


----------



## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> My dr upped the dose to 120 and told me that he thinks I was given a weaker version of Nardil he also said that there are many versions of Nardil on the market ( he didn't mean the one before 2003( that are stronger and weaker
> he said that if I was on the stronger Nardil it would have
> "kicked my *** on 60 mg "
> Does anybody here know about that versions of Nardil?
> ...


they all have the same amount of phenelzine to within about 10%.. so that 90mg u have is at worst around 80mg... i find it to be crazy u dont have any side effects from 90mg, even fairly immediately acting ones like blurred vision, especially if you're taking all the dose at once. you may just have a super tolerance to it or maybe it's just not your medication... it's certainly an odd reaction but i'd say just sleep on it for another 2 weeks and don't get too worked up about it not working in the meantime


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

robotaffliction said:


> they all have the same amount of phenelzine to within about 10%.. so that 90mg u have is at worst around 80mg... i find it to be crazy u dont have any side effects from 90mg, even fairly immediately acting ones like blurred vision, especially if you're taking all the dose at once. you may just have a super tolerance to it or maybe it's just not your medication... it's certainly an odd reaction but i'd say just sleep on it for another 2 weeks and don't get too worked up about it not working in the meantime


thank you. it is weird i don't have any SE om 90mg. no low blood pressure no blurry vision no Constipation no euphoria(i did get the euphoria for the first week on 90mg). just lack of appetite and fatigue around 4 pm. i don't think Nardil is not for me tho..... i think i just need a higher dose.i feel better since i started Nardil, suicidal thoughts have completely gone i am more outgoing and talkative.
i know this is not the "real deal" of Naardil.
depression lack of motivation and tiredness are still exist. i am not giving up on Nardil it will kick!


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

first dose of 30mg(added to 90mg) and euphoria fatigue blurry are back.
ohhh man...this Nardil takes forever to kick.


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## RenegadeReloaded (Mar 12, 2011)

RenegadeReloaded said:


> Where can u order Nardil online or by phone ?
> 
> I'm in a country where MAOIs doesn't exist and docs don't prescribe it, but I heard this drug is very effective and I'm eager to try it.
> 
> ...


up, want this to be visible


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

ive been on Nardil for 5 weeks with gradually upping the dose to 120mg(per my pdc instructions). i now take 90mg in the morning(been on 90mg for 2 weeks) and 30mg around 4pm.
so far my anxiety has been completely gone. but depression is still exist. 
SE(only after the afternoon dose)
1.one hour after taking the afternoon dose(30mg were added 2 days ago) i feel drugged stoned like feeling and very down.
2. fatigue after the afternoon dose
3. blurry
4.lack of motivation
5. pee every 10 minutes
6. can barely move my body
7. down feeling after euphoria is gone
question:
are these SEs normal?
how long from this point to the "real deal" of Nardil?
my pdc told me 2 months! omg!


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## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

90mg all at once in the morning is way to much to take. You should be taking 3 pills(45mg) tops in the morning, and another 45 around mid afternoon. That should give you a more even distribution of the drug in your system, which may result in you being less depressed. A knowledgable doctor would most likely recomend you split it into 3 doses(30 mg a day) 3Xs a day. 

When I was taking 120mg I took 4pills(60mg) twice a day and I was having a lot of problems with insomnia. On another note you should be more then happy with the complete relief of anxiety your getting. Living with anxiety is not living, so be happy with that. As far as your depression goes that should get better as time goes by. Also start doing stuff that you like, maybe that will make you less depressed. The pill is meant to relieve your anxiety and make you feel less depressed, but its on you to find the motivation and start making the positive changes you need to make in order to be truely happy. That part of the journey is up to you my friend. 

Also you may want to try augmenting me something, that could give you an added anti depressant effect.


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## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

Also you said you no longer experience suicidal thoughts. That right there shows that the Nardil is doing a good job. Give it more time, you will be fine.


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## mr t (Jan 28, 2010)

konamitech said:


> ive been on Nardil for 5 weeks with gradually upping the dose to 120mg(per my pdc instructions). i now take 90mg in the morning(been on 90mg for 2 weeks) and 30mg around 4pm.
> so far my anxiety has been completely gone. but depression is still exist.
> SE(only after the afternoon dose)
> 1.one hour after taking the afternoon dose(30mg were added 2 days ago) i feel drugged stoned like feeling and very down.
> ...


