# How do you truly know Jesus is real?



## roylee1970

I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real. I mean other than the bible or just being told. Do you know he's real or just think it.
I'll start. I was at an all-time low in my life and out of nowhere I asked him to come into my life. The very second I asked I felt a warm sensation start in my toes and continue up my entire body. I used to be depressed a lot I've tried to kill myself twice in the past and wound up in the critical care unit fighting for my life. I was also one of the most stressed out people you would ever meet. Ever since that night I have not known what depression is and I've became one of the most carefree people you will ever meet. So for me I don't believe there's a Jesus I know there is.


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## Rest or Real?

Anyone that believes this will probably cite some scripture or psalm or what have you, and lay something thick on you about faith.


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## Hiccups

jesus is a warm sensation?






..on a more serious note... I don't. I have had warm sensations run through my body but .... still.... I don't.


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## roylee1970

Hiccups said:


> jesus is a warm sensation?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..on a more serious note... I don't. I have had warm sensations run through my body but .... still.... I don't.


I don't believe I was talking about hand lotion.


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## JGreenwood

Delete


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## RenegadeReloaded

roylee1970 said:


> I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real. I mean other than the bible or just being told. Do you know he's real or just think it.
> I'll start. I was at an all-time low in my life and out of nowhere I asked him to come into my life. The very second I asked I felt a warm sensation start in my toes and continue up my entire body. I used to be depressed a lot I've tried to kill myself twice in the past and wound up in the critical care unit fighting for my life. I was also one of the most stressed out people you would ever meet. Ever since that night I have not known what depression is and I've became one of the most carefree people you will ever meet. So for me I don't believe there's a Jesus I know there is.


Can u put a good word for me ? :roll


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## brokenlight

Interesting question. I have gone through a lot of periods of doubt in my life. There have been stretches when I spent a lot of time in prayer, and would answer that I know Jesus is real. His presence was undeniable, as well as his help. I struggle with keeping a constant prayer life, and memories of that closeness fade for me over time. Faith does not come naturally for me. I have the kind of mind that wants to question everything. I won't get into it, but it even makes praying hard sometimes. Anyway, I like your post.


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## Hiccups

yeah I think the debates on such topics come from two ways of thinking. Logically.. someone that needs hard evidence, physical proof and the other that is happy with a simple belief that it is real or an intuitive hunch. They still consider it to be true and real even without the hard facts hence "belief", one has "faith" in it's true existence. 
I think the mind is a powerful thing in this sense, one can convince ones self of anything if you have the will to do so. 
This is my view and I think it's why I consider myself to be somewhere closer to the middle.. I don't believe and I don't not believe, yet I don't consider myself agnostic. In all honesty I consider it a bit arrogant to say god doesn't exist yet for someone that says they think he/it does then I see it as them just wanting to give them self strength or something to attach a sense of hope to. Which is more than fine because at the end of the day we're all individuals and we're free to live our lives as we please as long as we're not hurting ourselves or others (golden rule). If it makes one happy and gives one a sense of belonging or what have you then awesome. Being happy is better than being sad, angry, lost or miserable.


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## roylee1970

Hiccups said:


> yeah I think the debates on such topics come from two ways of thinking. Logically.. someone that needs hard evidence, physical proof and the other that is happy with a simple belief that it is real or an intuitive hunch. They still consider it to be true and real even without the hard facts hence "belief", one has "faith" in it's true existence.
> I think the mind is a powerful thing in this sense, one can convince ones self of anything if you have the will to do so.
> This is my view and I think it's why I consider myself to be somewhere closer to the middle.. I don't believe and I don't not believe, yet I don't consider myself agnostic. In all honesty I consider it a bit arrogant to say god doesn't exist yet for someone that says they think he/it does then I see it as them just wanting to give them self strength or something to attach a sense of hope to. Which is more than fine because at the end of the day we're all individuals and we're free to live our lives as we please as long as we're not hurting ourselves or others (golden rule). If it makes one happy and gives one a sense of belonging or what have you then awesome. Being happy is better than being sad, angry, lost or miserable.


As individuals we all have one thing in common and that is we all want to be happy and avoid misery. It's to bad more people do not realize that and take it to heart, thanks.


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## roylee1970

brokenlight said:


> Interesting question. I have gone through a lot of periods of doubt in my life. There have been stretches when I spent a lot of time in prayer, and would answer that I know Jesus is real. His presence was undeniable, as well as his help. I struggle with keeping a constant prayer life, and memories of that closeness fade for me over time. Faith does not come naturally for me. I have the kind of mind that wants to question everything. I won't get into it, but it even makes praying hard sometimes. Anyway, I like your post.


Thanks for you input.


