# "Misleading" guys on the internet ?



## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

I don't know if anyone else does this, but as most of you here, I'm single, and I don't actively pursue relationships, I'm frightened of them, I don't know how to interact with males, and I'm kind of content with it. But I still crave male attention, I want to talk to guys, so it comes down to the internet....A lot of guys on here have made rants about dating sites, but sometimes I just like to join them every so often to see what kind of guys would be interested in me. I am 95% sure I have no intention of ever meeting with them, because meeting with someone over the internet just does not seem like an option to me. I have SA, I'm confused how you guys can all muster up strength to do that. So I like their interest, I know it is a bit misleading to them, because they are expecting me to go out on a date...but yea...I like just talking to them...here...in the safety of the internet...I try to prolong our time talking together as long as possible..until they start asking for my number.:sus And then I will just write them off/ignore them/make up an excuse. It's a habit actually. Do you think this is really horrible of me?


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

Leading a person on is one of the most perplexing and, in the end, hurtful things that can be done. This goes both ways, I am not saying it happens in a one sided manner, by any means. Attention is grand and to feel desired is beautiful, but seeming mind f*ucks and psychological tomfoolery is far from grace. You absolutely must be sure of what you want, and how you see these relationships ending. Does this lead to any unhappiness on your part? Imagine the role reversed; I'm almost positive you'd feel none too good if a guy you had been getting to know just clams and disappears.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

Tenebrous said:


> Leading a person on is one of the most perplexing and, in the end, hurtful things that can be done. This goes both ways, I am not saying it happens in a one sided manner, by any means. Attention is grand and to feel desired is beautiful, but seeming mind f*ucks and psychological tomfoolery is far from grace. You absolutely must be sure of what you want, and how you see these relationships ending. Does this lead to any unhappiness on your part? Imagine the role reversed; I'm almost positive you'd feel none too good if a guy you had been getting to know just clams and disappears.


But oddly enough I have separated internet from real life. They just don't mix. I personally would never be offended if a guy didn't message me back after talking for some time, because I think in my head there's plenty of other guys. Well I talk to more than 1 guy to prevent myself from caring if a random guy forgets about me. I know I can't be the only girl who does this online....


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

The ethical thing to do is tell them up front you don't want to date and only want to talk. Many guys would still want to talk in hopes of igniting something. After that, its on them.

But yeah it is not a kind thing to do to waste someones time and falsely get their hopes up.


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

It goes against all probability to even entertain the idea that you are the only girl to do this, online or in waking life. Does any degree of power and the feel of control come into play during these occurrences? Also, do you only do this online, where it is more "safe" to do so? I am not trying to come across as brash, and I am merely curious. For the record, I don't think you are horrible, simply full of fright, maybe afraid of opening up and the possibility of getting hurt in doing so.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

VanDamMan said:


> The ethical thing to do is tell them up front you don't want to date and only want to talk. Many guys would still want to talk in hopes of igniting something.


No....they would definitely not like the idea of just talking..I'm fairly certain of that..


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

Tenebrous said:


> Does any degree of power and the feel of control come into play during these occurrences? Also, do you only do this online, where it is more "safe" to do so? I am not trying to come across as brash, and I am merely curious. For the record, I don't think you are horrible, simply full of fright, maybe afraid of opening up and the possibility of getting hurt in doing so.


For me, it's not about being in control or having power or the upper-hand at all. I just crave male company. Not in real life. Because I'm afraid of guys (to be honest). And yes, I only do it online, considering the fact that I don't even look them in the eyes in my day to day activities. But this is all the fun of social anxiety, I don't think "normal" women do this at all.

But I make this topic because I do feel pangs of guilt...like at the moment..


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## TinyFlutter (Jun 19, 2011)

VanDamMan said:


> The ethical thing to do is tell them up front you don't want to date and only want to talk. Many guys would still want to talk in hopes of igniting something. After that, its on them.
> 
> But yeah it is not a kind thing to do to waste someones time and falsely get their hopes up.


I agree with this.

I even get guys who get pissed off for "wasting" their time talking to me when they realize I just want to be friends :blank.

I think you should consider working on your fear . Maybe you'll find dating and being in an actual relationship satisfying and it would definitely fulfill your craving for male attention :yes.


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

calichick said:


> No....they would definitely not like the idea of just talking..I'm fairly certain of that..


Not all men are chauvinistic a*sholes who only want intimate relationships with women. Many guys would want to be just friends because, like you, they are anxious and terror stricken of the opposite sex. The fact that you recognize your behaviors as a sort of problem is a good sign, I think. It wouldn't be a horrible idea to maybe let your actual intentions be known.


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## TPower (Feb 3, 2011)

I always, I mean always hint at meeting up, talking on the phone, stuff like that. If they don't respond favorably, I quit and just wait for the next.

I once had a girl who changed the subject every time - I mean every single time I made jokes about us hooking up. I just ended up deleting her.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

PiscesVixen said:


> I even get guys who get pissed off for "wasting" their time talking to me when they realize I just want to be friends :blank.


Lol I get that too! It's like their desperation for intimacy is just a ticking time bomb. Some guys will say "next time when I message you, tell me straight forward that you're not interested." I'm like, why would there be a next time? I think that men online have more of a sense of urgency than girls...



Tenebrous said:


> Many guys would want to be just friends because, like you, they are anxious and terror stricken of the opposite sex.


But..but it is not even friends. It's "online friends". Which is practically nothing. Also just from observations from most of the topics here made by the males with social anxiety, it seems clear that they want to do something about their single status..

And here you go- most guys are like this- it is understandable after all..no future means no interest.


TPower said:


> I always, I mean always hint at meeting up, talking on the phone, stuff like that. If they don't respond favorably, I quit and just wait for the next.


It's just a weird game I play..I'm sure people play their games online as well.


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## luceo (Jan 29, 2011)

Typically people on dating sites are looking to date. It's not unreasonable to think that someone would find it a waste of time to talk to someone that never had any intention of dating.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

luceo said:


> Typically people on dating sites are looking to date. It's not unreasonable to think that someone would find it a waste of time to talk to someone that never had any intention of dating.


I totally understand that...thus the reason for this topic..misleading guys. I'm not even going to go into how I make sure they never know me...because it's completely crazy..


