# When no one yearns for you.



## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

I just turned 22 and have lived a life where no one, and I mean no one, has ever yearned to be around me. I have found that I always have to initiate conversation and, many times, if I jump into a conversation I kill it on impact. I am a quite attractive, physically fit young female, but it seems that I scare people away.

I find it quite disturbing how no one wants to get to know me. Being attractive, I find that men (mostly 3 times my age, who obviously believe me to be a prostitute [or at least believe that I need the money they will offer]) will come up to me, but when I look at them they back away. I even had one guy tell me I "had the eyes of a killer."

I haven't killed anyone, and I don't plan to. It just seems that something about my aura keeps people away. And even if I smile and pretend, people tend to see right through it. I've been told by my parents that if I pretend long enough it will become a reality, a theory based on human plasticity, but for years I have; since first grade I have been pretending, and it has not come to pass as of yet.

I want a relationship outside of my immediate family, as I have not had friends or lovers (ever, never ever. Hard to believe, yes, I know) but I yearn for it.

I yearn for a relationship of some sort, but have yet to meet a person in which I would ever want a relationship with. What's worse is that people do not change in my eyes.

What does that mean? It means that when I meet someone new (face to face), in minutes I can gauge what things they are into, what decisions they will make, what ideologies they will fall in and out of, how they view others and themselves, and practically anything else they want to know about themselves.

Apparently, this skill makes me have the perfect bartender-type personality, though I abhor anything related to alcohol and drugs (never tried any and never will). I listen well and give great advice, but that is my only relationship to other people outside of my parents... Why is this? For what reason have I lived this long and had no one interested in me? Dang, I know people hate people who act like they know it all, but I don't present that side till later down the road.

I have co-workers who will never be friends because they have and will make decisions that deem them quite untrustworthy. I went to college for one year and found that people grouped off but I was left alone, as the mother of each class; instructing the students who were lost by the teachers' instructions and making sure everyone got along with one another.

What the hell? Why do I always end up as a "convenience" but not a "preference." Can anyone help me?


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## Brightpaperwarewolf (Oct 16, 2008)

I can relate with the "homicidal look." I naturally have a glare with a lot of intensity in my eyes because I'm usually hyper-focused, I have a heightened sense of my surroundings. Sounds familiar? That intense gaze scares people before they realize who you are.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

anymouse said:


> you do realise that this forum is for social anxiety so nobody will think you are homicidal? just find yourself and worry about the rest later. and the truth is even those who feel monstrous inside and in the world can be yearned for and not even know it!


That's exactly the problem. I'm so reclusive and socially and emotionally isolated that people always think there is something wrong with me. My parents keep telling me to visit a Kaiser Permanente if I feel the stress become overbearing... I had to be sent into emergency therapy a year ago because the isolation apparently made the Kaiser psychological test have suicidal tendencies in the results... but I can fake outgoingness if my social status is threatened. If my income is threatened, my life is threatened, and I assimilate, yet everyone around me knows I come home everyday from work and sit. Just sit.

I don't live near my parents or siblings, and I don't have friends. I am alone here, and I want to know why.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

Hmm, sounds like you have a killa stare. Which keeps away the people you want but does nothing for the creeps and weirdos.  That sucks. 

I do believe in the fake it till you make it approach. But you are faking it until you trick yourself not everyone around you. I have a feeling like your too smart to outsmart yourself. 

Maybe all you offer people is a service, like that go to person for everything. Shes real nice and helps me with... instead of being that and offering more of a friendship vibe as well. 

How do you go with making friendships? Like do you have some friends but you want to be closer to them?


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

anymouse said:


> creeps and weirdos = superior. the killa stare comment looks like a compliment-- take it as such? i'm just rambling.


Well a killa stare is a great asset. But miss used can be dangerous. People end up dead.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

matty said:


> Hmm, sounds like you have a killa stare. Which keeps away the people you want but does nothing for the creeps and weirdos.  That sucks.
> 
> I do believe in the fake it till you make it approach. But you are faking it until you trick yourself not everyone around you. I have a feeling like your too smart to outsmart yourself.
> 
> ...


Well, since I don't have any friends, it's hard to state how I go about making friends. I generally don't care for most people because their detrimental traits (aka, traits that may cause me a problem further down the road) tend to outweigh any decent traits. And, all in all, that seems to be most people, even including my immediate family members. I think that's part of the reason I moved away from them (even though I bet most people wouldn't see them as bad people in the least).

For some reason, I have a great distrust of people and their capabilities to perform, well, just about anything with any sort of competence. Somewhere down the line it's going to cost me more than it's worth.

I can see how I came to that conclusion when I watch people in friendships and lover relationships, yet I still yearn for some sort of relationship, albeit maybe a fairytale one.

I just want to know that someone wants to know me, not my body (only), not my money, not my stockpile of manga. Just me, all of me as a person. Yet it seems that no one does.

I have noticed many of the people on this website seem to be in relations with other people, whether lovers or friends, yet I sit alone in the dark, again, trying to reach out.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

You have a stockpile of MANGA. I so want you for that :lol 

So on one hand you want friendship or some form of relationship, yet on the other you are saying you have trouble trusting people and accepting peoples traits. To gain what you want in hand one, say your left hand. You need to let go of what you have in your other, say your right hand. If you dont let down your walls and let people in then you greatly decrease your chances of friendship and love. If you dismiss people before you give them a chance then how are they meant to get anywhere. No one is perfect.

You do realise that your inability to accept other peoples detrimental traits is probably your worst trait and the one hurting you the most?

I think you see what you need to change but that they are pretty deep processes.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

matty said:


> You have a stockpile of MANGA. I so want you for that :lol
> 
> So on one hand you want friendship or some form of relationship, yet on the other you are saying you have trouble trusting people and accepting peoples traits. To gain what you want in hand one, say your left hand. You need to let go of what you have in your other, say your right hand. If you dont let down your walls and let people in then you greatly decrease your chances of friendship and love. If you dismiss people before you give them a chance then how are they meant to get anywhere. No one is perfect.
> 
> ...


Yeah, that's like asking me to completely obliterate my fight or flight processing. Where, if someone was coming at me with a knife, I would just stand there, blissfully unaware, till my gut was torn open.

I can see peoples' trains of thought and see where they're going with any decisions or behavioral patterns they take on. I elementary school I got in trouble for finishing my teachers' sentences out loud. I just know.

Many times this just makes people uninteresting because I already know them before they explain themselves to me. Sometimes, in order to escape annoying people, I would explain them back to themselves and, POW! conversation over.

I not only need people to fight me, I need them to fight me intelligently; they need to be able to tell me I'm wrong and have the wear with all to back it up. Backing up an argument logically would be good.

Say, many people, if kidnapped by someone who treated them kinder than their own loving parents and gave them everything they needed and let them roam free, say, on a different inhabitable planet with other cognitively aware humans, most people would grow to at least like the person (or alien?) who kidnapped them.

I would hate them with all my heart and always, and I mean ALWAYS, be searching for a way out.

This is how I feel about people. When I'm with people they take something away from me, whether material or spiritually/emotionally, and I never forget or forgive. I don't feel as if I have another half somewhere out there. I just want an equal. I have nothing that needs completing, I just want a relationship where ideas can be shared. Ideas that make me think.

Maybe people don't like to think as deeply as I do about every little thing. Many a person has stated I am "thinking to much" about or into something.

Let me know what you think.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

Well it isnt asking you to completely change your fight or flight processes. More run it at 80% instead of 100%. Which isnt going to be easy. Then I guess you want for someone who can challenge you mental and has no flaws. Which is easier and which is more likely to land you in a relationship are two different things. Do you think your thoughts are reasonable or do you believe they are unreasonable. Not everyones traits can be deal breakers like you say. Could you be screening too tightly and missing out of possible people? 

Do you mean when you are with people in general they take something away from you or previous people in your life have taken something away? 

Many people dont like to think as deeply as you do. There is no wrong way of doing it. Only a common way.


