# Why are shy guys so bitter about women?



## vicente (Nov 10, 2003)

Discuss.

(Full disclosure: I am a bitter* shy guy, and will stay out of this discussion, as should others who are also bitter shy guys)

EDIT:
*Bitter about, not bitter at women. I'm not bitter at anyone, except myself and society's expectations.


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## SOME (Jul 13, 2009)

shy guys are bitter about women?:help

I think you have the opposite. shy guys, imo, are always looking to get approve,praise and a good opinion from women.

But hey anyone can be bitter about women. it's just the shy guys who probably got punked by girls.

and I think you're getting the shy guy mixed up with the "nice guy". I don't see how a shy guy can be bitter, since he's shy, he's probably never made an attempt to talk to girl soo.. there's no reason for him to be bitter. The nice guy on the other hand has made numerous attempts to get a girlfriend and failed, that's when they get bitter and say girls or so and so.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

Disregard. Sorry.


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## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

I guess Matty is right, because I can't really think of another reason. I never understand the intense bitterness some guys have to all women. It makes me feel really uncomfortable, like I need to apologize to them for something I haven't done.


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## BetaBoy90 (Jan 5, 2010)

Because I do what I want!!!

Also I think this is a really dumb thread!


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## Timeofallout (Jun 23, 2010)

matty said:


> Because they need someone else to blame for the fact they dont have a girlfriend. Discussion over.


Note (I'm a bitter shy guy)

I believe that our being bitter is not because of not having a girlfriend; but our feeling as if though we can't get a girlfriend due to shyness.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

I currently feel like I cant and wont get a girlfriend. But I look at that as my fault and something I need to working within myself. No bitterness it just enables me, motivates me to change things. However, single life is grand so I am in no hurry.


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## Prodigal Son (Dec 11, 2005)

BetaBoy90 said:


> Because I do what I want!!!
> 
> Also I think this is a really dumb thread!


Yeah, I think a bad idea for a thread and probably won't end well. I think it depends on the guy, not all shy guys are necessarily bitter about women.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Oh.. I'll bite.

I think one reason is because they don't realize or accept that attraction isn't a choice. A girl doesn't _choose_ to be attracted to a guy. She just _IS_.

So instead of getting aggravated over what they have no control over (the psychology of attraction), they should be looking at themselves and thinking about what they could do to improve themselves so that they're viewed in a more attractive light. Things like...

- adjusting their attitude (the world isn't out to get you)
- improving self-confidence ("no girl wants me" - a girl can smell that kind of thinking a mile away.. get it in your head that you're better than that)
- APPEARING self-confident (walk with your shoulders back and your head up, look people in the face, etc...)
- improving their style (do something with your clothes and hair)
- paying attention to hygiene (having a polished look vs. looking like a grub)
- working out (or at least trimming down on the fat)
- overcoming their SA (being able to hold some semblance of a conversation)
- being productive (get a job or volunteer somewhere)
- etc..


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## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

Just Lurking said:


> I think one reason is because they don't realize or accept that attraction isn't a choice. A girl doesn't _choose_ to be attracted to a guy. She just _IS_.


Interesting, I've never thought of it that way before. I think - granted, from my chick perspective - that this would be helpful in trying to become less bitter and angry towards my gender.


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## mcmuffinme (Mar 12, 2010)

> I think one reason is because they don't realize or accept that attraction isn't a choice. A girl doesn't _choose_ to be attracted to a guy. She just _IS_.


At the mall this shoe-shine guy was bugging me to get my shoes shined (I know, random), and I tried to turn him down politely, and he got all accusatory with me, trying to guilt trip me (cause it was free) like I was blowing him off because I was a snooty b****- but I just wanted to go home cause I was feeling tired and I didn't want to be at the mall, and my shoes are so crappy that they aren't even worth shining.

That kind of behavior, to me, implied the bitter guy syndrome, and really put me off/scared me away. So, it's not attractive when a girl can sense a guy is like that. It's like warning flags go up when I see that mentality in a guy.

(I think a lot of Judd Apatow movies get support from the bitter guy demographic)


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## anomalous (Jun 12, 2004)

Perfectionist said:


> I guess Matty is right, because I can't really think of another reason. I never understand the intense bitterness some guys have to all women. It makes me feel really uncomfortable, like I need to apologize to them for something I haven't done.


The OP titled the thread "bitter about women," not "bitter toward women." You might be reading too much into it (both this thread and the more general bitterness you perceive from guys on SAS).

I think "bitter _about_ women" reflects my attitude, as well as that of most any guy here who actually is "bitter" -- which, of course, isn't all of them.

Why we'd be bitter _about_ not being able to partake in a core life experience is not exactly a mystery.

Of course, I do realize there are a select few characters who really are unabashedly sexist and hostile toward women, but that's a different issue.


