# Sometimes as an Atheist I'm afraid to tell people when I'm feeling down



## annoyedgrunt84 (Nov 14, 2013)

I'm afraid they will try to evangelize me, you know "what you really need is god in your life".


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## Xenos (Jun 24, 2012)

Yeah, I can relate to this. It's like I'm afraid that admitting any weakness or vulnerability will call into question every aspect of my identity and all my choices. It goes beyond the atheism/faith issue, but that's one dimension of it. Which is terrible, because it makes me reluctant to seek help and support when I know I need it.

My guess is that it's mostly insecurity, an internalization of past bullying and so forth. In my adult life nobody has tried to use my personal problems to their advantage in debates or attempts at evangelism. I've certainly never experienced it on this forum; most people seem to understand that would be _way _out of bounds. Not saying it never happens, just that it hasn't happened to me recently.


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## inerameia (Jan 26, 2012)

Me too. My dad's family is super religious. I wonder if it's a mental disorder because their solution for everything is religion. It's pretty revolting.


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## Richard Pawgins (Jul 11, 2013)

my friend claims my depression stems from demons and that only Jesus can save me

I made a thread about it a few months back

We're cursed because we dont believe in things that don't exist apparently.

http://www.socialanxietysupport.com...-claims-that-my-depression-stems-from-532321/


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## eukz (Nov 3, 2013)

Well, you can see there still are a lot of religious people having addictions, bad luck and freaky problems. Unlike God, the universe is pretty fair with everyone.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

annoyedgrunt84 said:


> I'm afraid they will try to evangelize me, you know "what you really need is god in your life".


That's sad and unfortunate you live in a society where that happens. Where i'm from we help people using rationality, be it family/peer support or if more serious professional referral.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

Xenos said:


> Yeah, I can relate to this. It's like I'm afraid that admitting any weakness or vulnerability will call into question every aspect of my identity and all my choices. It goes beyond the atheism/faith issue, but that's one dimension of it. Which is terrible, because it makes me reluctant to seek help and support when I know I need it.


Sorry to hear that.



> My guess is that it's mostly insecurity, an internalization of past bullying and so forth. In my adult life nobody has tried to use my personal problems to their advantage in debates or attempts at evangelism. I've certainly never experienced it on this forum; most people seem to understand that would be _way _out of bounds. Not saying it never happens, just that it hasn't happened to me recently.


Well that's good at least that people aren't preying on your insecurities. You certainly come across here as a very intelligent, confident and assured person so if your anything like that in person I doubt anyone would try and take advantage of you.

People prey on the weak and gullible, not the strong and rational.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

Peregrínus said:


> Me too. My dad's family is super religious. I wonder if it's a mental disorder because their solution for everything is religion. It's pretty revolting.


Religious belief in our species is ubiquitous enough to indicate it's not a disorder, but it is arguably an undesirable mental state.


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## Meli24R (Dec 9, 2008)

I fear the same. Also my sister has schizophrenia and I avoid talking about her to anyone outside of my family. I've had people tell me that they think she may be possessed by demons or that she sees dead people. Sometimes I feel like I'm living in the twilight zone because so many people believe this kind of bull****.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

Meli24R said:


> I fear the same. Also my sister has schizophrenia and I avoid talking about her to anyone outside of my family. I've had people tell me that they think she may be possessed by demons or that she sees dead people. Sometimes I feel like I'm living in the twilight zone because so many people believe this kind of bull****.


Sorry to hear that. That's incredibly abusive of them.


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## inerameia (Jan 26, 2012)

ugh1979 said:


> Religious belief in our species is ubiquitous enough to indicate it's not a disorder, but it is arguably an undesirable mental state.


Eh, but look at what causes religion. You should watch Robert Sapolsky's biology of religion (if you haven't already); it's on YouTube.

I actually regretfully used to have knee-jerk religion solutions for people who were suffering too.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

Peregrínus said:


> Eh, but look at what causes religion. You should watch Robert Sapolsky's biology of religion (if you haven't already); it's on YouTube.


I'm aware of how and why religious beliefs form, but what about it?



> I actually regretfully used to have knee-jerk religion solutions for people who were suffering too.


What knee-jerk solution am I proposing?


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## Ironyinivory (Nov 23, 2013)

haha yeah a lot of people have tried to convert me. Its sort of annoying but they have good intentions.