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## jmoop (Jul 12, 2009)

Oh, you remind me of myself. Like you I can tell most of the time what the habits, desires and agendas a person will have just by a brief, initial observation. Like if a person looks/talks like this, they will act like that, have certain beliefs, or like to do activities X, Y, and Z. But I have recently tried to stop thinking this way and to try to actually get to know people. If all you do is observe people and judge them before getting to really know them you place yourself at a disadvantage. Some people who act a certain way or seem to fit a stereotype at first will sometimes surprise you and if you keep an open mind you might be able to "click" with some folks.

Also I agree with matty that you need to break down some of your internal walls and stop being so defensive so you can let somebody in. I have the same issue (which is why I have given up on ever finding someone to have a serious relationship with) so I can relate. It is tough being such an analytical and critical thinker that you can't help but try to understand people by judging them.


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## so_so_shy (Sep 5, 2005)

Sounds like all you see in people are flaws and you feel superior to them. But we all have flaws, including yourself. If you want friends and lovers you are going to have to accept their flaws, just like they'll have to do the same with you. 

And you think you have this skill that allows you to know all about a person in minutes, but that's nonsense. It takes time to really get to know people.


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

Expect less; get more.


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

How attractive are you?


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## quietgal (Oct 18, 2007)

walden said:


> What the hell? Why do I always end up as a "convenience" but not a "preference." Can anyone help me?


It could be because people are just intimidated by you. By your own admission you're a very intelligent and competent person, and you know it. As so_so_shy pointed out it also seems like you tend to be somewhat judgmental and highly critical of others. This combination can be very off-putting, as most people don't like being judged, and they can sense when they're being judged.

Even if it's mostly true, I think it's presumptuous to believe that you can, as you put it, tell in minutes what a person "is into, what decisions they will make, what ideologies they will fall in and out of, how they view others and themselves, and practically anything else they want to know about themselves." If this were true you would understand better why people have acted the way they do around you.

Personally, while you come off as a very intelligent and analytical person, you seem to be lacking humility, tolerance, and compassionate understanding of other people. I think you should start trying to approach people with a more open mind and heart; stop analyzing them and trying to figure them out like logic puzzles, and simply try to enjoy their company without expectations of the future, or judgments of their value or qualities.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

VanDamMan said:


> How attractive are you?


Translation: Pics now


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## percyblueraincoat (Jun 2, 2009)

*hmm*

"Yeah, that's like asking me to completely obliterate my fight or flight processing. Where, if someone was coming at me with a knife, I would just stand there, blissfully unaware, till my gut was torn open."

Over active psychological protection devices.

"I can see peoples' trains of thought and see where they're going with any decisions or behavioral patterns they take on. I elementary school I got in trouble for finishing my teachers' sentences out loud. I just know."

Some times this can happen when a certain degree of rapport is established. But even then, observation, interpretation, assumptions and the placing of possibly false meaning onto things occurs. So, basically, you are either one of the most powerful beings on the face of the planet with the ability to read another human being like a book or various forms of belief systems and fears are encouraging you to judge people a particular way and make massive assumptions about their motives, intentions, actions and thoughts towards you.

"Many times this just makes people uninteresting because I already know them before they explain themselves to me."

Really? What was my first word? How many times have I had sex? When was the last time I lost a loved one and broke down on the floor in tears? When was the last time I experienced happiness and the love of another? Truth is, you know none of these things. So, am I uninteresting?

"Sometimes, in order to escape annoying people, I would explain them back to themselves and, POW! conversation over."

Well, actually, you're simply judging someone by assuming a false authority over the reality of another person. A person isn't this or that or the other thing because you assume they are. They may be. Sometimes you may hit the nail on the head. But you'll get it wrong a lot too and maybe acknowledging your capacity to be wrong about people when you make negative judgements about them. This may well help with the conversations and connecting with people. The person you meet for that brief period is not necessarily the full extent of the person.

"I not only need people to fight me, I need them to fight me intelligently; they need to be able to tell me I'm wrong and have the wear with all to back it up. Backing up an argument logically would be good. "

Funny you should say this. If I may suspend my modesty for a second, I've just done what you've asked for and so have other people on here.

"Say, many people, if kidnapped by someone who treated them kinder than their own loving parents and gave them everything they needed and let them roam free, say, on a different inhabitable planet with other cognitively aware humans, most people would grow to at least like the person (or alien?) who kidnapped them."

Massive assumption about the possibilities surrounding the development of Stockholm syndrome on alternative worlds.

"I would hate them with all my heart and always, and I mean ALWAYS, be searching for a way out.

This is how I feel about people. When I'm with people they take something away from me, whether material or spiritually/emotionally, and I never forget or forgive. I don't feel as if I have another half somewhere out there. I just want an equal. I have nothing that needs completing, I just want a relationship where ideas can be shared. Ideas that make me think."

That's all well and good. And maybe you will find that. But people don't necessarily take anything away from you even if you think they may be doing so. Or they don't do so automatically most of the time.

"Maybe people don't like to think as deeply as I do about every little thing. Many a person has stated I am "thinking to much" about or into something."

Some people do think as deeply as you do about things. I was the guy who, when someone was explaining chaos theory to me, got freaked out by the idea of a butterfly free universe. I mean, doesn't that sound like one of the most awful things ever? No butterflies. Why? What is wrong with butterflies? Who'd want that sort of thing to happen?

"Let me know what you think."


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

mbp86 said:


> Translation: Pics now


Well she mentions it at least twice. I am curious.


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

Maybe your too picky about who you want to be friends or a relationship with? To you it may seem that no one likes you, but really it may be the other way around. I've began to understand that I may also fall into this category as I don't find most people intriguing enough or 'beneficial' to some degree to be my friend(s). I don't think it's wrong because friends are sought after for beneficial purposes or else no one would really care to have friends or not. Still, you may be too picky. Or, perhaps, maybe no one has any benefit to you? Once again, this isn't strange I don't think. People with low-esteem automatically think there is something wrong with them just because they _may _not find interest in other people, but all that may indicate is that your not doing the things you want to do, and if you did that you'd probably be more interested in the people around you. Put us in a situation that doesn't interest us and we'll not be interested; put us in a place that does interest us and we will.

I will say that most attractive people, especially women, should have an easier time attracting the opposite sex. I believe what you say but I also think you may be too selective as well. If your as attractive as you say you are, I'm sure men around your age fancy you as well and not just older men.

What you need is some confidence in yourself. Do things that give you a sense of worth and stop focusing on the small things like eye contact. Try to focus on connections and interests. Find hobbies that interest you and make friends from that. Or, if you have a specific goal, attract people into your life that can help you with that. I've done that many times.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

matty said:


> Well it isnt asking you to completely change your fight or flight processes. More run it at 80% instead of 100%. Which isnt going to be easy. Then I guess you want for someone who can challenge you mental and has no flaws. Which is easier and which is more likely to land you in a relationship are two different things. Do you think your thoughts are reasonable or do you believe they are unreasonable. Not everyones traits can be deal breakers like you say. Could you be screening too tightly and missing out of possible people?
> 
> Do you mean when you are with people in general they take something away from you or previous people in your life have taken something away?
> 
> Many people dont like to think as deeply as you do. There is no wrong way of doing it. Only a common way.


Reducing my processes to 80% lets in 20% which just may be that one sociopath personality and I could find myself in a bad situation... And I am trying not to "settle" when it comes to picking people out as possible friends and lovers. I have had many acquaintances call me their "friend" but I have never felt the same way. I just don't have the wear with all to return those emotional feelings that make people call you a friend in the first place.

I don't mean that people's traits are deal breakers; for the general population it is more of a "lack-there-of" instead of the traits they already have.

In the way of people taking from me, I feel like I am a very generous person, and that many people take advantage of my giving and patient nature. I feel as if maybe, my actions give people the idea that I care for them more than I do the concrete floor we're standing upon, but I don't. I just tend to care for most things.

