# Alternatives to CBT? Is there another Route I can take?



## In The Shade (Jun 26, 2016)

I started therapy a few months ago after going to see my doctor about my anxiety/depression issues, they reffered me for CBT which I wasn't very optimistic about to begin with, anyway as the months have passed I really don't feel its worked, my therapy session are drawing close to an end now and I really don't feel CBT has/is going to help me really as I am finding it really difficult to step out of my comfort zone and if anything it has kind of made me feel a bit worse about myself to be honest.

I feel CBT is just a really cheap and temporary way to alleviate the problems I have, I feel like my problems go much deeper and requires a different kind of therapy but I am not sure what other kind there is? 

I am in the UK and waiting lists on the NHS can be quite long here. Anyway I was just wondering if any of you guys here have had any experience with CBT and how it worked out for you and what alternatives/next steps there are other than CBT to help with my issues.


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## Shredder (Apr 19, 2011)

CBT didn't work for me either. I think one important step is to find a therapist you can connect with and trust. 
EMDR might be a viable option depending on your history. It is said to be helpful especially in PTSD cases.


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## In The Shade (Jun 26, 2016)

Shredder said:


> CBT didn't work for me either. I think one important step is to find a therapist you can connect with and trust.
> EMDR might be a viable option depending on your history. It is said to be helpful especially in PTSD cases.


What's EMDR?


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## Shredder (Apr 19, 2011)

Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing. 
They can only theorize as to why it actually works and it first sounded like mumbo jumbo to me but it seems to work for some.

Here is a good overview: http://www.cognitivetherapy.me.uk/emdr.htm


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## Uneven (Aug 25, 2016)

Hello,
I've never had the courage to go seek help for my SA. But i've bought a book based on CBT recently called 'Overcome SA and shyness' by Gillian Butler. I know you are not optimistic about CBT but i've thought that maybe self-helping might be another option to consider.


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## LifeIsGood (Jan 29, 2012)

Yes there is! It's called ACT - Acceptance and Commitment Therapy.
Please see this link for recent articles in the literature about the topic, and comparing it to CBT. You will be able to see an abstract of the study. If you are interested in reading further, some articles are from free journals, but others can only be obtained from medical library subscriptions. This should be enough to get an ideal though.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/...mmittment+therapy+for+social+anxiety+disorder


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

In The Shade said:


> I started therapy a few months ago after going to see my doctor about my anxiety/depression issues, they reffered me for CBT which I wasn't very optimistic about to begin with, anyway as the months have passed I really don't feel its worked, my therapy session are drawing close to an end now and I really don't feel CBT has/is going to help me really as I am finding it really difficult to step out of my comfort zone and if anything it has kind of made me feel a bit worse about myself to be honest.


Did you do individual / one-on-one CBT? Or with a group? Or both? Did they do gradual exposure with you, too, or just the 'theory'?

I've done both individual and group CBT, and I found group more helpful than individual. Maybe it was hearing the real experiences of other people in the same position as me, or maybe the staff were just better in their delivery, but with the group CBT, I found myself actually using some of the techniques in the 'real world' whereas with individual CBT, it didn't stick with me at all. I'm hoping I'll be able to retain some of what I've learned for the long term. The improvement has been minor, and the depression has been a significant barrier for me, but I'll take any improvement at all, no matter how small.

You mention you deal with depression as well. I've found CBT to be ineffective against _some_ of its symptoms. Where CBT is good for addressing negative self-talk, forecasting, filtering, discounting the positive, etc., it does not seem effective against anhedonia and apathy. For those symptoms, you'll want to look at medication. It may take a lot of trial and error (and possibly different combinations), but medication does help some people alleviate those particular symptoms.

For me, I'm still experimenting (with a doctor) with medication, and in my last appointment, he made an offhand reference to ECT (electroconvulsive therapy) since meds haven't been working. This was the first time a doctor has prompted me about ECT, and it was kind of unsettling as it's a bit invasive...

There is also an experimental procedure called Deep Brain Stimulation (DBS) where they literally physically poke at the brain. This one, if I recall, has significant positive results so far.

ECT and DBS are last-resort treatments, so they are something to look at if you've been through CBT, psychotherapy, and many different medication combos.

There is also Dialectical Behaviour Therapy which teaches some good coping mechanisms. Where CBT addresses the thought process that _triggers _the negative feelings, DBT addresses the feelings _themselves_ (coping mechanisms for when you're emotionally overwhelmed). DBT is more for people who have volatile relationships, Borderline Personality Disorder, etc... but really, the content of DBT is the type of stuff that should be taught in school curriculums because _everyone_ can make use of its techniques.

