# World really is a worse place to live since 1980?



## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

I feel like compared to the world my parents had to navigate, the world really is a lot worse. Way more people, way more traffic, way less jobs and a lot more hoops to go through to get them. If you do want to start up some business, more money and harder to get off the ground and more patent trolls out there just waiting for companies to hit a certain point before they swoop in with ridiculous patents on obvious things to con companies into payouts. Poorly educated voters, full grown adults that believe in the tinkle down fairy, who are too dumb to see the widening income/wealth chasm that threatens to topple pretty much every 1st world country there is. These people get mad enough to spit nails at the thought of a regular worker making a living wage, but they don't blink when these CEO's are making 1000s of times what their front line workers make, for nothing but basically doing their job (glorified manager).


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## blue2 (May 20, 2013)

There is nearly 3 billion more people than in 1980 you can really see it on the roads if you drive at all, I agree even when I was a child in the late 80's early 90's adults in general seemed to have a lot less stress in their lives, my mother confirms this, people have less empathy for one another now


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

blue2 said:


> There is nearly 3 billion more people than in 1980 you can really see it on the roads if you drive at all, I agree even when I was a child in the late 80's early 90's adults in general seemed to have a lot less stress in their lives, my mother confirms this, people have less empathy for one another now


It takes both parents working full time jobs + another 10% to even get by... the cost of everything just keeps going up but most working adults actually make less now than they did in 1980.. despite higher education and all the 'benefits' of technology. People like to say that the poor are doing great because they can get a tv or phone for $100 that does a lot more than what our parents had, but they had space, privacy, and free time that few people have today. The quality of our food is terrible, we're awash in a sea of weird chemicals that didn't exist a century ago, and there is really no connection to the people around us except as obstacles to our success.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Depends where you are. Life is pretty bloody good where I am.

Bill Gates debunking myths about world poverty:


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

TicklemeRingo said:


> Depends where you are. Life is pretty bloody good where I am.
> 
> Bill Gates debunking myths about world poverty:


Some of what I'm saying is also the _perception_.. It seems on SAS at least, most of us don't feel the quality of our life is good enough to make it all worthwhile, I'm curious if this is a byproduct of the world demanding more and more and more without anything really ever there to make it all work out? I struggle a lot with accepting what I have in life as adequate, because I was raised to always expect more out of myself and feel mostly just depressed the opportunities to get where I want to be simply don't exist unless I move half the country away, and even then who knows...


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## boas (Jun 9, 2013)

It was definitely easier to get your foot on the property/career ladder 30-40 years ago, which is a big concern of mine at the moment, so in one sense yes it is. Obviously there is less racism, sexism and homophobia around now though, while medical science has advanced considerably and we have the internet.


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## tbyrfan (Feb 24, 2011)

ITT: People who did not exist in 1980.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

I was born in the early 70s and can verify that those times were better. Families stuck together more, things moved slower, food was better, tv was much better, less drug abuse in your neighborhood, more opportunity, people operated more on logic and less on emotion, music was waaaaaay better, less distractions, you actually had a powerful middle class!

The decline started in the 80s, accelerated in the 90s, by the 00s forget it, and now we are like human shells just going through the motions while our elites contol the flow of everything. As we learn to accept living in a harder, more complex world for less compensation.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

tbyrfan said:


> ITT: People who did not exist in 1980.


Your parents would have though.. Technically I was a fetus in 1980 myself :|


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## Batcat (Nov 19, 2014)

It was much easier career wise. My dad received low grade by today's standards in his law degree but still managed to practice law. The job market is so much more competitive due to globalisation. We are advancing in fields like science and technology, but not in a social sense.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

Anduin said:


> It was much easier career wise. My dad received low grade by today's standards in his law degree but still managed to practice law. The job market is so much more competitive due to globalisation. We are advancing in fields like science and technology, but not in a social sense.


Most of those 'advancements' are based on getting double digit year over year gains forever, not actually solving or curing anything.


