# What would you do if a therapist told you things like...



## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

_I don't know if I can help you, some people simply cannot be helped._ (-> by saying this he basically pushes all responsibility to help you away and blames the patient for the failure of the therapy. It's never his fault but only the patient's fault cause some patients simply don't want to get well.. I think this is total BS. This way psychologists can always get away with anything even if they suck they can always blame the patient and think that he simply didn't want to get better)

or

_I have the feeling that you actually like your fear and don't want to let go._

In my opinion such statements are a real offense and red flag. How do you see this?


----------



## artistgyrrl (Oct 26, 2010)

No one is gonna be able to "fix" you but you. The psychs and therapists are there to guide you and give advice, you have to do the work. So the statement is dead on. A lot of people expect others to do it for them or they just stop because its uncomfortable and work. 

After a time they can generally spot the ones who are ready to help themselves and those who are looking for others to do it for them. They will try to lead the ones who don't want to do it themselves but I'm assuming its rare those people pick up and realize that they are the only ones who can change it. Not doctors, pills etc.


----------



## katiebird (Sep 25, 2011)

I agree with Dragonflight, I mean the whole point of taking therapy is to help yourself in the first place so technically you're still making a first step to help yourself. The reason for being a therapist is that he/she should want to help people get through whatever they need and continue to try their best to give advice or simply talk about things, or guide them into different techniques. Even if he/she has a difficult client it's their job to keep positive and help you out even if at times they feel that "some people cannot be helped" they should never admit it to their patient it's just unprofessional and frankly rude... But I still support the belief that there is some truth to that statement, input=output right, and maybe your therapist said that to try and give you a harsh realization or something.. I guess the point i'm trying to make is that deep down only you can control yourself and reach your goals, a therapist is there to guide you and not give up when times are tough for the patient, but it's really up to you to see if it helps for you or not. everyone's different, sometimes therapy is good but it doesn't help for everybody, and it's up to you to make that decision but that doesn't mean you're not trying or that your just hopeless.... But now to answer the real question personally yes I'd take this as a red flag. I wouldn't give up on therapy just yet though, find another one and see how that goes. If you're finding it doesn't really help you out in anyway after awhile, perhaps start to look into something new.


----------



## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

I think this is just a lame excuse. For me this is a red flag if a therapist says stuff like some people simply cannot be helped. This says a lot about himself in my opinion. 
The patient could as well say some therapists simply suck and cannot help people get well because their advice suck.

And saying stuff like you want to be afraid is totally offensive and stupid. Who would go to a therapist if he wants to be afraid? Seriously, when I hear crap like this it angers me a lot.


----------



## Pam (Feb 14, 2009)

Maybe I'm in the minority, but those comments really piss me off too. Especially the one saying you must LIKE whatever it is that's wrong with you. That's so insulting....people don't say that about any other negative thing in life! 

And the first comment about some people just cannot be helped--yeah, maybe with their particular techniques. That doesn't mean a person can get help from somewhere or someone else. I really don't like that comment--it's like they are trying to cover their asse before or in case they fail with you. So it IS more a reflection on them, not us. It also implies blame, which is not what they get paid to do--they get paid to help!


----------



## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

Pam said:


> Maybe I'm in the minority, but those comments really piss me off too. Especially the one saying you must LIKE whatever it is that's wrong with you. That's so insulting....people don't say that about any other negative thing in life!
> 
> And the first comment about some people just cannot be helped--yeah, maybe with their particular techniques. That doesn't mean a person can get help from somewhere or someone else. I really don't like that comment--it's like they are trying to cover their asse before or in case they fail with you. So it IS more a reflection on them, not us. It also implies blame, which is not what they get paid to do--they get paid to help!


I totally agree with you. When he said this stuff about some people simply can't get helped the thing was basically over for me. I don't think I will be seeing him again. I have no interest at all to sit there and even talk to him anymore. I was really fired up in the beginning but I quickly realized that this is going nowhere. 
Also, how can you tell someone who has fears that he actually likes his fears and doesn't want to give them up? I cannot even comprehend how a professional could say something like this. This is really beyond me. :mum


----------



## JaneSmith (Dec 13, 2011)

Even therapists aren't perfect. But have you looked at the possibility that you're not being completely honest and open about why you are in therapy?