Your doc is retarded. 120mg is stupidly high. Yea those side effects are normal for that insane dose. Stick with 60mg


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## jeff almighty (Jan 20, 2012)

Yeah. I started with fatigue and blurry vision only at 45mg, so I can only imagine at 120mg. Those side effects stopped after a couple months.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

ilusive said:


> 90mg all at once in the morning is way to much to take. You should be taking 3 pills(45mg) tops in the morning, and another 45 around mid afternoon. That should give you a more even distribution of the drug in your system, which may result in you being less depressed. A knowledgable doctor would most likely recomend you split it into 3 doses(30 mg a day) 3Xs a day.
> 
> When I was taking 120mg I took 4pills(60mg) twice a day and I was having a lot of problems with insomnia. On another note you should be more then happy with the complete relief of anxiety your getting. Living with anxiety is not living, so be happy with that. As far as your depression goes that should get better as time goes by. Also start doing stuff that you like, maybe that will make you less depressed. The pill is meant to relieve your anxiety and make you feel less depressed, but its on you to find the motivation and start making the positive changes you need to make in order to be truely happy. That part of the journey is up to you my friend.
> 
> Also you may want to try augmenting me something, that could give you an added anti depressant effect.


starting from tomorrow i am going to take 45mg in the morning 45mg at noon and 30mg afternoon
my pdc finally agreed to break the dosage.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

When I take Nardil in the afternoon I get very tired will this stop ? Do you know if the fatigue I suffer will ever go away totally ?


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

*Low dosage!*

I have now been on Nardil 7wks.1st wk was on 45mg that made me ill,took 30mg for 5wks had no appetite, (lost weight) dizzy head sleeping was'nt too bad but still had depression n unable to go out. reduced down to 15mg a day thought then i cud stop easier but see how I felt as didnt want to stop!!! Lst couple of days I have eaten much better dizzy head decreased & I really feel I want to start going out always said I wanted to at least try & stick Nardil out for 8wks which is how long it took for them to work for me before n was only on 30mg then and then remember reducing to 15mg. So Fingers crossed they are starting to help me despite being on a very low dose!!


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

When I take Nardil in the afternoon I get very tired will this stop ? Do you know if the fatigue I suffer will ever go away totally ?


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> When I take Nardil in the afternoon I get very tired will this stop ? Do you know if the fatigue I suffer will ever go away totally ?


i got pretty big fatigue at doses greater than 75mg.. my sweet spot for optimizing the uplifting effects of nardil (unfortunately including insomnia for me) was 60-75mg. at 90mg it was counterproductive and i actually was just sleeping and apathetic all the time, though it felt kinda nice


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

OK so my pdc added 5mg Abilify to take with Nardil. he said it will decrease the tiredness SE of Nardil and increase the AD effect of Nardil
has anyone had any success with augmenting AD with Abilify??


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> OK so my pdc added 5mg *Abilify* to take with Nardil. he said it will decrease the tiredness SE of Nardil and increase the AD effect of Nardil
> has anyone had any success with augmenting AD with Abilify??


interesting..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aripiprazole


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i am not sure i will add Abilify. my pdc said its up to me. i would like to try to let Nardil a chance to work by itself.


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## UltraShy (Nov 8, 2003)

konamitech said:


> OK so my pdc added 5mg Abilify to take with Nardil. he said it will decrease the tiredness SE of Nardil and increase the AD effect of Nardil
> has anyone had any success with augmenting AD with Abilify??


Am I the only one so cynical as to think the "let's toss in Abilify" craze is part of the Pharmaceutical Industry Profit Maximization Act?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

UltraShy said:


> Am I the only one so cynical as to think the "let's toss in Abilify" craze is part of the Pharmaceutical Industry Profit Maximization Act?


 i agree with your opinion that the drug companies are trying to make money . i really want to try to give Nardil the chance it needs without adding any other drugs that might slow down my progress


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> OK so my pdc added 5mg Abilify to take with Nardil. he said it will decrease the tiredness SE of Nardil and increase the AD effect of Nardil
> has anyone had any success with augmenting AD with Abilify??


eff abilify, i have to agree with other ppl that's it's b.s.. as to lowering the tiredness i think u'd be less tired on a dose like 90mg/day, but if you're committed to 120mg/day, really the best thing to do is wait it out. abilify could just make u more tired, and it takes several many days of taking it to notice the effect and then several many days for it to wear off if you dont like it


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

konamitech said:


> OK so my pdc added 5mg Abilify to take with Nardil. he said it will decrease the tiredness SE of Nardil and increase the AD effect of Nardil
> has anyone had any success with augmenting AD with Abilify??


