# Dextroamphetamine Methylphenidate combination



## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

How would it fare?

MPH apparently reduces or blocks Amphetamine's neurotoxicity so that's already a plus.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

Also, can anyone post the link to the study or text about MPH's effect on Amphetamine's neurotoxicity? I've been searching for it but I can't find it and I need it in 20 minutes :b


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

^Try typing in methamphetamine, that's what it was studied for. Don't recall the link though sorry.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

Thx jim! 

What do you think about this combo? Both in theory and in practice.

Should you have more time than me, feel free to search for the study


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

I've got it already :clap


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## enfield (Sep 4, 2010)

http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/304/3/1181.abstract


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

Thx a lot enfield!


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> Thx jim!
> 
> What do you think about this combo? Both in theory and in practice.


Hard to say, is your doctor open to the suggestion? I have seen ADHDers on the combo but maybe that's way off label. I assume you'd preferably want a low dose of long acting preparation of MPH if you do try it, like 18mg Concerta for example.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

I'd prefer Concerta but it's just too expensive for me atm.

So I'll be going with the regular short acting Ritalin. I take my Dextroamphetamine 5-6 times a day so I'm used to very frequent dosing and walking around with pills lol (I even got myself a nice medical pill box to carry in my pocket |8)

I'm going to take 10 mg Dexamp 5-6x/day + 10 mg Ritalin IR 5-6x/day + Lyrica and then maybe also Xabut, but that's a maybe.

How would this work in practice since MPH is an (N)DRI?


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

15 Minutes until I have to go to my psychiatrist, gimme some info people so I don't potentially waste another week on a useless combo :teeth


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> I'd prefer Concerta but it's just too expensive for me atm.
> 
> So I'll be going with the regular short acting Ritalin.* I take my Dextroamphetamine 5-6 times a day* so I'm used to very frequent dosing and walking around with pills lol (I even got myself a nice medical pill box to carry in my pocket |8)


Yeah it seems like Dex is really short acting lately, like I'm lucky to get 2 hrs benefit out of a dose, no wonder vyvanse is gaining popularity in the US.


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

A weeks not that long I guess, more like 1 month+ between seeing pdoc for me. Guess you can try out your ideal combo for a week if she says so. Or subtly mention that Tramadol helped you the most with depression when you took it for pain (if your pdoc is open minded).


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> Yeah it seems like Dex is really short acting lately, like I'm lucky to get 2 hrs benefit out of a dose, no wonder vyvanse is gaining popularity in the US.


It's best dosed every 3 hours imo, gives more stable blood levels/effect and you don't have to take large single dosages.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> A weeks not that long I guess, more like 1 month+ between seeing pdoc for me. Guess you can try out your ideal combo for a week if she says so. Or subtly mention that Tramadol helped you the most with depression when you took it for pain (if your pdoc is open minded).


Yes I'll be trying it for a couple of days. You only see your shrink once a month?

Me being a hardcore case, my parents decided years ago I needed to be there weekly or at least a few times a month lol

I think she'd be open to prescribe me Tramadol but I can't take that with a stimulant, way too risky.


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> Yes I'll be trying it for a couple of days. You only see your shrink once a month?
> 
> Me being a hardcore case, my parents decided years ago I needed to be there weekly or at least a few times a month lol
> 
> I think she'd be open to prescribe me Tramadol but I can't take that with a stimulant, way too risky.


Yep only about once every 4-6 weeks, kinda sucks I agree. One time last yr they were so booked that it took 3 months. :mum

You mean because of the seizure risk I assume? I guess you don't find Tramadol alerting enough so it can't replace your stimulants then.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> Yep only about once every 4-6 weeks, kinda sucks I agree. One time last yr they were so booked that it took 3 months. :mum
> 
> You mean because of the seizure risk I assume? I guess you don't find Tramadol alerting enough so it can't replace your stimulants then.


It's alerting enough, it gives plenty of energy, a lot more than the stimulants do actually.

