# Hatred for humanity?



## Vade (Mar 11, 2006)

This seems like a cross between Secondary Disorders and Frustration, so hopefully this is the correct forum.

I feel one of the primary reasons that I suffer from social anxiety is because I find myself detesting humanity for different reasons with each passing day, and thus I withdraw into myself mentality.

Quite honestly, I believe I could write a book listing and analyzing the many examples of my abhorrence for people, but I'll just list a few:

• I visit several online games' message boards and other community forums daily (mostly as a lurker), and I constantly observe people getting involved in flame wars; what I mostly notice is the rampant personal attacks against others and disregarding the fact that there are human beings in front of computer screens. I see this as largely neanderthal-like behavior.

• Interacting with people daily on the superficial level; witnessing first-hand how people can be extremely insensitive and intolerant of you for a variety of reasons, such as your personality (in my case, timidity), views of the world, and more.

• The drama and deception involved in today's politics and the distressing social calamities occurring worldwide that are brought up in our media; to put it mildly, watching the news these days enrages me.

• And one that hits closest to home, my family - I had a heated argument with my brother a few days ago over the phone for two hours, and to make a long story short, the malice and snide tone in his voice and the content of the argument on his part demonstrated how vile people can truly be.

Like I said, I could list more, but the common theme I take from every one of these points is, at their core, selfishness, and it makes me not want to deal with *anyone*, including making friends, and as extreme as ordering something in person from a fast-food restaurant. So, why should I even attempt to integrate myself more into society when I take the risk of having to endure these petty issues?

Can anyone relate to this at all? And is there an official medical term for this?


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## Invisible13 (fake email) (Dec 28, 2006)

Yeah it's called Misanthropy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misanthropy


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## lonesomeboy (Aug 29, 2005)

I can relate, THanks for the link, I never knew there was a name for it. I keep on noticing how superficial and phoney people in the real world are. How they can backstab each other and tramp all over each other whilst pretending to be friends, how some are selfish, arrogant, narcissistic, self-centred...


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## Strength (Aug 12, 2006)

I can relate, I used to really be like that. I sort of hated people in general. I think it was from frustration with my own life that I transfered that scrutiny/negativity onto other people. Subconsciously, I saw myself as being a better human being than most people and resented the fact that they could be happier than I was. There's that old saying "you see what you want to see." What I mean by that is that if you just focus on how you dislike people, whenever you see it happen, it just adds more support to those views and makes them stronger. It's like a self-fulfilling prophesy. When you focus your life on the good in yourself and others, you will see more of it and will be less concerned with what bothers you.


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## embers (Dec 19, 2006)

I can completely relate to this. I wish it weren't so because when you strip away the social anxiety, people generally either irritate me or bore me and I can't be around them for a large block of time. It just seems pointless to me, but I do it because I get depressed if I don't....I make absolutely no sense to myself. I was also raised an only child and by a woman who also does not like people, on top of being physically and mentally bullied by my peers, so all that might come into play. 

Buddhism is helping me find my connection with people, although i'll never be one to choose to be around people more than being alone, if that makes any sense. Just learning to find a way to enjoy them I guess. :sigh


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## Mehitabel (Oct 13, 2006)

I can also relate. I realzed the other day that my SA might be so severe because I have this hate for the human race. My reasoning goes from the way humans think they're better than every other animal on Earth to people just being materialistic, shallow, and superficial. The things people in my peer group like doing as social activities has always pissed me off. So since I didn't want to partake in random acts of violence, drinking, smoking, doing any sort of drug, or just wadering the streets being an idiot, I stayed home a lot. At times it makes me feel like my misanthropic view will never allow me to fully recover from the current severity of my anxiety.


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## Scrub-Zero (Feb 9, 2004)

I feel like that most of the time. I don't like people in general, but i recently discovered that not everyone is the same. Sometimes, you just have to dig through a whole lot of dirt and rocks to find that nice precious gem. Not everyone is bad and ugly...
Most of the world will probably stay ugly, but you, and the people who want to, can change and become better. 
Dont hate the whole world because of a few idiots who can't control themselves. By doing that, you are only hurting yourself. 

guess i'll go hide now...


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## Razorblade Kiss (Oct 29, 2006)

Yeah I say "I hate people" alot, but I don't hate everyone, just almost everyone...


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## Drella (Dec 4, 2004)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

...


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## emptybottle (Jan 3, 2005)

Not at all. There's plenty of people that I think are nice and interesting, and I want to be friends with them. That's why I'm so depressed that I can't fit in with them.


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## Razorblade Kiss (Oct 29, 2006)

I'm easily annoyed too. I suppose hate is a strong word, but there are certain people I do hate, even though that sounds bad.


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## kikachuck (Nov 10, 2003)

I start feeling this way sometimes, but you know what I (eventually) realize when I get that way? It's a very arrogant attitude. By hating everybody else, it implies that you are better than everybody else and all those things you hate humanity for doing you are in no way responsible for yourself. It goes away when I think about it that way. I'm just as bad as everybody else.


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## njodis (Nov 8, 2006)

It's not healthy to have a hate for _everyone_, but I don't see the problem in being able to recognize that some people do things that just aren't very good. Society is definately going downhill fast, but that doesn't mean that everybody is bad. If you're at the point where you hate people without even knowing them, then yeah, that is pretty bad.


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## odd_one_out (Aug 22, 2006)

There are times when I hate humanity. It was more severe when I was younger because so many people around me acted stupidly, and it seemed like I shouldn't have been born on this planet. I kept noticing how people kept doing things to ruin it. Many teens were into binge drinking, and behaving like yobs. Mainly, my hatred arose from the fear of being different, not being able to relate, and having damaged self-esteem. 

Over the years, it's decreased because I've become more confident and somewhat accepting of the world (sometimes even to the point of apathy). It helps, and is very interesting, to study human behaviour from an objective scientific/mathematical point of view. I also avoid the news and only associate with people I like. Sometimes I get flare-ups if I feel opportunities (esp. jobwise) are being kept from me because of many people's negative attitudes towards my introversion etc.


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## Eraserhead (Sep 23, 2006)

Strength said:


> I can relate, I used to really be like that. I sort of hated people in general. I think it was from frustration with my own life that I transfered that scrutiny/negativity onto other people. Subconsciously, I saw myself as being a better human being than most people and resented the fact that they could be happier than I was. There's that old saying "you see what you want to see." What I mean by that is that if you just focus on how you dislike people, whenever you see it happen, it just adds more support to those views and makes them stronger. It's like a self-fulfilling prophesy. When you focus your life on the good in yourself and others, you will see more of it and will be less concerned with what bothers you.


 :agree That sounds a lot like myself.

I tend to deal with my deep insecurities and anxieties with a "hate" for everyone. That really just makes things much worse though. I hate myself for being such a ******* to others, and so I avoid social contact even more, and it all goes in a crazy cycle! I feel way better when I'm able to open myself up to people and see the good in them.

Unfortunately that doesn't happen very often :rain


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## kintrovert (Oct 28, 2005)

Yeah, I definitely feel ticked-off at humanity quite often. Like others, I'm easily annoyed and/or offended by people's behavior. And I guess much of my "hatred" stems from a retalitory annoyance regarding how people respond to me in the world. I hate people who stare at me (so I do a lot of hating) - like, what's so f-ing weird about me, *****es? And didn't their parents teach them any manners? When I see someone acting or doing something "peculiar" - I may take a signifcant glance - but I pretty much always cut off my glance before it gets to "staring" territory. I have that basic consideration for people and their feelings. Or at least _had_. Now it's gotten to the point where I might just say, "to hell with it" - I might take every opportunity to stare at someone in an attempt to make "humanity" feel as bad as it has made me feel.

And as others have mentioned - I hate that "fakeness" that you sense from people - you can somehow tell that just underneath the surface, they're either being really competitive with you and want to "beat" you in some way, and/or are judging you like crazy. Often their competitiveness comes to the surface, in so many "subtle" ways. Then, as others have mentioned, there is this intolerance and/or complete lack of understanding of people who are struggling with mental disorders such as s.a. and depression. There is a "rush to judgement"...people don't understand that not everyone finds it easy to speak to people. Yes, in their "socializing-is-as-easy-as-pie" existence - such things are expected and taken for granted - but just pause for a few minutes and try to understand how some people struggle mightily, and are very tormented.


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## SpesVitae (Oct 20, 2005)

I think it's a vicious cycle whereby hatred only breeds more hatred. Unless you are a brilliant actor, such a strong emotion cannot be easily hidden, and so people will eventually sense the annoyance (if not the "hatred") and will have no choice but to reciprocate it in some form, even if it means just avoiding you all together. I'd imagine this would only intensify the hatred, and the cycle continues. 

I agree with the people here who say that to hate everyone is just plain arrogance. But I can sympathize, because I think underlying that hatred is just a lot of hurt. It's so much easier to hate and blame others than it is to claim responsibility for how one feels. Ultimately, you have the last say about how contented or miserable your life will be, regardless of everyone else. Our world is what we make them to be.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

I hate humanity too. Not everyone...there are a FEW people I like. But the majority, I hate...most people are cruel, hideous, and don't care about anyone but themselves. And call me arrogant if you want, most people think I am anyway. But that's just the way I feel.


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## Meee (Oct 24, 2005)

I've found myself feeling this way quite often - i think i've made some posts on here stating i hate or at least dislike most people. I don't think it's really healthy, though... and giving people a chance i'm finding that some of them aren't actually that bad (most of the time). Though yes, there are quite a few complete ****tards who just need to be shot or something.



Triste Golem said:


> I feel like that most of the time. I don't like people in general, but i recently discovered that not everyone is the same. Sometimes, you just have to dig through a whole lot of dirt and rocks to find that nice precious gem. Not everyone is bad and ugly...
> Most of the world will probably stay ugly, but you, and the people who want to, can change and become better.
> Dont hate the whole world because of a few idiots who can't control themselves. By doing that, you are only hurting yourself.


And what he said ^^


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## staceypie (Nov 2, 2006)

Vade said:


> This seems like a cross between Secondary Disorders and Frustration, so hopefully this is the correct forum.
> 
> I feel one of the primary reasons that I suffer from social anxiety is because I find myself detesting humanity for different reasons with each passing day, and thus I withdraw into myself mentality.
> 
> ...


Man I can totally relate, the world pisses me off on a daily basis.


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## staceypie (Nov 2, 2006)

:dd


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## UltraShy (Nov 8, 2003)

I pretty much hate the world and most of the people in it because they're f'ing idiots. Yes, I'm rather misanthropic. I'm not normally a fan of medical dramas, but I'm come to enjoy "House" as the lead character, Dr. Gregory House, is about as misanthropic as me.


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## BeNice (Jan 2, 2004)

Glad to see you like House, Karl. Good show, eh?


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## oceanchief (Jan 6, 2007)

From my own experience, I have found that dislike of others is brought on my the fact that because of SA we become social spectators, and not so much participators. So, we tend to see how things really work, and some of it ain't pretty. I have found that alot of people who love attention and who are the centre of attention tend to be unhappy. They have the opposite of what I have. They get on very well in social settings, but one on one they fall apart. 

We do have somethings to be thankful for in that regard.


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## NewWorldOrder (Nov 19, 2004)

The majority of the human race is pretty low-quality.

http://vhemt.org/


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## oceanchief (Jan 6, 2007)

I don't agree. Call me an optimist, but how do you know the majority of the human race are low-grade? Do you know them all? Ever heard of a silent majority? On the other hand you could be right, but i choose to think otherwise.

I have a friend who believes everyone else are lower than him, and he openly admits to believing he is better than most people. That view is rather contrived. Alot of people out there are victims of their heritage. They need help, but don't seek it because they haven't aknowledged they need help.


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## NewWorldOrder (Nov 19, 2004)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



oceanchief said:


> I don't agree. Call me an optimist, but how do you know the majority of the human race are low-grade? Do you know them all? Ever heard of a silent majority? On the other hand you could be right, but i choose to think otherwise.
> 
> I have a friend who believes everyone else are lower than him, and he openly admits to believing he is better than most people. That view is rather contrived. Alot of people out there are victims of their heritage. They need help, but don't seek it because they haven't aknowledged they need help.


You really only have to look at the state of the world realistically. Most people are motivated by material comfort and fear of death. There is lots of evidence of this. If humans were generally better, I don't think they would just stay silent in the face of a mass ecological collapse, which is what we face if we do not change our path.

I'm not trying to sound superior, by the way, I'm obviously not perfect. And I don't agree with everything on Vehement.org (I don't think that we should all stop reproducing, but most of us should [stop]), but I think it's a mind-opening read.


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## oceanchief (Jan 6, 2007)

Yeah, you do hold some very valid points, points that civilization need to face up to. The fact of the matter is we need a good leader, someone to direct us out of harms way. All the possible candidates are eliminated, e.g. Ghandi, Hicks, Jesus..... Okay, maybe Bill Hicks wouldn't have made a great leader, but it'd sure be better than the hypocrites who currently lead us.

Also, I agree on the over-population sentiments. I think it reduces the quality of life for those who exist due to the sheer quantity of humans on this planet. The number is rising everyday, we're like parasites to Earth. Hopefully, we will wake up to a better way of life......soon!


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## 302 (Oct 20, 2006)

I have many thoughts about humanity, and that's what depresses me so much. I think too much about people and I take it very personal.


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## tinselhair (Nov 12, 2006)

I am weird, have always been weird, and will continue to be weird. I do not care to be "normal". 

I do prefer animals--like dogs, cats, spiders, hamsters, birds, etc. over humans any day of the week.

I do not hate people, but I am leery of them. I am slow to trust; I am thick-skinned, but have fun when I actually do make a friend. He/she will be my friend for life, and i am not kidding about that!

The few (and i can count them on one hand) people I love, are very very special people with somewhat unusual personalities and unique qualities. I do not go in for perfect people--if there are such folks.

Tinsel :b


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## Amelia (Nov 24, 2003)

Humans: bah, there should be a law against them!

I don't "hate" humanity, but dislike a lot of what we do. I much prefer animals. They seem so much more innocent and genuine. People's attempts at communicating with animals, like apes, fascinate me.



> I do prefer animals--like dogs, cats, spiders, hamsters, birds, etc. over humans any day of the week.


Same here. (As long as the spiders stay away from me! :lol)


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## FreeSoul (Jan 1, 2006)

interesting topic...
I suppose I do have misanthropic tendencies myself.
I don't like most people I encounter in the world. Selfishness, materialism, free-loaders, ungratefulness, lack of understanding, lack of empathy, disregard for others and the environment, me-first attitudes, my god is better than your god attitudes... I see it all.
But I can go on... overcrowding, broken transit systems, inept leaders, low wages, greedy companies, religious wars, partisanship,...
Oh yes, there is a lot to humanity I don't like. What usually bugs me the most, is that somehow I keep thinking that things should be better than this. Human beings have unlimited potential as beasts of this world, yet I rarely see that potential being seriously exercised anymore. 

Like with the space program. I seriously think humanity is going to need to start considering colonizing space and get a plan going on how to that. Population is still growing world-wide, but shrinking in others. It's a recipe for long-term global misery and the symptoms are already happening.
I kind of see hope in some areas like that... but again, it disturbs me how such a thing isn't taken seriously by the world at large.


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## beetle20901 (Feb 1, 2007)

I had never considered myself to have SA, but I am an introvert, and shy away from parties / gatherings where I don't know people (somewhat due to my stuttering, even though it's mild). 