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## ChrisA

roylee1970 said:


> I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real. I mean other than the bible or just being told. Do you know he's real or just think it.
> I'll start. I was at an all-time low in my life and out of nowhere I asked him to come into my life. The very second I asked I felt a warm sensation start in my toes and continue up my entire body. I used to be depressed a lot I've tried to kill myself twice in the past and wound up in the critical care unit fighting for my life. I was also one of the most stressed out people you would ever meet. Ever since that night I have not known what depression is and I've became one of the most carefree people you will ever meet. So for me I don't believe there's a Jesus I know there is.


Thank you for sharing your story. It gives me great hope when I hear how God has worked in other people's lives.
I became a Christian about four years ago. The first year I did not sense that Jesus was working in my life. I read the Bible every day and said the same prayer expecting something to happen, but nothing did. A combination of things changed my approach from just reading and praying to really seeking Him. Some of the issues were concerns about raising a family, financial issues and family health problems. I joined a Bible study group, listened to Christian radio, really talked to God in normal conversation and read to understand what His Word meant in my life. The way Jesus worked in my life was kind of odd. Whenever I studied a particular topic, that same topic would come up throughout the day. I would read a verse in the Bible, turn on the radio and the guy would say the same verse. Or the topic would come up in a different book I was reading. The more I sought after Him, the more the coincidences would happen. 
Unfortunately, I dont always keep it up. The worst part is that I feel that I can find Him whenever I want, but I dont. For the last 6 months I have really been having a lot of highs and lows. For the first time ever I feel that I have experienced the Holy Spirit as described in Gal 5:22. Unfortunately, when I stop seeking Him, that feeling leaves me and I get depressed. I dont know. It just seems like a constant battle for me.
I guess He works different in all of us. Sounds like you were at such a low point He decided to do a major work in your life. I wish you the best and pray that He continues to bless you.
Chris


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## Anxiety75

It comes down to faith. There may not be any physical evidence to show Jesus existed but many people have existed and there is no evidence. Doesn't mean they never existed. My faith is that he was a real man on earth and today as a heavenly King, I feel God's mercy and forgiveness through him and through the blood he shed for us.


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## millenniumman75

roylee1970 said:


> I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real. I mean other than the bible or just being told. Do you know he's real or just think it.
> I'll start. I was at an all-time low in my life and out of nowhere I asked him to come into my life. The very second I asked I felt a warm sensation start in my toes and continue up my entire body. I used to be depressed a lot I've tried to kill myself twice in the past and wound up in the critical care unit fighting for my life. I was also one of the most stressed out people you would ever meet. Ever since that night I have not known what depression is and I've became one of the most carefree people you will ever meet. So for me I don't believe there's a Jesus I know there is.


For me, it was a night in June 1999 (I had graduated college and had no friends and feared getting a job). At 2am driving home from a bar one Saturday night, through my desparation, I told God I hated my life (for being so alone at 24).

Not 15 seconds later I saw a baby rabbit trying to cross the street - I tried to avoid it, but I hit it anyway. No matter what I tried to do physically, God sent me the message that He could have taken care of me like that rabbit (I was born in the year of the Rabbit, 1975. 1999 was also a Rabbit year as 2011 is). He would show me over the next three months that He had a different plan for my life - through putting me in situations where He needed my attention. My four week period of going to bars thinking I could make friends ended that month - I have never looked back.

1999 was a transforming year for me. That's part of where my username comes from!


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## Neptunus

****A post has been removed for violating the Spiritual Support guidelines.****

A reminder:



> Guidelines
> 
> This section is intended to be a safe haven for those who need spiritual support, encouragement, inspiration and hope.
> 
> The Spirituality section is now open to all to discuss spiritual issues but please remember this is for faith-based support. It is *not* a place to proselytize or debate your beliefs.


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## swanlinnet

You will know once you look back after following His teachings for a while.


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## exorcist

i have had multiple suicidal thoughts. never attempted them because i have a fear of what lies after death. 

at a low point, i asked God to help me. but i didn't feel any presence. maybe I'm not holy enough. or maybe I'm not broken enough.

anyway, good for you.


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## fredbloggs02

millenniumman75 said:


> For me, it was a night in June 1999 (I had graduated college and had no friends and feared getting a job). At 2am driving home from a bar one Saturday night, through my desparation, I told God I hated my life (for being so alone at 24).
> 
> Not 15 seconds later I saw a baby rabbit trying to cross the street - I tried to avoid it, but I hit it anyway. No matter what I tried to do physically, God sent me the message that He could have taken care of me like that rabbit (I was born in the year of the Rabbit, 1975. 1999 was also a Rabbit year as 2011 is). He would show me over the next three months that He had a different plan for my life - through putting me in situations where He needed my attention. My four week period of going to bars thinking I could make friends ended that month - I have never looked back.
> 
> 1999 was a transforming year for me. That's part of where my username comes from!


You felt guilty hitting the animal?