But the seizure risk would be too real idd. Tramadol is the only drug I've ever had noticeable seizure activity on and that was on Tramadol only so :no


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> It's alerting enough, it gives plenty of energy, a lot more than the stimulants do actually.
> 
> But the seizure risk would be too real idd. Tramadol is the only drug I've ever had noticeable seizure activity on and that was on Tramadol only so :no


Doesn't that mean you could drop stims since they mostly help you with energy? Or do they help your depression as-well? They seem too short acting to give decent antidepressant coverage in my experience, they only improve my mood for an hr or so after a dose. Concerta might be a better antidepressant I guess?


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## bugasman (Jun 9, 2012)

GREAT THREAD!

I was searching for members using this combination but found none. I'm using Vyvanse since July/2012 and it's the only amph avaiable in my country. It's super inconsistency. Sometimes Vyvanses makes me sleepy, motivated or depressed. I'm still looking for the right dosage or timing, splitting the medicine, with/without food... Last week I decided to try Ritalin IR with Vyvanse. 

Wow, the combination removes the ritalin jitters and adds motivation and consistency to Vyvanse. I think the ideal is to use smaller doses. I'm still testing the right dose and timing. I will discuss this with my doctor in my next appointment. The good thing about this combination is that Vyvanse is slow released and it removes the Ritalin IR crash. I never felt "methylphenidate blues" using this combo.

In conclusion, Ritalin increases my motivation to study (do ultra-boredom stuff), and Dexamp relax me, makes me more social. So Methylphenidate + Dex = Motivation + Energy + Socialization + Confidence + Euphoria + Executive function (increased self-control)

The best dose I found for me is (I'm still experimenting): 

- 7:00 (I take 15mg Vyvanse oral) and 5 mg Ritalin sublingual
- 11:00 (15mg Vyvanse)
- 14:00 (post lunch) 5 mg Ritalin


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## UltraShy (Nov 8, 2003)

jim_morrison said:


> Yeah it seems like Dex is really short acting lately, like I'm lucky to get 2 hrs benefit out of a dose, *no wonder vyvanse is gaining popularity in the US.*


Vyvanse has the backing of Shire's entire marketing team. Who's selling Dex? Well, that would be nobody.

There's also the issue of how in recent years Dex has been in shortage where you couldn't get it at all & now it seems you can get it but it will cost way more than Vyvanse despite being a generic drug that's been on the market for 80 years. It's pretty easy to sell Vyvanse when you knock off the competition.

I'm not knocking Vyvanse as a drug. If you want a long-acting version of Dex this is it, but I'm not at all pleased with the unfair anti-competitive practices I witness.


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> Doesn't that mean you could drop stims since they mostly help you with energy? Or do they help your depression as-well? They seem too short acting to give decent antidepressant coverage in my experience, they only improve my mood for an hr or so after a dose. Concerta might be a better antidepressant I guess?


Atm they are helping me getting out of bed to begin with, afterwards they help me push through my physical pain as well. They give me more motivation in general and the energy to actually do something. I'd consider that AD action, especially since "the best SSRI" accomplished none of this and actually accomplished nothing at all.

The short duration could certainly be an issue but I dont work atm so I can dose 5-6 times a day. Concerta is a great med for sure but it's duration of action is too sbhort for once daily dosing. And twice a day dosing would mean you ard on it 24-7 :-D

+ Concerta is SO expensive!

Tramadol is still a future option. But you can't combine much with it nor can you push the dosage.


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## billyho (Apr 12, 2010)

UltraShy said:


> Vyvanse has the backing of Shire's entire marketing team. Who's selling Dex? Well, that would be nobody.
> 
> There's also the issue of how in recent years Dex has been in shortage where you couldn't get it at all & now it seems you can get it but it will cost way more than Vyvanse despite being a generic drug that's been on the market for 80 years. It's pretty easy to sell Vyvanse when you knock off the competition.
> 
> I'm not knocking Vyvanse as a drug. If you want a long-acting version of Dex this is it, but I'm not at all pleased with the unfair anti-competitive practices I witness.


I agree, although the dex shortage for the most part is over.. I am able to get 5mg dex ir and also get 5mg dex spansules, although the spansules seem to be harder and harder to find..