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## kageri (Oct 2, 2014)

> even when I was a child in the late 80's early 90's adults in general seemed to have a lot less stress in their lives, my mother confirms this, people have less empathy for one another now


I remember the times my mother completely cracked from taking care of us, a dog, work, and night school. Spanish classes really gave her trouble and sometimes she'd just lose it on us or the dog when it did things like chew up her dress shoes while she was gone. My grandpa scraped every penny with 12-14hr days to cover costs. With people having children later and many finishing college first it seems to me like there is less stress to having a family. Many also choose not to have a family and use all their excess money for entertainment and vacations which is a lot less stressful.


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## Batcat (Nov 19, 2014)

knightofdespair said:


> Most of those 'advancements' are based on getting double digit year over year gains forever, not actually solving or curing anything.


Agreed, imagine if we put all the scientific resources into something like curing cancer or developing AI rather than creating the latest TV or iPhone. It will come in time, but just at a slower rate.


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

Only with the myopic lens of human nostalgia is it worse.

Times change, change with them or get left behind.

EDIT: The internet and faster information travel means that you're exposed to more. It isn't that the world is worse than it was, it's that you're personally being exposed to all of the bad things that were always there and trust me, they're better than they were before. Just imagine how bad it really was thirty years ago, or a hundred years ago.


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## sprinter (Nov 22, 2003)

I grew up in the 60s and 70s. I'm kind of nostalgic for that time period and the 80s too. My parents kind of struggled financially during that time but I think they would have it even worse today. 

As far as traffic I remember there being a lot back then but where I live they've since built a new highway and added more lanes to one which has really relieved the congestion there used to be. 

Seems people used to go to the store a lot back then there were fewer stores and the ones that existed were busy. The only one that seems really busy these days is Walmart. The mall used to be crowded now many malls are closing across the US. I used to like to go to the mall because that's where the bookstore was and the GNC was better back then. If you wanted information on anything back then you would have to find it in a book at the library or at the bookstore or order a book from a catalog. People are buying a lot of stuff online but before the internet you could do almost the same thing you would just have to look through a catalog write down the catalog number and call or send in the form if you prefer but that would take longer to get your stuff. I don't see the big improvement in doing that online really. Not much different. Also doing everything online isn't all it's cracked up to be, I logged on to my bank today and of course had to pick out a new password and security questions. Stuff like that is why I still prefer to write out checks and just drop them in the mail. But the internet is great for finding information on anything for free, and for buying used items on ebay.


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## SD92 (Nov 9, 2013)

But there was no internet in the 1980's.


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## orsomething (Feb 14, 2014)

in the us, definitely



even if it seemed alright til the early 90's, it was getting progressively worse under that whole reagan/bush sr administration kabuki theatre nightmare

unfortunately the **** hit the fan REAL hard only somewhat recently

also, lol @ tinkle down fairy, i've gotta use that


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

SD92 said:


> But there was no internet in the 1980's.


Meh, the internet jumped the shark somewhere around 2007 anyway...lol


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## CowGoMoo (Apr 14, 2013)

Lol how about no? You have so many modern conveniences that you take for granted, and there are millions of survivors from African, central american, eastern european, and middle eastern wars that would strongly disagree with you.

This is just another case of "the grass is greener"



knightofdespair said:


> Poorly educated voters, full grown adults that believe in the tinkle down fairy, who are too dumb to see the widening income/wealth chasm that threatens to topple pretty much every 1st world country there is. These people get mad enough to spit nails at the thought of a regular worker making a living wage, but they don't blink when these CEO's are making 1000s of times what their front line workers make, for nothing but basically doing their job (glorified manager).


Lmfao! Get off your high horse.

So arrogant and so naive I can't believe you're 33 :no


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## Cletis (Oct 10, 2011)

People are more prosperous now than ever before.


