# OMG asked out a barmaid



## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Hmm

Well I FEEL like this is a triumph, or at least a triumphette ... as a behavioural experiment I asked a barmaid who I had a HUGE crush on out for a coffee! Hehe I was pretty drunk, but its the outcome that was important - she just said "oh no sorry I have a boyfriend". No huge disaster, no fight breaking out, no smashing glass, no ejection from the pub, no group humiliation (all my negative predictions) - just a polite 'no' 

I feel a bit silly because when she said that, I was suddenly so surprised I'd done it that I said, out loud "oh hey that was pretty brave of me" and she said "yes it was!". Feel a bit embarrassed at that but I suppose its not really a huge thing. She was nice about it! 

Even drunk it was hard to make myself do it. Hehehe oh wow :banana :yay

For the next experiment I need to go back there and test my predictions that something bad will happen if I return.

Ross


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## IllusionOfHappiness (Sep 6, 2007)

Good job


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## FairleighCalm (May 20, 2007)

Well now, you can make it a tradition!


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Yes a bit like Christmas - once a year 

Now I have done it once, and I wasnt physically assaulted, I feel less scared to do it again  This could be the beginning of something quite good! Like um, a date .. yeh!

Ross


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

Wow, that's awesome, Ross! She didn't even vomit on you once! :lol


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## CoconutHolder (Oct 13, 2007)

Keep up the good work!

You'll get a good catch soon. I can just feel it. :yes 

You get dancing bananas for that, even if you were a drunky drunk when you did it.

:banana :banana :banana :banana :banana


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## demian1 (Dec 11, 2006)

Hey Ross, good job. You've now made me more eager to talk to the starbucks barista I've had a huge crush on. Maybe when I'm buzzing from all that coffee, I can make my move!


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

ardrum said:


> Wow, that's awesome, Ross! She didn't even vomit on you once! :lol


Yeh I actually had a paranoid sense that could happen - like THIS: 



 _Warning - some will find this award winning show offensive. Dont click it if you're easily offended or hate watching comedy vomiting - its actually laughing AT bigoted people, but some might think its telling you to BE bigoted. You have been warned._

Coco - drunky drunk? Hey come on, some people get xanax to do these things ... I have to work with what I've got  :lol The next time I will only have 12 pints :kiss

Demian - I dunno if a latte has the same anxiolytic effects as Gin and Tonic, but fingers crossed! For me this was really overcoming my silly preconceptions, but if she'd said 'ok' then that would have been a cool bonus 

Illusion - thank you :hug

Rossie


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## CoconutHolder (Oct 13, 2007)

Ross, I was just teasing with the "drunky drunk" comment. :hug Nothing wrong with a few to loosin up.

Just wanted to make sure you didn't think I was making fun of you or being nasty or anything.


Nothin but love for ya. :hug


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

I know  I didnt think you were either! I only hope I didnt slur or dribble :afr


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

Barmaids probably get asked out a ton too, don't they? In any case, it's probably especially intimidating if you additionally had a huge crush on her. 

It sounds like she didn't even accuse you of being "creepy" or insult you too (in addition to the lack of projectile vomiting on your face). Why do I have such wild assumptions about how women will likely react to being asked out?? :lol


Here's how I feel it would go if I did such a thing...

Me: Hey, would you like to get some coffee sometime?
Her: Uhhh, no! Ugh! Did you just ask me out?? (laughing to reduce sensations of shock and disgust)
Me: Uhh, well, no. I mean, I was just asking. It's not a big deal.
Her: You're so creepy! Why would you ask me out?? That is so creepy!!
Me: Why? What's SO creepy? It was just a question! You're not interested, then fine. I won't bother you any longer so chill out.
Her: You're disgusting.
Me: Bye. Have a good day.
Her: (throws up on floor)


(OK, aside from the physical vomiting, that's how I expect 90%+ of women to react to such a casual question.)


So Ross, prepared to do the exercise of asking 100 women out in a park yet?


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

"WOOOAAAAAGGGGGHHHHH ... I especially liked the solo during 'silent night' "

Hyper - lol!!

Yeah it wouldnt really have been a good test if I wasnt actually attracted - but I thought that thing about them getting asked out a lot - she was a good model for a 'calm and rational' response! Now if I get a future vomit / attack I can go "oh hey that was oddly irrational" and my proof would be that some women react rationally that doesnt hurt me or ruin a good shirt 

Albert Ellis was insane by the way. INSAAAAANE.


