# Datinga another stripper



## Chrome

I know this sounds crazy but I can only seem to date strippers. Put me at a regular bar and nothing happens, but at a strip club idk the girls are aggressive and tell me they like me and then I gt all cocky and boom I got a number or am at there house or bringing them home. 
I thin I need to be caged and studied like a chimp because I have something beyond SA. idk it's like SA and Bipolar and schizophrenia and body dimorphic all mixed into one and constantly shape shifting.


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## Knowbody

As someone who is a semi virgin in his mid 20s _(meaning I never actually had sex but received oral from women before)_ I'd have to say that dating a stripper is kind of lame breh, It's equal to being in a serious relationship with a porn star imo, but hey, do you.

Imagine if a kid came out of that relationship tho? That would suck

Hoes aren't for wifing


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## Tomasso

dude i would love to take a stripper out for a night on the town. props.


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## MindOverMood




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## Famous

Knowbody said:


> As someone who is a semi virgin in his mid 20s _(meaning I never actually had sex but received oral from women before)_ I'd have to say that dating a stripper is kind of lame breh, It's equal to being in a serious relationship with a porn star imo, but hey, do you.
> 
> Imagine if a kid came out of that relationship tho? That would suck
> 
> Hoes aren't for wifing


Imagine having a kid with a prejudiced person, that would suck(or blow or something)


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## Knowbody

jeeez, I'm a bigot because I think it isn't wise to get into a serious relationship with a stripper or porn star

eh, can't win em all


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## zer0small

Totally Terrified said:


> Imagine having a kid with a prejudiced person, that would suck(or blow or something)


^Made me lol.
You really can't win em all


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## Elizabeth419

Chrome said:


> I know this sounds crazy but I can only seem to date strippers. Put me at a regular bar and nothing happens, but at a strip club idk the girls are aggressive and tell me they like me and then I gt all cocky and boom I got a number or am at there house or bringing them home.
> I thin I need to be caged and studied like a chimp because I have something beyond SA. idk it's like SA and Bipolar and schizophrenia and body dimorphic all mixed into one and constantly shape shifting.


 You should write a book on your technique, sell it to the socially anxious so they can get laid, and become a millionare. Problem solved.


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## kev

Lol. 

Whatever floats your boat. I have nothing against it but be prepared for some baggage.


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## hoddesdon

Knowbody said:


> jeeez, I'm a bigot because I think it isn't wise to get into a serious relationship with a stripper or porn star
> 
> eh, can't win em all


I think this is an aspect of political correctness.

If you say something is not right, then you are accused of prejudice against the person, even though you are talking about something they do, not about them personally.


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## RawrJessiRawr

Strippers aren't worth dating, usually the only thing they want is your money especially since you met them in the strip club <.< plus the only thing that shows is that all you can get is someone easy which isn't hard since they throw themselves at you. Now what's really hard and actually worth it is girls who actually respect themselves and have a nice job in which they worked very hard to get because most professionals Would say you probably have a personal problem due to certain past experiences either due to childhood trauma or other trauma. That this is just a unhealthy endless cycle you will go through until you seek some help.. Its like charlie sheen, his first girl was a prostitute which is also not healthy. But if thats what you want and what makes you happy then go ahead lol its your life and only you can live it


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## ForeverStallone

RawrJessiRawr said:


> Strippers aren't worth dating, usually the only thing they want is your money especially since you met them in the strip club <.< plus the only thing that shows is that all you can get is someone easy which isn't hard since they throw themselves at you. Now what's really hard and actually worth it is girls who actually respect themselves and have a nice job in which they worked very hard to get because most professionals Would say you probably have a personal problem due to certain past experiences either due to childhood trauma or other trauma. That this is just a unhealthy endless cycle you will go through until you seek some help.. Its like charlie sheen, his first girl was a prostitute which is also not healthy. But if thats what you want and what makes you happy then go ahead lol its your life and only you can live it


Strippers easy to get? They have guys always trying to pick them up while on the job so they know all the lame bs a guy would throw at her to get in her pants. A guy has to somehow stand out to her so that she'll date him. And I don't think she expects a guy she's dating to come to her strip club to pay her for a lap dance. Unless the OP is providing her with coke? Is that what you're doing OP?


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## Monroee

OP: Are you happy with dating strippers? Because you put this in the Triumphs section of the forum, so I would assume that you think of this as a triumph?

If you're happy with who you're dating, than that's fine. There's nothing wrong with dating someone in that profession. But if you're not happy then you should probably discuss why you're unhappy in your posts.


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## Pharoah

you are probably a very cool guy.


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## RawrJessiRawr

ForeverStallone:1059441217 said:


> RawrJessiRawr said:
> 
> 
> 
> Strippers aren't worth dating, usually the only thing they want is your money especially since you met them in the strip club <.< plus the only thing that shows is that all you can get is someone easy which isn't hard since they throw themselves at you. Now what's really hard and actually worth it is girls who actually respect themselves and have a nice job in which they worked very hard to get because most professionals Would say you probably have a personal problem due to certain past experiences either due to childhood trauma or other trauma. That this is just a unhealthy endless cycle you will go through until you seek some help.. Its like charlie sheen, his first girl was a prostitute which is also not healthy. But if thats what you want and what makes you happy then go ahead lol its your life and only you can live it
> 
> 
> 
> Strippers easy to get? They have guys always trying to pick them up while on the job so they know all the lame bs a guy would throw at her to get in her pants. A guy has to somehow stand out to her so that she'll date him. And I don't think she expects a guy she's dating to come to her strip club to pay her for a lap dance. Unless the OP is providing her with coke? Is that what you're doing OP?
Click to expand...

Easy as in, they strip their clothes for money lol you don't even have to work hard to see them naked, don't even have to try that hard to get a smile and when I say money, I don't mean spending money on lap dances in the club >.< I respect go go dances alot more though, they do the same thing but with clothes on Idc what strippers do, its their job, I understand but doesn't mean I have to like them. They live their lives and I live mine, the end. And like I said before, as long as hes happy then thats good.


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## rymo

OP...let me know how you do it man, I would love to take a stripper home. Dating one? Well...that's another story.


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## Kennnie

Well, that sounds fun tell us how it goes in a couple days....


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## blacklamb

hoddesdon said:


> I think this is an aspect of political correctness.
> 
> If you say something is not right, then you are accused of prejudice against the person, even though you are talking about something they do, not about them personally.


Acknowledging strippers are people isn't about being PC, it's about not being a jerk who can't see beyond their own nose.

Good luck to you, OP!


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## makavelithedon

Strippers...... woop woop!!!


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## Chrome

There really is no method to my madness. I'm not paying to date them or giving them drugs. This one barely even drinks. The girls just think I'm cute and not a pervert. Strippers are aggressive and your already in that environment so its easy to flirt. 

This one said she wanted to kiss me when she saw me walk in. (I always go alone..well because I have no friends lol). They all say they aren't used to such a nice guy.

Believe me I would rather have a nice library nerd girl because they don't play games but as you all know talking for us doesn't come very easy(unless were drunk). 

But yeah it won't last. I give it a month tops. With these short days my bipolar is out of control. Hell, I was just crying over an 80's song like an hour ago.


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## loquaciousintrovert

So much judgment in this thread.

If he was dating a lawyer, would people be saying things? No.

Women who dance for a living should be shown the same respect other women are shown...I'm sick of the twofaced hypocrisy where people are okay with sexuality in some contexts but then call a woman a **** in any other context. I'm sick of it.


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## rymo

loquaciousintrovert said:


> So much judgment in this thread.
> 
> If he was dating a lawyer, would people be saying things? No.
> 
> Women who dance for a living should be shown the same respect other women are shown...I'm sick of the twofaced hypocrisy where people are okay with sexuality in some contexts but then call a woman a **** in any other context. I'm sick of it.


bahahahaahah...respect....hahahahaha...


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## heroin

Knowbody said:


> Hoes aren't for wifing


Truth.


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## StayingMotivated

first off there's nothing wrong with strippers or porn stars or other sex workers  it's a JOB!! I've been a sex worker so don't go there. Unless you've lived it don't make assumptions  thank you!!!

To the OP the stripper could be using you or could be interested. If you have a problem w/ only dating strippers stop going to strip clubs. Stop making excuses .


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## StayingMotivated

I expect a lot of judgement in this thread. Why? Because most of the MALES here don't leave the house and have very little socialization. Therefore the lame sexist comments aren't as bothersome  don't open the can of worms


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## loquaciousintrovert

rymo said:


> bahahahaahah...respect....hahahahaha...


Yes, RESPECT. She has a job like other women have jobs, and she is a human being, and deserving of respect. If you don't understand, read it again.


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## loquaciousintrovert

StayingMotivated said:


> I expect a lot of judgement in this thread. Why? Because most of the MALES here don't leave the house and have very little socialization. Therefore the lame sexist comments aren't as bothersome  don't open the can of worms


I just find it troubling that men who have problems with women already would have attitudes like this about women that cannot possibly help them out of their problems.

It's a downright hateful attitude, honestly.

I find a lot of women with the same disrespectful attitude. I am not one of those women.


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## StayingMotivated

loquaciousintrovert said:


> I just find it troubling that men who have problems with women already would have attitudes like this about women that cannot possibly help them out of their problems.
> 
> It's a downright hateful attitude, honestly.
> 
> I find a lot of women with the same disrespectful attitude. I am not one of those women.


yes those attitudes towards women especially sex workers is part of the issue with our patriarchal society.


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## loquaciousintrovert

Judgment toward sex workers...I just don't get it. A woman who is a doctor or lawyer isn't judged. Why is another woman, with a job like other women, judged in such a hateful way?

Furthermore, and perhaps the mods will attack me for this...why do some men think it's okay to grab and do other unspeakable things to women who dance? I've read really horrible horror stories about men kissing, licking, grabbing and doing other horrible things to women who are trying to earn their living. I work as a cashier, and men don't do those things to me (though they do stare at me, bordering on the inappropriate). All women who work deserve that same respect.


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## StayingMotivated

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Judgment toward sex workers...I just don't get it. A woman who is a doctor or lawyer isn't judged. Why is another woman, with a job like other women, judged in such a hateful way?


social conditioning. Just like most people will ASSUME that sex workers have been abused as children which is a FALSE ASSUMPTION. totally false.

it's all part of the conditioning. sad but true. Education can help eliminate these stereotypes.