I do share many of the feelings presented here. People just piss me off sometimes, and it's not usually in direct contact with me, but just observing people having complete disregard for their fellow human beings. I like to think I'm a pretty positive person, and often give people the benefit of the doubt. As I say in many situations, "I am a born again optimist, with a special place in my heart for pessimism." 

I find that having a spiritual practice has helped me in seeing more good in people. When I don't see the good in others I try to send them a blessing that they will treat others with more respect. It's never ending and it wears me down. 

I'm pretty humble, but honestly, I do feel that at times I am better than some of those A-holes out there. This isn't healthy. On another level I see and accept that I am no better than anyone else, just different. 

Maybe all of us that feel this way towards humanity (or some proportion of it) *are* better people, in the sense that we know how to treat each other with respect... 

I feel that having these feelings of hate towards others is a sign that I am not at peace with myself. I hope that by coming to peace with myself, it will lead to coming to peace with the A-holes out there. I like to believe that we all have an inherent goodness, but it's obvious that not everyone seems to express it as much as we might like... 

Thanks for posting this topic and letting me get my thoughts out there... 

Blessings to all of us that we are able to stop hating humanity. The world is a wonderful place and there are many wonderful people out there.


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## embers (Dec 19, 2006)

Well said beetle! :agree


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## nothing to fear (Mar 23, 2005)

it's not that i hate anyone specific, i just can't stand people most of the time. i get sick of people so so quickly. it's not really even an SA or shyness thing, i just dislike humanity in general. i fantasize of one day living completely alone in the woods or somewhere, where i don't have to see or be around people much. 

i mean, i know there are good people out there (i know a few) but mostly i just don't care for interacting with any of them.


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## Amebix (Aug 30, 2006)

I like my humanity in small doses. Anything more and i slowly degenerate into madness, seriously. Sometimes ill wig out and think im going schizo because noone around me is making any sense, there actions just all seem so pointless and moronic to such an extent that i feel like im losing touch with reality.


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## silentstorm (Feb 12, 2007)

I guess I can relate, I have a low tolerance for certain things about people, and sometimes have no tolerance for other things. I have certain values and beliefs that some people dont exactly agree with or respect. I tend to go through the day not wanting to socialize because people are so judgemental and scrutinizing, I don't look at all humans this way, but I do have a tendency to be biased about certain people, like seeing a clique of teenagers I often think they are up to no good, or like making fun of people or something. I guess going to school didn't help me find social skills, more find the flaws in people and society that made me more insolated and untrusting. I guess my own insecurities play a pretty big role in it though, I don't blame others for all my problems but I definitely use the excuse of the flawed society as an excuse for feeling negative.


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## Logan (Jan 17, 2007)

Strength said:


> I can relate, I used to really be like that. I sort of hated people in general. I think it was from frustration with my own life that I transfered that scrutiny/negativity onto other people. Subconsciously, I saw myself as being a better human being than most people and resented the fact that they could be happier than I was. There's that old saying "you see what you want to see." What I mean by that is that if you just focus on how you dislike people, whenever you see it happen, it just adds more support to those views and makes them stronger. It's like a self-fulfilling prophesy. When you focus your life on the good in yourself and others, you will see more of it and will be less concerned with what bothers you.


Strength, this makes sense. I've been miserable like everyone else noticing all the negativity around me, if it's unfriendly pushy people at the grocery store or road rage when driving or the way poeple talk about co-workers. I've gotten really down about it and didn't want to be like that but I'm responsible to for not being friendly also. I probably look just as selfish and uncaring as what people appear to me and I am when I'm down, not doubt about it. I even go along with co-workers talking behind each others backs and then when that person is back, everyone treats them like a freind. If they do that to me to, I deserve it.

Yet, when I'm in that negative mode and someone is nice it surprises me because I'm not expecting it. It kind of wakes you up that it doesn't have to be that way and not everyone is bad like we expect them to be. I just don't know how to deal with it. I really don't think I'm superior to everyone else, as a matter a fact I think I'm inferior but maybe my passing judgment on what I think is bad behavior is me saying I'm superior in someway. I definitely don't want to be superior. I just don't know how to deal with all these emotions. I've behaved pretty terribly and I'm ashamed of it.


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## LoneLioness (Nov 16, 2003)

I have a strong hatred for humanity. I know theres some good people out there, but my experience tells me its 1% or less of people.


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## shy_girl (Dec 12, 2006)

LoneLioness said:


> I have a strong hatred for humanity. I know theres some good people out there, but my experience tells me its 1% or less of people.


Nah, there are a lot of good people out there. But then again, there are so many bad ones, and everyone always remembers the bad ones right. I don't hate humanity, but I do find it very hard and there are some real horrible people, but you shouldn't generalise, because i've known quite a few real genuine ppl, and thats not bad considering the lack of ppl i know.


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## LoneLioness (Nov 16, 2003)

shy_girl said:


> LoneLioness said:
> 
> 
> > I have a strong hatred for humanity. I know theres some good people out there, but my experience tells me its 1% or less of people.
> ...


Not alot. I can count on 1 hand the people who haven't screwed me over in some way, lied to me, rejected me, or made fun of/bullied me. Of course theres many "neutral" people (the kind who won't bully you but also won't step in to stop the bullies, etc), (the friend whos nice to you and fun to be with but found out your gf/bf is cheating on you and never tells you), but by being like that their not much better then the people commiting the bad acts, in fact I'd count them in with the 99%.


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## Razorblade Kiss (Oct 29, 2006)

LoneLioness said:


> I have a strong hatred for humanity. I know theres some good people out there, but my experience tells me its 1% or less of people.


I know what you mean. I feel serious hatred and anger when I think about people. It can be overwhelming at times and it seems like it's getting worse.
It kinda scares me when I feel like that, but I can't help it.


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## shy_girl (Dec 12, 2006)

LoneLioness said:


> shy_girl said:
> 
> 
> > LoneLioness said:
> ...


But there are decent ppl out there, trust me, I've seen it with my own eyes. I'm not talking about in school, because lets face it, it really sucks and ppl are so mean. Of course I have been rejected etc before by ppl, but as far as i'm concerned, thats their loss. Just trust me that there are many nice ppl.


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## LoneLioness (Nov 16, 2003)

shy_girl said:


> LoneLioness said:
> 
> 
> > [quote="shy_girl":9952a]
> ...


But there are decent ppl out there, trust me, I've seen it with my own eyes. I'm not talking about in school, because lets face it, it really sucks and ppl are so mean. Of course I have been rejected etc before by ppl, but as far as i'm concerned, thats their loss. Just trust me that there are many nice ppl.[/quote:9952a]

I'm not saying their aren't some nice people out there, but its not nearly as many as you think. My experience tells me so. As for school, those are the same people that are out in the world, a person can't be mean in 1 place and then be considered a good person later on just because their not in a situation to be as mean as they were (jobs tend not to put up with it nearly as much). A person who is nice because they have to be is not a nice person at all.


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## aznboi719 (Jan 20, 2007)

i hate soo many people

its not even funny


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## Mazza (Oct 22, 2005)

We ought to form some sort of militia.


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## shy_girl (Dec 12, 2006)

LoneLioness said:


> I'm not saying their aren't some nice people out there, but its not nearly as many as you think. My experience tells me so. As for school, those are the same people that are out in the world, a person can't be mean in 1 place and then be considered a good person later on just because their not in a situation to be as mean as they were (jobs tend not to put up with it nearly as much). A person who is nice because they have to be is not a nice person at all.


I agree with the last line. Why does my experience say there are plenty of nice people out there, and yours otherwise? Its just a question, but you have to give something back for people to be nice to you. No, I'm not talking about horrible people at school (but to say because they were horrible at school they are a horrible person is a bit shortsighted) - although even in that instance, you have to remember though its all about being popular and peer pressure at a young age, I'm talking about the general population after the age of 16. No, of course not everyone is nice, there are some rough ppl out there, but don't try to think they're aren't any nice people, because there are plenty.

But as I said someone is not going to be nice for no reason, you have to give a little yourself, think about that.


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## Mayflower 2000 (Nov 11, 2003)

Vade said:


> • I visit several online games' message boards and other community forums daily (mostly as a lurker), and I constantly observe people getting involved in flame wars; what I mostly notice is the rampant personal attacks against others and disregarding the fact that there are human beings in front of computer screens. I see this as largely neanderthal-like behavior.


Try to not consider those people human. I mean, they're very human. But those places tend to draw the most retarded of communication. I still today get baffled at the childish nature of people I've played online games with.



> Can anyone relate to this at all? And is there an official medical term for this?


Medical? I dont think so?
Misanthropy?
I've been there off and on. Loved and hated humanity at various times. The last couple of years (im 21) I've started to ease off my hate for humanity. I don't know how it comes and goes, but for me it seemed to go together with better understanding humanity, and better patience with it. We're all just flawed creatures, put to conscience by no real choice (robots made by a blind creator of evolution - certainly not perfect by any means)... none of us are made anywhere near perfect, and everyone is different... we just have to roll with it.


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## oceanchief (Jan 6, 2007)

I agree Mayflower. You may hate humanity, but at the end of the day you can not escape the fact that you are part of humanity. the way I think about it is that balance exists in every aspect of life. So, you'll have a lot of azzheads and you'll have alot of cool folk. it's just a shame that the azzheads are more prominent in society.


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## LoneLioness (Nov 16, 2003)

shy_girl said:


> LoneLioness said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not saying their aren't some nice people out there, but its not nearly as many as you think. My experience tells me so. As for school, those are the same people that are out in the world, a person can't be mean in 1 place and then be considered a good person later on just because their not in a situation to be as mean as they were (jobs tend not to put up with it nearly as much). A person who is nice because they have to be is not a nice person at all.
> ...


Maybe you've led a very sheltered life? Just a thought. :stu



> Its just a question, but you have to give something back for people to be nice to you. No, I'm not talking about horrible people at school (but to say because they were horrible at school they are a horrible person is a bit shortsighted) - although even in that instance, you have to remember though its all about being popular and peer pressure at a young age, I'm talking about the general population after the age of 16. No, of course not everyone is nice, there are some rough ppl out there, but don't try to think they're aren't any nice people, because there are plenty.
> 
> But as I said someone is not going to be nice for no reason, you have to give a little yourself, think about that.


I do "give a little". And I wasn't even talking about people needing to do stuff (other then not be mean and lie, etc) to be nice, I'd just like to meet someone who didn't lie to me or decieve me in someway, even my best friend since I was 7 did something to me so crazy it could be on the Jerry Springer show. Why are you even in this thread, its not the controversial forum and I don't really care to debate this with you.


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## Razorblade Kiss (Oct 29, 2006)

Mazza said:


> We ought to form some sort of militia.


Sign me up.


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## fc045 (Jan 4, 2007)

There was a time I felt "good" folks I'd like to meet were .001%, now it's more like 5-10%. At other days it's like 2-3%(paranoid day haha).

Still wondering what friends and being friends can be defined in an absolute way. Partners in crime? Fellow gang members? Fellow comrades with similar ideals , personalities and perceptions of what the world ought to be?

Team this , team that. And then you can get so much hatred between opposing fans. (i.e. smashing up of cars and semi-riots after big football/baseball games).


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## Shauna (Jul 29, 2006)

I can't really say if i FULLY have an hatred for humanity or not. Some days i do and some days i don't. I guess it depends on how i'm treated that day by people i come in contact with. 

...With that said......i do find it VERY hard to open up and trust people. I feel like everybody in this world is a walking cliche or some sort. Everybody seems soo fake and self-absorbed. Its every man for himself these days. Because of this, we have to deal with alot of evil people. 

Growing up in this society has definetly shaped my personally. Alot of people that i come across are just plain evil and you can't trust them. This has caused me to become an introvert and i only look out for myself now...which is totally not how i wanna be. Its not how i spirtually get down, but in these times...you have to protect and look out for yourself because no one else will. 

I still have a soft spot for elders and kids though. lol I plan on doing some Voleenter(sp?)/community service work with the elderly in the future.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

Does being self-absorbed make one evil? Detestable? There are a lot of people with mental illnesses who are self-absorbed. I wouldn't describe them all as evil.

Too fake? The problem with a lot of us SA'ers, and shy people, is that we expect people to be too real.

As for humanity, I can say that I like people for the most part, but when I look at each person individually I have my favorites and my not-so-favorites.

For the original poster, I see your points. Now that I see them, I would suggest you avoid online forums where there's a lot of flame wars, you watch the news on TV less often, and you find newspaper articles that cover upbeat positive reports (yes, they might be hard to find). It depends a lot on what you focus on, and I won't candycoat it by saying that everyone is beautiful in their own way.


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## Scrub-Zero (Feb 9, 2004)

LoneLioness said:


> As for school, those are the same people that are out in the world, a person can't be mean in 1 place and then be considered a good person later on just because their not in a situation to be as mean as they were (jobs tend not to put up with it nearly as much).


They can also just change and become better...



LoneLioness said:


> A person who is nice because they have to be is not a nice person at all.


actualy, thats not always true. It often means denying yourself. I'm in the subway station and i'm sitting comfortably and i see an elderly lady or pregnant woman...i don't feel like giving her my seat because i'm comfortable and i don't want to stand up, but i do it because i know it's the right thing to do. I deny myself and help someone in need.
You can't really call that bad, can you? even if my intentions weren't really good to start with.


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## Username (Oct 27, 2004)

Wouldn't those with a disregard, or even hatred, for humanity be the ones who most contribute to its most disgusting and pathetic traits?

I've felt the same anger and frustration a lot of people have been describing. There have even been times that I would relish the thought of having a "Destroy All Humans" button in front of me. But all of that stemmed from my own personal anguish and struggles which I in turn projected. I may not have been aware of it at the time, but what really pissed me off the most was that I embodied so many of the negative aspects of society that I hated. I hated myself. There may have never been an outright admission in my inner dialogue, but sub-consciously I knew that for every instance of human negligence, selfishness, betrayal, abuse I would witness or hear of, a mirror reflected my own dirty deeds.

And I'm not a terrible guy. Never in my life have I hit another person. Never have I tried to ruin another person's life. But there have been a couple of times I've bullied, that I've tried to humiliate another or bring them down. I've sneered, yelled, ignored and retaliated. I've sinned and in many parts of life just plain sucked. If everyone hated me for all the mistakes I had made and held their grudge to the grave, what point would there be in even trying to improve?

At first, when I read through many of the posts in this thread I felt a strong anger at the sheer spite of so many. Now I just feel pity. Not in any condescending way, but in an I've-been-there way. I really wish I had the words to change some of the powerful views expressed here. But recollecting my own experiences of misanthropy I recall being very stubborn and quick to defend my position. Why trust one of 'them'? :stu 

Maybe at least the dancing banana will make you smile. :banana 

Seems to work for me. Kudos to the person who made the dancing banana. He or she can't be all bad.


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## shy_girl (Dec 12, 2006)

LoneLioness said:


> Maybe you've led a very sheltered life? Just a thought. :stu


I haven't actually. I've done all the normal things you'd expect of someone my age = been to school, college, and i've been working almost non-stop for the past 6/7 years. I have met a lot of people, and I can assure you that there are a lot of decent people out there, but its up to you to find them.



> I do "give a little". And I wasn't even talking about people needing to do stuff (other then not be mean and lie, etc) to be nice, I'd just like to meet someone who didn't lie to me or decieve me in someway, even my best friend since I was 7 did something to me so crazy it could be on the Jerry Springer show. Why are you even in this thread, its not the controversial forum and I don't really care to debate this with you.


