# Ethylphenidate



## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

So I got some EPD a few weeks ago and have been taking it every day. I have pretty bad ADHD and have had no diagnosis as of yet and have never tried any of the official meds for it. I mixed the pure powder with ground sugar to make it easier to measure out a dose and have been taking roughly 5 mg per dose. It lasts roughly 2 hours and at this dose there were no after effects and no side effects to speak of.

It has worked wonders for my ADHD. I have been super productive for the last couple of weeks and it seems the longer I take it the more focused and motivated I become. My thinking is clearer and I find myself becoming preoccupied with things I realy should be doing when I am procrastinating - so I procrastinate less. It is wonderful and the effectiveness of it has made me even more certain that I have ADHD. No tolerance has developed at this dose and no insomnia. Even my SA has began to come into line, possibly owing to the clearheadedness that I now enjoy. 

I ran out a couple of days ago and am missing it dearly. I did not feel the need to(nor did I) drink any coffee while using EPD. Caffeine is a liar anyway. It promises so much but lets me down when I need it most. I wonder if the caffeine has effected my anxiety too. Perhaps not having any caffein in my system is the reason my SA has diminished. IDK. I have placed another order for this wonderful chemical and hope to be as productive for the rest of the year, if not more so...


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## GotAnxiety (Oct 14, 2011)

Wow, you can buy 1kg bag for 5,250 dollar's! lol how much did you pay for your's?


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

I don't want to break the rules so let's just say I ordered less that 1kg and paid less than 5 grand...


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

I should also point out that I had been placing the doses between my lower lip and gum and allowing it to absorb that way. It doesn't work when swallowed and the nasal membranes don't take too kindly to it...


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## swim (Apr 4, 2011)

Is it a stimulant like Ritalin? What's its commercial name?


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

I was under the impression that it was just a more euphoric version of methylphenidate. Never tried it myself, unless drinking lots of alcohol with lots of Ritalin actually produces enough of it to have any effect.


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

Legionnaire said:


> I looked at some reviews and it looks like most people like it for it's euphoric effect and not for it's ability to enhance cognitive energy or function, but I'll still probably try it eventually to see for myself.


Can't compare it to anything because it is the first time I have used a stimulant for this. Most of the reviews on bluelight that i read said that it wasn't much of a party drug unless combined with other stuff. All the people who had taken enough of it to achieve any appreciable euphoria mentioned heavy come down the next day. It seams that dopamine increase alone is not sufficient to produce euphoria and that the only way one can get high off this stuff is to take so much that the noradrenaline reuptake inhibition becomes apparent. At these dosages the dopamine increase would be huge causing lots of receptor downregulation.

The dosage I have been working with has been roughly 5mg. At 10 mg it became counterproductive and I got SFA done. 10 mg also caused me to experience ever so slight withdrawl effects next day. 5mg was perfect with no real stimulation other than the fact that I had no desire to imbibe massive quantities of coffee like i usually do. Perhaps methylphenidate is better because of the noradrenergic effects but this is what contributes to the side effects too. I fancy putting some clonidine or guanfacine into the mix to catch the alpha receptors in the frontal lobes just to see if it works any better.

Be careful with this stuff. I have seen lots of comments on the after effects being worse than cocaine or meth...


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

I was under the impression that ethylphenidate would be superior to methylphenidate (which I actually find quite euphoric and free of side-effects/crashes at 10-15 mg buccally even after being on 60 mg a day for months) in every way, like d-amphetamine versus l-amphetamine. Maybe the manufacturer used a crappy synth and you've got erythro-ethylphenidate rather than threo-ethylphenidate?


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

Duke of Prunes said:


> I was under the impression that ethylphenidate would be superior to methylphenidate (which I actually find quite euphoric and free of side-effects/crashes at 10-15 mg buccally even after being on 60 mg a day for months) in every way, like d-amphetamine versus l-amphetamine. Maybe the manufacturer used a crappy synth and you've got erythro-ethylphenidate rather than threo-ethylphenidate?