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## forex

StayingMotivated said:


> social conditioning. Just like most people will ASSUME that sex workers have been abused as children which is a FALSE ASSUMPTION. totally false.
> 
> it's all part of the conditioning. sad but true. Education can help eliminate these stereotypes.


well i think in poor coutries or were the living condition are poor or hard to get by, they mostly end up there :blank while some do it as a real job or for the money.


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## WalkingDisaster

I don't understand why so many people hate strippers. They're just doing a job, if you don't like it don't go to a strip club.


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## heroin

Respect is earnt. Not demanded.

As for why people are judgmental, she is a sex worker. The majority of men would not want a relationship with someone who is or has been a sex worker. A roll in the hay? Sure. A relationship? Unlikely.

It's a gut reaction. There is a natural resistance within the majority of men to form long term relationships with someone who has had a lot of sexual partners.

I don't care if someone wants to be a sex worker or have scores of sex partners. More power to them. But this thread talks of dating someone like that. That's where the judgment comes in. Do you date people without judging if they'd be a good match for you? But hey, if the OP is happy dating a stripper, who am I to object?


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## lonelywoman

I like and respect women who use ther brains instead of their t..ts to earn their money, but hey at least she isnt a prostitute bt just dancing i suppose? If u want her, well it ur life


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## JimmyDeansRetartedCousin

:high5

Strippers need love too.


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## polardude18

Wow banging a stripper? I have mad respect for you. Share your secret? lol.


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## loquaciousintrovert

Why would you assume a sex worker has had a lot of sexual partners? A dancer, for example, does not have sex with people for money, she dances for money. She may have just one partner. Her profession has NOTHING to do with how many partners she has. You're just making a big assumption, and a rather offensive one, and trying to justify an ignorant line of thought.

The same men who would be happy to go to a strip club are the same ones who judge women who work in them. I'm reminded of a poem by Juana Inez de la Cruz: 

Silly, you men-so very adept
at wrongly faulting womankind,
not seeing you're alone to blame
for faults you plant in woman's mind.

It pisses me off, honestly, I don't care how much crap I get for saying that. It's completely unfair. And other women buy into it and judge other women for working in the sex industry. I am happy to be one woman who doesn't, and never ever will. It's a JOB, like ANY JOB. It deserves the same respect.


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## loquaciousintrovert

Also, in terms of thinking respect has to be earned and not demanded...men who judge sex workers and call them *****s and ****s lose ALL of my respect. Every last bit.


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## dave twothree

I'd love to date a stripper, damn =[

I still think I'm too shy though, need to work on that!


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## komorikun

This is why I would never tell a boyfriend how many men I've slept with. I'll tell him how many relationships I've had but that's it. If they really push me for a number, I'll say 10. :rofl


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## millenniumman75

****Thread Advisory****
Alright, keep it clean or move on....


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## heroin

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Why would you assume a sex worker has had a lot of sexual partners? A dancer, for example, does not have sex with people for money, she dances for money. She may have just one partner. Her profession has NOTHING to do with how many partners she has. You're just making a big assumption, and a rather offensive one, and trying to justify an ignorant line of thought.


It's called "erring on the side of caution".
Someone who sells their body and sexuality for money is unlikely to have hang ups about sharing it freely. Yes, it is an assumption. But better to assume than fall for a stripper and then have your heart broken when she just moves on to another in her long line of partners.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> The same men who would be happy to go to a strip club are the same ones who judge women who work in them.


I have never been to a strip club, but I have watched porn. How do you date someone without "judging" if they'd be a good match for you? Do you just date anyone without knowing their personality, outlook towards life etc.? Would you date a right winger who thinks homosexuality is a sin, or would you "judge" him to be an inappropriate match for you?

I don't care if someone wants to strip or do porn. I don't care to judge them then. But the judgment will come in if I were to consider dating them.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> Silly, you men-so very adept
> at wrongly faulting womankind,
> not seeing you're alone to blame
> for faults you plant in woman's mind.


waaaaahhh!!! it's always the men's fault!!!


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## loquaciousintrovert

You watch porn, but if a woman told you she'd been in porn you'd judge her. 

At the risk of sounding sexist, a perfect example of man logic. "I like porn, but women who are in porn are worthless *****s."

:no


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## heroin

loquaciousintrovert said:


> At the risk of sounding sexist, a perfect example of man logic. "I like porn, but women who are in porn are worthless *****s."


No.

"I like porn, but I wouldn't *date* a porn star".

It has nothing to do with her being worthless or whatever. It has to do with protecting myself from heartbreak when she moves on to the next guy in her long line of partners.


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## loquaciousintrovert

There you go again, assuming she's had lots of partners.

How about this: from now on I'll assume men who watch porn have lots of partners, and avoid them.


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## rymo

loquaciousintrovert:1059449501 said:


> There you go again, assuming she's had lots of partners.
> 
> How about this: from now on I'll assume men who watch porn have lots of partners, and avoid them.


How could you compare men who watch porn (99% of guys) to women who have sex for money on film (and who we can clearly see have had lots of partners)??? As for strippers, no I would never date one (even if I didn't have a gf) because I honestly don't really have respect for them. Most strippers arent too bright and I appreciate intelligence. Sure, if I met a stripper and we talked and she told me her life story and how she's trying to support two kids or bla bla bla I would understand where she was coming from...but I would still not date her because I would still assume she was promiscuous and not very smart (not to mention my gf would be naked in front of a ton of guys every night - who wants to deal with that ****?).

I'm not saying every stripper is like stupid, and I would have no issue whatsoever being friends with one (preferably with benefits looool), but you judge it on a case by case basis. Anywyay, we can only talk in generalities here and in general I don't respect strippers (lol what a crazy thought...)


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## Joe

People who visit strip clubs seem to be older and have more of a 'treat women as meat' attitude, maybe someone carings a nice change anyway good luck with it.


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## Lyrical Lonely

......Why is this in the "Triumphs" section?

....*walks away and closes door*....


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## loquaciousintrovert

Men who watch porn can't control their sexual urges, and therefore must have had many, many lovers. Their need for porn is indicative of their need for sex with as many women as they can lure into bed.



> How could you compare men who watch porn (99% of guys) to women who have sex for money on film (and who we can clearly see have had lots of partners)???


Easily. I just did. And just because 99 percent of guys do it doesn't mean it isn't problematic. I take issue with a lot of the porn that men consume because it is violent toward women and misogynistic.



> As for strippers, no I would never date one (even if I didn't have a gf) because I honestly don't really have respect for them. Most strippers arent too bright and I appreciate intelligence.


Generalizations based on a few women you met (or maybe you didn't meet any). Some are dancing to pay for their master's degrees, so there goes that little theory. Many are very savvy businesswomen and understand the nature of what they do (it's a sales job). Your assumptions are based on ignorance.



> Sure, if I met a stripper and we talked and she told me her life story and how she's trying to support two kids or bla bla bla I would understand where she was coming from...but *I would still not date her because I would still assume she was promiscuous and not very smart* (not to mention my gf would be naked in front of a ton of guys every night - who wants to deal with that ****?).


Bolded: Your assumption, not reality. And very ignorant at that. I personally would not mind if I had a girlfriend who was naked in front of guys every night. It would not bother me in the least. Dancing is a JOB, as I've pointed out before, like any other job. I wouldn't be bothered by dating a lawyer or a teacher. I wouldn't be bothered by dating a dancer. Your insecurities, and not reality, are what give you your opinions.

It may be because I'm a woman and I don't have the same jealous tendencies that a lot of men have, but many men wouldn't be bothered either, because they're secure in themselves and their relationships. This entire line of thinking just reeks of insecurity.

I'm also pretty sure I would not date a man who would be insecure enough to have problems being with a woman who danced for a living.


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## loquaciousintrovert

Lyrical Lonely said:


> ......Why is this in the "Triumphs" section?
> 
> ....*walks away and closes door*....


Yeah, I see your point. But I like that it's provided the opportunity for much-needed debate and education.


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## identitycrisis

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Men who watch porn can't control their sexual urges, and therefore must have had many, many lovers. Their need for porn is indicative of their need for sex with as many women as they can lure into bed.
> 
> Easily. I just did. And just because 99 percent of guys do it doesn't mean it isn't problematic. I take issue with a lot of the porn that men consume because it is violent toward women and misogynistic.
> 
> Generalizations based on a few women you met (or maybe you didn't meet any). Some are dancing to pay for their master's degrees, so there goes that little theory. Many are very savvy businesswomen and understand the nature of what they do (it's a sales job). Your assumptions are based on ignorance.
> 
> Bolded: Your assumption, not reality. And very ignorant at that. I personally would not mind if I had a girlfriend who was naked in front of guys every night. It would not bother me in the least. Dancing is a JOB, as I've pointed out before, like any other job. I wouldn't be bothered by dating a lawyer or a teacher. I wouldn't be bothered by dating a dancer. Your insecurities, and not reality, are what give you your opinions.
> 
> It may be because I'm a woman and I don't have the same jealous tendencies that a lot of men have, but many men wouldn't be bothered either, because they're secure in themselves and their relationships. This entire line of thinking just reeks of insecurity.
> 
> I'm also pretty sure I would not date a man who would be insecure enough to have problems being with a woman who danced for a living.


While I agree with most of what you're saying, don't we all choose who to befriend / date based on assumptions we make? Just like rymo wouldn't date a stripper because she appears to be promiscuous, it sounds like you wouldn't date a man who appears to be insecure. I don't see anything intrinsically wrong with either of your views, but (just like everyone else) you both may miss out on getting to know amazing people because of certain assumptions you make.

I don't find it surprising at all that men on this forum would make such assumptions. We're some of the most insecure people on the planet  For the record, I probably wouldn't turn a girl down because she's a stripper, but it would probably make me a little insecure anyway - it's not really something I can control.


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## loquaciousintrovert

No. You absolutely can and *should* control it. I'm not saying it's easy, but it can be done. There are men who deal with their insecurity in better ways. It IS possible, but not easy.

Dancing is a job. It's not as though a woman who dances is being intimate with customers. She's doing what she does to make money. I would say that a lot of the unwanted physical contact is initiated by club patrons, not the dancers. There are often strict rules in place regarding touching and it's often not allowed. In a good club, management will ensure that dancers are not touched/groped/kissed/licked. I honestly think it should not be allowed in any club. Nobody tries to lick me while I ring them up for their band-aids and cold medicine. Dancers deserve the same consideration.

