# Anybody done a keto/very lowcarb diet?



## likeabrickwall (Oct 29, 2015)

Any benefits or results you saw? I've seen reports online that people did this diet and fatloss was a breeze. Or that energy levels were higher or moods stabilised?


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## indielife (Jun 17, 2015)

I did one for like 3 weeks, a VLCD one, despite only consuming 600 kcal a day (not recommending this to anyone), I still felt great with lots more energy. My mood probably also got better/more stable as insulin spikes went down.

Currently making a switch back to keto again, only on day 3 at the moment, but I'm already feeling a lot more energized and I don't get hungry; when I eat high carb I have to fight hunger all the time, which can be quite agonizing. It's by far the easiest diet to follow in my opinion. Most people are even able to eat however much they feel like because it suppresses appetite to such an extent. 

The main downside with such a diet is of course that whilst your overall energy levels go up, your strength goes way down because of the lack of glycogen stored to be used for fast energy, so it's quite a terrible diet if you're going to the gym and lifting weights, then eating carbs is an absolute must.


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## unemployment simulator (Oct 18, 2015)

I tried the so called miracle solution of carb backloading. load of bull, you can;t get stronger and build muscle while losing fat like it claimed. 
keto I have done as well but with the odd refeed. its not too good if you are training, good if you want to just lose weight. that or paleo seems to work wonders for just getting rid of flab.


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## goku23 (Nov 22, 2014)

other things to consider, cortisol and insulin are counterbalancing hormones. In the absence of insulin, cortisol will rise substantially over time and this can make fat loss more difficult. 
I much prefer the timed-carb and carb cycling approach to keep insulin sensitivity high and cortisol balanced.
Growth hormone and IGF-1 output both significantly decreased during prolonged keto and androgen levels effected also. 

Most people who've lost weight doing keto diets in controlled studies had (IMO) a poor fat-muscle loss ratio, meaning they lost too much lean muscle for the little fat they lost. This skews weight loss numbers because of course they lost a lot of weight, but how much of it was fat and how much was muscle/glycogen/intracellular and intramuscular fluid?

Not ideal IMO.


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## th14 (Jul 28, 2014)

bad idea healthwise, try changing the source of your carbs instead, fruit and vegetable intake assists weight loss independent of macronutrients


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

unemploymentsimulator2016 said:


> I tried the so called miracle solution of carb backloading. load of bull, you can;t get stronger and build muscle while losing fat like it claimed.
> keto I have done as well but with the odd refeed. its not too good if you are training, good if you want to just lose weight. that or paleo seems to work wonders for just getting rid of flab.


Then you weren't in ketosis.



goku23 said:


> other things to consider, cortisol and insulin are counterbalancing hormones. In the absence of insulin, cortisol will rise substantially over time and this can make fat loss more difficult.
> I much prefer the timed-carb and carb cycling approach to keep insulin sensitivity high and cortisol balanced.
> Growth hormone and IGF-1 output both significantly decreased during prolonged keto and androgen levels effected also.


Only in poorly formed keto diets. Just eat more iodized salt.



> Most people who've lost weight doing keto diets in controlled studies had (IMO) a poor fat-muscle loss ratio, meaning they lost too much lean muscle for the little fat they lost. This skews weight loss numbers because of course they lost a lot of weight, but how much of it was fat and how much was muscle/glycogen/intracellular and intramuscular fluid?


Did they also participate in strength training, and what was their protein intake like? It's hard to take any study at face value until the details of it are clear they apply to a specific situation.



th14 said:


> bad idea healthwise, try changing the source of your carbs instead, fruit and vegetable intake assists weight loss independent of macronutrients


A ketogenic diet is perfectly healthy.


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## unemployment simulator (Oct 18, 2015)

Sacrieur said:


> Then you weren't in ketosis.


not sure how you formed that conclusion? or in what part of my quote you are referring to? it's possible I wasn't during the time I was doing keto with the odd refeed but its likely I was. I did a period of time which I was on a diet to become fat adapted, 10 days. after which I had a refeed once after 4 whole days of becoming fat adapted. I followed john keifers carb night solution, if you want to check out how credible it is by all means download the pdf and read through it, it contains links to all his research and citations.

the period after that I was doing carb backloading again from the same author.


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

unemploymentsimulator2016 said:


> not sure how you formed that conclusion? or in what part of my quote you are referring to? it's possible I wasn't during the time I was doing keto with the odd refeed but its likely I was. I did a period of time which I was on a diet to become fat adapted, 10 days. after which I had a refeed once after 4 whole days of becoming fat adapted. I followed john keifers carb night solution, if you want to check out how credible it is by all means download the pdf and read through it, it contains links to all his research and citations.
> 
> the period after that I was doing carb backloading again from the same author.