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## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

^I think my reaction is affected by SA, when guys are ranting about not being in a relationship or women have it easier or whatever, I feel like they're getting mad _at _me. It can be a little overwhelming, even if my reaction is just caused by SA.

I think there are both on this site: men just bitter about not having a woman, and men bitter towards women for (in their opinion) having it easier in the dating world.


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## vicente (Nov 10, 2003)

BetaBoy90 said:


> Because I do what I want!!!
> 
> Also I think this is a really dumb thread!





Prodigal Son said:


> Yeah, I think a bad idea for a thread and probably won't end well. I think it depends on the guy, not all shy guys are necessarily bitter about women.


I know, that's why I created it at 1:45 am 

I'm still not going to participate in this thread, but I want to make it clear that this thread is about being bitter ABOUT women / relationships, not being bitter TOWARD / at women. This is not a thread glorifying misogyny.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Perfectionist said:


> ^I think my reaction is affected by SA, when guys are ranting about not being in a relationship or women have it easier or whatever, I feel like they're getting mad _at _me. It can be a little overwhelming, even if my reaction is just caused by SA.
> 
> I think there are both on this site: men just bitter about not having a woman, and men bitter towards women for (in their opinion) having it easier in the dating world.


Maybe the OP isn't aware, but this follows on the heels of several "bitter 'towards' women" topics in the past week or three. So yeah, there will be people misconstruing "about" as "towards".


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## Neptunus (Oct 29, 2007)

I had no idea until this site. Makes me sad, though.


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## xstrongandsilentx (Jul 17, 2010)

Not sure about any one elses reasons but I've been led on wayyyyy too many times and just have not had many loyal ladies in my life so I'm a bit skeptical that is all. But let it be known I still would like a lady hahaha


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## Post_Punk_Proclivity (Oct 12, 2008)

I think a lot of men can be bitter about woman, not just shy ones. I also think a lot of woman can be bitter about men, not just shy ones.


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## SilentWitness (Dec 27, 2009)

Either because of a bad experience or no experience at all.


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## coldsorehighlighter (Jun 2, 2010)

Well...I'm very shy. And I think girls happen to be pretty damn cool even though I'm fairly sure they don't see me the same way, if they even see me at all. But that's my fault, not theirs. I've had girls hurt me, while knowing what they were doing, but I chalked that up to them personally, not their gender.


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## mixolydian (May 23, 2009)

Because they ain't gettin' any


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## Jessie203 (Feb 20, 2008)

Some women are total losers and rude people, and some men are total losers and rude people. Who cares. The bitter people need a dose of reality, stop being prejudice because you will miss out on a good one.


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## LALoner (Dec 3, 2008)

vicente said:


> Discuss.
> 
> (Full disclosure: I am a bitter* shy guy, and will stay out of this discussion, as should others who are also bitter shy guys)
> 
> ...


don't like mommy = don't like women


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## benyamin (May 11, 2010)

because of fail with women we get fail fail fail while trying to be good and nice so its makes us hate women because we do the best and they dont give a crap and go to bad boys


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## vicente (Nov 10, 2003)

benyamin said:


> because of fail with women we get fail fail fail while trying to be good and nice so its makes us hate women because we do the best and they dont give a crap and go to bad boys


You're missing the point of this thread.

We don't hate women. We hate "the game".


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Stilla said:


> ^ Maybe you're approaching the wrong women then? Just a thought


How do you know who is wrong and who is right before approaching?


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Stilla said:


> Don't go solely on looks and try to get to know the person before you ask them out : O


So are you implying that most good looking women won't day a guy with SA?


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Lets change the subject, how do you get to know women anyways? What if they are total strangers?


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## Paul (Sep 26, 2005)

^ Obviously the same way you get to know anyone, mbp86. For most people it involves work or school or group activities, that makes them less than total strangers, though don't ask me how to get from there to really knowing someone.

I don't get how you can ask out a total stranger. Aren't you worried that you may be making a terrible choice and getting yourself into a bad situation if she says yes, since you really have no clue who she is? Are you really okay with taking such a leap of faith? Do you feel you're actually dating-compatible with the majority of women? Or does their physical "hotness" make you able to accept any personality they may have?



D11 said:


> Either because of a bad experience or no experience at all.


The former is easy to understand (unfair but human), but I don't see how the latter would lead to bitterness about women unless "no experience" actually means the experience of being rejected in attempts to gain experience.


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## Mr. SandMan (Aug 24, 2007)

Because all women do is rip your heart out and step on it, then leave you never to be seen again, while the person suffering from the mental illness contimplates hurting themselves because of the love that was his heart, was ripped into pieces in a sarcastic manner like she didn't care.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

I should have said how do you get to know any stranger? I work at a grocery store and I think it would be weird if I went up to a girl and asked her what she likes to do for fun.


