# Selenium: Implications in SAS ?



## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

I got to thinking. Social anxiety and Parkinson's both involve the Dopamine system. Then I came across this article.

http://www.phobias-help.com/social_phobia_treatment.html



> Research shows that people with social phobia are five times more likely to develop Parkinson's disease in later life - There is clearly a strong case for effective *social phobia treatment*.


While researching Parkinson's (which run in my family. My grandfather and I think my Dad also have it...am I next ?) I came across this study concerning selenium.



> *Selenium partially reverses the depletion of striatal dopamine and its metabolites in MPTP-treated C57BL mice.*
> 
> Khan HA.
> Department of Biochemistry, College of Science, King Saud University, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.
> ...


I've been takng selenocysteine for a few weeks now and I'm feeling pretty darn good. I feel happy and am visible more social. I am not taking manganese right now. Anyways, I searched for "selenium" and "dopamine" and found some interesting hits. By upregulating antioxidant status, selenium can protect dopaminergic neurons from many different insults. This is true for Parkinson's disease and it may have implications in SA.



> *Low selenium diet increases the dopamine turnover in prefrontal cortex of the rat.*
> 
> Castaño A, Ayala A, Rodríguez-Gómez JA, Herrera AJ, Cano J, Machado A.
> Departamento de Bioquimica, Bromatología y Toxicologia, Facultad de Farmacia, Universidad de Sevilla, Spain.
> ...


This one is interesting. Low selenium status leads to less dopamine and serotonin (these two are implicated in SA). At the same time, noradrenaline increased. Norepinephrine increases anger and low levels of serotonin increases fear in patients.



> It was concluded from the present study that Se's central action might be related to its ability to potentiate DA function.





> *Increase in dopamine turnover and tyrosine hydroxylase enzyme in hippocampus of rats fed on low selenium diet.*





> *Low selenium diet affects monoamine turnover differentially in substantia ***** and striatum.*
> 
> Castaño A, Cano J, Machado A.
> Departamento de Bioquímica, Bromatología y Toxicología, Facultad de Farmacia, Universidad de Sevilla, Spain.
> ...


So, is anyone using selenium ?


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## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

PD and SAS



> Cognitive-behavioral treatment for social phobia in Parkinson's disease: A single-case study.*Abstract*
> 
> *Individuals with Parkinson's disease often exhibit symptoms of social anxiety. * However, they rarely meet criteria for social phobia due to the medical exclusion criteria of DSM-IV. The present study reports the case of a 60-year-old male with Parkinson's disease who also met criteria for social phobia. After receiving 12 weekly cognitive-behavioral group sessions for social phobia, clinician ratings and self-report measures at post-treatment and 6-month follow-up showed a significant short-term and long-term reduction of his social anxiety. These findings suggest that cognitive-behavior therapy may be an effective treatment for social anxiety, even if these symptoms are related to Parkinson's disease.


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## Edwin (Jun 19, 2008)

Beggiatoa said:


> So, is anyone using selenium ?


I will be in a few days, thanks for posting this.


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## Noca (Jun 24, 2005)

SAS means social anxiety support, SA means social anxiety. SAS is not a disorder, its a forum.


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## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

Dr House said:


> SAS means social anxiety support, SA means social anxiety. SAS is not a disorder, its a forum.


You're right. Thank you for picking that up, it was an oversight in my part. However, I think "SAS" still works in getting my point across. Selenium does have a part in supporting patients with social anxiety disorder.

Thanks...next !


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## DrewDrewson (Mar 29, 2010)

Careful with selenium...from what I've read there's a sweet spot for dosage that's different for everyone and if you don't take the proper dose for your body you increase the risk of prostate cancer. Science can be such a ***** sometimes.


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## robertz (Feb 4, 2009)

Beggiatoa, 

It seems we have some kind of heavy metal/candida/... poisoning. That's why the antioxidants are good for us.