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## Marakunda (Jun 7, 2011)

As long as you don't go too far with it, I don't see much wrong with it. That being said, most guys are on those sites for real relationships... No offense but the reason you signed up for those sites seems kinda selfish to me, only YOU gain something from it. 

You don't want a relationship but still want male attention?! Why? Why the need for male attention? Doesn't make much sense to me....


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## Kennnie (Oct 21, 2010)

Skylaishot said:


> As long as you don't go too far with it, I don't see much wrong with it. That being said, most guys are on those sites for real relationships... No offense but the reason you signed up for those sites seems kinda selfish to me, only YOU gain something from it.
> 
> You don't want a relationship but still want male attention?! Why? Why the need for male attention? Doesn't make much sense to me....


I'm down with this post, that's completely fycked up!


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

Skylaishot said:


> You don't want a relationship but still want male attention?! Why? Why the need for male attention? Doesn't make much sense to me....


You do know that that's what girls are infamous for on the internet? Seeking out attention through photos or flirting? It's a case of low self-esteem and needing constant reaffirmation about yourself from the opposite sex. It's like a confidence booster.

What am I talking about "on the internet", in LIFE! =)


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## nemesis1 (Dec 21, 2009)

This happened to me quite a lot when i was using dating sites and tbh, it really pisses me off.

Why the hell join dating sites if you have no intention of ever meeting anyone and just want to play silly little games? You could at least make that clear in your profile that you just wanna chat and nothing more. They could be chatting with people who actually wanna meet instead of wasting their time with childish game players who are looking for a confidence boost and nothing more.

Pathetic.


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## Charizard (Feb 16, 2011)

Be upfront and honest with people. Don't waste their time. You might see it as just a game, or think that what happens online doesn't matter- but your exchanges with other people are just that, exchanges with other people. And they deserve at least a little bit of respect.


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## Kennnie (Oct 21, 2010)

Charizard said:


> Be upfront and honest with people. Don't waste their time. You might see it as just a game, or think that what happens online doesn't matter- but your exchanges with other people are just that, exchanges with other people. And they deserve at least a little bit of respect.


I second this, dont waste peoples times foo! Quit being selfish. Your interacting with people, even if its online theres a person behind that screen! :b


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## watashi (Feb 6, 2008)

Talk to guys from other countries or who live far away. Unless they travel a lot they won't have the opportunity to meet you and you can get all the attention you want.


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## leave me alone (Apr 1, 2011)

This keeps happening to me in most of my "online relationships". The other person expects me to meet asap. That in my case takes a lot of travelling and stuff, but most importantly, i cannot do it due to my SA. It is just too scary to meet with someone face to face, especially the girl i like. It is hard for them to understand, that at this point in my life, i cannot really deal with that kind of situation and "online friends" thing is good enough for me.



calichick said:


> I totally understand that...thus the reason for this topic..misleading guys. I'm not even going to go into how I make sure they never know me...because it's completely crazy..


Haha, now i am curious.


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## UndreamingAwake (Apr 11, 2011)

PiscesVixen said:


> I even get guys who get pissed off for "wasting" their time talking to me when they realize I just want to be friends :blank.


But of course! You're on a *dating*site for a reason. And my guess is that it's mostly not to find "friends".



calichick said:


> Lol I get that too! It's like their desperation for intimacy is just a ticking time bomb. Some guys will say "next time when I message you, tell me straight forward that you're not interested." I'm like, why would there be a next time? I think that men online have more of a sense of urgency than girls...


Think it through. It's probably got more to do with how you are on a datingsite, and therefore, men are going to assume that you too are looking for.... a date! And not friendship. Is that desperation? No, not in my book. It's simply assuming that you are using the site for the very reason it's meant to be used. If you go on a datingsite to find "friends", you're in the wrong place, unless the specific site also offers the option to search for friends, like OKCupid for example.

I mean, I can understand why it's scary, and sure, there's nothing wrong with feeling desired by the opposite sex, but it's not exactly fair to the other person.


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## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

calichick said:


> I don't know if anyone else does this, but as most of you here, I'm single, and I don't actively pursue relationships, I'm frightened of them, I don't know how to interact with males, and I'm kind of content with it. But I still crave male attention, I want to talk to guys, so it comes down to the internet....A lot of guys on here have made rants about dating sites, but sometimes I just like to join them every so often to see what kind of guys would be interested in me. I am 95% sure I have no intention of ever meeting with them, because meeting with someone over the internet just does not seem like an option to me. I have SA, I'm confused how you guys can all muster up strength to do that. So I like their interest, I know it is a bit misleading to them, because they are expecting me to go out on a date...but yea...I like just talking to them...here...in the safety of the internet...I try to prolong our time talking together as long as possible..until they start asking for my number.:sus And then I will just write them off/ignore them/make up an excuse. It's a habit actually. Do you think this is really horrible of me?


Is it horrible of you? Well when things are going well with a girl and then she clams up like that, it's pretty hurtful to the guy. The guy starts wondering, "aw crap was it something I said? asking for her number seemed needy right? shucks. Dammit why do I have to play these stupid dating games? Is it so wrong to seem interested in another fellow human being?" Or "dammit why did she flake out on me?"

Girls clamming up like that is something that just happens a lot with online dating. And guys gotta get used to it. But it is indeed hurtful to the guy. And I've been there. I was really eager for the meet up with a girl and she kept delaying it. It was getting ridiculous. I wanted to just drop her and that's that but she was talking about how she really liked me in that way so I kept giving her the benefit of the doubt. Especially when I know what it's like to be really socially anxious and there's a part of me that does want to flake out in those situations too.


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## River In The Mountain (Jun 6, 2011)

Hmm, its not really a nice thing to do if you just want positive attention. Its probably confusing for the guy, and you don't know what that might end up doing to his own self confidence/esteem. Besides, it will always only be a quick fix for you if your own sense of self has to come from a guy giving you attention. Whatever about just talking to guys online on various forums, some of them probably only want friendship, but I dont think its right to go on a dating site, specifically for people wanting something more and let them think they might be getting somewhere with you.
Its good that you are questioning this though, and yep, dating/online dating/ relationships in general are scary!


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## OldSchoolSkater (Jun 3, 2011)

I don't think what you are doing is any different than most women - on the internet and in real life. I don't think it's a good or acceptable practice, but it's pretty common.