What gives you this impression? The stuff worked wonders with hardly any side effects. The 10mg dose became counterproductive because it was too 'satisfying'. I  imagine if I increased the dose further this satisfied feeling would turn into euphoria. I had no intention of testing this hypothesis because I did not want to develope any tolerance. There was some slight withdrawl the next day when I used the 10mg but the 5mg was still as effective and I felt no withdrawl when it ran out(other than the fact that I am back to normal, which sucks). One other effect of consequence was that I had absolutely no desire to get high in any way shape or form. Normally I have a constant urge to get high on something. Not so while on this even though I wasn't 'buzzing'. Increased impulse control I would guess, owing to the efficacy of this substance in combating my ADHD.

It has less noradrenergic effects than methylphenidate which would make it less stimulating and possibly less euphoric. Depends on the individuals brain chemistry I guess. It is noteworthy that euphoriants like cocaine and meth also increase serotonin as well as dopamine and noradrenaline.

In anycase both isomers have similar pharmacological profiles, unlike methylphenidate where the l-isomer is more noradrenergic. Also your presuposition is flawed because noradrenaline may play a role in ADHD so methylphenidate may be superior as a monotherapy. I wish to test *this* hypothesis by trialing the ethylphenidate with an alpha agonist like clonidine...


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

I probably should have read your post a bit more carefully, I assumed you were interested in the euphoric/anxiolytic/pro-social effects as well.


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## euphoria (Jan 21, 2009)

I've been using 10mg + 5mg + 5mg a day of ethylphenidate, to get the ball rolling until I get my script for methylphenidate. Reasons for taking it are anhedonia, apathy, and a total lack of motivation or ability to focus. The other meds I'm on are:

20mg fluoxetine (depression/anxiety)
10mg clobazam (seizures)
0.6mg buprenorphine (opioid dependency)

For me at least, the initial effects of stimulants (reuptake inhibitors more so than amphetamine-like catecholamine releasers) are very different to those felt on subsequent days of usage. The mild euphoria / anhedonia relief is strongest with the first dose, followed by a crash, then a return of desirable effects when you redose, lessening each time but with the general feeling of stimulation from dosing still as strong as ever. At about 4 days in on my ethylphenidate regimen, I get no real mood lift, anhedonia relief or euphoria from dosing, just mild stimulation and disappearance of the fatigue I feel at night / in the morning without any ethylphenidate active (indicating a developing physical dependency). But at least the crashes have gone. 

My guess for why this happens is, you need to take a stimulant for the several weeks it takes for feedback loop inhibition (dopamine autoreceptors reducing synthesis & release, etc.) to stop, before the stim becomes fully effective and more like it felt with the first dose, except consistently over the course of the day rather than with ups and downs. The mood effects should return.

Ethylphenidate actually makes me feel pretty agitated and unhappy now even at this 10mg dose, but I just need to get through it for the results. Experimenting with it before this, 20mg or more seemed to be needed to treat my anhedonia/ADD, but I can't tolerate the adjustment period to that kind of dose. Will need to ramp up slowly.

Could be wrong, but it seems to be how things work. Feel like **** for 2 weeks, then the meds work.

I have gone on ethylphenidate binges a few times by the way, as I have with other stimulants. The first dose is always the best, then if you keep redosing to chase the euphoria, you get more and more agitated to the point you can't tolerate any more, then you have a crash that makes you wish you were never born.

The only way to use stimulants therapeutically (other than prn use which I don't believe in for most people) is to aim for consistent blood levels throughout the day and to expect results only after a few bad weeks - with ethylphenidate, this means if you start the day with 10mg, use 5mg doses every 5 or so hours afterwards, seeing as ethylphenidate levels drop by half every 3-6 hours. My guess based on personal experience, don't know the actual half life. But don't judge how much stimulant is in your body based on how euphoric it is making you feel, judge it by your heart rate, appetite, and other stimulant effects not related to mood. If you start crashing before it's time to redose, just power through it.


