# The stereotypical woman is a turn off to me



## GroupHug (Jan 27, 2012)

Am I alone in this? 

OK, I don't mean to be politically correct, attempt to sound more intelligent than I actually am, or try to be a radical when I say this:

I'm a straight guy, so obviously I'm attracted to women. Like every straight guy, there's certain characteristics that attract me to certain women. Being stereotypically and extremely feminine and passive/submissive or expecting me to be the opposite - very masculine, "in charge"...the stereotypical man's man, is not an arrangement I'm comfortable with.

Look, I'm not an effeminate man and I'm not looking for a "butch" girl, I just don't get it when guys say things like, "She makes me feel like a man" or when a woman says she likes a guy because of how she feels protected by his manliness...you know, things like that. Other examples don't come to mind right now, but you get the idea.

I'm very much attracted to independent minded women who don't necessarily conform to all the expected traditional female roles, and this has nothing to do with personal politics at all, but my preference is that having that intense feeling of equality just feels more intimate.


----------



## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

You are a girly-man.



Just kidding.


----------



## northstar1991 (Oct 4, 2011)

I definitely get what you mean. I'm not attracted to the stereotypical male. Men that act dominant and macho are a turn off to me.


----------



## applesauce5482 (Apr 26, 2012)

GroupHug said:


> I'm very much attracted to independent minded women who don't necessarily conform to all the expected traditional female roles


same here!


----------



## StayingMotivated (Sep 5, 2011)

I like submissive men muhahahaha depends though


----------



## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

I also like submissive men. Men who can follow directions well and carry my purse. To make him feel like a man he can carry the groceries and move furniture.


----------



## pythonesque (Jun 16, 2012)

Actually, I think what you've outlined in your OP is what most men want. No man with a healthy amount of self-esteem wants a woman who can't make up her own mind about things and submits to her guy's every whim. That gets boring, fast. The "she makes me feel like a man" comments are usually uttered when the girl does something to validate the guy's opinions or make him look good in front of company, etc. - things that every person would want that typically have nothing to do with their gender.


----------



## Ape in space (May 31, 2010)

There's a way to be manly without being domineering or one of those arrogant lunkheads. I consider protection to be a part of my definition of manliness, but being controlling or expecting the woman to be passive isn't. And accepting my protection / manly deeds that I do for her doesn't mean she has to submit to me or anything like that. I would happily grovel at her feet and obey her orders, but I would be disappointed if she didn't let me protect and take care of her in manly ways, or if she got offended by my efforts.

Also the 'wanting to feel like a man' thing is not necessarily a bad thing. For someone like me who has been anxious and dorky all his life, being able to improve yourself to become more tough and able to protect a woman is something that makes you feel better about yourself. And it lets you get in touch with your more 'primitive' side. That might be looked down on by some, but I can tell you that being 'civilized' all the time and living in your intellectual thoughts gets really tiresome after a while. It makes you want to experience some nice emotions and primal interactions. As long as it's not harming anyone it's not a problem.



komorikun said:


> I also like submissive men. Men who can follow directions well and carry my purse. To make him feel like a man he can carry the groceries and move furniture.


I'm willing to humiliate myself in a million different ways for a woman, but there's no way I'm carrying her purse. :no


----------



## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

I approve


----------



## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Ape in space said:


> I'm willing to humiliate myself in a million different ways for a woman, but there's no way I'm carrying her purse. :no


What are you willing to do and why is carrying a purse so horrible?


----------



## identitycrisis (Sep 18, 2011)

You're definitely not alone in this.

Here's the thing though. I don't think being strong and being feminine are mutually exclusive. It's those gender roles you talk about that contribute to that mindset of "any woman who's a woman is demure, submissive, and needs a strong man to protect her." What I look for in a woman is someone who bucks those traditional gender roles, and can show me how strong of a woman she is. That doesn't make them "butch." That doesn't take a single thing away from their femininity, sexuality, or attractiveness.