If a little rotting berry is out in the street I will risk possible death-by-car-accident in order to grab him and set him back with all his other little berries. I just can't see things be destroyed when I know I could have righted it. The same goes for people. If I can correct their issues, I will do everything in my willful power to do so. It's not because it is them, it is because I like to see things go "right."

People tend to try and take more meaning out of my actions than I have for them, thus either feeling entitled to take material things, thinking I am a generous person all the time for anything they may want (but not particularly need), or they speak like, "oh, yeah, my friend 'walden'..." or "yeah, we're good friends," automatically assuming I feel the same way about them that they do about me.

And when I state otherwise, they're shocked... and then they become annoying.

On the same token, I am looking for someone I can be interested in, beyond just correcting their wrongs, but I watch people (and watch them intensely) though I never find anyone, neither friend nor lover.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

jmoop said:


> Oh, you remind me of myself. Like you I can tell most of the time what the habits, desires and agendas a person will have just by a brief, initial observation. Like if a person looks/talks like this, they will act like that, have certain beliefs, or like to do activities X, Y, and Z. But I have recently tried to stop thinking this way and to try to actually get to know people. If all you do is observe people and judge them before getting to really know them you place yourself at a disadvantage. Some people who act a certain way or seem to fit a stereotype at first will sometimes surprise you and if you keep an open mind you might be able to "click" with some folks.
> 
> Also I agree with matty that you need to break down some of your internal walls and stop being so defensive so you can let somebody in. I have the same issue (which is why I have given up on ever finding someone to have a serious relationship with) so I can relate. It is tough being such an analytical and critical thinker that you can't help but try to understand people by judging them.


It's not so simple as observing and judging, at least, possibly not in the way I think you mean. When I watch people, 2 weeks later I can recount everything I saw them do, everything I heard them say, every expression they made. I watch people like a stalker... and I can do this to anyone in my surround space, hundreds of people simultaneously. That is were I am coming from when I finish peoples' sentences. I practically know what most people are thinking when they are just standing idle, and the moment they open their mouths to speak and can hold the conversation we may just have had by myself, and they are like "wow, how did you know?!" which is also part of the path in which I knew their verbally expressed thoughts were going to take....

People are quite boring when I can have the conversation with someone in my head days before it plays out and it THEN plays out exactly how I had it.

I don't just click with people because most people (well, all people I have thus far encountered), like I said before, tend to be put off by someone who seems smart alec-y.... OR they tend to want me to tell them everything.

I had seniors in high school asking me, when I was a freshman, if they could go play hacky sack... seriously... I don't mean to became the mother of every graduating class, but sometimes it's easy for people. I am a leader by nature and tend to know everything that's going on in order to avoid bad situations and make good situations happen to everything and everyone around me. I can see why people like to whine at me like they would their mother when they want a barbie doll, but that does not suffice for me. I need more from possible friends and lovers than this sort of onesidedness that I get from people...

I am not particularly interested in sexual relations or physical contact, but would not reject it if it was from someone I found interesting enough to warrant my interest in wanting to explore their physicality...

So here I sit alone again tonight, forum-chatting with what seems like a really well functioning NPC system... yet the emotions are not there as it seems like most other users here display (sheesh, even the NPC systems in many games seem more emotional than I am).


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

millenniumman75 said:


> Expect less; get more.


More like expect less, get less.


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## Brightpaperwarewolf (Oct 16, 2008)

How do you feel people take advantage of you? There simply no way you can "right" people. Each person is who they are in their core. What rewards do you get out of feeling this way?

I'm curious to know because by nature, I'm the same way and that's why I'm alone without a lover and with few friends. Because beyond a certain level, the caring is mingled in with feelings of indifference.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

so_so_shy said:


> Sounds like all you see in people are flaws and you feel superior to them. But we all have flaws, including yourself. If you want friends and lovers you are going to have to accept their flaws, just like they'll have to do the same with you.
> 
> And you think you have this skill that allows you to know all about a person in minutes, but that's nonsense. It takes time to really get to know people.


I've always wondered what exactly people mean when they state we "all" have flaws. "Flaws" are characteristics of a person or persons that are deemed by the presiding majority of a population to be something that is ill-fitted, incorrect, or detrimental to the individual or the group. Choosing to state you have flaws is just an easier way of settling for that which is less. I recognize which characteristics of mine teeter totter on detrimental. When they are not causing me issue, I can proudly state that I am flawless. Likewise, when I recognize they are, or have become detrimental to the image of myself that I wish to embody, I can state I have flaws.

After searching so long for people, I have found that if you use harsh tones, simple words, soft speech, smiles and frowns, roll your eyes, thrown them a curve ball topic, and ask NOT about their family, but of HOW THEY FEEL about their family, and their lives, you will learn a lot a person within a little a few short moments. Most people don't even know that you're doing it. Many just assume I have a really animated face.

People don't like to know they are easy to decipher, and many get angry if you let them know that. Being the mediator I am, I know how to soothe them and make them believe I want to be their friend. Yet nothing is in it for me, except escaping that possible confrontation. Sheesh, it's like I talk to people to escape confrontation most of the time (as I found out just blatantly ignoring people doesn't always make them go away...).


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

VanDamMan said:


> How attractive are you?


Quite, at least physically. I'm a black female (which makes my attractiveness in today's society not that of, say, I don't know, the most sexy white female you can think of) and I do not straighten my hair nor do I have gapped teeth... but I have found that black men fear me because I do not look like the stereotypical black girl, yet they do shuffle up to me and whisper, "uh... hey girl..." then shuffle away.

And I've had quite a few random men just pick me up and spin me around, in broad daylight; people I don't even know, and I wasn't even in a "safe" place like near a college campus or something... and then there's the "no-matter-what-I-wear-people-offer-me-money" prostitute thing... so I think it's safe to say I am assuredly attractive by today's standards.

But even when I was in those awkward teen years, I still found myself attractive (physically) when others did not. I just really like my body a lot, and am bent on keeping it safe from the hazards of other people.

I wish I was more emotionally attractive though.


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

walden said:


> Quite, at least physically. I'm a black female (which makes my attractiveness in today's society not that of, say, I don't know, the most sexy white female you can think of) and I do not straighten my hair nor do I have gapped teeth... but I have found that black men fear me because I do not look like the stereotypical black girl, yet they do shuffle up to me and whisper, "uh... hey girl..." then shuffle away.
> 
> And I've had quite a few random men just pick me up and spin me around, in broad daylight; people I don't even know, and I wasn't even in a "safe" place like near a college campus or something... and then there's the "no-matter-what-I-wear-people-offer-me-money" prostitute thing... so I think it's safe to say I am assuredly attractive by today's standards.
> 
> ...


Perhaps you can extract some physical attractiveness with a syringe and inject it into your personality.

That way men might still might be attracted to you when your looks fade and people wouldn't think you are a prostitute.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

quietgal said:


> It could be because people are just intimidated by you. By your own admission you're a very intelligent and competent person, and you know it. As so_so_shy pointed out it also seems like you tend to be somewhat judgmental and highly critical of others. This combination can be very off-putting, as most people don't like being judged, and they can sense when they're being judged.
> 
> Even if it's mostly true, I think it's presumptuous to believe that you can, as you put it, tell in minutes what a person "is into, what decisions they will make, what ideologies they will fall in and out of, how they view others and themselves, and practically anything else they want to know about themselves." If this were true you would understand better why people have acted the way they do around you.
> 
> Personally, while you come off as a very intelligent and analytical person, you seem to be lacking humility, tolerance, and compassionate understanding of other people. I think you should start trying to approach people with a more open mind and heart; stop analyzing them and trying to figure them out like logic puzzles, and simply try to enjoy their company without expectations of the future, or judgments of their value or qualities.


It's not so much "understanding why people act the way they do around me," as it is that I don't get anything out of being around them. You stated I should try to enjoy their company, and I have been for years... that is, I have been "trying" to enjoy their company for years. I don't even enjoy my parent's company, I just like the things they can teach me and what refections of myself I am able to see when I speak to them.