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

euphoria said:


> if you start the day with 10mg, use 5mg doses every 5 or so hours afterwards, seeing as ethylphenidate levels drop by half every 3-6 hours. My guess based on personal experience, don't know the actual half life. But don't judge how much stimulant is in your body based on how euphoric it is making you feel, judge it by your heart rate, appetite, and other stimulant effects not related to mood. If you start crashing before it's time to redose, just power through it.


I got on much better taking 4 x 5mg doses spaced at least 2 and a half hours apart. I avoided the higher dose because of it being counterproductive and leaving me feeling withdrawal effects the next day. I imagine tolerance would have set in pretty quickly had I continued at this dose and the desired effects may have returned once it became less satisfying.

I have done other posts on why I think the initial euphoria from higher doses of stims is not where the most benefit comes from. It may help with SA in the now but those immediate effects are short lived and undesirable after effects usually follow. I personally think that long term, every day low doses along with CBT would be the most effective approach, wit maybe some benzos or something to kill the SA when absolutely necessary. My hypothesis is that the consistently but mildly elevated dopamine levels will change the way our brains process emotional stimuli and will aid in the eventual recovery from this condition rather than this quick fix, short lived euphoria business followed by withdrawal effects...


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

Is Ethylphenidate even used to treat ADD?
From what I read when you take MPH and drink alcohol you get Ethylphenidate which acts different than MPH that's why people mustn't drink alc when on MPH. But if Ethylphenidate is actually good then this would mean that drinking alc when on MPH would also be good. :|


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

jonny neurotic said:


> I got on much better taking 4 x 5mg doses spaced at least 2 and a half hours apart. I avoided the higher dose because of it being counterproductive and leaving me feeling withdrawal effects the next day. I imagine tolerance would have set in pretty quickly had I continued at this dose and the desired effects may have returned once it became less satisfying.
> 
> I have done other posts on why I think the initial euphoria from higher doses of stims is not where the most benefit comes from. It may help with SA in the now but those immediate effects are short lived and undesirable after effects usually follow. I personally think that long term, every day low doses along with CBT would be the most effective approach, wit maybe some benzos or something to kill the SA when absolutely necessary. My hypothesis is that the consistently but mildly elevated dopamine levels will change the way our brains process emotional stimuli and will aid in the eventual recovery from this condition rather than this quick fix, short lived euphoria business followed by withdrawal effects...


I'm considering giving this a try with MPH. Atm I'm taking 20 mg three times per day (usually 15 mg four times but my sleep is back to front and I'm trying to fix it, so having to take a fourth dose at midnight or something would kinda suck), but I'm considering taking a two week break or so and then starting again with 10 mg every two hours or 5 mg an hour instead. Does that sound any good to you?

I'm actually finding that 20 mg of MPH is too much for daily use, as I just end up spaced out and content with doing nothing all day, but I was quite happy on 10 mg until I built up a bit of tolerance to the euphoria and thought it had pooped out, then had my dose upped.


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

Do you guys even know what you are doing? Mixing MPH with EPH? Sounds like some dangerous experiments going on here. I don't know if I can endorse that.


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

Duke of Prunes said:


> I'm considering giving this a try with MPH. Atm I'm taking 20 mg three times per day (usually 15 mg four times but my sleep is back to front and I'm trying to fix it, so having to take a fourth dose at midnight or something would kinda suck), but I'm considering taking a two week break or so and then starting again with 10 mg every two hours or 5 mg an hour instead. Does that sound any good to you?
> 
> I'm actually finding that 20 mg of MPH is too much for daily use, as I just end up spaced out and content with doing nothing all day, but I was quite happy on 10 mg until I built up a bit of tolerance to the euphoria and thought it had pooped out, then had my dose upped.


I can't say. I haven't experienced methylphenidate. I think if I could I would much prefer a timed release format. If it is a high enough quality product so as to ensure consistent plasma levels of the drug I think this would be the best bet. With mehtylphenidate I would definitely use an alpha agonist like clonidine or guanfacine to mitigate the adrenergic effects.