----------



## MindOverMood (Dec 12, 2009)

Ape in space said:


> I'm willing to humiliate myself in a million different ways for a woman, but there's no way I'm carrying her purse. :no


----------



## anomalous (Jun 12, 2004)

I completely agree with the OP. And I kind of get the hunch that what he (and I) meant isn't exactly how some of you have interpreted it.

Speaking for myself, the ideal relationship I envision is one of almost perfect equality, including areas in which almost every relationship I know of IRL conforms to established gender roles. I simply don't see any women in my everyday life who appear comfortable with or accepting of such an arrangement. Everyone says they want equality, and undoubtedly they do -- in certain areas. But when it comes down to it, very few of them want to break tradition or societal expectations in other areas.

The spectrum of relationships I see among my friends/family/colleagues goes something like this: most are male-dominant, in which the man is expecting to make most of the decisions, lead, and take initiative. Then there's a minority that are _female_-dominant, in which it appears to me the man simply gets bossed around and taken advantage of. It's very rare I've seen much in between, but that's just me.


----------



## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

anomalous said:


> I completely agree with the OP. And I kind of get the hunch that what he (and I) meant isn't exactly how some of you have interpreted it.
> 
> Speaking for myself, the ideal relationship I envision is one of almost perfect equality, including areas in which almost every relationship I know of IRL conforms to established gender roles. I simply don't see any women in my everyday life who appear comfortable with or accepting of such an arrangement. Everyone says they want equality, and undoubtedly they do -- in certain areas. But when it comes down to it, very few of them want to break tradition or societal expectations in other areas.
> 
> The spectrum of relationships I see among my friends/family/colleagues goes something like this: most are male-dominant, in which the man is expecting to make most of the decisions, lead, and take initiative. Then there's a minority that are _female_-dominant, in which it appears to me the man simply gets bossed around and taken advantage of. It's very rare I've seen much in between, but that's just me.


Why do you say if the relationship is female dominant the guy is getting bossed around and taken advantage but when the relationship is male dominant you say it as if it's a positive thing?


----------



## anomalous (Jun 12, 2004)

komorikun said:


> Why do you say if the relationship is female dominant the guy is getting bossed around and taken advantage but when the relationship is male dominant you say it as if it's a positive thing?


I don't see it as a positive thing to be the one "bossed around" in either case. But in most of the relationships I know of, if the girl is in that position, she appears to love it and eat it up. I've seriously seen numerous instances where the whole relationship seems centered around this cute little game where the girl likes to be talked down to by her BF and basically told she's stupid/incompetent -- and when she gets bored, she'll do something intentionally to make it happen. I even have a few friends who seem like pretty decent guys around me, but act like this to their GF because she likes it so much.


----------



## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

I also want to add that looks can be deceiving. For instance many people think that in Japan men rule the roost but in some ways they really don't. Traditionally the woman takes care of the finances. In many couples, in fact, the man only receives an "allowance" that is normally 10% of his salary to pay for lunch, cigarettes, gasoline, etc. So when you see older couples go out for dinner or shopping usually the woman pays because she has all the cards/cash. I remember this one TV show I used to watch where the guy would plead with his wife to increase his allowance. They showed the wife going out to an expensive lunch with her girlfriends while he always had to eat the lunch his wife prepared him in the morning.

I believe it is the same in several other Asian countries.


----------



## GroupHug (Jan 27, 2012)

anomalous said:


> I completely agree with the OP. And I kind of get the hunch that what he (and I) meant isn't exactly how some of you have interpreted it.
> 
> Speaking for myself, the ideal relationship I envision is one of almost perfect equality, including areas in which almost every relationship I know of IRL conforms to established gender roles. I simply don't see any women in my everyday life who appear comfortable with or accepting of such an arrangement. Everyone says they want equality, and undoubtedly they do -- in certain areas. But when it comes down to it, very few of them want to break tradition or societal expectations in other areas.
> 
> The spectrum of relationships I see among my friends/family/colleagues goes something like this: most are male-dominant, in which the man is expecting to make most of the decisions, lead, and take initiative. Then there's a minority that are _female_-dominant, in which it appears to me the man simply gets bossed around and taken advantage of. It's very rare I've seen much in between, but that's just me.