Sorry, that's not ketosis. To maintain ketosis you have to consume less than 5-10 grams of carbs a day. If you so much as eat a plate of speghetti after adjusting into ketosis, then you've knocked yourself out of ketosis. Once you've adjusted you can't have ANY carbs. You can't cheat on it, at all.

So basically, you got scammed.


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## Farideh (Nov 13, 2011)

Fat loss WAS a breeze

Energy level was lower

for me

I got bad heart palpitations when I didn't eat carbs and I could barely start my work out routine.

I mean yes, everyone is different, but I need to have my carbs. Healthy carbs. Otherwise, I feel like I'm on the verge of dying.


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## unemployment simulator (Oct 18, 2015)

Sacrieur said:


> Sorry, that's not ketosis. To maintain ketosis you have to consume less than 5-10 grams of carbs a day. If you so much as eat a plate of speghetti after adjusting into ketosis, then you've knocked yourself out of ketosis. Once you've adjusted you can't have ANY carbs. You can't cheat on it, at all.
> 
> So basically, you got scammed.


I don't think you really understand how its possible to be flexible with ketosis, i've experimented with this a lot, its not that strict at all. you can eat up 30 grams of net carbs (net carbs = total carbohydrates - fibre) and it is fine. i've even heard of people eating up to 50 grams and still being in ketosis, its different for each individual but 30g of net carbs daily is fine to stay in ketosis. have you even heard of cyclical ketogenic dieting?


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

unemploymentsimulator2016 said:


> I don't think you really understand how its possible to be flexible with ketosis, i've experimented with this a lot, its not that strict at all. you can eat up 30 grams of net carbs (net carbs = total carbohydrates - fibre) and it is fine. i've even heard of people eating up to 50 grams and still being in ketosis, its different for each individual but 30g of net carbs daily is fine to stay in ketosis. have you even heard of cyclical ketogenic dieting?


_Some _people can eat up to 100 grams without being knocked out of ketosis. It varies from person to person, but true ketosis, as medically defined, is achieved by eating less than 10 grams a day.

Every single reputable medical study on the subject uses this, which is called a "true ketogenic diet" in that it's not just very low carb, it's zero carb.

You cannot cycle in and out of ketosis. Ketogenic adaption takes a week to two weeks, and your body will gladly throw all that adaption aside at the first sign of a large amount of carbohydrates. It's a very inflexible process, not flexible like your source describes. I don't know where they got the "30 grams" number or this "cycling" nonsense, but it's wrong.


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## unemployment simulator (Oct 18, 2015)

Sacrieur said:


> _Some _people can eat up to 100 grams without being knocked out of ketosis. It varies from person to person, but true ketosis, as medically defined, is achieved by eating less than 10 grams a day.
> 
> Every single reputable medical study on the subject uses this, which is called a "true ketogenic diet" in that it's not just very low carb, it's zero carb.
> 
> You cannot cycle in and out of ketosis. Ketogenic adaption takes a week to two weeks, and your body will gladly throw all that adaption aside at the first sign of a large amount of carbohydrates. It's a very inflexible process, not flexible like your source describes. I don't know where they got the "30 grams" number or this "cycling" nonsense, but it's wrong.


its well known within nutrition that you do not need to go as low as that, for starters you need fibre. going that low, its extreme and its not neccessary.
zero carb would have negative affects on your gut health. you need fibre for proper digestive health.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_ketogenic_diet


> Although most people report a waning of cravings while in ketosis, some people may crave carbohydrates during ketosis for psychological reasons. During a hypocaloric ketogenic diet, the carb cravings may combine with hunger pangs, making matters worse.[2] (However, it is noteworthy that most people report having no hunger pangs on a ketogenic diet, due to its higher fat and protein contents, which help to increase a sense of fullness).[1]
> 
> A CKD offers a way to combat this. It offers a cyclical "refeed" (sometimes also called a carb-up). During this phase, the diet consists mostly of complex carbohydrates, with limited fat, sucrose and fructose. Since the glycogen stores in the liver and muscles are depleted, these carbohydrates go straight to refilling them, instead of being added to the body's fat stores. For this reason, the amount of calories consumed during a refeed can be far above an individual's usual dietary intake. While a typical CKD consists of 50g or less carbs per day, the typical refeed consists of 450-600g of carbs. Also a weight gain of 1-2 lbs is usually reported during refeeding. Which would mainly be water and will normally be lost in 2-4 days.
> 
> ...