This isn't controversial, all I'm trying to say to you is that, probably due to your experiences, think that most people are bad. Of course if you've been hurt, lied to or decieved to many times before you may think that. Maybe you get in with the wrong people I don't know, but there are more than enough good, decent, genine people in this world.


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## LoneLioness (Nov 16, 2003)

shy_girl said:


> LoneLioness said:
> 
> 
> > Maybe you've led a very sheltered life? Just a thought. :stu
> ...


I just mean this isn't the debate forum so why come into a thread about hatred for humanity to say everyones good, you're wrong about people, blah blah. You can't seriously think you're gonna change my mind.


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## LoneLioness (Nov 16, 2003)

:sigh Why are you people in this thread....do not care to debate this so this will be my last post here.



Triste Golem said:


> LoneLioness said:
> 
> 
> > As for school, those are the same people that are out in the world, a person can't be mean in 1 place and then be considered a good person later on just because their not in a situation to be as mean as they were (jobs tend not to put up with it nearly as much).
> ...


And so can murderers, but their still bad people. Some things are just unforgivable, and part of the problem is we as humans forgive and give second chances too easily. If someone beat up some kid after school and made fun of them daiy with their friends for the better part of a year, then I don't care what they do later in life, which most likely is the same kind of behavior, or would be if they had the chance to. Same for people that cheat or beat their spouses or abandon their children. I don't care what they do later on, some things are just unforgivable.



> LoneLioness said:
> 
> 
> > A person who is nice because they have to be is not a nice person at all.
> ...


As I've stated I don't think not going out of your way to do nice things makes you a bad person. Now if you made fun of or purposely tripped the elderly or pregnant person then you would be a bad person.


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## shy_girl (Dec 12, 2006)

LoneLioness said:


> I just mean this isn't the debate forum so why come into a thread about hatred for humanity to say everyones good, you're wrong about people, blah blah. You can't seriously think you're gonna change my mind.


I don't think everyone's good, but then again the majority of people aren't bad, either. But I guess its not worth discussing this with you, and you have such a negative thought process not sure if you'll ever change. If you look on the world in such a negative way, you'll never get better, and spend your whole life like this. And finally have u ever thought that some of your problems are down to you? Just a thought. Anyway this is not worth discussing with you.


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## Lilfly (Feb 16, 2007)

Hey LoneLioness,

Perhaps your confusing "debate" with "support". Just a thought... but I'm new here , so what the h**l do I know? :stu 

Peace,
Lilfly


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## Scrub-Zero (Feb 9, 2004)

LoneLioness said:


> And so can murderers, but their still bad people. Some things are just unforgivable, and part of the problem is we as humans forgive and give second chances too easily. If someone beat up some kid after school and made fun of them daiy with their friends for the better part of a year, then I don't care what they do later in life, which most likely is the same kind of behavior, or would be if they had the chance to. Same for people that cheat or beat their spouses or abandon their children. I don't care what they do later on, some things are just unforgivable.


If you don't want to forgive them, thats up to you, but you shouldn't say they are unforgivable(you're not in people's shoes and don't know their situations. It's easy to be on the outside looking in). Some people realise the bad things they done and they regret and change their behavior. To me those people deserve forgiveness, no matter what they have done.

My dad did terrible things to us and if he decided to changed and became better i think id gladly forgive him for what he has done.

I did terrible things too, to my dad, and others and i have changed my whole life around, so am i still a bad person? I don't think so. I think i became a decent man over the years, and i still will be a decent man in 10 years from now. I will keep changing and strive to be better inside.


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## Hatter (Feb 19, 2007)

I used to be quite angry and bitter towards other people and in a way the more I felt this the more I was allowing them to ruin my life. I raised this on another forum and quite liked the advice I was given: 

"There's really nothing you can do about other people's actions. You can only control your own actions and your own beliefs. Don't hang on to the negative emotion but instead learn to see it, feel it then let it go. We can't waste precious time allowing other people or situations to engulf us because it is then that we become lost to ourself."


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## Raye (Feb 20, 2007)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Hatter said:


> I used to be quite angry and bitter towards other people and in a way the more I felt this the more I was allowing them to ruin my life. I raised this on another forum and quite liked the advice I was given:
> 
> "There's really nothing you can do about other people's actions. You can only control your own actions and your own beliefs. Don't hang on to the negative emotion but instead learn to see it, feel it then let it go. We can't waste precious time allowing other people or situations to engulf us because it is then that we become lost to ourself."


Yes, although these words are true to an extent, it is not as easy as it is stated. A person's past and experience can vary and dictate the difficulty of accepting society as it is now. 
There are times where I am able to enjoy company with people, however my disgusts towards humanity can appear occasionally for the most trivial reasons and i often have to spend time by myself to "chill". As a highschool student at a boarding school, this social complexity can be difficult to handle. I envy those around me who can live a social life without this issue.

Anyways, nice forum, it helped me feel better.


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## Teneras (Jan 14, 2007)

kikachuck said:


> I start feeling this way sometimes, but you know what I (eventually) realize when I get that way? It's a very arrogant attitude. By hating everybody else, it implies that you are better than everybody else and all those things you hate humanity for doing you are in no way responsible for yourself. It goes away when I think about it that way. I'm just as bad as everybody else.


This post really got passed over but I just want to say I whole heartedly agree with this.

When I found myself doing this inevitably I realized I had become what the root of my SA feared others were doing: being judgemental. I worry constantly about how people are judging me and why, yet I find I have no problem doing it to other people.

Unlike this poster though that doesn't make me feel any better, just makes me aware of my own hypocrisy.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

I don't think it's hypocritical or judgemental to hate humanity...besides, everyone doesn't like someone(or a few people at least), I don't care who you are. And just the same, I'm there are also probably at least a few people you do like... I like anyone who's nice, but those people are rare, so for the most part...I hate people. Maybe I am arrogant, conceited, I don't care. I can't help how I feel or how I am. Most people in this world suck. And unless I can change that(which is IMPOSSIBLE), then I'm going to hate most people.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

I totally agree with the previous post. I hate most people, too. I have been hurt by a lot of people, and it came to the point where I quit trusting people. I still don't trust anyone. I do like some people. Because I am quiet, I have always been perceived as a snob. I am not. It was a case of myself reaching out to people for so long, and getting little or nothing in return. I don't care what anybody thinks about me. If they have a problem with me, they know where they can find me. At my current job, I heard people talking behind my back. If a person doesn't have the guts to say something to my face, then they are a coward. I used to try to change things about myself, but finally I just gave up. This is me, and if a person can't except me for me, too bad. I know this all sounds terrible, but I have always said that I just wanted to live a normal life. Being made fun of, physically abused, lied to, and hurt in so many other ways, I have always said that I didn't do this to myself, other people did.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



BeachGaBulldog said:


> I totally agree with the previous post. I hate most people, too. I have been hurt by a lot of people, and it came to the point where I quit trusting people. I still don't trust anyone. I do like some people. Because I am quiet, I have always been perceived as a snob. I am not. It was a case of myself reaching out to people for so long, and getting little or nothing in return. I don't care what anybody thinks about me. If they have a problem with me, they know where they can find me. At my current job, I heard people talking behind my back. If a person doesn't have the guts to say something to my face, then they are a coward. I used to try to change things about myself, but finally I just gave up. This is me, and if a person can't except me for me, too bad. I know this all sounds terrible, but I have always said that I just wanted to live a normal life. Being made fun of, physically abused, lied to, and hurt in so many other ways, I have always said that I didn't do this to myself, other people did.


I agree, I hate so much when people can't be brave or honest enough to say something to your face...they have to go say it to everyone else INSTEAD of you...even some of my stupid family members are like that...like my aunt & grandma. They're too much of cowards to say anything to my face but they have no problem saying mean, hurtful stuff about me to everyone else, even spreading lies about me. :mum 
And like you, I blame others for the way I am today...if people would just treat me with respect and not be such assholes or lie to me all the time, I wouldn't have to be so negative towards other people...I would actually like people if they DESERVED to be liked, but most of them don't deserve ****.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

I'm sorry you guys hate me. And there are other people like me in this world. :yes


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> BeachGaBulldog said:
> 
> 
> > I totally agree with the previous post. I hate most people, too. I have been hurt by a lot of people, and it came to the point where I quit trusting people. I still don't trust anyone. I do like some people. Because I am quiet, I have always been perceived as a snob. I am not. It was a case of myself reaching out to people for so long, and getting little or nothing in return. I don't care what anybody thinks about me. If they have a problem with me, they know where they can find me. At my current job, I heard people talking behind my back. If a person doesn't have the guts to say something to my face, then they are a coward. I used to try to change things about myself, but finally I just gave up. This is me, and if a person can't except me for me, too bad. I know this all sounds terrible, but I have always said that I just wanted to live a normal life. Being made fun of, physically abused, lied to, and hurt in so many other ways, I have always said that I didn't do this to myself, other people did.
> ...


I had a situation Christmas Eve where I heard my siblings talking about me behind my back (they didn't know I was right down the hall. I have come to expect that, but I still love them.

What I'm trying to say is that you're not alone.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

You have really hit the nail on the head. My hate started in the home growing up. My father physically, verbally, and mentally abused me for years. He and my sister always talked about me behind my back. I never got along with either one, and am very much looking forward to the day that they die. My mom and I always got along.
The anger went from there to high school. Likewise, I was physically, verbally, and mentally abused there, too. I was picked on, laughed at, never went out on a date because the few girls I asked turned me down. The teachers even gave me hell, and I was not a bad kid. I was just quiet like always. 
So as I grew older, more and more people hurt me and my hate of people really took off, and his still here, to this day. I trust noone. 
Yes, they are cowards, and I say to hell with all of them.


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## Yomanda9 (Dec 6, 2005)

lol at whoever said that most of humanity is low quality, made my day.

I think I personally direct my hatred towards the media though, for influencing people to become wicked and greedy, people lose their humanity when influenced by the media. I think that we would be better off going back to the jungle(or I would lol)


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## Scrub-Zero (Feb 9, 2004)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Yomanda9 said:


> lol at whoever said that most of humanity is low quality, made my day.
> 
> I think I personally direct my hatred towards the media though, for influencing people to become wicked and greedy, people lose their humanity when influenced by the media. I think that we would be better off going back to the jungle(or I would lol)


People were wicked and greedy long before the media came along. All that evil is just hiding deep inside all of us. Some people just decide to let it out in the open.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Yomanda9 said:


> lol at whoever said that most of humanity is low quality, made my day.
> 
> I think I personally direct my hatred towards the media though, for influencing people to become wicked and greedy, people lose their humanity when influenced by the media. I think that we would be better off going back to the jungle(or I would lol)


I hate when people blame the media for stuff...so you watch a movie about a serial killer or listen to music about murder...doesn't mean you're going to start killing people. People don't do stuff cause movies or music tell them to...people would do this stuff no matter what. Personally, movies & music like that are what KEEPS me sane.
Well I dunno if I'm completely sane. But it keeps me from doing anything crazy. :b


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



BeachGaBulldog said:


> You have really hit the nail on the head. My hate started in the home growing up. My father physically, verbally, and mentally abused me for years. He and my sister always talked about me behind my back. I never got along with either one, and am very much looking forward to the day that they die. My mom and I always got along.
> The anger went from there to high school. Likewise, I was physically, verbally, and mentally abused there, too. I was picked on, laughed at, never went out on a date because the few girls I asked turned me down. The teachers even gave me hell, and I was not a bad kid. I was just quiet like always.
> So as I grew older, more and more people hurt me and my hate of people really took off, and his still here, to this day. I trust noone.
> Yes, they are cowards, and I say to hell with all of them.


I could never ask anyone out on a date. I still couldn't even today. But back then I know I would have been turned down or laughed at cause I was fat and people always used to make fun of me for that.
The teachers here always sided with the bad kids, the cheerleaders, the ball players, or the teachers' kids or whatever....I'll say that there were a FEW decent teachers who weren't like that(I think one of em once said he wished all the kids were quiet & would just sit and do their work like me), but not many. Once there were these 3 girls I was forced to sit with and I HATED them so much...they used to copy off of me on tests and stuff...I'd try to cover my papers because I hated them so much. They'd try to act all nice when they wanted something from me, but they were such assholes to me, I'd see them looking at me and talking to each other and I knew they were talking bad about me. My mom went in and tried to help me...she asked for him to either move them or move me so they couldn't copy off me anymore and so they wouldnt bother me in that class but the teacher was such a dumbass, he didn't care...he favored them over me so he didn't give a **** and didn't even try to help me. In 5th grade 2 of those girls pulled my chair out from under me and made me hit my head on a table. I always hated them after that and I still do. :mum They never got punished for it or anything.....it happened in the school library so my best friend at the time went and told them what had happened & the library woman came and said something to them but that was it...then she just walked away. My mom went over there and told my teacher and she said "Well I didn't see it happen so I can't do anything about it"... ugh I hated that teacher, she was such a *****! And she's my mom's cousin's wife so you'd THINK she would have been a little nicer, but she really hated me for some reason. And at another time, she threatened to send me to detention cause people were copying off of me on a test. She said if I didn't stop "letting people copy off of me" she'd make me re-do the test and send me to detention to do it. :wtf :mum Never said a damn thing to the ones who were actually copying off of me. :roll Stupid ****ing *****.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

I absolutely hated high school! The teachers were a--holes because I was quiet. The one thing that always did that really pissed me off, was when they would ask the class a question. A lot of students would raise their hand, with some having answered more than one question. I never raised my hand, and of course the jerkoff would call on me, saying something stupid like, "Lets give someone else a chance to answer a question." I always got called on. And I would always say "I don't know." Because I didn't care. I was in a world where I was catching hell from every direction. I was picked on at home, by students, teachers, and kids in the neighborhood. So, my hate for people grew and grew. 
Now, all of these still run very deep with me. A few years ago, some lady called me to ask me if I would come to the 25th year high school reunion. And this was from one of the girls who made fun of me. I told her what she and the class could do, and it was pretty ugly. To this day, I still have nightmares about high school. Also, to this day, if I see ANYONE from that period, I walk in the other direction, because I know I will be ugly to them.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

I guess I wont be invited to anything like that since I graduated from homeschool instead of public school.
If I did go to something like that though, I would go try to make everyone miserable. :evil 
Or if I actually ever got rich and/or famous I would go just to show them that I made something of myself since nobody ever believed in me and thought I was a loser. Plus it would be nice to see how many of them were fat & ugly when they used to call ME fat & ugly...then I could say "Eww what happened to you? YOU GOT FAT! YOU LOOK LIKE ****!" :lol 
I actually went to a 4th of July thing(which SUCKED) in town last year with my (now ex) boyfriend...and I saw 2 of the girls from school there I didn't like. That was enough for me...enough to ruin my night. I went home. I didn't wanna be anywhere near them. Funny thing is one of them is now fat though. :lol WHO'S FAT & UGLY NOW, *****? ...That's what I wanted to say.







