# What should an undesirable person do?



## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

Please don't make this personal. I'm not saying I or anyone else here fits the description of the theoretical description that follows...It's just something that bothers me on a theoretical level in regards to social relationships...


Let's suppose someone is not attractive or desirable to anyone (either for friendships or romance). What should such a person do with their life, given that they are still a social being with a brain that is fundamentally built/wired to associate happiness with a healthy social life and depression with a lack of social life?

Are they basically screwed? I can't think of how they are not screwed if it's assumed that they are unattractive/undesirable to everyone and radical brain surgery is off the table.

Then again, perhaps drugs could help trick the brain if the society had developed adequate options with highly reliable efficacy and insignificant negative side effects. 

It would be a difficult situation to say the least, and I think action would need to be taken on the brain itself in order to boost the quality of the person's experience.


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## Meee (Oct 24, 2005)

> Are they basically screwed?


Yes.

I can't really fathom that anyone could be unlikeable by 100% of people with 0% chance of improvement though. If you look at things logically it seems extremely unlikely. Of course if the number of compatible people are small enough it could be almost impossible (to find friendship / a relationship), but it'd still be worth pursuing, i think. Happiness is what we're all after, right? So even if there's only a small chance we should go for it.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

I would suggest to such a person to go out and volunteer (for anything -- whatever they're interested in). If you can't establish any sort of personal relationships, at least you could be with people on a professional level.


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## shyvr6 (Feb 18, 2008)

Date a blind person? I guarantee there is someone in this world that would date that person. I seen some very unattractive people in my opinion in this world, and they seem to always be with someone, which leaves me dumbfounded. I end up asking myself, what the hell am I doing wrong, lol? It's just finding that person which is the hard part.


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## HoboQueen (Jan 25, 2008)

If they were desperate for companionship they could always get a russian bride.


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## queequag (May 4, 2008)

Blah! You cannot buy companionship! Unless you buy a dog. A Russian dog...

But I think volunteering would be a great idea. You meet other volunteers. And you can help others who are in pain - something we can all relate to, huzzah! 

I used to volunteer at an annual film festival, which forced me to interact with lots of people for a short period of time. It was great because it made me feel social, but if I made a fool of myself- who cares! You'll never meet them again, anyways!


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## Zephyr (Nov 8, 2003)

I'll go for the "basically screwed" option.


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## yeah_yeah_yeah (Mar 27, 2007)

Even the most butt ugly and dull people can end up happily married

dude where has this all come from?


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## nightmahr (Jan 2, 2008)

Even monsters and demons have a place in the world.


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## LostinReverie (Mar 18, 2007)

> Let's suppose someone is not attractive or desirable to anyone (either for friendships or romance). What should such a person do with their life, given that they are still a social being with a brain that is fundamentally built/wired to associate happiness with a healthy social life and depression with a lack of social life?


The question of my life. I have not yet found an answer. People tend to recommend investing yourself into your interests and not focusing on having relationships. Yet if you have a personality like mine, which craves human connection, that is not possible.


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## ardrum (May 13, 2007)

LostInReverie said:


> > Let's suppose someone is not attractive or desirable to anyone (either for friendships or romance). What should such a person do with their life, given that they are still a social being with a brain that is fundamentally built/wired to associate happiness with a healthy social life and depression with a lack of social life?
> 
> 
> The question of my life. I have not yet found an answer. People tend to recommend investing yourself into your interests and not focusing on having relationships. Yet if you have a personality like mine, which craves human connection, that is not possible.


If you could be a subject to some sort of sci-fi brain surgery that would cut off the craving (and let's assume cost is a non-issue, say it's free... and there are no negative accidents in the procedure 99.9% of the time), would you agree to do it?


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## Kanashi (Jan 5, 2008)

They wait to die....


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## LostinReverie (Mar 18, 2007)

ardrum said:


> If you could be a subject to some sort of sci-fi brain surgery that would cut off the craving (and let's assume cost is a non-issue, say it's free... and there are no negative accidents in the procedure 99.9% of the time), would you agree to do it?