I think people are focusing way too much on the sexual aspects of the job (which are incidental) rather than the reality of the job. It is a sales job where a woman is selling her time and dances for money (Note: NOT selling sex or even the promise of sex--SEE?). It is hard work, and it takes courage and I have an enormous amount of respect for women who see it as an opportunity and work hard at it to better their lives.

I think men get way too hung up about it, in general.


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## komorikun

I believe this is called the madonna-wh*re complex.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=madonna-*****+complex

"A man with a madonna-***** complex is a man who will sleep with and lust for a sexual and beautiful woman but he will never respect her as "wife" material and he will never marry her. In his eyes, she is tainted, impure, unworthy of the status of wife---yet he may possess passionate and contradictory feelings for her. He may even be in love with her but will never allow himself to be with her in any real sense. 
He will look for a "good girl" to marry---usually a woman who is cold sexually but, for example, is good at "wifely" domestic things: cooking, cleaning, homemaking in general, etc. A proper, pure "madonna" type woman who will bear his children."

"The seemingly conflicting desires that some (but certainly not all) men have for a woman who is experienced in the bedroom and unashamed of showing sexual prowess ("*****"), but at the same time a woman who is wholesome, clean and nuturing ("madonna"), particularly enough to not be branded a "****".

This concept is due to having a large population of sexually frustrated people (both men AND women) who were raised to believe that sexual activity or just being sexy is a dirty and shameful act, and a society where both men and women have been led to believe that women have to either be complete prudes or totally promiscuous."


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## loquaciousintrovert

Sexual hypocrisy runs rampant. It's appropriate to lick a dancer, but nobody would ever do that to me, a cashier. Sexuality is repressed sometimes, allowed others.

Being sexual is okay in some situations, frowned on in others. I get so confused that I just repress always, which has led to so many of my problems.

I know this isn't about me, though. I just wanted to point out how screwed up American (and western, I guess) society is.


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## identitycrisis

loquaciousintrovert said:


> No. You absolutely can and *should* control it. I'm not saying it's easy, but it can be done. There are men who deal with their insecurity in better ways. It IS possible, but not easy.


Feeling insecure and acting on those insecurities are two different things. The latter I can control. The former, well, perhaps it's possible to curtail it with lots and lots of therapy, but I doubt I'd ever completely get over it, in the same way I don't think I'll ever completely "get over" my SA. It's about managing yourself despite your shortcomings.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> Dancing is a job. It's not as though a woman who dances is being intimate with customers. She's doing what she does to make money. I would say that a lot of the unwanted physical contact is initiated by club patrons, not the dancers. There are often strict rules in place regarding touching and it's often not allowed. In a good club, management will ensure that dancers are not touched/groped/kissed/licked. I honestly think it should not be allowed in any club. Nobody tries to lick me while I ring them up for their band-aids and cold medicine. Dancers deserve the same consideration.
> 
> I think people are focusing way too much on the sexual aspects of the job (which are incidental) rather than the reality of the job. It is a sales job where a woman is selling her time and dances for money (Note: NOT selling sex or even the promise of sex--SEE?). It is hard work, and it takes courage and I have an enormous amount of respect for women who see it as an opportunity and work hard at it to better their lives.
> 
> I think men get way too hung up about it, in general.


Again, I agree with you save one point - it has _everything_ to do with sex. No, they're not _selling_ the act of sex or the promise of sex (that's called prostitution), but they are selling a sexual fantasy nonetheless. If the sexual aspects of stripping were purely coincidental, why would strip clubs be dominated by male patrons?

Your use of the "dancing" euphemism for stripping is also not lost on me. I realize that you're dignifying a job that our culture deems undignified. But if there's inherent dignity in being a stripper, why should you need to resort to euphemisms at all?

I just can't buy stripping as "just another job." I don't think it's a gender issue (as there are male strippers out there too, remember). I think it's because our culture is obsessed with sex, *NOT* because I think stripping makes you a lesser person. It's not just another job in the way that movie acting is not just another job - we glorify movie actors to the realm of 'celebrity', and thus set it far apart from, say, a data entry drone.


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## loquaciousintrovert

identitycrisis said:


> Again, I agree with you save one point - it has _everything_ to do with sex. No, they're not _selling_ the act of sex or the promise of sex (that's called prostitution), but they are selling a sexual fantasy nonetheless. If the sexual aspects of stripping were purely coincidental, why would strip clubs be dominated by male patrons?
> 
> Your use of the "dancing" euphemism for stripping is also not lost on me. I realize that you're dignifying a job that our culture deems undignified. But if there's inherent dignity in being a stripper, why should you need to resort to euphemisms at all?
> 
> I just can't buy stripping as "just another job." I don't think it's a gender issue (as there are male strippers out there too, remember). I think it's because our culture is obsessed with sex, *NOT* because I think stripping makes you a lesser person. It's not just another job in the way that movie acting is not just another job - we glorify movie actors to the realm of 'celebrity', and thus set it far apart from, say, a data entry drone.


No, stripping is a sales job. The sexual aspect is part of it but it's not ultimately the main point of it. Selling a fantasy? No. Selling dances, and one on one attention.

I said INCIDENTAL, not coincidental. Part of the sales job of dancing is a sexual aspect. That doesn't change the fact that, at its core, it's not a "sex" job.

I use the term "dancer" because "stripper" has demeaning connotations. It's semantics to a degree, but I prefer to be respectful toward the profession by acknowledging it for what it is. It's very physically demanding, and calling it stripping makes it sound like it's just taking clothes off. It's much, much more than that, and I choose to acknowledge it as such. There's a reason women who dance have referred to women who do not as "civilians." It takes a lot of courage and strength to do what they do.

You can choose not to see this profession as just another job. That's fine. And as long as you and others choose to do that, women who dance will continue to be demeaned and disrespected by men and women alike. It's really unfortunate. Do you really want to partake in that? I don't.


----------



## humourless

blacklamb said:


> Acknowledging strippers are people isn't about being PC, it's about not being a jerk who can't see beyond their own nose.
> 
> Good luck to you, OP!


well said!


----------



## humourless

Totally Terrified said:


> Imagine having a kid with a prejudiced person, that would suck(or blow or something)


good one!!


----------



## matty

I have been on a couple of dates with a stripper, she was incredibly nice. Nothing happened but we had some good conversation and a good night. 

I have met a couple of really solid girls which Dance either through a club or through general crossing paths. I know a lot of Dancers I would not want to know. But some are not how they are being portrayed here.


----------



## heroin

komorikun said:


> ...Madonna-***** complex


It's because men are evolved that way. To marry/wife up a woman usually means an intention to start a family with her. Men cannot be sure of paternity, unlike women who always know the child they're birthing is their own. So men don't want to risk raising some other dude's child by marrying a promiscuous woman. It's like rape to us.
Sexual loyalty and faithfulness is a very high priority for men when seeking a relationship.


----------



## SylvanFox

heroin said:


> It's because men are evolved that way. To marry/wife up a woman usually means an intention to start a family with her. Men cannot be sure of paternity, unlike women who always know the child they're birthing is their own. So men don't want to risk raising some other dude's child by marrying a promiscuous woman. It's like rape to us.
> Sexual loyalty and faithfulness is a very high priority for men when seeking a relationship.


If only men cared half so much about BEING loyal as about having someone loyal to them.

I don't care about what men's "nature" is. I'm sick of men trying to use nature as an excuse to stick their penis in every person who will let them and then expect a woman to be loyal to them and only them. It's just a weak excuse for being a liar and a thin disguise for having absolutely no respect for women.

That's why I just don't mess with men at all anymore (never got too much involved with that stuff). I'd like to be more than your own personal piece of @$$ and baby factory. Nope. I don't think men really respect that sort of woman any more than they respect prostitutes. As for me, I respect the hookers more (note: I'm not talking about dancers. I'm talking about hookers. Did you know they're two different things?). At least they are getting paid. Some women are perfectly happy to be cooking, cleaning, working baby factories, just so that they can feel loved. But then that man leaves for the next piece and she's shackled with his kids and blamed for HIS actions (the cheating). Then she becomes a stripper to pay for his kids, and gets judged by people like you, who are the types that helped her make those mistakes in the first place.

(prejudice intended for purposes of irony)

I've dated two guys who got some notion into their heads of marrying me and all that crap, just because I pay my bills, clean my house, and cook my own food. But they made the mistake of letting me hear comments like yours before they ever tried to ask me such a question. I waited, and made them regret it.. Oh, how they regretted it. One of them, at least, is STILL trying, after years of me not having anything to do with him, to get me to talk to him again. He must be out of his mind. As if his attitude weren't bad enough, he's had lots of sexual partners!

Eh. Whatever. It's not like I'd ever waste my time talking to you in real life. I'd rather hang out with the strippers.


----------



## Cashew

Well said ^


----------



## matty

SylvanFox said:


> If only men cared half so much about BEING loyal as about having someone loyal to them.
> 
> I don't care about what men's "nature" is. I'm sick of men trying to use nature as an excuse to stick their penis in every person who will let them and then expect a woman to be loyal to them and only them. It's just a weak excuse for being a liar and a thin disguise for having absolutely no respect for women.
> 
> That's why I just don't mess with men at all anymore (never got too much involved with that stuff). I'd like to be more than your own personal piece of @$$ and baby factory. Nope. I don't think men really respect that sort of woman any more than they respect prostitutes. As for me, I respect the hookers more (note: I'm not talking about dancers. I'm talking about hookers. Did you know they're two different things?). At least they are getting paid. Some women are perfectly happy to be cooking, cleaning, working baby factories, just so that they can feel loved. But then that man leaves for the next piece and she's shackled with his kids and blamed for HIS actions (the cheating). Then she becomes a stripper to pay for his kids, and gets judged by people like you, who are the types that helped her make those mistakes in the first place.
> 
> (prejudice intended for purposes of irony)
> 
> I've dated two guys who got some notion into their heads of marrying me and all that crap, just because I pay my bills, clean my house, and cook my own food. But they made the mistake of letting me hear comments like yours before they ever tried to ask me such a question. I waited, and made them regret it.. Oh, how they regretted it. One of them, at least, is STILL trying, after years of me not having anything to do with him, to get me to talk to him again. He must be out of his mind. As if his attitude weren't bad enough, he's had lots of sexual partners!
> 
> Eh. Whatever. It's not like I'd ever waste my time talking to you in real life. I'd rather hang out with the strippers.