Exactly.


----------



## Gryffindor85 (Nov 7, 2011)

As a submissive male, I want a girl to get out a strap on and reprimand me for being such a naughty boy for all the wanking I do.

I seriously hate the way men are expected to be dominant.


----------



## Rich19 (Aug 11, 2012)

To an extent, by which I mean I don't like girls who are really clingy and want to spend whole days on end with me. However I'm not attracted to dominant women


----------



## wrongnumber (May 24, 2009)

Yeah, I find gender stereotypes and authoritarian vs submissive dynamics extremely off putting, even repulsive. I don't like mothering people much, and I balk when someone expects me to do what they say just because. I think men can be strong without being domineering, and women can be sensitive without being weak. The differences are attractive, but are better when they even each other out to be equal, like peers.


----------



## General Specific (Mar 4, 2008)

komorikun said:


> I also want to add that looks can be deceiving. For instance many people think that in Japan men rule the roost but in some ways they really don't. Traditionally the woman takes care of the finances. In many couples, in fact, the man only receives an "allowance" that is normally 10% of his salary to pay for lunch, cigarettes, gasoline, etc. So when you see older couples go out for dinner or shopping usually the woman pays because she has all the cards/cash. I remember this one TV show I used to watch where the guy would plead with his wife to increase his allowance. They showed the wife going out to an expensive lunch with her girlfriends while he always had to eat the lunch his wife prepared him in the morning.
> 
> I believe it is the same in several other Asian countries.


And now I know why the suicide rate is so high in Japan.


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

komorikun said:


> What are you willing to do and why is carrying a purse so horrible?


Carrying a woman's purse is as about as low as a dude could go. He might as well wear a Bellhop's uniform.


----------



## BobbyByThePound (Apr 4, 2012)

pythonesque said:


> Actually, I think what you've outlined in your OP is what most men want. No man with a healthy amount of self-esteem wants a woman who can't make up her own mind about things and submits to her guy's every whim. That gets boring, fast. The "she makes me feel like a man" comments are usually uttered when the girl does something to validate the guy's opinions or make him look good in front of company, etc. - things that every person would want that typically have nothing to do with their gender.


This is 100000000% true. Wanting a woman to be like that just shows that you're not healthy psychologically. And being so insecure like that is not being a "real man." That sort of thing just makes you a fake-*** imitation of a real man.

I dated a woman like that once and it really was boring. There was this song where the singer said " I want a man to stand beside me, not in front of or behind me" and that's how I feel about women. Some women seem to have submissive personalities but if I was dating someone submissive I'd be with them in spite of- not because of- their submissiveness.



theseventhkey said:


> Carrying a woman's purse is as about as low as a dude could go. He might as well wear a Bellhop's uniform.


I co-sign this. You must be outta your mind if you think I'mma walk around with your purse. I got no problem being respectful but being ***** whipped is where I draw the line.



komorikun said:


> I also like submissive men. Men who can follow directions well and carry my purse. To make him feel like a man he can carry the groceries and move furniture.


I think that's more like a way to make him feel more like a slave than like a man. But you have a right to your preferences and if you find a man who likes being submissive then he has a right to his preferences. Personally, I'd never date someone who wanted me to be submissive.



komorikun said:


> What are you willing to do and why is carrying a purse so horrible?


It's not something self-respecting men do.



komorikun said:


> Why do you say if the relationship is female dominant the guy is getting bossed around and taken advantage but when the relationship is male dominant you say it as if it's a positive thing?


Imo this is a false dichotomy. I think there can relationships where neither the male nor female is dominant. Like in that song I quoted. But, for some set of sociological reasons, in reality, relationships where the male is more dominant are more common in our society. I think part of it is that there's more submissive women than submissive men in our society.


----------



## Fruitcake (Jan 19, 2012)

Interesting that it's seen as a whipped thing to hold a woman's purse, when a guy who does that is doing a favour for someone and is secure enough to not care how people view him, whereas a guy who makes a big deal out of it and refuses to because society has made him think it's feminine and he doesn't want to be judged by others seems a lot more stereotypically feminine to me.