people get results in fat loss doing this,its been tried and tested, their body is using fat for fuel during the days they are not eating high amounts of carbs. they can eat the same amount of calories. and no, that is not how the body works when in ketosis, it will not take long at all for the body to return to ketosis, *if it was previously fat adapted and if you load intelligently*. one short period of carbs will not mean you need another 1 to 2 weeks lol. people have been doing this for decades in bodybuilding and getting results with losing fat, do some research, look up carb nite and the anabolic diet. I have done a cyclical ketogenic diet, I ate fats and protein and under 30grams of carbs for 5 days, then had a refeed of about 400g of carbs and then back to keto, I lost a load of bodyfat and didn't pull out of ketosis. I could keep doing this cycle over and over, it didnt take me weeks to get back to fat burning after a night of carbs! sorry but you have no idea what you are talking about.


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## McFly (Jul 15, 2014)

What change in moods have people experienced on the diet? 

I've read some and a few people talk about an increase in anxiety with the loss of carbs, and others have said after being on the diet for a while that their mood changed for the better and they had a euphoric sensation. I'm sure that would rely on an individual's chemistry. But has anyone noticed an increase or decrease in anxiety or depression or other mood changes on the keto diet?


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## likeabrickwall (Oct 29, 2015)

McFly said:


> What change in moods have people experienced on the diet?
> 
> I've read some and a few people talk about an increase in anxiety with the loss of carbs, and others have said after being on the diet for a while that their mood changed for the better and they had a euphoric sensation. I'm sure that would rely on an individual's chemistry. But has anyone noticed an increase or decrease in anxiety or depression or other mood changes on the keto diet?


I tried sticking to a low carb diet and found it very hard. I still live at home and most of the food are carbs you shouldn't eat.

Anyways, when I do manage to do low carb for a few days, I notice more stability in my moods. I become more relaxed. No sudden mood swings. Even though I might be in a good mood, I become more content to be lazy. I'm sure this is due to the decrease in energy. I'm probably one of those people that are "carb sensitive".


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## McFly (Jul 15, 2014)

likeabrickwall said:


> I tried sticking to a low carb diet and found it very hard. I still live at home and most of the food are carbs you shouldn't eat.
> 
> Anyways, when I do manage to do low carb for a few days, I notice more stability in my moods. I become more relaxed. No sudden mood swings. Even though I might be in a good mood, I become more content to be lazy. I'm sure this is due to the decrease in energy. I'm probably one of those people that are "carb sensitive".


Seems like running on fat would help to prevent fatigue that happens from sugar highs and lows.

I tried the atkins a couple years ago but I didn't do it right because it's difficult to keep your carbs at a low point, due to foods in the stores being supplemented with sweeteners and most diets are carb heavy. All I felt was lethargic and nauseated. I'm going to get the keto another try but right now I have a fridge with carb foods.


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## unemployment simulator (Oct 18, 2015)

my staple keto foods were cheese, sausages, sugar free peanut butter, avocados, double cream, eggs, bacon, high fat beef mince, various other nuts like macadamias, seeds aswell sometimes are high in fat. low sugar high fibrous veg, mushrooms.
condiments; caesar, mayo.

i've noticed different mood levels with these things, when I am low fat /regular high carb for long periods it can contribute to feeling a bit depressed. I did this for some of last year and all of this year so far.
when high fat low carb which I did for most of last year and some of 2014, physical energy levels were fluctuating somewhat more. sometimes after I have consumed a high fat meal while keto I would get this curious rush which is similar to a sugar rush but less scattered, a bit more clear headed.
there is also something called bulletproof coffee you might want to try out as its keto friendly you can experiment with that too while on the diet, there is a super expensive version which uses mct oil and there is the budget version with butter. i'm a bit skeptical but apparently it does work for some.
http://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...-butter-to-your-morning-coffee-a-step-too-far


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## AllTheSame (Mar 19, 2016)

In my personal experience so far (which is very limited) I cannot starve myself of carbs. I need them. I work them off while doing upper body (lifting). I haven't been able to run for the last few months because of an injury, but it all seems to still be working for me. I've been able to lose ten pounds since the first of the year JUST by going low-fat. Before I put anything in my shopping cart I look at the fat content and so far it's worked for me. The pounds (I want to lose 25, and have lost 10 so far) are coming off very slowly, but they are coming off.


And I really feel a lot better after changing the way I eat.


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