Bear in mind that I am not swallowing the ethyl because it is around 8 times less potent that way. I don't know about the bioavailability of methyl. I dare say that taking lower doses more frequently would be preferential but I don't know about the spacing of the doses. You can but try. Do keep me posted...



norad said:


> Do you guys even know what you are doing? Mixing MPH with EPH? Sounds like some dangerous experiments going on here. I don't know if I can endorse that.


Who said anything about mixing the two? And why would that be any more dangerous than taking a higher dose of either?



> Is Ethylphenidate even used to treat ADD?
> From what I read when you take MPH and drink alcohol you get Ethylphenidate which acts different than MPH that's why people mustn't drink alc when on MPH. But if Ethylphenidate is actually good then this would mean that drinking alc when on MPH would also be good. :|


Don't fancy the idea of drinking throughout the day. In fact, I don't like alcohol too much at all. TBH I don't think that it would cause any great quantity of ethylphenidate to be generated...


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

As far as I know EPH acts different than MPH which is why you cannot predict the effects of drinking alcohol when you take MPH. That's at least what I read.


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## goodgrief999 (Aug 25, 2012)

The keyword *Ethylphenidate *has brought me to this forum, This is a fascinating discussion, even if I have run out of the required energy to use a medical dictionary.
Having just read the forum rules, it makes me inhibited about what to contribute. 'I have a friend who has been self-medicating, using stimulants like methiopropamine and other legally available chemicals, for 14 months straight. In the last week, he has discovered EPH and it seems a very good time to come across this thread, given the warnings stated.'
I didn't understand OP's opinion that 5.mg. is a dose i.e. 1 gram lasts 25 days. (???) but, as also stated - it's eight times stronger through gum tissue than intestine. AND 'my friend has noticed that a little goes a long way.' I am intrigued by one person's statement in this thread that stimulants in general 'can be used PRN' (with whatever strings attached) as I have always thought regarding such chemicals that 'self-medicating' is more or less 'USING'. Period.


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## goodgrief999 (Aug 25, 2012)

Second thoughts, Thank God I found this post A) 'my friend thinks 500mg is a small daily dose.' and b) I pick up my Doctor's meds in 3 hours, including benzos (valium) and opiate pain relief.


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

goodgrief999 said:


> I didn't understand OP's opinion that 5.mg. is a dose i.e. 1 gram lasts 25 days. (???) but, as also stated - it's eight times stronger through gum tissue than intestine. AND 'my friend has noticed that a little goes a long way.'


That was 5mg four times a day so half a gram would last 25 days. It worked OK for my ADHD and motivation but not so good for SA. I have since found something that works even better for my ADHD and, happily, improves my SA into the bargain. Beautiful...


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## goodgrief999 (Aug 25, 2012)

jonny neurotic said:


> That was 5mg four times a day so half a gram would last 25 days. It worked OK for my ADHD and motivation but not so good for SA. I have since found something that works even better for my ADHD and, happily, improves my SA into the bargain. Beautiful...


I'm glad for you. The dose of EPH you mention, is so small it could only be classed as 'medicinal', it couldn't have any 'intoxicating' effects, I believe. Thanks for the thread. 'My friend (who uses a lot) needs more information.'


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## Crimsondl (Oct 28, 2013)

goodgrief999 said:


> The keyword *Ethylphenidate *has brought me to this forum, This is a fascinating discussion, even if I have run out of the required energy to use a medical dictionary.
> Having just read the forum rules, it makes me inhibited about what to contribute. 'I have a friend who has been self-medicating, using stimulants like methiopropamine and other legally available chemicals, for 14 months straight. In the last week, he has discovered EPH and it seems a very good time to come across this thread, given the warnings stated.'
> I didn't understand OP's opinion that 5.mg. is a dose i.e. 1 gram lasts 25 days. (???) but, as also stated - it's eight times stronger through gum tissue than intestine. AND 'my friend has noticed that a little goes a long way.' I am intrigued by one person's statement in this thread that stimulants in general 'can be used PRN' (with whatever strings attached) as I have always thought regarding such chemicals that 'self-medicating' is more or less 'USING'. Period.


