# Why Does Female Virginity Have Value?



## lyric (Aug 21, 2011)

I know times are changing, but there is a general notion that a woman's virginity has strong value. She's got to lose it to a man who loves her, be "pure", wait until marriage, etc. However none of these rules apply to men, who are encouraged to lose virginity as a rite of passage. Why should a woman's virginity mean more than a man's? Why is it believed that a woman can't have emotionally detached sex like a man can?

The reason I ask this is because I could possibly lose mine soon and my mom is convinced I'll regret it. Simply due to the silly rule that girls have to lose virginity to a man who loves them.

Thoughts?


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## Blue Bird (Jun 28, 2004)

Christianity, patriarchy, double standards...

Have you read this article: http://jezebel.com/female-purity-is-bull****-493278191
Your post reminded me of it.


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## lyric (Aug 21, 2011)

Blue Bird said:


> Christianity, patriarchy, double standards...
> 
> Have you read this article: http://jezebel.com/female-purity-is-bull****-493278191
> Your post reminded me of it.


Interesting read.


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## coldsorehighlighter (Jun 2, 2010)

In general, women are in control of when sex happens. So a woman's virginity has "value", as you put it, because if (again, in general) a woman could have sex with "anyone", but she's choosing to have sex with you as her first...that's cool. 

Whereas a virgin male, in general, would probably hump a tree if it had a smooth hole. 

Basically, (AGAIN IN GENERAL lol) it's "easy" to take a guy's virginity, if you're a female and know he's a virgin. I don't think it's nearly as easy for a guy, to take a girl's virginity...


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

There is no point in being a good girl. I was probably less picky about the first guy I had sex with than later guys. I was almost 20 and was desperate for experience.


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## Mousey9 (Dec 27, 2012)

Nuff said


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## sas111 (Oct 20, 2010)

No ones even going to believe a women if she says she's a virgin, so many women this day are lying about it, we know you're ****ing not. It's like the perfect words for a guy to hear so why not tell them left and right.


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## lyric (Aug 21, 2011)

sas111 said:


> No ones even going to believe a women if she says she's a virgin, so many women this day are lying about it, we know you're ****ing not. It's like the perfect words for a guy to hear so why not tell them left and right.


Idk, alot of guys prefer an "experienced" woman.


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## The Enclave (May 10, 2013)

The same reason they treated as "****s" if they're open doors. 

And everyone: laff at the reverse white knight thread. I mean seriously...


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## YahYouBetcha (Mar 24, 2012)

the cheat said:


> In general, women are in control of when sex happens. So a woman's virginity has "value", as you put it, because if (again, in general) a woman could have sex with "anyone", but she's choosing to have sex with you as her first...that's cool.
> 
> Whereas a virgin male, in general, would probably hump a tree if it had a smooth hole.
> 
> Basically, (AGAIN IN GENERAL lol) it's "easy" to take a guy's virginity, if you're a female and know he's a virgin. I don't think it's nearly as easy for a guy, to take a girl's virginity...


I agree with this. In general, men are more horny and are willing to have sex more often.

Also, what someone else said about women having more to lose by having sex.... women could get pregnant, but for men, there are no long-term consequences. This also translates into women being more picky about who they have sex with, and men sleeping with a girl just b/c they're horny and/or she's hot.

And women have a physical hymen that they need to break; men have nothing. So it could be considered a more sacred act for women.


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## Noca (Jun 24, 2005)

YahYouBetcha said:


> I agree with this. In general, men are more horny and are willing to have sex more often.
> 
> Also, what someone else said about women having more to lose by having sex.... women could get pregnant, but for men, there are no long-term consequences. This also translates into women being more picky about who they have sex with, and men sleeping with a girl just b/c they're horny and/or she's hot.
> 
> And women have a physical hymen that they need to break; men have nothing. So it could be considered a more sacred act for women.


Not all women are born with hymens.


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## The Enclave (May 10, 2013)

Noca said:


> Not all women are born with hymens.


The vast majority are. Moot point.


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## depressedkat (Dec 10, 2012)

lyric said:


> I know times are changing, but there is a general notion that a woman's virginity has strong value. She's got to lose it to a man who loves her, be "pure", wait until marriage, etc. However none of these rules apply to men, who are encouraged to lose virginity as a rite of passage. Why should a woman's virginity mean more than a man's? Why is it believed that a woman can't have emotionally detached sex like a man can?
> 
> The reason I ask this is because I could possibly lose mine soon and my mom is convinced I'll regret it. Simply due to the silly rule that girls have to lose virginity to a man who loves them.
> 
> Thoughts?


I personally think losing your virginity with someone you care about and cares about you is a better choice. Since Virginity for women is such a big deal if you have a guy hit it and quit it, it can be a blow to self esteem. Also because it is usually a big step for a girl she'll usually have feelings for that guy so if he's just in it for the sex she'll get hurt.

I know a few people who lost their virginity to someone who used them and they regret it. I lost mine to my first boyfriend that i dated long term and i am glad it worked out that way.



Persephone The Dread said:


> biologically speaking women have a lot more to loose because they might get pregnant (takes up about nine months before trying sgain and then you have to raise the offspring too) where as males when it comes to mammals (which humans are) have a very different role and are meant to have sex with as many women as possible to father children. Obviously as hunans we are nit so base and are capable (at least some of us) of objective, rational thought but those basic principles are what created these long running societal prejudices and taboos.


I agree with this



lyric said:


> Idk, alot of guys prefer an "experienced" woman.


Guys want virgins with the skills of an experienced women. in other words not possible.


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## ShadyGFX (Jul 18, 2012)

infamous93 said:


> Nuff said


That picture says so much about the world lol


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## lyric (Aug 21, 2011)

YahYouBetcha said:


> I agree with this. In general, men are more horny and are willing to have sex more often.
> 
> Also, what someone else said about women having more to lose by having sex.... women could get pregnant, but for men, there are no long-term consequences. This also translates into women being more picky about who they have sex with, and men sleeping with a girl just b/c they're horny and/or she's hot.
> 
> And women have a physical hymen that they need to break; men have nothing. So it could be considered a more sacred act for women.


These are all good points.


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## John316C (May 1, 2011)

i got a cousin in riverside CA named aileen


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

I'm glad I didn't lose my virginity to my first boyfriend. I certainly didn't want him to think he was the only guy and that he somehow owned my sexuality. It icks me out how some guys dig purity.


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## totalloner (Jan 29, 2013)

I'm glad I didn't lose my virginity at all!


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## popeet (Dec 8, 2005)

economic control


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## Milco (Dec 12, 2009)

lyric said:


> I know times are changing, but there is a general notion that a woman's virginity has strong value. She's got to lose it to a man who loves her, be "pure", wait until marriage, etc. However none of these rules apply to men, who are encouraged to lose virginity as a rite of passage. Why should a woman's virginity mean more than a man's? Why is it believed that a woman can't have emotionally detached sex like a man can?
> 
> The reason I ask this is because I could possibly lose mine soon and my mom is convinced I'll regret it. Simply due to the silly rule that girls have to lose virginity to a man who loves them.
> 
> Thoughts?


Are we talking historically or now?
Well, I guess the now does have something to do with the history.
Historically, it's because women get pregnant, so women have more to 'lose' by having casual sex and men have more to 'lose' by sleeping with someone who has casual sex, as they don't know whether the child that comes from it is really theirs.

But things have changed quite a bit - maybe more so in some places than others though.
We sadly live in a world full of idiots, and I guess part of the challenge in life is learning not to listen to them. Anybody that values female virginity or encourages male promiscuity would seem to fall into that category, but to some extent it probably does affect us still.

So why can men have emotionally detached sex and women can't?
My guess would be that it's because men are seen as sexual aggressors.
Men are violent, raping brutes while women are dainty, little flowers (slight exaggeration).
Here, female sexuality is really quite strongly encouraged through sexual education in school, in magazines, by parents ect., but studies still show that women enjoy one-night stands less than men; they feel they have been used. And while most men can enjoy them, many do note that one thing that bothered them about it, was that they felt they had used the woman.
I think that we have done a lot to get rid of the "dainty, little flower" image for women and now see them as capable, independent people who can do whatever they like, but there still is a sense of men as "violent, raping brutes" and as long as that stands, it's all too easy to feel that 'we' have used someone.

There obviously are women that enjoy casual sex and there's no reason why you couldn't be one of them, so go for it if you want to.
The question isn't whether other people will judge you for it - they have no right to a say over your sexuality - the question is whether you will judge yourself, but if you believe you won't, then there should be nothing stopping you.