I think most people understand that people are always judging them, it's just that people don't like the negative judgment. When someone thinks you're interesting, whether by the way you look, the way you move, or the things you say, they have just judged you. And, like most people, you're using the word "judgment" as a "bad/negative" thing. We are all passing judgments, all the time. I just heed peoples neutral traits, as well as their good and bad traits. The moment I start listing the bad ones I'm seen as a judgmental *******, for all intensive purposes. If I say someone is pretty, someone is nice, someone is caring, I become a gosh-darn great person. Yet, in both instances I was passing very fixed, and possibly ill-informed, judgment.

Making logic of our surroundings is exactly what humans do. It's what our brain does. Even the most crazy or most minimally, cognitively functioning brain does this. Seeing logic in something allows us to pass the judgments that have kept the human race going this long. Throwing out one or the other would most definitely lead to a quite death. Thus, this is not a solution.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

bwidger85 said:


> Maybe your too picky about who you want to be friends or a relationship with? To you it may seem that no one likes you, but really it may be the other way around. I've began to understand that I may also fall into this category as I don't find most people intriguing enough or 'beneficial' to some degree to be my friend(s). I don't think it's wrong because friends are sought after for beneficial purposes or else no one would really care to have friends or not. Still, you may be too picky. Or, perhaps, maybe no one has any benefit to you? Once again, this isn't strange I don't think. People with low-esteem automatically think there is something wrong with them just because they _may _not find interest in other people, but all that may indicate is that your not doing the things you want to do, and if you did that you'd probably be more interested in the people around you. Put us in a situation that doesn't interest us and we'll not be interested; put us in a place that does interest us and we will.
> 
> I will say that most attractive people, especially women, should have an easier time attracting the opposite sex. I believe what you say but I also think you may be too selective as well. If your as attractive as you say you are, I'm sure men around your age fancy you as well and not just older men.
> 
> What you need is some confidence in yourself. Do things that give you a sense of worth and stop focusing on the small things like eye contact. Try to focus on connections and interests. Find hobbies that interest you and make friends from that. Or, if you have a specific goal, attract people into your life that can help you with that. I've done that many times.


Well, I do have quite a few public hobbies, but I tend to out perform people. I am an avid anime watcher and manga reader, and I draw quite well (aka most people don't know I'm NOT a mangaka), but when I go and hang out at conventions or clubs most people act much of the way I've explained above. They ask me what series I like, and I list things that aren't mainstream and they have no idea what it is (I don't have a problem with mainstream, it's just that I had watched/read most of these series 5-10 years prior to it's American release, and I have tired of it). Try to explain a series and they eyes get cloudy because it doesn't include the stereotypical qualities they market to American's nowadays.

I ask them what they're into and it, Pokemon, Naruto, One Piece, Full Metal Alchemist, and whatever else plays on adult swim/cartoon network, and any other channel. Oh yeah... and Bleach. Not that I dislike these series, but I watched them myself years before they began airing in American, and for the most part, I tend to notice (or make up) more subtleties than what your most obsessive friend may.

AKA, I know more about the hobbies in which I partake in than anyone else I have thus run spoken to. Which again comes to the conclusion of me teaching them something and I, myself, only learning that this particular person is just another one of all the others.

Because I lack sexual interest in other people unless they interest me in other ways (never had sex and don't plan on settling just to get the "experience"), I tend to have a harsher reaction to people who make it known they want to have sex. I will talk cordially to someone until they say "hey, so how much?" or "we should head to my place" (as guys are so stereotypical sometimes... especially in Japan....) then that's when I get "killing eyes." It let's people know they are not welcome around me anymore. Not that they ever were, but now they have become a nuisance.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

Brightpaperwarewolf said:


> How do you feel people take advantage of you? There simply no way you can "right" people. Each person is who they are in their core. What rewards do you get out of feeling this way?
> 
> I'm curious to know because by nature, I'm the same way and that's why I'm alone without a lover and with few friends. Because beyond a certain level, the caring is mingled in with feelings of indifference.


Oh, I'm not righting people. I'm righting the things around them to give them the best chances for whatever outcome they are pursuing. It because "taking advantage" when they forgo their original goals, tempted by my assistance to assume I will assist them in every way, then assume I want to be their friend.

Example. Say if someone was hungry, and generally made healthy food choices, but they happen to be out on the road and there was a burger joint. They grab a burger because they're hungry. But when they return to that comfort zone, they get home and continue to eat burgers, then get fat, then get heart disease.

I'm like the burgers they continued to eat. I oblige once or twice. When someone latches on I become poisonous and always make it my business to disappear from there lives, whether by scaring them off or making it known I am now out to destroy them. But usually it doesn't come to that. Most people realize I'm poisonous if they latch on to just the do-good part of my personality. Kind of like, take the whole or have none of it, sort of thing.


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

Sounds like your a little too narrow in your efforts to connect with others. There has to be SOMETHING. To say there is nothing to connect you with others, I would have to say your being too narrowly minded, and I don't mean that to insult.

Just because you know something that others may not doesn't mean you can't find something about them interesting. In fact, I seriously doubt that someone with all their complexities doesn't have something about them worth knowing. And I know that goes beyond what I said earlier, but I guess I was basing that off of first impressions. If you really want to be interested in someone, sometimes you have to get to know them more first.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

VanDamMan said:


> Perhaps you can extract some physical attractiveness with a syringe and inject it into your personality.
> 
> That way men might still might be attracted to you when your looks fade and people wouldn't think you are a prostitute.


Wouldn't it be even better if I could gain a more attractive personality without having to diminish another part of myself. I have often told my parents that I may have to hit myself over the head with a rock in order to just complete destroy certain functions of my brain, and thus become attractive.

I find it quite deflating that I must destroy a positive trait in myself in order to gain another... and this sort of theorizing seems to extend into many aspect of beauty and attractiveness, not just for/with myself.

*sigh*


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

bwidger85 said:


> Sounds like your a little too narrow in your efforts to connect with others. There has to be SOMETHING. To say there is nothing to connect you with others, I would have to say your being too narrowly minded, and I don't mean that to insult.
> 
> Just because you know something that others may not doesn't mean you can't find something about them interesting. In fact, I seriously doubt that someone with all their complexities doesn't have something about them worth knowing. And I know that goes beyond what I said earlier, but I guess I was basing that off of first impressions. If you really want to be interested in someone, sometimes you have to get to know them more first.


It's not really about "worth" of knowing them. It's about how I connect to them. Many of the things I know I wouldn't had there not been people scatter throughout my life, thus knowing them enough to ask the questions and press for answers was a good thing.

I find the information I can get from people far more interesting than the person themselves. It is like a book. If it has no information in which I find interesting, I don't just innately like the book. It is not natural for me to just like people just because they are people. I like the information they can provide, and the ease of access in which the provide it, but I do not like them. I can derive facts from opinions but I do not care for opinions themselves (which are all judgments are).

A boy tells me "that girl is nice." It doesn't sway my opinion about that girl. She has the possibility to be anything I judge her to be. And in all this the boy is the one who is hurt because his judgment/opinion about a situation did not sway my thoughts. I have no reason to believe people, because I am competent enough to pass my own judgments. I don't need theirs. Although, if the boy states the girl is nice, I can derive the theoretical fact that the girl had treated the boy kindly in some instance, and probably a recent instance at that. It does not change how I feel toward the girl or how I feel toward the boy. This is usually when people start wondering what's "wrong" with me.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

If you have brains and beauty, guys will be intimidated by you. Pretty and smart girls often have very high standards. Also, most guys aren't willing to put in the intense amount of effort it takes to impress women who are like you.


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

No, I think that's normal. What people may seem as 'wrong' with you is that you haven't connected with anyone. I find it difficult to believe that if you knew enough of someone for a specific time you couldn't make a connection. I've had friends of which we operate completely different and to my surprise they are deep intellectuals. I think people are designed to be that way. If you have emotions your going to be complex and diversified and interesting in some aspect. I can't really fathom that you can't make connections with others. The only setback I can think of that would impose upon that would be someone mentally challenged or on drugs.