Aren't you already on Zyprexa? I don't know why your doc keeps piling the anti psychotics on unless he thinks theres a psychotic component to your depression or something.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> Aren't you already on Zyprexa? I don't know why your doc keeps piling the anti psychotics on unless he thinks theres a psychotic component to your depression or something.


yes i am on Zyprexa. i told my pdc that i am not going to add abilify because i dont see the need of adding another AAP. he was fine with my decision.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

ok update on 120mg(5 days on 120 5 weeks on Nardil)
2 hours after i take my dose i feel euphoria and stoned like feeling. this lasts for 2 hours. then i feel so down and depressed for couple of hours, then the fatigue starts around afternoon.
could someone please tell me if these feelings are normal?
people tell me that Nardil takes months to kick, is that true? i am so close to give up  please help me!


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## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

I dont understand why you would give up. Gathering from what you have said in this thread so far, it appears the Nardil has gotten rid of you anxiety. Thats a huge improvment right there so why would you give up? Also you said you no longer have suicidal thoughts because of Nardil, which is also a huge improvment. Nardil can take a long time to work dood. Give it time. The fatigue is something that from what I understand goes away with time, be pacient. Also dont take your dose all at once in the morning, if your doing that then thats probably the reason your getting so tired. At 120mg's you really should be dividing your dose into at least 2X a day. Good luck.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

You know something ilusive
I started Nardil mainly for the depression you are right Nardil does reduce my suicidal thoughts and anxiety . 
I need the Nardil to work with my depression because when i am severely depressed i get very anxious, at that point my suicidal thoughts take over .. i need the nardil to break that cycle.
if Nardil is the golden standard for social anxiety then i don't need Nardil .. i already have used Xanax XR to control my anxiety and suicidal thoughts very well for 24 hour periods. 
I really think that after 5 weeks on Nardil i should finally be feeling some relief. with depression.
so....how long will it take for Nardil AD effect to kick? weeks? months? years? i don't have a problem to wait as long as it needs but dood.....how much longer?
What do you think ?


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## ilusive (Apr 24, 2012)

Be patient with this med, It can take months to work. Split your doses into 2 so there is a more even distribution of the medication in your system. Have faith that it will work. Goodluck I wish you the best.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> You know something ilusive
> I started Nardil mainly for the depression you are right Nardil does reduce my suicidal thoughts and anxiety .
> I need the Nardil to work with my depression because when i am severely depressed i get very anxious, at that point my suicidal thoughts take over .. i need the nardil to break that cycle.
> if Nardil is the golden standard for social anxiety then i don't need Nardil .. i already have used Xanax XR to control my anxiety and suicidal thoughts very well for 24 hour periods.
> ...


what other meds are you taking with the nardil?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

robotaffliction said:


> what other meds are you taking with the nardil?


zyprexa


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> zyprexa


zyprexa can counteract many of the effects of nardil on dopamine unfortunately.. and i feel like the predominant effects of nardil that many people describe here are due to dopamine


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

i dont think Zyprexa counteract the effect of Nardil, my pdc would have told me if it was


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> i dont think Zyprexa counteract the effect of Nardil, my pdc would have told me if it was


well as an antipsychotic that antagonizes almost all of the dopamine receptors it is very possible that any effect on dopamine from nardil would be reduced. maybe you should discuss it with the pdc, i have no idea what your symptoms were and the rationale behind prescribing zyprexa..


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

robotaffliction said:


> well as an antipsychotic that antagonizes almost all of the dopamine receptors it is very possible that any effect on dopamine from nardil would be reduced. maybe you should discuss it with the pdc, i have no idea what your symptoms were and the rationale behind prescribing zyprexa..


zyprexa was prescribed to help me eat and sleep. ive been on it for 2 years.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> zyprexa was prescribed to help me eat and sleep. ive been on it for 2 years.


it might be worth discussing lowering the zyprexa dose with your pdc, but you may find that 120mg of nardil is way too much without as much zyprexa on board


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

robotaffliction said:


> it might be worth discussing lowering the zyprexa dose with your pdc, but you may find that 120mg of nardil is way too much without as much zyprexa on board


my pdc upped the dose to 120 because i was (and still ,, are)severally depressed.
i am waiting patiently for Nardil AD effect to kick. man...the waiting is hard.