My ex said I should have said it and beat her up. But she's bigger than me now. :b


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## Razorblade Kiss (Oct 29, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



BeachGaBulldog said:


> I absolutely hated high school! The teachers were a--holes because I was quiet. The one thing that always did that really pissed me off, was when they would ask the class a question. A lot of students would raise their hand, with some having answered more than one question. I never raised my hand, and of course the jerkoff would call on me, saying something stupid like, "Lets give someone else a chance to answer a question." I always got called on. And I would always say "I don't know." Because I didn't care. I was in a world where I was catching hell from every direction. I was picked on at home, by students, teachers, and kids in the neighborhood. So, my hate for people grew and grew.
> Now, all of these still run very deep with me. *A few years ago, some lady called me to ask me if I would come to the 25th year high school reunion. And this was from one of the girls who made fun of me. I told her what she and the class could do, and it was pretty ugly*. To this day, I still have nightmares about high school. Also, to this day, if I see ANYONE from that period, I walk in the other direction, because I know I will be ugly to them.


Good for you! To hell with 'em.

I didn't have a terrible high school experience. Junior high was my worst nightmare, compared to that, I was popular in high school. I'd never go to a reunion though. I couldn't care less about those mofos.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

I always thought that when I first started high school, it felt like before you walked in the building, two people were handing out signs. One said "Accepted", and the other "Not Accepted", and as you walked in one of these was handed to you, and depending on which you were given, you were either in for 4 years of a good experience, or 4 years of a living hell. They would place neck, and your off.....
Of course, I was given the "Not Accepted" one. And, things started to deteriorate from there. I just gave up on everything. I hated everybody. I didn't give a damn about the schoolwork. I said "F--- off world!"


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## kirin-riki (Feb 26, 2007)

i like the idea of misanthropy, it's somewhat mysterious and cool.
but sometimes my intriguity(word?) of it makes me beleive i am that way.
it's hard to form an opinion on it about myself...


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## VCL XI (Jan 19, 2004)

I used to hate people, now I'm just sort of indifferent towards them. Nothing about their behavior surprises me so what's to hate? I don't have the energy or obsession that the idea requires. Misanthropy's too trendy a scene these days anyway, seriously. I'd would say humans are nothing but hypocrites, liars, thieves, and scumbags, of course, and I'm surely not any different.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



BeachGaBulldog said:


> Now, all of these still run very deep with me. A few years ago, some lady called me to ask me if I would come to the 25th year high school reunion. *And this was from one of the girls who made fun of me. I told her what she and the class could do, and it was pretty ugly. * To this day, I still have nightmares about high school. Also, to this day, if I see ANYONE from that period, I walk in the other direction, because I know I will be ugly to them.


If you can't forgive after 25 years over this, you got some serious problems, dude.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Optimistic said:


> If you can't forgive after 25 years over this, you got some serious problems, dude.


I can't forgive either. How can you forgive somebody when they can't even say 2 simple words: "I'm sorry"?



VCL XI said:


> I used to hate people, now I'm just sort of indifferent towards them. Nothing about their behavior surprises me so what's to hate? I don't have the energy or obsession that the idea requires. Misanthropy's too trendy a scene these days anyway, seriously. I'd would say humans are nothing but hypocrites, liars, thieves, and scumbags, of course, and I'm surely not any different.


They don't surprise me either but I still hate people. Can't help the way I feel.
How is misanthropy "trendy"? That would be like saying SA or depression is "trendy"...sure some people may say they're depressed or whatever for attention but that doesn't change the fact that some people really do have it and it's a serious problem for them. :con


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> Optimistic said:
> 
> 
> > If you can't forgive after 25 years over this, you got some serious problems, dude.
> ...


They don't surprise me either but I still hate people. Can't help the way I feel.
How is misanthropy "trendy"? That would be like saying SA or depression is "trendy"...sure some people may say they're depressed or whatever for attention but that doesn't change the fact that some people really do have it and it's a serious problem for them. :con[/quote:5161a]

A lot of people probably don't realize what they did to you. I dealt with the same things as a kid and if I asked some of those people if they knew what they did to me, I would venture to guess they wouldn't. I could now meet those people (and have), and be fine with them...it's just that what they did has lasted psychologically.


----------



## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

If you can't forgive after 25 years over this, you got some serious problems, dude.


No, I can't forgive after 25 years. You were probably one of those people that was always doing sick s--- to other people. No ma'am, I my life is just fine. Serious problems...NOPE! Perhaps you do, Miss Dudette.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



srschirm said:


> A lot of people probably don't realize what they did to you. I dealt with the same things as a kid and if I asked some of those people if they knew what they did to me, I would venture to guess they wouldn't. I could now meet those people (and have), and be fine with them...it's just that what they did has lasted psychologically.


It still bothers me to see the people who said/done stuff to me....it's like all the anger & hatred towards them come back if I see them or hear them mentioned. 
Like I said I saw 2 of those girls back on the 4th of July and it just ruined my night. I had to go back home to not be in such a bad mood...


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

I understand. It is horrible what people do to each other. That's why I have always made it a point to never make fun of someone.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



srschirm said:


> *A lot of people probably don't realize what they did to you.* I dealt with the same things as a kid and if I asked some of those people if they knew what they did to me, I would venture to guess they wouldn't. I could now meet those people (and have), and be fine with them...*it's just that what they did has lasted psychologically.*


Exactly. Stan, have you ever thought about being a psychologist? Your wisdom far exceeds your years on this planet. :yes 

What good does it do for us SA folk to dwell on all of this past stuff? I think getting past it is the best answer. Surely ppl can be mean; they can tease; they can hurt. Will feeling hatred toward them really help us?
Is every hurt in the past like someone having murdered us or a loved one? And in the case of the latter, there even have been people who amazingly enough have forgiven the criminal.

We can put the bar high or low as far as what really affects us and how we may or may not be able to forgive a wrong or perceived wrong. I'm positive that if I were to meet each and every SASer, I'd eventually find something they would say or do to me which would require a withdrawal from my bank of forgiveness. I'm sure I've said or done things that other's have taken the wrong way, been overly sensitive to, or were mean in some way to begin with. Like Stan said, we're not always aware of what we've said or done, and while "I'm sorry" is sometimes in order, it is difficult to say that when someone doesn't know where the other person is coming from.

Also, an apology doesn't always work, and it's often a matter of opinion as to whether what was said or done was improper or a case of the recipient being oversensitive.


----------



## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

Well I can't help the way I feel. I can't just say "I'm going to like & forgive everyone"...doesn't work like that.
It might not help things, but it's the way I am and I can't change. And I definitely dont see how someone could forgive a murderer for murdering a family member or something. Even if they did change/apologize, I could never forgive for something like that...that is when I would definitely go out for revenge. If anybody ever did anything like that to my parents...they would pay. I probably wouldn't kill them, but I would want them to suffer...for a very long time. And thats why I wouldn't kill them...death is the easy way out. 
Apology does work though as long as we aren't talking about something quite as extreme as murder. If those girls came up to me now and said "Shauna I'm sorry I was such a ***** in school...I realize what a dumbass I was. Please forgive me" then I would. But until they say it and mean it, I won't forgive them. They know what they done and they should know they hurt me. If they don't realize that then they're really ****ed up in the head...which they are anyway, obviously...



Optimistic said:


> What good does it do for us SA folk to dwell on all of this past stuff? I think getting past it is the best answer. Surely ppl can be mean; they can tease; they can hurt. Will feeling hatred toward them really help us?
> Is every hurt in the past like someone having murdered us or a loved one? And in the case of the latter, there even have been people who amazingly enough have forgiven the criminal.
> 
> We can put the bar high or low as far as what really affects us and how we may or may not be able to forgive a wrong or perceived wrong. I'm positive that if I were to meet each and every SASer, I'd eventually find something they would say or do to me which would require a withdrawal from my bank of forgiveness. I'm sure I've said or done things that other's have taken the wrong way, been overly sensitive to, or were mean in some way to begin with. Like Stan said, we're not always aware of what we've said or done, and while "I'm sorry" is sometimes in order, it is difficult to say that when someone doesn't know where the other person is coming from.
> ...


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

People handle different things in their own way. If someone chooses to not forgive, like myself, its not a "problem". The wounds happened for several years and they are DEEP! Yeah, if those people came up to me and apologized for being the a--holes that they were, yes, I would forgive them. Likewise, this is how I feel about it, and I am not going to change, either. There are plenty of people on here who won't forgive...do they all of them have a "problem"? NOPE! Op must be perfect.


----------



## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



BeachGaBulldog said:


> People handle different things in their own way. If someone chooses to not forgive, like myself, its not a "problem".


Well, sure it is. You said it's a "nightmare" for you. You beat yourself up thinking about it. You generalize your feelings to others. You can't let go after 25 years. BTW, I'm not a dudette , I'm a 40-something dude, just like you.  If you want to think me as "perfect," that's your prerogative. I'm not, but if it fits into your world, your reality, then maybe it makes sense to you.

Yes, it takes time to overcome hurt. I agree that some things are harder to forget or forgive than others. Your teacher calling on you in class I wouldn't expect to be really an issue for anyone after 25 years. Teachers said and did stuff to me, and I too was the quiet one. I wasn't there listening on the phone as you talked to the reunion person. Did you ask for an apology or remind her without simply blasting her about what she and others said or did? Or was it more of simply "getting it off your chest" by letting her have it? She may have teased you long ago and it was probably not nice, but I imagine she got the blame for everyone in your high school past. And, of course, people in your future suffer the consequences of your past frustrations as you walk down the road toward your hatred of humanity.

Was I a teaser? Did I say crap to people? Well, that's a bit of labeling and I see how quickly you are to come up with that labeling, that hasty generalization. Sure, I teased. Most of the time good-naturedly. Some of that probably was taken the wrong way, and I may never know. I bet those people have long forgotten, and forgiven if they haven't forgotten, those misunderstandings or those times I was a little mean or simply made a mistake in saying something I didn't mean to say. I'm not perfect, and I don't say nice things all the time, but still, I, and others I know, feel I'm a nice person.

I seriously wonder if you, and some of the others here, are able to separate their anger from their feelings of hatred. They're two separate things. It's possible to forgive everything and everyone. Is it always easy? Could I do it if my loved ones were affected in all situations? Perhaps not. But there is a lot of stuff that we can let go of. I don't believe in beating myself up over the thoughts of those I refuse to forgive and to begin to hate all others (humanity) as a result.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

First of all, I'm not now, nor have I ever beat myself up over all of this. Where did you come up with that? Talk about assuming, labeling and/or generalizing! No, I can't let go after 25 years, but thats my deal. I like who I am. 
What got this ball rolling is when you said that if I couldn't forget after 25 years, there are problems. You don't even know me, and it was uncalled for you to say something ugly to me. Why are you even on here? Are you on here to criticize? I, nor anyone else need that, and we are not here for that. I found this forum, and I am very happy that I did. I don't need you to point out about the teacher from 25 years ago. It is an issue, so lets just leave it at that. I didn't "blast" or "let anyone have it", when I was talking to the reunion lady. It was simply a case of my electing not to attend because there was no point. How do you figure I blamed her for everyone in high school. Hmmm, another assumption. I am not suffering in regard to humanity. Thats my business. This all would have been avoided if you didn't even respond to my first post. It served no purpose. 
This is a social anxiety SUPPORT forum. Were you just looking for someone to jump down their throat and I happened to be the lucky one?
It just strikes me as curious that you are able to give all of these keen insights on other peoples lives. Yes, I am not a people person. I never have been, and I don't want to be. I don't trust them. Are you some kind of expert in mental health? Maybe(don't count on it) I will forgive one day, but if I don't, so what? I am not suffering. I am very happy with my life. I started out just wanting to live my life like everyone else. It just seems that a lot of people just thought I was a perfect candidate to degrade. I did not do this to myself. I never wanted this to happen, but it did. So, I choose to hate humanity.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

I don't see not forgiving as a "problem" either...I'm sure there are some certain things that are unforgiveable to everyone.
And anger & hatred may be 2 seperate things but they usually go together.
It is NOT possible for everyone to forgive everyone...like I said, if people came up and apologized to me, I would accept their apology and I'd be ok with them then. But until they do that, no. I won't. Even alot of my own family can't apologize to me...my grandma and my aunt still owe me an apology for stuff they've done and said to me but I know I'll never hear it. :roll If they would just say they're sorry...that would mean alot to me. But it tells alot about somebody when they can't even say they're sorry... that they're a very ****ty person.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Optimistic said:


> srschirm said:
> 
> 
> > *A lot of people probably don't realize what they did to you.* I dealt with the same things as a kid and if I asked some of those people if they knew what they did to me, I would venture to guess they wouldn't. I could now meet those people (and have), and be fine with them...*it's just that what they did has lasted psychologically.*
> ...


Well thank you, Martin. That is actually my ideal career, which I might pursue again if I leave the family business. I have a B.A. in Psychology.

You have some great advice yourself. :yes


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



BeachGaBulldog said:


> First of all, I'm not now, nor have I ever beat myself up over all of this. Where did you come up with that? Talk about assuming, labeling and/or generalizing! No, I can't let go after 25 years, but thats my deal. I like who I am.
> What got this ball rolling is when you said that if I couldn't forget after 25 years, there are problems. You don't even know me, and it was uncalled for you to say something ugly to me. Why are you even on here? Are you on here to criticize? I, nor anyone else need that, and we are not here for that. I found this forum, and I am very happy that I did. I don't need you to point out about the teacher from 25 years ago. It is an issue, so lets just leave it at that. I didn't "blast" or "let anyone have it", when I was talking to the reunion lady. It was simply a case of my electing not to attend because there was no point. How do you figure I blamed her for everyone in high school. Hmmm, another assumption. I am not suffering in regard to humanity. Thats my business. This all would have been avoided if you didn't even respond to my first post. It served no purpose.
> This is a social anxiety SUPPORT forum. Were you just looking for someone to jump down their throat and I happened to be the lucky one?
> It just strikes me as curious that you are able to give all of these keen insights on other peoples lives. Yes, I am not a people person. I never have been, and I don't want to be. I don't trust them. Are you some kind of expert in mental health? Maybe(don't count on it) I will forgive one day, but if I don't, so what? I am not suffering. I am very happy with my life. I started out just wanting to live my life like everyone else. It just seems that a lot of people just thought I was a perfect candidate to degrade. I did not do this to myself. I never wanted this to happen, but it did. So, I choose to hate humanity.


I'm not seeing where Optimistic "jumped down your throat." In fact, he's trying to be helpful. I think having a "hatred of humanity" isn't healthy in any regard. People are social creatures, and I'm sure you're no different. Meaning, you want a friend or two, and a life partner to share yourself with.

Sometimes letting go is best. All that hatred doesn't do any good.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

I don't see how it's unhealthy though :stu 

Hatred may not do any good but some people can't forgive as easily as others.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

I'm not seeing where Optimistic "jumped down your throat." In fact, he's trying to be helpful. I think having a "hatred of humanity" isn't healthy in any regard. People are social creatures, and I'm sure you're no different. Meaning, you want a friend or two, and a life partner to share yourself with.

Sometimes letting go is best. All that hatred doesn't do any good.[/quote]

I do call it jumping down my throat, so believe what you want. Saying "you have some problems" is NOT HELPFUL! HELLO! I feel much like Little Miss Scare All, in that I am not going to forgive. If people would just say "I'm sorry for hurting you", then I would surely forgive, but until then, NO WAY.

Not forgiving is not a problem to me either. Everybody is different. There is not rule that says a person has to forgive. Its a choice.

Are you some kind of expert on mental health? I don't see "hatred for humanity" as being unhealthy, either. And no, I am not a social creature. I don't trust people. Once again, this is a SUPPORT group, not a group to tell someone that they need to "let go". If support can't be given, I would prefer you and he not respond to any of my postings. Most of the time, a person(like myself) just wants someone to listen, or in this case, read a post, but they don't want any advice. I DON'T want any advice. I would appreciate it.


