# The Myth of Male Privilege: Woman spends months living as a man, prefers being female



## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

Vincent even dabbled in the art of picking up women and agreed to wear a hidden camera for "20/20" during her exploits.
She was quickly reminded that in this arena, it's women who have the power, she said.
"In fact, we sit there and we just with one word, 'no,' will crush someone," she said. "We don't have to do the part where you cross the room and you go up to a stranger that you've never met in the middle of a room full of people and say the first words. And those first words are so hard to say without sounding like a cheeseball or sounding like a jerk."
Vincent encountered some pretty cold shoulders in her attempts at the bar, but she did manage to go on about 30 dates with women as "Ned," mostly arranging them on the Internet.
Vincent said the dates were rarely fun and that the pressure of "Ned" having to prove himself was grueling. She was surprised that many women had no interest in a soft, vulnerable man.
"My prejudice was that the ideal man is a woman in a man's body. And I learned, no, that's really not. There are a lot of women out there who really want a manly man, and they want his stoicism," she said.
...

She continued her emotional descent, and a week later, checked in to a hospital with severe depression. Identity, she concluded, was not something to play around with.
"When you mess around with that, you really mess around with something that you need that helps you to function. And I found out that gender lives in your brain and is something much more than costume. And I really learned that the hard way," she said.
Vincent says she's healed now and glad to be rid of Ned. But her views about men have changed forever.
"Men are suffering. They have different problems than women have, but they don't have it better," she said. "They need our sympathy. They need our love, and maybe they need each other more than anything else. They need to be together."
Ironically, Vincent said, it took experiencing life as a man for her to appreciate being a woman. "I really like being a woman. ... I like it more now because I think it's more of a privilege."

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/Entertainment/story?id=1526982










More women are graduating college.

Young single women earn more than men.
http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html

Women get lower sentences for the same crime.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html

Women are far less likely to suffer violent assault or homicide.

The suicide rate for young men is *4 times* that of young women.

Women are far less likely to be homeless.

Women are never called on to go to war.

Women take 50% more sick leave than men.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/02/080204212846.htm

When working in the same job with the same experience, women earn the same as men.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2012/04/16/its-time-that-we-end-the-equal-pay-myth/

In general, women have higher rates of happiness.

Women have more social support and more close friends.
http://www.salon.com/2013/12/08/american_mens_hidden_crisis_they_need_more_friends/

And yes they have an easier time dating.

More on the myth of male privilege:


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

So you're comparing the dating scene to thousands of years of systemized sexism. Cool sturry brah.

Don't you ever get tired of posting these ridiculous threads?


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

This is only for certain women, not all.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> So you're comparing the dating scene to thousands of years of systemized sexism. Cool sturry brah.
> 
> Don't you ever get tired of posting these ridiculous threads?


More women are graduating college.

Young single women earn more than men.
http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html

Men get prison sentences that are 63% longer than women's for the same crime.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html

Women are far less likely to suffer violent assault or homicide.

The suicide rate for young men is *4 times* that of young women.

Women are far less likely to be homeless.

Women are never called on to go to war.

Women take 50% more sick leave than men.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/02/080204212846.htm

When working in the same job with the same experience, women earn the same as men.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2012/04/16/its-time-that-we-end-the-equal-pay-myth/

In general, women have higher rates of happiness.

Women have more social support and more close friends.
http://www.salon.com/2013/12/08/american_mens_hidden_crisis_they_need_more_friends/

And yes they have an easier time dating.


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## andy1984 (Aug 18, 2006)

^ he's not really talking about history, more about now i think.
(i meant ^^^ *diamondheart89)*


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

:spam


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

opcorn


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## meganmila (Jul 25, 2011)

komorikun said:


> :spam


Hahaha yes


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

arnie said:


> More women are graduating college.
> 
> Young single women earn more than men.
> http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html
> ...


Women still make less money than men overall and have less stable jobs.

Domestic violence against women is higher than against men.

Women are raped much more than men are.

Few women hold positions of leadership or power in government or businesses.

Women with children are discriminated against in the workplace while men aren't.

Women are much more likely to be living in poverty than men are.

Primary care for children, elderly, and the disabled usually falls on women.

So, we have established that each gender faces a variety of problems. Now what? Instead of recognizing that there are issues to be addressed on both sides you're going to find some other way of promoting your obsession with anti-feminism?

:roll


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## RelinquishedHell (Apr 10, 2012)

Interesting. 