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## orsomething (Feb 14, 2014)

CowGoMoo said:


> Lol how about no? You have so many modern conveniences that you take for granted, and there are millions of survivors from African, central american, eastern european, and middle eastern wars that would strongly disagree with you.
> 
> This is just another case of "the grass is greener"
> 
> ...


i feel you about the modern conveniences, but the US has been on a steady decline since 1981, practically

modern conveniences are present in many countries, but the cost of living here is getting higher, while wages are low/stagnant, so it isnt so easy to keep up with "modern conveniences"

there are basically no regulatory branches of government in proper working order, and most american people call you a loony pinko if you say anything positive about even unions

hes really not being arrogant

the majority of americans are idiots


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## nubly (Nov 2, 2006)

Hell no. In the 80s, I was too young to get laid. The world is a better place now.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> early 70s. . .less drug abuse


Dude, we're talking about the era of free love and drugs. . . :um

You guys all sound like a bunch of teenagers yelling that the 90s was the best decade evarrrrr. Your impressions of the time are clouded by either by nostalgia or just plain out not being alive at the time.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

CowGoMoo said:


> Lmfao! Get off your high horse.
> 
> So arrogant and so naive I can't believe you're 33 :no


They must have better kool aid where you're at I guess?


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## Esteban (Dec 8, 2014)

It's better for recluses in many ways, such as having internet access, video games, lots of awesome new books to read, etc.

Before you just had poetry and classic novels to reread for the bazillionth time. And dancing like Michael Jackson in private. The horror. Just think, instead of being on SAS we could be dancing like Michael Jackson in private while entertaining thoughts of suicide for not living up to his dancing.






You seriously want to go back to this s**t? Just look at the dumb earings, shiny faces, and other horrible physical effects that come from being an actual human being. Kind of. Awful.

And their dips. My god, their dips were awful. Someone was definitely tinkling in those. Dips are so much better now with chemical enhancements. Real sophisticated s**t. If you think marijuana has been enhanced, compare some 80's dip with some modern dip. World of difference.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

Esteban said:


> It's better for recluses in many ways, such as having internet access, video games, lots of awesome new books to read, etc.
> 
> Before you just had poetry and classic novels to reread for the bazillionth time. And dancing like Michael Jackson in private. The horror. Just think, instead of being on SAS we could be dancing like Michael Jackson in private while entertaining thoughts of suicide for not living up to his dancing.
> 
> ...


I think it makes a lot of people's anxiety worse though, back when there was less to do without interacting with people, there was more of a real community and you actually knew the people around you. Now with the internet and all that, I find it rare to actually know my neighbors, know all my coworkers, etc. People in general live in these bubbles where they ignore everything going on around them, living these lives that are more about online status and posing than real world accomplishments. I think you get judged more now based on your income, job title, and conformity than you used to - People are more capable of striking out alone now, but I think you feel it more when the world is not really set up to allow single people to succeed.


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## Esteban (Dec 8, 2014)

knightofdespair said:


> I think it makes a lot of people's anxiety worse though, back when there was less to do without interacting with people, there was more of a real community and you actually knew the people around you. Now with the internet and all that, I find it rare to actually know my neighbors, know all my coworkers, etc. People in general live in these bubbles where they ignore everything going on around them, living these lives that are more about online status and posing than real world accomplishments. I think you get judged more now based on your income, job title, and conformity than you used to - People are more capable of striking out alone now, but I think you feel it more when the world is not really set up to allow single people to succeed.


That or you'd end up bouncing a tennis ball against your ceiling because you've been shunned by that community for being mentally ill.

Maybe modern technology enables. Maybe it provides some relief. I think it probably depends on who you are and whether your mental health issues are inherited or not.

Also, footloose:






I bet I'd just end up dancing alone. All alone. So alone. The essence of alone-ness would infect my dancing. Kevin Bacon wouldn't dance with me. I just know it.


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## DarrellLicht (Mar 9, 2013)

Wars have a way of compromising an economy. We're in the longest conflict in US history. Something's got to give. 

As far as the human condition goes, I don't think anything has adversely changed. Despite whatever advanced provisions there are in place. Regional factors affect a great deal how a community functions. We're not all alike.


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## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

I personally ****ing miss the 80's to be honest. I did happy-80's-kid-stuff. People were optimistic. There was no internet, but we actually went outside to do things. Internet sucks the life out of me. I, and many others with me, have become so impatient and lazy.


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## knightofdespair (May 20, 2014)

probably offline said:


> I personally ****ing miss the 80's to be honest. I did happy-80's-kid-stuff. People were optimistic. There was no internet, but we actually went outside to do things. Internet sucks the life out of me. I, and many others with me, have become so impatient and lazy.