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

I would be happy so long as I wasn't insulted or accused of being x, y, or z. Your result sounds pleasant. :lol


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

And anyway she might have stolen some of my cinnamon and apple muffin. Maybe I escaped a fate worse than muffin loss


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

So when's your next challenge?


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Slave driver!! :whip (dontcha love how his little mouth opens on the 'whipcrack' ? Awww)

I dunno. I guess it will have to be more sober, I wrote up that experiment about 4 days ago not quite knowing how or when it would happen, I just saw the opportunity to carry it out! Ehmm I think I will practice more on the 'light friendly chatting' front before I try that sober. The little 'success' will hopefully add to it, cos now I can say "oh hey disasters dont always happen, and if they do it might be due to their thinking and not me being repulsive".

I will write up a plan for an experiment today! :yay

Ross


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

Well, you know what that means :roll....


:boogie :boogie :boogie


GOTCHA! :haha


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

This is a conversatrion I just had with myself in the shower, shortly before I am going out for a coffee:

**noticed I kept feeling embarrassed when i thought about the incident and felt I had to _make some noise or sing to cover my own feeling of silliness _(yeah, like wtf???)**

A: Why are you embarassed?
B: Because you asked out a girl who doesnt like you.
A: So? Why is that embarrassing?
B: Because you are repulsive - its obvious no girl is really going to want you, so why put yourself through this pain? Why dont you accept you will never have a girlfriend again?
A: Because I had GF's in the past and I enjoyed it, and so I cant be totally repulsive
B: Well maybe not back then, but now you have extra pounds round your middle, and you have lost any charm you ever had. Face it, its over.
A: Wow is that ever a bunch of cr*p .. theres all or nothing thinking, overgeneralisation and magnifying of your faults and minimising your good points.
B: Whatever. Its Aberdeen and you're english. Face it the locals hate the english - give up.
A: Well actually, not all the locals are Aberdonian, and anyway you are totally overgeneralising. You have aberdonian friends and many locals have been friendly to you when you have been friendly to them. OK not all, and that group of girls you spoke to were actually quite young - they acted in that 'irrational' way that you were talking about before. Remember how you have acted like an azz in the past when you were young? They are not the whole population.

B: But why risk it? Youre just gonna go through pain.
A: I may well have less than perfect responses, yes. But does 'less than perfect' equal FAILURE? Is it either "I am a stud" OR "I am a repulsive leper" ?
B: Er ok maybe that is a bit extreme. I suppose if you have never really learned how to be comfortable then it will take some practice. You cant make an omelette without breaking some eggs.
A: Yeah! Thats more like it! And if I do genuine things that cause me to be rejected, then I can learn in EXACTLY THE SAME WAY as I have learned about normal relationships. I know my pitfalls and I am working to overcome them. As long as I use the form, and state exactly what I think will go wrong, then I will have something to compare against instead of a bunch of random ideas on perfection and utter failure, which to be honest is just silly. Ive seen I dont get beaten up or attacked, so really its only a slight dent to the pride! And after a while I will see that its not so bad and can sometimes be funny  I AM HUMAN AND SO I *SHOULD* AND *MUST *MAKE MISTAKES. _I CANNOT GROW WITHOUT MAKING MISTAKES._ I AM WORTHY BECAUSE I LIVE AND BREATHE - I CAN TRY TO IMPROVE MYSELF BUT MY SUCCESS OR FAILURE IN DOING SO CANNOT CHANGE MY 'WORTH' BY ONE LITTLE BIT  I got 'blown out' by that barmaid, and I survived! That shows I am strong and that the world is not as cruel as I thought. I can survive!

Showers. Useful.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

millenniumman75 said:


> Well, you know what that means :roll....
> 
> :boogie :boogie :boogie
> 
> GOTCHA! :haha


THREE BOOGIES!!!! YEAH!!! :banana


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

The trademark three boogies. You know you've done something right when you see that!

I like these inner dialogues. I should do them more often. I think I'm making women out to be vicious monsters, and I'm almost laughing when I try to play the role of what they are thinking of me.


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

I was reading some of those interactions - ARDrum, I just can't imagine a lady vomiting when you say "Bye, have a nice day" :con.

YeahYeahYeah - Who's A and who's B? :stu :lol


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

A is healthy Ross and B is unhealthy Ross! I could go into a deep psychological discourse of who those voices represent but I am enjpying brevity for a time


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> Yeh I actually had a paranoid sense that could happen - like THIS:


:lol !