The immediate hostile reaction from the women on here is pretty funny too.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> Women still make less money than men overall and have less stable jobs.
> 
> Domestic violence against women is higher than against men.
> 
> ...


When they work they same job, with the same experience they *earn the same* as men. 
http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2012/04/16/its-time-that-we-end-the-equal-pay-myth/

However, The point is women don't *have* to make as much as men. Many women *choose* to have children and rely on their husband's income. Other women *choose* to take more people friendly career instead of Business, Math or Science related fields. It's their privilege. Men don't have this choice. Women still expect their husband's to earn more than them.


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## Putin (May 21, 2013)

Women have really never been oppressed more than men, and especially not in the modern western world.

Also, as 'Girl Writes What' has pointed out, the fact that women are biologically the more valuable sex makes "male privilege" very unlikely. When I look at the 93% on the job male fatality rate, the constant underfunding of male healthcare issues, the consistent bias against men in family court, etc etc, I have to scratch my head and wonder which sex is really "privileged."


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> Domestic violence against women is higher than against men.
> 
> :roll


Only slightly. Men are the victims of 40% of severe domestic violence and that number is probably under-reported.

http://domesticviolencestatistics.org/men-the-overlooked-victims-of-domestic-violence/

Also, what matters is overall violence, not just domestic violence. Men are much more likely to suffer violence of any kind and much more likely to be murdered.


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## RelinquishedHell (Apr 10, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> Women still make less money than men overall and have less stable jobs.


All the women where I work make significantly more than the guys do and have better positions as well. My head of store manager is also female. This is a tool store btw.

Your "statistics" don't coincide with anything I've ever seen in real life. Like.. ever.


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## To22 (Apr 6, 2012)

Yeah, we have our own struggles. Men can be doing better by growing out of the stigmas of yesteryear. It also doesn't hurt for all genders to acknowledge the difficulty of other genders and keep it in mind when interacting with someone you care about.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

Isn't there some rule about 'who has it worse' threads? Perhaps a rule that's stickied right at the top of the forum.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

arnie said:


> The point is women don't *have* to make as much as men. When they work they same job, with the same experience they earn as much as men. However, many women choose to have children and rely on their husband's income. Other women choose to take more people friendly career instead of Business, Math or Science related fields. It's their privilege. Men don't have this choice. Women still expect their husband's to earn more than them.


You say *women* choose to have children as if the men in those relationships also don't make a conscious choice to have children with their wives. Yet the wife pays the price for that joint choice, while the man does not, as far as work is concerned. And no, not all women expect their husbands to earn more than them. In fact it's quite well known that many men do not want to be with women who out-qualify them.


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## kiirby (Oct 8, 2010)

Sigh. This is missing the point. It's like saying heterosexual privilege doesn't exist because openly gay sportsmen are statistically less likely to be injured whilst playing. That's a tedious example but the gist is that many of these discrepancies are a direct result of institutionalised sexism. For instance: women aren't called on to go to war because they are defined by their gender; as fragile caregivers. This is not a privilege, this is _condescending and discriminatory_ (the morality of war aside). Women can find casual sex partners more easily because they are sexually commodified.

Privilege as a social principle is not exclusive; there is female privilege too. Just as acknowledging white privilege doesn't mean that black people can't have an advantage in some areas too.

There are valid points to be made, and necessary discussions to be had; the high male suicide rate is an example. But it's so hard to take you seriously when you use this flimsy anecdotal evidence and irrelevant statistics to absolutely deny that men might have a direct advantage in many areas of life because of their gender alone, and that the proof you use to negate that is often taken from extreme examples of a concerted, but often clumsy societal effort to deinstitutionalise inherent discrimination, and that maybe, on the whole, that is a good thing.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

RelinquishedHell said:


> All the women where I work make significantly more than the guys do and have better positions as well. My head of store manager is also female. This is a tool store btw.
> 
> Your "statistics" don't coincide with anything I've ever seen in real life. Like.. ever.


That's the point of statistics, they represent averages and a big picture view of society, not your particular circumstances.


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

The Norah Vincent piece is interesting. I've been citing that in discussions for years. Few want to take the time to read.