That is really all I'm going to say about that because I think that is as far as I can say what I need to say. Just give someone the patience and time and you'll most likely be pleasantly surprised.


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## bsd3355 (Nov 30, 2005)

mbp86 said:


> Also, most guys aren't willing to put in the intense amount of effort it takes to impress women who are like you.


Yeah, seeming too good for other people is a connection killer, and to be honest, I seriously doubt that you can't connect with others. I find that very unlikely unless your giving up on someone incredibly too soon.

I'll shut up now. I'm no doctor. I think your over thinking this too much though. This stuff is natural if you let it, SA or no SA.


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## Judi (Jun 22, 2009)

Are you sure you have SA? Have you been to a psychologist/psychiatrist? It sounds to me like you have something else... but I'd rather not say what it is...


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## LostPancake (Apr 8, 2009)

You sound really intelligent - maybe if you went to some place like Harvard, you could meet some people you connected with better? 

It sounds like you're looking for more of an intellectual connection than an emotional one, anyway. Normally I would see things like that as a repression of emotions, but maybe it's just that you're on a different level from people around you?

But then my emotions got pretty buried in childhood, and the defenses against them are still there. It made connecting with people really difficult. 

And without emotions, you wind up basing your identity on ego images, which are often either inflated or deflated (ie either grandiosity or feeling utterly worthless).


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## sacred (May 25, 2009)

have you ever experienced significant emotional or physical pain? the reason why im asking is i think people like you have been too sheltered and pampered throughout your life and because of that dont get to experience alot of the emotions good and bad and pain most people do.

maybe that doesnt explain everything but it could be part of the puzzle.

get out there make a friend have that friend die unexpectedly and maybe you might feel something.

or maybe we could warp you back to ww2 and you could spend a week or two in a concentration camp.

or maybe you just have aspergers syndrome?


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

walden said:


> Wouldn't it be even better if I could gain a more attractive personality without having to diminish another part of myself. I have often told my parents that I may have to hit myself over the head with a rock in order to just complete destroy certain functions of my brain, and thus become attractive.
> 
> I find it quite deflating that I must destroy a positive trait in myself in order to gain another... and this sort of theorizing seems to extend into many aspect of beauty and attractiveness, not just for/with myself.
> 
> *sigh*


Well so far, your "self-confidence" in your looks makes you seem rather ugly. There are some externalities to beauty.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

walden said:


> Reducing my processes to 80% lets in 20% which just may be that one sociopath personality and I could find myself in a bad situation... And I am trying not to "settle" when it comes to picking people out as possible friends and lovers. I have had many acquaintances call me their "friend" but I have never felt the same way. I just don't have the wear with all to return those emotional feelings that make people call you a friend in the first place.
> 
> I don't mean that people's traits are deal breakers; for the general population it is more of a "lack-there-of" instead of the traits they already have.
> 
> ...


Ok, How is reducing your processes 'settling'? By the sounds of it you dismiss 99% of people before they have even said 'my name is' sorry if I am wrong but you assume your thoughts on people way to early. I dont even know what you go on half the time. I am pretty sure that if someone worked me out within minutes on the street I would be very surprised. Maybe even buy them a drink and ask them my future. Bottom line is that you dismiss people way too early. It appears that you have the opinion that you are right and everyone else is wrong, which is fine. But why ask questions if you already know the answers? At the end of the day you and I know that something has to change. What it is lies within you.

I dont believe you should be friends with people to correct them. Or date people for the same reason, if you cant accept them for who they are then that is a huge problem. Have you met anyone which you accept how they are? Or do you see flaws in everyone and see it as your mission to correct them? People have flaws, it is human nature, sure some should be corrected but at the end of the day it is part of what makes use unique, the good, the bad and the ugly.


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## Ambivert (Jan 16, 2010)

walden said:


> It's not really about "worth" of knowing them. It's about how I connect to them. Many of the things I know I wouldn't had there not been people scatter throughout my life, thus knowing them enough to ask the questions and press for answers was a good thing.
> 
> I find the information I can get from people far more interesting than the person themselves. It is like a book. If it has no information in which I find interesting, I don't just innately like the book. It is not natural for me to just like people just because they are people. I like the information they can provide, and the ease of access in which the provide it, but I do not like them. I can derive facts from opinions but I do not care for opinions themselves (which are all judgments are).
> 
> A boy tells me "that girl is nice." It doesn't sway my opinion about that girl. She has the possibility to be anything I judge her to be. And in all this the boy is the one who is hurt because his judgment/opinion about a situation did not sway my thoughts. I have no reason to believe people, because I am competent enough to pass my own judgments. I don't need theirs. Although, if the boy states the girl is nice, I can derive the theoretical fact that the girl had treated the boy kindly in some instance, and probably a recent instance at that. It does not change how I feel toward the girl or how I feel toward the boy. This is usually when people start wondering what's "wrong" with me.


You're way too over-analytical and intellectualizing about all facets of your life. I used to be like you. Then I stepped back and "smelled the roses" for lack of a better cliche.

Now I feel much more happier like a weight has been lifted off my shoulders. I used to be scared that I would drop my intellectual barriers and "be like them" but now I see that there's nothing to be scared of. It was all just a self-defense mechanism I created to protect myself from future rejection. Reject them before they could reject me! Of course my words are hard to understand right now but you'll get them sooner or later. Advice: stop analyzing and start living. Learn to trust people and you'll get far (but of course have some common sense along the journey as well)


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

walden said:


> More like expect less, get less.


Nope, expect less; get more.

I hate to think what you think of myself and everyone else on the forum. I am quite fine with who I am, I accept that I may not be anything, but I am someone and I have a lot to offer. I am full of flaws and I accept them. Just because you look down on people does not mean you are situated above them.


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## Judi (Jun 22, 2009)

I find it ironic that the OP is afraid of sociopaths when her personality traits are indicative of psychopathic behaviour. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopath


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## quietgal (Oct 18, 2007)

walden said:


> It's not so much "understanding why people act the way they do around me," as it is that I don't get anything out of being around them. You stated I should try to enjoy their company, and I have been for years... that is, I have been "trying" to enjoy their company for years. I don't even enjoy my parent's company, I just like the things they can teach me and what refections of myself I am able to see when I speak to them.
> 
> I think most people understand that people are always judging them, it's just that people don't like the negative judgment. When someone thinks you're interesting, whether by the way you look, the way you move, or the things you say, they have just judged you. And, like most people, you're using the word "judgment" as a "bad/negative" thing. We are all passing judgments, all the time. I just heed peoples neutral traits, as well as their good and bad traits. The moment I start listing the bad ones I'm seen as a judgmental *******, for all intensive purposes. If I say someone is pretty, someone is nice, someone is caring, I become a gosh-darn great person. Yet, in both instances I was passing very fixed, and possibly ill-informed, judgment.


Yes, the term "judgment" has a negative connotation even though you can also literally judge someone as being good, I agree with that. I meant it in the usual sense that people don't like to be judged negatively. People liked to be judged positively. When you compliment people, treat them well and give them the benefit of the doubt, people will be more open to building up social ties and establishing rapport. Sometimes it's necessary to be critical of others, like when you're trying to teach them something, or you want to prevent them from making a mistake, or hurting yourself/others. But why take it upon yourself to go around analyzing people so systematically, as if God himself had appointed you their judge? Is that really necessary?

You talked about liking the information in a book, rather than the book itself. Do you actually speak this way? Do you say to other people, "I like the information in this book," or "I like the enjoyment this anime gives me," rather than "I like this book, or "I like this anime?" I'm not sure I understand. It's as if you see people as simply organic knowledge vending-machines waiting around for you to push the right buttons so that they may dispense their knowledge for you. I think that's a very cold and limiting view of people.