----------



## BobbyByThePound (Apr 4, 2012)

Fruitcake said:


> Interesting that it's seen as a whipped thing to hold a woman's purse, when a guy who does that is doing a favour for someone and is secure enough to not care how people view him, whereas a guy who makes a big deal out of it and refuses to because society has made him think it's feminine and he doesn't want to be judged by others seems a lot more stereotypically feminine to me.




So he's feminine for holding the purse and he's feminine for not holding the purse?

Well...... actually, if he holds the purse he'll be feminine in the eyes of his male peers. If he refuses to hold the purse, he'll be feminine in the eyes of a very intelligent poster from SAS. It is "stereotypically feminine" to be overly concerned about what his male peers think of holding the purse. But it's also just bad to be overly concerned about what Fruitcake thinks.

Hmm..... so, really, he shouldn't be concerned about what either Fruitcake or what the male peers think. He should be concerned with his own feelings about holding the purse. For sake of argument, let's suppose he's an average 19-year-old male from Texas....

Odds are he has internalized his society's notion that it is feminine for him to carry the purse- thus it is feminine *in his own eyes*- not just in the eyes of his male peers. Unless this is not the case and he feels 100% comfortable with carrying the purse and doesn't feel degraded at all by carrying it in public, the best choice is for him to not carry the purse. Hopefully his girlfriend is understanding enough to respect his feelings and won't try to pressure him into doing something he's not comfortable with.


----------



## Fruitcake (Jan 19, 2012)

BobbyByThePound said:


> So he's feminine for holding the purse and he's feminine for not holding the purse?
> 
> Well...... actually, if he holds the purse he'll be feminine in the eyes of his male peers. If he refuses to hold the purse, he'll be feminine in the eyes of a very intelligent poster from SAS. It is "stereotypically feminine" to be overly concerned about what his male peers think of holding the purse. But it's also just bad to be overly concerned about what Fruitcake thinks.
> 
> ...


No no no. Everyone should be concerned with what Fruitcake thinks.
And yes I agree that the average guy would feel that way and it's reasonable enough. I think there would be self-respecting guys who do hold purses though.
By the way I was just making a note of that, I would never actually pressure a man to hold my purse. I respect men and their right to remain purse-free.


----------



## BobbyByThePound (Apr 4, 2012)

Fruitcake said:


> No no no. Everyone should be concerned with what Fruitcake thinks.
> And yes I agree that the average guy would feel that way and it's reasonable enough. I think there would be self-respecting guys who do hold purses though.
> By the way I was just making a note of that, I would never actually pressure a man to hold my purse. I respect men and their right to remain purse-free.


You're right. I shoulda said most self-respecting men would not hold a purse. I'm sure there are exceptions out there (I'm assuming they're the minority).


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

Aces_Shy said:


> And now I know why the suicide rate is so high in Japan.


lol!!!:haha


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

BobbyByThePound said:


> So he's feminine for holding the purse and he's feminine for not holding the purse?
> 
> Well...... actually, if he holds the purse he'll be feminine in the eyes of his male peers. If he refuses to hold the purse, he'll be feminine in the eyes of a very intelligent poster from SAS. It is "stereotypically feminine" to be overly concerned about what his male peers think of holding the purse. But it's also just bad to be overly concerned about what Fruitcake thinks.
> 
> ...


LOl, you are fighting losing battle. You can't win. Women want everything on their terms, you can't make request, you can't refuse, you can't take a stand, you can't do this, you can't say that, you can't, you can't you can't, you fu#king can't!!! That's why divorce is rising. :no


----------



## Fruitcake (Jan 19, 2012)

theseventhkey said:


> LOl, you are fighting losing battle. You can't win. Women want everything on their terms, you can't make request, you can't refuse, you can't take a stand, you can't do this, you can't say that, you can't, you can't you can't, you fu#king can't!!! That's why divorce is rising. :no


You can't talk about women like that.