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> my pdc upped the dose to 120 because i was (and still ,, are)severally depressed.
> i am waiting patiently for Nardil AD effect to kick. man...the waiting is hard.


yea that's totally understandable to be feeling impatient when you are seriously depressed. if you and your pdc are willing to try it, you would be able to tell if a lower dose of zyprexa would be helpful within 48 hours after lowering the dose.


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

*My Update*

I have now been on just 15mg of nardil for over a wk n 7half wks on Nardil in total. This has definately been my best wk!! I don't wake up every morning with racing heart, My blood pressure is fine, I have had good nights sleep only woke a couple of times. Eating has definately improved I have now got to try & start getting out more & not just to corner shop!! When i feel my confidence really is improving I may increase dose back to 30mg but NO MORE.


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

step back and re-evaluate yourself. 6-8 weeks is enough time for any anti depressant to get its full effect. weigh out the pros and the cons. only you can say if nardil is worth it or not. 

and seriously, don't go past 120mg/day, if you arn't already you will end up in the hospital. peace bro.
/thread


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

Had my best day in ages yesterday Walked to Town Centre & Back and walked round some shops felt good. Also went round local chippy and bought Fish n Chips n enjoyed them. 15mg is low dose but is definately helping!!!So proves don't have to take lots!!!


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

linmeme said:


> Had my best day in ages yesterday Walked to Town Centre & Back and walked round some shops felt good. Also went round local chippy and bought Fish n Chips n enjoyed them. 15mg is low dose but is definately helping!!!So proves don't have to take lots!!!


cool im happy for you. good that it works at only 15mg you must be the first


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

jjyiss said:


> cool im happy for you. good that it works at only 15mg you must be the first


 Have read the amount u weigh effects amount u need!! I do only weigh 112lb. Can anyone tell me if it is OK to take Vitamin B6 with Nardil have read mixed opinions.


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## jjyiss (May 6, 2006)

linmeme said:


> Have read the amount u weigh effects amount u need!! I do only weigh 112lb. Can anyone tell me if it is OK to take Vitamin B6 with Nardil have read mixed opinions.


yea read about the vitamin B deficiency too. i used to take b-complex, but now too lazy and just take multivitamin. not sure if the B-complex helped or not


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

ok guys, i did blood tests and there was a small very small inflammation in my liver. could that be cause of Nardil? is so then i am switching to Parante.


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

konamitech said:


> ok guys, i did blood tests and there was a small very small inflammation in my liver. could that be cause of Nardil? is so then i am switching to Parante.


Maybe, but you said you used to drink a liter of rum a day right? I'd bet more strongly on that.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> Maybe, but you said you used to drink a liter of rum a day right? I'd bet more strongly on that.


a liter of rum a day? nope! i never said that. i dont drink alcohol i hate it.


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

konamitech said:


> a liter of rum a day? nope! i never said that. i dont drink alcohol i hate it.


Sorry, my bad I must have been thinking of someone elses post :doh


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

Nardil raised my liver enzymes. Take fish oil, and a liver support supplement.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir said:


> Nardil raised my liver enzymes. Take fish oil, and a liver support supplement.


hi
which one helps you to protect you liver most? Fish oil or liver supplement?


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> ok guys, i did blood tests and there was a small very small inflammation in my liver. could that be cause of Nardil? is so then i am switching to Parante.


yeah it really could be caused by too high of a dose of nardil. 90mg is a limit for a reason. plus zyprexa on top of it could aggravate it further. why don't u lower your dose to 75mg a day and wait it out, maybe lower the zyprexa dose along with it and you should be in better shape. or switch to parnate, parnate is really strong on the dopamine (due to additional reuptake inhibition and possibly releasing dopamine like an amphetamine) so it could be better at counteracting the antipsychotic effects of zyprexa. plus it is safer at higher doses and i've heard many reports of people taking as much as 100mg a day, both anecdotally and in the medical literature.

your doctor does not sound very responsible putting you up on 120mg of nardil. you should really never exceed 75mg for at least the first 3 months of treatment, at least get some blood work done first. hydrazine drugs like nardil can have bad effects on the liver if you're susceptible.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

I have ordered liver supplement. i hope it will work.