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## fredbloggs02

Neptunus said:


> ****A post has been removed for violating the Spiritual Support guidelines.****
> 
> A reminder:


It would be the Greek Gods in charge of the spiritual forum, not decadent ones for prostrated sufferers as the rest here share. The Greek Gods don't want sufferers or stoics who give up on life, if you understood Greek culture you'd realise that. You weren't born into them as most of the people here were you? You may have made a choice; how many people here do you suppose ever truthfully chose for themselves? What makes you think you owe it to anybody to decide the divide between faith and debate, that you've suffered enough to decide how free on this forum lives should be from healthy, potentially liberating, criticism? How could you listen to other people's stories of unhappiness and deny them the right to truthfully choose for themselves? I couldn't do it. I don't believe many people here need God or Gods, I believe such an idea does them yet more harm. Safe haven and silence are easily mistaken for oneanother.

"If what can be known should turn out to be something quite other than what one is supposed to believe, that is no disadvantage even for the belief, since it is the nature of belief to teach what cannot be known"
-Schopenhauer

...Go for it, delete me.


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## roylee1970

fredbloggs02 said:


> It would be the Greek Gods in charge of the spiritual forum, not decadent ones for prostrated sufferers as the rest here share. The Greek Gods don't want sufferers or stoics who give up on life, if you understood Greek culture you'd realise that. You weren't born into them as most of the people here were you? You may have made a choice; how many people here do you suppose ever truthfully chose for themselves? What makes you think you owe it to anybody to decide the divide between faith and debate, that you've suffered enough to decide how free on this forum lives should be from healthy, potentially liberating, criticism? How could you listen to other people's stories of unhappiness and deny them the right to truthfully choose for themselves? I couldn't do it. I don't believe many people here need God or Gods, I believe such an idea does them yet more harm. Safe haven and silence are easily mistaken for oneanother.
> 
> "If what can be known should turn out to be something quite other than what one is supposed to believe, that is no disadvantage even for the belief, since it is the nature of belief to teach what cannot be known"
> -Schopenhauer
> 
> ...Go for it, delete me.


Maybe I'm a little slow here. What are you trying to say. The real shame here is that a moderator has to come into a post and remove any comment that one individual is trying to share with like minded individuals in an area set up specifically for that reason. I'm curious to know what kind of thoughts go through a persons head when he or she cannot just allow others to discuss what they believe without having to yell your wrong or criticize them for it. I am so happy I do not have to live inside those heads. To get so upset over what someone else feels what a hell that must be.


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## roylee1970

As an after thought. I did not knock on anyone's door they came into post of their own free will. Anyone of sound mind that does not like it considering where it is would just turn around and leave. I walked into a gay bar by accident once I said, "oops" and turned around and left.


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## The Professor

roylee1970 said:


> I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real. I mean other than the bible or just being told. Do you know he's real or just think it.
> I'll start. I was at an all-time low in my life and out of nowhere I asked him to come into my life. The very second I asked I felt a warm sensation start in my toes and continue up my entire body. I used to be depressed a lot I've tried to kill myself twice in the past and wound up in the critical care unit fighting for my life. I was also one of the most stressed out people you would ever meet. Ever since that night I have not known what depression is and I've became one of the most carefree people you will ever meet. So for me I don't believe there's a Jesus I know there is.


Jesus Christ was a real person... that is a proven fact, no debate about it. Whether he was divine or not is unknown.


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## millenniumman75

fredbloggs02 said:


> You felt guilty hitting the animal?


Naturally, but God's timing is absolutely impeccable. 2:15am - right after I lamented? A rabbit crossing a five-lane road that was not heavily-traveled at the time? I was alone on the road in a compact car.



fredbloggs02 said:


> It would be the Greek Gods in charge of the spiritual forum, not decadent ones for prostrated sufferers as the rest here share. The Greek Gods don't want sufferers or stoics who give up on life, if you understood Greek culture you'd realise that. You weren't born into them as most of the people here were you? You may have made a choice; how many people here do you suppose ever truthfully chose for themselves? What makes you think you owe it to anybody to decide the divide between faith and debate, that you've suffered enough to decide how free on this forum lives should be from healthy, potentially liberating, criticism? How could you listen to other people's stories of unhappiness and deny them the right to truthfully choose for themselves? I couldn't do it. I don't believe many people here need God or Gods, I believe such an idea does them yet more harm. Safe haven and silence are easily mistaken for oneanother.
> 
> "If what can be known should turn out to be something quite other than what one is supposed to believe, that is no disadvantage even for the belief, since it is the nature of belief to teach what cannot be known"
> -Schopenhauer
> 
> ...Go for it, delete me.


I can't even decipher what this is trying to say.


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## percyblueraincoat

How the divine speaks to the human spirit is going to be an individual thing. It is, after all, about the individual's personal relationship with, in this case, Jesus or what Jesus means to them.