----------



## The Professor (Jul 31, 2011)

norad said:


> _I don't know if I can help you, some people simply cannot be helped._ (-> by saying this he basically pushes all responsibility to help you away and blames the patient for the failure of the therapy. It's never his fault but only the patient's fault cause some patients simply don't want to get well.. I think this is total BS. This way psychologists can always get away with anything even if they suck they can always blame the patient and think that he simply didn't want to get better)
> 
> or
> 
> ...


I was told the same exact thing. I went to a lcsw so she wasn't an actual docotr in the first place. But I had hw to do and it was just too hard... if I could go up to a girl and ask her how her day has been (which is lame in the first place) then I wouldn't be in here asking for help!


----------



## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

JaneSmith said:


> Even therapists aren't perfect. But have you looked at the possibility that you're not being completely honest and open about why you are in therapy?


Oh please. Do you think I drag my *** out of the bed go to a therapist, even pay him with own money, because I like being afraid? Give me a break!
This is totally offensive and angers me. I have suffered from various fears since I was a child. But of course it's easy to come up with crap like this and then feel like you're the super psychologist who figures everything out and who can read people's minds. :mum


----------



## JaneSmith (Dec 13, 2011)

norad said:


> Oh please. Do you think I drag my *** out of the bed go to a therapist, even pay him with own money, because I like being afraid? Give me a break!
> This is totally offensive and angers me. I have suffered from various fears since I was a child. But of course it's easy to come up with crap like this and then feel like you're the super psychologist who figures everything out and who can read people's minds. :mum


Sorry, didn't mean to offend. I didn't mention being affraid... but you mentioned fears twice. Is that your therapy need?


----------



## UltraShy (Nov 8, 2003)

norad said:


> _I don't know if I can help you, some people simply cannot be helped._
> 
> _I have the feeling that you actually like your fear and don't want to let go._


I wouldn't have a problem with the first statement if it stood alone. After all the first statement is factually accurate. Not everybody gets better.

Though when you toss in the second statement it adds to the context and gives me a pretty good idea of the attitude & tone this therapist had. An attitude that would make me want to tell him to go f*** himself.


----------



## Philosophical Ponderer (Apr 29, 2011)

I can somewhat see the reasoning behind his second statement, although what "fear" he is referring to obviously could change the meaning. But as far as social anxiety goes, can any of us really deny that we "like" the feeling of avoiding "possible rejection" when we decide not to engage in social activies? Yes, in hindsight we may regret it and may genuinely want to change, but the fact is we find it more comfortable to avoid social situations than to jump into them. Thus you could argue that we "like our fear" in the moment as it is what makes us comfortable. 
So whether or not the statement was applicable to you I dont know, but if you try looking at it from a different angle I can see it as a helpful statement. Though as with everything in therapy, timing is important.


----------



## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

As an example. Imagine you are totally afraid of taking the practical test for your driver's license then you can fear not only that you're not good enough and fail but even if you practice a lot and are well prepared then there is still the problem of not being able to deal with the pressure and simply failing. Under fear things which are usually no problem to you can suddenly be a huge problem. Imagine you walk on a 10 inch wide line. That's no problem. Usually you could do that for hours without stepping off it. But now imagine you walk on a 10 inch wide wood across a waterfall and then it's a whole different situation. I was trying to get this across to him that the fear of the fear is also a problem for me and then he told me this crap that he has the feeling that I like being afraid. :mum


----------



## Invisiblehandicap (Jul 31, 2011)

If I was in therapy, I would think: what an idiot! I'm paying for this? Why the hell would someone like feeling bad, being embarrassed, being unhappy etc. Same argument as people who are depressed want to be depressed. You could get an ignorant person to tell you this for free.


Obviously he hasn't bothered to read a single book on anxiety disorders. Anxiety is a self defense mechanism, not a conscious choice. The OP needs to register the anxiety as harmful rather than good.

Get a new shrink, one that has dealt with SA patients before.


----------



## Green Eyes (Sep 6, 2009)

norad said:


> _I have the feeling that you actually like your fear and don't want to let go._
> 
> In my opinion such statements are a real offense and red flag. How do you see this?


One therapist has said something like that to me. It's really not fun hearing that. That she thinks I like having no friends, school, work. That I like being home almost all the time. But she was a worthless therapist, at least with someone that has sa. She obvious doosn't knew much about it.