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## inerameia (Jan 26, 2012)

ugh1979 said:


> I'm aware of how and why religious beliefs form, but what about it?


If it's caused by mental illness then I suppose it is an undesirable mental state/belief for normal people. Maybe it can be considered delusional thinking.



ugh1979 said:


> What knee-jerk solution am I proposing?


? Nothing. I was just talking about myself.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

Peregrínus said:


> If it's caused by mental illness then I suppose it is an undesirable mental state/belief for normal people. Maybe it can be considered delusional thinking.


Yes for people who aren't religious it's often thought of as delusional thinking. As I say though, I don't think it can be called a mental illness, despite there sometimes being correlations with mental illness.



> ? Nothing. I was just talking about myself.


OK. You said, "too", which made me think you were talking about me as well.


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## inerameia (Jan 26, 2012)

ugh1979 said:


> Yes for people who aren't religious it's often thought of as delusional thinking. As I say though, I don't think it can be called a mental illness, despite there sometimes being correlations with mental illness.
> 
> OK. You said, "too", which made me think you were talking about me as well.


Because it's too common? Maybe 'mental pandemic' is more accurate.

I didn't mean it that way. I said "too" to indicate an addition separate from what I said to you.


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

Peregrínus said:


> Because it's too common? Maybe 'mental pandemic' is more accurate.


The fact that it's so common means it could well be that it's an evolved trait, so not indicative of a disorder.



> I didn't mean it that way. I said "too" to indicate an addition separate from what I said to you.


Yeah fair enough, just an interpretation confusion.


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## Xenos (Jun 24, 2012)

ugh1979 said:


> Sorry to hear that.
> 
> Well that's good at least that people aren't preying on your insecurities. You certainly come across here as a very intelligent, confident and assured person so if your anything like that in person I doubt anyone would try and take advantage of you.
> 
> People prey on the weak and gullible, not the strong and rational.


I missed this, and I want to thank you for it. It means a lot for me to hear that, for real.


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## Richard Pawgins (Jul 11, 2013)

Meli24R said:


> I fear the same. Also my sister has schizophrenia and I avoid talking about her to anyone outside of my family. I've had people tell me that they think she may be possessed by demons or that she sees dead people. Sometimes I feel like I'm living in the twilight zone because so many people believe this kind of bull****.


 If you're parents were deeply religious they'd probably consider an exorcism over real professional help this is the country that we live in.


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## Irvy (Nov 27, 2013)

that's why i don't really tell anyone about it


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## Richard Pawgins (Jul 11, 2013)

God makes people feel good. Its understandable. Whenever I read or hear stories from the old testament I'm actually frightened though. Dude is a sick egomaniac in their book


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## fury5 (Nov 11, 2013)

This is essentially why I've stopped talking to my father about anything.


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## hazelblue (Jun 6, 2012)

This is my exact problem as well. I can't look for support from my family because I would have already welcomed the devil into my life through atheism.


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## WTFnooooo (Mar 27, 2010)

Why would anyone in their right mind go seek advice from people who have imaginary friends?


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## beli mawr (Dec 18, 2013)

I have read plenty of "studies" that connect a disbelief in a "higher power" to depression and anti-social behavior. A few people I have met online expressed the same. It seems that to them we don't have something to believe in so we must be abnormal.

To the OP, love your forum ncik... d'oh!


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## Richard Pawgins (Jul 11, 2013)

WTFnooooo said:


> Why would anyone in their right mind go seek advice from people who have imaginary friends?


the large majority of U.S citizens are religious. Non religious are still the minority


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## WTFnooooo (Mar 27, 2010)

Richard Pawgins said:


> the large majority of U.S citizens are religious. Non religious are still the minority


I should have stated that the particular advice sought was psychological, not simply any advice.

I wouldn't seek emotional advice from someone who finds emotional consolation from an imaginary friend.


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## AlienJay (Dec 13, 2013)

Damn I'm sorry you feel that way. You can talk to me man!


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## owls (Oct 23, 2010)

I totally feel you.


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## Morumot (Sep 21, 2011)

If it makes you feel any better, I believe the high and mighty FSM will guide you and you will be touched by his noodly appendages.