----------



## BobbyByThePound (Apr 4, 2012)

theseventhkey said:


> LOl, you are fighting losing battle. You can't win. Women want everything on their terms, you can't make request, you can't refuse, you can't take a stand, you can't do this, you can't say that, you can't, you can't you can't, you fu#king can't!!! That's why divorce is rising. :no


It's all womens' fault?? Maybe you just need to date cooler women. Maybe being a pushover in relationships with women is a problem for some men but I don't let no man or woman walk all over me.


----------



## Diacetylmorphine (Mar 9, 2011)

Aces_Shy said:


> And now I know why the suicide rate is so high in Japan.


lmao :spit


----------



## arpeggiator (Jan 6, 2011)

anomalous said:


> I completely agree with the OP. And I kind of get the hunch that what he (and I) meant isn't exactly how some of you have interpreted it.
> 
> Speaking for myself, the ideal relationship I envision is one of almost perfect equality, including areas in which almost every relationship I know of IRL conforms to established gender roles. I simply don't see any women in my everyday life who appear comfortable with or accepting of such an arrangement. Everyone says they want equality, and undoubtedly they do -- in certain areas. But when it comes down to it, very few of them want to break tradition or societal expectations in other areas.
> 
> The spectrum of relationships I see among my friends/family/colleagues goes something like this: most are male-dominant, in which the man is expecting to make most of the decisions, lead, and take initiative. Then there's a minority that are _female_-dominant, in which it appears to me the man simply gets bossed around and taken advantage of. It's very rare I've seen much in between, but that's just me.


I agree with this.
A couple is really a reduced social group and like in other social groups there's always a hierarchy, in which the one who makes the decisions is usually the less needy person of the two. As you said a relationship based in equality is an ideal.

Personally, both passive and dominant women turn me off. I like women who know what they want, who don't let society dictate how they are supposed to behave or live and at the same time, they don't impose their way of living on their partner.


----------



## Ape in space (May 31, 2010)

Something I forgot to say in my last answer: The reason I'm comfortable with adopting a 'manly' role is that I consider it to be just one small part of a relationship. Even if I were to date a 'submissive' girl, that's just one part of her personality. There are other things that are more important, like intelligence, compassion, etc. And as a dork I know that our external confidence is not what defines us, even though society seems to tell us that it is. So for that reason I have no problem with taking on some characteristics of traditional gender roles (while still rejecting others) without feeling like I am just obeying what society wants me to do. There's nothing about being submissive or being manly that implies a lack of equality. They are simply different modes of being.



komorikun said:


> What are you willing to do and why is carrying a purse so horrible?


There's no way to hold a purse in such a way that others will know that it's not yours. I was in an airport with my mom once and she was going to the bathroom so she gave me her purse and made me stand in the hallway with it until she got back. That was awful. I held the bag behind me pretending that my arm wasn't attached to my body, breathing hard the entire time. My sister has tried to make me hold her purse as well and I just say to her, "No way, give me those other bags but you keep the purse."

What I'm willing to do: If necessary, I can do things like grovelling, massaging feet, generally serving, taking her places in the middle of the night, cleaning up after her, signing a contract that gives her full ownership of me, etc. Some people might think I'm crazy or that I have low self esteem, but that's not the case. As long as she's a nice person, little things like this don't really bother me.


----------



## rymo (Sep 6, 2009)

I agree with the OP about meeting an equal - someone who is independent and ambitious and this kind of thing. I'm not sure how the conversation turned into holding a purse, but I would do it (if there was a good reason).


----------



## meeps (Dec 5, 2011)

Ape in space said:


> There's no way to hold a purse in such a way that others will know that it's not yours. I was in an airport with my mom once and she was going to the bathroom so she gave me her purse and made me stand in the hallway with it until she got back. That was awful. I held the bag behind me pretending that my arm wasn't attached to my body, breathing hard the entire time. My sister has tried to make me hold her purse as well and I just say to her, "No way, give me those other bags but you keep the purse."


So even holding it for like a few seconds would freak you out? what if she just needs to readjust all the things she's carrying and doesn't want to put her purse on the floor and asks you to take it really quick?