Where has your opinion come from? There is a lot of unnecessary hate



Siringo said:


> Well said ^


Well said? Which part?


----------



## SylvanFox

Unnecessary hate? Cry me a river. 

If you had half a brain, you could see the part where it says PREJUDICE INTENDED FOR PURPOSES OF IRONY.

You really think you can just talk about strippers/hookers/women as if they weren't even human, and then you get offended by a sarcastic retelling of my own life experience? 

You're just dying for some reason to be offended, aren't you? There's always a lot of that on this site. Everybody needs to be a victim. 

I have the balls to say something to ridiculously judgmental people. And no, I will NOT be nice to someone who thinks that they have the right to declare someone else inhuman and inferior. I've tried that. You know what that's called, when somebody steps on your toes and you apologize for standing?

I think I've heard people refer to that as SOCIAL ANXIETY. Which, by the way, is something we are supposed to be here to get over, not to molly-coddle each other and make each other feel like we are justified in every thought. 

If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything. But you're not. And you don't.


----------



## komorikun

heroin said:


> It's because men are evolved that way. To marry/wife up a woman usually means an intention to start a family with her. Men cannot be sure of paternity, unlike women who always know the child they're birthing is their own. So men don't want to risk raising some other dude's child by marrying a promiscuous woman. It's like rape to us.
> Sexual loyalty and faithfulness is a very high priority for men when seeking a relationship.


Why does promiscuous in the past= more likely to cheat now? I know most guys would be totally turned off if a woman said she was prostitute or a stripper in the past, even if it was years ago. Or even if the woman said she had many one-night stands in the past. It's all very funny cause most guys are extremely easy themselves. This is part of the reason why I lost sympathy for men's eternal plight for sex that can be seen in the 80 zillion threads on this forum. Especially the "How did the first girl react to your Virginity?" thread.


----------



## HackerZC

Chrome said:


> I know this sounds crazy but I can only seem to date strippers. Put me at a regular bar and nothing happens, but at a strip club idk the girls are aggressive and tell me they like me and then I gt all cocky and boom I got a number or am at there house or bringing them home.
> I thin I need to be caged and studied like a chimp because I have something beyond SA. idk it's like SA and Bipolar and schizophrenia and body dimorphic all mixed into one and constantly shape shifting.


I guess the question you need to ask is "what kind of person do you WANT/NEED, and why don't you think you are attracting that kind of person?"

Some of the most interesting people I've known either do porn or are escorts or have danced. I envy them for having the bodies and the confidence to do that. Then again if I was them I'd likely do the same thing (if you got it,flaunt it).



komorikun said:


> Why does promiscuous in the past= more likely to cheat now? I know most guys would be totally turned off if a woman said she was prostitute or a stripper in the past, even if it was years ago. Or even if the woman said she had many one-night stands in the past. It's all very funny cause most guys are extremely easy themselves. This is part of the reason why I lost sympathy for men's eternal plight for sex that can be seen in the 80 zillion threads on this forum. Especially the "How did the first girl react to your Virginity?" thread.


Once a cheater, always a cheater... it's that simple. And guys and girls are pretty even in this respect. It all comes down to the individual. 
I'm poly, and I like it that way. I have multiple partners, and so do the girls I'm with. We all know each other, and it's all good. 
As for guys being easy, it's because they have to be. Roles have been reversed. Women can pick and choose who they want (as long as they are reasonably attractive), they are also a hell of a lot more picky nowadays, so men pretty much have to take what they can get... which is why I constantly feel so stupid for passing up sex as much as I do, because I know there was a time when I didn't get to make that choice... women made it for me. Hell that's part of the reason I have SA and feel like I'm not good enough or can't get who I truly want.


----------



## identitycrisis

This thread is starting to make me feel guilty for being born a man.

And that's a goddamn shame.

Why don't you all do yourselves a favor - judge people individually, don't generalize based on gender, job, or sexual experience.


----------



## komorikun

HackerZC said:


> Once a cheater, always a cheater... it's that simple. And guys and girls are pretty even in this respect. It all comes down to the individual.
> I'm poly, and I like it that way. I have multiple partners, and so do the girls I'm with. We all know each other, and it's all good.
> As for guys being easy, it's because they have to be. Roles have been reversed. Women can pick and choose who they want (as long as they are reasonably attractive), they are also a hell of a lot more picky nowadays, so men pretty much have to take what they can get... which is why I constantly feel so stupid for passing up sex as much as I do, because I know there was a time when I didn't get to make that choice... women made it for me. Hell that's part of the reason I have SA and feel like I'm not good enough or can't get who I truly want.


How is being promiscuous cheating when you are not in a relationship at the time?


----------



## matty

SylvanFox said:


> Unnecessary hate? Cry me a river.
> 
> If you had half a brain, you could see the part where it says PREJUDICE INTENDED FOR PURPOSES OF IRONY.
> 
> You really think you can just talk about strippers/hookers/women as if they weren't even human, and then you get offended by a sarcastic retelling of my own life experience?
> 
> You're just dying for some reason to be offended, aren't you? There's always a lot of that on this site. Everybody needs to be a victim.
> 
> I have the balls to say something to ridiculously judgmental people. And no, I will NOT be nice to someone who thinks that they have the right to declare someone else inhuman and inferior. I've tried that. You know what that's called, when somebody steps on your toes and you apologize for standing?
> 
> I think I've heard people refer to that as SOCIAL ANXIETY. Which, by the way, is something we are supposed to be here to get over, not to molly-coddle each other and make each other feel like we are justified in every thought.
> 
> If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything. But you're not. And you don't.


Where is this hate coming from. Seems to be a pretty huge blanket on anyone with a penis. I have plenty of respect for women regardless of their profession or life situations. Even you with your panties in a knot. So who wronged you and why is everybody else paying for it?

I am not offended, I am just interested to know what has lead you to this point.


----------



## Atticus

SylvanFox said:


> Unnecessary hate? Cry me a river.
> 
> If you had half a brain, you could see the part where it says PREJUDICE INTENDED FOR PURPOSES OF IRONY.
> 
> You really think you can just talk about strippers/hookers/women as if they weren't even human, and then you get offended by a sarcastic retelling of my own life experience?
> 
> You're just dying for some reason to be offended, aren't you? There's always a lot of that on this site. Everybody needs to be a victim.
> 
> I have the balls to say something to ridiculously judgmental people. And no, I will NOT be nice to someone who thinks that they have the right to declare someone else inhuman and inferior. I've tried that. You know what that's called, when somebody steps on your toes and you apologize for standing?
> 
> I think I've heard people refer to that as SOCIAL ANXIETY. Which, by the way, is something we are supposed to be here to get over, not to molly-coddle each other and make each other feel like we are justified in every thought.
> 
> *If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything. But you're not. And you don't.*


I agree with much of what you said. The part I bolded, however, sounds a bit like you know my experience as a male by virtue of.......I'm not sure, but your experience as a woman is beyond my capacity to understand. Since it's your bent, educate me.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

heroin said:


> It's because men are evolved that way. To marry/wife up a woman usually means an intention to start a family with her. Men cannot be sure of paternity, unlike women who always know the child they're birthing is their own. So men don't want to risk raising some other dude's child by marrying a promiscuous woman. It's like rape to us.
> Sexual loyalty and faithfulness is a very high priority for men when seeking a relationship.


Whoa.

If you regularly compare anything other than rape to rape, expect to have problems with women for a long, LONG time.

I stopped talking to a man who compared a man losing everything in a divorce to rape.

It's NOT okay.

And I hardly see how raising a child who would love you and who you should love regardless of genetic material is tantamount to rape. Grow up.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

Let's also remember that there is no correlation between promiscuity and dancing. Many women who dance do not cheat, and many women who cheat are not dancers.


----------



## HackerZC

komorikun said:


> How is being promiscuous cheating when you are not in a relationship at the time?


Oh it doesn't. I guess I misunderstood what you were saying.


----------



## SylvanFox

matty said:


> Where is this hate coming from. Seems to be a pretty huge blanket on anyone with a penis. I have plenty of respect for women regardless of their profession or life situations. Even you with your panties in a knot. So who wronged you and why is everybody else paying for it?
> 
> I am not offended, I am just interested to know what has lead you to this point.


A whole slew of things- and I'm not hating on all men, but I do HATE the kind of men who say stuff like "Well, we want a loyal, devoted woman who cooks to bear our children".

Why? Because that doesn't work out. Because men who wanted a quiet, cooking brood mare beat the **** out of every single woman in my family and broke them. Because men who say stuff like that will NEVER really care about a woman. Because men with that attitude put pressure on one of my best male friends, leading him to ruin a great relationship with a girl he loved, for something he didn't even really care about just because that's what men are "supposed" to do. Too late, he tried to go back and fix the problem, but she is dead... Because a cooking, childbearing housewife broke an older friend of mine and now he's dying of depression and alcoholism. Because I actually have friends who are strippers. Because a my mom's boyfriend had some blonde girl over at my house when I was six and he beat the living **** out of me for asking him in front of my mom when she would be coming over again. Because a man called one of my closest friends while she was giving birth to his child to announce that she was an ugly ***** and he found a better girl than her, and he wanted a divorce. Because men always tell me that they just aren't complicated and emotional like women, and I like to prove them wrong by firing up their emotions. Because a guy told me that we weren't dating, that he wasn't interested in me, and then tried to strangle me at a party when I went on a date with somebody else. Because all the other men at that party thought that was okay, but called me a crazy ***** for knocking the crap out of the guy to get him off me. Because I lost my job when I showed up at work with bruises and finger marks on my neck.....

That list could go on forever (it's not just one guy- I've only met 3 exceptions out of at least 20 or 30 friends/family/etc I've been acquainted with over the years), but the real problem is this:

I do not, nor will I ever, belong to anybody. I'm not property. I'm a person. Yet for some reason I'm expected to be owned. I'm supposed to eat, sleep, and breathe sexiness. I've heard males on the opposite boards (the ones full of men complaining about how it's women's fault they have SA) complain about how some women are shallow and only care about looking pretty. Why do you think it's so important to them?