It's true that people derive tangible benefits from each other, and that's part of why we inherently like other people. We're social animals who take inherent pleasure in each other, and that's just part of our nature, just like it's part of your nature to like knowledge. But I don't see why you have to draw such a rigid separation between the benefits you get from a person and the person herself. If you like the fresh water that a spring provides, does that necessarily mean that you can't like the spring? If you like the sustaining power that water provides your body, does that mean you can't like the water? I don't get this.

If you can't experience pleasure just being around another human being, I think that's a real issue, as that's part of what makes us human. I don't think it's beyond you, but I think you might be subconsciously suppressing this potential. Have you had traumatic experiences with people in the past, or experienced some kind of abuse/neglect?


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

Judi said:


> Are you sure you have SA? Have you been to a psychologist/psychiatrist? It sounds to me like you have something else... but I'd rather not say what it is...


A therapist I saw at Kaiser thought I had traits akin to Aspergers but would not formally diagnose me till I'd had more visits... but I didn't really care for her because she didn't provide me with information I didn't already know.

I certainly have qualities of SA when people confront me, face to face. When speaking to people face to face my voice and words become slurred, I get sweaty to the point of drops running down my face, and I start shaking.

Realize, this only happens when people come up to me. If I go up to people, or volunteer to give a speech, I'm perfectly fine. This is certainly related to feeling like I am in control of the situation. When I'm approached I don't know instinctively what that person is planning to do (though they probably just want to talk) but when I go up to them, because I am the one who made the move, I feel in control... Thus the SA symptoms don't set in...


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

LostPancake said:


> You sound really intelligent - maybe if you went to some place like Harvard, you could meet some people you connected with better?
> 
> It sounds like you're looking for more of an intellectual connection than an emotional one, anyway. Normally I would see things like that as a repression of emotions, but maybe it's just that you're on a different level from people around you?
> 
> ...


I feel like, for myself, the intellectual has to come before the emotional. I need to know what kind of functionality a person has before I commit to them. And outside of my immediate family members (and I mean the most immediate members, for I do not care for aunts, uncles, nephews, grandparents, or my parents'/siblings' close friends), I have not found that people serve any other function aside from providing information.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

sacred said:


> have you ever experienced significant emotional or physical pain? the reason why im asking is i think people like you have been too sheltered and pampered throughout your life and because of that dont get to experience alot of the emotions good and bad and pain most people do.
> 
> maybe that doesnt explain everything but it could be part of the puzzle.
> 
> ...


Dang, seriously. No, I have never felt serious emotional or physical pain. Worst emotional was probably when my mom thought I was racist for not liking black people (when I am black), then when she found out I didn't like any people suddenly it was okay.... nevermind that I didn't have any relations outside of my family. Worst physical pain was a sprained ankle.

I don't really want to experience these pains, and actually that is what keeps me from people as, from watching others, I don't see that the benefits outweigh the pain I see people suffer at the hands of each other.

Seriously, if it meant possible death in order to learn how to be emotional with others, I would become a hermit on some remote island. Not worth it at all.

And, yeah, I probably have Aspergers as well.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

VanDamMan said:


> Well so far, your "self-confidence" in your looks makes you seem rather ugly. There are some externalities to beauty.


That would explain why I am rather repulsive. I think most people can sense how I feel about them well before they come within 3 feet of me. They like to ogle but not approach.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

matty said:


> Ok, How is reducing your processes 'settling'? By the sounds of it you dismiss 99% of people before they have even said 'my name is' sorry if I am wrong but you assume your thoughts on people way to early. I dont even know what you go on half the time. I am pretty sure that if someone worked me out within minutes on the street I would be very surprised. Maybe even buy them a drink and ask them my future. Bottom line is that you dismiss people way too early. It appears that you have the opinion that you are right and everyone else is wrong, which is fine. But why ask questions if you already know the answers? At the end of the day you and I know that something has to change. What it is lies within you.
> 
> I dont believe you should be friends with people to correct them. Or date people for the same reason, if you cant accept them for who they are then that is a huge problem. Have you met anyone which you accept how they are? Or do you see flaws in everyone and see it as your mission to correct them? People have flaws, it is human nature, sure some should be corrected but at the end of the day it is part of what makes use unique, the good, the bad and the ugly.


I didn't say reducing was settling, reducing my processes will allow for dangerous people to enter my world. I tend to put off all people as I myself tend to be lucky when it comes to my physical well being, but my personality does not draw predators.

Also, I tend to ignore people who start off with the stereotypical "Hi, I'm..." I just really do not like that statement... I need someone who is interesting from the first moments. Saying something so common as that makes you seem just like everyone else and from that point on, if you don't recover, I'm uninterested.

I'm not out to correct people. I don't care how people are, as long as it isn't destroying my life. When I stated that I "correct" people, I am talking only about what they are doing. EXAMPLE. If someone sets a cup down on the table, I instantly see them getting up to grab something, walking back towards the desk and knocking it off. So I move the cup, just inches, the moment they get up.

I've tested my foresight before, and found that if I don't correct these things, about 80% of the time the bad thing happens and the person will spill the drink on themselves. So I tend to just adjust things. I do not care to change people at all.

I accept almost all people exactly as they are, they just don't interest me (I won't accept people who try to kill me or my family members, and I won't try to change them so much as trying to destroy them back).


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

counterfeit self said:


> You're way too over-analytical and intellectualizing about all facets of your life. I used to be like you. Then I stepped back and "smelled the roses" for lack of a better cliche.
> 
> Now I feel much more happier like a weight has been lifted off my shoulders. I used to be scared that I would drop my intellectual barriers and "be like them" but now I see that there's nothing to be scared of. It was all just a self-defense mechanism I created to protect myself from future rejection. Reject them before they could reject me! Of course my words are hard to understand right now but you'll get them sooner or later. Advice: stop analyzing and start living. Learn to trust people and you'll get far (but of course have some common sense along the journey as well)


No. It's not hard to understand. But you do realize that you're saying that you eventually got over your fear and became exactly "like them," right? I do not want to become "like them." In that sense, I am rejecting them, for I do not want to be like them. They may have very specific emotional traits that intrigue me, but very few. I want to find happiness without having to lessen myself.

Instead I want to grow myself and become more so I can have and keep personality traits that I consider important without feeling like I have diminished myself. I want to go "upward" and be able to gain interpersonal relations without feeling I am pretending (as I feel now and have felt since I was put into the school system, and then subsequently thrown into adult life).


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

matty said:


> Nope, expect less; get more.
> 
> I hate to think what you think of myself and everyone else on the forum. I am quite fine with who I am, I accept that I may not be anything, but I am someone and I have a lot to offer. I am full of flaws and I accept them. Just because you look down on people does not mean you are situated above them.


I'm not saying you don't have anything to offer. This is all about how I interpret what it is you are offering. It is like when someone watches, I don't know, sesame street, and person A thinks "oh, I just learned about counting numbers and eating cookies," while person B thinks "oh my god, there are hundreds of sexual connotations in this show! Is this really a children's show? This is what happens when adults try to create childlike things! It's all sex!"

Neither interpretation is wrong for we all interpret the world they way we choose to, but I find it that I do not know why I lack the emotional interpretation, given the fact that I did not have traumatic life experiences, abuse, or otherwise. My parents thought I was quite normal and anyone would, even now, think so if they saw me chatting with my family, but I cannot connect with other people like that.

I feel like I just don't understand how to create relationships. I feel like I only love my siblings and parents because they have been around me all my life and I got use to the situation.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

Judi said:


> I find it ironic that the OP is afraid of sociopaths when her personality traits are indicative of psychopathic behaviour. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopath


Gosh, you will not imagine how much research I did on mental and personality disorders. I think I purchased and read about 150 books and did at least 6 month worth of hard scouring on the web.

For about a week I thought it was possible I was a sociopath, and when it started to become clear I wasn't, I really began to wish I was, because they seemed to be completely free of emotional problems, to the point where it didn't bother them that they didn't have emotional ties to people. Sociopathy seemed like a way out.