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## Username (Oct 27, 2004)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

Essentially, if you hate humanity, of which you're an equal member, you must therefore hate yourself. I'm pretty sure we can agree that self-hatred is unhealthy.

Maybe a lot of people in this thread are using 'hatred' a bit liberally and mean more to say "I distrust most humans". At least that's what I seem to be reading.

Nobody should be surprised that their misanthropy is being challenged, albeit mostly in a friendly and positive manner, especially considering the topic. You can't really expect to not strike at the core of some people when you come onto any message board and claim to harbour a hatred for humanity. It basically says to everyone reading "I don't really know you, but I unconditionally hate/dislike/resent you." It's tough to support someone who right off the bat gives the impression of having no trust or respect for you. But a lot of members have tried, and in their words also made efforts to soothen some of that anger - you can't hate without it.

I am absolutely convinced that nobody can both be happy and hate humanity. I think the only exception would be a psychopath, which I doubt any one of us is.

Not wanting to forgive? Fine. Hate some people in particular? OK. It's extremely difficult not to feel anger and resentment at those who've hurt you. But extend those feelings to the entirety of our species and the human condition? To me, that's going way too far and the start of a very painful, lonely and unhappy life.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

I hate humanity in general but that doesn't mean I hate EVERYONE...there are a FEW people I like...not too many, but some.
Of course I love my parents, the rest of my family with a few exceptions, and the few true friends I have. 
But as I've said, the majority...probably over 99%...of the population is just ****... worthless, horrible people you can't trust.


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## User (Mar 20, 2004)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Username said:


> Essentially, if you hate humanity, of which you're an equal member, you must therefore hate yourself. I'm pretty sure we can agree that self-hatred is unhealthy.
> 
> Maybe a lot of people in this thread are using 'hatred' a bit liberally and mean more to say "I distrust most humans". At least that's what I seem to be reading.
> 
> ...


I haven't even read this thread yet, but it might as well end here. This is definitive advice (from my namesake no less  ).

I've had feelings of rage and even hatred toward humanity as a whole. But I've realized that there are people who are worth knowing, and you're only hurting yourself by cutting yourself off from the world. I think hatred kills the soul, and hatred of humanity is a sure way to have "a very painful, lonely and unhappy life".


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## VCL XI (Jan 19, 2004)

Username said:


> Essentially, if you hate humanity, of which you're an equal member, you must therefore hate yourself. I'm pretty sure we can agree that self-hatred is unhealthy.


As mentioned before, some just hate people because think they're better than everyone else. Often in a case like that it's not that they necessarily hate them, they just hate that people get in their way or disagree with them.

Speaking of teachers/grudges - The biggest misanthropes I've ever met were also the worst people I've ever met: My high school junior algebra teacher and my freshman religion teacher, the latter of which told me she'd force me to cry in front of the class by the end of the year because I was slow in class (being an atheist in a Catholic school sucked to say the least). Those two put into practice their misanthropy by tormenting everyone around them.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> I hate humanity in general but that doesn't mean I hate EVERYONE...there are a FEW people I like...not too many, but some.
> Of course I love my parents, the rest of my family with a few exceptions, and the few true friends I have.
> But as I've said, the majority...probably over 99%...of the population is just @#%$... worthless, horrible people you can't trust.


This is really a shame. Here's an attractive, intelligent lady who I could easily see catching the attention and interest of many 20-something single men and before a word is even spoken, 99 out of 100 are written off as "worthless, horrible people you can't trust." :um And that's talking about just the guys.

Maybe this is simply just who you are, but I find it amazing that someone at only 23 has had enough life experience to arrive (or jump) at this conclusion. How much time have you even spent outside your little corner in Kentucky? Have you ever met anyone from SAS? If you've made some kind of calculation based on your experiences, I'd be curious to know what constitutes a "worthless, horrible person." Would that include anyone who has ever told a lie or rejected you or broke up with you even if there was at least some positive in your relationship?

You may very well be right that everyone can't forgive everyone else, but you take it to extremes. At 23 you have time to work on changing a lot, if not in how you feel, then in how you think. I believe you shoot yourself in the foot with your current thinking. Maybe that's okay with you, because maintaining who you are may be extremely important to you, but I can tell you *if* I were one of these 20-something guys who had an eye for you and wanted to get to know you better, your view of humanity would most likely drive me to rosier pastures. :yes


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

No, I don't judge people before I talk to them. I give everybody a chance if they want one[to show if they're a decent person or not], but everyone just disappoints me.
And did I say that was just guys? No, I believe both men and women probably suck equally. Though I probably have met more men who do, but that's just because I have known more men than women in my life. I've known plenty of girls who suck too though...in fact I just got a message from a stupid girl last night calling me a ****, etc... and she doesn't even KNOW me. Pretty much all the people on my block list on myspace are females. Females who live near me who judge me and get *****y without even knowing a damn thing about me. It's people like that who should do the world a favor and go jump off a ****ing cliff.
I've met enough people to know that most of them do suck. I do give people a chance, though I don't see why I even bother. I've never met anyone on SAS in person but I have met other people with SA.
And yes lying does make someone a bad person. I don't think rejecting someone makes somebody a bad person but if you lead somebody on, lie to them and then reject them, that certainly doesn't make somebody a wonderful person. That would make them one of the idiots who needs to jump off the cliff.
And I can tell you that my view on humanity has nothing to do with how people think of me, because like I said, I give people a fair chance(though I really dont see why I do)...but they just go on to further prove my point, that most people in the world suck. But I have actually talked to some people who agree with me on my views or think it's great that I'm so honest. Usually people who live far away though. AND if I ever did find somebody worth having, they would accept me for who I am, and they would most likely have to share at least some of my views or else they wouldn't understand me.



Optimistic said:


> This is really a shame. Here's an attractive, intelligent lady who I could easily see catching the attention and interest of many 20-something single men and before a word is even spoken, 99 out of 100 are written off as "worthless, horrible people you can't trust." :um And that's talking about just the guys.
> 
> Maybe this is simply just who you are, but I find it amazing that someone at only 23 has had enough life experience to arrive (or jump) at this conclusion. How much time have you even spent outside your little corner in Kentucky? Have you ever met anyone from SAS? If you've made some kind of calculation based on your experiences, I'd be curious to know what constitutes a "worthless, horrible person." Would that include anyone who has ever told a lie or rejected you or broke up with you even if there was at least some positive in your relationship?
> 
> You may very well be right that everyone can't forgive everyone else, but you take it to extremes. At 23 you have time to work on changing a lot, if not in how you feel, then in how you think. I believe you shoot yourself in the foot with your current thinking. Maybe that's okay with you, because maintaining who you are may be extremely important to you, but I can tell you *if* I were one of these 20-something guys who had an eye for you and wanted to get to know you better, your view of humanity would most likely drive me to rosier pastures. :yes


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## Jimiam (Jan 8, 2007)

Well, I for one have never had an actual attractive lady give me much of a chance. Just a few dates and when they see what a low paying job I have; just seems not to last much longer. Funny huh.

Thats probably the reason for the last couple of years I don't even date or try to date. My dog is the best love for me. She will never hurt me. I don't know if hate is the word but I sorta have a bad view of women at this stage of my life and I don't see it changing.


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## embers (Dec 19, 2006)

Anyone who has a hatred for anyone, is obviously deeply hurt, esp if its for all of humanity. I've been there, for me it was the deepest depression of my life. 

I realized that holding onto the hate is like poisening myself, because the people I reserve it for have either moved on or could care less. 

People hurt us, we hurt them, its life. If you hold onto it, YOU'RE hurting YOURSELF.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> No, I don't judge people before I talk to them. I give everybody a chance if they want one[to show if they're a decent person or not], but everyone just disappoints me.


A decent person would be what?



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> And did I say that was just guys? No, I believe both men and women probably suck equally.


Sorry, you misunderstood me, or perhaps I wasn't clear. I figured 99/100 of humanity being sucky would include women too. I was referring to the previous point I had made in my post, saying that *I* had only mentioned that 99 out of 100 guys would be judged as "horrible."



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> ...in fact I just got a message from a stupid girl last night calling me a ****, etc... and she doesn't even KNOW me.


That was mean of her to say, I'll agree. Just ran this by my wife and teenage daughter. Their reaction, "Yeah, females can be mean."



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> I've met enough people to know that most of them do suck. I do give people a chance, though I don't see why I even bother.


People of all ages? Children? Senior Citizens? My guess is that most of those calling you "*****" or "****" are around your age. Probably jealous types. I do wonder what kind of "chance" you do give others. Maybe some people aren't deserving of your time, but do you write them off pretty much the minute they do something to you that you consider mean, whether you know them or not?



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> I've never met anyone on SAS in person but I have met other people with SA.


I've met people with SA, too. I found them all to be likable.



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> And yes lying does make someone a bad person.


I'll take it that you've never lied. :stu 



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> I don't think rejecting someone makes somebody a bad person but if you lead somebody on, lie to them and then reject them, that certainly doesn't make somebody a wonderful person. That would make them one of the idiots who needs to jump off the cliff.


What if they apologized to you? They probably don't, but if they did, would you still think them not wonderful? Also, I'm not sure that what they have done to you, even if it was a bad action, should be the sum total of whether the person is objectively a bad person or a good one. I mean, if I were to say that I had lied to a girl to get what I wanted and yet was every bit respectful, loyal, kind, honest to every other girl I ever met, should I be viewed as not wonderful because I had had one moral error?



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> And I can tell you that my view on humanity has nothing to do with how people think of me, because like I said, I give people a fair chance


"Hi, my name is Shauna. I'll give you a fair chance, but just remember, at least 99% of humanity sucks and I distrust them. Good luck!"
:b



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> (though I really dont see why I do)...but they just go on to further prove my point, that most people in the world suck.


I didn't realize it included Asia, Europe, Africa, and South America. Have you tried those places yet? 



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> But I have actually talked to some people who agree with me on my views or think it's great that I'm so honest.


I don't agree with you and I think it's great you're being honest. Are these people who agree with you depressed? If they think that 99% of humanity sucks, do they include you and/or themselves, or have you and they been lucky enough to find that 1%?



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> Usually people who live far away though.


Well, then move. Easier said than done, I know. :yes Maybe a lot of the suckiness is the result of your immediate environment and online brats. :stu


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## Username (Oct 27, 2004)

VCL XI said:


> As mentioned before, some just hate people because think they're better than everyone else. Often in a case like that it's not that they necessarily hate them, they just hate that people get in their way or disagree with them.


Then that's just as unhealthy, but for different reasons. It smacks of sanctimony, arrogance, narcissism and delusion. To believe yourself to be above everyone else needs some strong evidence, so I have to ask those people who put themselves on such a pedestal: What great achievements have you made to benefit humankind? Have you never erred? Are you that pure and virtuous?

Going about with a conscience drowning in hatred isn't going to endear you to anyone. It's almost a self-fulfilling prophecy for a misanthropist - if you already believe most of humanity is scum then that's all you'll ever really look for and see in any new encounter. And don't think your thoughts will be concealed. Your attitudes will show in your facial expressions and mannerisms, in your eyes and in your gestures, in your posture and in your tone. Anyone you talk to will pick up some of that darkness brooding within you, and depending on who they are and just how their day is going, will at the very least do their best to avoid you. They'll feel threatened by you. Some may respond with violent words, others with veiled disgust. The way you'll be treated will only help to further solidify your doubts. You'll recede even further into the shadows spread by what you thought was sound judgement.

The saddest irony is that those who develop a resentment for our species end up becoming everything they learned to hate about humanity.

I remember my life coming up to my mid-teens - age 16 or so was when I slipped into depression, heightened anxiety and misanthropy - when I was a lot more trusting of people. I'd smile and laugh more. Nowhere within me was there a deep anger towards strangers or friends and family alike. I got along well with most individuals, made friends relatively quickly and found myself the apple of many a gorgeous girl's eye. Looking at photos of myself back then ... scrawny, pale, short, freckled, crooked teeth, bad mushroom cut ... but always with a genuine smile.

Fast forward a decade and here I am. Tall, built, perfect white teeth, tanned and clean cut. Been that way for a while. But rarely were people as affable and attracted to me as they were during my 'golden years'. Some even showed some resentment towards me - resentment I returned. "Women only care about looks and money" I've told myself. "The only person you can ever trust is yourself." "We're worse than animals. Even other animals won't screw each other as much as we do." "Love is nothing more than good sex - infatuation by a different name." "War doesn't interrupt peace - peace seems to interrupt war." And so on. My thoughts were basically: People suck. And in some degree or other, I guess everyone does suck. But I suck more.

The best way to lead, to bring about the results you want, is to lead by example. If I go around expecting the worst our of everyone, why shouldn't they reciprocate?

cheers
:banana


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

I hate humanity, too. There are a few people that I do care about. But, most of the people in this world are stupid, selfish and I don't trust them, either. At no time have I thought that I am better than everyone else. We are all equal. Its just this world is so screwed up. Most people are worthless. In my opinion, when a person starts to hate humanity, it doesn't matter if a person is only 23. Mine started before that. I wasn't getting anything from home or school. 

Being rejected used to bother me a long time ago, but I learned to develop the attitude, "oh well, its their loss". People disappoint me, as well. A couple of weeks ago, I overheard 3 co-workers talking about me behind my back. To hell with them. If a person doesn't have the guts to say something to my face, they are a coward. I don't care what most people think of me. Who made them God? I don't judge people until they hurt me in some way. Then I hate them. Look, I didn't just wake up one day and say, "The human race sucks, lets hate the world". I just wanted to be like everyone else growing up. All of the lack of trust, anger, etc. grew over a lot of years, & a lot of experiences. Some days I do say to myself, "The human race....what a joke!" This was done to me by other people. You can't just sweep this under the carpet. Some people never recover from whats been done to them by others. I am very happy with myself. Its most people that piss me off.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*

A decent person is somebody who isn't an *******, isn't a liar/cheater, is in general, a good person...
not many people like that exist.
& yes people of all ages can be assholes. it's not just people in their 20's or whatever... my grandma is one of the meanest people to ever exist...and if you ever went to school you should know children can be evil little beasts too. you have some of the people i went to school with & my grandma to partly think for my being so negative & hateful. it was in elementary school i was almost killed by stupid *****es i went to school with. kids are not all sweet & innocent and neither are all old people.
No I've never told any hurtful/big lies. I've already said I ****ing hate liars. This doesn't include small lies to make people feel better about their appearance or something, like if somebody asks "Am I fat?" I'm not going to say "Yeah you're a cow!" unless it's somebody I hate, of course. Then I wouldn't give a damn. But I don't ****ing tell people I "love" them if I don't, I don't lead people on, I don't lie about my feelings towards other people like they have done to me...people like that are worthless pieces of ****.
And I already said I'd accept people's apology if they had the ****ing common decency TO apologize, but nobody will. Because almost everyone sucks. I did have ONE ex to apologize to me though. And I still talk to him. I forgave him because he wasn't a ***** like most men I've known, and actually had the nerve to apologize for being an *******. He was an ******* and he knew it...and he felt bad for it. Most people don't.
There are assholes everywhere in the world. Maybe I haven't been everywhere in the world but just because it's another state or country isn't going to make people different, good or perfect. 
I have SA...do you find me to be likeable? Apparently not.
You don't have to be depressed to think most people suck...it's just the truth. Even a happy person should be able to see that.