I feel like it creates this hyper competitive society where if you're not doing something amazing all the time people feel like you're worthless. Jobs all expect you to have tons of degrees and experience and nobody hires entry level, and housing and everything else has skyrocketed in cost while job pay has gone down.


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## Raspberriexx (Dec 3, 2014)

There was no internet so it was much worse in the 1980. I don't understand how people entertained themselves or how did they survive when they didn't have google and youtube helping them? And how did they pay bills? I think their life was difficult and boring.

I think the way world is now is the best. In the future there will be robots and self driving cars that can get viruses and kill you.


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## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

knightofdespair said:


> *I feel like it creates this hyper competitive society where if you're not doing something amazing all the time people feel like you're worthless.* Jobs all expect you to have tons of degrees and experience and nobody hires entry level, and housing and everything else has skyrocketed in cost while job pay has gone down.


I couldn't agree more about this. Social media, in particular, make people feel like they're being watched, and that they need look good in front everyone who is "monitoring" them. Just look at how upset people get get if they don't get approval or praise online. Especially kids and teenagers. Their world was ruthless enough before internet, since it's always been mostly focused on fitting in or not fitting in. Internet basically tells them that they're uselss if they don't get likes on facebook. It's not suprising that so many teens have issues with anxiety these days.


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## Esteban (Dec 8, 2014)

Social media also means outcasts who just ended up completely alone before can now find other people online without much trouble. The mentally ill were already shunned for the most part. At least with internet, it's just a google search away from interacting with people going through similar problems. 

I'd say social media mostly just makes things harder for normal people who might not have been outcasts in the 80's. This mostly just makes me happy. Have a taste of your own medicine, normies.

No longer can you just look down on people in your communities. Now you've got to deal with images of success on the internet. No matter how awesome you think you are, it's only a google search away to find someone more awesome than you. 

Bwahahahaha hahahah ahahaha


That pretty blonde girl who thought she was hot sh-t back in the day? Well, now she ain't sh*t. Just another pretty girl who's no longer pretty in comparison to many other girls online. 

The internet has had an equalizing effect on people. No more bubbles of success. We all get to be miserable now.


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## Tombu (Oct 9, 2012)

I'm in southern england.

Every road is now congested. Every till has some prick buying one lottery card after another (queues actually went down faster in the 80's). Every property is bought by someone wanting to rent it to poorer people. Every job has 50-100 applicants (when I was in my teens, 90's, I could get stoned at work and not get sacked because there was a genuine balance between available jobs and the workforce).

England's two main parties seem to say things Thatcher never would have dared to say. The whole politcal playing field has jumped to the right (not saying it's good or bad).


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

Raeden said:


> Dude, we're talking about the era of free love and drugs. . . :um


There was no small town heroin epidemic then like there is now. Now people are stealing all kind of stuff to support their heroin habit. Don't remember that stuff happening then.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

probably offline said:


> I personally ****ing miss the 80's to be honest. I did happy-80's-kid-stuff. People were optimistic. There was no internet, but we actually went outside to do things. Internet sucks the life out of me. I, and many others with me, have become so impatient and lazy.


+1


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## CWe (Mar 7, 2010)

Seems better to me


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## Sinatra (Mar 13, 2013)

I wasn't alive in the 80s so I voted neutral but I'm gonna say that now and then both had their goods and bad.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> There was no small town heroin epidemic then like there is now. Now people are stealing all kind of stuff to support their heroin habit. Don't remember that stuff happening then.


Well, apparently you were a kid in the 70s, so I guess it's reasonable that you would be looking at that decade through rose tinted glasses. Let me refresh your memory:

Marijuana use: 


> Table 1 shows that fewer than half a million people per year began using marijuana before 1966. *However, beginning in 1966, sharp increases in incidence occurred until 1973, when the number of new users peaked at 3.7 million. *Although gradual declines in incidence occurred for the remainder of the 1970s, incidence remained at over 3 million new users per year through 1980. By 1987, incidence had dropped to below 2 million


Cocaine use:


> Incidence of cocaine use (Table 2) was low
> during the 1960s, *but appears to have begun to increase as early as 1968. The increase continued until 1982*, nearly a decade beyond the peak year for marijuana incidence. *Since 1982, cocaine incidence has gradually diminished* but remained at over 1 million new users in 1989. The average age of new cocaine users has changed little since 1974, but reached a peak of 23.8 in 1981, suggesting that much of the increase in cocaine use during the early 1980s was due to new use among adults, a finding previously reported.