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## percyblueraincoat (Jun 2, 2009)

*hmm*

"I should have said how do you get to know any stranger? I work at a grocery store and I think it would be weird if I went up to a girl and asked her what she likes to do for fun."

Yep, writing on this forum whilst on my holiday. Go me. LOL. Anyway, you work at a grocery store. So, talking to the customers should be well within pretty much any socially acceptable framework or blueprint of normality you care to imagine or construct or believe has been constructed. You may well be too outcome specific. Must get her number. Must ask her out. Must...must...must...goodness gracious me what a lot of pressure. And the darkness of disappointment follows on the heels of such pressure. So, just talk to people where you work. A simple "hi" is a victory and an achievement.

As for shy guys, nice guys/whatever imagined category they come up with next guys being bitter about women....well...where there are relationships and interactions there will be hurt and rejection. Otherwise the balance overflows and the whole thing goes topsy turvy.

And it is so easy to hate yourself when that hurt comes to you. Hate and hold it in until it bleeds into the identity construct and out from there it infects the perceptions and from there it infects the general viewpoint and then a belief system forms.

Attraction is a choice. But it is made on many different levels of awareness. It's far more complicated than "she's attracted to you" or "she isn't". Women change their minds. Men change their minds. People change. Heck, catch me in one mood and I'll be head over heels for one type of girl and catch me two days later and it's a different kind of woman I'm after.

There is an inherent darkness is trying to change yourself to become more attractive. If you haven't got a girlfriend, it is not your fault. You have not failed. there is no failure. You don't win a prize and women are not prizes. You don't validate the self by wandering around going: "oh look, I must be a good person because I have a girlfriend". So when you don't get what you want, it is not a failure. Just what happened. That's not sugar coating. That's life.

Personal improvement and development can be undertaken with the purpose of healing and or moving the person forward. In other words: for the benefit of the individual and not under the orders of others or their ideas. To become more attractive, you become happier and more of who you are.


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## vicente (Nov 10, 2003)

Stilla said:


> Don't go solely on looks and try to get to know the person before you ask them out : O


Most (okay, some) bitter guys aren't only looking for the pretty / hot women. Some of us aren't liked by anyone. It's not like we're turning down women left and right who aren't hot enough for us. For me, if I'm attracted to your personality, and your face isn't vomit-inducing, then I wish you would ask me out because I'm socially anxious.


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## Akane (Jan 2, 2008)

opcorn


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## stranger25 (Apr 29, 2010)

*winks*


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## Madison_Rose (Feb 27, 2009)

Well, I will say this:

I hate the "boys chase girls, girls run away" idea. It's sexist nonsense that's bad for both men and women, and things would be so much better, easier and less confusing if no-one did the "playing hard to get" thing.


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## low (Sep 27, 2009)

I'm not especially bitter at women or more than to other people. But I'd like to share mine without being attacked. One reason may be because it's irritating and depressing seeing women go for loud obnoxious, jerk types whilst you know you may be a much better person morally, in terms of reliability, plenty of other posative traits to pick from - than the tool they are dating or getting boned from.

Here's a scenario. A friend or friends doing all the pulling and your always left out and you constantly see this happening and they have failed relationships because your friend is a jerk and treats them like crap every time. But you get on well with the girl, you may talk to each other more than they do, they argue in front of you all of the time. However, you're in the no dating friends exes 'lockout rule' now. If only they'd talked to you more instead that first night. Most women go for obnoxious confident types though. Not all as a strict rule - but the majority. It's sending out the message to be a loud, obnoxious prat. Treat em mean, keep em keen. All that. When that just isn't you, that can be a bit embittering.

Any regular dating site also, maybe not the mental health ones, but normal mainstream ones the women are rather similar and a bit superficial too I would say personally. Don't bite my head off. They tend to be 'looking for someone who doesn't take life seriously' or 'just want a laugh'. Other phrases like that. What's wrong with taking life seriously and considering, planning things carefully? Another problem for shy in our case - bad shyness, SA, is that guys don't tend to like clubbing and dancing and that's also a commonly listed interest from women on these types of sites. You're made to feel boring by their standards in a way.

Shy guys likely won't get approached. Shy women likely will. Could be another one.

I think womens brains are wired to have an attraction to showing off, feats from males etc from caveman days. 'Look at me, look at the animal I killed, look at the meat I have' The whole potential provider thing. Women often complain men are pervs etc and only interested in looks. I think that's true to the extent of caveman days also. We're wired to look for attractive mates but we hold the dead animal meat so can do the bargaining. If that makes sense...


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## Alongroadforsomedude (Apr 23, 2010)

1.Uhh shy guys are bitter because they have no experiance with women. '

2.They are influenced by the media and porn more than reality.

3.The only girls they have encountered were agressive and crazy.

4. These guys probably hate them selves because they cant force them selves to talk to women they are atracted to.

5.They are super insecure and inexperianced/naive.