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## AxlSlash (May 10, 2012)

Don't just go out and get any "liver support" Makes sure it's Milk thistle, or the supplement you get has it in it.


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> hi
> which one helps you to protect you liver most? Fish oil or liver supplement?


10mgfish oil perday, liver52, milk thistle.


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## AxlSlash (May 10, 2012)

I wouldn't go crazy with the supplements though. Milk thistle can be expensive (depending on the strength, brand you get) Only supps i take for better health well being are niacin, fish oil and milk thistle. Niacin being the ONLY supp that has had beneficial effects ( lowered my bad cholesterol) Fish oil i just take cause i never eat fish, but no matter what strengths i take it hasn't lowered my blood pressure or cholesterol. I use to drink like a fish, so the milk thistle is more of a supplement i take just to be safe. It should be fine alone for liver health, I know a bad comparison but hell bodybuilders are known to take it after a steroid cycle to bring their liver enzymes down to normal


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

hi guys 
ive been on Nardil 7 weeks. the fatigue and euphoria have subside. when should i expect to feel 
a lift in my mood?(i am on 90mg)


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

*Nardil & Vitamin B6*

I have now been on a low dose of Nardil for 81/2 wks last 4 days I have started taking 100mg of Vit B6 I have found I do feel more relaxed after but have had dizzy head in the mornings. my blood pressure is fine! I have been taking Nardil in morn and vit b6 of eve wonder if I would be better doing it the other way round? Considering now of increasing my dose of nardil back to 30gm as well any advice????

OOOPs I meant 10mg vitB6


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

konamitech said:


> hi guys
> ive been on Nardil 7 weeks. the fatigue and euphoria have subside. when should i expect to feel
> a lift in my mood?(i am on 90mg in the morning and 30 afternoon)


anyone?


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

what's your mood like right now? How much has it risen?

I'm pretty positive I wasn't depressed anymore by week 7.

By not depressed that means, no constant depressive thoughts, interests back, wanting to see friends and no avoidance for no reason, more optimism and definitely not visiting forums everyday or searching things like depression.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

gilmourr said:


> what's your mood like right now? How much has it risen?
> 
> I'm pretty positive I wasn't depressed anymore by week 7.
> 
> By not depressed that means, no constant depressive thoughts, interests back, wanting to see friends and no avoidance for no reason, more optimism and definitely not visiting forums everyday or searching things like depression.


i wish i was at that stage.
i am not suicidal no anxiety i am more friendly to my family and i go out to fo my things instead of laying down in bed all day. i still have depression thoughts lack of motivation sadness and low self esteem.


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

How often do you have depressive thoughts, and do they always interfere when you're doing stuff like reading, out with friends, family, watching a movie? Because then you're still depressed. If you just have depressing thoughts if you're doing nothing then that's not always uncommon.

Because everyone has depressing thoughts, but if they are always getting in the way when you're doing something, then you're depressed. Your mind doesn't wander to those places if you're normal while doing things. You also zone out a lot less, and you don't dwell on depressing thoughts. Its as if they come and immediately then leave your head. You don't just agree with them all day when you're normal.

Motivation doesn't always come with depression being lifted also. For me, it seems like it always has.

Give it a week or two. If you're not out of depression, I can't see how its going to work after 9 weeks.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

gilmourr said:


> How often do you have depressive thoughts, and do they always interfere when you're doing stuff like reading, out with friends, family, watching a movie? Because then you're still depressed. If you just have depressing thoughts if you're doing nothing then that's not always uncommon.
> 
> Because everyone has depressing thoughts, but if they are always getting in the way when you're doing something, then you're depressed. Your mind doesn't wander to those places if you're normal while doing things. You also zone out a lot less, and you don't dwell on depressing thoughts. Its as if they come and immediately then leave your head. You don't just agree with them all day when you're normal.
> 
> ...


thank you for taking the time to reply.
my depression thoughts come when i do nothing(which is how my life is at the moment) i do thing tho that motivation and energy are symptoms of depression.
my pdc told me that Nardil can take months to fully kicked so i still have hope....