(I know all this is a mix of biology and culture, but I make no attempt in this post to separate the two.)


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## Alienated (Apr 17, 2013)

When you put it like that it does sound like a double standard , men are supposed to stay virgin too. It has to do with offering yourself to the one you love, you can only do that once. It is a sign that you waited for that special one, and you have a special gift for them... male/female...

Plus God made sex to be just between husband and wife, it is the ultimate marriage between two people. The two become as one, and is a bond that should be for life. If it's cheapened like our society has done, it lost it's meaning. And the divorce rate with be like 60 %, and a tag team match. NEXT !!


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## CrimsonTrigger (Jun 28, 2011)

A lot of people here said what I was already going to say, about women having more to lose any social factors, so I'll just give my own opinions about how people see virginity and things I don't agree with.

When it comes to casual sex, the smartest people all have one thing in common, and that is they don't volunteer that information to just anybody. I've seen it on this site before where people will tell everyone that they just lost their virginity or just had sex with someone. These threads _always_ turn sour because someone has some moral issue with it or because of double standards. Like it or not, people are going to say nasty things to others, male or female, if they openly volunteer that information. That is why I've personally decided that if I ever have no strings attached sex, I'm not telling anybody. What I choose to do with someone else is between me and that person and not the business of random internet strangers or people I meet in real life.

Another thing is that virginity is more of a social construct than anything. The thing that people will tell you is that your virginity is a gift that you can only give away once, so give it to the right person. Personally, I don't agree with this at all. Let's say you decide to wait until marriage to have sex. You meet the right guy. He's everything you ever wanted in a man. You feel this man is the man you want to give you virginity to. So you get married and have sex. Well, what happens if this man suddenly becomes abusive, or reveals a side to him you never knew? What if this man was never the right man in the first place, but he only seemed like it? Sounds like a wasted gift to me. I'm not saying this happens to everybody, but it can happen.

What you do with your virginity and body is your business and yours alone. If you choose to share it, people are going to say things about it. If you keep it to yourself, then nobody can judge you for it. I don't really know why people feel the need to talk about their sexual adventures with people anyways. I'd rather have sex than talk about it, haha.

Anyways, if you do decide to go through with your plan, are you going to regret it? That's really your choice. You can choose to regret it or you can choose to be happy with it. Nobody else can make that choice for you. I simply tell people that it takes two to tango, and the actions of the other person DO affect you, so when you have sex with someone, you have to consider what kind of person they are and whether doing it with them would be worth it. Personally, I don't believe the right person _has_ to be the person you'll spend your life with, but they do need to be someone that you won't regret having sex with.

Of course, nobody is going to read this because my opinions aren't worth taking seriously 

And just something final to add, doing _anything_ in this society requires a certain degree of self-efficacy. If you just go by everything society says, then you have no self-efficacy. To do things based purely on your beliefs and not those of society takes a lot more will and courage than just blindly following society. Society provides you with shelter and security, but that doesn't mean you have to do everything it says. Sometimes the only way to be truly happy in life is to turn your back on certain things. But you _do_ have an obligation to be responsible and not hurt others. If having sex with someone isn't hurting anybody, then I really don't see any problems. But again, people are judgmental.


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## CrimsonTrigger (Jun 28, 2011)

Grand said:


> LOL.
> It doesn't.
> 
> Society is stupid.
> ...


I agree. I wouldn't tell just any woman if I was a virgin either, not unless we actually planned on having sex and she told me it wasn't important to her if I was one or not, but she was just curious. If she asked me because she cared that much, then I wouldn't have sex with her because I don't need that kind of judgment in my life. I would never treat a woman like that, so I would expect the same from them.


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## Freiheit (Dec 8, 2008)

komorikun said:


> I'm glad I didn't lose my virginity to my first boyfriend. I certainly didn't want him to think he was the only guy and that he somehow owned my sexuality. * It icks me out how some guys dig purity.*


Me too. It's creepy.


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## The Enclave (May 10, 2013)

komorikun said:


> I'm glad I didn't lose my virginity to my first boyfriend. I certainly didn't want him to think he was the only guy and that he somehow owned my sexuality. It icks me out how some guys dig purity.





> Me too. It's creepy.


It's "creepy" and "icky" that a guy's into a girl that another guy hasn't stuck his privates into? Now that's a new one.


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## Milco (Dec 12, 2009)

Grand said:


> Yeah... this is my problem with my virginity. I don't want some guy to think he "took" something from me... uke


If the guy is "saving himself" for that special someone, I can understand him preferring that his partner has done the same. I don't see that as about "taking" something as such, rather "sharing" something. It's not something I believe in personally, but I don't see anything to object to either.
But when it becomes a one-way street, where one has to live up to some standard that the other doesn't, then it becomes about "taking" and is degrading to that other person.


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## I Punt Puppies (May 6, 2013)

Well to put it bluntly, it's the reason why the two respective genders would be virgins.

A female for instance would be a virgin because, shy and doesn't go out much, she hates men, or she's waiting for marriage.

Her male counter part on the other hand would be because he's socially inept, a creepo, or women just plain don't want to **** them. There's a major difference. Even a fat chick can get a easy lay. A woman could have sex 7 days a week if she really wanted to, that's why female virginity has value. That won't no matter how liberal our society becomes because of that simple fact.


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## Persephone The Dread (Aug 28, 2010)

The Enclave said:


> The vast majority are. Moot point.


not really even those who are often break them in a variety of ways.


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## The Enclave (May 10, 2013)

Grand said:


> It's pretty ridiculous to think that a woman is worth less because she has had a penis in her vagina. Seriously...
> 
> It is creepy/icky when non-virgin men want a woman to be a virgin.


I think it's creepy for a guy to only want a women who's had another guys penis in her vagina before and the guys that actually make it a requirement that she has. It just seems a bit "off" to me that a man would prefer that she has had another guy before, I find that creepier


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## The Enclave (May 10, 2013)

Persephone The Dread said:


> not really even those who are often break them in a variety of ways.


Yeah, but he's trying to use that as a reason why it doesn't matter. Even so, it doesn't change much on how the two virginities are viewed and it probably shouldn't because at least it's viewed positively.

If anything, it's the male view of virgintiy that needs to change/improve.


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## SnowFlakesFire (Aug 23, 2012)

Because men are mean and they think women are dirty after having sex at first time. 

Effect of from angels into ****s.


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## Durzo (Jun 4, 2011)

I Punt Puppies said:


> Well to put it bluntly, it's the reason why the two respective genders would be virgins.
> 
> A female for instance would be a virgin because, shy and doesn't go out much, she hates men, or she's waiting for marriage.
> 
> Her male counter part on the other hand would be because he's socially inept, a creepo, or women just plain don't want to **** them. There's a major difference. Even a fat chick can get a easy lay. A woman could have sex 7 days a week if she really wanted to, that's why female virginity has value. That won't no matter how liberal our society becomes because of that simple fact.


Pretty much this. A girl just has to be willing.

Also I think a lot of this is from old values placed on genders because of how society worked then. Now it seems to be more that the fact girls can have sex whenever they want but guys cannot, is why it has stuck around. Which makes sense to be honest. It is a sellers market, not a buyers!

Until society, in particular men, stop glorifying sex it is not going to change any time soon. Personally I think this generation should not reproduce at all, and accept the inevitable death of our species before we disgrace ourselves further than we already have and continue to do.


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## Theillusiveman (Mar 18, 2013)

Durzo said:


> Pretty much this. A girl just has to be willing.
> 
> Also I think a lot of this is from old values placed on genders because of how society worked then. Now it seems to be more that the fact girls can have sex whenever they want but guys cannot, is why it has stuck around. Which makes sense to be honest. It is a sellers market, not a buyers!
> 
> Until societ, in particular men, stop glorifying sex it is not going to change anytime soon*. Personally I think this generation should not reproduce at all, and accept the inevitable death of our species before we disgrace ourselves further than we already have and continue to do.*


Thank god you're not king of the world then.


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## Durzo (Jun 4, 2011)

Theillusiveman said:


> Thank god you're not king of the world then.


Hey if the position existed I wouldn't want it  I would be embarrassed to be the king of this.


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## lyric (Aug 21, 2011)

CrimsonTrigger said:


> A lot of people here said what I was already going to say, about women having more to lose any social factors, so I'll just give my own opinions about how people see virginity and things I don't agree with.
> 
> When it comes to casual sex, the smartest people all have one thing in common, and that is they don't volunteer that information to just anybody. I've seen it on this site before where people will tell everyone that they just lost their virginity or just had sex with someone. These threads _always_ turn sour because someone has some moral issue with it or because of double standards. Like it or not, people are going to say nasty things to others, male or female, if they openly volunteer that information. That is why I've personally decided that if I ever have no strings attached sex, I'm not telling anybody. What I choose to do with someone else is between me and that person and not the business of random internet strangers or people I meet in real life.
> 
> ...