Nobody listens to an unpretty girl, not even other women. Not that I'm very bad-looking, but I refuse to put makeup on my face, and I refuse to spend $300 on a pair of shoes. I've been told repeatedly that this makes me "not a girl." Not a girl! As if a girl's only function in life is to be pretty.

---And at work? Ha! I can't even offer an idea for the office at meetings. Everyone turns, looks at me, and then goes back to doing what they are doing. I have to just put my plans into motion without any feedback or permission. Then they say something like "This was a great idea, why didn't you bring it up at the meeting?" I'm the only female who even gets to come to meetings, and sometimes it seems like I'm only there to fun to the fridge and grab another coke when somebody runs out.

Except for 3 guys I know, anytime I am trying to hang out with a bunch of people and there are guys there, the girls are all silent, and the guys look at me funny if I say anything. This is the same basic principle as what's going on at work.

Now, as near as I can deduce, the major difference in attitudes between all those ***holes and my 3 good guy friends is this:

The ***holes all believe that a woman should be loyal, but that "monogamy is unnatural" for men. They have a possessive attitude towards women.

The 3 decent guys say that they want their wife/woman to be their best friend. They are all cheaters, but they don't demand a little faithful wifey in return for their infidelities. And they certainly don't demand virgin wives. You see the difference, here? Maybe it's just my imagination.


----------



## HackerZC

> If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything. But you're not. And you don't.


Well do you understand that in a way women are EXACTLY that? If it wasn't for sex (play) men wouldn't need women... and vice versa. 
Not just that but a lot more women these days (at least in the US) use their sex appeal to get what they want... hence the term "tease".

Trust me, no straight guy in the world who you know (aside from direct relatives) likes you JUST for who you are. Every single one who likes you is physically attracted on some level and secretly wants to get in your pants. It's that simple. 
Even the "nice guys" want to screw you, they're just too afraid to ever admit it.


----------



## heroin

SylvanFox said:


> That's why I just don't mess with men at all anymore (never got too much involved with that stuff).


On the behalf of mankind, I thank you profusely.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

HackerZC said:


> If it wasn't for sex (play) men wouldn't need women...


I see. So the only thing men like about women is getting sex off of us.

That's why these men want "female friends" meaning women they can use for sex when they feel like it. Not friends who get the same respect as male friends, except they're women. Not a chance.

Re: SylvanFox: and for these reasons and many many others I am part of the women's liberation movement.


----------



## SylvanFox

heroin said:


> On the behalf of mankind, I thank you profusely.


You're welcome.


----------



## heroin

komorikun said:


> Why does promiscuous in the past= more likely to cheat now? I know most guys would be totally turned off if a woman said she was prostitute or a stripper in the past, even if it was years ago. Or even if the woman said she had many one-night stands in the past. It's all very funny cause most guys are extremely easy themselves. This is part of the reason why I lost sympathy for men's eternal plight for sex that can be seen in the 80 zillion threads on this forum. Especially the "How did the first girl react to your Virginity?" thread.


Past behaviour is indicative of character. If someone never valued their sexual partners enough and kept going through them like used underwear, the guy wouldn't expect her to value him any more and it's only a matter of time before she moves on to the next one, openly if he's lucky which will only cause him heartbreak, or covertly which will likely stick him with someone else's child to raise.

It's not worth it.

You know that visceral disgust you get in the pit of your stomach when an unattractive man dares to look at you desirably that causes the immediate "ewwwwww!!!!" reaction and him being labelled a creep? I'm sure most women know what I'm talking about, even if few would acknowledge it. That's basically the kind of reaction that develops within a guy at the thought of building a relationship with a promiscuous woman.


----------



## SylvanFox

HackerZC said:


> Well do you understand that in a way women are EXACTLY that? If it wasn't for sex (play) men wouldn't need women... and vice versa.
> Not just that but a lot more women these days (at least in the US) use their sex appeal to get what they want... hence the term "tease".
> 
> Trust me, no straight guy in the world who you know (aside from direct relatives) likes you JUST for who you are. Every single one who likes you is physically attracted on some level and secretly wants to get in your pants. It's that simple.
> Even the "nice guys" want to screw you, they're just too afraid to ever admit it.


I didn't say that guys shouldn't be sexually attracted to women. But there should be more to it than that, at least a little more.


----------



## heroin

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Whoa.
> 
> If you regularly compare anything other than rape to rape, expect to have problems with women for a long, LONG time.


Feel free to put me on ignore or something if it bothers you that much. As a man, I'd rather be raped than be duped into raising someone else's child. So regardless of what you think, it is like rape for me, and for most men I'd guess.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> And I hardly see how raising a child who would love you and who you should love regardless of genetic material is tantamount to rape. Grow up.


Let's just stick women with any baby when they walk out of the maternity ward without making sure that it is actually hers. After all, the child would grow to love her regardless. :roll

You don't get to tell me how I should feel about things.


----------



## SylvanFox

heroin said:


> Past behaviour is indicative of character. If someone never valued their sexual partners enough and kept going through them like used underwear, the guy wouldn't expect her to value him any more and it's only a matter of time before she moves on to the next one, openly if he's lucky which will only cause him heartbreak, or covertly will likely stick him with someone else's child to raise.
> 
> It's not worth it.
> 
> You know that visceral disgust you get in the pit of your stomach when an unattractive man dares to look at you desirably that causes the immediate "ewwwwww!!!!" reaction and him being labelled a creep? I'm sure most women know what I'm talking about, even if few would acknowledge it. That's basically the kind of reaction that develops within a guy at the thought of building a relationship with a promiscuous woman.


So you consider me a sexist, yet you think all women are completely sickened by unattractive men? No, that's not sexist at all.

:roll


----------



## HackerZC

loquaciousintrovert said:


> I see. So the only thing men like about women is getting sex off of us.
> 
> That's why these men want "female friends" meaning women they can use for sex when they feel like it. Not friends who get the same respect as male friends, except they're women. Not a chance.
> 
> Re: SylvanFox: and for these reasons and many many others I am part of the women's liberation movement.


At it's core, yeah. That's what it's all about. 
Now there are a lot of other things guys enjoy about women, but ultimately it does come down to sex.

BTW, sex and respect are two different things.


----------



## Gatt

heroin said:


> Past behaviour is indicative of character. If someone never valued their sexual partners enough and kept going through them like used underwear, the guy wouldn't expect her to value him any more and it's only a matter of time before she moves on to the next one, openly if he's lucky which will only cause him heartbreak, or covertly will likely stick him with someone else's child to raise.


THIS, people judge you on the choices you make.


----------



## heroin

SylvanFox said:


> So you consider me a sexist, yet you think all women are completely sickened by unattractive men? No, that's not sexist at all.
> 
> :roll


They're not sickened by unattractive men. They are sickened by unattractive men showing sexual/romantic interest in them.

And I don't consider you a sexist. You are free to feel how you want and express it. I don't have a problem with it.


----------



## komorikun

heroin said:


> Past behaviour is indicative of character. If someone never valued their sexual partners enough and kept going through them like used underwear, the guy wouldn't expect her to value him any more and it's only a matter of time before she moves on to the next one, openly if he's lucky which will only cause him heartbreak, or covertly will likely stick him with someone else's child to raise.
> 
> It's not worth it.
> 
> You know that visceral disgust you get in the pit of your stomach when an unattractive man dares to look at you desirably that causes the immediate "ewwwwww!!!!" reaction and him being labelled a creep? I'm sure most women know what I'm talking about, even if few would acknowledge it. That's basically the kind of reaction that develops within a guy at the thought of building a relationship with a promiscuous woman.


Cheating on past partners might mean the person is more likely to cheat but I don't agree that being promiscuous in the past does. I don't get why someone who is promiscuous between relationships would value a long-term relationship any less than someone who was celibate between relationships. I strongly believe that that is a falsehood.


----------



## heroin

komorikun said:


> Cheating on past partners might mean the person is more likely to cheat but I don't agree that being promiscuous in the past does. I don't get why someone who is promiscuous between relationships would value a long-term relationship any less than someone who was celibate between relationships. I strongly believe that that is a falsehood.


Like I said, then the man would be lucky, since she'd at least afford him the courtesy of being dumped, which should only cause him heartbreak. But most men would rather not risk it. Especially since you said that as a promiscuous woman, you are open to lying about your sexual history to any prospective dude. If that is a common attitude, better safe than sorry. Not much good is going to come out of a relationship based on lies and subterfuge.


----------



## HackerZC

SylvanFox said:


> I didn't say that guys shouldn't be sexually attracted to women. But there should be more to it than that, at least a little more.


Oh there is, but sex seems to be really important for guys. And there is a lot to that. First is the whole "need to continue the species" primal thing. then you have to consider that guys just naturally express themselves more easily in a physical manner. 
I know I have this thing where I like to comfort and protect girls, but my first instinct isn't to tell them that and talk about it... my first instinct is to hold them. That's not something I learned from society or other guys or anything like that, it's just instinct.

For men it seems like physical comes before emotional, but for women it's emotional then physical. 
Mind you some guys are just *******s, and some women are *****es. So there are exceptions.


----------



## komorikun

heroin said:


> Like I said, then the man would be lucky, since she'd at least afford him the courtesy of being dumped, which should only cause him heartbreak. But most men would rather not risk it. Especially since you said that as a promiscuous woman, you are open to lying about your sexual history to any prospective dude. If that is a common attitude, better safe than sorry. Not much good is going to come out of a relationship based on lies and subterfuge.


I'd prefer not to lie, just better to have a don't ask, don't tell agreement. I don't think there is any point in knowing about your partner's sexual history. It only causes jealousy and bad feelings. I won't ask my partner's history (really don't want to know) and I won't tell him mine.


----------



## SylvanFox

heroin said:


> They're not sickened by unattractive men. They are sickened by unattractive men showing sexual/romantic interest in them.
> 
> And I don't consider you a sexist. You are free to feel how you want and express it. I don't have a problem with it.


I don't think every woman is sickened by unattractive men "looking." Sadly, I do know some that are that way. But what if those women behaved differently? Supposing they simply had sex with whoever was interested (and believe me, whereas those women act all aloof with unattractive men, they're like rabbits with men they actually like)? Would you still want her?