That sort of need belongs to your soul, not your brain. So if humans found a way to remove the soul, then we would create vampires, such as in _I am Legend_.

Technology is scary. Haven't you seen _The Matrix_; _Minority Report_; _I, Robot_; _The Island_, etc. ?


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

To answer your question Adam, I don't think there's anyone who is 100% unattractive to anyone. That's probably not the answer you were looking for, but I believe it to be the truth. That being said, if there was such a person, there are other ways to fill the void of relationships (as everyone on here has had to do to some extent). Hobbies, pets, volunteering, working, etc. I think it's possible to achieve a certain level of happiness without being involved in intimate relationships. Would I want it for my life? No, but it's possible.


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## aries (May 2, 2008)

Physical attraction does not matter to everyone. Ever heard the song that goes if you want to be happy for the rest of your life never make a pretty woman your wife!
I don't want a wife that wants a job and no kids or her own bank account or something, I'm too traditionalist, but I know there are girls out there itching for that kind of role, I don't particularly care what they look like, it has more to do with personality for me not sexuality.


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## CopadoMexicano (Aug 21, 2004)

read the bible


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## Noca (Jun 24, 2005)

Get a Russian bride and take Adderall to achieve happiness.


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## Scrub-Zero (Feb 9, 2004)

join a monk temple and meditate until the worldly thoughts go away.


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## markx (Dec 22, 2007)

Logan X said:


> join a monk temple and meditate until the worldly thoughts go away.


For a second there I thought that said "_meditate until the *woody* thoughts go away_"! :lol

No one is undesirable to _everyone_ but sometimes we need to lower our sights significantly or be prepared to accept that we'll always be alone.


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## LostinReverie (Mar 18, 2007)

markx said:


> No one is undesirable to _everyone_


You have no reasoning or evidence to say such a thing. It's just something nice to say and I hate it when people say that.


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## markx (Dec 22, 2007)

No? Take an extreme case - ever heard of Joseph Merrick? As undesirable as he might have seemed, he had more than a few women admirers during the latter part of his short life although ultimately nothing ever became of that interest. Murderers and rapists marry while they're still locked up for their crimes. People who have been badly disfigured through accident or illness find love and start families. There's enough evidence around to convince _me_ that no one is undesirable to everyone.


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## LostinReverie (Mar 18, 2007)

Merely seeing people you think are undesirable in relationships does not in the least give evidence that there aren't people undesirable to everyone. You haven't met everyone nor even seen everyone. You are taking your own personal experiences and forming absolute statements. My own personal experiences prove otherwise.


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## markx (Dec 22, 2007)

It's impossible to find _absolute_ proof either one way or the other. :stu If you'd met some of the girls that my brother has dated, you wouldn't believe that anyone was totally undesirable either. 

Let's say there are about 8bn people on earth, give or take a few. Let's say half of those are adults, with a 50/50 gender split. So, for my theory to be proved correct, I only need to find 1 person out of 2bn. For the opposite theory to be proved correct, a person would have to be rejected by _every one_ of those 2bn. I know which theory I'd put *my* money on.


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## SaigeJones (Mar 17, 2008)

ardrum said:


> Please don't make this personal. I'm not saying I or anyone else here fits the description of the theoretical description that follows...It's just something that bothers me on a theoretical level in regards to social relationships...
> 
> Let's suppose someone is not attractive or desirable to anyone (either for friendships or romance). What should such a person do with their life, given that they are still a social being with a brain that is fundamentally built/wired to associate happiness with a healthy social life and depression with a lack of social life?


This person should make the most of their life meaning that they should have a job that provides enough adequate income to live comfortably.



ardrum said:


> Are they basically screwed? I can't think of how they are not screwed if it's assumed that they are unattractive/undesirable to everyone and radical brain surgery is off the table.