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## mind_games

fredbloggs02 said:


> What makes you think you owe it to anybody to decide the divide between faith and debate, that you've suffered enough to decide how free on this forum lives should be from healthy, potentially liberating, criticism? How could you listen to other people's stories of unhappiness and deny them the right to truthfully choose for themselves? I couldn't do it.


If a person wants debate and differing opinions on a religious topic they can open up a topic in the Religious debate forum. When they instead choose to make a thread in this, the Spiritual forum, they are choosing the direction of the discussion to exclude differing opinions/debate. You just have to respect that choice. To think you know what's best for this stranger on the internet even after they've made that choice is rude and disruptive to the discussion they are trying to have.


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## fredbloggs02

mind_games said:


> If a person wants debate and differing opinions on a religious topic they can open up a topic in the Religious debate forum. When they instead choose to make a thread in this, the Spiritual forum, they are choosing the direction of the discussion to exclude differing opinions/debate. You just have to respect that choice. To think you know what's best for this stranger on the internet even after they've made that choice is rude and disruptive to the discussion they are trying to have.


I don't think I know what's best for anyone, but you are right, I'll not interrupt the discussion further. I diddn't come here for an arguement, I've just been reading about the effects religion can have on children, aceticism and the like; I'd also heard similar stories of late night conversions from people before which upset me. People convinced for life they were corrupted by original sin in terrible depression. It bothered me to hear it, that's all.


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## Jimt68

The way I see it is that The Old Testament informed us about the coming of the Messiah. 

With that said, the Bible states that the earth is a sphere (Isaiah 40:20). Originally, the scientists insisted it was flat! 

The Bible says the earth was free floating in space (Job 26:7), long before modern space exploration was able to prove it. 

The Bible states in Hebrews 11 that the earth is made up of invisible elements, and this was found to be evident in the discovery of atoms. 

The Bible teaches that air has weight (Job 28:25). Scientists, first doubted this but were eventually disproven. 

Just a few examples. Other than that, I believe in Jesus because I believe in God.


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## millenniumman75

There are just things that happen that aren't coincidence - people in our path, signs around us, etc. It is all in the relationship.


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## Jimt68

Albert Camus said, "I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is".


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## Neptunus

joinmartin said:


> How the divine speaks to the human spirit is going to be an individual thing. It is, after all, about the individual's personal relationship with, in this case, Jesus or what Jesus means to them.


Yep, I agree!


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## Michael13453

I think that our "conscience" is the voice of God telling us what's right and wrong. We can choose to listen to or not, and when we don't listen to it that voice gets weaker and weaker. I look at the Bible, and think that if this were written by real people(which it was), and Jesus was a real person(which I believe he was), then God surely exists as shown by his actions as described in the Bible.


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## RUFB2327

You don't. That's why it's called faith. Some people just believe he is real.


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## Ironpain

I don't have a huge testimony of driving down the road at night or one that involves drug or alcohol use etc; my testimony isn't really a one day a revelation came and hit me type of thing. For me personally my testimony of Jesus Christ started out with me reliving all the guilt and shame I felt over not living up to expectations, letting everyone I loved down. 

I was so sick and tired of being depressed, I felt so weak and I had gone on in my life with low self esteem, anxiety, depression, my life was going nowhere and I had let it go on so long. 

I was angry at God and I was scared and confused and I saw how horrible my life was turning out, no drugs or alcohol but I felt like I was in prison, I was trapped by negative thoughts, looking at pornography, getting angry, depression was eating my life. 

I hated myself, who I had allowed myself to be, I kept feeling this sense that I need to pour out my heart, I would constantly get these feelings and I would feel uncertain and have doubts I was scared bt this presence was not there in my brain but in my heart, a presence that said stop fighting, stop pushing me away, you keep fighting your feelings but you know deep down in your heart that you have faith that you trust, I'm here trust me. 

Tears down my face I started to confess to God that I was a sinner and turned to Jesus and repented and I professed and claimed Jesus as my Lord and Savior, I was so weak and I cried and said Lord please take this burden away from me I profess and believe in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior and ask you Jesus to come into my heart. 

I know Jesus is real because I feel his warmth and his love, the same way as the OP knows I have had that same feeling and I got up and it was like all the anger and fear and sadness had left me and I felt calm. When I opened the door of my heart to receive Christ I received the greatest gift. 

I have struggled since in my faith it's only been a year and I've fell into temptation, I've gotten angry, felt low and distanced myself out of fear, even in my suicidal moments I couldn't do it but one day something came over me an urge to profess and I know Jesus is my Lord and Savior.


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## nork123

I know that Jesus is real because a year or so ago I was so lonely and depressed at being lonely and frustrated and I just started desperately praying that God would bring someone into my life that could just accept me as I am and love me, and after a couple of days I got a friend request on this website and we got to talking and it kept developing from there until we arranged to meet which too some doing because she was in New Zealand and I was in the UK, let alone how anxious I was not knowing if I could go through it. 