[email protected]
What I don't get is why men let themselves get all bent out of shape about having lots of partners. I mean themselves. Like, some of the guys on here who feel so awful about not having had sex, or having had only a few partners. The sex obsession hurts everybody, not just women. We humans, with hands and eyes and feet, are reduced to just one organ of importance.

It's just sickening. That's why I refuse to call myself a feminist until a parallel masculinist movement gets up and running. Men have to get _themselves_ out of that line of thinking before they can do anything about freeing up women. You're not a man until you've had sex with 80 people? You're not a man unless you pay for everything for your girlfriend? You're not a man if you have an emotional connection with a woman? You're not a man unless you can possess a woman utterly?

I don't get why that doesn't upset men at all. It's a bunch of truly silly expectations, but instead of questioning it, many men come to the conclusion that there's something horribly wrong with them, or that they're hopeless or whatever. They seem perfectly fine with being judged based on sex. Maybe it's also a man thing not to talk about it. I dunno. People play some crazy games, and meanwhile, we are mortal.


----------



## Ventura

Strippers just want attention ... as you say your dating 'anther' meaning it did not work out last time.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

heroin said:


> Feel free to put me on ignore or something if it bothers you that much. As a man, I'd rather be raped than be duped into raising someone else's child. So regardless of what you think, it is like rape for me, and for most men I'd guess.
> 
> Let's just stick women with any baby when they walk out of the maternity ward without making sure that it is actually hers. After all, the child would grow to love her regardless. :roll
> 
> You don't get to tell me how I should feel about things.


If you had even the slightest understanding of what rape was, you wouldn't DARE compare it to raising a child not genetically yours. Are you crazy?

I don't think you should speak for all men. You are a very young man without much experience in the world, and this colors your opinions. I've seen other things you've said here that are downright ridiculous.

Raising a child that the woman that you supposedly love gave birth to is not like sticking a woman with any child. There ARE men who have been with women who were pregnant with children that were biologically someone else's and loved the children as much as if they'd been the biological fathers. You might want to keep in mind that the person whose child it is is the one who raises the child, not the sperm/egg donor. Just because perhaps you are not capable of it doesn't mean no men are. There are men who can rise above ridiculous things like judging dancers, only wanting kids from their sperm, and watching porn. There are those men. They're rare, but they exist. Just because something is common doesn't mean it's right.

And I'm not telling you how to feel. It's clear that you will feel how you will regardless and my opinion means less than nothing to you. Good luck with that.


----------



## Pialicious88

MindOverMood said:


>


ROFL that was my s***


----------



## heroin

SylvanFox said:


> I don't think every woman is sickened by unattractive men "looking." Sadly, I do know some that are that way. But what if those women behaved differently? Supposing they simply had sex with whoever was interested (and believe me, whereas those women act all aloof with unattractive men, they're like rabbits with men they actually like)? Would you still want her?


That was an example of the internal feelings aroused. There is a difference between disinterest and disgust. I don't care to dictate to women what they must or mustn't do. They are free to do as they please.

I'd prefer partnering with someone who has shown genuine interest in building relationships in their past. A proper relationship takes time to build and doesn't leave one with the time to be sexually promiscuous. I wouldn't mind someone who has had sex every day for two years in their relationship, but I would if they did it with a number of partners.



SylvanFox said:


> What I don't get is why men let themselves get all bent out of shape about having lots of partners. I mean themselves. Like, some of the guys on here who feel so awful about not having had sex, or having had only a few partners. The sex obsession hurts everybody, not just women. We humans, with hands and eyes and feet, are reduced to just one organ of importance.


Because women find men who are sexually promiscuous and desired by other women very attractive. See the phenomenon of groupies. According to women, George Clowney, who has had a string of partners, is hot and a "real man" and they'd marry him in a heartbeat. While the dude that has never been laid in his life is pathetic and undesirable.



SylvanFox said:


> You're not a man until you've had sex with 80 people? You're not a man unless you pay for everything for your girlfriend? You're not a man if you have an emotional connection with a woman? You're not a man unless you can possess a woman utterly?


That's what women want. Women love someone who is desired by other women (groupies). They want someone who makes more money than them (to pay for stuff). They don't want someone who is "needy" and "clingy" (too emotional). Therefore, men compete with each other to be like that.



SylvanFox said:


> I don't get why that doesn't upset men at all. It's a bunch of truly silly expectations, but instead of questioning it, many men come to the conclusion that there's something horribly wrong with them, or that they're hopeless or whatever. They seem perfectly fine with being judged based on sex. Maybe it's also a man thing not to talk about it. I dunno. People play some crazy games, and meanwhile, we are mortal.


It does upset men, but like they say, you have to suck it up and "man up" and "take it like a man". Either they can ***** on a site like SAS about their lack of relationships, or deliver what women want to actually get a relationship.

Again, I'm not saying women have to change or whatever, they are free to do as they please. It's just better if both sexes understand each other and their options so they are better informed when making their choices.

FWIW, I am actually very, very different from the typical man that I describe here and my relationship with my girlfriend is not the "norm". So I'm not talking so much about myself as I am talking about what I see in general in heterosexual relationships. And you are free to reject whatever I say. I am just putting forth things from my perspective.


----------



## Miss Meggie

Whoa! I wouldn't even know where I'd start with this.
And SylvanFox, it doesn't sound as though you've met very many decent men. I'm sorry for that.


----------



## heroin

loquaciousintrovert said:


> If you had even the slightest understanding of what rape was, you wouldn't DARE compare it to raising a child not genetically yours. Are you crazy?


And as a woman, you have no understanding of what it is like to be duped and made to raise someone else's kid to adulthood.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> I don't think you should speak for all men.


I don't. I just explain things as I understand them. You (and other people, regardless of gender) are free to disagree.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> You are a very young man without much experience in the world, and this colors your opinions.


I'm older than you and have grown up relatively poor in an overpopulated third world country, and have had to compete with millions of other people for opportunities. I have more experience of the world than most people will ever have in their lives.

But if you mean experience regarding matters of love and sex, you're right. I've only had one partner.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> I've seen other things you've said here that are downright ridiculous.


I explain why I think the way I do and why I have certain opinions. I think that's a lot better than throwing around insults like "the things you say are ridiculous" and "grow up" and whatnot.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> Raising a child that the woman that you supposedly love gave birth to is not like sticking a woman with any child.


It is if you were duped into it. Why must the hospital ensure that the baby the woman walks out of the hospital with is hers, but few people care if the man worries about a child being his. You saying "it's nothing like sticking a woman with any baby" without any reasons for why it is not like that is not very convincing.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> There ARE men who have been with women who were pregnant with children that were biologically someone else's and loved the children as much as if they'd been the biological fathers.


In those cases they decide to raise the child of their own volition. They're not duped into it. I'm talking about cases where you are likely to be *duped* into raising a child not of your own.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> You might want to keep in mind that the person whose child it is is the one who raises the child, not the sperm/egg donor.


Then why not just give women leaving the maternity ward any random baby instead of making sure it's hers? If it doesn't matter who the egg donor is. I know you don't much care for the sperm donor.



loquaciousintrovert said:


> Just because perhaps you are not capable of it doesn't mean no men are. There are men who can rise above ridiculous things like judging dancers, only wanting kids from their sperm, and watching porn. There are those men. They're rare, but they exist. Just because something is common doesn't mean it's right.


I put forth proper *reasons* why men don't want to enter a relationship with dancers and are wary of being duped in cases of paternity. You not accepting it and making a pronouncement of how it is all "wrong" isn't going to change it. 
Good luck to you and the others who want to find men willing to be duped into raising another guy's kids. As you say, they are indeed rare.


----------



## komorikun

In the long run, these hypocritical ideas just screw over men as much as they do women. Women become more conservative for fear of being judged a "loose woman", making it just that much harder for guys to have sex. On top of that, ironically men end up in sexless marriages because they marry "good girls" who probably have low sex drives and therefore were never tempted to be promiscuous. Luckily society is more liberal now and if you live in a large city, men have no way of knowing your sexual past. A hundred years ago, women had to wait till they were married to have sex and men had to wait too or pay to have sex with prostitutes.


----------



## sanspants08

Ventura said:


> Strippers just want attention ... as you say your dating 'anther' meaning it did not work out last time.


Strippers certainly do like attention, but there's no basis for arguing that attention is all they want. I dated a stripper who certainly had a great deal of emotional depth, and wanted a real relationship. Things didn't work out between us, but that had nothing to do with her occupation.


----------



## Ventura

sanspants08 said:


> Strippers certainly do like attention, but there's no basis for arguing that attention is all they want. I dated a stripper who certainly had a great deal of emotional depth, and wanted a real relationship. Things didn't work out between us, but that had nothing to do with her occupation.


I'm just saying their has to be a reason.. why they are doing such an act, attention ... needing money (in that case the man is their suga daddy) or just seeking help. I am not saying a stripper can turn clean, I just think they aren't stable to date.


----------



## Cletis

OP:

Your post goes from dating a stripper to seeing unusual shapes and objects which is a sign of the distorted thinking patterns of schizophrenia.


----------



## GPU

> the girls are aggressive and tell me they like me...


there you go bro... IOW, they are more easy... although their intentions are only focused on one thing.

edit: they are like that to the next guy walking in. but if that's your thing, more power to you bro.


----------



## GotAnxiety

Be careful who you date alway's protect yourself, you can't really date someone who sleep's with everyone can you


----------



## SylvanFox

heroin said:


> I put forth proper *reasons* why men don't want to enter a relationship with dancers and are wary of being duped in cases of paternity. You not accepting it and making a pronouncement of how it is all "wrong" isn't going to change it.
> Good luck to you and the others who want to find men willing to be duped into raising another guy's kids. As you say, they are indeed rare.


How old are you, if you don't mind my asking?


----------



## heroin

SylvanFox said:


> How old are you, if you don't mind my asking?


29


----------



## SylvanFox

That's surprising.


----------



## Cletis

Strippers are great for one night stands but would you ever want to marry one?