6.They are probably ultra sexual frustrated and cant think straight anymore.

7. YES not having sex or interaction with a female can actually make a man feel angry and insane. Why? Dont know, its huMAN nature.

8.They creep women out wich makes them feel even worse about them selves because they cant communicate who they really are.

The list goes on but you either start to understand at this point or you never will.


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## LALoner (Dec 3, 2008)

Alongroadforsomedude said:


> 1.Uhh shy guys are bitter because they have no experiance with women. '
> 
> 2.They are influenced by the media and porn more than reality.
> 
> ...


Thats a pretty good list.


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

Stilla said:


> It feels like people totally misinterpreted my posts.
> All I ever meant was if you only go for women based on looks without regarding their personality it's not weird that they're not what you expected from when you first asked them out without knowing them.
> The posts I replied to I interpreted as to having to do with approaching women so that's why I mentioned that the guys were asking them out.
> 
> ...


I think, if you're the woman in the avatar, you're a 10 on the looks scale. So you telling a guy to not go for the good looking women, and you're a good looking woman, you're basically telling him that you'd never date him. Basically reiterating the stereotype.

Nerdy guys have been told this before (don't go for looks, go for personality!) The hidden message is, 'date uglier girls, because you're not good looking enough for the good looking girls.' After a while, the nerdy, shy guys get tired of hearing it, and then out comes the bitterness.


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## Cleary (Nov 10, 2007)

WintersTale said:


> I think, if you're the woman in the avatar, you're a 10 on the looks scale. So you telling a guy to not go for the good looking women, and you're a good looking woman, you're basically telling him that you'd never date him. Basically reiterating the stereotype.
> 
> Nerdy guys have been told this before (don't go for looks, go for personality!) The hidden message is, 'date uglier girls, because you're not good looking enough for the good looking girls.' After a while, the nerdy, shy guys get tired of hearing it, and then out comes the bitterness.


:con Huh? You really gathered all of that from Stilla's post?

Maybe she's saying it would be foolish to be in a relationship that is based entirely on physical attraction. It would probably lead to some trouble if your personalities clash with each other.

Just a hunch.


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## coeur_brise (Oct 7, 2004)

Alongroadforsomedude said:


> 1.Uhh shy guys are bitter because they have no experiance with women. '
> 
> 2.They are influenced by the media and porn more than reality.
> 
> ...


this just illustrates the fact that the problem lies within the man, not in the women... so many of these are about the man.. so why blame the women?


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## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

WintersTale said:


> Nerdy guys have been told this before (don't go for looks, go for personality!) The hidden message is, 'date uglier girls, because you're not good looking enough for the good looking girls.'


Yes, I imagine that would get annoying after the 100th time, as all advice does.

However, all I think when I read that is that since guys are not only still rejecting the quite truthful advice of personality over looks but are even getting _offended _by the suggestion, these "uglier" girls who also happen to have rocking personalities and would make rocking girlfriends really have even more right to be bitter than shy guys.


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## Selbbin (Aug 10, 2010)

Perfectionist said:


> However, all I think when I read that is that since guys are not only still rejecting the quite truthful advice of personality over looks but are even getting _offended _by the suggestion, these "uglier" girls who also happen to have rocking personalities and would make rocking girlfriends really have even more right to be bitter than shy guys.


Amen to that.


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## stranger25 (Apr 29, 2010)

why are they bitter? because they never get a chance, they get rejected because they don't qualify on all the reqquirements girls want (money, friends, social skills, good looks, evil personality, acoholic, etc.) they get rejected for the douche. It is the women......they judge and stereotype the shy guy without even knowing him. They think because he is a virgin in his 20's he is a lunatic and because he has no friends and doesn't know how to be social they dismiss him quickly maybe if girls stopped judging and stereotyping and rejecting and being picky there would be no problem


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Stilla said:


> All I ever meant was if you only go for women based on looks without regarding their personality it's not weird that they're not what you expected from when you first asked them out without knowing them.


Yeah but you got to realize that a lot of us with SA aren't involved in activities or such that put us in situations where we can get to know people. So when we do leave the house to go to the grocery store, it is easy for us to fall for pretty women. Yes, we haven't spoken to her and she may be a horrible person... but it's not like we will say anything to her anyways. So she becomes a face or a body who we stick in the memory bank and masturbate to (or not).

In conclusion, guys with SA need to approach women and not give up after a few rejections. Also we don't need to settle for someone who we aren't physically attracted to.


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

stranger25 said:


> why are they bitter? because they never get a chance, they get rejected because they don't qualify on all the reqquirements girls want (money, friends, social skills, good looks, evil personality, acoholic, etc.) they get rejected for the douche. It is the women......they judge and stereotype the shy guy without even knowing him. They think because he is a virgin in his 20's he is a lunatic and because he has no friends and doesn't know how to be social they dismiss him quickly maybe if girls stopped judging and stereotyping and rejecting and being picky there would be no problem


Before a girl jumps on this post, I'd like to say that guys do this, too.