I did read, and I appreciate the informative advice.


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## melodielemon (Apr 30, 2013)

They want us to be all "ooh this is my first time, I've no idea what I'm doing...can you show me how it's done??" i.e. men want to feel like a SEX GURU. It gives them more power, especially if they're insecure themselves. 
They may also think that if a girl is inexperienced she will think the sex better than it actually is because its a novelty, and that will make them feel good about themselves also. Takes away the fear that she will be comparing him to others.
This is just my theory, probably a lot more intelligent answers out there, but you know...not really my area of expertise, to be honest. The stuff about the girl having more to lose also makes a lot of sense. There are a lot of explanations, but I think it all boils down to men wanting dominion and control, no matter how dormant that instinct may be lying. Again, what do I know?


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## Royals (Jul 20, 2012)

Ofcourse of what comes with becoming pregnant "by accident". One accident and it is carrying a baby 9 months in the belly and raising the baby by yourself. Guys can just drop their load easier.


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## AmandaMarie87 (Apr 24, 2013)

komorikun said:


> . It icks me out how some guys dig purity.


I agree, unless of course the guy is a virgin himself. Then that's different.


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## AmandaMarie87 (Apr 24, 2013)

Grand said:


> Yeah... this is my problem with my virginity. I don't want some guy to think he "took" something from me... uke


^ This. I feel the same way as you.


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## IveGotToast (Jan 1, 2013)

I would try to find a virgin myself because i am also a virgin. Something wouldn't seem right to me if i had sex with a girl who has had sex with 8 other guys. I suppose i might feel different if i were "experienced". But i'm out of luck because there are so few female virgins my age. I think?


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## EternallyRestless (Jul 19, 2011)

melodielemon said:


> They want us to be all "ooh this is my first time, I've no idea what I'm doing...can you show me how it's done??" i.e. men want to feel like a SEX GURU. It gives them more power, especially if they're insecure themselves.
> They may also think that if a girl is inexperienced she will think the sex better than it actually is because its a novelty, and that will make them feel good about themselves also. Takes away the fear that she will be comparing him to others.


In my experience they see teaching a girl as tedious. Guys who prefer a virgin because she can't compare him to anyone are probably insecure in their ability.


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## melodielemon (Apr 30, 2013)

EternallyRestless said:


> In my experience they see teaching a girl as tedious. Guys who prefer a virgin because she can't compare him to anyone are probably insecure in their ability.


I fail to see how teaching a girl about sex could be tedious, it's not exactly anything overly technical (is it? really?). It seems to me that they like showing her the ropes because it makes them feel like, if they are the ones who introduced her to sex, then they will have INVENTED sex, in her eyes at least. Maybe not literally, but I thought that that was kind of the general appeal. Again, I'm no expert, but...


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

Because men used to use their "pure" daughters as bait for alliances and there was less of a chance a child by a virgin would be illegitimate. Plus the whole women's worth being measured by how naive and unexposed to sexuality she was so the man who got with her would feel less insecure. A lot of men still think women who have sex outside of marriage are somehow less worthy of love or respect, my ex and his friends used to say that all the time. :| Funny how they all were completely okay with screwing anything that moved, but the blame was all on the woman, not the man.


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## melodielemon (Apr 30, 2013)

diamondheart89 said:


> Because men used to use their "pure" daughters as bait for alliances and there was less of a chance a child by a virgin would be illegitimate. Plus the whole women's worth being measured by how naive and unexposed to sexuality she was so the man who got with her would feel less insecure. A lot of men still think women who have sex outside of marriage are somehow less worthy of love or respect, my ex and his friends used to say that all the time. :| Funny how they all were completely okay with screwing anything that moved, but the blame was all on the woman, not the man.


 Agree.


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## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

That's an easy one. It's all about breeding. If a man breeds with a virgin then he knows the offspring is his. No other sperm to compete.


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## EternallyRestless (Jul 19, 2011)

melodielemon said:


> I fail to see how teaching a girl about sex could be tedious, it's not exactly anything overly technical (is it? really?). It seems to me that they like showing her the ropes because it makes them feel like, if they are the ones who introduced her to sex, then they will have INVENTED sex, in her eyes at least. Maybe not literally, but I thought that that was kind of the general appeal. Again, I'm no expert, but...


I've been told that only perverts think that way, that normal guys aren't into that.


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

melodielemon said:


> They want us to be all "ooh this is my first time, I've no idea what I'm doing...can you show me how it's done??" i.e. men want to feel like a SEX GURU. It gives them more power, especially if they're insecure themselves.


.


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## popeet (Dec 8, 2005)

diamondheart89 said:


> Because men used to use their "pure" daughters as bait for alliances and there was less of a chance a child by a virgin would be illegitimate.


and this.


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## JohnWalnut (May 2, 2012)

It's a double standard back from the days when people married before 18 and seldom divorced. Made sense back then, not so much now.


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## I Punt Puppies (May 6, 2013)

JohnWalnut said:


> It's a double standard back from the days when people married before 18 and seldom divorced. Made sense back then, not so much now.


Well the only people complaining about it is guys that can't get laid. It's not like it's that big a deal I hate to say.


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## Blue Bird (Jun 28, 2004)

The Enclave said:


> The vast majority are. Moot point.


It's also very likely to have broken your hymen by non sexual means...like using tampons or being physically active.


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## michijo (Nov 12, 2011)

It really doesn't matter. I haven't noticed it as being particularly a striking issue in my life whether or not I or anyone else was a virgin. I don't see it as being particularly meaningful if you are or are not a virgin. Its not really a big deal in the greater scheme of things. Also, I don't remember losing virginity as being a rite-of-passage issue for me as a male. I just did it, because I wanted to. There seems to be a strong desire in this forum to take away the responsibility of sexual activity, to portray people who have sex as the victims of media endorsement or cultural norms. I think that is really lame and people need to take responsibility for themselves instead of blaming external stimuli.


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## Blue Bird (Jun 28, 2004)

The Enclave said:


> It's "creepy" and "icky" that a guy's into a girl that another guy hasn't stuck his privates into? Now that's a new one.


I wonder how you feel about your own genitals. How do you feel about other people that say the same thing about you after you had sex? It's not like women that don't wait for marriage walk around covered in filth, smelly.... They can be clean and healthy like a woman that's decided to wait.

It's creepy that a guy's is into a girl because she hasn't been with a guy, like somehow he's more worthy because of it. Sometimes I think there are guys that place their own desire to be valuable and worthy on the choices that someone else has made with _their_ body, instead of focusing on themselves.


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## darthyoda (Mar 15, 2013)

Blue Bird said:


> I wonder how you feel about your own genitals. How do you feel about other people that say the same thing about you after you had sex? It's not like women that don't wait for marriage walk around covered in filth, smelly.... They can be clean and healthy like a woman that's decided to wait.
> 
> It's creepy that a guy's is into a girl because she hasn't been with a guy, like somehow he's more worthy because of it. Sometimes I think there are guys that place their own desire to be valuable and worthy on the choices that someone else has made with _their_ body, instead of focusing on themselves.


i don't want to stick my penis in to an area where other men's penises has ejaculated. its like using a secondhand condom


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Virgins are good.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

diamondheart89 said:


> Funny how they all were completely okay with screwing anything that moved, but the blame was all on the woman, not the man.


Women hold the cards.


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## To22 (Apr 6, 2012)

I personally, find moral conviction attractive and subsequently if a female holds off for moral purposes she simply seems more attractive. 

In regards to why virginity became of value in the first place, no clue.


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## caelle (Sep 9, 2008)

lyric said:


> I know times are changing, but there is a general notion that a woman's virginity has strong value. She's got to lose it to a man who loves her, be "pure", wait until marriage, etc. However none of these rules apply to men, who are encouraged to lose virginity as a rite of passage. Why should a woman's virginity mean more than a man's? Why is it believed that a woman can't have emotionally detached sex like a man can?
> 
> The reason I ask this is because I could possibly lose mine soon and my mom is convinced I'll regret it. Simply due to the silly rule that girls have to lose virginity to a man who loves them.
> 
> Thoughts?


Says who? Society? Religious folks? I could care less about them. They do not speak for me. I think everyone's virginity is important. Although at the end of the day, what someone does with their virgin genitals is not a huge concern of mine.