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## billyho (Apr 12, 2010)

bugasman said:


> _* In conclusion, Ritalin increases my motivation to study (do ultra-boredom stuff), and Dexamp relax me, makes me more social. So Methylphenidate + Dex = Motivation + Energy + Socialization + Confidence + Euphoria + Executive function (increased self-control)*_


I have used both the IR versions of Focalin and Dex at the same time. I took half the dose of each. I believe my experience was similar to the above poster but there was a reason why i stopped doing it, can't really remember what that was at the moment. I don't really think i was that big of a fan of focalin in the first place.


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> Atm they are helping me getting out of bed to begin with, afterwards they help me push through my physical pain as well. They give me more motivation in general and the energy to actually do something. I'd consider that AD action, especially since "the best SSRI" accomplished none of this and actually accomplished nothing at all.
> 
> The short duration could certainly be an issue but I dont work atm so I can dose 5-6 times a day. Concerta is a great med for sure but it's duration of action is too sbhort for once daily dosing. And twice a day dosing would mean you ard on it 24-7 :-D
> 
> ...


Is Ritalin LA cheaper/works 8 hrs? If so you could get 16 hrs from it with 2 doses to smooth out the dexamphetamine I guess.

I agree that for improving the functional aspects of depression stimulants dominate over SSRIs for sure. Without stimulants I'm in a constant brain fog, they certainly take the edge off CFS. (CFS + depression = zero energy ever).


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

bugasman said:


> GREAT THREAD!
> 
> I was searching for members using this combination but found none. I'm using Vyvanse since July/2012 and it's the only amph avaiable in my country. It's super inconsistency. Sometimes Vyvanses makes me sleepy, motivated or depressed. I'm still looking for the right dosage or timing, splitting the medicine, with/without food... Last week I decided to try Ritalin IR with Vyvanse.
> 
> ...


What's up with the ***** doses bro?


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> Is Ritalin LA cheaper/works 8 hrs? If so you could get 16 hrs from it with 2 doses to smooth out the dexamphetamine I guess.
> 
> I agree that for improving the functional aspects of depression stimulants dominate over SSRIs for sure. Without stimulants I'm in a constant brain fog, they certainly take the edge off CFS. (CFS + depression = zero energy ever).


It's cheaper than Concerta yes but still quite a lot more expensive than Ritalin IR. And I like the control IR versions give me.

CFS is something I've never been tested for (does a test even exist?) but it sure looks like I have it as well!


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## jim_morrison (Aug 17, 2008)

Inshallah said:


> CFS is something I've never been tested for (does a test even exist?) but it sure looks like I have it as well!


You can do blood testing, especially looking for Epstein-Barr virus (EBV) aswell as full blood counts to check your blood cells are all within normal range. About 90% of people are exposed to EBV but it lays dormant in most people, only becomes active and progresses to Glandular Fever in a few people whos body's can't deal with it properly.

This article's not too bad:



> Some people have a genetically weak immune system that fails to mop up the bad cells from the EBV, allowing it to get a hold of their system and take root permanently in an active form for years if not decades.
> 
> After months of burning the candle at both ends, I contracted a bad case of glandular fever - a severe flu-like virus that most commonly affects those under 25. I spent the next six months in bed, unable to read or do anything.
> I never really recovered. And for the past 20 years, I have lived in a sort of twilight world of semi-wellness, knowing that there was something wrong, but never quite being able to put my finger on it. ​​



​​
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...-virulent-common--incurable--virus-blame.html


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## Inshallah (May 11, 2011)

jim_morrison said:


> You can do blood testing, especially looking for Epstein-Barr virus (EBV) aswell as full blood counts to check your blood cells are all within normal range. About 90% of people are exposed to EBV but it lays dormant in most people, only becomes active and progresses to Glandular Fever in a few people whos body's can't deal with it properly.
> 
> This article's not too bad:
> 
> ...


After narcolepsy yet another thing I'll have to look into. Might as well go live in the hospital


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## EnjoysSubstances (Nov 18, 2013)

Hey all..This is my first post on this forum(other than that greeting thing). As such I expect extremely astute, insightful and expeditious replies to my queries.

But in seriousness.. It's late and I've had a long and heavily-medicated day, I am fairly scattered right now so please be gentle if I accidentally a word or something. This thread is actually what brought me to this forum while googling: 'Dextroamphetamine Methylphenidate combination'.