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## AxlSlash (May 10, 2012)

konami bro. I think you will know when the effects start hitting you. You have to be patient. I know you want the med to kick in as fast as possible. But making a post everyday asking when it's going to start working is just going to drive yourself crazy. PLus it's different for everyone, depending on their dose, how it effects them.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

my pdc recommended me to add 5mg Abilify to be taken with Nardil. does anyone have success with Abilify and Nardil or any other antidepressant?


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## AxlSlash (May 10, 2012)

Why does your doc keep adding meds on top of the nardil? any good psych will first want to see how the nardil only effects you once it hits your therapeutic levels before throwing on other medications.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

AxlSlash said:


> Why does your doc keep adding meds on top of the nardil? any good psych will first want to see how the nardil only effects you once it hits your therapeutic levels before throwing on other medications.


ive been on Nardil for 7 weeks. my pdc said that adding Abilify will boost up the Nardil AD effect. dont you think that after 7 weeks it reasonable to make a change?


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## AxlSlash (May 10, 2012)

konamitech said:


> ive been on Nardil for 7 weeks. my pdc said that adding Abilify will boost up the Nardil AD effect. dont you think that after 7 weeks it reasonable to make a change?


Not if you haven't felt the effects from the Nardil yet. I could see afterwards if still no pregress.. but then again this is the doc who wanted you to take all your doses at once right?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

AxlSlash said:


> Not if you haven't felt the effects from the Nardil yet. I could see afterwards if still no pregress.. but then again this is the doc who wanted you to take all your doses at once right?


right. but now i split the dose to 90mg in the morning and 30 afternoon


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

konamitech said:


> right. but now i split the dose to 90mg in the morning and 30 afternoon


what side effects have u experienced these past few days? do u feel tired or more alert from the nardil? i would agree with most people here that adding abilify is probably not a good idea.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

robotaffliction said:


> what side effects have u experienced these past few days? do u feel tired or more alert from the nardil? i would agree with most people here that adding abilify is probably not a good idea.


from 7am to 4pm i feel more awake and talkative. then around 4pm i crash into depressive stage. emptiness sleepiness and lack of energy.


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

konamitech said:


> from 7am to 4pm i feel more awake and talkative. then around 4pm i crash into depressive stage. emptiness sleepiness and lack of energy.


Yeye. Thats Nardil, or at least it was for me. Except I'd crash at 1pm until 4pm. I also increased my dose fairly quickly to 75 mg. I might have been able to adjust if I didn't go up so quickly, because it did work on my depression.

I think you went up in dose even quicker, so I'm not surprised your crashing. After 10 weeks I never got over the crashes, it might have needed longer, but I wasn't able to urinate so it didn't matter.

You should look into adding something with Nardil maybe. I'm personally planning to add something to Parnate if after 5-6 weeks its not doing much.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

gilmourr said:


> Yeye. Thats Nardil, or at least it was for me. Except I'd crash at 1pm until 4pm. I also increased my dose fairly quickly to 75 mg. I might have been able to adjust if I didn't go up so quickly, because it did work on my depression.
> 
> I think you went up in dose even quicker, so I'm not surprised your crashing. After 10 weeks I never got over the crashes, it might have needed longer, but I wasn't able to urinate so it didn't matter.
> 
> You should look into adding something with Nardil maybe. I'm personally planning to add something to Parnate if after 5-6 weeks its not doing much.


my pdc added Abilify 5mg he said it will boost Nardil AD effect and also kill the afternoon tiredness.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

good news
i feel better from 7am to 4pm. much less depressed more awake and talkative and also mood has lifted.
at 4pm i get this down feeling. maybe i need more of Nardil?


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

You're already taking 120 mg and want to take more?


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Inshallah said:


> You're already taking 120 mg and want to take more?


is 120 the maximum dose?:


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

konamitech said:


> is 120 the maximum dose?:


Just found out today that MAOI's cause octopamine to replace NE, which causes NE not to increase. This is probably why I was so damn tired on both Nardil and Parnate.

Going to get an NRI, NDRI or stimulant from my psychiatrist. Nortryptyline, adderall or wellbutrin are all valid choices, with past cases of them being VERY effective. As much as 74% effective (adderall + maoi). This will bump your NE up and give you energy again, or thats what I think will happen to me.