I can tell you now though that it is really amazing and she literally was just the girl I was praying for, and I even found out that she had been praying much the same prayers as me and had been for a while, and the previous year or so she said she was praying and felt God saying that he had already chosen a guy for her but he wasn't ready yet, this was during the time that I was struggling with rejection, loneliness, and went through dark periods in my mind involving drugs and delusions and anxiety from them and just felt really trapped and hopeless. 

Today she is now my wife and I am currently living in New Zealand and we are currently trying our best to find some employment and money so we can aim towards getting our own place. This last year has probably been my biggest year, don't get me wrong I still struggle a lot with social anxiety, but not being lonely any more makes it so much easier


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## Quinn the Eskimo

for me, Jesus was the same as you and me, except that he was a spiritual master, he tried to show people the way and had many followers, yet he was very much* ahead of his time *and was *misunderstood* by most

over the years his message has been corrupted and turned into an egoic teaching that stunts any real spiritual progress. I know most people like and accept this version of jesus, so to those people reading this please don't be offended. it's only my opinion.


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## somemvp

The Professor said:


> Jesus Christ was a real person... that is a proven fact, no debate about it.


:blank

I'm not saying whether or not he did exist, but its a proven fact? no debate about it? That's not even close to true.

I'm sure this will get deleted since it's in a sub forum where you cant question things or debate (lol)


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## Barette

I don't know if Jesus Christ is my savior, I can never know for sure in this lifetime, but I believe it.


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## Albert11

somemvp said:


> :blank
> 
> I'm not saying whether or not he did exist, but its a proven fact? no debate about it? That's not even close to true.
> 
> I'm sure this will get deleted since it's in a sub forum where you cant question things or debate (lol)


There are many references to him other than the bible. There is more written about Him than Abraham Lincoln. Many wittnesses. I wonder why people have such a hard time excepting this?


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## Rossy

I'd better not say anything because I will get in trouble....


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## db4805

brokenlight said:


> Interesting question. I have gone through a lot of periods of doubt in my life. There have been stretches when I spent a lot of time in prayer, and would answer that I know Jesus is real. His presence was undeniable, as well as his help. I struggle with keeping a constant prayer life, and memories of that closeness fade for me over time. Faith does not come naturally for me. I have the kind of mind that wants to question everything. I won't get into it, but it even makes praying hard sometimes. Anyway, I like your post.


My thoughts are very similar to this.:yes


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## Meta14

Jimt68 said:


> Albert Camus said, "I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is".


But that implies there's a 50-50 chance of God being real. Come on.


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## arnie

Anxiety75 said:


> ...many people have existed and there is no evidence....


extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

If they didn't we would have to believe every random thing people say.


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## nbtac41

Jesus is verified historically true. Josephus,tacitus mentioned Him in their writings..


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## Syndacus

You either feel him in you, or you don't...


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## max87

Are you talking about a historic Jesus? He did existed. Non-christian sources mentioned him and his followers before the christian era. 
Most of the early christians must have received the Gospells from someone who must have known the Disciples or maybe even Jesus himself.


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## GameGuy

I believe Jesus existed. But, I also believe that the Jesus most religions worship today is not the Jesus that once existed. I believe that the world and flesh of man has changed the teachings and gospels that were once taught by the real Jesus. And that what is taught in today's religions are things of the flesh, and not the spirit.


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## snowflakeinmay95

When I was younger I went through this whole rationalization process- trying to figure out what religion was true by asking, does God exist? If He does, which God is it? Which religion? Which lead me to Christianity... and then I asked, which branch of Christianity... and I concluded that if Christianity was true, then it had to be Catholicism.

^ I considered history/logic/philosophy... (Aquinas' 5 proofs, ontological argument, Jesus in history, C.S. Lewis, miracles, apostolic succession, Church history...) 
While they didn't prove that Jesus was real, I thought it was pretty good evidence. 


Now that I'm older, and have lived my faith longer, I have to say that while reason is important and shouldn't be ignored, a lot of my faith is based on my experiences (encountering God personally, in every day life and at church), and finally, I just have to take that leap and choose to believe. It's really a combination that leads me to believe that Jesus is real. 

Didn't want to make this post too complicated. I didn't make it to convince other people, just share my own thoughts.


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## millenniumman75

How do I know?

He speaks to me through symbolism - the night that changed my life in June, 1999. 
I was driving home from a club (just turned 24, just graduated college, was trying to make friends in a very uncertain time in my life). I told God I hated my life (it was a bout 2am, and I was driving home dejected). My car ran over a baby rabbit that had been hopping across the road - I tried to miss it, but I clipped it. 

1999 <- the year of the Rabbit.......1975 (the year I was born).....year of the Rabbit.

God gave me the message that that rabbit (what was he doing hopping across a busy street at 2am?!) could have been me, but He had better plans for me. From that point, He put me in situations where I needed to be - to learn about Him and myself. The rest is a testimony and a half!