I've heard of Acceptance and Commitment Therapy as someone else mentioned, but don't know much about it. From what I _have_ read about it, though, it does sound like it has some potential (though perhaps not as much as CBT).


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## rewired (Jul 31, 2016)

In The Shade said:


> I started therapy a few months ago after going to see my doctor about my anxiety/depression issues, they reffered me for CBT which I wasn't very optimistic about to begin with, anyway as the months have passed I really don't feel its worked, my therapy session are drawing close to an end now and I really don't feel CBT has/is going to help me really as I am finding it really difficult to step out of my comfort zone and if anything it has kind of made me feel a bit worse about myself to be honest.
> 
> I feel CBT is just a really cheap and temporary way to alleviate the problems I have, I feel like my problems go much deeper and requires a different kind of therapy but I am not sure what other kind there is?
> 
> I am in the UK and waiting lists on the NHS can be quite long here. Anyway I was just wondering if any of you guys here have had any experience with CBT and how it worked out for you and what alternatives/next steps there are other than CBT to help with my issues.


CBT is certainly not for everyone. I would suggest that you consider the pros and cons of CBT and contemplate why it was not something for you. I also consider CBT to be somewhat shallow for my makeup. I don't believe it's a method that gives long lasting results for complex cases such as myself. Whilst NLP is a facet of CBT, _Neuro-linguistic programming_ could be a door way out of CBT into something that offers you more tangible results. Again - it will come down to your own make up and what your intent and aims be. NLP is often associated with hypnosis and such can still be considered a form of behavioral therapy. The key difference as I have come to see it, is the avenue of self healing. CBT is very much a commercial form of therapy that relies on a clinical focus. Not only is the method shallow for me, it also relies on a power other than myself. The beauty of NLP when applied from ones own perspective is the liberation that comes from self control.

My first knowledge of NLP way after I had already started doing it myself. The fact I was already into self help only made the process that much more effective. Clinical intervention rarely lasts with me given I believe it's pretty much based on a revolving door principle much like our food and medical "industry" There is nothing stronger than self realization that comes from that ability to glean from all concepts and a genuine desire to help ourselves without relying on one method or any at all. I am speaking about a genuine intent that no wiz bang abbreviated process can ever hope to generate.

In short - I started with relaxation music. Very Basic stuff. That simply process was soon to be complicated with Bio Feed Back terminology which like CBT now sells in the millions. I will however try the KISS (keep it simple stupid) principle and just call it for what it was ... giving myself a good dose of Alpha Wave Treatment through slowing down my brain with relaxation music. I required no special frequency in order that it many work. Had I researched it perhaps whales, ocean waves and the rain would no longer work. It was a good discovery for me all the same. Given it was so long ago ... I kept going back to the library as was then my only source.

Eventually I gave Brain Sync a go. Enter Biofeedback Technology. Given my receptive ability to listening to relaxation music, (despite being an extremely volatile individual often prone to outbursts) it came as no surprise that this technique was very effective for me after I learned how the process worked. Once does need to read up on it as there can be side effects and barriers that impeded on the healing and performance boosting effects. You can't just pop it like a pill and expect that to solve everything - I also consider many abbreviated clinical therapies on the same path as like wise complacent acts. The become a langue unto themselves - red, white and blue. Take your pick.

So anyways - Biofeedback is certainly something you could consider. Although like I said, there is more to it than simply putting on a pair of headphones as is the case for anyone just turning up for therapy. Goes back to discovery yourself and one's intent. Why did the previous effort no work and what direction is best to take next. I kept on with such questions ... and then found myself doing Guided Meditations: BINGO - good hit that link ... explains it well enough.

Again - I was a great candid for such a concept. Not every voice worked for me, so I would just keep searching and filing always all those files voices that worked for me. Male of female did not matter so much, but TONE was important. I was so open to this form of therapy that I found Youtube more than good enough. In fact I found some practitioners much better than those requesting money. Of course by this stage I was very good at gleaning by ignoring what did not work and focusing and what does. I made it an art to loose myself even with presenters that had not quite all the elements that I preferred. Finding a presentation with background music at the right volume when combined with voice, the pace of dialogue and especially worn our phrases or type of suggestions where and are all trigger that either made or broke a session for me. The more I considered what made all these therapies work or not ... I came to realize how much of all these methods rely on my own ability and no so much the "concept" itself. This made me feel in control - it was a good discovery ... I soaked up more in the ways of self-help.

