# nice guys.... jerks



## workman (Mar 5, 2004)

Nice Guy: Wishes girls would ask him out. Will not confront. Extremely sensitive, extremely emotional, easily infatuated. Wants to marry the girl after the first date. This leads to a lot of "what if's" and rejection by scaring the girl away

Bitter Guy: Realization of the nice guys finish last, wants to change. Still considers themselves nice guys, but have lost many of the good qualities of a nice guy because of the "what if's" and rejection.

Decent Guy: Still not able to utilize himself fully, still unable to fully propel his personality. Yet, he is now able to control his feelings. He stops getting easily infatuated, he stops being over emotional. 

Neat Guy: He has become comfortable with women, with even approaching women some of the time. Yet, still, he doesn't have that charm, that knack. If he keeps trying (i.e. getting rejected) he will eventually become...

Good Guy: This is what the girls are looking for. Good guys charm naturally; it requires no effort.

--Unfortunately, many former nice-guys don't get past their insecurity. They realize the methods but not the inner core. They begin to swing to the opposite extreme...--

Jerk: Cares about only one thing... His charm has deteriorated due to him taking things for granted (his looks, his confidence, all pulling in chicks).

The Player: Everything revolves around sex. The Player will do everything possible to obtain it short of force, from mind games, to hypnosis, all his intellect goes into the task of getting girls. You might ask, "What is wrong with this?" All their time and energy could have gone into their talents and skills so that they could fulfill their potential in life. The player must have many women because he is afraid he cannot be loved by one.
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I got this from one of those seduce women websites, but I do think it has some points.
One is that it shows the difference between "nice guys" and "good guys" and why nice guys don't get women. It also shows that going from "nice guy" to "jerk" isn't the way about getting women.

Nice guys need to stop putting women on a pedestal, work on themselves(physical, emotional, work/hobbies, being happy), they need to go out and learn to talk and be around women(this means that you will be rejected, but that gives experience which is a positive), and eventually they will be comfortable around women, have charm, and skills that will allow them to find the right girl for them.
They don't need to start treating women like crap, playing games with them, ect...

Guys: does this clear up the nice guy/jerk thing? Does it make sense?
Gals: does this sound about right on the nice guy/jerk thing or is it way off?

Any thoughts, opinions, disagreements?


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## silentbutdeadly (May 28, 2005)

i used to be a nice guy but i think im a bitter guy now.


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## schooley (Mar 25, 2005)

silentbutdeadly said:


> i used to be a nice guy but i think im a bitter guy now.


Me too.

I agree with that model. It makes sense from what I've read.


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

I see myself as the bitter guy.

Other guys see me as a good guy, threatening to them in terms of relating to their women - I'm sick of that one!


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## nakedshrew (Dec 5, 2004)

I was the nice guy for a long time but now I'm well and truely bitter :|


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## Futures (Aug 27, 2005)

I think i hover back and forth between bitter and decent.


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## Argo (May 1, 2005)

Decent Guy, I'd guess.


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## countrybumpkin (Dec 31, 2004)

I think I am nice guy and neat guy rolled into one. When I think that I don't have a chance with a woman (which I usually automatically assume is the case with all women , just by reflex), I am past feeling all wistful with them , and women usually tell me that I'm charming ,funny , cute, all that good stuff and ask why don't I have someone. But then nice guy rears his ugly head again when things start to develop with anyone , and I swing back to my old familiar ways , which usually spells my doom before too long. So where do I go from here? When I have anything that lasts any length of time (even a month or so) , I usually feel totally defeated when it ends and don't try again for a really long time (years). So anything that I may have learned from it is usually gone when I do have anything with anyone again , which kind of takes away the notion of me becoming good guy doesn't it ?


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## popeet (Dec 8, 2005)

i'm at times a bitter guy and at times a neat guy. i'm not a guy, but i can relate. i approach people. as a woman doing this to men, this has a different effect. it works at first, then men get confused later. they don't know what hit them, usually. i don't know why i do it. but yes, experience, getting rejected, developing a thick skin, it's all good in the long run imo. i've been pursuing who i wanted for fifteen years. can't say i envy men or that i like it much. but i almost always want someone who'd never guess i'd be interested in them.

i've seen these pop psychology categories and i agree categories are .... not useless, but .... not really useful either.. however, it make it easier to set parameters on an idea, i think.