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## ForgetMeForever

Anxiety75 said:


> It comes down to faith. There may not be any physical evidence to show Jesus existed but many people have existed and there is no evidence. Doesn't mean they never existed. My faith is that he was a real man on earth and today as a heavenly King, I feel God's mercy and forgiveness through him and through the blood he shed for us.


Actually, there is some evidence that He actually existed on earth. Knowing that He lived on earth doesn't give you faith that He is the Son of God, however.

There are some non-Christian documents that mention Jesus, mention Christians are followers of the Christ. There are some excellent articles at Bible.org that talk about the evidence.

Ancient evidence for Jesus from non-Christian sources
http://bible.org/article/ancient-evidence-jesus-non-christian-sources

Did Jesus even exist?
http://bible.org/seriespage/did-jesus-even-exist

"Defense of the Faith: Who Was Jesus?"
http://bible.org/seriespage/defense-faith-who-was-jesus

How reliable are the Gospels (why the gap between the life of Jesus and the written Gospels).
http://bible.org/seriespage/reliable-gospel-transmissions

Also, you can do a search for a document called "Messianic Prophecies", basically, Old Testament prophecies that are fulfilled by the person and life of Christ, Jesus of Nazareth.


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## ForgetMeForever

exorcist said:


> i have had multiple suicidal thoughts. never attempted them because i have a fear of what lies after death.
> 
> at a low point, i asked God to help me. but i didn't feel any presence. maybe I'm not holy enough. or maybe I'm not broken enough.
> 
> anyway, good for you.


Jesus talked about leaving a whole flock to rescue one lost lamb. Its certainly NOT because you aren't "holy" enough. In fact, Jesus was criticized for "hanging out" with sinners and ne'er-do-wells, but He replied "It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick. But go and learn what this means: I DESIRE COMPASSION, AND NOT A SACRIFICE, for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

It can just be hard to "tune in" to the spiritual. My first prayers were like, "God, if You really exist, please help me find You. If Jesus is the Savior of mankind, please help me understand. Please help me get rid of my doubts and gain a testimony of You. If my sins or my thoughts prevent me from understanding You, please help me to change. Please soften my heart."

You have to seek and *keep* seeking if its important enough to you. Ask God to help you with your unbelief.

"or maybe I'm not broken enough." Only you know the answer to that one. Yeah, it is easier to hear God when you've got nothing else to turn to, I'll say that much.

Good luck to you, I hope you come back around to read this. PM me if you want.


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## josh23

millenniumman75 said:


> How do I know?
> 
> He speaks to me through symbolism - the night that changed my life in June, 1999.
> I was driving home from a club (just turned 24, just graduated college, was trying to make friends in a very uncertain time in my life). I told God I hated my life (it was a bout 2am, and I was driving home dejected). My car ran over a baby rabbit that had been hopping across the road - I tried to miss it, but I clipped it.
> 
> 1999 <- the year of the Rabbit.......1975 (the year I was born).....year of the Rabbit.
> 
> God gave me the message that that rabbit (what was he doing hopping across a busy street at 2am?!) could have been me, but He had better plans for me. From that point, He put me in situations where I needed to be - to learn about Him and myself. The rest is a testimony and a half!


I'm just wondering what holy, divine, loving God would just impose a death sentence to one of his creations. Why wouldn't he show a sign in another way?


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## millenniumman75

josh23 said:


> I'm just wondering what holy, divine, loving God would just impose a death sentence to one of his creations. Why wouldn't he show a sign in another way?


Because sometimes, it's the only way to get the point across. You make it sound like he does what he does because it is fun. He doesn't enjoy doing that.


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## RenegadeReloaded

snowflakeinmay95 said:


> I have to say that while reason is important and shouldn't be ignored, a lot of my faith is based on my experiences (encountering God personally, in every day life and at church)


Can u give examples ?



millenniumman75 said:


> There are just things that happen that aren't coincidence - people in our path, signs around us, etc. It is all in the relationship.


Come to think of it, I can remember such a coincidence. The only time I tried to leave the house determined 100% to kill myself I was stopped by my father. He never stopped me ever before when I was going out alone looking suicidal, sometimes drunk, depressed, angry, during night time, etc.

He just stood in the door and at that time he had 120kg compared to me, 70kg, so I had no chance to move him away, although we got into a little sumo-like fight. But still, I cannot see it as a sign but only as a coincidence. Or should I say a not enough evidence for Jesus or God.


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## 7th.Streeter

Well for me, it was when I learnedthat the illuminat was real. There are many celebs,artists,actors and politicians that worship the devil. When I got saved I jad a dream of my brothers and I ran up a golden staircase after I got saved.


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## jg43i9jghy0t4555

roylee1970 said:


> I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real.