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## phoenixwright (Jun 22, 2011)

PiscesVixen said:


> I agree with this.
> 
> I even get guys who get pissed off for "wasting" their time talking to me when they realize I just want to be friends :blank.
> 
> I think you should consider working on your fear . Maybe you'll find dating and being in an actual relationship satisfying and it would definitely fulfill your craving for male attention :yes.


If you have down that you are "looking for/here for: friends" in your dating site profile, I don't think what you are doing is bad. Plenty of Fish, OKCupid, etc. may be known as "dating sites" but there is an option for meeting friends on there.

Personally I don't mind befriending girls. Because I actually like talking to girls and value friendship. A lot of guys don't see things that way though. They're just narrowly focused on the goal of getting a girlfriend or getting laid. And don't see the potential for personal growth from a friendship with a female. Maybe it's because I have SA and barely have a social life to begin with. And I see how much a lack of strong social relationships in my life has hindered my mental health and social development. I have trouble relating to people (that's pretty much the core fundamental of a relationship) and I'm rather disconnected from society. Making new friends, especially ones that I can hang out with in-person, is very beneficial for me. Even if a guy isn't shy, it would help to have female friends so that he can gain experience with relating to women.


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## Atticus (Nov 10, 2003)

Understanding your motives makes what you're doing understandable, but it doesn't make it OK. Fundamentally, you're using people to meet your needs under deceptive circumstances. If you're straight with them about your intentions and they stick around hoping for something else, then that's their call. Give them that choice.


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## Jeff (Nov 11, 2005)

calichick said:


> I don't know if anyone else does this, but as most of you here, I'm single, and I don't actively pursue relationships, I'm frightened of them, I don't know how to interact with males, and I'm kind of content with it. But I still crave male attention, I want to talk to guys, so it comes down to the internet....A lot of guys on here have made rants about dating sites, but sometimes I just like to join them every so often to see what kind of guys would be interested in me. I am 95% sure I have no intention of ever meeting with them, because meeting with someone over the internet just does not seem like an option to me. I have SA, I'm confused how you guys can all muster up strength to do that. So I like their interest, I know it is a bit misleading to them, because they are expecting me to go out on a date...but yea...I like just talking to them...here...in the safety of the internet...I try to prolong our time talking together as long as possible..until they start asking for my number.:sus And then I will just write them off/ignore them/make up an excuse. It's a habit actually. Do you think this is really horrible of me?


You can't expect the other person to have the same casual attitude about it as you do. You are on dating site, not a friendship site. Yes! It's rude to just ignore someone. Actually, it's beyond rude, it's hurtful. It's easy to fall into the mindset that the internet is an anonymous experience, like you're playing a video game or something. But you have to remind yourself that the person on the other end is a human being with feelings. When it comes to online dating sites and chatrooms, there are usually far more men than women, and unfortunately a lot of women get caught up in the power of this advantage and treat men like another pair of shoes, sad.

You should feel guilty and I hope that you've learned something that will make you a better person going forward. Not to be harsh, but you _knew_ when you started this thread you were doing something wrong, that's why you started it, you didn't really even have to ask.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

watashi said:


> Talk to guys from other countries or who live far away. Unless they travel a lot they won't have the opportunity to meet you and you can get all the attention you want.


That is exactly what I do. I speak French so it's easy to fit in international websites or I just pick a random state across the country. But the thing is, guys want convenience and if you say you're from 5,000 miles away, they won't even be interested. Which is why I usually invent a little white lie that I live near them?



Jeff said:


> You can't expect the other person to have the same casual attitude about it as you do. You are on dating site, not a friendship site. Yes! It's rude to just ignore someone. Actually, it's beyond rude, it's hurtful. It's easy to fall into the mindset that the internet is an anonymous experience, like you're playing a video game or something. But you have to remind yourself that the person on the other end is a human being with feelings. When it comes to online dating sites and chatrooms, there are usually far more men than women, and unfortunately a lot of women get caught up in the power of this advantage and treat men like another pair of shoes, sad.
> 
> You should feel guilty and I hope that you've learned something that will make you a better person going forward. Not to be harsh, but you _knew_ when you started this thread you were doing something wrong, that's why you started it, you didn't really even have to ask.


Yes, it is an emotional high and I get addicted to it. I know it's wrong but feeling wanted is just something I need..



max4225 said:


> Are there sites for just flirting with no expectations of hooking up? Seems like you'd have more fun somewhere like that. I usually stay clear of dating sites so I'm not sure what's out there.


Every forum on the internet? But that isn't really satisfying, because you rarely know their true intentions...I want to know if I'd be someone they would actually consider a relationship with....This is weird :blank


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## Atticus (Nov 10, 2003)

The more you explain yourself the more I think you need to take a hard look at your behavior. You know it's wrong and you seem aware of how it might feel to be mistreated in this manner, and yet you need..........


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## Jeff (Nov 11, 2005)

calichick said:


> But the thing is, guys want convenience and if you say you're from 5,000 miles away, they won't even be interested. Which is why I usually invent a little white lie that I live near them?


Wow....



calichick said:


> Yes, it is an emotional high and I get addicted to it. I know it's wrong but feeling wanted is just something I need..


So if you know what you are doing is wrong, why the thread? You were hoping some people will tell you it's no big deal and you can keep up your little addiction without as much guilt? :no


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## River In The Mountain (Jun 6, 2011)

calichick said:


> Yes, it is an emotional high and I get addicted to it. I know it's wrong but feeling wanted is just something I need..


Sorry, but using somebody else to feel wanted like that is pretty manipulative. Consider what the other person feels. :|


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

Jeff said:


> So if you know what you are doing is wrong, why the thread? You were hoping some people will tell you it's no big deal and you can keep up your little addiction without as much guilt? :no


I was actually hoping some more people would say they've been doing the same thing or share their experiences online with me. But confessing this stuff to you guys kind of relieves guilt.



River In The Mountain said:


> Sorry, but using somebody else to feel wanted like that is pretty manipulative. Consider what the other person feels. :|


I think that I have this pretty negative view of guys deep down and think they're all out for the wrong reasons and deserve to be hurt.

To be honest. Wow I love these types of forums, I can be completely honest..


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## TinyFlutter (Jun 19, 2011)

Metalunatic said:


> But of course! You're on a *dating*site for a reason. And my guess is that it's mostly not to find "friends".





phoenixwright said:


> If you have down that you are "looking for/here for: friends" in your dating site profile, I don't think what you are doing is bad. Plenty of Fish, OKCupid, etc. may be known as "dating sites" but there is an option for meeting friends on there.