Hallucinogen use:


> Trends in hallucinogen incidence (Table 3) appear to be somewhat similar to the trends for marijuana, *increasing in the mid-1960s and reaching a peak around 1972-74*.


Heroin use:


> Because the number of heroin users captured in the NHSDA is small, estimates of incidence are unstable, and the average age of initiates could not be estimated. Nevertheless, the data do show a peak period for initiation of 1971-77.


Let's not even mention the fact that it was considered to take some meth anytime you had a headache before the 70s.

All of these quotes were taken from a peer reviewed journal article. So. . .what were you saying about the low rates of drug use in the 70s?


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

Raeden said:


> Well, apparently you were a kid in the 70s, so I guess it's reasonable that you would be looking at that decade through rose tinted glasses. Let me refresh your memory:
> 
> Marijuana use:
> 
> ...


Dude! People were NOT breaking into people's homes and stealing their copper pipes to sell for scrap metal so they could get another fix! 
Drug "culture" was mainly confined to the cities back then. Now it is everywhere.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> Dude! People were NOT breaking into people's homes and stealing their copper pipes to sell for scrap metal so they could get another fix!
> Drug "culture" was mainly confined to the cities back then. Now it is everywhere.


Drug culture wasn't widespread in the 70's. . .which was why DARE was founded in 1983 to discourage children from joining gangs or becoming druggies.

Also, Rates of theft, larceny theft, vehicle theft, and property crime have all peaked during the 70s and 80s and have gone down during the 90s and 00s. Perhaps they were committing all of those crimes to pay for their hallucinogens and cocaine?

The murder rate also peaked during the 70s and 80s. Great times, man.

At this point, you're just being dishonest in order to cling to some delusion that the 70s was a great time in history.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Cletis said:


> People are more prosperous now than ever before.


As are income inequality and wealth disparity.



blue2 said:


> people have less empathy for one another now


This is the single biggest difference I've seen as more time passes. It's possible it's more a perception than a reality, but when it comes to what we feel... perception _is_ our reality. It's a bit of both.

Technology, I think, has a lot to do with it. The internet, texting, and such... It allows us to communicate so much easier, and in that sense, we are more connected with one another. Yet... it's so hollow... There is no personal touch to it. We're just pixels on screens with no emotion or feeling... We get more fragmented with each passing year.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

Raeden said:


> Drug culture wasn't widespread in the 70's. . .which was why DARE was founded in 1983 to discourage children from joining gangs or becoming druggies.
> 
> Also, Rates of theft, larceny theft, vehicle theft, and property crime have all peaked during the 70s and 80s and have gone down during the 90s and 00s. Perhaps they were committing all of those crimes to pay for their hallucinogens and cocaine?
> 
> ...


The drug culture in my area is worse now than it was in the 70s. No doubt about it. Much more drug related crime.
Also, I was born in the early 70s so the 80s were more "my time."
Also, if you look at the poll results it's obvious I am not the only one who feels that the past was better. Are we all "delusional"? I think I already know your answer to that. ;-)


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> The drug culture in my area is worse now than it was in the 70s. No doubt about it. Much more drug related crime.


Care to cite any statistics? You've just been talking out of your *** this entire time, so I'm not sure how you expect me to take you seriously.



funnynihilist said:


> Also, I was born in the early 70s so the 80s were more "my time."


And the 80s was still worse than now with regards to murder, hard drug use, and theft. So, I don't see what your point is.



funnynihilist said:


> Also, if you look at the poll results it's obvious I am not the only one who feels that the past was better. Are we all "delusional"? I think I already know your answer to that. ;-)


Millions of Twilight fangirls doesn't make the series a work of meaningful art. Similarly, a bunch of nostalgic SASers doesn't make the 70s/80s any better of a time. Could you even _try_ to be objective?