However, it's much harder to be a shy guy than a shy girl. Shy girls get hit on, while shy guys never get anywhere. That is why shy guys are bitter, because the playing field isn't even.

And it's even worse if you're not stereotypically good looking, because then you're the 'creepy guy.' Creepy, meaning that you're shy, quiet, and unattractive...not that you're a bad guy.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

WintersTale said:


> Before a girl jumps on this post, I'd like to say that guys do this, too.
> 
> However, it's much harder to be a shy guy than a shy girl. Shy girls get hit on, while shy guys never get anywhere. That is why shy guys are bitter, because the playing field isn't even.
> 
> And it's even worse if you're not stereotypically good looking, because then you're the 'creepy guy.' Creepy, meaning that you're shy, quiet, and unattractive...not that you're a bad guy.


Yeah if you're a good looking shy guy, you may be classified as "mysterious" lol.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

:lol this is awesome. Thanks for the lulz

Nerdy, shy, etc. etc are ****ty because they cant get 'hot' girls but then get offending when told to get to know girls of all appearance. Which is what they want hot girls to do. 

Personally I want to be attracted to the person I date, and I will be because that is a huge part. But personality trumps looks every day of the week for me. Looks dont count for much down the track. Say 1 year or 2. Sure it helps but the personality is what really counts.


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## CopadoMexicano (Aug 21, 2004)

I thought shy guys were nice. Ive personally never seen such a thing.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

stranger25 said:


> why are they bitter? because they never get a chance, they get rejected because they don't qualify on all the reqquirements girls want (money, friends, social skills, good looks, evil personality, acoholic, etc.) they get rejected for the douche. It is the women......they judge and stereotype the shy guy without even knowing him. They think because he is a virgin in his 20's he is a lunatic and because he has no friends and doesn't know how to be social they dismiss him quickly maybe if girls stopped judging and stereotyping and rejecting and being picky there would be no problem


They never get a chance because they either dont attempt to talk to girls or they are just interested in the uber hot girls which 90% of guys dont have a chance with, sa, shy, or a body builder. They need to open their eyes and look around.

If I am getting passed up for alcoholics and people with evil personalities then good because that is not the type of girl I am looking for


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## stranger25 (Apr 29, 2010)

Yeah exactly. They can judge and single us out but we can't do it to them back because we are supposedly losers. They ignore us. They ignore the quiet guys. If they do any approaching at all it's always gonna be with the alpha thug. Girls with social anxiety and girls who are introverted/shy have nothing to worry about with relationships because they will all get one automatically. It's us guys who are in trouble. Even the "ugly" girls reject the guys like her. "I don't want a bad boy, I wnt a guy who's shy like me". Why are you ignoring him and paying attention to the others then? The only guys who are wanted are bad boys. The different guys , we are the ones that have to do everything. Asking out, risking rejection, make lots of money, be mean, do drugs and drink alcohol, drive fancy cars etc. We have to live up to their demands or we get rejected, ignored, and put down. Females rule the dating world and relationships in general. They get them automatically. Always.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

MavenMI6Agent009 said:


> I thought shy guys were nice. Ive personally never seen such a thing.


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## silentcliche (Jun 30, 2010)

Looking back, I consider myself as being bitter 5 or 6 years ago when I was still getting over a relationship with the only girlfriend I've had so far. So now that I'm no longer bitter (but still shy), I believe my bitterness stemmed from my own shortcomings being projected onto women. Basically I was saying that everyone else had problems when the problems really existed within myself.

That's just from my own personal experiences though. I honestly haven't put myself out there much for fear of rejection but I can totally get how anyone (man or woman) can become bitter if they constantly put their hearts on the line only to get rejected time and time again.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

I agree with Matty and I think a lot of the guys on this forum do too. Looks may draw us to you but personality keeps us with you.


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## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

I hope I'm not present the one time stranger25 sees a girl attracted to a shy, quiet male and his entire philosphy on relationships and understanding of women implodes.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Drella have you ever considered joining an activity or a class? The first few times would be terrifying but after that you can get to know some cool people who like the same things as you. Just my 2 cents...


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## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

Drella can't take activities or classes, she has already mastered everything.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Tell your mom that you are struggling to get a boyfriend. Perhaps she can offer you some tips.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

Perfectionist said:


> I hope I'm not present the one time stranger25 sees a girl attracted to a shy, quiet male and his entire philosphy on relationships and understanding of women implodes.


Hehe, That would be funny.

Stranger25 - This is my thoughts and you will disagree but I am going to put them out there. Why because it is the internet. 