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## annoyedgrunt84 (Nov 14, 2013)

I've still never really told many of my family members I have given up my faith. I'm afraid they would mock me or make fun of me at the least, and I don't think I'm totally out of line to think my sister would forbid me from seeing my nieces which would be almost too much for me to bear.


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## shyguyred (Jul 26, 2013)

Morumot said:


> If it makes you feel any better, I believe the high and mighty FSM will guide you and you will be touched by his noodly appendages.


Ramen brother!


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## RobAlister (Apr 4, 2010)

Agreed. I want real advice, not "god loves you". Even if I believed in god I'd still find that advice lacking in substance.


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## DyingBreed (Jan 19, 2014)

*I hear you completely*

For my part, I don't care if people start spurting their 'convert ye' speech, but I'm too afraid to confirm any prejudices the religious have about atheists (we're emotionally weak / atheism=a bleak outlook on life /etc.) Of course, not sharing my true feelings and feeling like a social pariah make it hard not to fit their stereotypes. I have a similar problem as a vegan - I purposefully gained weight when I made the switch because people would overlook the fact I had always been underweight and claim I was proof that veganism was unhealthy. Unfortunately I didn't do it the right way, ended up with a binge-eating disorder, and now am overweight and again afraid that I'm "proof" veganism is bad.



ugh1979 said:


> Religious belief in our species is ubiquitous enough to indicate it's not a disorder


I have to disagree here. First, we have to define 'disorder,' I'm assuming your definition would be maladaptive over the course of evolution. I don't like this definition though... it doesn't take into account the well-being of the person or the world around them (or in this case the accuracy of their beliefs), it only looks at how well the trait spreads through the population. This can mean that the benefits of the trait to one's propagation outweigh the costs, or that the trait is entirely costly but linked to other traits that have greater benefits. For example, traits that accelerate aging or lead to geriatric diseases can still be "adaptive" due to increased fertility/strength/etc, and the tendency toward war and violence is clearly adaptive so long as it is mostly aimed at non-relatives and not punished by society. So religion could lead to faulty thinking, even mental illness in the extremes (and of course warring between groups) but still be "adaptive" if the benefits of a sense of community etc. outweigh the costs. I personally believe the traits that lead toward superstition (e.g. mental heuristics) were adaptive, allowing religion to spread like wildfire through people's brains, and then because it was so ubiquitous, it became maladaptive to not conform (due to ostracism/fewer mating opportunities), so religion is in a way selecting for itself. Religiosity is still a disorder, but the overwhelming number of those 'suffering' said disorder makes it more maladaptive to NOT have the disorder, and so it continues to prevail through the population.

What was that I said about not wanting to appear bleak? Haha oh well...


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## ugh1979 (Aug 27, 2010)

DyingBreed said:


> I have to disagree here. First, we have to define 'disorder,' I'm assuming your definition would be maladaptive over the course of evolution. I don't like this definition though... it doesn't take into account the well-being of the person or the world around them (or in this case the accuracy of their beliefs), it only looks at how well the trait spreads through the population. This can mean that the benefits of the trait to one's propagation outweigh the costs, or that the trait is entirely costly but linked to other traits that have greater benefits. For example, traits that accelerate aging or lead to geriatric diseases can still be "adaptive" due to increased fertility/strength/etc, and the tendency toward war and violence is clearly adaptive so long as it is mostly aimed at non-relatives and not punished by society. So religion could lead to faulty thinking, even mental illness in the extremes (and of course warring between groups) but still be "adaptive" if the benefits of a sense of community etc. outweigh the costs. I personally believe the traits that lead toward superstition (e.g. mental heuristics) were adaptive, allowing religion to spread like wildfire through people's brains, and then because it was so ubiquitous, it became maladaptive to not conform (due to ostracism/fewer mating opportunities), so religion is in a way selecting for itself. Religiosity is still a disorder, but the overwhelming number of those 'suffering' said disorder makes it more maladaptive to NOT have the disorder, and so it continues to prevail through the population.
> 
> What was that I said about not wanting to appear bleak? Haha oh well...


Indeed I should have added that it can be considered a disorder when certain definitions of a disorder are being applied.


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## Mikebissle (Oct 24, 2011)

Same here; it's why I stopped talking to my family about personal issues.My mother in particular used to be (and probably still is) upset that I don't come to her, but why bother if the answer to everything is God?


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