----------



## diamondheart89

SylvanFox said:


> A whole slew of things- and I'm not hating on all men, but I do HATE the kind of men who say stuff like "Well, we want a loyal, devoted woman who cooks to bear our children".
> 
> Why? Because that doesn't work out. Because men who wanted a quiet, cooking brood mare beat the **** out of every single woman in my family and broke them. Because men who say stuff like that will NEVER really care about a woman. Because men with that attitude put pressure on one of my best male friends, leading him to ruin a great relationship with a girl he loved, for something he didn't even really care about just because that's what men are "supposed" to do. Too late, he tried to go back and fix the problem, but she is dead... Because a cooking, childbearing housewife broke an older friend of mine and now he's dying of depression and alcoholism. Because I actually have friends who are strippers. Because a my mom's boyfriend had some blonde girl over at my house when I was six and he beat the living **** out of me for asking him in front of my mom when she would be coming over again. Because a man called one of my closest friends while she was giving birth to his child to announce that she was an ugly ***** and he found a better girl than her, and he wanted a divorce. Because men always tell me that they just aren't complicated and emotional like women, and I like to prove them wrong by firing up their emotions. Because a guy told me that we weren't dating, that he wasn't interested in me, and then tried to strangle me at a party when I went on a date with somebody else. Because all the other men at that party thought that was okay, but called me a crazy ***** for knocking the crap out of the guy to get him off me. Because I lost my job when I showed up at work with bruises and finger marks on my neck.....
> 
> That list could go on forever (it's not just one guy- I've only met 3 exceptions out of at least 20 or 30 friends/family/etc I've been acquainted with over the years), but the real problem is this:
> 
> *I do not, nor will I ever, belong to anybody. I'm not property. I'm a person. Yet for some reason I'm expected to be owned. I'm supposed to eat, sleep, and breathe sexiness.* I've heard males on the opposite boards (the ones full of men complaining about how it's women's fault they have SA) complain about how some women are shallow and only care about looking pretty. Why do you think it's so important to them?
> 
> Nobody listens to an unpretty girl, not even other women. Not that I'm very bad-looking, but I refuse to put makeup on my face, and I refuse to spend $300 on a pair of shoes. I've been told repeatedly that this makes me "not a girl." Not a girl!* As if a girl's only function in life is to be pretty. *
> 
> ---And at work? Ha! I can't even offer an idea for the office at meetings. Everyone turns, looks at me, and then goes back to doing what they are doing. I have to just put my plans into motion without any feedback or permission. Then they say something like "This was a great idea, why didn't you bring it up at the meeting?" I'm the only female who even gets to come to meetings, and sometimes it seems like I'm only there to fun to the fridge and grab another coke when somebody runs out.
> 
> Except for 3 guys I know, anytime I am trying to hang out with a bunch of people and there are guys there, the girls are all silent, and the guys look at me funny if I say anything. This is the same basic principle as what's going on at work.
> 
> Now, as near as I can deduce, the major difference in attitudes between all those ***holes and my 3 good guy friends is this:
> 
> *The ***holes all believe that a woman should be loyal, but that "monogamy is unnatural" for men. They have a possessive attitude towards women.*
> 
> The 3 decent guys say that they want their wife/woman to be their best friend. They are all cheaters, but they don't demand a little faithful wifey in return for their infidelities. And they certainly don't demand virgin wives. You see the difference, here? Maybe it's just my imagination.


This.

If you want loyalty, purity, and faithfullness, be prepared to give it. Don't want an 'easy' girl? You sure as hell better not be easy yourself. How is it okay to sleep with a stripper or a hooker, but suddenly she's not good enough to be your gf or wife? This is a human being with feelings, that you're talking about. It disgusts me that people could USE someone for as a sextoy and then pretend that they are somehow morally superior to them. You are worse than the hooker if that's how you think. People who use other people as sex toys and then want to marry some pure, innocent, naive person disgust me. How hypocritical and nasty is that? I have no respect for anyone who upholds this double standard. If you don't RESPECT or LIKE someone, you shouldn't be having sex with them, period. Dehumanizing someone and deeming them unworthy even though you are participating in the actions you apparently disapprove of is just ridiculous and horrible.

This distinction some men and women have between mutual caring/respect and sex bothers me. It is unhealthy and the root of many problems in society. Sex should not be about using someone to 'score', or as a sexual object. This trend hurts both genders. It makes women mistrust and withold from men, and it makes men have a harder time with relationships. Also, I think it kind of ruins the act of sex by making it shameful and manipulative and impersonal. It shouldn't be that way.


----------



## Gatt

Cletis said:


> OP:
> 
> Your post goes from dating a stripper to seeing unusual shapes and objects which is a sign of the distorted thinking patterns of schizophrenia.


Nothing better than an internet diagnosis based on one post.


----------



## WalkingDisaster

SylvanFox said:


> If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything. But you're not. And you don't.


Why do you need to be a woman to feel used? I'm not a woman and I've felt incredibly used before. Not sexually, but in terms of people taking advantage in other ways, pretending they were friends with me in order to recieve favours. My friends using me as the butt of every single joke made.

So yes, I do know what it is like to be a "plaything." And it destroyed my self-esteem. Please think before you post massive generalisations next time.


----------



## WalkingDisaster

SylvanFox said:


> They seem perfectly fine with being judged based on sex.


No, the majority of men are not fine being judged based on sex or number of sexual partners. For example, a man who is intelligent and has many good qualities, but is a virgin. Does he want to be judged based on sex? Of course he doesn't. But he often is nonetheless.


----------



## WalkingDisaster

loquaciousintrovert said:


> There are men who can rise above ridiculous things like judging dancers, only wanting kids from their sperm, and watching porn. There are those men. They're rare, but they exist. Just because something is common doesn't mean it's right.


May I ask what's wrong with watching porn? If you're referring specifically to violent or degrading porn then I agree, but what's wrong with for example a couple having sex who decided to put their video up?


----------



## meganmila

Well I say that a lot of strippers are actually smart and know what they are doing, are not drug addicted, are not dirty. Yea maybe some are like that but that is like a huge stereotype. And I think they should have respect..they are human beings after all. I think it is kind of smart what they are doing:um


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

Juliette said:


> It's not rocket science. If you take your clothes off exposing your breasts, genitals and buttocks and dance provocatively in front of various strange men in a club you will be viewed as nothing more than a sex object.
> 
> A stripper's job is_ not_ like other jobs - the stripper is merely an attractive piece of meat who takes money from men for...stripping. And if you really expect strippers (or any type of sex worker) to deserve respect like female lawyers, doctors, etc then I think you're living in cloud cuckoo land 'cause it ain't gonna happen.


Believe me, it does happen. I am just one person who respects the profession. There are many people who give these women the respect they are deserving of. Sadly, you don't appear to be one of them. That's too bad.

You seem to reflect our society's unhealthy attitudes toward nudity and sexuality. That's sad.

There are women who dance are paying their way through advanced degrees, who have other "normal" jobs in addition to dancing (I actually read about a law graduate who danced after she was unable to find work as a lawyer). I would say, don't judge until you actually know them as people. Since you appear not to, I don't think you can judge. It's bad enough when men judge dancers, but when women do it it's just the saddest thing in the world to me.

P.S. The job is much more complicated than just taking clothes off. Saying that dancing is just taking clothes off is like saying my job as a cashier is just pushing buttons on a register. I have to deal with rude customers, angry customers, I have to play psychologist half the time, and sure don't get paid for that! My other jobs include psychologist, mind reader, waste management person, store inventory expert, complaint department personnel, and sometimes...gps. Yes, people expect me to tell them where this is or that is. And I don't get paid for all those jobs.

I have a huge amount of respect for dancers. So do many others. Please do not make the mistake of thinking your attitude is either acceptable or universal.


----------



## Huk phin

SylvanFox said:


> If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything.


I am ok with being a plaything!


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

Huk phin said:


> I am ok with being a plaything!


Having male privilege makes it easier to be okay with being a plaything. Women have been treated as objects for centuries, so for us it has different connotations.


----------



## jamesd

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Having male privilege makes it easier to be okay with being a plaything. Women have been treated as objects for centuries, so for us it has different connotations.


"Male privilege"....give me a break. This isn't the 19th century, get over it sweetheart. :roll


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

jamesd said:


> "Male privilege"....give me a break. This isn't the 19th century, get over it sweetheart. :roll


Ah, that's right. It's "better now."

One little problem: you're not in a position to make that judgment.

Also, you are calling me sweetheart...why, exactly?


----------



## jamesd

If anything women enjoy more perks and privileges than men do these days but no one coins a term like female privilege. It's pretty insulting to men that you even bring this antiquated term up.


----------



## sanspants08

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Believe me, it does happen. I am just one person who respects the profession. There are many people who give these women the respect they are deserving of. Sadly, you don't appear to be one of them. That's too bad.
> 
> You seem to reflect our society's unhealthy attitudes toward nudity and sexuality. That's sad.
> 
> There are women who dance are paying their way through advanced degrees, who have other "normal" jobs in addition to dancing (I actually read about a law graduate who danced after she was unable to find work as a lawyer). I would say, don't judge until you actually know them as people. Since you appear not to, I don't think you can judge. It's bad enough when men judge dancers, but when women do it it's just the saddest thing in the world to me.
> 
> P.S. The job is much more complicated than just taking clothes off. Saying that dancing is just taking clothes off is like saying my job as a cashier is just pushing buttons on a register. I have to deal with rude customers, angry customers, I have to play psychologist half the time, and sure don't get paid for that! My other jobs include psychologist, mind reader, waste management person, store inventory expert, complaint department personnel, and sometimes...gps. Yes, people expect me to tell them where this is or that is. And I don't get paid for all those jobs.
> 
> I have a huge amount of respect for dancers. So do many others. Please do not make the mistake of thinking your attitude is either acceptable or universal.


With another member on this board, dehiscence, I met two strippers with Masters' Degrees, at a diner in Baltimore. They'd come from Portland, OR, for their 5-year class reunion at Johns Hopkis. They started talking to us, just totally out of nowhere. They were talking about how they have to be actresses while on the job,because not everyone gives them positive attention on stage. They have their share of hecklers, regardless of how they look. It takes guts to be a stripper.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

sanspants08 said:


> With another member on this board, dehiscence, I met two strippers with Masters' Degrees, at a diner in Baltimore. They'd come from Portland, OR, for their 5-year class reunion at Johns Hopkis. They started talking to us, just totally out of nowhere. They were talking about how they have to be actresses while on the job,because not everyone gives them positive attention on stage. They have their share of hecklers, regardless of how they look. It takes guts to be a stripper.


It takes SO much strength, and courage, and I have so much respect for them and what they do.