I just saw that. That's pretty much what I'd expect to happen if I tried what you did! :lol


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## korendir (Jul 6, 2007)

Things to remember when a girl says no to being "asked out" 

1. she's on her period
2. Her boyfriend is an abusive jerk and she'll end up being a fish wife
3. She's got syphilis and likes you too much to spread it around
4. She said no because she thinks your way too pretty and smart and your out of her league
5. Your body language said "i'm scared", you leaned in when you shouldn't have
6. You should have asked for her email/number first because that's alot easier for her than a date
7. You were pinning all your hopes on her when you should have been thinking "o.k who's next" (this doesn't make you a jerk!)
8. She had 25 stupid drunk ars*holes try to win her approval by giving up their balls before you got there and saying "I have a boyfriend" was just easier.
9. You took "I have a boyfriend" as no - If a woman isn't married she's still looking and all you did was ask her out for coffee, not whip it out and say "whattya think of this"
10. As a barmaid she has a pretty tough persona and you took it personally when it shouldn't even have fazed you.
11. You were thinking about some trick or technique when it was about your insecurity and the stuff on the inside.
12. You should have said "bring me some grapes and suck my toes"
13. you should have asked for her phone not her phone number(think about it)
14. you were just admiring the ficus in the corner and she's scared you might have a scythe at home.
15. You say hi while waving your wallet at her and grinning.
16. you cared what she thought of you - why?, she doesn't know you, if she did she'd have dumped her boyfriend and gone with you.
17. Your respect MUST BE EARNED
18. She wants a man "Who knows what he wants" not a man who wants to buy her a little purse for his balls.
19. that pub/club is YOUR house why would you be scared to go back home?


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## daaaaave (Jan 1, 2007)

Wow that is amazing...I honestly could never go back there again but you are the CBT man so I trust you will be able to do that. Did you talk to her leading up to it or just ask her out? Does she know you from before?


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## korendir (Jul 6, 2007)

I feel i should say congrats too Yeah_yeah_yeah my previous post stands but I don't want to sound like an ars(*hole or take away from your success - I'm workin on my self-confidence too and I'm starting to feel what its like to be myself around other people and its such a fkin great feeling!!!...WELL DONE!. The funny thing is I can imagine sometime in my near future when I'll look back and laugh. SA is something we feel, not something we are.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

So, went back to the bar again tonight, was sober all the way through as have stopped drinking  I went to the bar and she served me. I said "Its ok, I am on lemonades tonight so you are safe" and she laughed 

I like to think she gave me a couple of nice smiles later and she knew my drink whenever I went up, so its clear she doesnt hate me or anything, so in my view this is a success, the aim being to see that disasters do not happen if I ask someone out.

Been feeling a little 'off' lately as its emerging more and more that I have been suffering from a personality disorder for most of my life which makes me feel angry at the therapists I've had, but now it seems things are finally changing in all areas of my life. Tonight I felt a bit washed out because I have been working SO HARD on overcoming my impulsivity and self-discipline problems (its basically an all-day job, everyday) and so wasnt very sparkly, but my friends are cool so they didnt get funny with me. I have come home early to get sleep.

I also noticed that a lot of girls seem to look at me, and one even approached me too - but my mood was way off tonight. I was practicing the emotional self-discipline part tonight - which is overcoming my tendency to not think before I speak and to become emotionally wobbly. Its kind of hard to learn new ways of behaving on the fly so I was just a bit quiet tonight. I dont feel too bad about it though - its more like I am getting in touch with who I really am and he is fighting to get out.

Tired but happy

Ross


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

Interesting :con


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

You're a soldier.


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## CoconutHolder (Oct 13, 2007)

:squeeze


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Hee  Thanks guys!


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## GreyFox08 (Dec 22, 2007)

:banana Great job! Sounds like you are making awesome progress. You deserve it  I'm feeling a little more positive about talking to others, especially girls, now that I've read what you've done. Keep it up.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

I got a banana!  Hi grey! BTW I got your PM, will sit down soon and write a reply - am flying around all over the place at the moment  

boogie back atcha! :boogie


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

millenniumman75 said:


> Interesting :con


Anything I can elaborate on? 

Ross


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## Veggie1 (Jan 12, 2006)

Congratulations! :yay


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## korendir (Jul 6, 2007)

> its more like I am getting in touch with who I really am and he is fighting to get out.


That's pretty much how I feel although there are times when Somehow I seem to "forget" to be anxious and suddenly I'm myself and then I catch myself and its like "hey wtf". Then other times when I can't seem to shake it. I look at this like a pendulum thats slowly returning to center - it'll take more desensitization but I'm getting to the point where I'll be taking more "leaps of faith" and leaving the SA behind for good. The great thing about it is that your trying stuff most "ordinary" guys wouldn't so Keep it up!!