Opps, I meant that guys *in general* get mad at me when they realize I just want to be friends. I don't use any dating sites.


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## OldSchoolSkater (Jun 3, 2011)

calichick said:


> I was actually hoping some more people would say they've been doing the same thing or share their experiences online with me. But confessing this stuff to you guys kind of relieves guilt.
> 
> *I think that I have this pretty negative view of guys deep down and think they're all out for the wrong reasons and deserve to be hurt.*
> 
> To be honest. Wow I love these types of forums, I can be completely honest..


When I first read your original post I thought "Eh, whatever. No one is getting really hurt by you wanting the attention," but the bolded statement above would lead me to believe that you are intentionally doing this to hurt men and enjoy doing it. I do NOT think this is ok, and I think you know it as well. Why can't you just put that you are looking for "friends" in your profile, and then stay as friends with these guys instead of blowing them off or insulting them or whatever it is that you do to "hurt" them how they "deserve to be hurt."

I can honestly say as a man that yeah I had some bad karma coming to me after high school (cheated on and lied to women), but at this point in my life I think it's evened out and I don't think most men deserve to be hurt. What is this, a tv movie where the main actresses goal is to ruin and hurt every man she meets? You need to think about why you have so much hatred towards men and then decide whether or not RANDOM guys you don't even know "deserve to be hurt."

I would say that you manipulating and hurting men that didn't hurt you in any way is childish and unacceptable. No wonder I can't find a decent woman I'd like to spend more time with - you have proven to me that women can be and are just as brutal as men.


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

Calichick, what did you expect to come of this thread? This behavior is rather incorrigible and generally looked down upon. Do you feel remorse or will you continue this trend to soak what you "need?"


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## watashi (Feb 6, 2008)

calichick said:


> But the thing is, guys want convenience and if you say you're from 5,000 miles away, they won't even be interested.


That's because they want someone they can meet in real life and date, but not all do. Some people look for friends too and like talking online. When I used social networking sites I befriended many guys who lived across the world from me. As long as they think you're cute and have something in common with them they'll talk to you. You shouldn't lie about your location though.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

Tenebrous said:


> Calichick, what did you expect to come of this thread? This behavior is rather incorrigible and generally looked down upon. Do you feel remorse or will you continue this trend to soak what you "need?"


I don't see what's worse about my topic then the many prostitution threads and posts on SAS. We have our needs. We satisfy them. My needs in this case are emotional. Everyone in this world uses other people..it's a fact.


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## OldSchoolSkater (Jun 3, 2011)

calichick;[I said:


> 1059311434[/I]]I don't see what's worse about my topic then the many prostitution threads and posts on SAS. We have our needs. We satisfy them. My needs in this case are emotional. Everyone in this world uses other people..it's a fact.


Ahhh. You are one of _those_ people, huh?

"I see everyone else taking advantage of people, so I'll do it too. I see everyone else stealing something, so I'll steal it too. I see everyone else lying to their boyfriend/girlfriend, so I'll do it too."

Unfortunately this is all too common. We, as humans, are obligated to one another to try to make this place (earth) better for EVERYONE. It's really just too bad that this attitude has taken over and all everyone cares about these days is themselves - everyone from CEO's at fortune 500 companies to the women/men who use vulnerable people in order to get what they want.

But yeah don't worry, no one here thinks your a ***** for doing this


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

OldSchoolSkater said:


> Ahhh. You are one of _those_ people, huh?
> 
> "I see everyone else taking advantage of people, so I'll do it too. I see everyone else stealing something, so I'll steal it too. I see everyone else lying to their boyfriend/girlfriend, so I'll do it too."
> 
> ...


But using other people is not a crime nor sin like lying or stealing. It is completely natural. We use our parents to get grounded in life. We use our teachers for knowledge. We use our spouses for emotional and financial support. As Aristotle put it, the most basic form of relation rests on utility. The problem with CEOs is not using "vulnerable people" but the corruption of decision-making at the top and corporate greed.


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## GunnyHighway (Sep 28, 2010)

I was going to post something meaningful in this thread, but I'm just gonna go ahead and delete it since it's of no use. Might as well replace it with this, since I see a ****-slinging fest coming up.


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## Dan iel (Feb 13, 2011)




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## UniversalPolymath (Jun 3, 2011)

calichick said:


> But using other people is not a crime nor sin like lying or stealing. It is completely natural.


Sorry (no I'm not), but you're seriously off-base. For one, it's irrelevant that what you're doing isn't a "crime". This isn't a legal issue, but it's certainly a moral one. I like how you mention lying as something that's _really_ wrong. What you're doing isn't unlike lying at all.


calichick said:


> We use our parents to get grounded in life. We use our teachers for knowledge. We use our spouses for emotional and financial support.


Horrible comparisons. Parents help in their children's development _by choice_. Teachers impart us with knowledge _by choice_. Our spouses offer emotional and financial support _by choice_. See what all these cases have in common?

Aristotelian ethics were based on* mutual* utility - that is, relationships in which both parties have something to offer, and both parties benefit equally. It has absolutely nothing to do with "using" someone for your own purposes without them even knowing it, and in a way that you know causes them harm. There's no good defense for what you're doing; at the very least, I can tell you that you're not going to find it in the works of Aristotle.

I find it interesting that you started the thread asking if what you were doing was "horrible", and then you conceded several times that you know that it's wrong. I really think you expected people to pardon you, and I really think that's the reaction you were hoping for; upon not getting it, it looks like you went into hyper-defensive mode, where not only are you suddenly willing to stand by your actions at all costs, but you claim they deserve it. It's absurd, but that's the only way I can make sense out of the trajectory of this thread.


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## s0dy (May 23, 2011)

UniversalPolymath said:


> What you're doing isn't unlike lying at all.


She does, somewhere along the text, admit that she lies about her location (ie. where she lives) to keep the guys interested.
I would say...it's a case of hypocrisy.

*edit*
Adding quote so I don't look like a lying *******:



calichick said:


> That is exactly what I do. I speak French so it's easy to fit in international websites or I just pick a random state across the country. But the thing is, guys want convenience and if you say you're from 5,000 miles away, they won't even be interested. Which is why I usually invent a little white lie that I live near them?