But if I had a son, I would definitely explain the importance of virginity and saving yourself for someone special, as I would if I had a daughter. Even with friends of mine, I would encourage them to wait for the right person. My views on sex do not differ when it comes to men and women.

I don't know what's up with your mom and the double standard. Maybe for her it's just a mom thing. She doesn't want to see her baby get hurt. My mom can be like that too.


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## Eudirya (Jan 7, 2013)

> i don't want to stick my penis in to an area where other men's penises has ejaculated. its like using a secondhand condom


hopefully you expect girls to think in the same way. they don't want a guy to stick a second hand penis, that had been in other vaginas, inside them.


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## CrimsonTrigger (Jun 28, 2011)

darthyoda said:


> i don't want to stick my penis in to an area where other men's penises has ejaculated. its like using a secondhand condom


It's not like the vagina is a pure and noble place filled with cotton candy and blankets when the girl is a virgin. Some pretty nasty stuff comes out of there, like blood, the uterine lining, children and all the goop that's expelled when those children come out, vaginal discharge. You get the idea.

It's not like women can help the way their bodies are built. And that secondhand condom argument is dumb. It's not like the semen and whatever else comes from the guys penis when he has sex with a woman stays there forever.

I always wondered if women felt weird having sex with a man who obviously stuck his penis into some other girl's vagina, but for the most part, they don't seem to care at all.


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## CrimsonTrigger (Jun 28, 2011)

Also, you guys have to understand that just because a woman isn't a virgin, it does NOT mean that she's somehow soiled or damaged goods. Some of them may have been pressured into it or did it because their self-esteem was low. Maybe she wanted to try the casual route and then realized that it wasn't for her. People make mistakes. Get over it. To dump a girl because she isn't a virgin is as stupid as a girl dumping a guy because he's shy.

Respecting women is more than just expecting them to be pure or noble. It's also about respecting their personal choices.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

If I had a daughter I'd get her a huge box of condoms (with a variety of brands) and tell her I'll bring her to the doctor to get an IUD when she is ready. I'd also tell her that she should sleep with at least 10 guys before and a have a couple relationships before getting married.


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## Beingofglass (May 5, 2013)

Well.. It just has. It is somehow linked to a healthy sense of self. There are so many small and big advantages to dating a virgin for a guy, and a man does'nt even have to be a shallow douch to appreciate most of those. Most guys just love to lead.

I wish women would feel the same way about guys that are otherwise attractive, but don't sell their body short left and right. They should.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

komorikun said:


> If I had a daughter I'd get her a huge box of condoms (with a variety of brands) and tell her I'll bring her to the doctor to get an IUD when she is ready. I'd also tell her that she should sleep with at least 10 guys before and a have a couple relationships before getting married.


So she can be just like you? :roll


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

arnie said:


> So she can be just like you? :roll


No. So she can find out what sort of guy she likes best and be safe while doing so. It would have really sucked if I married my first boyfriend. I wouldn't have discovered that other guys with different personalities can be much funner to be around and the sex can be better too. My parents never gave me birth control or anything. I'd say 10 is pretty modest number. Most women I know have had lots more than that.


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## Life Aint No Joke (Mar 8, 2013)

komorikun said:


> I'd say 10 is pretty modest number.


That's crossing into non-wifeable territory. Dead *** serious.


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## AmandaMarie87 (Apr 24, 2013)

CrimsonTrigger said:


> It's not like the vagina is a pure and noble place filled with cotton candy and blankets when the girl is a virgin. Some pretty nasty stuff comes out of there, like blood, the uterine lining, children and all the goop that's expelled when those children come out, vaginal discharge. You get the idea.
> 
> It's not like women can help the way their bodies are built. And that secondhand condom argument is dumb. It's not like the semen and whatever else comes from the guys penis when he has sex with a woman stays there forever.
> 
> I always wondered if women felt weird having sex with a man who obviously stuck his penis into some other girl's vagina, but for the most part, they don't seem to care at all.


Regarding the last paragraph, no it wouldn't make a difference to me, as long as the guy doesn't have any STDs that were aquired by sex with other women.


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## JohnWalnut (May 2, 2012)

Eudirya said:


> It's just a penis!


I'm gonna use that next time I'm streaking.


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## EternallyRestless (Jul 19, 2011)

komorikun said:


> I'd say 10 is pretty modest number. Most women I know have had lots more than that.


This is actually true. We need to realize that WE are the ones who are different, not them.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

komorikun said:


> I'd say 10 is pretty modest number. Most women I know have had lots more than that.





Life Aint No Joke said:


> That's crossing into non-wifeable territory. Dead *** serious.


I don't think I could ever trust a girl that's been with 10 guys before me. :no

At that number she's either a party girl or a serial monogamist that doesn't get attached to anyone very deeply and just goes from man to man when she gets bored of the relationship. Why would she sleep with all of those guys and then suddenly quit that lifestyle as soon as she meets you? You will spend the entire relationship worrying about everyone she talks too because you know that if someone better comes along, then it will be over just like that. That kind of paranoia isn't healthy.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

arnie said:


> I don't think I could ever trust a girl that's been with 10 guys before me. :no
> 
> At that number she's either a party girl or a serial monogamist that doesn't get attached to anyone very deeply and just goes from man to man when she gets bored of the relationship. Why would she sleep with all of those guys and then suddenly quit that lifestyle as soon as she meets you? You will spend the entire relationship worrying about everyone she talks too because you know that if someone better comes along, then it will be over just like that. That kind of paranoia isn't healthy.


It's not always easy to find a boyfriend, you know. Guys are very picky about who they commit to but will have sex with anyone half-way decent looking. When you finally get a boyfriend of course you won't be looking for another guy cause you might end up looking for years. I was never on the lookout for the next guy while in relationships.

Don't you think it's bad to marry the 1st or 2nd man/woman you meet? You'll end up wondering if there isn't something better out there. By having more experiences once you decide on that person you can be more sure that you have made the correct choice.


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## tbyrfan (Feb 24, 2011)

komorikun said:


> If I had a daughter I'd get her a huge box of condoms (with a variety of brands) and tell her I'll bring her to the doctor to get an IUD when she is ready. *I'd also tell her that she should sleep with at least 10 guys before and a have a couple relationships before getting married.*


If my mom told me to have a certain number of sex partners and relationships when I was younger, i'd feel horrible. Some women prefer not to have a lot of sex partners and won't sleep with just anyone, so 10 is a pretty steep number for them.

I remember one of my therapists told me there would be something wrong with me if I didn't have a serious boyfriend by 16. That was bad enough, lol.


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## Zeppelin (Jan 23, 2012)

komorikun said:


> Don't you think it's bad to marry the 1st or 2nd man/woman you meet? You'll end up wondering if there isn't something better out there. By having more experiences once you decide on that person you can be more sure that you have made the correct choice.


I've meet a lot of adults that have married there first girlfriend/boyfriend. And they have turned out just fine and are happy. I mean, this certainly isn't the majority, but there is nothing wrong with it. I'm not saying a person should or shouldn't marry there first boyfriend/girlfriend, but people don't need at least 10 different people just to make a decision.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

tbyrfan said:


> If my mom told me to have a certain number of sex partners and relationships when I was younger, i'd feel horrible. Some women prefer not to have a lot of sex partners and won't sleep with just anyone, so 10 is a pretty steep number for them.
> 
> I remember one of my therapists told me there would be something wrong with me if I didn't have a serious boyfriend by 16. That was bad enough, lol.


You're still very young. And 10 is not sleeping with just anyone. 1000 is sleeping with just anyone. Maybe it's bad to give an exact number or say do this by ___ age though.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Zeppelin said:


> I've meet a lot of adults that have married there first girlfriend/boyfriend. And they have turned out just fine and are happy. I mean, this certainly isn't the majority, but there is nothing wrong with it. I'm not saying a person should or shouldn't marry there first boyfriend/girlfriend, but people don't need at least 10 different people just to make a decision.


I know of a few people who ended up divorced because their partner started getting curious about sleeping with other people because they never got a chance to before marriage.

Oh yeah. There was this one woman who I worked with in Japan. She was maybe 24 or 25 and she had only had 1 boyfriend before the current one and slept with one other guy besides that. She said she was pretty sure she was going to marry the current one but wanted to just have sex with one more guy before tying the knot. So she slept with this one Japanese bartender at our job. I haven't kept in contact with her but I'm pretty sure she did marry her boyfriend.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

Grand said:


> So... what's the acceptable number of sex partners for men to have?


You're a woman, why don't you answer this question.