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## cicada (Aug 25, 2005)

yeah_yeah_yeah,

Congratulations for having the guts to ask the barmaid to coffee. It was great to see how you handled the situation when she rejected your offer. I really liked how you let us in on your negative self-talk and your rational responses. I always feel so hopeful after reading your posts. Thanks for the inspiration.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Hey thanks Cicada! Really glad it helps SOMEONE to see the worrying internals of my twisted mind! :lol

I should add an after chapter to this. I went out on Saturday and was feeling very relaxed. I've had some more breakthroughs in the schema arena and how it affects my view of the world and me. We went to a club and I was just chatting to people without much of a care - I wasnt bothered if people reacted badly. I was smiling the whole time cos I liked being there and I noticed I got lots of smiles back.

Long story short - I met a girl there and we chatted so easily, and ended up having a kiss!  First one in rather some years :afr She came back to my flat, and we just chatted mainly - anything else didnt seem right. I may well see her again next week sometime. 

In addition I felt super relaxed round some friends I had felt inferior to. I have suddenly begun seeing the world in an absolute polar opposite way to what I did before and suddenly no one represents much of a threat anymore. Its great!

Whee banana whee banana

Ross


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

Jimminy crickets! Lookachu!


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Hee yeah look up "social ranking" vs "affiliative" models of attachment theory. Quite mindblowing in its implications for the DEEPLY buried effects that trauma has on the way we see the world around us.


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

You must have an obscure source there, Ross. I'm not finding anything.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Oh okies. Its from a book! Add 'compassion' to the search, and "paul gilbert"


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Im just gonna plonk this in this thread rather than get all up on my big ol self and create a new one.

Small 'not being afraid of women' advance today - in bookstore, very attractive blonde girl. Decided it would be awesome to ask her about her cookery skills as I am a total food incompetent and didnt know what book to buy. She claimed to know nothing about cooking or cookery books to which I decided to reveal the time when I gave 5 friends terrible gas for a whole day when I tried to cook for them. She did laugh and then directed me to the 'beginners' section on a nearby wall. Aussie. Cute. 

But hey - random conversation starting and no screaming, crying, vomiting, stabbing or use of non lethal weapons.

Whee :banana


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## FairleighCalm (May 20, 2007)

Way to go Ross!


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

Awesome! I love conversations that don't end with me bleeding!! :clap


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## Debi (Dec 2, 2007)

:nw Wow, amazing stories, it sounds like you're doing really well! :banana


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Aww thank you Debi! Next time I;m getting a recipe out of her (whoever it may be next time). Mmmm COOKIES.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Oh oh oh and today I went in Starbucks and had a short moment of actually feeling charismatic. All the baristas were talking to me, and for a sec I realised "hey, everyone is talking to ME, and I dont feel anxious" and it was fun. Then a bunch of schoolgirls (who I'd spoken to last week after I thought someone had left some abandoned luggage there) started saying hi and smiling at me. They all filed out and said "byee" and I felt like their music teacher or something. Bit questionable I know but it was just a little hint to say "hey Rossie - you're an OK guy - see? Young girls arent terrified of you on sight"

For a little moment I felt like I was in 'Hard days night'' by the Beatles.

Hee

Ross


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> Oh oh oh and today I went in Starbucks and had a short moment of actually feeling charismatic. All the baristas were talking to me, and for a sec I realised "hey, everyone is talking to ME, and I dont feel anxious" and it was fun. Then a bunch of schoolgirls (who I'd spoken to last week after I thought someone had left some abandoned luggage there) started saying hi and smiling at me. They all filed out and said "byee" and I felt like their music teacher or something. Bit questionable I know but it was just a little hint to say "hey Rossie - you're an OK guy - see? Young girls arent terrified of you on sight"
> 
> For a little moment I felt like I was in 'Hard days night'' by the Beatles.
> 
> ...


Haha, awesomnationistic!!!


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

And the thing is, its not like it needed any social skills training, or techniques, or 'charisma generating routines'. Its just simply becoming comfortable with myself and letting whatever is inside come up, no matter what happens. Truly, anything goes as long as you are respectful and upbeat and just give yourself time to think.

Oh I thoight of something for you Ardie. Last couple of weeks I have been trying to cut out 'addictions' - you know, like choccy, SAS (whoops) and so on. I am keeping a chart of the days I have either given in or resisted. 