The complex nature of our world

A long-held tradition of religious belief and practices

The security of not changing

A supportive morality-based structure to community living

These things support each other and a belief that we shouldn't change our behaviour that's religious. Although they are not facts, well, such is life.. we don't always have evidence for everything.

So on that basis you could say it's very natural for a society of intelligent beings to adopt those kinds of systems for living. If we could never understand the universe in entirety, then it's natural questioning our own existence that we create reasoning, rationality for us to be here and to exist.

It's a very safe way to live, and it's more pleasant and more easy for the individual. When we start to build computer intelligence that doesn't have these (individual) interests/boundaries however, we will see much different behaviour. That would be conclusive of all the above.


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## dirsad

millenniumman75 said:


> He speaks to me through symbolism





ForgetMeForever said:


> "It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick. But go and learn what this means: I DESIRE COMPASSION, AND NOT A SACRIFICE, for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."


Oddly enough, I just thought of this scripture yesterday.

OT: Also, youversion is a great android/iphone app.


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## millenniumman75

dirsad said:


> Oddly enough, I just thought of this scripture yesterday.
> 
> OT: Also, youversion is a great android/iphone app.


Interesting.

Churches, in a way, are also spiritual hospitals. I can't tell you how many times I have been anxious only to find immediate peace when in praise, worship, and prayer. :yes


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## millenniumman75

RenegadeReloaded said:


> Can u give examples ?
> 
> Come to think of it, I can remember such a coincidence. The only time I tried to leave the house determined 100% to kill myself I was stopped by my father. He never stopped me ever before when I was going out alone looking suicidal, sometimes drunk, depressed, angry, during night time, etc.
> 
> He just stood in the door and at that time he had 120kg compared to me, 70kg, so I had no chance to move him away, although we got into a little sumo-like fight. But still, I cannot see it as a sign but only as a coincidence. Or should I say a not enough evidence for Jesus or God.


God can show himself in anyone at any time.....if he had a prostitute named Mary Magdalene give the news that Jesus has risen from the grave....one can only imagine what he can do. That event changed her life forever.


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## josh23

I hate to break it to ya'll, but you simply can't know that he's real. It is not possible. Sure you can believe all you want and i'm glad that belief has brought something positive upon you, but there is zero evidence that truly proves his existence, and if anything a lot that proves it's fiction.


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## sonofanarchy

I don't. It is most likely that he never existed.


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## sonofanarchy

millenniumman75 said:


> God can show himself in anyone at any time.....if he had a prostitute named Mary Magdalene give the news that Jesus has risen from the grave....one can only imagine what he can do. That event changed her life forever.


Yes, and I'm sure that "a prostitute named Mary Magdalene" would provide "reliable" testimony. And I'm sure that the people who wrote of her (who never met her by the way) in the bible also provided accurate details of her "reliable" testimony. And I'm sure that the church who, on numerous occasions, altered what the biblical scriptures said, kept every part of the accurate details of her "reliable" testimony in tact.


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## millenniumman75

sonofanarchy said:


> Yes, and I'm sure that "a prostitute named Mary Magdalene" would provide "reliable" testimony. And I'm sure that the people who wrote of her (who never met her by the way) in the bible also provided accurate details of her "reliable" testimony. And I'm sure that the church who, on numerous occasions, altered what the biblical scriptures said, kept every part of the accurate details of her "reliable" testimony in tact.


When she said that Jesus had risen, they went to look for his body - it was not where He was left.

Scripture has never been altered. Doing so is blashpemy.


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## sonofanarchy

millenniumman75 said:


> When she said that Jesus had risen, they went to look for his body - it was not where He was left.
> 
> Scripture has never been altered. Doing so is blashpemy.


If you do the research, you'll find that it has been altered over and over again. Whether it's blasphemy or not is irrelevant.


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## sonofanarchy

nbtac41 said:


> Jesus is verified historically true. Josephus,tacitus mentioned Him in their writings..


No it isn't.


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## sonofanarchy

Meta14 said:


> But that implies there's a 50-50 chance of God being real. Come on.


Right on man. Also, it matters which god you believe in. What if allah is the true God? You'd be sent to hell if you were a Christian or partake in any other religion besides Islam. The chances of going to hell for everyone, assuming it existed, is virtually infinity. There are an infinite amount of gods that one can perceive, and each and every one of them could potentially have different versions of hell with different criteria for what gets ya there.


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## millenniumman75

sonofanarchy said:


> If you do the research, you'll find that it has been altered over and over again. Whether it's blasphemy or not is irrelevant.


Where is the research.

It has also been proven that events in the Bible did occur.

This forum isn't even for this kind of debate.


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## sonofanarchy

millenniumman75 said:


> Where is the research.
> 
> It has also been proven that events in the Bible did occur.
> 
> This forum isn't even for this kind of debate.