Optimistic said:


> A decent person would be what?
> 
> Sorry, you misunderstood me, or perhaps I wasn't clear. I figured 99/100 of humanity being sucky would include women too. I was referring to the previous point I had made in my post, saying that *I* had only mentioned that 99 out of 100 guys would be judged as "horrible."
> 
> ...


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## Teneras (Jan 14, 2007)

> A decent person is somebody who isn't an @$$#, isn't a liar/cheater, is in general, a good person...
> not many people like that exist.


I think the inherint problem with this is that 99% of your conclusion is based purely on speculation. Even to assume 1% of it is based on evidence is incredibly generous. Your conclusion of them is not rooted in reality, it's in your imagination.

Unless you have known someone for years it is very unlikely you know much, if anything, about why they act the way they do and whether their intentions are good, bad, or completely indifferent. So you take maybe a few events, and you form your unbending bias based on how they affected you. In addition I really shouldn't need to point out that your social interractions probably don't extend further than english speaking countries and given that you live in the United States, your opinion is heavily shaped by what U.S. culture is like, so now not only are you basing your judgement on very little information, you're also applying it to everybody in different societies and cultures.

People are not one dimensional. Just because someone lied to you doesn't mean they are a terrible person. Just because they laughed at you doesn't mean they are a terrible person. Just because they said something mean or cruel, doesn't mean they are a terrible person. Most of all, just because *you don't like someone* does not make them a terrible person.

As for apologies, the reason people don't apologize is because they are stubborn and generally do not feel they are wrong. You feel strongly that you are right, 99% of people are liars/cheaters, and if the last 8 pages of this thread is any indicator, it is probably very unlikely you could be convinced otherwise. Most people are just like that, they have a fixed mindset. When they assume they are not wrong, how could they possibly be motivated to apologize? Just because you think they should?

Furthermore, what are right and wrong? They're nothing but beliefs, and again, 100% based in our heads, not in reality. I feel people are more good than bad, you seem to feel the polar opposite. Both of us believe we are right, but which one of us is? By your *belief* you are the one who is right, by mine I am right.

In virtually every scenario where you dont recieve an apology, its because the other person doesn't feel they have anything to apologize for, either because they felt it was justified, or because they simply do not feel they did anything wrong. It has nothing to do with their decency or whether or not they are good or bad. It's that they do not believe they should have to.

I'd like to point out this line in your last post:


> I'm not going to say "Yeah you're a cow!" unless it's somebody I hate, of course.


You've basically justified to yourself that saying something mean and cruel is okay if it's to someone you hate.

I hope that throughout your life you will meet enough people to change your outlook on the world, or at the very least enough to make you stop stereotyping those you have never met or talked to.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

Teneras said:


> As for apologies, the reason people don't apologize is because they are stubborn and generally do not feel they are wrong. You feel strongly that you are right, 99% of people are liars/cheaters, and if the last 8 pages of this thread is any indicator, it is probably very unlikely you could be convinced otherwise. Most people are just like that, they have a fixed mindset. When they assume they are not wrong, how could they possibly be motivated to apologize? Just because you think they should?


You made some good points, and I thought I'd expand on what you've said.

There are various reasons people don't apologize. People may underestimate the effect of what they've said. They may even realize it was wrong but don't realize the recipient was impacted very much emotionally. In some cases, what was said may have been taken out of context, or it was meant to be a joke or a good-natured tease and it was not understood as such. So I think we have to look at the receiving end of what's said as well.

I'm not sure why Scare-All, and others, wouldn't seek a way to settle the matter that has caused them hurt. I agree it would be ideal for the affecting person to come forward and apologize. That's one way to settle it. But if there has been no apology, what's stopping the affected one from *maturely* taking the initiative and discussing their hurt and asking, or politiely insisting, on an apology that is seen as being owed them?

I predict Scare-All will think something like, "Well, why should I? They're the ones who hurt me. I don't need to do anything for them." If that indeed is the thinking, I think it shows some inflexibility. The point really is to achieve self-healing and secondarily, to find strength to forgive them. Certainly, it won't work in all cases, but why not try, starting with those closest to you (relatives)? Also, I'd keep an open mind to the possibility that I was wrong: that I had misunderstood someone else, that I had magnified it too much, that possibly there was no need for an apology after all.



Teneras said:


> Furthermore, what are right and wrong? They're nothing but beliefs, and again, 100% based in our heads, not in reality. I feel people are more good than bad, you seem to feel the polar opposite. Both of us believe we are right, but which one of us is? By your *belief* you are the one who is right, by mine I am right.


There's the concept of absolute morality and that of relative morality, the latter being applied to a level as low as each individual. Controversial and best discussed in the Society forum, I think. :yes


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

It's not my imagination. It's reality. Maybe in your optimistic world you can't see it, but those of us who see things realistically instead of trying to see "the good" in everyone or whatever BS...can see it.
Yes, lying DOES make somebody a terrible person. Maybe you don't care if people lie to you and deceive you, but I HATE!!! liars. And if people do this over & over repeatedly and never apologize...you SERIOUSLY think they're a good person? Would you seriously be friends or date somebody who lies to you every day, or somebody who beat the hell out of you? Apparently so from the way you talk...
Lying and physically hurting someone IS wrong. Anyone who thinks otherwise is obviously ****ed in the head...so they KNOW they need to apologize to me...unless they're completely insane. People don't apologize because they're worthless pieces of crap, that's exactly why. Anyone who's lied or hurt someone should automatically know they should apologize, they're just too much of a coward to admit they were wrong.
Yeah, saying something cruel to somebody who says something cruel to me first is fine...I treat people the way THEY treat me. If I hate somebody I always have a good reason to.
I'm not stereotyping anyone, I'm just telling it like it is.



Teneras said:


> I think the inherint problem with this is that 99% of your conclusion is based purely on speculation. Even to assume 1% of it is based on evidence is incredibly generous. Your conclusion of them is not rooted in reality, it's in your imagination.
> 
> Unless you have known someone for years it is very unlikely you know much, if anything, about why they act the way they do and whether their intentions are good, bad, or completely indifferent. So you take maybe a few events, and you form your unbending bias based on how they affected you. In addition I really shouldn't need to point out that your social interractions probably don't extend further than english speaking countries and given that you live in the United States, your opinion is heavily shaped by what U.S. culture is like, so now not only are you basing your judgement on very little information, you're also applying it to everybody in different societies and cultures.
> 
> ...


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

I've already said how I feel on the subject of whether they think what they done was wrong or not...they KNOW.
If I asked for an apology I still wouldn't get it...and besides, I have SA...I could probably ask my family members who have hurt me for one(but it wouldn't do any good...they're cruel people and would just think they're perfect and would say they don't know what I'm talking about or some BS.)...as for the others, I have trouble enough approaching somebody to ask them something mandatory... how could I go ask somebody for an apology? Those people are also so cruel they'd probably laugh at me anyway.
Ummm how can you "misunderstand" someone telling you you're worthless, you'll never amount to anything and that you can't even carry on a conversation? My own grandma told me that. Now do you think I deserve an apology from her? She said that years ago and I never got an apology. If I expect an apology, there has to be a good reason for it...though I don't actually EXPECT apologies anymore because well...you already know what I think about most humans. They can't be counted on, or trusted.



Optimistic said:


> You made some good points, and I thought I'd expand on what you've said.
> 
> There are various reasons people don't apologize. People may underestimate the effect of what they've said. They may even realize it was wrong but don't realize the recipient was impacted very much emotionally. In some cases, what was said may have been taken out of context, or it was meant to be a joke or a good-natured tease and it was not understood as such. So I think we have to look at the receiving end of what's said as well.
> 
> ...


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## Teneras (Jan 14, 2007)

Little Miss Scare-All said:


> It's not my imagination. It's reality.


You state your opinion as though it is fact while having no evidence to support your theory. Reality is based on individual perception, people are only as evil as you choose to think of them.

Just because someone doesn't share your bleak point of view on the world hardly means they're "BS"ing themselves. I'm under no illusion that the world is made of flowers and ponies, but I also don't pretend to be the moral authority on how people should act. People are not as transparent as you paint them to be, their actions are not based on reasonings as simple as "they're just bad people."


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

Little Miss Scare-All said:


> ...as for the others, I have trouble enough approaching somebody to ask them something mandatory... how could I go ask somebody for an apology? Those people are also so cruel they'd probably laugh at me anyway.


Write them a letter telling them how you feel w/o cussing them out? If they laugh, I don't see how that'll change your view of them as it is now anyways. What do you have to lose? At least you'll have stood up for yourself.



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> Ummm how can you "misunderstand" someone telling you you're worthless, you'll never amount to anything and that you can't even carry on a conversation? My own grandma told me that. Now do you think I deserve an apology from her?


I really don't know your family, but from how you describe them, some of them sound like jerks. I don't know how representative your family really is. I mean, you say your parents are great, and that's more than some kids can say. There does sound like you, unfortunately, have suffered some verbal, emotional, and physical abuse. I agree, that's bad.
And I may not have had anything more to do with those people. I don't know the extent of your experiences with them and if it continues to this day (I apologize if you've mentioned it in one of your posts and I haven't read it or simply forgot it).

Still, while your grandma and aunt (I think) have done and/or said some (or many) bad things to you, I don't think it's a fair representation of humanity. I still don't see how you can hold fast to that 99% "horrible people" figure. I imagine if I had grown up in a family where I was verbally and physically abused by my mom & dad, sodomized by my uncle, and ignored by my grandparents, and teased by some classmates at school, that I would tend to view the world differently than I do. I wouldn't be insisting that 70% or 80% or 99% of people are horrible because I would realize that what I had experienced was not the norm.

I've heard you talk some about your family/relatives, but have you stopped to consider how others here and in RL were raised and their familial experiences. Do you think my relatives never said or did anything mean to me, for starters? My life experiences may not have included as much abuse and bad luck as yours has up to your age, but don't think that everything has been peachy in my life.

You asked a few posts back whether I found you likable. You concluded "apparently not." I kind of wonder why you asked, and especially why you made such a conclusion. Just so you know, I look at various aspects of people over time as I get to know them better. If I didn't like you, I wouldn't say it here, but fact is, there is enough about you that I find likable to drown out the one aspect being your view of humanity which doesn't appeal to me.

I'm a happily married family man in his 40s. Had I been a single guy in my early 20s scouting for females on SAS, the one thing that probably would make me want to get to know other ladies and to skip you would be the fact that you think 99 out of 100 are horrible. I wouldn't waste my time with anyone at those odds.


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## embers (Dec 19, 2006)

For little miss and for anyone else who "hates"

Hate is pretty much self contained. Lets say you hate Johnny poo and Suzie Q. They either don't care, don't know, or perhaps even get a kick out of it because the word hate is something you throw around in kindergarten. "I hate you cuz you stole my tinker toys!" "No, I hate you cuz you stole my whazywhoo!" Whatever!

Can we compare it to playing racquetball by yourself? You know how you get in those little cement block rooms? Compare the walls to your mind and body and compare hate to the racquetball. Just throw it against the side of the wall as hard as you can. The only person its gonna come back and bonk on the side of the head is you, you're the only one in there. Johnny poo and Suzie Q are out having a life. 

So anyone who hates others, do you see this?


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

The OK/Not OK Matrix (from Changingminds.org):

*I'm not OK - You're OK*

When I think I'm not OK but you are OK, then I am putting myself in an inferior position with respect to you.

This position may come from being belittled as a child, perhaps from dominant parents or maybe careless teachers or bullying peers.

People in this position have a particularly low self-esteem and will put others before them. They may thus has a strong 'Please Others' driver.

***

*I'm OK - You're not OK*

People in this position feel themselves superior in some way to others, who are seen as inferior and not OK. As a result, they may be contemptuous and quick to anger. Their talk about others will be smug and supercilious, contrasting their own relative perfection with the limitation of others.

This position is a trap into which many managers, parents and others in authority fall, assuming that their given position makes them better and, by implication, others are not OK.

These people may also have a strong 'Be Perfect' driver, and their personal strivings makes others seem less perfect.

****

*I'm OK - You're OK*

When I consider myself OK and also frame others as OK, then there is no position for me or you to be inferior or superior.

This is, in many ways, the ideal position. Here, the person is comfortable with other people and with themself. They are confident, happy and get on with other people even when there are points of disagreement.

****

*I'm not OK - You're not OK*

This is a relatively rare position, but perhaps where people unsuccessfully try to project their bad objects onto others. As a result, they remain feeling bad whilst also perceive others as bad.

This position may also be a result of relationships with dominant others where the other people are viewed with a sense of betrayal and retribution. This may later get generalized from the bullies to all others people.

*****

*So what?*

Understand how you frame yourself and others as being OK and note how you respond to this. Then think about the other person and how they are framing it.

Note how some combinations work together, for example if one person has the position of 'I'm OK/You're not OK' and the other person has 'I'm not OK/You're OK'. In such matching positions the relationship will be stable and both will gain some comfort of confirmation from this.

When positions do not fit, particularly when both people are 'I'm OK/You're not OK', then this is a recipe for conflict or confusion.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Wow. Another thread with some great replies. We should all be thankful we have such a caring community here. I wish I had more time to reply to all these posts. I'd actually reverse your calculus on you. 99% of people kick *** and 1% suck. At least that's the way this board makes me feel.


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## Yomanda9 (Dec 6, 2005)

Its easy to say we hate humanity but i think that its more societal norms that we hate, such as backstabbing, dog eat dog, uncaring, decietful coworkers. These to me exemplyfy why I find myself agreeing, hmm yes i hate humanity.

But is it really humanity that im hating? of course not, rather its corrupt decadent western society that is hateable. As you sit there listening to co workers yammer on about who they hate and who is ugly on trivial bull**** like pop idol, you see that the worst of humanity is coming from the society around them, the way theyve been conditoned to only value winners, rich people/ obnoxious people etc. 

Many times Ive bumped into people I would consider perfect examples of humanity, just, honest, and helpful, willing to be my friend, and most of the time I find they have not been conditioned wih this bull**** society(alot of immigrants fit this description).


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

I don't see how writing them a letter would do any good...all that would make them do is make fun of me all over again. Like I need that.
& yes it continues to this day...it's mainly my aunt now though. she's becoming her mother. :um That's scary. :afr
I'm not just going by my aunt & grandma. I've been treated like **** by ALOT of people. I have not met many good people in this cruel world. The bad definitely outweighs the good...BY FAR!!!!!! I've already said my parents are great. My 2 best friends are great, alot of my mom's family are great or at least decent. But most other people I've met...were not good. How could I think good of people if most of the people I've met are crappy?
Anyway...no matter what any of you say it isn't going to change me. I am who I am and I can't change and I don't see why I should anyway because in my opinion I am right.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Little Miss Scare-All said:


> I don't see how writing them a letter would do any good...all that would make them do is make fun of me all over again. Like I need that.
> .


If they made fun of you after you wrote them a letter, then there's nothing you can do, really. But if you take that step, at least you know you tried.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

srschirm said:


> If they made fun of you after you wrote them a letter, then there's nothing you can do, really. But if you take that step, at least you know you tried.


It wouldn't work anyway...it would just be a waste of time and they'd get a good laugh out of me, yet again.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Little Miss Scare-All said:


> srschirm said:
> 
> 
> > If they made fun of you after you wrote them a letter, then there's nothing you can do, really. But if you take that step, at least you know you tried.
> ...


I have a difficult time believing this, but ok.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

You don't know these people.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

Little Miss Scare-All said:


> Anyway...no matter what any of you say it isn't going to change me. I am who I am and I can't change and I don't see why I should anyway because in my opinion I am right.