<i've edited inappropriate things out of this post many times by now>


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## Zephyr (Nov 8, 2003)

Man, categories are so useless to describe me. I'm the exception to every rule. I'm all of those and none of those at once.


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## AliBaba (Nov 16, 2005)

Zephyr said:


> Man, categories are so useless to describe me. I'm the exception to every rule. I'm all of those and none of those at once.


That would be category #8: The Insane Guy 

j/k Zephyr. Or am I  I'm seriously considering pulling a "George Costanza" the next time I find a woman I'm interested in. I will do the exact opposite of my natural instincts. For if my instincts have led me to my current state...then the exact opposite would have to be the correct choice 

Matt


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## roya (Nov 12, 2005)

I'm slowly turning from the nice pathetic guy into the bitter type.


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## jtb3485 (Nov 9, 2003)

I'm bitter :cry


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## RX2000 (Jan 25, 2004)

Where's the "in-a-relationship guy" or "married guy?"

Before I met my fiancee I was probably a nice guy. But now I'm one of the 2 guys I mentioned. :lol


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## AliBaba (Nov 16, 2005)

Becky said:


> AliBaba said:
> 
> 
> > Zephyr said:
> ...


Oh I'm sure you would. Just keep your comments to yourself girly.


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## pixiedust (Aug 11, 2005)

How about "Narcissist" guy? He's a very special breed and I didn't see him on the list.


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## AliBaba (Nov 16, 2005)

pixiedust said:


> How about "Narcissist" guy? He's a very special breed and I didn't see him on the list.


Narcissists (nice word by the way) and other special breeds such as the psychopath would fall under that "Insane Guy" category I was discussing.

Matt


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## pixiedust (Aug 11, 2005)

I don't think Narcissists are insane. If I had to stuff them into a category it would be the jerk category, the difference is they don't realize how they behave.


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## Lonelyguy (Nov 8, 2003)

I'm probably a blend of the first three. I can be overly sensitive and emotional at times, but I won't allow myself to develop infatuations because I've turned slightly bitter from being rejected for most of my life.


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## silentbutdeadly (May 28, 2005)

AliBaba said:


> Zephyr said:
> 
> 
> > Man, categories are so useless to describe me. I'm the exception to every rule. I'm all of those and none of those at once.
> ...


 :lol


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## Longie (Jul 14, 2004)

Heh.. this sounds quite familiar. I started off at Nice Guy, was Bitter Guy for a long time.. so now I guess I'm Decent Guy.. maybe.


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## OnyxHeart (Jun 13, 2005)

Let's not forget Alpha/Beta male *s*


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## Mike^D (Feb 26, 2004)

I'm just getting out of the bitter catagory and heading towards "neat guy" and I aint stopping till I get to "totally awesome guy."

Actually I find myself in different catagories depending on who I'm around. Some people I'm more comfortable with than others.



crowe9999 said:


> Let's not forget Alpha/Beta male *s*


Already forgotten. :b


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## OnyxHeart (Jun 13, 2005)

Mike^D said:


> crowe9999 said:
> 
> 
> > Let's not forget Alpha/Beta male *s*
> ...


LOL


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## Mr_Twig (Apr 10, 2006)

Going Bitter all the way-one day at a time. Actually, I'm Decent Guy 90% of the time, but without the unrealized potential. Decent is about the best I could hope for.


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## Lyric Suite (Mar 16, 2006)

This progression might work for normal people, but for us SA guys there can be no development. 

Being a 'good guy' implies 100% confidence, and i know i'm not getting there. 

I'm kinda proud of being able to jump from nice guy to bitter guy. At least now i don't get my hopes up only to see them crashed anymore...


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## Lyric Suite (Mar 16, 2006)

workman said:


> Guys: does this clear up the nice guy/jerk thing? Does it make sense?


Actually, upon furthere reflection, i disagree.

For starters, a lot of these roles are not the result of a progression. Some people are born into them.

Good guys will be good guys from the get go, likewise for jerks.

Also, i disagree with the characterization of the latters. Jerks do care only about one thing: themselves, but make no mistake, their talent does not go anywhere. I don't understand how the author figures their skill with the opposite sex 'deteriorates', but that's just not the case.