This thread is however. The OP isn't looking for support. The OP is looking for the answer to, "How do I know if Jesus existed?". Last time I checked, the OP didn't only invite what Christians have to say about the subject.

How does the fact that "some" events of the Bible actually occurred make it 100% reliable? A lot of things in did not occur. Most of it is fiction mixed in with some minor historical facts.


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## LxHi

Syndacus said:


> You either feel him in you, or you don't...


basically if he exists he's having sex with you right now

(lol)


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## Quinn the Eskimo

I would definitely encourage everyone to not blindly follow beliefs

There are lots of realms of research one can get into concerning Jesus, Gnosticism, Metaphysics, and Non-Duality... There is much one can learn if they try...

but why blindly accept the explanation which doesn't solve? which doesn't really *explain* anything? keep goin' with it


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## josh23

God - serving as the ultimate placebo since forever.


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## TonyHow

I was sad...I,asked GOD to help me and since then I felt a little better instanly.... and this fourm helped me to. I want to belive in GOD and I truley hope he is real... untill the day I know for sure... I will continue to belive in him.


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## Droidsteel

roylee1970 said:


> I'm curious to know what makes you believe is real. I mean other than the bible or just being told. Do you know he's real or just think it.
> I'll start. I was at an all-time low in my life and out of nowhere I asked him to come into my life. The very second I asked *I felt a warm sensation* start in my toes and continue up my entire body. I used to be depressed a lot I've tried to kill myself twice in the past and wound up in the critical care unit fighting for my life. I was also one of the most stressed out people you would ever meet. Ever since that night I have not known what depression is and I've became one of the most carefree people you will ever meet. So for me I don't believe there's a Jesus I know there is.


Oddly enough that is one of the ways I can tell too  I always think maybe God knows Im too skeptical to follow him without something like that.

The other way is hearing his voice.


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## Droidsteel

Also I thought the spiritual support section was not up for debate, so why all the 'Jesus did not exsist/was not the son of god' stuff in this thread :?

Come on how childish, none of us are debating in the atheist section... for ****s sake.


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## Syndacus

LxHi said:


> basically if he exists he's having sex with you right now
> 
> (lol)


Man I definitely walked myself into that..lol


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## josh23

Droidsteel said:


> Also I thought the spiritual support section was not up for debate, so why all the 'Jesus did not exsist/was not the son of god' stuff in this thread :?
> 
> Come on how childish, none of us are debating in the atheist section... for ****s sake.


It's a thread about 'how do you truly know Jesus is real.' This thread leads itself to his being real being challenged. I don't think he is real, and I would like to discuss whether he is or not.

Fact is, there is ZERO proof that he is, and much proof that he isn't. Everyone wants to be happy in life, and to me God is a placebo effect to bring that happiness. I think that if I believed enough in a bucket of off yoghurt i'd get the same 'benefits' as someone who believes in God.

Also, I have a little something against religion in general. It causes so much trouble. You have no idea how many people i've seen/heard of develop problems because of it. It causes as much harm as it does good...when to me the good could be replicated in ways that are actually real.

You can disregard what I say if you want, but don't call me childish.


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## ManOnTheMOON

josh23 said:


> Fact is, there is ZERO proof that he is, and much proof that he isn't.


Have you asked God to reveal himself to you? If you want proof you have to seek him on a personal level.


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## josh23

ManOnTheMOON said:


> Have you asked God to reveal himself to you? If you want proof you have to seek him on a personal level.


No, I haven't - and I don't plan on doing so. What proof do you have personally that proves his existence? What did asking him into your life do for you?


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## ManOnTheMOON

josh23 said:


> No, I haven't - and I don't plan on doing so. What proof do you have personally that proves his existence? What did asking him into your life do for you?


He revealed himself to me to put it simply. He spoke to me through the bible and I felt the holy spirit enter me. Since then, every time I have prayed and trusted in him things have worked out for the better. God is a supernatural entity, if he exists isn't it likely that he will reveal himself to you through supernatural means. You can make arguments why he doesn't exists but until you search for him you will not find the truth.

It is promised, "Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you." James 4:8 There's really no risk on your behalf. Search for him sincerely in his way, and if he doesn't reveal himself he can hold nothing against you. The bible says God is not a liar. Its up to you to take the first step.


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## Neptunus

****Thread Closed****

Seeing as the OP is no longer around to respond, I am going to close this thread to prevent further violations of this forum's no debate rule.

ETA- If any mod disagrees with this decision, feel free to reopen it.



> *Spiritual Support Guidelines:*
> 
> This section is intended to be a safe haven for those who need spiritual support, encouragement, inspiration and hope.
> 
> The Spirituality section is now open to all to discuss spiritual issues but please remember this is for faith-based support. It is *not* a place to proselytize or debate your beliefs.





> If you come across any disruptive comments on this subforum just report them (using the report icon
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). It is far more effective than trying to address an issue within a thread.


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