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## Zeppelin (Jan 23, 2012)

komorikun said:


> I know of a few people who ended up divorced because their partner started getting curious about sleeping with other people because they never got a chance to before marriage.


I don't feel the need to sleep with "x" number of people before I get married or something. I would be satisfied if I only slept with one person and married that person. I'm sure they are others that feel like this out there.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Zeppelin said:


> I don't feel the need to sleep with "x" number of people before I get married or something. I would be satisfied if I only slept with one person and married that person. I'm sure they are others that feel like this out there.


I'm sure that's what they initially thought when they got married.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

Grand said:


> I think all men should remain virgins forevermore. :yes


:wels

You've come to the right place. :yes


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## PickleNose (Jul 11, 2009)

arnie said:


> I don't think I could ever trust a girl that's been with 10 guys before me. :no
> 
> At that number she's either a party girl or a serial monogamist that doesn't get attached to anyone very deeply and just goes from man to man when she gets bored of the relationship. Why would she sleep with all of those guys and then suddenly quit that lifestyle as soon as she meets you? You will spend the entire relationship worrying about everyone she talks too because you know that if someone better comes along, then it will be over just like that. That kind of paranoia isn't healthy.


 Seriously? Sometimes I think women are too hard on men and then I see things like this.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

I don't think you have to be a party girl or a professional serial monogamist to have slept with 10 people. Let's say for example a 26 year old woman. Slept with a couple guys at 16 but that didn't turn into a relationship. Then had a 1 year relationship at 17. Ended once they went to different colleges. Slept with a couple guys at college but didn't turn into a relationship. Then had a 2 year relationship at age 19-21. Broke up with that guy and slept with a couple more guys but no relationship. Then had another relationship from age 23-26. Boom there's 9 guys. 

And most everyone is a serial monogamist until they get married (often interspersed with periods of promiscuity between relationships).

This is kind of similar to: what does it say about someone if they are 25 years old and have never had a girlfriend/boyfriend?


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## Glass Child (Feb 28, 2013)

arnie said:


> I don't think I could ever trust a girl that's been with 10 guys before me. :no
> 
> At that number she's either a party girl or a serial monogamist that doesn't get attached to anyone very deeply and just goes from man to man when she gets bored of the relationship. Why would she sleep with all of those guys and then suddenly quit that lifestyle as soon as she meets you? You will spend the entire relationship worrying about everyone she talks too because you know that if someone better comes along, then it will be over just like that. That kind of paranoia isn't healthy.


Excuse me, shouldn't this apply for men too?

But I agree anyways. Don't trust women like that with anything you have. Party girls who sleep with multiple men are just really insecure, and you can't worry about your partner being disloyal to you like that.


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## Diacetylmorphine (Mar 9, 2011)

Life Aint No Joke said:


> That's crossing into non-wifeable territory. Dead *** serious.


This.


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## PickleNose (Jul 11, 2009)

Life Aint No Joke said:


> That's crossing into non-wifeable territory. Dead *** serious.


 Sorry man but this is just disgusting.


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## Milco (Dec 12, 2009)

PickleNose said:


> Sorry man but this is just disgusting.


It's nice to know that, even though we disagree on many things, there are some areas where we can see things the same way.


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## Glass Child (Feb 28, 2013)

Milco said:


> It's nice to know that, even though we disagree on many things, there are some areas where we can see things the same way.


How come the world can't see that way?


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## Life Aint No Joke (Mar 8, 2013)

PickleNose said:


> Sorry man but this is just disgusting.





Milco said:


> It's nice to know that, even though we disagree on many things, there are some areas where we can see things the same way.


Both of you are much older than the age that most people get married at. Sure, if a woman is 30+ years old and she's had 10 partners and never been married that's fine and dandy.

If she's around my age, early 20s, hell no. All the possible reasons I could figure for her having that many partners makes her less desirable. Especially when you are talking a woman you'd consider marrying.


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## Amorphousanomaly (Jun 20, 2012)

It doesn't, you get better with practice. I lay there like a dead fish till I was in my twenties, but a decade of sexual abuse can do that to you.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Life Aint No Joke said:


> Both of you are much older than the age that most people get married at. Sure, if a woman is 30+ years old and she's had 10 partners and never been married that's fine and dandy.
> 
> If she's around my age, early 20s, hell no. All the possible reasons I could figure for her having that many partners makes her less desirable. Especially when you are talking a woman you'd consider marrying.


Milco is only 29. Most people with degrees don't get married till around then in the US. Besides most women won't tell you how many they have slept with.


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## SilentWitness (Dec 27, 2009)

VickieKitties said:


> It doesn't, you get better with practice. I lay there like a dead fish till I was in my twenties, but a decade of sexual abuse can do that to you.


:squeeze


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Sometimes I think half of SAS lives under a rock.


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## Milco (Dec 12, 2009)

komorikun said:


> Milco is only 29. Most people with degrees don't get married till around then in the US. Besides most women won't tell you how many they have slept with.


On average, women here get married when they're 33 years old and men when they're 35.

I just don't understand this puritanism.
If you sense somebody isn't ready for settling down yet and that makes you uneasy, that's completely understandable.
But if you both like each other and want to be together, I don't understand why their past matters.
I don't know if it's the thought of them with others that makes people uncomfortable or if they think a number alone says something about someone's personality.
None of us are pure, none of us can be.

So next time you're flirting with someone you really like, just try to remember they have smelly poo inside them just waiting to be let out.
And then realise that just as you normally (thankfully!) can ignore that, you can ignore their past if you just want to.


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## EternallyRestless (Jul 19, 2011)

komorikun said:


> Sometimes I think half of SAS lives under a rock.


Same. A lot of people here place all of the blame on "society" and can't admit to themselves that they're not normal. That's why I like most of your posts komorikun, at least you know what the real world is like and you don't sugar-coat things.


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## enfield (Sep 4, 2010)

EternallyRestless said:


> Same. A lot of people here place all of the blame on "society" and can't admit to themselves that they're not normal. That's why I like most of your posts komorikun, at least you know what the real world is like and you don't sugar-coat things.


oh we're talking about what we like about komorikun's posts now are we. is that what we're talking about. well good. because i have something to contribute to this discussion. i like how she posts on a thread, normally, but then comes back and adds some tangentially related story to it, many times personal but of little personal significance, but which basically comes out of nowhere. it makes me want to understand how her mind works to produce the post. i want to get inside of her head and see what it's like to be her, etc., but she's impenetrable, so i cannot.


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## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

arnie said:


> I don't think I could ever trust a girl that's been with 10 guys before me. :no
> 
> At that number she's either a party girl or a serial monogamist that doesn't get attached to anyone very deeply and just goes from man to man when she gets bored of the relationship. Why would she sleep with all of those guys and then suddenly quit that lifestyle as soon as she meets you? You will spend the entire relationship worrying about everyone she talks too because you know that if someone better comes along, then it will be over just like that. That kind of paranoia isn't healthy.


:blank


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

PickleNose said:


> Sorry man but this is just disgusting.


You've been making so much sense lately, what's going on?


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## PickleNose (Jul 11, 2009)

Life Aint No Joke said:


> Both of you are much older than the age that most people get married at. Sure, if a woman is 30+ years old and she's had 10 partners and never been married that's fine and dandy.
> 
> If she's around my age, early 20s, hell no. All the possible reasons I could figure for her having that many partners makes her less desirable. Especially when you are talking a woman you'd consider marrying.


1. How many sexual partners have you had?

2. If none or not many, how many would you have had if you could have one every night?

3. Why should women be held to higher standards? You and I both know that the vast majority of males would have sex with as many females as they could get to have sex with them.


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

Life Aint No Joke said:


> Both of you are much older than the age that most people get married at. Sure, if a woman is 30+ years old and she's had 10 partners and never been married that's fine and dandy.
> 
> If she's around my age, early 20s, hell no. All the possible reasons I could figure for her having that many partners makes her less desirable. Especially when you are talking a woman you'd consider marrying.


I understand. A *guy or girl* having 10 or more partners at my age (19) would be a turn off too. Maybe I'm just insecure but if someone used to be promiscuous, it would be kind of hard to trust that they would be all of a sudden willing to change their ways and settle down with me.


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## apx24 (Jan 31, 2012)

arnie said:


> I don't think I could ever trust a girl that's been with 10 guys before me. :no
> 
> At that number she's either a party girl or a serial monogamist that doesn't get attached to anyone very deeply and just goes from man to man when she gets bored of the relationship. Why would she sleep with all of those guys and then suddenly quit that lifestyle as soon as she meets you? You will spend the entire relationship worrying about everyone she talks too because you know that if someone better comes along, then it will be over just like that. That kind of paranoia isn't healthy.