In terms of being in relationships, yes they are "screwed"



ardrum said:


> Then again, perhaps drugs could help trick the brain if the society had developed adequate options with highly reliable efficacy and insignificant negative side effects.


maybe, maybe not.


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## SaigeJones (Mar 17, 2008)

yeah_yeah_yeah said:


> Even the most butt ugly and dull people can end up happily married
> 
> dude where has this all come from?


I don't think it has much to do with being "ugly". Some people just can't attract people to them. I am one of those people.

Its virtually impossible for me to interact with people. Deep down inside I feel that other people know about my inability to interact as well so I am shut off from most areas of human interaction. The closest thing I can achieve in terms of interacting is to stare at people. Staring at people is something I do frequently and ive connected to alot of people by doing so. Through the years that I have stared at people ive received smiles, grimaces, signs of anger and signs of neutrality.


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## SaigeJones (Mar 17, 2008)

LostInReverie said:


> ardrum said:
> 
> 
> > If you could be a subject to some sort of sci-fi brain surgery that would cut off the craving (and let's assume cost is a non-issue, say it's free... and there are no negative accidents in the procedure 99.9% of the time), would you agree to do it?
> ...


I have to respectfully disagree with this. Ive always looked at the soul (I don't really like to call it the soul. I like to call it the "Base point"), as that thing that experiences. In my opinion all experiences originate from the brain so if you can fully control the brain then you can control your needs, desires, etc. Your soul is not there to need, want, or desire. The soul is simply there to experience.


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## SaigeJones (Mar 17, 2008)

nightmahr said:


> Even monsters and demons have a place in the world.


According to society (Which controls the world we live in), monsters and demons have no place in the world. Some people are not even monsters and according to society they still have no place in the world.


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## SaigeJones (Mar 17, 2008)

LostInReverie said:


> markx said:
> 
> 
> > No one is undesirable to _everyone_
> ...


I have to agree with LIR. There is no evidence that supports that no one is undesirable.

I see people bringing up cases where even the worse of people were considered desirable to support that no one is undesirable. In my opinion this proves nothing because life does not work out that way. If life was balanced in this way then no evil man would die rich and happy while poor men die poor and alone.

Sometimes bad things happen to good people and good things happen to bad people. This is how life works.

I consider myself a good person but I know for a fact that I am undesirable. I can look at people in the eye and know what they think I am so incredibly different to the point where my identity boarders on that of an alien (or at least something that is not human). Through staring at people I notice that there are 4 different types of people :

*1. People who hate me in terms of my aesthetical appearence *. There individuals do not like me because of the arrangement of bodily and facial features. 
*2. People who hate me because of my race*
*3. People who hate me because of my gender. * This has made me insecure about my body as I am a man. I always try to keep my weight down so my appearance isn't so masculine. I feel that people hate my gender. Over time I am starting to dislike the my male features. 
*4. People who hate me because of my body language and overall outward appearence. * I don't really know what to do in order to look at least presentable to people. Its useless.

There are individuals who smile at me but this is only because they are either laughing at me, faking, or trying to make themselves feel better.

Despite my negative experiences with staring at people I have also had good experiences as well. Maybe two or three times a year I will stare at a person that respects me as a true human being. These people do not give me fake smiles, genuine smiles, or any sign that they "like" or "dislike" me. I find that these people connect with me on a neutral level that respects me as a person. I believe these people know who I truly am and they do not hate or like my true nature but they respect it. These are the people I enjoy staring at the most.


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## RubyTuesday (Aug 3, 2007)

ardrum said:


> Please don't make this personal. I'm not saying I or anyone else here fits the description of the theoretical description that follows...It's just something that bothers me on a theoretical level in regards to social relationships...
> 
> Let's suppose someone is not attractive or desirable to anyone (either for friendships or romance). What should such a person do with their life, given that they are still a social being with a brain that is fundamentally built/wired to associate happiness with a healthy social life and depression with a lack of social life?
> 
> ...


I'd say that the problem isn't "desirability" or "undesirability"... that it all comes down to state of mind.