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## muirmuir (Dec 14, 2014)

Back on my day, you had to stand in front of the camera and hold still for a long time to get your picture taken. Now they're all taking the damned "selfies" and women wore long dresses, none of these short shorts. Oh wait... I misread. I thought you said 1880's.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

Raeden said:


> Millions of Twilight fangirls doesn't make the series a work of meaningful art.


Got any objective citations to back up that statement?


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> Got any objective citations to back up that statement?


Good job rebutting any of the evidence I've put forward thus far, man. A+ for effort with your responses filled with nothing but anecdotal evidence and now appeals to majority.

. . .


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## SaladDays (Nov 26, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> Got any objective citations to back up that statement?


And do you have any objective citations to back up your statements and counter what she said previously? Also

****

Twilight.


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## nubly (Nov 2, 2006)

It really all depends on the choices you make in life. In the '80s, I lived in a two bedroom apartment with 4 kids and 7 adults. Now, I live in a house with 1 kid and 2 adults. Make the right choices in life, work your way up, don't make excuses for failures and don't feel entitled to things you didn't earn.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

Raeden said:


> Good job rebutting any of the evidence I've put forward thus far, man. A+ for effort with your responses filled with nothing but anecdotal evidence and now appeals to majority.


wow. you sure put a lot of work into all of this.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

SaladDays said:


> And do you have any objective citations to back up your statements and counter what she said previously? Also
> 
> ****
> 
> Twilight.


Well, she was the one condemning me for not being objective then she goes on to make a totally subjective statement herself. That is like calling someone a thief while you have your hand in their pocket....lol

Also, I know nothing about this "Twilight" business but if it's about ideas presented in some form of media with the intent to stimulate the human mind then I would have to say that it is indeed, art.


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## SaladDays (Nov 26, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> Well, she was the one condemning me for not being objective then she goes on to make a totally subjective statement herself. That is like calling someone a thief while you have your hand in their pocket....lol
> 
> Also, I know nothing about this "Twilight" business but if it's about ideas presented in some form of media with the intent to stimulate the human mind then I would have to say that it is indeed, art.


The Twilight thing is a joke on the internet, it's a movie triology that's infamous for being terribly bad, not a medium and it doesn't stimulate anything (other than your genitals if you're a teenage girl, appearantly).

Back on subject - I've yet to see you disprove her claims.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> wow. you sure put a lot of work into all of this.


I'm the only one who has provided any citations for my claims, sooooo...



funnynihilist said:


> Well, she was the one condemning me for not being objective then she goes on to make a totally subjective statement herself. That is like calling someone a thief while you have your hand in their pocket....lol


Your arguments thus far have been totally illogical, poorly argued, and just completely dishonest.

I brought up the Twilight thing as a tongue in cheek way of trying to show you that your argument that the 70s must be better because many people agree that they were was fallacious. Saying that something is right because many people agree* isn't* a sound argument. In fact, it's a logical fallacy. I already explained this to you in my last post, but you just totally ignored that....lol


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## AmandaMarie87 (Apr 24, 2013)

In some ways it is definitely worse. I also wonder why the numbers of cases of autism and other disabilities in kids seems to have increased exponentially since the 80's. I do think/hope science will find out why sometime in this century, otherwise we could be in big trouble.


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## WillYouStopDave (Jul 14, 2013)

blue2 said:


> people have less empathy for one another now


 You can definitely thank the internet for that. People know what other people are really like now.


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

Raeden said:


> Your arguments thus far have been totally illogical, poorly argued, and just completely dishonest.


ouch! Good thing I'm drinking! Harshness!



> I brought up the Twilight thing as a tongue in cheek way of trying to show you that your argument that the 70s must be better because many people agree that they were was fallacious. Saying that something is right because many people agree* isn't* a sound argument.


But there is no "sound" argument when you are arguing over something subjective such as what time is better because, as someone mentioned earlier in this thread, perception is everything. If the majority feel that these are worse times then these ARE worse times because, in this instance, the perception colors everything.



> In fact, it's a logical fallacy. I already explained this to you in my last post, but you just totally ignored that....lol


Well I do salute your mad citation skillz!