Stop being so judgemental, guys are just as guilty of this **** as girls are. Not every single person wants a serious long term relationship.


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

apx24 said:


> Stop being so judgemental, guys are just as guilty of this **** as girls are. Not every single person wants a serious long term relationship.


Think of it the other way around. The popular jock at school who has banged half of the girls in his class wants to date one of the quiet, shy girls (who only wants a serious relationship). The likelihood of him sticking around for a serious relationship seems slim, right? I think it would be naive of her to automatically trust him.


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## apx24 (Jan 31, 2012)

mezzoforte said:


> Think of it the other way around. The popular jock at school who has banged half of the girls in his class wants to date one of the quiet, shy girls (who only wants a serious relationship). The likelihood of him sticking around for a serious relationship seems slim, right? I think it would be naive of her to automatically trust him.


I understand what you're saying, I'm starting to think I might have taken what arnie said the wrong way.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

mezzoforte said:


> Think of it the other way around. The popular jock at school who has banged half of the girls in his class wants to date one of the quiet, shy girls (who only wants a serious relationship). The likelihood of him sticking around for a serious relationship seems slim, right? I think it would be naive of her to automatically trust him.


:yes

It works both ways.


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## tbyrfan (Feb 24, 2011)

mezzoforte said:


> I understand. A *guy or girl* having 10 or more partners at my age (19) would be a turn off too. Maybe I'm just insecure but if someone used to be promiscuous, it would be kind of hard to trust that they would be all of a sudden willing to change their ways and settle down with me.


Same. I know of 2 people at my school (1 guy and 1 girl) who were promiscuous, then tried their hand at a serious relationship - both of them cheated on their partners. I'm not saying this happens to everyone, but it's hard to suddenly change one's lifestyle from promiscuity to monogamy.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

mezzoforte said:


> Think of it the other way around. The popular jock at school who has banged half of the girls in his class wants to date one of the quiet, shy girls (who only wants a serious relationship). The likelihood of him sticking around for a serious relationship seems slim, right? I think it would be naive of her to automatically trust him.


But that's different. I would be okay with someone having slept around in the past but only if they were with people not in my social circle. That would just make things uncomfortable.

And banging half the people at your school in a matter of couple years is different from sleeping with 10 people you met at different places in 5 or 10 years. I wouldn't even call 10 people in 5 years promiscuity. Not everyone you sleep with will turn into a relationship even if you want a relationship.


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

tbyrfan said:


> Same. I know of 2 people at my school (1 guy and 1 girl) who were promiscuous, then tried their hand at a serious relationship - both of them cheated on their partners. I'm not saying this happens to everyone, but it's hard to suddenly change one's lifestyle from promiscuity to monogamy.


Yeah. And I'm not saying I'd completely cancel out dating the person if they were trying to earn my trust, but I'd _definitely_ be more cautious, not to get hurt. I wouldn't just be like "Okay, I completely trust you. Have fun going out with your 40988934 female friends. ^______^"


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

komorikun said:


> But that's different. I would be okay with someone having slept around in the past but only if they were with people not in my social circle. That would just make things uncomfortable.


Yes that would be uncomfortable...



komorikun said:


> And banging half the people at your school in a matter of couple years is different from sleeping with 10 people you met at different places in 5 or 10 years. I wouldn't even call 10 people in 5 years promiscuity. Not everyone you sleep with will turn into a relationship even if you want a relationship.


Well saying half was a form of hyperbole. :b I still think 10 is a lot for a 19 year old. I know a 17 year old who has had about that many partners and it's very clear that she isn't ready for anything serious. I'm not saying I hate these people or I wouldn't have sex with them - I would just be more cautious in a serious relationship with them, than someone who has had fewer partners. And again, it could just be my insecurity.


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

You'll be amazed what you find on yahoo answers lol


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## Life Aint No Joke (Mar 8, 2013)

PickleNose said:


> 1. How many sexual partners have you had?
> 
> 3. Why should women be held to higher standards? You and I both know that the vast majority of males would have sex with as many females as they could get to have sex with them.


Four different women. Three substantially older than me.

One of which was on the regular in a "it's complicated" situation for a good six months.

I have never been the type of guy to want to have sex with as many women as possible, because the women I was with fulfilled me at the time.

I think how people have this idea of "I have to test out every damn penis and vagina in the world to know what I like" is f*cking stupid, and that's why relationships in general are so quick to fall apart.

The dudes I hang out with are dogs (they are of the type I just mentioned) and I wouldn't bet on any female having a serious relationship with them enjoying it. I don't hold females to a different standard than what I hold dudes to. Somebody that has had that many sexual partners just isn't the type that I'd consider to be good in long term relationships, male or female. That's just the way I feel.



PickleNose said:


> 2. If none or not many, how many would you have had if you could have one every night?


If I was getting laid every night, I'd rather be f*cking the same chic...every night.


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## PickleNose (Jul 11, 2009)

Life Aint No Joke said:


> I have never been the type of guy to want to have sex with as many women as possible, because the women I was with fulfilled me at the time.


 Well, again, I think most guys would disagree. Some of the things women say about men are a little unfair but we didn't get the reputation we have for nothing and I think every man is aware of this even if his own policy is different.



> I think how people have this idea of "I have to test out every damn penis and vagina in the world to know what I like" is f*cking stupid, and that's why relationships in general are so quick to fall apart.


 I don't know how you connect experimentation with relationships falling apart. Generally, when people are experimenting, they're not looking for a relationship at the same time. They're testing the waters. They want to live a little before they get tied down. Having sex with ten different people is nothing in this context. The only thing I'd be worried about would be STDs. And that's easy enough to deal with by simply getting tested.



> I don't hold females to a different standard than what I hold dudes to. Somebody that has had that many sexual partners just isn't the type that I'd consider to be good in long term relationships, male or female. That's just the way I feel.


 Well, I disagree. People are capable of (and often do) going through stages. I think that if/when someone is ready to settle down, they will. I don't think you can make a blanket rule that says "If you've had _____ many partners, you're not relationship material".



> If I was getting laid every night, I'd rather be f*cking the same chic...every night.


 At this point, I wouldn't be able to keep up with a woman who wanted to go that often. But when I was, say, 25, I could have easily gone at least 3 times a night with a different woman each time. (Note I didn't do this because I simply couldn't get laid in those days).

If I could have had many sex partners in my 20s, I probably would have. I'm still not husband/BF material and my youth is gone. I never got to explore things to the fullest.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

PickleNose said:


> Well, again, I think most guys would disagree. Some of the things women say about men are a little unfair but we didn't get the reputation we have for nothing and I think every man is aware of this even if his own policy is different.
> 
> I don't know how you connect experimentation with relationships falling apart. Generally, when people are experimenting, they're not looking for a relationship at the same time. They're testing the waters. They want to live a little before they get tied down. Having sex with ten different people is nothing in this context. The only thing I'd be worried about would be STDs. And that's easy enough to deal with by simply getting tested.
> 
> ...


I think some people are always long term relationship material and some who always aren't. There are few that actually go through stages and "settle down" eventually. Usually habits are hard to change. I think the issue is that someone like komorikun who actually wanted a relationship but the situation didn't turn out that way doesn't deserve to be labeled "not wife material" because she's had sex with more than whatever even number you decided to set the standard at. It really depends on how people behave when they're in relationships that tells me if they're marriage material or not. For example if someone was willing to cheat on their previous partner, chances are high that they will not be a good long term partner. Whatever someone was willing to do once, they are more than capable of doing again because they've already crossed that line.


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## PickleNose (Jul 11, 2009)

diamondheart89 said:


> For example if someone was willing to cheat on their previous partner, chances are high that they will not be a good long term partner. Whatever someone was willing to do once, they are more than capable of doing again because they've already crossed that line.


 Perhaps. I guess it depends on whether or not you're willing to gamble and what you feel you'll really lose if it turns out bad. Some people don't mind taking a risk on a relationship if they are really interested in the person. If it doesn't work out, they move on. Of course this gets much more complicated if you actually marry the person or have kids with them. Which is why it's probably best to try people on for a few years before you go in so deep it's impossible to completely get out.

I feel that it's crazy to meet somebody and marry them six months later. Many marriages fail because the people didn't take their time.