Yes, I have psychopathic tendencies... along with a few other things. The point I was making is that I do not want to draw someone to me who can go on pretending interest in me for 45 years, all in a very well thought out plan to kill me when I turned 67, or something... I do not what to get caught up in something like that.

People tend to bring baggage along or be baggage themselves.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

quietgal said:


> Yes, the term "judgment" has a negative connotation even though you can also literally judge someone as being good, I agree with that. I meant it in the usual sense that people don't like to be judged negatively. People liked to be judged positively. When you compliment people, treat them well and give them the benefit of the doubt, people will be more open to building up social ties and establishing rapport. Sometimes it's necessary to be critical of others, like when you're trying to teach them something, or you want to prevent them from making a mistake, or hurting yourself/others. But why take it upon yourself to go around analyzing people so systematically, as if God himself had appointed you their judge? Is that really necessary?
> 
> You talked about liking the information in a book, rather than the book itself. Do you actually speak this way? Do you say to other people, "I like the information in this book," or "I like the enjoyment this anime gives me," rather than "I like this book, or "I like this anime?" I'm not sure I understand. It's as if you see people as simply organic knowledge vending-machines waiting around for you to push the right buttons so that they may dispense their knowledge for you. I think that's a very cold and limiting view of people.
> 
> ...


When I judge people it is only in relation to how they will affect me. I do not care what they do with others unless I feel I can learn from their actions or if their actions become life-threatening. I do not judge the like God, for I do not care for them unless they disrupt my life, whether for better or worse.

Yes. I do talk like that. I make it subtlety clear that I do not like anything for "what it is." I like specific things about everything. If I find something I like completely and wholly, with no animosity toward any of its parts, that's when I'll state "I like it." Otherwise, I will state that "I like the roundness of that thing," or such similar statements.

I would say "I like spring," only if there was nothing I disliked about spring, and such is not the case. I cannot yet think of something that I don't dislike or, at least, not care for some part of it.

The same goes for people.

By the way, I am not subconsciously suppressing it. This is a very conscious process. I make it well known that I do not like being in the presence of others. This stems from the fact that I seem to have a sensitivity to touching motorized things...

What's that mean? I don't like touching or being in the obvious vicinity of things that move on their own. And I especially don't like touching them.

Due to my wishes to remain in society, I put up with going out to shop, work, and the like, but if you saw me move through a crowd, you would be amazed. I bend over backwards not to touch people, which must certainly come off like I am repulsed by them, and thus they feel rejected by me, and thus they reject me themselves.

No. Exposure therapy does not help. I actually will freeze up for about an hour, using my toe muscles to hold my toes apart, keep my legs apart, spread my arms, separate my fingers, and open my mouth (moving my tongue away from my inner-mouth, and opening my eyes, wishing so hard I would not blink.

I do not like touching, and since touching is part of our social constructs, the anxiety I get from such motion is exactly what let me to assume another one of my characteristics causing a problem was social anxiety (mixed with Aphenphosmphobia and OCD).


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## quietgal (Oct 18, 2007)

walden said:


> Yes. I do talk like that. I make it subtlety clear that I do not like anything for "what it is." I like specific things about everything. If I find something I like completely and wholly, with no animosity toward any of its parts, that's when I'll state "I like it." Otherwise, I will state that "I like the roundness of that thing," or such similar statements.
> 
> I would say "I like spring," only if there was nothing I disliked about spring, and such is not the case. I cannot yet think of something that I don't dislike or, at least, not care for some part of it.
> 
> The same goes for people.


Sorry, I meant a spring - like a source that fresh water flows out of.

I still don't get it. On the one hand, you say you don't like anything for "what it is," but on the other hand, you say that you'll like something "for what it is" so long as you like every part of it (insofar as "it" is the sum of its parts).

You don't have to like every part of someone. But don't you think it'd be kind of awkward if instead of saying to someone, "I love you," you have to say, "I love your muscles, your intelligence, your eyes, your smile, your hands, but not your temper, your morning breath, or your addiction to watching crappy reality tv-shows?" Most people don't really talk or think at that level of specificity all the time, and for good reason. If you had to function at that level of specificity and accuracy all the time, you probably wouldn't get very much done. A little ambiguity won't kill you.



walden said:


> By the way, I am not subconsciously suppressing it. This is a very conscious process. I make it well known that I do not like being in the presence of others. This stems from the fact that I seem to have a sensitivity to touching motorized things...


It seems like you're conscious _of_ it, but what I meant was that this inability to enjoy other people's presence is not something you can consciously control. You said yourself you've been trying to enjoy other people's company for years, but you're unable to. And you don't really know why that is, or how to change it. Why is that you enjoy manga so much, unless you read purely educational manga? It must be that you still are able to feel some emotional connection and sympathy with the characters in it, and at least with the _idea _of emotional connection with another person.

It just seems like you're suffering a lot of the symptoms of abuse, even though you say you've never experienced anything like that in the past. I don't know how much help any of this can be to you. Maybe talking about it is helping? It looks like you've thought about these issues a lot.


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## Ambivert (Jan 16, 2010)

walden said:


> No. It's not hard to understand. But you do realize that you're saying that you eventually got over your fear and became exactly "like them," right? I do not want to become "like them." In that sense, I am rejecting them, for I do not want to be like them. They may have very specific emotional traits that intrigue me, but very few. I want to find happiness without having to lessen myself.
> 
> Instead I want to grow myself and become more so I can have and keep personality traits that I consider important without feeling like I have diminished myself. I want to go "upward" and be able to gain interpersonal relations without feeling I am pretending (as I feel now and have felt since I was put into the school system, and then subsequently thrown into adult life).


haha no I haven't become like them, I've just gotten closer to them while maintaining my own integrity and comfort zone.

I used to be scared of the phrase "ignorance is bliss". But now I try to revel in ignorant abashed pleasure every so often, while maintaining comfortable corner space in my brain for my deeper accumulated knowledge and sense of self.

I have carved out a comfortable niche for myself, both in social relation to others and in my mind. Sounds to me like you need to look for people with values similar to your own, try listing them out and see what cultural archetype/group fits those parameters the best.


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## so_so_shy (Sep 5, 2005)

I don't understand why you even want somebody to yearn for you. You don't like anybody, not even your own family.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

quietgal said:


> Sorry, I meant a spring - like a source that fresh water flows out of.
> 
> I still don't get it. On the one hand, you say you don't like anything for "what it is," but on the other hand, you say that you'll like something "for what it is" so long as you like every part of it (insofar as "it" is the sum of its parts).
> 
> ...


Oh,yeah... I died on the couch yesterday. Sorry for the misinterpretation.

I know what you're saying about not having to like everything about someone but, because I grew up with my parents and siblings, I already liked them before I knew what I didn't like about them, and thus the things I knew and liked about them outweighed the bad things when I was finally able to realize them... but I have decided to stop communicating on an emotional level with some of my siblings because they are just... well, idiots... and I cannot keep them in my life any longer.

As for people outside my family, I don't think they are good or bad until I see them do or act in some way that I would not want in my life (aka. they may not be a good or bad person but what they do is recognized by myself as good or bad), and thus make the judgment of whether I want to be around this person or not.

Because what good people do for me is severely limited, and those who do do good for me almost always want me to do good back to them (setting expectations on me), I tend to find that much of what most people would think is "doing good" is actually bad, to me.

Say, if someone gave me a flower because I looked sad. Starting off a relationship with pity earns a huge "let-me-get-the-hell-away-from-this-person" response. Even if isn't pity and instead it is someone trying to "cheer-me-up," then they need to get it together and write a $100 check (or grab some cash) and hand it over. Then I'd be interested.

The only problem with that is that a person handing over money to someone not asking for it has expectations to one degree or another, and may show up later in my life saying, "remember when I gave you $100? So can you do *blank* for me?" and actually expect me to honor it.