I started the anti-candida diet a week ago. Besides that I'm taking all important minerals (as far as I know): calcium, magnesium, zinc, manganese and selenium.

After years of reading, I'm starting to think almost all "mental" disorders start in the digestive system. 

I may be wrong, that's just my opinion.


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## ju_pa (Sep 21, 2008)

Beggiota, remember me ? You have probably tried almost everything now. Do you still suffer from social anxiety ?


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## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

robertz said:


> Beggiatoa,
> 
> It seems we have some kind of heavy metal/candida/... poisoning. That's why the antioxidants are good for us.
> 
> ...


You're not wrong. Read this blog. It's amazing.

http://high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.com/2010/07/wheat-and-lactase.html


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## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

ju_pa said:


> Beggiota, remember me ? You have probably tried almost everything now. Do you still suffer from social anxiety ?


It's not a yes or no answer. Part of social anxiety involved a learned behavior. After years of being avoidant, you "learn" to be socially anxious. I still have some problems in that where I avoid social situation and going out just because I'm so used to being this way. However, my social interactions have improved immensely to the point where I'm dating, having girlfriends, friends, etc. It's not perfect but It's a major improvement.

My SA was bad. It was so bad that I couldn't go to the supermarket without thinking people were staring at me and judging me for the foods I was buying. Sounds crazy doesn't it ?

Copper actually makes SA worse because it decreases cathecholamines. Manganese works but too high a dose and I become a careless risk taker and too outgoing. I didn't like that either. The right dose is ok.

However, selenium is doing something different. I feel more natural when I socialize. Again, it comes naturally. On the other hand, 20 mg manganese everyday made me manic. I felt like a type A personality *******. The combination of say, 5-10 mg manganese, selenium AND a high fat diet should make me feel better than ever.


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## ju_pa (Sep 21, 2008)

Beggiatoa said:


> It's not a yes or no answer. Part of social anxiety involved a learned behavior. After years of being avoidant, you "learn" to be socially anxious. I still have some problems in that where I avoid social situation and going out just because I'm so used to being this way. However, my social interactions have improved immensely to the point where I'm dating, having girlfriends, friends, etc. It's not perfect but It's a major improvement.


My SA was bad. It was so bad that I couldn't go to the supermarket without thinking people were staring at me and judging me for the foods I was buying. Sounds crazy doesn't it ?

*I can relate my SA I had to yours. And when I got home I was mentally tired.*

Copper actually makes SA worse because it decreases cathecholamines. Manganese works but too high a dose and I become a careless risk taker and too outgoing. I didn't like that either. The right dose is ok.

*Very good to know that. I haven't tried manganese. I'm only taking magnesium and some potassium currently but manganese sounds interesting.
*
However, selenium is doing something different. I feel more natural when I socialize. Again, it comes naturally. On the other hand, 20 mg manganese everyday made me manic. I felt like a type A personality *******. The combination of say, 5-10 mg manganese, selenium AND a high fat diet should make me feel better than ever.
*
Have you got any similar results when eating brazil nuts ? I went over to low carb diet in January and it has improved my SA greatly. Currently I am going to extremes and eating 0 carb diet. Feels pretty good  I am happy to hear that you have found your edges and your doing great. I also agree with psychological aspect. Few things can't be "cured" but must be overcomed.*


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## Edwin (Jun 19, 2008)

I just started taking selenium (200 mcg/day), will let you know how it works for me.


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## ju_pa (Sep 21, 2008)

Edwin said:


> I just started taking selenium (200 mcg/day), will let you know how it works for me.


Edwin and Beggiatoa how has it worked out for you with selenium ?


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## Edwin (Jun 19, 2008)

It caused me severe stomach aches when taken on an empty stomach. I did notice some benefit, but nothing amazing.

Edit: trying it on a full stomach now. Although not spectacular, I really like Selenium's feel and duration. In my opinion it's more useful than the following supplements: Magnesium, Manganese, B-vitamins, D-vitamins, Fish-oil (if not deficient), Inositol. Maybe even more useful than L-Tyrosine.