----------



## Badwolf (Oct 13, 2012)

Funny, my boyfriend is definitely the more dominate one in the relationship, well, at least when it comes to some areas, but I have no doubt he would carry my purse, (if I actually liked carrying one that is), without a problem. Same with buying tampons and pads for me, which for some reason some men also feel uncomfortable doing.


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

Fruitcake said:


> You can't talk about women like that.


----------



## louiselouisa (Jul 12, 2012)

I don't like stereotypical men either, I would a man who can cover up my flaws but I don't like it when he wouldn't let me do anything I want just because I'm supposed to be a stereotypical woman and he's supposed to be a man.


----------



## strugglingforhope (Jun 13, 2009)

You're not alone, gender roles are messed up; I think it's pretty a pretty common sentiment around here. I don't like being forced into the male stereotype either. I don't mind certain aspects about femininity though, so femininity isn't often a turn off for me.


----------



## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

I like men who are not so serious about their masculinity. Guys who wouldn't mind wandering around wearing pink nail polish for a day. They'd just kind of laugh it off.

Some guys are violently afraid of not appearing masculine at all times. Like if you try to put a little mascara on them they get upset.


----------



## AllToAll (Jul 6, 2011)

I'm _somewhat_ of a control freak. In fact, I don't even like dancing with a partner because I don't like to be led; I like to lead.

I'm not saying that in a relationship I'd like to be the dominating one, not at all what I'd like, but the thought of being with someone who feels entitled to control me simply disgusts me. 
I like the idea of a relationship being a partnership where both people have equal standing. The whole dominant/submissive thing might be good in bed, but not in an actual relationship.

As for the purse thing, I find it ridiculous that a man couldn't carry a purse. How is that demeaning? Not that I'd ask my BF to carry it around for me, but if I ask him to take my purse while I go to the bathroom I expect him to do it as a favor.



komorikun said:


> I like men who are not so serious about their masculinity. Guys who wouldn't mind wandering around wearing pink nail polish for a day. They'd just kind of laugh it off.
> 
> Some guys are violently afraid of not appearing masculine at all times. Like if you try to put a little mascara on them they get upset.


+1
When I was younger I jokingly tried putting red lipstick on my stepfather's lips, and he got seriously annoyed. He said, "no, now you've crossed the line." :um


----------



## Perfectionist (Mar 19, 2004)

I have a bit of trouble accepting help from a guy - I've always really valued my independance. 

For me it's that I don't want to get used to their help or protection in case I come to depend on it and it isn't there one day. I'm trying to be a bit better though, since I realize you have to be able to help each other out in a relationship. It's hard, though.

And I would never never never ask a guy to hold my purse. I get it - it's super embarassing.


----------



## squall78 (Feb 17, 2012)

I read this thread and I have to add: I AINT HOLDING NO DAMN PURSE


----------



## Ape in space (May 31, 2010)

I think 'carrying a purse' is being interpreted in two different ways in this thread. I assumed we were talking about something that happens on occasion, like if she has to go to the bathroom. Others are interpreting it as 'carrying it around', like she makes you carry it everywhere instead of carrying it herself. The latter would probably be demeaning for most people because it brings to mind a servant fawning over the master. (But I don't have such a problem with it, because I'm messed up. :eyes) The former isn't demeaning, but just embarrassing.



meeps said:


> So even holding it for like a few seconds would freak you out? what if she just needs to readjust all the things she's carrying and doesn't want to put her purse on the floor and asks you to take it really quick?


I will grudgingly hold it for a few seconds as long as she's present the whole time and it's clear that it's her purse. But if she goes off somewhere, people will look at me and think, "Why is that dude carrying a purse?" Not a pleasant situation. I will be sweating and breathing hard.



komorikun said:


> I like men who are not so serious about their masculinity. Guys who wouldn't mind wandering around wearing pink nail polish for a day. They'd just kind of laugh it off.
> 
> Some guys are violently afraid of not appearing masculine at all times. Like if you try to put a little mascara on them they get upset.