You have some pretty warped views on women and relationships and the guys they are dating instead of you. Who does this help, doesnt help yourself, doesnt help the girls which would be attracted to you if you had a different opinion on them.

You are letting a small percentage of girls wreck your opinion on women. Which means you have a bitter negative view towards all girls. They dont deserve that and why would they be interested in a shy guy like yourself when you think so poorly of them?

Not all girls are like you think. Some girls enjoy dating a nice, shy, quiet guy. Some girls refuse to date jerks. Some guys which are nice, shy and quiet get girlfriends, some said guys get really hot nice girls. Some of those guys are not pretty but have so much going for them that girls see this amazing guy which has so much to offer and they live happily ever after. Or whatever happens these days. Some of those guys dont have a dollar in the bank. Girls are rarely shallow, they leave that to the guys.

I beg you to rethink your views on girls. They dont help anyone.


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## Selbbin (Aug 10, 2010)

I am curious to hear people's opinions about which the 'bitter shy guy' is angry about more: the lack of sex, or the lack of intimacy?


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Yeah I know what you mean. I told my mom about my frustrations and she gave me some crap advice. She told me to do online dating LOL. I've tried that mom, I can't even get a response.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

Selbbin said:


> I am curious to hear people's opinions about which the 'bitter shy guy' is angry about more: the lack of sex, or the lack of intimacy?


I want to know too.


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## stranger25 (Apr 29, 2010)

When you've been single your whole life, never even gotten flirted with or had a friend of the opposite sex you start to wonder. You have no idea how the female mind thinks, what they like, how they act. Are they all like that? Maybe. You need real convincing. True shy guys are invisible to girls. Like me. We are so afraid to talk to a girl we see that we just go on living life with noone. All while hopping on that small chance that maybe someday a girl will be intrigued and start opening us up. That's rare to happen. They enjoy dating shy guys and they obviously know he won't reciprocate so why don't they go after him? why ignore. They won't do it. He won't do it. Nothing happens out it.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

So you've never approached a girl stranger? I guess you've let the media and internet or whatever, convince you that there is no pretty woman who will want to be with you. You can continue to be bitter and assume no girl will want you or you can keep approaching women and find a girl who enjoys your company.


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## stranger25 (Apr 29, 2010)

Shy guys especially need to live up to their ridiculous requirements.


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

stranger25 said:


> When you've been single your whole life, never even gotten flirted with or had a friend of the opposite sex you start to wonder. You have no idea how the female mind thinks, what they like, how they act. Are they all like that? Maybe. You need real convincing. True shy guys are invisible to girls. Like me. We are so afraid to talk to a girl we see that we just go on living life with noone. All while hopping on that small chance that maybe someday a girl will be intrigued and start opening us up. That's rare to happen. They enjoy dating shy guys and they obviously know he won't reciprocate so why don't they go after him? why ignore. They won't do it. He won't do it. Nothing happens out it.


Because shy guys try so hard to stay out of sight and avoid contact. Whos fault is it if they dont notice you. You either have to be ridiculously good looking or have something which people notice. A skill, a manor, something


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

matty said:


> Because shy guys try so hard to stay out of sight and avoid contact. Whos fault is it if they dont notice you. You either have to be ridiculously good looking or have something which people notice. A skill, a manor, something


Or you can peacock like this douche










He wears a fluffy hat, black nails, and platform shoes so he can stand out from the crowd.

Edit: and wears binoculars lmao


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## Selbbin (Aug 10, 2010)

It's interesting how some people who fear being judged are so judgmental. What's wrong with the guy in the pic? Seriously, so what if he dresses like that? If we all chilled out a bit SA would be far less of a problem. IMHO anyway....


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## matty (Nov 2, 2009)

^ true. Or become a pua like that dude. Which I am assuming you dont want to. 

I have always wondered pua courses, like if they would give the confidence needed in all aspects of life. 

My mate isnt a douche, but he wore a bright purple suit with green socks, orange shirt and he got so many pics taken with him. He is just a really fun guy, he loves people and people love him. Makes me think it is sometimes how you carry yourself.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

He isn't a douche I'm just jealous thats all. The guy in my pic has slept with 1000s of women (or so he says).


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## aviator99 (Nov 23, 2006)

I was never bitter at all, up until the last ohhhh...9 months or so, equally the farthest i've ever gone with a girl in my life, but equally one of the worst experiences in my life.

It's left me with a very negative viewpoint on young girls (18-23 ish) and relationships in general. Bitterness is only targeted towards that age group, really. NONE of this was because of my shortcomings. I put a lot of effort into it what went on between us. Months in I also started to really have feelings for her (wouldn't say Love, but you know -- butterflies, whatever, the normal). 

Nonetheless, I undoubtedly know there was nothing I could do that would have changed the outcome.