Stop increasing nardil, and add something with it instead. You probably will have to lower your nardil dose to do this back to 45 or 60 mg.

Do not use any TCA's like imipramine or clomipramine or any strong SSRI's, as they are too serotonergic.

What you want is a bump up in NE, not in SERT.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

konamitech said:


> is 120 the maximum dose?:


It says 60 mg max in the leaflet of our Nardil-version.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

Inshallah said:


> It says 60 mg max in the leaflet of our Nardil-version.


60 mg wont get me out of bed.


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## gilmourr (Nov 17, 2011)

How are you even able to take 120 mg without having side effects being off the charts? 

I was at 75 mg and lethargic for most hours of the day + 10 day periods of constipation + huge urinary issues


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## robotaffliction (Jul 24, 2009)

gilmourr said:


> How are you even able to take 120 mg without having side effects being off the charts?
> 
> I was at 75 mg and lethargic for most hours of the day + 10 day periods of constipation + huge urinary issues


yeah i agree, i got the most stimulating effect of nardil at around 60mg/day. 75mg was a little sedating and 90mg made me just sleep all the time, caused swelling, possibly liver problems. 
right now i'm doing 30mg, trying to get the most stimulating effect while minimizing weight gain.


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

*Nardil *

Im now on 30mg Nardil take 1x15 in morn n again in eve after dinner.
Not felt depressed for several days did have loss of appetite again when tried vitB6 & got agitated so stopped the vit. Sleep is ok do get tired first thing n late afternoon. Really hope things are starting to pick up. Wont be increasing dose any more!


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

90mg is max for most.. an with good reason. 1. silly insomnia. 2. Liver starts working like mad.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir said:


> 90mg is max for most.. an with good reason. 1. silly insomnia. 2. Liver starts working like mad.


what is the solution for the effect on the Liver?


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## boostinggtir (May 27, 2011)

konamitech said:


> what is the solution for the effect on the Liver?


1.








2.








3.


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## Konami (Jul 5, 2011)

boostinggtir said:


> 1.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i got this one
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001EQ92VW/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01
is this good?


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## linmeme (Apr 16, 2012)

*15mg nardil seem b est for me!!*

Well I tried increasing my nardil to 30mg Depression is much better BUT anxiety when eating returned, flatulance awful and had increased headaches despite blood pressure ok. Going to go back to 15mg as anxiety definately reduced then.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

Is it just me or has nardil grown in popularity over the past year? Just looking at the threads in the medication forum and it seems like every second thread is about nardil now lol. 

I can certainly see why it has gained popularity though. I wonder if the drug companies have actually noticed an increase in nardil sales? Would be interesting if word spread around and MAOI's were "back in fashion" again.


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## shy-one (May 10, 2008)

Also how come hardly any women are on nardil? Are they perhaps more scared than men to take it due to the dietary restrictions?


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## viper1431 (Jun 6, 2012)

Probably don't know about it, it isn't advertised any more and doctor's rarely bring it up so it's often men that have spent ages researching meds that find out about it. Girls just go with what the doctor says in most cases where as us men like to be our own doctors and control the meds.


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## maninabox (Aug 23, 2012)

shy-one said:


> Is it just me or has nardil grown in popularity over the past year? Just looking at the threads in the medication forum and it seems like every second thread is about nardil now lol.
> 
> I can certainly see why it has gained popularity though. I wonder if the drug companies have actually noticed an increase in nardil sales? Would be interesting if word spread around and MAOI's were "back in fashion" again.


I'm not so sure. This website is still just a small % of all the people with anxiety/depression, and I'm sure most people don't research meds like people here. A lot of pharmacists and even doctors don't even know what an MAOI is lol, and Wallgreens recently sold me a drug that my doctor prescribed that I later found out is a no-no on Nardil. Apparently, I'm the only person who takes it at the Wallgreens I go to because the first time I went, they told me they'd make sure to keep it in stock as long as I was a customer. And my psychiatrist told me there are only 2 other patients on Nardil and 1 on parnate in his entire practice. I think it's still very rarely used.


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## ChopSuey (Nov 5, 2012)

This is pretty much the only forum on the whole internet that discusses Nardil and Parnate, second place would go to Psycho-Babble. Other than those two there's not much MAOI discussion on the whole wide intarweb, except for a few random posts here and there with usually few or no replies.


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