I do think like that all the time and, yes, it adds to the stress, which is probably killing me more than a "little ambiguity" would, but I know becoming ambiguous is wrong for me, just as someone knows they would never want to become a prostitute. It makes me feel fake, wrong, and actual gives me that "dropping heart" feeling, and that's just when I think about it.

Well, I feel like I could if I really wanted to, but the risks do not outweigh the benefits. People swarm, and where there's safety in numbers there is also internal violence in numbers. I can stand to be around people for safety, and I can do it without being completely outcast because of how I look and my ability to know what people want to hear, but I stay away from emotional ties because 85% of murder is people killing people they know on an interpersonal level. And since I do not know the joy of being around other people, the risk does not outweigh the benefit with other people as it does in my immediate family.

I like manga and anime because I can get the emotional fix humans need to continue to thrive without the fear of that human coming to kill me. Yes, these characters could pop out of a parallel dimension and come after me but, in order to hold on to what little sanity I have left, I have decided to overlook that negative, possible aspect, and enjoy the emotional rise I get from watching these characters.

Yeah, I guess... since I do it quiet often. The only problem is that talking about it only reinforces the way I think, it doesn't make me change it. And, yeah, that is a major problem I run into when talking to people as most of them assume that there is some abuse I am suppressing, but I assure you, there is none.

I think I just landed on a train of thought that allowed me to get over my fear of life by turning it into a fear of people, which allowed me to live through other facets of my life without so much fear. I will tell you though, I am what I call "deathly afraid of death." I don't accept it, I don't want it, I don't want to hear about it, and yet I... (well, I wouldn't say I "like").... but I always want to see what dead bodies look like. I wonder if that is some coping mechanism as well... Probably.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

counterfeit self said:


> haha no I haven't become like them, I've just gotten closer to them while maintaining my own integrity and comfort zone.
> 
> I used to be scared of the phrase "ignorance is bliss". But now I try to revel in ignorant abashed pleasure every so often, while maintaining comfortable corner space in my brain for my deeper accumulated knowledge and sense of self.
> 
> I have carved out a comfortable niche for myself, both in social relation to others and in my mind. Sounds to me like you need to look for people with values similar to your own, try listing them out and see what cultural archetype/group fits those parameters the best.


See, and that is what I do not know how to do. You have accomplished it for yourself but I do not feel like I could go about it the way you have.

I cannot perform "ignorance is bliss," if you get what I mean. If someone is approaching me, within 2 seconds my brain has made up about 200 different ways this conversation could go, honing in about 50-60 solely based off how the person appears, and then focuses on the bad ones to ensure I make the quickest move on getting away if things "go south." I completely trust my own will to survive. I believe my body and brain know what to do to keep my physical self alive, and that comes first and foremost. Nothing can trump that, for if I'm dead I could do nothing more with this physical world (let's proceed without going into the hundreds of theories about what happens after death, if there is an "after death").

I have done that, but I have not found that any particular group of people fits myself. That aside, I have seen very few, and I mean VERY FEW, people I am physically attracted to. And obviously even less that I am emotionally attracted to.

I have found that when people who have a few similar traits talk to me, I am always distracted by the fact that I don't like how they look. It's not that they are ugly, but I have an I for replication that allows me to capture all the little details, then I start focusing on which I like and which I don't like. They faces I "like" are those faces that have far more positive characteristics than negative, and those are things you can't change.

People don't become prettier, or at least "less ugly," the more time I spend with them. This does seem to be something most people do. Talking to my siblings about their friends, they found that they found their friends attractive, even though most people looking from the outside would have placed them at below average.

I see bone structure, which means if a large person looses weight, they still look the same to me (facially), and it does not change how I feel about them. The same goes for when people put on makeup.

Much of the reason I can't talk to other females for an extended period of time is because I can see all their makeup and am sitting there, trying to listen to an uninteresting conversation while piecing together why they felt they needed to go the route of makeup, whether because they have unflattering bone structure (and want to change the depth perception) or have bad skin . No. I do not wear makeup and never have, nor will I ever.

Of the faces I like, obviously these people are pretty enough and/or talented enough to be in the public eye, but seeing their pretty faces does not make me want to meet them in the least. I can make the differentiation between pretty physically and the rest of the person.

My mother once asked me (well, she probably asked me more than once to see if my answer would changed when she sensed I was in different moods), if I had acquired backstage passes of the people I like the face of (he is a musician), would I want to meet him. Every time I said "no, because I don't know him and don't care to."

I don't have some ideology that he is a great guy. It's not going to crush my dreams of how I imagine him to be if he doesn't live up to it, mainly because I don't have any dreams of what he is like. As previously stated, I don't care about people who are not physically in my vicinity, and of those people who are, I don't care to know them unless the infringe upon my life somehow. I make no judgment on these people unless they seem like they are going to become another Hitler or something and make people around me become harmful to me.

Thus, that "spotted someone pretty across the room" thing doesn't work for me. I can recognize someone as physically attractive but that does not make me want to know them. And this is also due, in part, to the fact that I am not really interested in having sex. I mean, if the right (and I mean "right" in every sense) person comes along, fine. But, when other 22 year olds are hopping around like bunnies, or religiously chaste, I just don't feel the need to focus on sexual things like either of those groups do. And apparently that is a huge turn off for most people, even people who want to be my friends because it's such a prevalent topic in society for which I don't have any emotional feelings towards. I can talk about sex, but people get the sense very quickly, I guess, that I'm not interested.

Yeah, that's about the gist of what happens when there are people around with similar characteristics.


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## walden (Jul 29, 2010)

so_so_shy said:


> I don't understand why you even want somebody to yearn for you. You don't like anybody, not even your own family.


That's exactly the point. When I looked around in high school and saw that people though I was sexually attractive but didn't want to actually come up and speak to me, I was like, "what the hell?"

I would turn around and see other people "just want to know" some other person, and why I asked them why, they just said there was something about them they liked.

That's when I figured it had a lot to due with my personality that was putting people off. The only problem was that I really liked who I was and, now, who I've grown to be, yet it does not attract people, in the least.

I mean, no one is attracted to me in the way I see people being attracted to each other when in anonymous groups. I found it quite amazing that NO ONE was attracted to me. I mean, there had to be someone out there who thought my personality attractive, right? There are so many types of people; someone has to.

Then I just assumed, "maybe that someone is on the other side of the planet, not the other side of the city." So I did some international traveling, and still found I got the same results. People thought I was a prostitute, or at least wanted the money they could offer, and when staying at these places for extended periods of time, they ended up not interested.

I was quite deflated then, yes.

So I asked, why does no one yearn for me? Someone on yahoo answers said I should stop being so self-centered and go to a "third-world" country to see what real despair was like. Now, I know some of the yahoo answers people are not to, er... shall we say "competent," but it did give me the idea that maybe the person who would be drawn to me (and I would be drawn to them) is like the leader of some hunter/gatherer African tribe or maybe Inuit or something.

Then I realized I was not that desperate to find them, but instead more intrigued as to why my personality was so repulsive. What specific parts are so repulsive? So I came to this forum, where I had no face, and asked my question.


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## LostPancake (Apr 8, 2009)

walden said:


> Then I realized I was not that desperate to find them, but instead more intrigued as to why my personality was so repulsive. What specific parts are so repulsive? So I came to this forum, where I had no face, and asked my question.


It must be your body language and expressions that are intimidating people or scaring them away then. In order for people to be drawn to you, you need to be at least somewhat approachable. And I think that requires being open to your own emotions - it seems like you are cut off from yours though. I assume you have them, as they're a part of being human, but the higher brain can repress them pretty well sometimes.

Sometimes our emotions are just unacceptable to us, for one reason or another, and we repress them out of conscious awareness. But they're still there, and still affecting us. For instance, you mentioned being afraid of murderers - that could be a projection of your own darker emotions, which you have repressed from awareness. That's what a psychoanalyst in the Freudian tradition might say, anyway. And those darker emotions could be what people are reacting to, even though you've repressed them. Things like that usually go back to childhood experiences.

That's all speculation though, and I'm not a therapist or anything.


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