I've considered joining before since I do actually have pretty bad anxiety, but this is what got me to join... So if anyone could help me out with a few questions I have that would be fantastic. 

By the way, the parts in _italics_ may seem odd and/or irrelevant; but it's just the way I rationalize. The parts in *bold* are my questions (so if this post is TL;DR; I'd still appreciate it if you read and answered (or tried to answer the questions in bold)).

I started seeing a psychiatrist about a month ago with the intention of getting an ADD/ADHD diagnosis and a prescription for either ritalin or dex; it was surprisingly easy- I got the ADD diagnosis and a script for ritalin within my first half hour with him.

My primary motivation for wanting these medications was to help with my motivation, get things done etc.. Though I was also curious to their recreational effects.

I have seen the psychiatrist twice since my first visit; the last time I saw him I swapped the rialin for dexies since I wanted to see how they compare.

My psychiatrist is moving so I will only have one more appointment with him (in 6 days); where I will make my final decision about which medication to stick with. I don't intend to start going to another psychiatrist(too expensive too keep seeing them), I just want a script. I can't really make up my mind about whether to go with the dex or the ritalin.

I know I should probably just disregard everything apart from which I think works best for me but there are so many factors that could sway the argument; many of which I'm sure I haven't even considered or had time to properly research yet eg. how each of them interact with other substances I may take, or which builds tolerance faster etc.... It's just such a close call between the 2 that I can't decide.

Both are the same price ($6 since PBS), neither really give me bad comedowns, especially since I have plenty of benzos and things. For reading around different boards/forums; it seems that around 70% of people prefer dex to ritalin.

Though given that my main problem was motivation, ritalin seems to work a little better for that. I was actually a bit disappointed with dexies, but that's probably because I had pretty high expectations.

A few of the pros and cons of each I've noticed are: Ritalin has the benefit of being better for insufflation (if you're into that), Dex seems to give me more of a physical energy boost than ritalin; although after a long day with quite a bit of dex my mind seems to wander.

_In recreational doses It seems dex is a bit like a less potent version of meth, whereas ritalin is a bit like a less potent version of cocaine(except with the ritalin lasting several times longer). And let's be honest who would choose meth over coke?

Since more psychiatrists have issues prescribing dex than ritalin then if i do decide on ritalin I may have a harder time switching back. I also have to consider that dexies have a much higher street value(not that I would sell them, just; to me it could feel like kind of a waste going with ritalin when I could go with the *harder to get and more valuable* dex._

*I had one idea; though I'm not sure if my(and possibly the vast majority of psychiatrists) would go for it even it even though it would be the perfect solution-

If I tell the psychiatrist that both work pretty much equally well; the only problem being that I'm very worried about addiction and tolerance issues (perhaps adding that I read so much about addiction and WD horror stories, or that a friend went through it and I saw how horrible it was). And then suggest possibly alternating the dex and ritalin prescriptions on a monthly or bi-monthly basis; to avoid/reduce tolerance. I know it's a long shot but could it possibly work? I only managed to skim through the replies in this thread (sorry I really should get some sleep, but I want to get this done). I got the impression a few of you have scripts for both amphetamines as well as ritalin. How did you go about that? And in what country (QLD Australia here).

I would really appreciate your opinions on either or both or which you would prefer and why?/ which you think I should go for and why? Also if you could post any opinions on the pros and cons of ritalin and/or dex that would surely be helpful.*

Thanks in advance, sorry for the long spun-out post, I didn't think it would take that long.. I hope it's not too long that nobody reads it.


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## butterz (Aug 8, 2013)

Does this mean that ritalin is actually good for the brain?


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## EnjoysSubstances (Nov 18, 2013)

Goddammit, I should have previewed it.. I wouldn't blame anyone if they didn't read all of that, I probably wouldn't.

summary would pretty much be: I can't decide between ritalin or dexies so is it possibly to get prescriptions for both if you make up a good enough excuse and do you think my excuse could work?. Also pls respond with opinions to the stuff in the last paragraph.

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand that's it. Thanks, and goodnight.


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