Eventually I found my way into Self Hypnosis - then whilst one again already having experienced the process off another term, I read up more on NLP ... All of this was well before the FAD of CBT hit the scene and whilst that may appear a valid option for many ... your term of shallow hits that nail on the head when is comes to folks like me.  Quick Fix really .. Reliance factor that plays well into the market that creates the need. Another story - or should I say a book. Oh My ... I have rambled on ... I think I will make this a blog entry actually.
________________________________

There are many options in the market to which we can choose in order to uses as tools so that we may help ourselves. The path I just happened across was once that seemed to come about more naturally than any type of intensive Google search. Which seems fitting giving that each of us already has the power within. Sometimes we just need a little help. Even if it's in the form of a rubber band on the wrist that we give a good flick in order to rewire the brain. I find a good mix of science research, established routines, and self reflection based on a system that relies solely on ones self is the best way for me. What we eat, think, say and do will ultimately effect the outcome of any path we wish to take.

Best of luck with whatever direction you choose to take and of course when you hop skip and change tracks. Never get rutted in only one way. Is not as simple a ABC - woops ... I meant CBT. 123 - NLP - XLZ - & or hugging trees.

Here's to wishing you all the very best. :wink2:


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## In The Shade (Jun 26, 2016)

LifeIsGood said:


> Yes there is! It's called ACT - Acceptance and Commitment Therapy.
> Please see this link for recent articles in the literature about the topic, and comparing it to CBT. You will be able to see an abstract of the study. If you are interested in reading further, some articles are from free journals, but others can only be obtained from medical library subscriptions. This should be enough to get an ideal though.
> 
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/...mmittment+therapy+for+social+anxiety+disorder


Thanks. I will look into this.



Just Lurking said:


> Did you do individual / one-on-one CBT? Or with a group? Or both? Did they do gradual exposure with you, too, or just the 'theory'?
> 
> I've done both individual and group CBT, and I found group more helpful than individual. Maybe it was hearing the real experiences of other people in the same position as me, or maybe the staff were just better in their delivery, but with the group CBT, I found myself actually using some of the techniques in the 'real world' whereas with individual CBT, it didn't stick with me at all. I'm hoping I'll be able to retain some of what I've learned for the long term. The improvement has been minor, and the depression has been a significant barrier for me, but I'll take any improvement at all, no matter how small.
> 
> ...


Hey. My CBT was on an individual basis with my therapist, although like I said in the OP it just hasn't worked out well because it's theory based and I cant seem to take it upon myself to carry out the tasks I said I would, hence why it's not worked. I really do feel like CBT has been inaffective for me as my issues run deeper than just a few negative thoughts. I feel it's a really cheap alternative to better therapy, even if I did manage to grasp it now, I know for a fact the CBT techniques would not last long before I'd regress back into my normal way of thinking.

Thanks for your reply anyway, I hope my post made sense.


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## In The Shade (Jun 26, 2016)

rewired said:


> CBT is certainly not for everyone. I would suggest that you consider the pros and cons of CBT and contemplate why it was not something for you. I also consider CBT to be somewhat shallow for my makeup. I don't believe it's a method that gives long lasting results for complex cases such as myself. Whilst NLP is a facet of CBT, _Neuro-linguistic programming_ could be a door way out of CBT into something that offers you more tangible results. Again - it will come down to your own make up and what your intent and aims be. NLP is often associated with hypnosis and such can still be considered a form of behavioral therapy. The key difference as I have come to see it, is the avenue of self healing. CBT is very much a commercial form of therapy that relies on a clinical focus. Not only is the method shallow for me, it also relies on a power other than myself. The beauty of NLP when applied from ones own perspective is the liberation that comes from self control.
> 
> My first knowledge of NLP way after I had already started doing it myself. The fact I was already into self help only made the process that much more effective. Clinical intervention rarely lasts with me given I believe it's pretty much based on a revolving door principle much like our food and medical "industry" There is nothing stronger than self realization that comes from that ability to glean from all concepts and a genuine desire to help ourselves without relying on one method or any at all. I am speaking about a genuine intent that no wiz bang abbreviated process can ever hope to generate.
> 
> ...


Hey, that was a very long read but some interesting stuff you posted there. I will definitely look into the stuff you have suggested as I really need to fix myself before it's too late.

Big thanks for in depth post anyway man, opened my eyes to some stuff I didn't even know about.


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## rewired (Jul 31, 2016)

In The Shade said:


> Hey, that was a very long read but some interesting stuff you posted there. I will definitely look into the stuff you have suggested as I really need to fix myself before it's too late.
> 
> Big thanks for in depth post anyway man, opened my eyes to some stuff I didn't even know about.


You won't find any twits from me on this topic. There is no one way. Instead ... there's a bunch! When it comes to recovery like this, lots of reading is required.  It takes years to develop the hangups many of us have, therefore it only makes sense that it's going to take just as much time to correct the imbalances.

I'm sure you'll do what's needed when the penny drops. It's the usual way for those smart enough to move on when they've had enough.


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