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## UniversalPolymath (Jun 3, 2011)

s0dy said:


> She does, somewhere along the text, admit that she lies about her location (ie. where she lives) to keep the guys interested.


Missed that one. Lovely.


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

I have a quick way of dealing with knowing whether a girl is serious to date or just beating around the bush:

I text/call and ask them to hang out. It never fails. Every time a girl isn't interested she will either keep making up excuses or never return the call or text. It's that simple. In which case, I delete them from my contacts as they probably wish I do.


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

Pretty low act tbh, specially considering you have stated that you think they deserve to be hurt. One day the favour will be returned and you will be a mess.


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## au Lait (Sep 8, 2010)

calichick said:


> But using other people is not a crime nor sin like lying or stealing. It is completely natural. We use our parents to get grounded in life. We use our teachers for knowledge. We use our spouses for emotional and financial support.


That's debatable.

The examples you give are more like mutualism. Our parents nurture us, help us grow, and when they become elderly, we repay the favor by caring for them. We don't necessarily "use" them. Teachers teach b/c it is their job. They get paid for it, and we pay them with tuition fees. And I would certainly hope that people who are married bring more to the table than just the need to be financially/emotionally dependent.

When you use someone, it is not an equal exchange. The other person is often unaware that they are being used, and ends up getting hurt.

There is nothing wrong with flirting without the intent of ever meeting, as long as the other person is aware that's all it is. Some people just like to flirt, and will be totally up for that. You are not obligated to meet anyone irl. However, *you need to be upfront and honest about your intentions*. Tell the other person that you just want to flirt online, and that you're not looking to take things offline.

If you expect others to be honest with you, then you owe them the same courtesy. You should let the other person know that you don't wish to meet irl, so that they can make an informed decision about whether or not they want to continue to communicate with you. Some people will be cool with that, and some will not. That is their choice. It is wrong to willfully deceive others just to get something you want from them, and that is exactly what you are doing.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

GunnyHighway said:


> I was going to post something meaningful in this thread, but I'm just gonna go ahead and delete it since it's of no use. Might as well replace it with this, since I see a ****-slinging fest coming up.


Fortunately, I know how to have an intelligent conversation in the "controversial discussion" section of the website without flaming anyone. 



UniversalPolymath said:


> Aristotelian ethics were based on* mutual* utility - that is, relationships in which both parties have something to offer, and both parties benefit equally. It has absolutely nothing to do with "using" someone for your own purposes without them even knowing it, and in a way that you know causes them harm. There's no good defense for what you're doing; at the very least, I can tell you that you're not going to find it in the works of Aristotle.


I know it's based on mutual utility. You think that just by engaging in a conversation with a guy, that they aren't benefiting from it at all? Am I caging them and sucking the life from them, are they unhappy from it? No quite the opposite! Friendship is the mutual feeling of goodwill between two people. So ask yourself this, isn't it rare for non-mutual "relations" to occur? Tyranny? Slavery?

BTW I wanted to add I don't really lie, I just don't admit to them where I am. So lying really is not the same thing as withholding . .



bwidger85 said:


> I text/call and ask them to hang out. It never fails. Every time a girl isn't interested she will either keep making up excuses or never return the call or text. It's that simple. In which case, I delete them from my contacts as they probably wish I do.


And the longer a guy waits around for you, is directly related to how much interest/attraction he really has in you...I know this all..Online dating is literally a game.



Ospi said:


> Pretty low act tbh, specially considering you have stated that you think they deserve to be hurt. One day the favour will be returned and you will be a mess.


Well for one, a guy already has done that, so that's taken care of. And second, to prevent against it happening again, the motto is, make sure _the guy is more interested in you than you are in him._ Why do you think there are so many "unequal" relationships out there..


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## s0dy (May 23, 2011)

calichick said:


> I know it's based on mutual utility. You think that just by engaging in a conversation with a guy, that they aren't benefiting from it at all? Am I caging them and sucking the life from them, are they unhappy from it? No quite the opposite!


So...I can nurture a child for years, watch him/her grow and then someday without warning get in the car with them and drop them in the middle of the forest?
They benefited from living with me for years, do you think they didn't benefit, quite the opposite!...and they can always be adopted by wolves :teeth

The problem is not you talking with them (nurturing the kid, in my analogy), the problem is that you mislead them on the conversation to serve your purposes (lying about where you live and whatnot, as long as it grabs their interest. In my analogy it would be part of nurturing: "I'm your father and I love you very much! I want to see you grow and become a good person.") and then, when you get tired of them you simply drop them and ignore how they might feel (in my analogy, dropping the child in the forest.).
In fact, it's worse, you don't simply ignore how they feel, you KNOW they'll probably feel like crap and rejoice on that.
Certain roles come with certain expectations. Becoming a parent comes with loving your child (or at least not dropping them in the woods); going on a dating site and talking with someone comes with actually being open/available to a date (and/or rejecting people with a bit of tact).
At least be honest with them about what you expect/want (in my analogy it would be warning the child early on: "As soon as you're 12 years old I'm dropping you in the woods, be ready for it") at least you warned beforehand.


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## reno316 (Jun 13, 2009)

calichick said:


> No....they would definitely not like the idea of just talking..I'm fairly certain of that..


You're on a dating site. The initial expectations of others is that you would be interested in dating. If your not, atleast you should be upfront about it at first so your not wasting anyone's time.


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## reno316 (Jun 13, 2009)

calichick said:


> For me, it's not about being in control or having power or the upper-hand at all.* I just crave male company. Not in real life.* Because I'm afraid of guys (to be honest). And yes, I only do it online, considering the fact that I don't even look them in the eyes in my day to day activities. But this is all the fun of social anxiety, I don't think "normal" women do this at all.
> 
> But I make this topic because I do feel pangs of guilt...like at the moment..


There is nothing wrong with this. Just be honest with them.


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## Jeff (Nov 11, 2005)

calichick said:


> I think that I have this pretty negative view of guys deep down and think they're all out for the wrong reasons and deserve to be hurt.





calichick said:


> Online dating is literally a game.


Not everyone see's it that way. Some people are actually trying to find a partner for life. Your perspective on this is morally F'd up and I cannot believe you are actually trying to defend your actions. It sounds like you need to speak with a professional about your negative view of men before you really hurt someone. You being hurt before is absolutely NO excuse. I've been cheated on by a special woman in my life before, but I don't (nor would I ever) use this as an excuse to mislead and hurt a woman. Seriously, are you for real? Your thread is starting is starting to feel like a practical joke of some kind. I keep waiting for you to reveal it was all some social experiment or something. Unbelievable..........