Jerks are naturals, and if there's anything any nice guy know, is that jerks are incredibly good at playing the part of the 'good guy' in front of the opposite sex.

This is very ironic because very often girls mistake bitter guys for jerks and jerks for good guys, fancy that.

Also, jerks and players are often the same person.

Infact, all those characterizations are but a different facet of two distinct ideals: the beta male, and alpha male. In short:

Beta male = Nice guy = Bitter guy = Decent guy = rarely gets the girl.

Alpha male = Good guy = Jerk = Player = gets the girl almost everytime.

Ultimetly then, it's a question of degrees. An alpha male can be more of a good guy then a jerk, and vice versa. Likewise for any other characterization.


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## Brooklyn79 (Apr 15, 2006)

I used to be very, very bitter but I'm actually pretty close to Good guy. My girlfriend has been very supportive of me


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## FreeSoul (Jan 1, 2006)

I guess from that I'm probably a neat guy.


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## BeNice (Jan 2, 2004)

I wouldn't take something like that seriously.


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## tewstroke (Feb 18, 2006)

BeNice said:


> I wouldn't take something like that seriously.


I know, these scales, generalizations, whatever you'd like to call them don't have to describe you.


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## JenWiz (Feb 24, 2006)

what happens in actuality that made the whole 'nice guys turn into jerks thing' is that the nice guy was too nice to girls that he never got laid, no experience, so that when he finally gets a girl, he becomes so anxious, so wanting to have sex, hence the girl perceives him as some sort of a desperate jerk.


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## Strength (Aug 12, 2006)

I totally agree with the first 5 categories, it's a transgression that does work like that. Right now i would be the "Neat Guy", and I have gone through the first 3 stages leading up to it. When I was the bitter guy, it was tempting to become a jerk, because i thought to myself "what's the point of being nice?" I am mostly a good person again now, but sometimes I do have an attitude because I think it's kind of necessary to have that so other people don't take advantage of you.


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## CopadoMexicano (Aug 21, 2004)

I think the information given by sosuave.com is very insightful im the jack of all trades.


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## bent (Aug 4, 2005)

i agree with Lyric Suite. except that often women are well aware that a "good guy" might really be a jerk and that a "jerk" might just be a nice loser. sadly, that isn't enough to change what makes us tick and turns us on. Many women will often go for a jerkish "good guy" thinking that the degree of jerkness is outweighed by the emotional and psychological security, as well as physique, that is usually required to truly be a jerk rather than just a despised loser (nice/bitter). They then tell themselves that there is more goodness than jerkness and that the jerkness is to be expected from someone who is so powerful and privileged...ooo, sexy. As long as it's not ever directed at them and they don't have to see it. Powerful privileged males have so much patience with beta males sometimes...now that's a good guy! (sarcasm)


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## emptybottle (Jan 3, 2005)

MavenMI6Agent009 said:


> I think the information given by sosuave.com is very insightful im the jack of all trades.


Ugh, those sosuave guys. They're the vile and whiniest kind of "nice guys" right there. Mediocre dudes who feel entitled to hot women, and when they don't get the girls who are totally out of their league, they're all "how dare she not want to have sex with me, i'm a _nice_ guy." I'm talking about the message boards. Don't know how effective the advice part of the site is.


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## bent (Aug 4, 2005)

I haven't read that forum but it is always bad when jerks who are unsuccessful then try to exploit the woes of nice guys by claiming to be one of them. Unfortunately I see far more nice guys turned down for being nice (in any league high or low) than jerks turned down for being mediocre.


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## AdamCanada (Dec 6, 2003)

JenWiz said:


> what happens in actuality that made the whole 'nice guys turn into jerks thing' is that the nice guy was too nice to girls that he never got laid, no experience, so that when he finally gets a girl, he becomes so anxious, so wanting to have sex, hence the girl perceives him as some sort of a desperate jerk.


i think the guy thats tries to get sex but gets rejected because hes desparete is a desparete jerk.

Nice guys sit back and don't try to get laid(but want to of course), then get frustrated because he didn't due to her getting with another guy or putting the nice guy in the freinds zone(or i guess shes breaking the news to him cause he was always in the freinds zone in her books)


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