Alot of women may find that career/material success isn't what they thought it was. Many guys find successful women intimidating and unattractive.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

kiirby said:


> Sigh. This is missing the point. It's like saying heterosexual privilege doesn't exist because openly gay sportsmen are statistically less likely to be injured whilst playing. That's a tedious example but the gist is that many of these discrepancies are a direct result of institutionalised sexism. For instance: women aren't called on to go to war because they are defined by their gender; as fragile caregivers. This is not a privilege, this is _condescending and discriminatory_ (the morality of war aside). Women can find casual sex partners more easily because they are sexually commodified.
> 
> Privilege as a social principle is not exclusive; there is female privilege too. Just as acknowledging white privilege doesn't mean that black people can't have an advantage in some areas too.
> 
> There are valid points to be made, and necessary discussions to be had; the high male suicide rate is an example. But it's so hard to take you seriously when you use this flimsy anecdotal evidence and irrelevant statistics to absolutely deny that men might have a direct advantage in many areas of life because of their gender alone, and that the proof you use to negate that is often taken from extreme examples of a concerted societal effort to deinstitutionalise inherent discrimination, and that maybe, on the whole, that is a good thing.


Exactly. Because bad thing A exists, it doesn't nullify the existence of bad thing B. Or eliminate the need for focus on eliminating bad thing B. Which is what threads like this are meant to suggest.


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## Putin (May 21, 2013)

VanDamMan said:


> Many guys find successful women intimidating and unattractive.


Actually, it's the opposite. Successful women find men less successful than herself to be unattractive and undesirable.

The fact that marriages where the woman has the higher income are 40% more likely to go through divorce can attest to that.


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## KelsKels (Oct 4, 2011)

I dont think men have it better than women.. but I dont think women have it better than men either. They both have their problems. Men generally have to take charge in dating relationships, and women generally have to look like a 10/10. Neither are easy if youre insecure/shy/whatever. Cant we just agree that everyone has problems? Different problems, but problems none the less.


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## meganmila (Jul 25, 2011)

KelsKels said:


> I dont think men have it better than women.. but I dont think women have it better than men either. They both have their problems. Men generally have to take charge in dating, and women generally have to look like a 10/10. Neither are easy if youre insecure/shy/whatever. Cant we just agree that everyone has problems? Different problems, but problems none the less.


Yeah, all of us have problems.


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## Persephone The Dread (Aug 28, 2010)

Didn't someone post that first video in a thread before? And the last two videos several thousand times? I think various people might have.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

RelinquishedHell said:


> Interesting.
> 
> The immediate hostile reaction from the women on here is pretty funny too.


Actually my hostile reaction isn't to the subject matter of inequality in the courts for men, but to the barrage of incessant threads meant to somehow destroy the credibility of a phenomenon well established, documented, and researched in our society (sexism against women) by using cherry-picked data and huge generalizations. Mostly just because a bunch of posters on here dislike women for one reason or another and are convinced that all women ever are somehow evil creatures who just want to take their moneys and send them to jail with a fake accusation or rape. Or something.

If you want to make a post about inequalities men face, do it without disparaging women. Or somehow alluding to the idea that women are oppressing you when that is clearly not the case. Make an argument against the system of inequality rather than trying to justify that somehow women don't face any problems in society.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> If you want to make a post about inequalities men face, do it without disparaging women. Or somehow alluding to the idea that women are oppressing you when that is clearly not the case. Make an argument against the system of inequality rather than trying to justify that somehow women don't face any problems in society.


I never disparaged woman. I disparaged the societal system. Stop lumping me in with all the other men on this site you hate so much. All I did was present statistics showing the inequality between Men and Women.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Persephone The Dread said:


> Didn't someone post that first video in a thread before? And the last two videos several thousand times? I think various people might have.


The hive mind.


__
https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1oljvp


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

Putin said:


> Women have really never been oppressed more than men, and especially not in the modern western world.
> 
> Also, as 'Girl Writes What' has pointed out, the fact that women are biologically the more valuable sex makes "male privilege" very unlikely. When I look at the 93% on the job male fatality rate, the constant underfunding of male healthcare issues, the consistent bias against men in family court, etc etc, I have to scratch my head and wonder which sex is really "privileged."


Um, what?

I generally find what you post mind boggling, but this one is a winner. Can you please elaborate?


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

arnie said:


> I never disparaged woman. I disparaged the societal system. Stop lumping me in with all the other men on this site you hate so much. All I did was present statistics showing the inequality between Men and Women.


Oh please. The majority of your post is aimed at proving how women really have it much easier than men, who have the REAL problems. I'd rather not get into semantics, that's rather a waste of time. Looking at your post history of anti-feminism, accusing people of being feminists, and manhaters, I think we both know what the real intention here is. :blank

Also I don't hate anyone on this site. I post about topics and aim my disagreement or dislike towards opinions rather than at people. Which is why I can talk politely to you in other threads where you aren't being completely unreasonable.