Because I later found out, I was just 1 of 4 other guys, and NONE of us guys knew about the other guys. So heres the story:

Guy #1 = She used this guy for $$$ and events. He took her to MLB games, NHL hockey games, out to eat, as far as I know they also went shopping together often, don't know if he paid for what she bought though. They posted pics of eachother on facebook, but she always claimed this was just a friend of hers (I believed it -- he wasnt her type, AT ALL, and I know that for a fact). She was, in a sense, just using him so he could take her to those things. He didn't know that though, all she had to do was do some flirting and ohhhhhhh let the Detroit Tigers @ Chicago Cubs tickets roll in!

Guy #2 = Ex boyfriend of hers. She'd constantly see him and do things with him, more family oriented activites (since he's her ex, he knew her family, so they would go to say, wedding receptions together, as a "couple" per say). They were friends, but in January-February he started to pursue her for BF/GF again (wanted to get back together). Didnt know about me (pursuing her since November) or anyone else.

Guy #3 = This is me. I'm the college guy that lived down the hall from her. Interest was mutual. It was obviously she liked me, and vice versa. We did a lot of things on campus; going out to eat all the time, hanging out together, etc. Everything seemed to stay -on campus only-.

Guy #4 = This guy works with her at her job. They started going out to eat (off campus). This was the party-guy. They went to house parties/clubbing/dancing together. Out of all these guys she apparently wanted this one to become the 'boyfriend' per say.

So, 1 girl playing 4 guys over a 5 month span. WELL it all came crashing down between February and April (this year). 

In February, Guy #1 apparently made a move to have sex with her. He probably expected to get laid after months of taking her out to all these $$$ venues. She rejected him. Guy got mad -- that was the end of their 'friendship' (friendship in her mind, he probably thought it was going to be a relationship, since they went out together so often). 

February also, Guy #2 found out about Guy #4. Guy #4 posted photos on facebook of him and her, and he tagged her in the photos (which appeared on her FB profile) from a night club and some other things they did together. Thats ALSO how I found out about Guy #4. 

Guy #2 apparently ripped her a new one verbally (called her every derogatory name in the book) and sent nasty text messages. He blocked and deleted her from facebook. 

Me, Guy #3, I wasn't sure what to make of Guy #4. But, I totally disengaged my interest for her from then on. She in turn starts treating me like ****. No, I didn't do it rudely, I always said hi/bye, normal self. I just stopped going over to her place, stopped texting, and started giving excuses to go out to eat/whatever else. She then starts badmouthing me to my buddies and ignoring me (in public), gave me dirty looks/snide behind my back comments.

Fast forward to April now. Guy #4 is all thats left, still oblivious to Guy #1/2/3 that have bailed. 

I'm not sure what happened, but I heard Guy #4 and her having a huge argument on the LAST day of college (day before moving out) right in the hallway of our dorm hall. She was crying and everything. I'm not sure what happened. All I know is that the next day, Guy #4 deleted all the pics of him/her on facebook, and he blocked her on facebook (thereby deleting her as a friend).

Guy #3, me -- end of April after moving out, she treated me like **** the last day also (ran into eachother many times while moving out), so I also blocked/deleted her from facebook. 

In the end, hey, you get feelings for the person after months of involvement/doing things with them, and they reciprocate that to you, and you find all this out? 

What a crushing blow, really. My emotions plagued me for months afterwards. It sucked, bigtime. Fortunately today, August, emotions are gone, but it still crosses my mind sometimes. And to see someone so careless, who goes on after you're out of the picture like a "Oh whatever, screw him" kind of mentality? Like you were a waste, like you were nothing?

And she didn't just do that to me, she did that to the other 3 guys also.

The only vindication I have is knowing she has 0 men in her life right now. But with school starting in almost 3 more weeks? Oh, i'm sure she'll round up another set of 3, 4 or 5 guys, all for different purposes, to keep her busy for the next school year. She's 19 years old (will be 20 in Sept) by the way.

Yeah, now can you understand my bitterness?


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

Yeah, but not all women are like her though. Don't let a bad experience taint your view of women. Be like a dog, live in the moment. They don't think about the past (According to Cesar Milan anyways).


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## DeeperUnderstanding (May 19, 2007)

I agree, the quality girls I know in my life (as friends) don't do that to guys. They have one boyfriend and that's it.

Problem is, I'm never the boyfriend. But I've never run into a girl like the one you described. She sounds like a sociopath.


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## mbp86 (May 11, 2010)

WintersTale said:


> I agree, the quality girls I know in my life (as friends) don't do that to guys. They have one boyfriend and that's it.
> 
> Problem is, I'm never the boyfriend. But I've never run into a girl like the one you described. She sounds like a sociopath.


No, she sounds like a maneater!


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## TRENNER (Sep 21, 2009)

Simple answer to the question---prolonged frustration hurts bad, so bitterness is a common reaction.