Getting judged before anyone even knows you--yeah. It definitely takes strength. I get judged because I'm quiet and have SA...I know something about others judging me.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

jamesd said:


> If anything women enjoy more perks and privileges than men do these days but no one coins a term like female privilege. It's pretty insulting to men that you even bring this antiquated term up.


That's an interesting perspective. Thank you for taking the time to share it with us.


----------



## sanspants08

loquaciousintrovert said:


> It takes SO much strength, and courage, and I have so much respect for them and what they do.
> 
> Getting judged before anyone even knows you--yeah. It definitely takes strength. I get judged because I'm quiet and have SA...I know something about others judging me.


Talk about judgement--I think the dancers are hardest on one another. The knowledge that so-and-so will be ridiculing you for the size of your breasts, the expression on your face, and so on, throughout the day, makes it one of the most socially difficult work environments on the planet. Being able to shoulder that burden, the still put on a convincing stage show, must take an incredibly strong self of self.


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

It does. I know I could never do it. I would be in tears on a daily basis. I'm hardly strong enough to be a cashier. lol.


----------



## Phoenix Rising

opcorn


----------



## loquaciousintrovert

You're right--society may very well always remain that ignorant. Thanks for sharing your opinion.


----------



## Catherine Cavatica

SylvanFox said:


> A whole slew of things- and I'm not hating on all men, but I do HATE the kind of men who say stuff like "Well, we want a loyal, devoted woman who cooks to bear our children".
> 
> Why? Because that doesn't work out. Because men who wanted a quiet, cooking brood mare beat the **** out of every single woman in my family and broke them. Because men who say stuff like that will NEVER really care about a woman. Because men with that attitude put pressure on one of my best male friends, leading him to ruin a great relationship with a girl he loved, for something he didn't even really care about just because that's what men are "supposed" to do. Too late, he tried to go back and fix the problem, but she is dead... Because a cooking, childbearing housewife broke an older friend of mine and now he's dying of depression and alcoholism. Because I actually have friends who are strippers. Because a my mom's boyfriend had some blonde girl over at my house when I was six and he beat the living **** out of me for asking him in front of my mom when she would be coming over again. Because a man called one of my closest friends while she was giving birth to his child to announce that she was an ugly ***** and he found a better girl than her, and he wanted a divorce. Because men always tell me that they just aren't complicated and emotional like women, and I like to prove them wrong by firing up their emotions. Because a guy told me that we weren't dating, that he wasn't interested in me, and then tried to strangle me at a party when I went on a date with somebody else. Because all the other men at that party thought that was okay, but called me a crazy ***** for knocking the crap out of the guy to get him off me. Because I lost my job when I showed up at work with bruises and finger marks on my neck.....
> 
> That list could go on forever (it's not just one guy- I've only met 3 exceptions out of at least 20 or 30 friends/family/etc I've been acquainted with over the years), but the real problem is this:
> 
> I do not, nor will I ever, belong to anybody. I'm not property. I'm a person. Yet for some reason I'm expected to be owned. I'm supposed to eat, sleep, and breathe sexiness. I've heard males on the opposite boards (the ones full of men complaining about how it's women's fault they have SA) complain about how some women are shallow and only care about looking pretty. Why do you think it's so important to them?
> 
> Nobody listens to an unpretty girl, not even other women. Not that I'm very bad-looking, but I refuse to put makeup on my face, and I refuse to spend $300 on a pair of shoes. I've been told repeatedly that this makes me "not a girl." Not a girl! As if a girl's only function in life is to be pretty.
> 
> ---And at work? Ha! I can't even offer an idea for the office at meetings. Everyone turns, looks at me, and then goes back to doing what they are doing. I have to just put my plans into motion without any feedback or permission. Then they say something like "This was a great idea, why didn't you bring it up at the meeting?" I'm the only female who even gets to come to meetings, and sometimes it seems like I'm only there to fun to the fridge and grab another coke when somebody runs out.
> 
> Except for 3 guys I know, anytime I am trying to hang out with a bunch of people and there are guys there, the girls are all silent, and the guys look at me funny if I say anything. This is the same basic principle as what's going on at work.
> 
> Now, as near as I can deduce, the major difference in attitudes between all those ***holes and my 3 good guy friends is this:
> 
> The ***holes all believe that a woman should be loyal, but that "monogamy is unnatural" for men. They have a possessive attitude towards women.
> 
> The 3 decent guys say that they want their wife/woman to be their best friend. They are all cheaters, but they don't demand a little faithful wifey in return for their infidelities. And they certainly don't demand virgin wives. You see the difference, here? Maybe it's just my imagination.


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I entirely agree with you, mate. And I can totally see where you are coming from


----------



## Catherine Cavatica

SylvanFox said:


> Unnecessary hate? Cry me a river.
> 
> If you had half a brain, you could see the part where it says PREJUDICE INTENDED FOR PURPOSES OF IRONY.
> 
> You really think you can just talk about strippers/hookers/women as if they weren't even human, and then you get offended by a sarcastic retelling of my own life experience?
> 
> You're just dying for some reason to be offended, aren't you? There's always a lot of that on this site. Everybody needs to be a victim.
> 
> I have the balls to say something to ridiculously judgmental people. And no, I will NOT be nice to someone who thinks that they have the right to declare someone else inhuman and inferior. I've tried that. You know what that's called, when somebody steps on your toes and you apologize for standing?
> 
> I think I've heard people refer to that as SOCIAL ANXIETY. Which, by the way, is something we are supposed to be here to get over, not to molly-coddle each other and make each other feel like we are justified in every thought.
> 
> If you were a woman, you might understand what it's like to be considered nothing but a plaything. But you're not. And you don't.


^^^^^^^^^

:clap :clap


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## anthrotex

I knew someone who was in a long-term relationship with a stripper. They got stabbed with a kitchen knife.


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## Catherine Cavatica

loquaciousintrovert said:


> I see. So the only thing men like about women is getting sex off of us.
> 
> That's why these men want "female friends" meaning women they can use for sex when they feel like it. Not friends who get the same respect as male friends, except they're women. Not a chance.
> 
> Re: SylvanFox: and for these reasons and many many others I am part of the women's liberation movement.


^^^^^^^^^
Awesome, hun Can I join, too! I'm sick of constantly feeling like we women are just on this earth to be playthings for men.:mum

We deserve RESPECT!!! And have many wonderful things to offer the world besides being around just for men to ogle us!!!


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## Miss Meggie

I have never once felt like a man's plaything before. What am I doing wrong?


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## Catherine Cavatica

What I've always hated is that after a man has had sex with a woman, he can take the condom off or wash his **** , and he is "clean" again.

After a woman has sex she can try and wash herself out with certain female hygeine products however, the man has been INSIDE her.

I've felt this before and in certain circumstances I've felt so dirty and ashamed. So depressed to the point of.... well major depression.

I've been through a lot of sexual, physical and mental abuse from men
that has damaged me.

I don't hate all men. But I would love to find a genuine, kind hearted, loyal, nice looking, man.


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## Miss Meggie

Catherine Cavatica said:


> I've been through a lot of sexual, physical and mental abuse from men that has damaged me.
> 
> But I would love to find a genuine, kind hearted, loyal, nice looking, man.


I am truly sorry for that.
And I hope that you do find that man someday.


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## Catherine Cavatica

thanks, mate.


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## ohgodits2014

> People who use other people as sex toys and then want to marry some pure, innocent, naive person disgust me.


+1

I'm okay with people who want to marry someone "pure" if they themselves are pure (and preferably by choice, not because they can't get anyone to sleep with them), but I'm not okay with people who say things like



> Strippers are great for one night stands but would you ever want to marry one?


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## loquaciousintrovert

Yeah, men who are not virgins saying "I want a woman to be a virgin" is just complete hypocrisy. When I call them out they say "women are SUPPOSED to stay virgins! I can **** whoever I want because I'm a MAN."


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## Noca

strippers are hot! way to go man!


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## ryobi

I don't know going to a strip club or watching porn and then judging people who work in those industries seems hypocritical


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## ryobi

komorikun said:


> In the long run, these hypocritical ideas just screw over men as much as they do women. Women become more conservative for fear of being judged a "loose woman", making it just that much harder for guys to have sex. On top of that, ironically men end up in sexless marriages because they marry "good girls" who probably have low sex drives and therefore were never tempted to be promiscuous.


This^


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## identitycrisis

loquaciousintrovert said:


> Yeah, men who are not virgins saying "I want a woman to be a virgin" is just complete hypocrisy. When I call them out they say "women are SUPPOSED to stay virgins! I can **** whoever I want because I'm a MAN."


Where are you finding these men? The sewers? Saturn? I've never heard a guy talk like this except in jest.

The problem is with the culture we (yes, WE) built. A man who has a lot of sexual partners is a "player". A woman who has a lot of sexual partners is a "****". People end up believing this not because they think it's right, but because that's how people talk. It's not ok, it should be changed, but that's the way it is right now.

Just because you may have been disrespected by men doesn't mean all men are disrespectful. Just because a woman is a stripper doesn't mean she's promiscuous. This should all go without saying, as it's pretty sound logic, and yet this thread is full of posts like "all men think women are objects" and "lol strippers are hot". I feel silly even posting this because it won't change anyone's mind about anything (see previous paragraph about culture).


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## Miss Meggie

identitycrisis said:


> Just because you may have been disrespected by men doesn't mean all men are disrespectful. Just because a woman is a stripper doesn't mean she's promiscuous. This should all go without saying, as it's pretty sound logic, and yet this thread is full of posts like "all men think women are objects" and "lol strippers are hot". I feel silly even posting this because it won't change anyone's mind about anything (see previous paragraph about culture).


Exactly.


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## thissillygirl

I am a stripper
and a good girl lol
I wouldn't date a costomer 
perhaps u actually have something to say.
you are interesting!
or these ladies are just sleezy unless you know they're not
The ladies at the bar are usually not.ladies u want. Ladies in a strip club can actually be different.
If they're sober and u actually do get to know them and they're not taking advantage of you then run with it! 
Because to be.honest I'm not ur typical sleezy stripper. (I've been with two men and I'm 20) (we'll say 5 LBJ's in my life and 2sexual partners actually) 
Some girls who.are there are actually just trying to get ahead.
please respond to mine of you can!  there's nothing wrong.g with this unless u think so!


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