That's all right, you don't need to change. We're just here discussing, voicing opinions, offering suggestions. I think we generally seek happiness and if you have your own method of doing that, more power to you. :yes If happiness is not what you, or others, are trying to achieve or you can find happiness being by yourself because you can't find that 1% to have and to hold for the rest of your life, then I guess who's to say that you should even try to change.

I'm not sure if you are able to put yourself easily into others' shoes. There may be something unusual about your experiences, your environment, your personality, that has made it convenient for others to victimize you. Still, can you understand how others, such as I, may be amazed at your view of humanity? It's highly unusual. I mean, I have SA, have been teased, come from a somewhat dysfunctional family, have run into jerky people, have dated dozens of people, have had several relationships (not all picture perfect), and yet I have the view that humanity is basically good (maybe 15 to 25% of people suck).


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

No, I can't understand...you can't put yourself in my situation and see my point of view....so what makes you think I should be able to see yours? I don't think my view is unusual...at least I didn't until I came on here. I assumed most people probably felt the same way I do, they just hold it inside & don't say it. :stu



Optimistic said:


> Still, can you understand how others, such as I, may be amazed at your view of humanity? It's highly unusual.


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## Teneras (Jan 14, 2007)

Little Miss Scare-All said:


> No, I can't understand...you can't put yourself in my situation and see my point of view....so what makes you think I should be able to see yours? I don't think my view is unusual...at least I didn't until I came on here. I assumed most people probably felt the same way I do, they just hold it inside & don't say it. :stu


I can see your point of view (though I am not implying I know everything about it but I can certainly understand the implications of being mistreated by so-called "loved ones" for such a long period) and I disagree with optimistic's statement that it is highly unusual. If anything it is probably the norm. I think that most people at some point or another hate humanity. I hated it for years. However it is not a very logical outlook and inevitably the people you hate pull you down to their level.

I believe the reason people stop hating humanity is by meeting other good people who inspire them to improve their and others lives and while things probably don't seem that way, I'm sure eventually you will get to that point too.

My only real advice is to try not to let preconcieved notions get the better of you or you may end up missing those opportunities.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

Teneras said:


> ...and I disagree with optimistic's statement that it is highly unusual. *If anything it is probably the norm.* I think that most people at some point or another hate humanity.


I respectfully doubt that. I believe that a lot of what may be thought of as hate ends up being anger. Kind of like one's response when being cut off on the highway, "Other drivers are just rude. I hate people."


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## Teneras (Jan 14, 2007)

Sure, but then a pretty large portion of the time when someone grows to hate another person it is usually because they have unresolved anger toward them. I didn't mean hate for humanity on the same long-term level that I had felt it, but as momentary as those situations may be I think most people experience them at some point or another.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Teneras said:


> Sure, but then a pretty large portion of the time when someone grows to hate another person it is usually because they have unresolved anger toward them.


Probably how it is in a lot of cases.



Teneras said:


> I didn't mean hate for humanity on the same long-term level that I had felt it, but as momentary as those situations may be I think most people experience them at some point or another.


I don't see eye-to-eye with you here. People use emotional reasoning even momentarily to generalize their feelings to extend to a larger group, such as humanity. It's typically an illusion borne out of their anger and frustration and as a way to match their thoughts, their reasoning, with their current feelings, they blurt out "I hate people."

I, and I'd guess others here, have said things in the heat of the moment, for example, and couldn't believe we had said such things. Maybe it was for effect or a self-defense mechanism, but I believe that in lots of these cases it was an impulsive kind of emotional reasoning.

Years ago I told myself that I hated women. Looking back, I realize it was a way for me to justify my anger which arose out of the frustration I was having in looking for a mate. It was an illusion, or self-delusion, based on small numbers, the extent of my experiences at that time. If I had truly hated women, I wonder why I continued pursuing them.

I do find Scare-All's view unusual. I'm sure she thinks, or rather feels, she holds the key to the truth. The results of my "People Suck" poll in the Voting section I think are unusual too. If this is what people think on SAS, I believe their views are definitely in the minority. I just looked at a Yahoo poll on "Hating Humanity," and though I realize it may be as unscientific as the poll here, at least 80% said that humanity, while it may have its jerks and whatnot, does not incur their hate.

I've been trying to do the math on Scare-All's conclusion that 99% of humanity is horrible. I may be off here, but I think, including her friends and family, she may feel that 8 to 10 ppl do not suck. Given that, that would represent 1%, I figure that would mean she has met and gotten to know to some extent 800 to 1,000 people in her lifetime. That'd be a good accomplishment for anyone, much more so for someone (like me or anyone else here) with SA.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Optimistic said:


> Still, can you understand how others, such as I, may be amazed at your view of humanity? It's highly unusual.


I agree with Optimistic here. It is unusual to hate everyone. People make mistakes. If you were in the small minority of people I have wronged in my life, you might hate me too, but that hate wouldn't be indicative of the kind of person I am overall. The people we come in contact with can't be all that different, Shauna. So I wonder why you feel the way you feel, when I feel the opposite.


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## Atticus (Nov 10, 2003)

I've been on both sides of this type of discussion. I haven't hated humanity so much as felt that I'm so defective that I described life as a race and I'm running it in concrete shoes. I had some strong resentment for the "fleet afoot" that bordered on hatred, but I wouldn't have described myself as a minanthrope. Anyway, when I was *feeling* that way, no amount of evidence or persuasive logic would have swayed me.

I've also tried to point out when people may be doing themselve's harm by various inaccurate cognitions like mind reading, overgeneralization, predicting the future. If you're interested Little miss scare all, I think your thoughts about your feelings may be making you feel worse, and that is hard to sit back and watch. But like I said, I know from my own experience how tough it is to think clearly when I'm feeling lousy.

Little miss scare all ( and everyone else arguing for the "I hate humanity" side is entitled to feelingthat way. I think its bordering on harassment, Optimistic, to keep arguing numbers with her or to question how long someone can hold on to a bad experience. In LMSA's case, what if we agreed that 99% is an emotional # that isn't meant to be taken literally. Its an illustration of how bad she feels.


----------



## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

Teneras said:


> I believe the reason people stop hating humanity is by meeting other good people who inspire them to improve their and others lives


There's not enough good people. I've already said I have met a FEW good people but the bad outweigh the good, by FAR.



srschirm said:


> The people we come in contact with can't be all that different, Shauna. So I wonder why you feel the way you feel, when I feel the opposite.


Apparently they are different, or you just don't take it as badly as I do...or people just don't/haven't treated you as bad. Life's not fair, life is not the same for everybody. Everybody has bad **** happen to them once in awhile, but some people do get treated like **** more than others...and I'm one of those "lucky" people who gets treated like **** ALOT. I feel like I've had enough bad **** to last me the rest of my entire life, but I know it's not nearly over...unless I die anytime soon that is. And I already said I don't hate everyone, just the majority.



Atticus said:


> Little miss scare all, I think your thoughts about your feelings may be making you feel worse, and that is hard to sit back and watch. But like I said, I know from my own experience how tough it is to think clearly when I'm feeling lousy.
> Little miss scare all ( and everyone else arguing for the "I hate humanity" side is entitled to feelingthat way. I think its bordering on harassment, Optimistic, to keep arguing numbers with her or to question how long someone can hold on to a bad experience. In LMSA's case, what if we agreed that 99% is an emotional # that isn't meant to be taken literally. Its an illustration of how bad she feels.


Doesn't matter if it makes me feel bad or not...as long as sucky people exist, I'll feel bad no matter what. If we could just shove all the bad people off a cliff I'd feel a hell of alot better(or like my hero Becker says: "I swear the world would be a better place if I could just get rid of 6 idiots a day--just 6 a day, that's all I ask!"), but that isn't possible so......I'm screwed. And yeah the 99% is how I feel...& I dont see why Optimistic is obsessing over it.



Optimistic said:


> I do find Scare-All's view unusual. I'm sure she thinks, or rather feels, she holds the key to the truth. The results of my "People Suck" poll in the Voting section I think are unusual too. If this is what people think on SAS, I believe their views are definitely in the minority. I just looked at a Yahoo poll on "Hating Humanity," and though I realize it may be as unscientific as the poll here, at least 80% said that humanity, while it may have its jerks and whatnot, does not incur their hate.
> I've been trying to do the math on Scare-All's conclusion that 99% of humanity is horrible. I may be off here, but I think, including her friends and family, she may feel that 8 to 10 ppl do not suck. Given that, that would represent 1%, I figure that would mean she has met and gotten to know to some extent 800 to 1,000 people in her lifetime. That'd be a good accomplishment for anyone, much more so for someone (like me or anyone else here) with SA.


It IS the truth to me. And like I said above...I really don't see why you're obsessing over my 99%.


----------



## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Atticus said:


> Little miss scare all ( and everyone else arguing for the "I hate humanity" side is entitled to feelingthat way. I think its bordering on harassment, Optimistic, to keep arguing numbers with her or to question how long someone can hold on to a bad experience. *In LMSA's case, what if we agreed that 99% is an emotional # that isn't meant to be taken literally. Its an illustration of how bad she feels.*


Paul, I think she means that every bit of it should be taken literally. It's the truth. Even happy people don't see that truth. Nevertheless, I'll drop my obsession over the 99% figure. I'm a numbers guy, what can I say?  Maybe I'll use 98% instead. (j/k ).

It's not my objective to harass. On the other hand, this is a discussion area open to opinion. My opinion obviously differs from that of a few in this thread. I'm not condemning them as people, but if I don't agree with their view (one which very well could include me in its scope--which is only a minor concern of mine, btw), I'm not going to pretend that I do agree with it. Sometimes it takes repetition to drive home a point.

Sometimes when the rationality of math is coupled with one's experiences, a clearer perspective is achieved. You speak of LMSA's perception as perhaps being clouded, but I believe she feels it's crystal clear.

****

Let's bring this topic to a more local level for us. I'm not trying to pin down where you live, but I know that you, like me, live in the St. Louis area. Based on what I know about you and my fascination for stats, I'm willing to guess that you live in the suburbs somewhere (as I do) and would bet you don't live in North St. Louis city. Imagine if we were born and raised on one of the mean streets in the city. With the rampant crime--robberies, murders and drugs--we might be tempted to generalize that to the whole city sucks--everyone is a thief, murderer, or robber. Let's not stop there, though. You can't trust anyone in the metro area. You can't trust anyone in the state. You can't trust anyone in the country. You can't trust anyone in the world. Virtually everyone (notice I used no numbers ) is a criminal and the world sucks.

My opinion is that we can run into big problems when we try to frame the world simply based on our limited experiences.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

The only one I agree with is Little Miss. Her experiences in life are just like mine. I don't hate everyone, but most. There have been times in my life where I thought more bad s--- couldn't happen to me, but I, like Little Miss have had MORE than my share. No, its not fair. I know, I know...life isn't fair. Everybody sees life differently. If a person feels a certain way, all the talk in the world to them won't change anything. I don't expect anyone to understand. Only one person understands me, and that is my girlfriend. She is the only person that has every accepted me for who I am. She knows that I am not a "people person". I never have been, I never will be, and I don't want to be. What has been done to me most of my life by other people should have never happened. Be it home, school, work, etc. there was always some s--- thrown at me. I haven't had any friends for a long time, but I've learned to accept it for a long time. If people can't accept me for who I am, its their loss. I know people are going to take issue with what I said. Like Little Miss, no, you have no clue what I have been through. I still don't understand why some people are in here who seem to be trying to "council" others. I could be off, but it sure looks like it.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Bulldog, do you hate Optimistic and myself?


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



srschirm said:


> Bulldog, do you hate Optimistic and myself?


Stan, I'm not sure that can be asked and answered on this forum.  :stu

I would like to apologize to Bulldog if I came across as short, harsh, or too direct in replying to his posts. I do not, however, apologize for my differing view of humanity.

As for counseling, unless I've misunderstood the rules here, I think people are free to respectfully offer insight, suggestions, and opinions, even if they run counter to those to whom they're replying. Bulldog has asked me not to advise him, so I will honor that request. That's not saying that I will stop offering insight and advice on this board, and while I'm not a mental health expert, I do believe I have shared some good suggestions over the years.

One thing to keep in mind is that counseling can come in different forms. If we simply nod our heads in agreement, it can be easily interpreted as reinforcing the other person's thoughts and/or behaviour. My therapist does this to me, to some degree, at every monthly session. This thread could have had just Bulldog and Scare-All talking. It would have been an interaction of simple reinforcement.

Had this been a thread about the original poster seeing purple dragons or green martians outside his window (an extreme example, I know), would we have all just sat by nodding our heads in agreement? I doubt it.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Optimistic said:


> My opinion is that we can run into big problems when we try to frame the world simply based on our limited experiences.


It's not limited experiences...it's almost everyone I've ever met. If I had just met a few bad people then I guess I would probably, maybe think like you, but I've already said I've met ALOT and the bad outweigh the good by far...I can pretty much count on my hands how many good/decent people I've met. And I've came across alot of people. :rain


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Believe it or not, I have nothing more to add. :lol


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



srschirm said:


> Believe it or not, I have nothing more to add. :lol


Neither do I, neither do I... :lol


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

No, I don't hate you, but I think you are both wrong for trying to be "counselors". I don't care if you apologize or not about anything. Thats not my problem. Unless you are someone who is an expert in mental health, I feel it is wrong for you to be telling/suggesting what a person needs to do. I stick by everything that I have said so far in these postings. Yes it was totally unnecessary for Op to say what was said. It was stupid. He doesn't know me. This is a support group.....where has the support been in here. There hasn't been any. Rules? Where does it say a person can give advice on life, unless they are trained to do so. 
Nothing else to say.....yeah, right.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

Isn't trying to help people a major reason why this board is in existence? I'm sorry, but I'm not going to apologize for attempting to improve anyone's life. 

I wish I could wipe that chip from your shoulder.


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## Atticus (Nov 10, 2003)

I don't think anyone has broken any rules for this board, but that's not my business anyway. I happen to agree with you, Optimistic. "Nothing is either good or bad but thinking makes it so". I even understand your approach, trying to use data to refute or support. I quantify everything, myself, and numbers like 99% or 25 years resonate for me too. But....

Bulldog and LMSA aren't open to your efforts right now. They made that clear a few pages ago, and that's what I was responding to. I happen to think that they lose by choosing to reject your efforts, but that's the choice they're making.


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## CovertBanana (Nov 12, 2003)

What I say, I say with *respect *to both you srschirm and Optimistic, as I respect your views, opinions, and often enjoy and appreciate many of your other posts.

Optimistic, srschirm, while it's admirable to help someone, you both are totally going about it the wrong way. And you're forgetting that people have to want help. Which clearly is not the case here. And might I add; neither of you is completely right in all that you have said to support your views. Projecting incomplete knowledge on such an important subject may do more harm than good, especially if the delivery is more focused on proving your own view as _right_. Which may have not been your initial intentions, but appears to have become that way.

If you really want to help someone, it requires patience, understanding, respect, care, empathy, an open mind and validation. Also being non-judgemental. Much of which is lacking here.

At the end of a day, all you can do is offer your view, and what has worked for you in this world. And you *must* respect the decision of another person, if they choose to either ignore or accept that.