Well, I also chucked 'Approval Addiction' in there. I have to actually force myself NOT to seek approval or try too hard. Its hard at first and there are those "must speak" type moments, but then I got used to there being silence when I got served or whatever. Oddly, after a while, natural things started to pop up into my mind to say.

Seriously, just overcome the URGE to say things, and in its place, things to say arise!

Try the anti-addiction method and see what happens to your confidence 

And remember where ya heard it first ... :lol


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

I need to get into social situations a bit more to do this. Now that my friend moved, my "getting out there" has plummeted. I'd say about 75%+ of the interaction with people I have involves the transfer of money. The rest might be casual greetings at work or something. Yeesh.

It seems like most places aren't too conducive to talking. Therapy seems to be the best place, but that's it's own sort of animal.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Pretty much all of these situations are money transfer ones. Just see how people react to an open disposition. I have chatted to the starbucks guys so much that they all know me now, so when I go in there I end up feeling happy because they are all fun. Its taken time to build that up, gradually chatting to each one individually. They are all cool people and have interesting stories to tell. Once I get that little buzz going then things feel better, and I can chat to other folks more easily. It just flows.

Try the approval addiction avoidance. Actually AIM to not be fun, not try to talk to people. AIM for mostly silence in an open way i.e not grumpy. Try it, damn you!!


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## Debi (Dec 2, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> Try the approval addiction avoidance. Actually AIM to not be fun, not try to talk to people. AIM for mostly silence in an open way i.e not grumpy. Try it, damn you!!


Whoa... sounds like it's working, but I can't ever imagine myself trying *not* to talk... seems counter-intuitive! Perhaps this isn't what you mean, but if there's a person there and I can actually think of something to say to them, it's like some kind of miracle, there's no way I'm about to waste that opportunity by stopping myself saying it!

Perhaps it's about learning how to give off a cool and mysterioius air by not talking, rather than simply looking unfriendly and boring (which I'm pretty sure is how I appear) so that people actually want to approach you and talk to you...


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> Try the approval addiction avoidance. Actually AIM to not be fun, not try to talk to people. AIM for mostly silence in an open way i.e not grumpy. Try it, damn you!!


:lol

Hmm...I think that will be remarkably easy actually. That doesn't sound too different than what I do now. I think it would be really awkward to try to talk all the time or fill the air with words to entertain/please others.

I don't think I do that. :stu


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Im talking more about where the focus is - putting it in a different place makes me feel more relaxed. Really, its a simpler way of doing attentioal training - but this time it makes you put the pressure on them - instead of wishing you had something wonderful to say, you wait for them to. Just a little difference, and maybe that expectation somehow carries over. Just try changing the focus is all.

Its the old surrender / avoisance / overcompensate thing again. I am a compensator - but the same fear is at the root - the fear of disapproval. Instead of fearing it, I am doing something else - just waiting to see what the world throws up.

Ah well, perhaps it only makes sense to me.


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## U.P.Kev (Apr 6, 2008)

Congratulations, it sounds like you are doing really well!!!


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

I think the disapproval comes into play with me more often in subjugating social interactions. My fear of disapproval doesn't really carry over nearly as much in a lot of other settings. I think it's kind of context-specific.

I still laugh about the interaction I had with the lady who held my food like a baby and said it was her baby. :lol That took me by a surprise a bit, and I like bizarre interactions. Good times.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

I see what you mean. I remember using this technique at work with my boss in a similar way, and got the same relaxed, controlled feeling then. Really, try using it whenever the approval / disapproval thing comes up. I was amazed at how my FEELING of what I should be doing did not mesh with what is actually acceptable. Its just that the feeling is VERY VERY strong. So it takes balls to face it down - but then you see, there was nothing to fear once you've done it.

Pure behavioural I know, but thats what Im keen on right now. The cognitive stuff is pretty weak *on its own*.


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

Church.

(I learned that one from Urban Dictionary.)


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

You want to go try this at a strip club?


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## CoconutHolder (Oct 13, 2007)

LMAO


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> You want to go try this at a strip club?


I'll reply via emoticons.

ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke ops uke


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

um

thats not what i meant

'Church', under the urban dictionary, also means "strip club or ti**y bar'. You started it


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

I think that's like as an excuse to give around females who might disapprove.

"I uh..wondered if..uh, you wanted to go to 'church' this weekend, bro."
"Uhh, 'church.' Sure, why not. I'll, uhhh, give it a try."
"I'll see you at 11, Saturday night. Uhhh, they are open a lot."
(Suspicious males of fe watch them talk.)

I was using it in the agreement sense though.


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