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

s0dy said:


> So...I can nurture a child for years, watch him/her grow and then someday without warning get in the car with them and drop them in the middle of the forest?
> They benefited from living with me for years, do you think they didn't benefit, quite the opposite!...and they can always be adopted by wolves :teeth
> 
> The problem is not you talking with them (nurturing the kid, in my analogy), the problem is that you mislead them on the conversation to serve your purposes (lying about where you live and whatnot, as long as it grabs their interest. In my analogy it would be part of nurturing: "I'm your father and I love you very much! I want to see you grow and become a good person.") and then, when you get tired of them you simply drop them and ignore how they might feel (in my analogy, dropping the child in the forest.).
> ...


Except that's not really a valid comparison, for one online dating is all about chance, and uncertainty, you're not a child and a parent on an online dating site, bound to eachother by obligation. The purpose of online dating is not to put all your eggs in one basket, but explore what's out there. I think it'd be impractical to already think girlfriend marriage wife with one person.


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## UniversalPolymath (Jun 3, 2011)

calichick said:


> I know it's based on mutual utility. You think that just by engaging in a conversation with a guy, that they aren't benefiting from it at all? Am I caging them and sucking the life from them, are they unhappy from it? No quite the opposite! Friendship is the mutual feeling of goodwill between two people. So ask yourself this, isn't it rare for non-mutual "relations" to occur? Tyranny? Slavery?


The question is whether or not that brief window of friendship justifies abruptly cutting them off later on. I'd argue it doesn't (as would, presumably, most people who've responded to this thread).

As already said many times, developing a relationship with someone, with the expectation that it could become something more (implicit due to the fact that it unfolds on a dating website), and then having them cut you out later on can be really hurtful. It's confusing, it's frustrating, and it can discourage people to try again with someone else in the future. The potential harm caused by the fallout greatly outweighs whatever temporary happiness you provide for them under false pretenses.


calichick said:


> Which is why *I usually invent a little white lie* that I live near them?





calichick said:


> BTW *I wanted to add I don't really lie*, I just don't admit to them where I am. So lying really is not the same thing as withholding . .


Huh. Is it just me, or are you having trouble keeping your story straight?

Besides, it doesn't matter if you specifically lie about your location or not; this whole game you're playing is based on deception. You're already aware of the fact that you're misleading others. It's a dishonest game, and you know that.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

au Lait said:


> There is nothing wrong with flirting without the intent of ever meeting, as long as the other person is aware that's all it is. Some people just like to flirt, and will be totally up for that. You are not obligated to meet anyone irl. However, *you need to be upfront and honest about your intentions*. Tell the other person that you just want to flirt online, and that you're not looking to take things offline.


To be fair, I have never said "after we get to know each other online, we are going to meet". Never. I usually just tell them I'm not used to online dating and I'm not sure it works. Actually that's exactly what I tell them.



Jeff said:


> It sounds like you need to speak with a professional about your negative view of men before you really hurt someone. You being hurt before is absolutely NO excuse.


So riddle me this, how is it possible to get hurt from someone.........online?



> I keep waiting for you to reveal it was all some social experiment or something. Unbelievable..........


That is what outsiders think of people with social anxiety. It is unbelievable to fathom that someone can act/think/feel these ways about social situations. But as you and I both know...it's possible!


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## UniversalPolymath (Jun 3, 2011)

calichick said:


> So riddle me this, how is it possible to get hurt from someone.........online?


Trust me. It happens. People can get hurt online _badly_. And it doesn't matter if you've never experienced it or if you couldn't even begin to understand it. It happens, and that's a fact.

I still find your change of heart throughout this thread fascinating, though. From the top, you've given us:

- Do you think this is really horrible of me?
- I do feel pangs of guilt.
- I know it's wrong ...
- I think [guys] are all out for the wrong reasons and deserve to be hurt.
- Using other people is not a crime nor sin ...It is completely natural.

Care to explain?


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## s0dy (May 23, 2011)

calichick said:


> Except that's not really a valid comparison, for one online dating is all about chance, and uncertainty, you're not a child and a parent on an online dating site, bound to eachother by obligation. The purpose of online dating is not to put all your eggs in one basket, but explore what's out there. I think it'd be impractical to already think girlfriend marriage wife with one person.


Sorry, I edited my post before I realized someone quoted, I knew someone would point that those are different situations and the poor child couldn't really choose his/her parents (oh look, chance and uncertainty, who would've known...). So here is what I added:



> Certain roles come with certain expectations. Becoming a parent comes with loving your child (or at least not dropping them in the woods); going on a dating site and talking with someone comes with actually being open/available to a date (or at least rejecting people with a bit of tact).


And...holy crap...



calichick said:


> So riddle me this, how is it possible to get hurt from someone.........online?


Are you really asking how it's possible for someone to get hurt by suddenly being ignored after a period of conversing with someone? It's online? Same **** as if it was real life, someone suddenly without warning stops talking to you after a period of conversation, you get hurt, almost nothing? a little bit? a lot? completely wrecked? depends on the person, but...damn...as much as I love to joke that for me people on forums are simply bits of text that pop-up now and then, I still know one thing: they are people, hence they most probably have feelings.
"One should treat others as one would like others to treat oneself.", it's called the Golden Rule for some reason. It has been around for 4000 years or more and unfortunately gets ignored quite often...


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

UniversalPolymath said:


> Care to explain?


You know I really just wanted to let you guys know the motives behind some women for going online like I do, because of the number of threads made in this section complaining about unresponsive women and such. Girls who aren't socially ept need a guy every so often to stroke their egos. And I don't see anything wrong with it, because online dating is not the same as real dating. It is a different world, you have to expect it to happen and be prepared...


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

calichick said:


> And the longer a guy waits around for you, is directly related to how much interest/attraction he really has in you


wrong. a lot of guys don't like waiting around and being pen pals


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## Atticus (Nov 10, 2003)

I think calichick knows exactly what she's doing on those dating sites and here. And here, we're all falling for her sad little act.

Seems you do this about once per year, huh?