I put some of my mom's nail polish on one time when I was 5 - just out of curiosity - and went to school like that. The whole class made fun of me and tried to stop me from going to the boys' bathroom and told me to go to the girls' bathroom instead. Never again.


----------



## komorikun (Jan 11, 2009)

Ape in space said:


> I put some of my mom's nail polish on one time when I was 5 - just out of curiosity - and went to school like that. The whole class made fun of me and tried to stop me from going to the boys' bathroom and told me to go to the girls' bathroom instead. Never again.


You were 5. That's when kids are figuring out gender roles and all that crap. That's not going to happen to an adult.


----------



## AllToAll (Jul 6, 2011)

^I think it actually could. Not as blatant as not being let into the boy's bathroom, but possibly being called gay or a *****. Both insults that stem from homophobia. If you're a grown man your sexuality will be questioned by some, too. I understand where these fears (holding a purse, wearing makeup, etc.) come from, after all we live in a society that cherishes hyper-masculinity in men, which is why I think that in order to fight it you need to "man up" and hold the damn purse or wear the damn nail polish. You're still a man. And if you're gay, well damn it, you're still a man, too.


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

AllToAll said:


> ^I think it actually could. Not as blatant as not being let into the boy's bathroom, but possibly being called gay or a *****. Both insults that stem from homophobia. If you're a grown man your sexuality will be questioned by some, too. I understand where these fears (holding a purse, wearing makeup, etc.) come from, after all we live in a society that cherishes hyper-masculinity in men, which is why I think that in order to fight it you need to "man up" and hold the damn purse or wear the damn nail polish. You're still a man. And if you're gay, well damn it, you're still a man, too.


Reading this and other post that women are writing here, its making believe women really don't want a man.....they want women. If you want a man to act like a woman, putting on make-up, carry purses, wearing stockings, crying all the time, finger nail polish, why not just be a lesbian? That way you get the real deal instead of a man "acting" like a woman. I mean damn I don't want a woman with masculine traits period, if I did I might as well be messing around with men.


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

komorikun said:


> A little gender bending can be fun. One of the most perverted parties I've ever been to was a huge university drag party where all the guys dressed as women and all the women dressed as guys. I don't remember too much (alcohol) but I did make out with a cute guy wearing a white mini-skirt. (I was wearing men's jeans, a t-shirt, and a buttoned down shirt) I recall that the skirt allowed easy access to.......
> 
> And my Brazilian friend told me about this threesome she had with her female roommate and it started with the girls dressing the guy in female lingerie and putting makeup on him. I met the guy once and he's pretty hot.


Lol, I tell you, Kids today......:stu


----------



## AllToAll (Jul 6, 2011)

theseventhkey said:


> Reading this and other post that women are writing here, its making believe women really don't want a man.....they want women. If you want a man to act like a woman, putting on make-up, carry purses, wearing stockings, crying all the time, finger nail polish, why not just be a lesbian? That way you get the real deal instead of a man "acting" like a woman. I mean damn I don't want a woman with masculine traits period, if I did I might as well be messing around with men.


I don't "want" my BF to wear makeup and nail polish, but if he does it doesn't mean he's gay or any less of a man. I don't believe in gender binaries and find gender to be fluid.


----------



## john1990 (Oct 20, 2012)

haha am i the only guy that like carrying woman purse? i like when my gf to toilets in mall, i standing outside carrying her purse. Whenever other people look at me i feel proud lol, like "yeah look at me, i'm nice guy who dont feel weird carrying my gf purse". I just feel like i'm stand over other guys and i'm different cause i dont care how other people think of my masculinity. Maybe other people are laughing cause i'm so manly, you know i like sports and working out so i'm kinda muscular and i'm tall , but carry a cute pink purse in hands lol.

and not only my gf, whenever i go with my mom to every public place, like to malls, to gorcery, i always carrying her purse and bags. I dont feel weird at all.



theseventhkey said:


> Reading this and other post that women are writing here, its making believe women really don't want a man.....they want women. If you want a man to act like a woman, putting on make-up, carry purses, wearing stockings, crying all the time, finger nail polish, why not just be a lesbian? That way you get the real deal instead of a man "acting" like a woman. I mean damn I don't want a woman with masculine traits period, if I did I might as well be messing around with men.


because they ( straight women ) sexually attracted to guys. No matter how we wearing a make up, crying, and carrying purses, we still a man, we have those muscles women dont have, penis ( no matter how most women dont want to admit it, they like our penis ) , we dont have boobs, vagina, we have testosterone, etc.