The first time I was really in therapy (16 years old) was groupstherapy and there you also had one-to-one therapy once every few weeks. And at the last session with my therapist there, she told me that I might need intensive therapy (then you stay 5 days a week in a house with others and in the weekends you're at home) and if after that I would still have anxiety I might need help for the rest of my life. And that I would need to life with help (so never on my own).
I really didn't like hearing that. It made me so angry. But of course I was afraid to say anything.

But now, 6 years later, I know she was just a totally stupid therapist. I can do a lot of thinks. I now I can live on my own. The only problem is my anxiety. And now it's to much. I can't work, too much anxiety.
But I haven't got the right help. All those therapist were stupid. They didn't knew how to help someone that has sa. Now I have a good therapist who knows about sa.


----------



## Monroee (Aug 26, 2009)

It really angers me to hear that. I'm in agreement with the OP about this one. Even if it puts me in the minority.

My first therapist was a very young woman who was just into the profession. She admitted that she couldn't help me. But she didn't say ANYTHING resembling what your therapist has said, OP. The woman I went to simply admitted that she wasn't specialized enough to handle my case. That I was too complicated & complex for her current understanding. She then continued to ask if I wanted a referral to a better therapist/doctor. I declined at the time but I appreciated the honesty on her part. & The tact.

The fact isn't that one is impossible to fix or doomed to be this way forever. The fact is - that therapist is not specialized enough to handle more complex cases. & I do know - like the others are saying - that one needs to fix themselves in the end. But some people, like myself & probably the OP, need a professional to help them do that. I've been to the hospital twice due to suicide attempts & mania. I have a lot of complicated problems that my therapist has no idea how to help or even start to help. Turns out - oen of the psychiatrists at the hospital said he wanted to take my case in his private practice. He viewed me as a challenge that he was willing to take on. I'm not sure if that should be taken as a nice thing or not. But I do know that this doctor is very skilled & turns out, I'm seeing him tomorrow for the first session.

OP - Don't give up hope. Just find another, more specialized, therapist/doctor.


----------



## nerdybunny (Nov 12, 2011)

norad said:


> _I don't know if I can help you, some people simply cannot be helped._ (-> by saying this he basically pushes all responsibility to help you away and blames the patient for the failure of the therapy. It's never his fault but only the patient's fault cause some patients simply don't want to get well.. I think this is total BS. This way psychologists can always get away with anything even if they suck they can always blame the patient and think that he simply didn't want to get better)
> 
> or
> 
> ...


I'm not saying this was right of your therapist to do, but I will tell you that my therapist said the same things to me because she thought I was whining too much and wanted to challenge me to look at what was holding me back in a specific area we were working on. She wanted me to work on seeing what was rational or not about my thought processes around the situation and to ask me how I was going to move on. She told me that the job of a therapist is to teach you how to become your own therapist. The techniques your therapist is using most likely aren't helpful for you.


----------



## Still Waters (Sep 18, 2008)

Hmmm...I think I'd be tempted to say "Well then,I don't think I'll be able to cover that check I just wrote you."


----------



## Hiccups (Jul 15, 2011)

some therapist just flat out suck, shop around.... don't settle for the first one you come across. If you find one that is not clicking with you then just get up and leave and try another. Just because they have a framed certificate on their wall doesn't make them infallible.


----------



## mreynolds102787 (Feb 4, 2011)

My therapist.. flagged my file and went I went to schedule an appointment( haven't gone in a year) they receptionist said I had to talk to the therapist first... So I waited a week( she was on vacation). Tried again.. still not in the office so I asked to go ahead a schedule. They informed me the reason she flagged me is because I missed an appointment and she was unsure whether she would see me again! So we scheduled( I was anxious and on the spot at that point) and she told me she would call me to make sure it was okay and she would actually see me. 

So now I'm looking for a new therapist... I WILL NOT go back there now. She is well aware that I struggle with SA and clearly isn't that worried about helping me. I wasn't a fan of her anyways. I think I had a total of three sessions with her. She kept wanting to talk about breathing techniques to "help" me during a panic attack. When I have panic attacks... it is usually because I am in a public place, crowds, on the spot, speaking, or talking to someone... NOT the kind of place to start breathing weird and drawing even more attention to myself. The ONLY thing I'm capable of doing/trying to do during a panic attack is trying to gain control of myself and not look like a complete weirdo.


----------