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## ManOfFewWords (Mar 20, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> I think some people are always long term relationship material and some who always aren't. There are few that actually go through stages and "settle down" eventually. Usually habits are hard to change. I think the issue is that someone like komorikun who actually wanted a relationship but the situation didn't turn out that way doesn't deserve to be labeled "not wife material" because she's had sex with more than whatever even number you decided to set the standard at. It really depends on how people behave when they're in relationships that tells me if they're marriage material or not. For example if someone was willing to cheat on their previous partner, chances are high that they will not be a good long term partner. Whatever someone was willing to do once, they are more than capable of doing again because they've already crossed that line.


Good point. She might be great long term relationship material, but the guys she tries to get into relationships with end up abandoning her after sex. A series of these occurrences causes her "people I've slept with" number to rise over time. That doesn't mean one should draw conclusions that she's overtly promiscuous or incapable of a long term relationship. "X" amount of partners isn't a clear measure for determining if a person is marriage material. Like you said, that can be better explained by the individual's _behavior _in a relationship.

But to be fair, when you look at it from (Life Aint No Joke)'s point of view, he's making a reasonable assumption. Say he's dating 2 prospects (late teens, early 20s), and he connects with both of them on a physical and emotional level. One of them has slept with 10+ guys in the last couple years. The other lost her virginity last year. Gun to your head, who should he pursue an exclusive relationship with, with the hopes of it being long term?


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

I'd be worried about dating a woman with a low sex drive. It seems that is very common among women. If a woman (especially if she is not a shy type) is over a certain age and virgin, I might think that she is either a prude, has sexual hangups, or simply has a low sex drive.

If you get a woman warmed up with kissing and stuff and she is able to say no to sex....then she just might not be a horny type.


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## tbyrfan (Feb 24, 2011)

komorikun said:


> I'd be worried about dating a woman with a low sex drive. It seems that is very common among women. If a woman (especially if she is not a shy type) is over a certain age and virgin, I might think that she is either a prude, has sexual hangups, or simply has a low sex drive.


What age? Before I lost it, I remember the nurse at my gynecologist asked if I was a virgin (at 20) and she was taken aback when I said yes. I feel like most people think there is something wrong with a guy or girl if they haven't had sex by 18.


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## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

tbyrfan said:


> What age? Before I lost it, I remember the nurse at my gynecologist asked if I was a virgin (at 20) and she was taken aback when I said yes. I feel like most people think there is something wrong with a guy or girl if they haven't had sex by 18.


If the person is shy and just never had an attractive person of the opposite sex make a move on them then that would be an exception. I didn't lose my virginity till I was nearly 20 simply because no attractive guy had ever made the moves on me.

If the woman is not shy then I'd say 22 or so.

Was it the same for you?


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## Insane clown (May 15, 2013)

Pretty much what they said above, good luck and just do what feels right to you.


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## Barette (Jan 17, 2012)

If a woman values her virginity and thinks of it as a defining part of who she is as a person, that's totally fine. If a guy finds his virginity precious, and would only like to date a girl who finds hers precious as well, that's fine. But I find it incredibly frustrating when people push their own sexual beliefs onto others, and then judge anybody who doesn't live up to those values. It's ridiculous. I personally don't think of virginity as having any value, nor do I think it defines a woman in any way. Anyone ever hear of the "chewing gum" metaphor? (That a girl is a piece of chewing gum, who would want one that's already used as opposed to a crisp new piece?) I mean, how insulting is that? Putting value on a girl's virginity is basically reducing her to an object. One that needs to be new and unused and "pure."

Personal TMI time, but after losing mine, and after my mom finding out (screaming tends to get the truth out) I was told I was cheapened. My own mother told me that I lost part of my worth as a woman because I didn't lose my virginity a respectable way (i.e. I am not in love). That I would now be judged by all future men for being loose. So basically, I got shamed for following normal biological urge and for enjoying it, because I apparently had some set of guidelines that I should have followed. It's disgusting, IMO, to have women believe that a part of our worth is dependent upon how we behave sexually. If we don't have this lofty value connected to our hymen or have sex with a man we are not in a relationship with, it's not because we, like men, have sexual urges and wanted to follow them. Oh no, we've just fallen prey to some big bad wolf that fooled us poor emotional women. Because we can't remain emotionless, no, we're going to fall in love because our brains are too weak and hormone-controlled to bother separating urges from affection. When I lost mine, I thought I'd suddenly be some emotional creature with these new flooding feelings, but alas, all I felt was more empowered, confident, and liberated. All dangerous feelings that should be avoided evidently, seeing as they're all invalidated by my new cheapness. (My mom didn't talk to me for 2 days and nearly hit me after finding out, said she was too ashamed to be around me. I'm still bitter as you can see)

Hell, even if you lose it to someone you care about, what if you break up? Then you've just "given" this guy a part of your worth. Maybe someone will think you should've held onto it longer, held onto it to "give" to another guy that would've cared for you more. You've just made a mistake "giving" it to a guy too prematurely, even if you thought you cared for each other. Now you're cheapened. Now you're loose. You poor little emotional creature. Now you're risking, god forbid, enjoying sex for what it is, rather than for more stereotypical reasons, like what it can give you or making a guy like you more. 

Long story short, the value we have on female virginity is insulting and demeaning and I am glad that it is becoming more and more antiquated an idea.

Edit: After reading through the thread (meaning, like, 1 1/2 pages so far) I see not many other people offered personal anecdotes or such a long-winded response. W/e, I'm just passionate.


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## arnie (Jan 24, 2012)

Barette said:


> Personal TMI time, but after losing mine...




So how was it?


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## Barette (Jan 17, 2012)

arnie said:


> So how was it?


Incredibly painful and anti-climactic. I couldn't believe that at one point I wanted to wait for someone special, for what? To help me bleed profusely and scream in pain. Funnily enough, I'd watched Cruel Intentions like a day before and it had Ryan Phillippe making passionate and sweet love to Reese Witherspoon, during which she came amongst delicately flickering candles and some smooth R&B. That's another stupid thing, movies making it seem like something so romantic and sweet which feeds into this stupid idea. In actuality, it's horrible. Like, super horrible. Made me realize all the more how stupid virginity is and how stupid this notion is that it has value.

Not to knock anyone who thinks it does, it's just my opinion. But that's enough of my TMI.


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## Elad (Dec 6, 2009)

Barette said:


> ~snip~
> 
> Edit: After reading through the thread (meaning, like, 1 1/2 pages so far) I see not many other people offered personal anecdotes or such a long-winded response. W/e, I'm just passionate.












These are the kind of posts that you read and get a tear in your eye, beautiful. Good to see its affected you positively even if the physical experience was a horror story.

Don't let the hymen hold you down.


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## Barette (Jan 17, 2012)

diamondheart89 said:


> Because men used to use their "pure" daughters as bait for alliances and there was less of a chance a child by a virgin would be illegitimate. Plus the whole women's worth being measured by how naive and unexposed to sexuality she was so the man who got with her would feel less insecure. A lot of men still think women who have sex outside of marriage are somehow less worthy of love or respect, my ex and his friends used to say that all the time. :| Funny how they all were completely okay with screwing anything that moved, but the blame was all on the woman, not the man.


So agreed.



komorikun said:


> Sometimes I think half of SAS lives under a rock.


I'm pretty sure some truly, truly do.



EternallyRestless said:


> Same. A lot of people here place all of the blame on "society" and can't admit to themselves that they're not normal. *That's why I like most of your posts komorikun, at least you know what the real world is like and you don't sugar-coat things*.


Agreed. I can pretty much know that komorikun is going to say the most honest, and right-on things.



Elad said:


> These are the kind of posts that you read and get a tear in your eye, beautiful. Good to see its affected you positively even if the physical experience was a horror story.
> 
> Don't let the hymen hold you down.


Thanks, man. That last sentence is also getting stored away as the future title of my female empowerment book that I now plan on writing.


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## thetimebeforetime (May 27, 2013)

The inquiry you should be imposing upon me is why an individual's virginity should not matter in terms of scientific publications. Afterall, when has sexual purity not been an advantage of astronomical significance? It is a promulgated fact that females with unpenetrated sexual apparatuses before the age of eighteen have been more successful later in life - they get into better colleges, have supreme salaries, and meet more robust men. On the other hand, the rotten and penetrated are destined failures. Simply take a gander at one of your fellow comrades who have been penetrated; prone to emotional detriments and fraught with failing grades, they are indeed the living manifestation of the common locution "phailing at life". 

Ostensibly, virginity before the age of eighteen is an intrinsic factor of success in numerous occasions. Consequently, it should be a determination in the success of scientific publication as well.