If you are in a good and content state of mind, you attract people and your positives are emphasized and will also even develop.

If your state of mind is poorly, your bad points will magnify and your good ones shrink ...leading a person to view themselves and be viewed as possibly 'undesirable'.

The only cure then is to alter your state of mind, and how happy you feel within your self.

Me, personally -my experience is that I more than likely have a fragile brain chemistry that makes me prone to anxiety and emotional instability. So, for me, having tried medication and found it successful -this is what I personally think people with anxiety disorders like SA need. ...if I was to base it on my self.

And my other cure is to do volunteer work, since I figure this gives a person grounding in terms of feeling connected with others. -Many other forms of socializing seem to be conditional, where there is more expectation to meet a standard. Whereas volunteer work doesn't involve so much of this kind of pressure.

...In other words, if you can BE happy, you will then attract happy experiences with others.

My shrink asked me what plans I had for the future. I told her that all I want is to continue to feel good within my self, like I have since taking Lexapro, and hopefully continue feeling even more good. And I don't care so much about what type of job I have or how often I go out ...and, eventually as I adjust, I won't care so much about aging and losing my physical desirability. Just so long as I feel contentment and a lack of anxiety within my self, I will be happy.

...interestingly, I saw a study done on 'lucky people' ....one of the major characteristics that such people had in common was that they lacked anxiety and others found them more appealing. Their body language, for example, was more 'open' and others picked up on this and responded positively to them. ...So, it has to come down to how good you feel inwardly as to what experiences you then attract.
So what's needed is finding ways to improve how you feel within. -_You're undesirable if you feel undesirable._


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## RubyTuesday (Aug 3, 2007)

I thought I'd also say that...

I think you're desirable, Adam. -You're a really unusual and interesting person, who stands out from the crowd even over the internet! You're intelligent with a unique way of thinking and approaching things. And have good taste in music and movies. You also look quite handsome when you wear a suit (like those photos you once put up) -and I'm not just saying that! :b


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## RubyTuesday (Aug 3, 2007)

LostInReverie said:


> Merely seeing people you think are undesirable in relationships does not in the least give evidence that there aren't people undesirable to everyone. You haven't met everyone nor even seen everyone. You are taking your own personal experiences and forming absolute statements. My own personal experiences prove otherwise.


I think you look at people as if they are fixed and don't go through changes or phases.

My rapid aging is one great example for me how quickly a person can change. How, as a woman with my own individual set of genes, I can go from having a lot to having quite a good deal less (and I'm only 30 years old!) ...on the other hand, some women are lucky in that they actually look better later in their life, and blossom at around 30.

But, change is everywhere -most people don't stay the same way or keep any one thing or way that they have throughout their life.

And just like that, you are better off viewing people in terms of their potential (for both bad and good). You'd actually be more in keeping with reality if you did, since this is how reality works.

Furthermore, if you befriend 'change', change is more likely to work in your favor: it's something that spiritual people understood/understand. Buddha and Jesus knew about it. They tended to see past what people thought of themselves and see the bigger picture and what they were moving towards or due to experience -and, when it was appropriate (when the person was ready to accept change and a new experience) they helped them along. Jesus helped people move on to have a new experience and I read that he always saw more in people than they usually saw -potential in other words and the bigger picture and change -but he also encouraged them to accept change themselves and to look at themselves and life in this way. (notice that he didn't 'heal' everyone, but just helped them along in the process that they were going through themselves -a process that he noticed because he didn't see anything or anyone as fixed a certain way.)

...anyhow, the point is that life is about change and people are full of potential for both bad and good, highs and lows.

You might feel yourself to be unattractive now; but life always changes. And some years later, you may have a totally different experience.


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## CoconutHolder (Oct 13, 2007)

RubyTuesday said:


> I'd say that the problem isn't "desirability" or "undesirability"... that it all comes down to state of mind.
> 
> If you are in a good and content state of mind, you attract people and your positives are emphasized and will also even develop.
> 
> ...


 :clap :banana :yes


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