How do you prepare this for absorbing through the gum. I'm considering trying this but it's in powder/small crystals how would I go about administering this through the gum. Any help would be great thanks


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## butterz (Aug 8, 2013)

If you want to find out how EPH works then could you simply take MPH and drink some alc at the same time or wouldn't this work?


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## cyanide444 (Oct 20, 2013)

Ethylphenidate is not pharmacologically superior to methylphenidate, at least according to pharmacological studies. Now, I am only taking into consideration the racemate here, as that's what is usually found on market.

The IC50 for DAT inhibition (measured by dopamine displacement) of racemic ethylphenidate is around 95 nM versus around 20 nM for methylphenidate (racemic). A lower number indicates a lower necessary concentration needed to facilitate this effect. In terms of direct DAT affinity (ability to displace a potent ligand), methamphetamine was around 122 nM while ethylphenidate was around 319 nM, with the lower endpoint of the confidence interval at around 221 nM. In comparison, cocaine has an affinity for the DAT at around 367 nM and an ability (IC50) for reuptake inhibition at about 289 nM. Both methyl and ethylphenidate are more potent at binding to the DAT than cocaine.

The NET reuptake inhibition (based on displaced norepinephrine) for methylphenidate was 51 nM while ethylphenidate was at 480 nM (280 at the lower end of the confidence interval). Binding to the NET itself was at 788 nM for methylphenidate and above 7200 nM for ethylphenidate, indicating that ethylphenidate is not the greatest substrate for the norepinephrine transporter. In comparison, cocaine had NET reuptake inhibition IC50 at around 460 nM and actual binding to the NET at around 2990 nM. 

At 2.5 mg/kg (in rats), ethylphenidate outperformed methylphenidate (both racemic) in its ability to promote motor activity (a measure of stimulation in rat studies). At the other dosages (5 mg/kg and 10 mg/kg), methylphenidate outperformed ethylphenidate. Interestingly, at the 10 mg/kg level, the (+) isomer of ethylphenidate outperformed that of methylphenidate.

Of course, all of this ignores the pharmacokinetic properties of each substance as well as bioavailability. Methylphenidate metabolizes quite poorly, and has a rather low bioavailability (whereas cocaine has a slightly better bioavailability via the oral route; obviously the intranasal route is more effective for both in terms of bioavailability). Ethylphenidate may or may not be metabolized in a similar fashion. Compounds with higher lipophilicity like methipropamine and desoxypipradrol might perform better in this sense.

Data acquired from " Journal of Medicinal Chemistry, 2005, Vol. 48, No. 8"


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## Crimsondl (Oct 28, 2013)

jonny neurotic said:


> I can't say. I haven't experienced methylphenidate. I think if I could I would much prefer a timed release format. If it is a high enough quality product so as to ensure consistent plasma levels of the drug I think this would be the best bet. With mehtylphenidate I would definitely use an alpha agonist like clonidine or guanfacine to mitigate the adrenergic effects.
> 
> Bear in mind that I am not swallowing the ethyl because it is around 8 times less potent that way. I don't know about the bioavailability of methyl. I dare say that taking lower doses more frequently would be preferential but I don't know about the spacing of the doses. You can but try. Do keep me posted...
> 
> ...


if its 8x less effective by swallowing if you take 5mg via cheek and gum if you swallowed 40mg in a capsule would you then get around the same effect? anyone know?


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## adamaus (Mar 24, 2013)

anyone know where i can get it


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## swim (Apr 4, 2011)

adamaus said:


> anyone know where i can get it


there are plenty research chemicals retailers on the web.


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## Crimsondl (Oct 28, 2013)

for anyone that is interested i have started today with a trial run of using ethylphenidate for my ADHD.