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## Dane (Jul 27, 2009)

Some things have gotten worse, but on the whole the people of the world are much better off now.

Life in Eastern Europe, China, and most of the rest of Asia is vastly better now than it was in 1980.

In 1980, there were no treatments for SA. These days we have therapy, SSRIs and other meds that have made life better for a lot of us.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> But there is no "sound" argument when you are arguing over something subjective such as what time is better because, as someone mentioned earlier in this thread, perception is everything.


Your posts weren't worded as an opinion. You weren't just saying, "Man, I miss the times when we had classic rock and mail order catalogs!".

The problem is that you weren't making any distinction between your personal opinion and reality. You were trying to argue that the 70s were an objectively better time for specific (and false) reasons. First you tried saying there was less drug abuse and then you tried saying there was less theft. These are both totally false statements regarding that time period. If you are going to state these sorts of claims, then you need to provide evidence.



funnynihilist said:


> If the majority feel that these are worse times then these ARE worse times because, in this instance, the perception colors everything.


A large reason why you (and many SASers) probably _think_ that the 70s/80s were better was because you were a young and ignorant teen/20 something who was likely free from most adult stress and responsibilities. Obviously your previous life as a carefree young adult would likely be preferable to your life now, so that could be an explanation for why you're grasping at straws to justify holding the 70s/80s with high regard.

That's all ultimately irrelevant, though. I can't argue over your gushy feelings, but I can argue about the criteria you have set for considering a decade's quality and whether that criteria was actually met. If your criteria for whether a decade is good is based upon the crime rate, unemployment rate, and drug abuse rate, then the 70s/80s fail miserably.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

AmandaMarie87 said:


> In some ways it is definitely worse. I also wonder why the numbers of cases of autism and other disabilities in kids seems to have increased exponentially since the 80's. I do think/hope science will find out why sometime in this century, otherwise we could be in big trouble.


At least with child mental illness and learning disabilities, it is likely that we've just gotten better at recognizing the signs and diagnosing them. For instance, a student who previously may have just been incorrectly considered lazy may now actually be recognized as a child with dyslexia or something other learning disability.


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## WillYouStopDave (Jul 14, 2013)

Raeden said:


> At least with child mental illness and learning disabilities, it is likely that we've just gotten better at recognizing the signs and diagnosing them.


 Indeed. Before you know it, there will be a "mental illness" for everyone. If you breathe, you need professional help. That's moving forward!

(And now if you'll excuse me, I need a mirror. I was moving forward and leaning forward at the same time and hit my forehead on a closed door)


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## blue2 (May 20, 2013)

statistics we become http://www.worldometers.info/ scroll down for full info


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

WillYouStopDave said:


> Indeed. Before you know it, there will be a "mental illness" for everyone. If you breathe, you need professional help. That's moving forward!


Errr, are you trying to imply that learning disabilities and autism don't exist? :um


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## Paul (Sep 26, 2005)

knightofdespair said:


> If you do want to start up some business, more money and harder to get off the ground


A huge percentage of self-employed people, including myself, could not have been so before the internet eliminated nearly all of the startup costs and barriers to entry. It was incredibly harder to start a business in 1980 than today.

_Poorly educated voters, full grown adults that believe in the tinkle down fairy,_

In 1980 the USA voters were electing Ronald trickle-down-fairy Reagan himself.

And crime rates were sky high, everyone was being poisoned by lead gasoline, the ozone hole was growing, constant threat of nuclear war, etc etc. I remember the 80s. Would never go back.


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## WillYouStopDave (Jul 14, 2013)

Raeden said:


> Errr, are you trying to imply that learning disabilities and autism don't exist? :um


 Not necessarily. I'm trying to imply that the majority of "mental illnesses" are probably either hogwash or made out to be much more than what they actually are. Most "mental illness" is (IMO) normal human behavior that just happens to be really inconvenient when they need to control people. Or it is a person's natural reaction to an unnatural environment.