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## meganmila (Jul 25, 2011)

diamondheart89 said:


> Oh please. The majority of your post is aimed at proving how women really have it much easier than men, who have the REAL problems. I'd rather not get into semantics, that's rather a waste of time. Looking at your post history of anti-feminism, accusing people of being feminists, and manhaters, I think we both know what the real intention here is. :blank
> 
> Also I don't hate anyone on this site. I post about topics and aim my disagreement or dislike towards opinions rather than at people. Which is why I can talk politely to you in other threads where you aren't being completely unreasonable.


this.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> Actually my hostile reaction isn't to the subject matter of inequality in the courts for men, but to the barrage of incessant threads meant to somehow destroy the credibility of a phenomenon well established, documented, and researched in our society (sexism against women) by using* cherry-picked data* and huge generalizations.


Cherry picking data? I choose only the most import measures like overall hapiness, sucide rates, violent crime rates and homelessness.

What's cherry picking is when the feminists get upset about the top 1% of 1% of women that can't get executive top level jobs, while ignoring the millions of men that are homeless, in prison or suffering from violent crime.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

arnie said:


> Cherry picking data? I choose only the most import measures like overall hapiness, sucide rates, violent crime rates and homelessness.
> 
> What's cherry picking is when the feminists get upset about the top 1% of 1% of women that can't get executive top level jobs, while ignoring the millions of men that are homeless, in prison or suffering from violent crime.


Cherry-picking = Purposely leaving out data that doesn't support your bias. For example: men do die due to violent crimes a lot more than women do, but they usually die due to violence other men commit. Men are much more likely to commit violent crime. Does that signal a systematic inequality due to sexism?

Systematic inequality is something that happens due to lack of resources or education or power that is due to a system preventing you from having any of the above. What in the system is causing men to not have access to resources or education or power so that they have to resort to violence?


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

> suffering from violent crime.


You have to commit a crime to go to prison.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

DeeperUnderstanding said:


> You have to commit a crime to go to prison.


Yes, but if you're a man, then your sentence will be 63% higher.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

If you're going to pretend the legal system is biased in favor of women, better click the link in my signature.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

Gwynevere said:


> If you're going to pretend the legal system is biased in favor of women, better click the link in my signature.


If you want to talk about custody rights, why not mention all of the times when women have lied about being on birth control, poked holes in a condom or literally stolen sperm from a sperm bank to get pregnant and are then awarded child support?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/02/layne-hardin-sperm-toby-devall_n_2796503.html


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

arnie said:


> If you want to talk about custody rights, why not mention all of the times when women have lied about being on birth control, poked holes in a condom or literally stolen sperm from a sperm bank to get pregnant and are then awarded child support?
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/02/layne-hardin-sperm-toby-devall_n_2796503.html


Why would I mention that? It has no relevance to the topic.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

Gwynevere said:


> Why would I mention that? It has no relevance to the topic.


Because when it comes to issues of paternity, what I posted is *far far more common*.


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

What is it with all these gender war people? Jesus, get a life already. It's Christmas.


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## nothing else (Oct 27, 2013)

I'm glad I just don't get pregnant.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

arnie said:


> Because when it comes to issues of paternity, what I posted is *far far more common*.


Well that's false, but more importantly, how does it relate to privilege?


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

nothing else said:


> I'm glad I just don't get pregnant.


Did you hear about the girl who got a sex change operation, and then got pregnant as a man? That kind of freaked me out.


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## Droidsteel (Mar 22, 2012)

Can't we all just agree that things suck whatever gender you are and just move the **** on?


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

Droidsteel said:


> Can't we all just agree that things suck whatever gender you are and just move the **** on?


Men suck.
Women suck.

Dogs and cats rule.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

DeeperUnderstanding said:


> Men suck.
> Women suck.
> 
> Dogs and cats rule.


Cats suck.


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## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

Gwynevere said:


> Well that's false, but more importantly, how does it relate to privilege?


It doesn't. He just want to whine about women, as usual. I don't think he understands what it actually means.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

probably offline said:


> It doesn't. He just want to whine about women, as usual. I don't think he understands what it actually means.












I never said women are doing anything wrong and I'm not here to attack anyone. I'm just making a point that life is easier when society gives you more privileges. Men are constantly being bashed by feminists for being "privileged" when it's just not true anymore.


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