----------



## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Atticus said:


> I don't think anyone has broken any rules for this board, but that's not my business anyway. I happen to agree with you, Optimistic. "Nothing is either good or bad but thinking makes it so". I even understand your approach, trying to use data to refute or support. I quantify everything, myself, and numbers like 99% or 25 years resonate for me too. But....
> 
> Bulldog and LMSA aren't open to your efforts right now. They made that clear a few pages ago, and that's what I was responding to. I happen to think that they lose by choosing to reject your efforts, but that's the choice they're making.


Thank you for your post, Atticus. :yes 

As I've posted, I really have nothing more to say. I'll drop my discussion in this thread. I have already apologized to Bulldog for being too direct and too harsh in what I had initially posted in response to one of his posts pages ago, but based on his post following my apology, apparently he doesn't accept it or it just doesn't matter.

As for LMSA, it's sad for me to see such a relatively young person with apparently a lot going for her feel about humanity as she apparently does. Pages ago, I said that basically it is her choice and she doesn't have to change. Maybe I misjudged the affect that her view may be having on her. :stu It's her life and if it works out best for her despite any view of humanity she does have, then that's great. Although she has 
kept in step with me in replying to my posts and engaging in discussion, I will cease talking to her about it, including doing my mathematical analysis.

****



CovertBanana said:


> If you really want to help someone, it requires patience, understanding, respect, care, empathy, an open mind and validation. Also being non-judgemental. Much of which is lacking here.


Thank you, too, for your post, CovertBanana. :yes

I agree, to a certain extent, to what you have written above. Those elements are often important, and they can be important for both sides. I do think there is room for respectful disagreement, be it on this forum, or in a group support environment or in a therapist/patient arrangement.
Support goes beyone simply complacently nodding one's head. I agree, though, when help is offered, and the recipient clearly states that they don't want or need help, that the offer should be withdrawn. That refusal also can be delivered respectfully.

I have withdrawn the hand that I had reached out with in an attempt to help. I did so quickly with Bulldog, and I believe I did that more recently with LMSA. Years ago on this board I used to be wary, especially in the Frustration forum, to offer help when not asked for. I once even posted my concern and surprisingly someone replied saying that I shouldn't feel held back in my natural inclination to do so as I could and had provided some valuable insight in previous posts.

One question I do have for you, Covert, is what you mean by "validation". Does that mean that somebody is saying that the other person's feelings are justified given their situation?

Again, I appreciate your post. We might not see perfectly eye-to-eye, but that doesn't really matter.


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## Shauna The Dead (Jun 16, 2005)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Atticus said:


> I happen to think that they lose by choosing to reject your efforts, but that's the choice they're making.


It's not a choice...other people make me the way I am. It's their choice, and they choose to piss me off.

*And I have a question for those of you who love people & think most people are good*... why do you have SA? I mean...if people are basically good...what do you really have to be anxious about anyway? You should be able to go up to any random stranger and strike up a conversation and become best friends with them if they're such great, trustworthy people, right? :stu What's there to fear?
My SA started as a very small child so I don't think anything could have prevented mine, but still...I hear alot of people say their anxiety didn't start until later on...why would these people develop SA after so long if people were basically good? I'm guessing something(or SOMEONE...or lots of people?) scarred them so bad to make them develop SA after so many years? I wouldn't think it would just happen for no apparent reason after having no previous problems all those years before?
And I would think if most people were "good" & "trustworthy" that my SA would have went away or at least improved greatly by now, and I wouldn't have developed such a hatred for humanity in general...I mean, if people weren't such assholes, If I hadn't gotten treated like **** by almost everyone I've ever known...I wouldn't hate them. And some of my family members and alot of the kids I went to school with didn't help my problem any, as a child. If people would have just been nice to me and not been such dumbasses, I would be just fine.


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



Little Miss Scare-All said:


> *And I have a question for those of you who love people & think most people are good*... why do you have SA? I mean...if people are basically good...what do you really have to be anxious about anyway?


That's a good question, and man, I'd like to run with it and answer it right here and now. But I won't. I've said that I won't discuss any more in this thread.

If you're really interested in my answer to your question, please let me know in a PM.  I will try to provide you with an answer in the next few days. And heck, I may even provide you with a link to a picture of me. It's only fair that you see a pic of the "old" gray-haired geezer you've been chatting with in this and other threads, after I have seen your nice photos in the Member's Photos forum. :b


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## embers (Dec 19, 2006)

^^^^ to Miss Scare --- I think people here with SA are at different stages. Some are able to function at a certain level in society, better than others, and some are house bound, with several in between. 

Having been through all the stages, hating people, afraid to leave my house, depressed, I chose to work on myself. Yes people scare me, of course they do, look what they're capable of. But i'm not going to let it run my life anymore so i'm fighting it as best as I can. I do that by being positive.

You're at a place in your life where you're not ready to do that. You don't see the way out. You still depend on others for total happiness when its really all about changing your own perspective. 

Maybe believing as you do that everyone is hateful and is out to get you justifies you not doing anythng about your SA. You're just not ready. My thinking that there really are good people out there motivates me to go out there and find them, thereby fighting my SA at the same time. I still get knocked down from time to time, like recently with the gals at my school, but it doesn't color my whole world against society.


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



zengirl said:


> ^^^^ to Miss Scare --- I think people here with SA are at different stages. Some are able to function at a certain level in society, better than others, and some are house bound, with several in between.
> 
> Having been through all the stages, hating people, afraid to leave my house, depressed, I chose to work on myself. Yes people scare me, of course they do, look what they're capable of. But i'm not going to let it run my life anymore so i'm fighting it as best as I can. I do that by being positive.
> 
> ...


I couldn't have said it better.

None of us mean to patronize either LMSA or Bulldog. We only want to help. It comes from a good place.


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## CovertBanana (Nov 12, 2003)

> I do think there is room for respectful disagreement, be it on this forum, or in a group support environment or in a therapist/patient arrangement. Support goes beyond simply complacently nodding one's head.


Agreeing 100% with someone without question is just as harmful. And it would only lead to a break down in trust, as one can not trust someone who refuses to tell the truth.

But if you're helping someone, such a disagreement should be handled tactfully, and offered as a challenge to a person's view or thoughts. (And a challenge that you do not dispute after its original mention. You offer it as an _option of *thought*_).

A challenge with compassion and empathy in mind, that allows and leaves the person to question their own views or thoughts. So you don't even have to put up a disagreement, instead you help guide their mind to that conflict. This allows the person to think for him or her self. Which is also an empowering experience because you have enabled this for them. But you still allow them to make their own decision, even if it is the wrong one.

This is more important than actively airing a disagreement, especially if you would like someone to share your view and are trying to reach an understanding or trying to help. But it was never going to happen in this thread, with these circumstances.



> One question I do have for you, Covert, is what you mean by "validation". Does that mean that somebody is saying that the other person's feelings are justified given their situation?


One of the worst things you could ever do, is deny someone their reality. Their thoughts, feelings, perceptions, views, opinions etc etc. To instruct them they are wrong, and try to reason logically or mathematically with them - denying how they feel, will never work and will only make someone feel negatively towards you. Because you are in fact telling them, that the world they know and experience, is wrong.

Validation is about understanding, respecting and accepting a person's reality, without disputing it. And respecting the *legitimacy* of their reality.



> Years ago on this board I used to be wary, especially in the Frustration forum, to offer help when not asked for. I once even posted my concern and surprisingly someone replied saying that I shouldn't feel held back in my natural inclination to do so as I could and had provided some valuable insight in previous posts.


And by all means, you should *never* hold back that natural inclination. This world needs more people who are so inclined to offer help in all its forms. But that walks hand in hand, with many questions you should always ask yourself (if you sincerely wish to help someone), to further improve your ability to help. (some of this you may already know)

First, is this help needed? Or is this person merely venting/looking for comfort? Second, should you help? What can you offer this person? And will this person gain anything from what you have to say? And are they *open* to actually receiving _help_?

Thirdly, and the most difficult part, is how do you offer and deliver this help? This is something that is difficult, and success can vary from person to person (although there are basics). This is something that therapists struggle with and have to learn through their career. Learning about emotional health and communication helps. Even searching the Internet or reading books on emotional health can help. But after each time you help someone, always ask yourself "how can I make this better".

_Sometimes you are the teacher, but always be the student._


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## Optimistic (Nov 4, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



CovertBanana said:


> But if you're helping someone, such a disagreement should be handled tactfully, and offered as a challenge to a person's view or thoughts. (And a challenge that you do not dispute after its original mention. You offer it as an _option of *thought*_).


Do you see how by replying to my post, you open the door for further discussion, questions, differences, agreements into a topic? That's how much of this thread progressed. I can only speculate how Bulldog, for example, would have responded to my original reply to his post if I had put it to him as a question, say, "Isn't 25 years a long time to hold onto what you termed as a 'nightmare' experience in high school?" or alternatively, "Carrying around the weight of this odious 'nightmare,' as you call it, sounds like a real problem." What if I had said simply, "I feel sorry for you"?

Of course, my sympathy, although with good intentions, would have been a waste of time as I later learn that he's "very happy" despite the negativity he had expressed in earilier posts.



CovertBanana said:


> A challenge with compassion and empathy in mind, that allows and leaves the person to question their own views or thoughts. So you don't even have to put up a disagreement, instead you help guide their mind to that conflict.


What conflict? According to certain individuals here, there is no conflict. Guiding their minds would be intrusive, too. I'm inclined to believe that you are describing psychotherapy techniques where suggestions/questions are implanted and the patient runs with them. I understand that, but this is a discussion group, not a psych session. Bulldog even asks if we are mental health experts. I don't represent myself as one, though I have a knowledge of psych greater than what most people have. If I had been one, would it have even mattered?

I believe I prompted them with questions and tried to learn more about them, and myself, as the thread developed. I don't believe they're open to questioning their views or thoughts--it's a closed case. I eventually realized that, apologized for a somewhat harsh initial approach, and have since dropped the issue.

You seem to favor a soft approach, and that does work at times. It does often show respect, but the recipient is still free to choose how they react to any approach.

Still, I do not believe the soft approach works all the time. I'm reminded here of a post on SAS where a member told us about his anxious self-consciousness that he felt as he walked around campus. His psych's reply: "Wow. You must be a big, famous guy around here for so many to be interested in you" (Not the exact words). Hard sarcasm to effect a change. Brilliant. The member said it lit a lightbulb in his head. He benefitted from an approach that wasn't so "touchy, feely." We can only guess what approach is going to work, and what will not.



CovertBanana said:


> This allows the person to think for him or her self. Which is also an empowering experience because you have enabled this for them. But you still allow them to make their own decision, even if it is the wrong one.


Kind of see your point. It can be "empowering." Is it always the right technique? I don't think so. Let's take this slightly extreme, non-psychological example:

You see someone filling up their tire at a gas station. You notice that they've been filling up the tire for a long time. You worry that they don't know or don't realize what could happen. You offer your help. They tell you that they asked for no help. You see the tire bulging; you know what's likely to happen. They can learn the hard way and that may empower them in some way or you can insist on helping even to the point of taking the hose out of their hands and then pointing out the bulge in the tire, in the process saving them from injury and giving them a learning experience.

Maybe they didn't have the knowledge, maybe they simply didn't realize what was happening, maybe they were in denial, or maybe they were just bullheaded. If people want to learn the hard way, I guess that's their choice.



CovertBanana said:


> But it was never going to happen in this thread, with these circumstances.


Yeah, apparently not, Covert.



CovertBanana said:


> One of the worst things you could ever do, is deny someone their reality. Their thoughts, feelings, perceptions, views, opinions etc etc. To instruct them they are wrong, and try to reason logically or mathematically with them - denying how they feel, will never work and will only make someone feel negatively towards you. Because you are in fact telling them, that the world they know and experience, is wrong.
> 
> Validation is about understanding, respecting and accepting a person's reality, without disputing it. And respecting the *legitimacy* of their reality.


Okay, now I know what you mean by "validation." Thoughts and feelings are separate, albeit often interconnected, attributes. I don't believe I ever denied posters' feelings in this thread; it was basically thir thoughts and concomitant conclusions that I didn't feel comfortably honestly agreeing with.

And, BTW, Covert, I really like your use of color blocks in your post. 
The color block starting with "One of the worst things you could do..." is in a very interesting, almost titillating, shade of hot pink. How come you didn't use blue??



CovertBanana said:


> And by all means, you should *never* hold back that natural inclination. This world needs more people who are so inclined to offer help in all its forms. But that walks hand in hand, with many questions you should always ask yourself (if you sincerely wish to help someone), to further improve your ability to help. (some of this you may already know)


We can always learn, yes. :yes



CovertBanana said:


> First, *is this help needed? Or is this person merely venting/looking for comfort?* Second, should you help? What can you offer this person? And will this person gain anything from what you have to say? And are they *open* to actually receiving _help_?


Yeah, good questions to ask ourselves. Like I"ve said, it's not clear when someone only wants to vent and hear no suggestions or helpful hints in reply. We can't mind read. If someone only wants to vent, it would help for that person to say so and respectfully state that they just want people to listen. That's rarely, or ever done, on SAS. So is asking the OP or another poster if they want a suggestion. I have run into very few backfirings in reaching out to others with a helpful suggestion, when not even asked for, on this board. What's happened in this thread is very much the exception. Of course, there may have been a few that I ticked off but who said nothing about it. :stu


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## srschirm (Jun 25, 2006)

*Re: re: Hatred for humanity?*



CovertBanana said:


> One of the worst things you could ever do, is deny someone their reality. Their thoughts, feelings, perceptions, views, opinions etc etc. To instruct them they are wrong, and try to reason logically or mathematically with them - denying how they feel, will never work and will only make someone feel negatively towards you. Because you are in fact telling them, that the world they know and experience, is wrong.


Sometimes people misperceive reality though...would you not agree?

Damn, I wish I had more time to sift through these posts and expand more eloquently.


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## BeachGaBulldog (Feb 13, 2007)

First of all, going back since my last post....srschirm, Whats all this "apologizing" crap? I don't care what you do. Attempting to improve someones life? Well, it isn't working. Why are people like you on here if all you do is tell people what they need to do, what they are doing wrong, etc.
This is a support group..HELLO....Support, to me, means not trying to COUNCIL a person, but letting that person know you care. IT DOES NOT MEAN giving advice. 
Second, I also take issue with what Atticus said. How are Little Miss and I, in your opinion, "losing out"? We are doing what works for both of us. I am WINNING, because despite all the s--- I have been through, I am still here. At times I considered suicide, but that means other people would win. Why all this harping about efforts to help someone? I have never asked for it. Optimistic & the others who think "life is so grand", & are so sure that what I & Little Miss are doing is wrong, think what you want. Unless you are trained in mental health, you are wasting your time. 
Third, to Optimistic...you have a problem with my comment on being happy. The only reason I have responded negatively was your stupid first comment to myself, & subsequent comments after that by you & others. I am happy, so it doesn't matter if you believe it or not. I am happy with myself, its humanity that I am unhappy with.


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## Thunder (Nov 5, 2003)

> This is a support group..HELLO....Support, to me, means not trying to COUNCIL a person, but letting that person know you care. IT DOES NOT MEAN giving advice.


It means both. It would be a pretty useless board if all people did was pat each other on the back.
When someone does give you advice you don't have to take it or even read it but right or wrong you do have to treat them with some respect. And for those giving advice, there is a time to back off because not everyone is open to it and once you reach the point where you're only trying to prove your point then it's no longer advice.
The goal is to have fun, make new friends, learn more about this disorder and get motivated to take the steps necessary to overcome it.


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