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## diamondheart89 (Mar 21, 2011)

thetimebeforetime said:


> The inquiry you should be imposing upon me is why an individual's virginity should not matter in terms of scientific publications. Afterall, when has sexual purity not been an advantage of astronomical significance? It is a promulgated fact that females with unpenetrated sexual apparatuses before the age of eighteen have been more successful later in life - they get into better colleges, have supreme salaries, and meet more robust men. On the other hand, the rotten and penetrated are destined failures. Simply take a gander at one of your fellow comrades who have been penetrated; prone to emotional detriments and fraught with failing grades, they are indeed the living manifestation of the common locution "phailing at life".
> 
> Ostensibly, virginity before the age of eighteen is an intrinsic factor of success in numerous occasions. Consequently, it should be a determination in the success of scientific publication as well.


LOL


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## thetimebeforetime (May 27, 2013)

diamondheart89 said:


> LOL


Have I answered your inquiry well, diamondheart89? Or do you seek another verbose demonstration?


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## Alienated (Apr 17, 2013)

I'm like Captain Kirk... " I want to go where NO Man has been before... not where every man has been before...."

It' s just really special for a woman to give herself for the first time to the man she chose. She is offering something vary special and one of a kind.


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## Milco (Dec 12, 2009)

Barette said:


> It's disgusting, IMO, to have women believe that a part of our worth is dependent upon how we behave sexually.


Disgusting indeed.
Well, if somebody (man or woman) sleeps with 5 different people in one night at a party, others might find that a bit iffy and I'm not sure that's morally wrong entirely. But within 'normal' sexual behaviour we should make it a point for it not to matter what people do.
Nobody gets cheapened (or has their value go up) by losing their virginity.
Nobody gets cheapened (or has their value go up) by kissing on the first date.
Nobody gets cheapened (or has their value go up) by having sexual urges and desires.


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## tbyrfan (Feb 24, 2011)

Barette said:


> Personal TMI time, but after losing mine, and after my mom finding out (screaming tends to get the truth out) I was told I was cheapened. My own mother told me that I lost part of my worth as a woman because I didn't lose my virginity a respectable way (i.e. I am not in love). That I would now be judged by all future men for being loose. So basically, I got shamed for following normal biological urge and for enjoying it, because I apparently had some set of guidelines that I should have followed. It's disgusting, IMO, to have women believe that a part of our worth is dependent upon how we behave sexually.





Barette said:


> Incredibly painful and anti-climactic. I couldn't believe that at one point I wanted to wait for someone special, for what? To help me bleed profusely and scream in pain.


I'm sorry your mom behaved like that towards you. I'm glad that you felt confident afterwards, though. Don't let skewed beliefs like those ever make you feel ashamed of yourself.

Sorry that your first experience was so painful, too. I think that in most cases, no matter who it's with, losing it is either painful or awkward. (Luckily, it gets so much better after the first time. ) I would guess that it's almost never a magical, perfect night (complete with mood-lighting, rose petals, and candles). :lol


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## au Lait (Sep 8, 2010)

Value, as a concept, is largely a social construct. Society must agree that something has a certain level of value before it can be deemed "valuable". This applies to virginity as well. The idea that a woman must be "sexually pure" in order to have any value is simply another way to control female sexuality. The policing of women's sexuality is something that has been happening for decades in various forms.

People use biological determinism as the fall-back reasoning here, but that excuse seems patently false to me. If the idea is that the desire to reproduce trumps all logic and reason, then it would make sense that women would be encouraged to have more sex rather than less, as a way to increase their chances of becoming pregnant. The fact that the opposite belief is considered to be true indicates that the value which is place on a woman's virginity is cultural rather than biological.


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## The Silent 1 (Aug 21, 2011)

Aside from some of the reasons already mentioned, I think it was a way for men to ensure that their children were actually theirs. They may have viewed a woman who sought sex purely for pleasure as risky or not wife material because they were afraid that they might cheat on them and have another man's children. I think a lot of men's attempts to control women in the past was based on this.


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## CrimsonTrigger (Jun 28, 2011)

Barette said:


> Long story short, the value we have on female virginity is insulting and demeaning and I am glad that it is becoming more and more antiquated an idea.


Cut out most of it to save on space, but I agree with everything you said and the last sentence especially echoes what I believe. Everybody is different and I don't feel that we have the right to judge everybody because of their personal choices.


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## BrookeHannigan (Mar 29, 2012)

It is?
Most guys here always say they would never want a virgin and prefer experienced girls :um


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## vulgarrobot (Jul 23, 2012)

au Lait said:


> The idea that a woman must be "sexually pure" in order to have any value is simply another way to control female sexuality.


yup


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## CrimsonTrigger (Jun 28, 2011)

I feel as if those feelings that many women claim you will get after losing your virginity are mainly fueled by your feelings before you do it. They'll always tell you to wait for the right person, but I feel like only the individual is capable of deciding who that right person is. If a girl is unsure about Jim Douchebag who lives across the street and she decides to lose it to him, maybe she would feel a lot of regret over it. But if she was confident enough to approach some guy she liked and respected enough, even if she wasn't going to be in a relationship with him, then maybe she wouldn't get those same feelings of regret.


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## EternallyRestless (Jul 19, 2011)

CrimsonTrigger said:


> I feel as if those feelings that many women claim you will get after losing your virginity are mainly fueled by your feelings before you do it. They'll always tell you to wait for the right person, but I feel like only the individual is capable of deciding who that right person is. If a girl is unsure about Jim Douchebag who lives across the street and she decides to lose it to him, maybe she would feel a lot of regret over it. But if she was confident enough to approach some guy she liked and respected enough, even if she wasn't going to be in a relationship with him, then maybe she wouldn't get those same feelings of regret.


Yeah, I've always felt that the feelings you have afterward are just an extension of the feelings you had before hand. If you don't have feelings for someone to start with, I don't see why you would suddenly fall in love with them after their genitals touched yours.


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## Barette (Jan 17, 2012)

tbyrfan said:


> I'm sorry your mom behaved like that towards you. I'm glad that you felt confident afterwards, though. Don't let skewed beliefs like those ever make you feel ashamed of yourself.
> 
> Sorry that your first experience was so painful, too. I think that in most cases, no matter who it's with, losing it is either painful or awkward. (Luckily, it gets so much better after the first time. ) I would guess that it's almost never a magical, perfect night (complete with mood-lighting, rose petals, and candles). :lol


Thanks, it helped me actually. Made me realize I don't actually care about what she thinks, that I don't really care what anybody thinks anymore. If I'm a cheap girl, then so be it, because I'm having a good time and that's all I care about. Why deny myself that because someone out there might look down on me for it. **** 'em. I'm not going to compromise my enjoyment in the present, just to appease some theoretical man in the future.

And I know, right? Virginity is horrible and awkward and crappy, IMO it's the farthest thing from a special moment. It's like trying to scratch your intestines with a sharpened cactus. If that's someone's idea of special, then more power to them. But no matter who it's with, it's awkward, I totally don't get the idea that it's magical or mystical or w/e. Or that by experiencing that awkwardness while in love, you're a better person than if you experienced it by just getting it over with. But I guess some girls dream about that, and while I don't understand it, I can respect it. Lose it however you want to lose it, just don't judge someone else cause they didn't do it the same way you did. (general "you", btw, lol).



Milco said:


> Disgusting indeed.
> Well, if somebody (man or woman) sleeps with 5 different people in one night at a party, others might find that a bit iffy and I'm not sure that's morally wrong entirely. But within 'normal' sexual behaviour we should make it a point for it not to matter what people do.
> Nobody gets cheapened (or has their value go up) by losing their virginity.
> Nobody gets cheapened (or has their value go up) by kissing on the first date.
> Nobody gets cheapened (or has their value go up) by having sexual urges and desires.


I really don't understand why people give a **** about other people's sex lives in the first place. I know that it stems from their own insecurities, but I don't see how they can have so little self-awareness to not recognize that fact. Like my old roommates judged other girls as ****s/hos/whatevs, but that's cause they were raised to be ashamed of their sexuality (parents were SUPER conservative Christians), so they thought other girls should be ashamed as well. People just seem to always have their nose up everyone else's genitals. As long as it's consensual, who cares.



Alienated said:


> I'm like Captain Kirk... " I want to go where NO Man has been before... not where every man has been before...."
> 
> It' s just really special for a woman to give herself for the first time to the man she chose. She is offering something vary special and one of a kind.


I never understood this, I understand it's a "no turning back" type thing, once it's gone it's gone, but every single girl on Earth is born a virgin. Being a virgin can't be special or one of a kind when literally every person on Earth spends a part of their life as one. Whether it's taken from them too soon, or they can't get rid of it soon enough, we all spend time as one. But eh, that's my opinion.


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