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## UniversalPolymath (Jun 3, 2011)

That doesn't really explain the quick reversals. Hey look, you just gave us a new one:


calichick said:


> Yes, it is an emotional high and I get addicted to it. *I know it's wrong* but feeling wanted is just something I need..





calichick said:


> *And I don't see anything wrong with it*, because online dating is not the same as real dating.


I just think you're really confused.


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

She is getting the attention she so craves, to be sure.


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## Dead Leaves (Aug 20, 2011)

We're feeding a troll. :yay


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## Jeff (Nov 11, 2005)

calichick said:


> So riddle me this, how is it possible to get hurt from someone.........online?


Very easily. The fact that you even ask this question is scary. I guess you assume that every guy you meet online has thick skin, massive amounts of confidence and see's the situation as a "game" like you do. On the contrary, I'd say the majority of men who resort to online dating are more likely to be insecure and have confidence issues, making them even more vulnerable to someone like you who views them as random characters in an online video game.



calichick said:


> That is what outsiders think of people with social anxiety. It is unbelievable to fathom that someone can act/think/feel these ways about social situations. But as you and I both know...it's possible!


The majority of people I've come across with SA still have their innate sense of morality intact, no matter how poorly they calculate the right course of action in social interactions. You have lost that somewhere along the line. Despite over 20 people on this very thread telling you otherwise, you are still defending yourself, still looking for that one reply that will validate your actions. You're in denial, and I feel sorry for the next guy on some dating site (or in real life) who takes a chance to connect with you, only to get ignored and swept aside like a mosquito.


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## UniversalPolymath (Jun 3, 2011)

Dead Leaves said:


> We're feeding a troll. :yay


I'm usually pretty good about not getting sucked in, but I suspect you're right. We all needs to get outa here.


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## s0dy (May 23, 2011)

Tenebrous said:


> She is getting the attention she so craves, to be sure.


Except it's not positive attention, but hey, might stroke her ego anyway :teeth

And yeah, I'm also done here...


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## RetroDoll (Jun 25, 2011)

calichick said:


> I don't know if anyone else does this, but as most of you here, I'm single, and I don't actively pursue relationships, I'm frightened of them, I don't know how to interact with males, and I'm kind of content with it. But I still crave male attention, I want to talk to guys, so it comes down to the internet....A lot of guys on here have made rants about dating sites, but sometimes I just like to join them every so often to see what kind of guys would be interested in me. I am 95% sure I have no intention of ever meeting with them, because meeting with someone over the internet just does not seem like an option to me. I have SA, I'm confused how you guys can all muster up strength to do that. So I like their interest, I know it is a bit misleading to them, because they are expecting me to go out on a date...but yea...I like just talking to them...here...in the safety of the internet...I try to prolong our time talking together as long as possible..until they start asking for my number.:sus And then I will just write them off/ignore them/make up an excuse. It's a habit actually. Do you think this is really horrible of me?


they probably do the same types of things, misleading about themselves. just say from the jump, you're only looking for male friends and that should clear things up....whole movie made recently about this same type thing. fascinating movie too -- "Catfish."


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## IcedOver (Feb 26, 2007)

I agree with you that we use each other to satisfy our wants. That's a realistic view. People have a romantic view of male/female relationships where it's about all these frothy sentiments you'd find on greeting cards, but that's not reality. It's about desires and who can fulfill them. 

You crave male attention, and probably attention in general, and since you won't allow yourself to get it in real life, you get it online. What you're doing isn't that offensive, but it'd be better if you didn't do it on a formal dating site. It's extremely difficult for a man to get any kind of sustained female attention on such sites, so when a woman messages him, he gets his hopes up. Despite what you think, it will hurt him if he finds that it was all a sham. You also said that online dating is just a game, but for some it's not. Like you, a lot of guys can't go out and get dates in person (e.g., 98% of the people on this forum). To them, online dating can be a legitimate avenue for meeting someone. A message in an inbox on a dating site, whether solicited or not, will brighten someone's day. If it's all fake, that really sucks, and you're almost no better than the fvcking African scam artists that regularly invade such sites (including this forum). 

You really should consider taking this flirting activity to another type of site other than a dating site. What kind, I don't know. Maybe some adult-oriented chat group, whether or not it's sexual.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

calichick said:


> Do you think this is really horrible of me?


"Horrible" would be if you talked them into coming over and then killed them.

This just seems... immature, inappropriate, unethical... Take your pick.

No doubt other people do this sort of thing you describe (not that I buy into it being as prevalent as you imply), but that doesn't excuse it.


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## stylicho (Nov 8, 2003)

> I don't know if anyone else does this, but as most of you here, I'm single, and I don't actively pursue relationships, I'm frightened of them, I don't know how to interact with males, and I'm kind of content with it. But I still crave male attention, I want to talk to guys, so it comes down to the internet....A lot of guys on here have made rants about dating sites, but sometimes I just like to join them every so often to see what kind of guys would be interested in me. I am 95% sure I have no intention of ever meeting with them, because meeting with someone over the internet just does not seem like an option to me. I have SA, I'm confused how you guys can all muster up strength to do that. So I like their interest, I know it is a bit misleading to them, because they are expecting me to go out on a date...but yea...I like just talking to them...here...in the safety of the internet...I try to prolong our time talking together as long as possible..until they start asking for my number. And then I will just write them off/ignore them/make up an excuse. It's a habit actually. Do you think this is really horrible of me?


Nope. This just validates the expression I once heard that stated attention is the currency of women.


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## stylicho (Nov 8, 2003)

Lol at everyone freaking out about what she's doing. There are people much more deceiving on these sites than she is. Things that cause much more than "feelings" getting hurt. And most of these people are men. They pretend they're women in an attempt to get something from the deceived. Or they are guys having fun at the desperate guy's expense. I mean if she were trying to get money from the lonely guys and then take off that would be totally different.


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## stylicho (Nov 8, 2003)

> We're feeding a troll.