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## ju_pa (Sep 21, 2008)

Edwin said:


> It caused me severe stomach aches when taken on an empty stomach. I did notice some benefit, but nothing amazing.
> 
> Edit: trying it on a full stomach now. Although not spectacular, I really like Selenium's feel and duration. In my opinion it's more useful than the following supplements: Magnesium, Manganese, B-vitamins, D-vitamins, Fish-oil (if not deficient), Inositol. Maybe even more useful than L-Tyrosine.


So with selenium you think you don't need any listed supplements anymore ?


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## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

Thanks Edwin. It's a different feel with selenium. It's very mellow and not as stimulating as other supplements you mentioned. I think part of the problem is oxidative stress and selenium helps by increasing glutathione production. That's just a guess though.

Thanks for your input !


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## ju_pa (Sep 21, 2008)

Beggiatoa said:


> Thanks Edwin. It's a different feel with selenium. It's very mellow and not as stimulating as other supplements you mentioned. I think part of the problem is oxidative stress and selenium helps by increasing glutathione production. That's just a guess though.
> 
> Thanks for your input !


Thyroid should be producing glutathione (wrong! Right: http://glutathione-gsh.org/biology-and-science/how-is-glutathione-made/) but needs selenium, iodine and Vit E for it. You both have pretty same description for "mellow". So how is it ?

I am eating a lot of pork and fish. I suppose I get pretty much selenium through the diet (don't know about the bio-availability though). After eating this way I feel good but avoiding monosodium glutamate(+ wheat) has always been my #1 for SA.


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## clovereater (May 9, 2008)

i started taking selenium (methionine) a couple of days ago. dose is 200ug. so far havent noticed any effect. whats the best form to take and what kind of dose is it safe at? should it be taken with food or not? 
i have also been taking manganese with really good results lately. i was hoping selenium would be an alternative to mn as i'm nervous about manganese toxicity after long term use. 
thanks.


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## Beggiatoa (Dec 25, 2004)

Clovereater, 

A better form is methylselenocysteine. The methionine form just has very little action in the body. This could be a reason why.


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## robertz (Feb 4, 2009)

Beggiatoa said:


> Clovereater,
> 
> A better form is methylselenocysteine. The methionine form just has very little action in the body. This could be a reason why.


Hi there,

Are you still taking selenium ? If so, how is it going ? Also, do you think selenium citrate is worthless ?


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## robertz (Feb 4, 2009)

Food affects mood more than most of us realise, and low selenium levels in the diet can lead to irritability and depression, cautions Dr Wynnie Chan

​


> According to scientists from the Department of Psychology at the University of Wales in Swansea, a deficiency in selenium - an essential trace element found in cereal grains, meat and fish - may be associated with increased anxiety, depression and fatigue. It also acts as an antioxidant and can help the body to fight cancer and heart disease. The current average adult intake of selenium for women and men is thought to be around 43 micrograms (mcg) per day. This compares unfavourably with the government's recommended daily intake of 75mcg for men and 60mcg per day for women. Selenium is found in varying concentrations in soils throughout the world. While levels are high in North American soil, they are comparatively low in Britain and Europe. Due to a decrease in imports of selenium-rich, high-protein wheat flour from North America and Canada, and an increase in the acquisition of locally produced wheat, daily selenium intake among the British population fell dramatically from 60mcg in 1978 to around 43mcg by the 1990s. The Food Standards Agency, which looks at trends in food consumption, noted in its annual National Food Survey that there has been a decrease in bread consumption over the past 10 years. This is also believed to be a cause in the reduced intake of selenium. Finally, the low bio-availability (i.e. the amount that the body is able to use) of this mineral in soils due to acid rain and excessive use of artificial fertilizers, has also affected selenium intake.
> 
> Read more: Nutrition: Selenium deficiencies and your mood
> ​


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