I made 4 capsules of 40mg in each last night and started this morning taking the first one at 9. then plan to take the next one around 11.30/12 and so forth throught the day

the first 40mg felt a bit to euphoric but my head was a lot clearer and i was more focused and felt more calmer in my self

for my next one I have halved the dose to around 20mg so hopefully will just feel clear headed and focused without the euphoria


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## Crimsondl (Oct 28, 2013)

for anyone that is interested i have started today with a trial run of using ethylphenidate for my ADHD.

I made 4 capsules of 40mg in each last night and started this morning taking the first one at 9. then plan to take the next one around 11.30/12 and so forth throught the day

the first dose swalled in the capsule 40mg after my breakfast. it felt a bit to euphoric but my head was a lot clearer and i was more focused and felt more calmer in my self

for my next dose i decided to redose after my dinner which i ate just after 12 and redosed around 1. I have halved this dose to around 20mg so hopefully will just feel clear headed and focused without the euphoria.

So after the reduced 2nd and 3rd dose of 20mg these where less euphoric. Which is what I wanted I did feel a lot calmer and more focused and my head felt silent bliss. 


I did feel the 20mg wasn't enough though but the 40mg to much I will try a dose of 30mg tomorrow and report back after Sunday with my views. And then report back after my full week. 

1 definite bonus of this substance at this dose is that your are still able too eat I've eaten breakfast and I had a full 12inch pizza for dinner I'm only 10st 10 if anyone wondered if I was overweight lol. Because you must redose after 2-3 hours you are still able to eat you regular meals as it wares off. 

If anyone is interested in also trialling and helping with feedback and if it helps don't hesitate to pm me or if anyone else had tried this and offer me some tips please offer them


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## Crimsondl (Oct 28, 2013)

Just a quick bit about myself the reason why I've decided to do this:

Trouble concentrating
Trouble with anger in relationships
Lack of motivations doing house hold task
Lack of stimulation from social situations prefer own company
Lack of organisation
Falling asleep in work meeting due to strain on Brain to stay focused
Feeling tired around 4/5 after work stay awake but trouble sleeping on night
Lots of thoughts going through mind through day
Started getting annoyed by girlfriends tone of voice especially when asking to due jobs think this is a coping mechanism due to my lack of interest but at the moment her voice makes me angry and find annoying which I don't obviously want

There is more but you get the drift


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## Gustavus (Oct 31, 2013)

Hi Crimson,
Your trial run is really interesting. 

Are you using powder or crystals? 
Do you sleep well after a full day on EPH (4 caps)? 
Is there any comedown when the effects disappear after 2-3 hours? 
Do you feel any stimulation or only calmer and focused?

Please keep us updated


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## jonny neurotic (Jan 20, 2011)

Crimsondl said:


> for anyone that is interested i have started today with a trial run of using ethylphenidate for my ADHD.
> 
> I made 4 capsules of 40mg in each last night and started this morning taking the first one at 9. then plan to take the next one around 11.30/12 and so forth throught the day
> 
> ...


Sounds awesome, man. I haven't been taking anything for a while. Got over most of my SA just some fine tuning to do but I have ADHD pretty bad. I loved Ethylphenidate. It cleared my head without feeling like I was on a stimulant. I recon I may be buying some soon because I could do with the boost...


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## Crimsondl (Oct 28, 2013)

jonny neurotic said:


> Sounds awesome, man. I haven't been taking anything for a while. Got over most of my SA just some fine tuning to do but I have ADHD pretty bad. I loved Ethylphenidate. It cleared my head without feeling like I was on a stimulant. I recon I may be buying some soon because I could do with the boost...


Yes it defiantly did feel like that it did help a lot. I have put trial on hold as I got a letter from NHS for new assessment so gona go down that road and see if get results if not th gona start it back up


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## iagteyh (Jun 29, 2014)

So, this morning's brainwave found me on ethylphenidate (for well bad adhd, currently undiagnosed.. adhd-i, which is where the anxiety fits in, in a complicated way)

5mg sugar doses sounds sensible, I think I will (it would be sensible to) start lower.. but, are there any follow up thoughts 8 months on?


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