Maybe it's a guy :lol


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

Ladies, you wonder why guys appear bitter.....this one is at least being honest.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

stylicho said:


> Maybe it's a guy :lol


*Nope...not a guy..just a 21 year old girl with a lot of mental problems..lol But hey, you think I'm bad, you should meet my 22-year old friend, manipulation of guys is really a game to some women- (this isn't really about online dating just manipulating men in general and she doesn't have social anxiety)*



> if you do it wrong, he'll hate you, potentially physically abuse you. if you do it right, he won't know you're doing it, and will think any issue that arises IS his fault (key is to discover all of his secrets and lies while keeping yours buried) and will love you for life. so it all depends on execution. if he KNOWs youre doing it, and many girls arent very subtle, he will dislike it, but if youre a master manipulator, its akin to producing extremely longlasting stockholm syndrome ... not necessarily right, but if you do it right, it works
> 
> but mine are not affection. i would certainly agree that my method is a horrid basis for a relationship. but like i said, i'm not seeking an affectionate relationship when i pull it. when you want affection, it is best to be loved, and my method will not achieve true love. but if you want power, it is best to be feared and to have other people obsessed with you, which is what my method seems to achieve. if i put in no effort, i can get a kind and considerate boyfriend. but if i put in this effort, i'll get the boyfriend who dumps any friend i disapprove of without question, who buys me anything i ask for without question. that is my purpose and my means achieve that.
> 
> ...


This last paragraph completely describes me...


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

Im not gonna lie, having been in a relationship quite similar to the ones calichick abides by,i enjoyed it a bit. but it wasnt overseas or online, it was rl. let it be known, i am a masochist though, heh. but ive a plethora of mental problems myself, not just SA, by any means, im talking mood and personality disorders.


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

calichick said:


> I don't know if anyone else does this, but as most of you here, I'm single, and I don't actively pursue relationships, I'm frightened of them, I don't know how to interact with males, and I'm kind of content with it. But I still crave male attention, I want to talk to guys, so it comes down to the internet....A lot of guys on here have made rants about dating sites, but sometimes I just like to join them every so often to see what kind of guys would be interested in me. I am 95% sure I have no intention of ever meeting with them, because meeting with someone over the internet just does not seem like an option to me. I have SA, I'm confused how you guys can all muster up strength to do that. So I like their interest, I know it is a bit misleading to them, because they are expecting me to go out on a date...but yea...I like just talking to them...here...in the safety of the internet...I try to prolong our time talking together as long as possible..until they start asking for my number.:sus And then I will just write them off/ignore them/make up an excuse. It's a habit actually. Do you think this is really horrible of me?


Those actions are the cross between a tease and a con woman. Honesty is the best policy. Don't waste guys' time if you aren't truly interested.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

Tenebrous said:


> Im not gonna lie, having been in a relationship quite similar to the ones calichick abides by,i enjoyed it a bit. but it wasnt overseas or online, it was rl. let it be known, i am a masochist though, heh. but ive a plethora of mental problems myself, not just SA, by any means, im talking mood and personality disorders.


Well I do too, that's what makes our relationships so so eccentric!



bwidger85 said:


> wrong. a lot of guys don't like waiting around and being pen pals


you'd be surprised. It can last months..



Atticus said:


> Seems you do this about once per year, huh?


A few times a year, and then I become jaded at this whole internet thing and take months off from going on sites like these.



stylicho said:


> Lol at everyone freaking out about what she's doing. There are people much more deceiving on these sites than she is.


Exactly.


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## Rest or Real? (Apr 1, 2011)

calichick said:


> Well I do too, that's what makes our relationships so so eccentric!


So, hey, let's do this :yes


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

stylicho said:


> Lol at everyone freaking out about what she's doing. There are people much more deceiving on these sites than she is. Things that cause much more than "feelings" getting hurt. And most of these people are men. They pretend they're women in an attempt to get something from the deceived. Or they are guys having fun at the desperate guy's expense. I mean if she were trying to get money from the lonely guys and then take off that would be totally different.


Yeah, there are a lot of people doing much more deceiving things on these sites.

A couple years ago, I was real bored and depressed (about not finding work and lack of friends) and I probably chatted (mostly short chats) with 100s of guys from a couple dating websites. Theoretically I was interested in going on dates but it would take a small miracle to get me motivated enough to leave the house. I did end up meeting 4 people. One outright admitted (on messenger after the date) to having a girlfriend and 2 **** buddies and to doing some sort of social experiment. Two more I actually really enjoyed but I think both had live-in girlfriends. Of those 2, one claimed he was living with his ex in a 1 bedroom and the other denied having a girlfriend but said that I couldn't go over to his place cause of his roommates. Yeah, right!! :sus


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## Steve123 (Sep 13, 2009)

VanDamMan said:


> Ladies, you wonder why guys appear bitter.....this one is at least being honest.


:yes


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

stylicho said:


> Lol at everyone freaking out about what she's doing. There are people much more deceiving on these sites than she is. Things that cause much more than "feelings" getting hurt. And most of these people are men. They pretend they're women in an attempt to get something from the deceived. Or they are guys having fun at the desperate guy's expense. I mean if she were trying to get money from the lonely guys and then take off that would be totally different.


Just because others do worse doesn't make her actions any less immature.


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## calichick (Jul 30, 2010)

komorikun said:


> Yeah, there are a lot of people doing much more deceiving things on these sites.
> 
> A couple years ago, I was real bored and depressed (about not finding work and lack of friends) and I probably chatted (mostly short chats) with 100s of guys from a couple dating websites. Theoretically I was interested in going on dates but it would take a small miracle to get me motivated enough to leave the house. I did end up meeting 4 people. One outright admitted (on messenger after the date) to having a girlfriend and 2 **** buddies and to doing some sort of social experiment. Two more I actually really enjoyed but I think both had live-in girlfriends. Of those 2, one claimed he was living with his ex in a 1 bedroom and the other denied having a girlfriend but said that I couldn't go over to his place cause of his roommates. Yeah, right!! :sus


That's why I don't trust *most* guys. They think with their sexuality first and their head second.



VanDamMan said:


> Ladies, you wonder why guys appear bitter.....this one is at least being honest.


I figure I don't have anything to lose by being honest here...all of us have our problems..


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

calichick said:


> I figure I don't have anything to lose by being honest here...all of us have our problems..


It not a pretty thing to read about, but I am glad you can be honest about it. Too often people can't admit to the selfish ugly sides of their human nature.


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## au Lait (Sep 8, 2010)

Oh great, and here come the "All women are secretly like this I knew it!!!!1111" replies. :roll

I think it's p obvious that this is a :troll thread by now.


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

****Thread Lock Warning****
Well, Millenniumman75 is laying the smack down on this.

Playing on people's vulnerabilities is taking advantage of people, period. You play with fire and you'll get burned someday.


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