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## Alongroadforsomedude (Apr 23, 2010)

mbp86 said:


> or you can peacock like this douche
> 
> 
> 
> ...


omfg lmfao rotfl


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## Misanthropic (Jun 25, 2010)

I'm bitter about humans in general. Women are no better or worse than men are.


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## VanDamMan (Nov 2, 2009)

I think there is a sense of unfairness.


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## vicente (Nov 10, 2003)

Selbbin said:


> I am curious to hear people's opinions about which the 'bitter shy guy' is angry about more: the lack of sex, or the lack of intimacy?


Intimacy. Sex would be nice, but there are other ways to get one's rocks off.

No, I am not one of those guys with SA who b*tch about hot girls not liking them and who ignore average looking girls who like them. No one likes me. I'll date anyone with a great personality who isn't hideous looking.


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## anomalous (Jun 12, 2004)

vicente said:


> Intimacy. Sex would be nice, but there are other ways to get one's rocks off.
> 
> No, I am not one of those guys with SA who b*tch about hot girls not liking them and who ignore average looking girls who like them. No one likes me. I'll date anyone with a great personality who isn't hideous looking.


This, this, and this. And I'm sure the answer is the same for the vast majority here.


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## merryk (Dec 25, 2008)

vicente said:


> if I'm attracted to your personality, and your face isn't vomit-inducing, then I wish you would ask me out because I'm socially anxious


you sweet talker, you :b

I'm curious: how does a self-described socially anxious guy make it apparent to a woman that he's attracted to her and wishes for her to ask him out?


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## Steffen (Aug 14, 2010)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_shyness

This might give some information. I was painfully shocked by it... The fact that there are literally *millions* of people in the world who will never get so much as a kiss.

I thought for a long time I'd be one of them.



> I'm curious: how does a self-described socially anxious guy make it apparent to a woman that he's attracted to her and wishes for her to ask him out?


Get a friend to force you into just doing it: "I'd like to go on a date with you". Try not to pass out.  And she'll probably find your blushing cute.


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## anomalous (Jun 12, 2004)

I'm not sure how well this fits with the subject OP intended to hone in on, but I'll mention it anyway:

The social stigma of being a shy, nerdy guy who can't get girls is simply *massive*.

I realize I'm coming at this from a biased point of view, but I'm struggling to think of any stereotype more widely and relentlessly panned, without an ounce of hesitation or restraint. Sure, certain minority groups like homosexuals face a lot of stigma as well; but we've reached the point as a society where such stigma is at least considered inappropriate and backwards in an open forum, even if a lot of snickering and disapproval still goes on privately.

But for us, it seems like a no-holds-barred scenario even here in 2010. I mean, just look at Hollywood (see 40YOV or any Michael Cera flick). Completely public, transparent mockery of guys who have trouble with women that's lauded by most in our society. And it's certainly not just in the world of fiction, either. Real men are insulted on the basis of their (lack of or quality of) sexual conquests continuously and publicly. I visit quite a few message boards besides this one, and this is absolutely, positively the only one of the bunch where guys who reveal themselves to be virgins, perpetually single, or simply not successful with women aren't immediately and irreversibly scorned, marked to be ridiculed on a post-by-post basis until they're driven away. In real life, of course, this behavior goes on amongst my college-age friends and peers a lot too. But what's so devastating about watching the unfiltered primal behavior that unfolds online is this: it's not just the insecure teenage guys doing the mocking. It's grown, successful, married men -- and sometimes women -- relentlessly pounding away at what little self-esteem is left of some poor pimply-faced 18- or 20-year-old who can't get laid! Basically, the entirety of Western society seems to have the impression that it's open hunting season on male virgins year-round.

So I'm thinking the extremely intense degradation we're subject to on a continuous basis may be one aggravating factor, given that our failures themselves would be devastating in their own right -- so taking them lightly and as comedy material is obviously touchy.


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## stranger25 (Apr 29, 2010)

Thanks for your contribution.


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## XxArmyofOnexX (Aug 13, 2007)

Perfectionist said:


> I hope I'm not present the one time stranger25 sees a girl attracted to a shy, quiet male and his entire philosphy on relationships and understanding of women implodes.


You mean a mind****?


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## XxArmyofOnexX (Aug 13, 2007)

vicente said:


> No, I am not one of those guys with SA who b*tch about hot girls not liking them and who ignore average looking girls who like them. No one likes me. I'll date anyone with a great personality who isn't hideous looking.


+849328492849328423942

As for the thread from personal experience,

too easily swayed due to no experience, addicted to negative, read only negative, expect the same outcome for themselves, go in with that mindset, get rejected or are too afraid, feel the world is mocking them, then voila, bitterness galore.

Stigma against shy guys is stupidly high...
if you're shy around women or don't have "game" you're worthless. Open to being alone, the third wheel, on the outside, mocked by one's peers.


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