I never feel less manly if 'm crying m carry a purse, or putting a moisturizer on my face ( although i dont need make up and finger polish, men without make up is sexier in my opinion)


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

john1990 said:


> haha am i the only guy that like carrying woman purse? i like when my gf to toilets in mall, i standing outside carrying her purse. Whenever other people look at me i feel proud lol, like "yeah look at me, i'm nice guy who dont feel weird carrying my gf purse". I just feel like i'm stand over other guys and i'm different cause i dont care how other people think of my masculinity. Maybe other people are laughing cause i'm so manly, you know i like sports and working out so i'm kinda muscular and i'm tall , but carry a cute pink purse in hands lol.
> 
> and not only my gf, whenever i go with my mom to every public place, like to malls, to gorcery, i always carrying her purse and bags. I dont feel weird at all.
> 
> ...


Oh jesus christ.......:blank


----------



## john1990 (Oct 20, 2012)

theseventhkey said:


> Oh jesus christ.......:blank


FYI, i live in Asia, South East Asia, so maybe there's a cultural differences compared to US....


----------



## theseventhkey (Jul 22, 2012)

john1990 said:


> FYI, i live in Asia, South East Asia, so maybe there's a cultural differences compared to US....


No, men around the world go to great length's to get laid. I'm glad my libido has been slowly dying as I'm getting older, Pride keeps me from "bowing" down to anyone maybe that's my problem.


----------



## Thinkerbell (Jul 8, 2012)

Hm I don't even know what "kind" of men I like. I guess a man I dated would have to like an independent woman...


----------



## Andre (Feb 27, 2004)

I agree with most of the others who've posted here who appreciate complimentary features in men and women to produce equilibrium, not one partner dominating the other. I think the submissive/dominant dichotomy is no longer needed and is in fact becoming obsolete.


----------



## Andre (Feb 27, 2004)

komorikun said:


> I also like submissive men. Men who can follow directions well and carry my purse. To make him feel like a man he can carry the groceries and move furniture.


The question is, what do you have to offer? Sure there are some submissive men, but most will take offense at being bossed around. Some may even believe they are submissive when they are not, once they acknowledge the inexplicable rage welling inside of them.


----------



## iAmCodeMonkey (May 23, 2010)

pythonesque said:


> Actually, I think what you've outlined in your OP is what most men want. No man with a healthy amount of self-esteem wants a woman who can't make up her own mind about things and submits to her guy's every whim. That gets boring, fast. The "she makes me feel like a man" comments are usually uttered when the girl does something to validate the guy's opinions or make him look good in front of company, etc. - things that every person would want that typically have nothing to do with their gender.


*Exactly.*


----------



## MaxPower (May 1, 2012)

GroupHug said:


> I'm very much attracted to independent minded women who don't necessarily conform to all the expected traditional female roles, and this has nothing to do with personal politics at all, but my preference is that having that intense feeling of equality just feels more intimate.


Same here


----------



## john1990 (Oct 20, 2012)

Rufus said:


> The question is, what do you have to offer? Sure there are some submissive men, but most will take offense at being bossed around. Some may even believe they are submissive when they are not, once they acknowledge the inexplicable rage welling inside of them.


what i don't like is some women said they like submissive men, but in bed they always want to be dominated.( its true especially among feminist women )

My relationship with my ex is not really i'm dominating and shes submissive, guess were kinda equal, but i hate to always be the one in charge/ take the lead/ dominating in bed.

My biggest fantasy is to be bossed and dominated wildly in bed, but its only happened once to me when i had sex ( not in real relationship ) with woman much older than me ( shes 40 ).

I guess the myth that older women always better in bed is true.


----------