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

funnynihilist said:


> I was born in the early 70s and can verify that those times were better. Families stuck together more, things moved slower, food was better, tv was much better, less drug abuse in your neighborhood, more opportunity, *people operated more on logic and less on emotion*, music was waaaaaay better, less distractions, you actually had a powerful middle class!





funnynihilist said:


> But there is no "sound" argument when you are arguing over something subjective such as what time is better because, as someone mentioned earlier in this thread, perception is everything.


I love irony.

Exactly what game are you playing here? It would reflect better on your character if you simply came out and said, "Wow I didn't realize this has been studied so extensively before, thanks for sharing!" Instead when demonstrated wrong you get defensive and refuse to be right.

And you are wrong, objectively.



> If the majority feel that these are worse times then these ARE worse times because, in this instance, the perception colors everything.


Prove it.


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## VictimEternal (Aug 10, 2014)

Don't worry conflicts like the one in ukraine will roll back the clock


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## Perkins (Dec 14, 2010)

Well, yeah. Of course it's gotten worse. The world is facing increasing overpopulation, the o-zone is depleting, poverty levels have increased significantly, cost of living is more outrageous, recession we have now is at least 3x worse than the Great Depression, which makes it all the more heartwarming for our generation.


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## copper (Nov 10, 2003)

1980 economy sucked. Gas prices were high, interest rates were high, layoffs. My mom had to start working due to couldn't live on a one wage earner income anymore. She went to school and became a Nurse. Dad then got laid off for three years due to working for John Deere factory. But luckily Deere was able to restructure and stay above water. So my dad was able to go back to work there. The early 1980's was the start of the farm depression that went throughout the '80's. Since living in Iowa agriculture is the largest industry. Many farmers lost their farms, banks went bust, small towns died. This one farmer outside of the village I lived in was once worth 5 million dollars but it was because of his land and after the crash he was lucky to get a 1 million for it. He owed 4 million dollars on it. He had to go into this government program were he had to account for every dime he spent. My dad bought a snowmobile off of a farmer that said he never had a job outside of the farm all his life and now he would have to go to work for someone. His dad told him to take the easiest classes in highschool and get right home and get on the tractor. He also urged him to keep expanded at all costs. He bought 500 acres of farm land when he was 16. He thought about ending it and many farmers did. So the 1980's weren't peaches and cream where I grew up.


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## WinterDave (Dec 5, 2003)

There wasn't an Internet in the 1980's like there is today, but there were computer Bulletin Board Systems or BBSs.....

Sites that people could log into, post messages, upload and download programs and games etc...

There was cable TV, video tapes, CDs, video games etc.

There was plenty of technology and convenience, it just didn't control the people like it does today.

No online shopping and educational resources like today, and being connected 24/7 to everywhere and everyone with your cellphone and tablet....

That's about the only difference....

There was mail, books, newspapers, magazines, and catalogs....

I don't know about the 1960's, but the drug problem today is certainly worse than it was in the 1980's....

People are dropping like flies from Heroin overdose now....

Every case is different, so it is really impossible to judge something about the whole world being better or worse....

I think that most people would consider the era in which they were in their twenties, to be the best decade ever....


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## funnynihilist (Jul 29, 2014)

WinterDave said:


> I don't know about the 1960's, but the drug problem today is certainly worse than it was in the 1980's....
> 
> People are dropping like flies from Heroin overdose now....


I agree. The heroin epidemic is out of control.


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## Pennywise (Aug 18, 2011)

*In some ways*

The Bad:

- Population is at over 7 billion and counting.
- Political correctness further encroaches upon our lives in many countries, as well as big government.

The Good:

- Population, while continuing to rise, is declining in its rate of growth, meaning we will now begin seeing population grow at a slower rate.
- Life expectancy is rising across the world, which could be considered good or bad. I consider it okay since population growth is beginning to slow down to compensate anyway.
- Some formerly poor, dependent countries are now richer and more self-sufficient. This raises standards of living for these countries, while they can also afford to give foreign aid to poorer countries and raise their standard of living as well.

So some things have gotten worse, but others have gotten better, and I think the world is in an overall better place than it was 30 years ago.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Interesting article on the subject (are we living in more peaceful times now than in the past?)

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...nd_lines_reveal_an_increasingly_peaceful.html


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