# which will you choose!



## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

:teeth time of truth... let's take this poll for 7 days to conclude! Hahaha... only 1 choice per user so... be honest!

P/S: This is a choice, not a debate. Just choose! Hahaha


The blue pill, or the red pill? 









1. Ugly, fat and confident!
2. Pretty, Handsome, Good Looking, Attractive... and full of anxiety.


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## Jesuszilla (May 26, 2013)

Good looking because anxiety can be worked on.


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## PaintItBlack (May 9, 2013)

Jesuszilla said:


> Good looking because anxiety can be worked on.


This.


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## IAmDisappoint (Oct 9, 2013)




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## TobeyJuarez (May 16, 2012)

cant function normally in society if your an anxious wreck... fat and ugly + confident anyday


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

IAmDisappoint said:


>


I agree. This thread is nothing sustainable. No deep debates no deep philosophy.

It's purely just a choice! 

Often we think too much about a simple question. The choice we take will be the obvious and most reliable answer to whatever questions or debates that precedes the answer.

Will you take the blue pill, or the red pill?

It's that simple. It boils down to, which path will you take in the end? The journey isn't what matters now, it's the destination. :teeth


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## tehuti88 (Jun 19, 2005)

I chose fat, ugly, and full of confident (sic), because I'm already basically the first two and they don't cause me much trouble, but I could really do without the stupid anxiety (which I have worked on for years, and have gotten nothing but worse).


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## Kalliber (Aug 18, 2012)

The first one


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## aGenericUsername (Apr 7, 2013)

If you're good looking, you're life is 10000x times better than if you're not. It's a superficial culture we live in. If you are shy and good looking it will be viewed as cute. If you are fat, ugly and confident you will be seen as annoying


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## Nono441 (May 14, 2012)

I don't like fat and ugly, and I prefer the company of anxious people. What was the question again?


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## PaintItBlack (May 9, 2013)

ffslol said:


> wow i can't believe some people actually chose the first option


Those people are probably attractive and they have no idea whats it like to be ugly, or they are one of those people who actually believe confidence is more important than looks lol.
Anyway, being attractive is 1000 times better than being ugly, even attractive with SA is still better than normal ugly person without SA.


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## StarDude (May 29, 2011)

Handsome because you can as confident as you want but if you're ugly no one will want you and your confidence just comes off as cocky.


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## Tommywang (Oct 20, 2013)

PaintItBlack said:


> Those people are probably attractive and they have no idea whats it like to be ugly, or they are one of those people who actually believe confidence is more important than looks lol.
> Anyway, being attractive is 1000 times better than being ugly, even attractive with SA is still better than normal ugly person without SA.


Sigh life is not fair. everyone wants pretty or handsome. Even me, as an average person.


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## Parsnip (Sep 5, 2013)

This entire thread confused me. I have no idea what's going on.

Either way, fat ugly and confident remains my favourite choice.

I'd rather be confident enough to tell people to go swivel if they feel my physical appearance undermines who I am as a person, than so anxious it doesn't matter that I'm attractive because any perceived bonuses would be undermined by that anxiety.

Personally I'm not sure there are any benefits to being attractive that are so great that I'd want to keep anxiety around. My anxiety can be crippling, it prevents me from living, and regardless of how physically attractive people perceive me to be if I'm too anxious to live then any perceived ease I'd have as an attractive person is negated by the complications of trying to get through life without sitting in a corner crying.


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## Nekomata (Feb 3, 2012)

The second one~


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## Milkman (Apr 19, 2013)

Pretty, Handsome, Attractive, Good Looking and full of confidence.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

aGenericUsername said:


> If you're good looking, you're life is 10000x times better than if you're not. It's a superficial culture we live in. If you are shy and good looking it will be viewed as cute. If you are fat, ugly and confident you will be seen as annoying


Hahaha! spot on bro!

When you're good looking... even when you walk on a banana skin and fell you still look cute haha. :clap

My own opinion is that, being good look is less hardwork, while getting the same or more perks.

Look, if you are good looking, people are willing to suck up to u, bring things to u, give u things just because you're eye candy to be with.

But being ugly, you have to do some work in everywhere you go before people treats you good. you need to be nice to people, act confidently before people feels your aura.

In anyway......... there are jobs only pretty people can do. But there are no jobs only ugly people can do. Simple as that.


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## Imbored21 (Jun 18, 2012)

If it didn't say *FAT*, I would chose ugly and confident. Too bad fat is just gross. I have to choose good looking+ anxiety. O wait I have that and it sucks. O well I'm better than a fat person.


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## Douhnut77 (Jun 6, 2013)

Before I got SA I was (skinny) and ugly, very ugly. But I was confident and outgoing and made a **** ton of friends. After getting SA I did alot to improve my appearance. Now I'm considered "attractive" I guess, but with my social anxiety my life became hell. I was sooooo much happier when I was ugly and confident and actually had a life, girlfriends, etc. 

Its strange how this works and its very counter intuitive, but there's alot of truth in that looks aren't the single most important aspect in life. Its really something you have to experience for your self in order to actually understand.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

Imbored21 said:


> If it didn't say *FAT*, I would chose ugly and confident. Too bad fat is just gross. I have to choose good looking+ anxiety. O wait I have that and it sucks. O well I'm better than a fat person.


Ha ha! Hi beautiful people! :b


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

Douhnut77 said:


> Before I got SA I was (skinny) and ugly, very ugly. But I was confident and outgoing and made a **** ton of friends. After getting SA I did alot to improve my appearance. Now I'm considered "attractive" I guess, but with my social anxiety my life became hell. I was sooooo much happier when I was ugly and confident and actually had a life, girlfriends, etc.
> 
> Its strange how this works and its very counter intuitive, but there's alot of truth in that looks aren't the single most important aspect in life. Its really something you have to experience for your self in order to actually understand.


Sounds legit if this comes from your own experience. Thank you for your input


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## fire mage64 (Jun 20, 2011)

I choose the second option because like someone else said, anxiety can be reduced. If I'm overweight I'll be unhealthy and there will always be certain activities I couldn't do. Losing the weight could lead to even more confidence but it would require an intense workout. As for being ugly... I think that's subjective. Whose to say what is and is not unattractive?


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## angrychair (Oct 20, 2013)

I choose the first option. I can lose the weight and gain even more confidence. Anxiety can be worked on too, but I wouldn't want to have it in the first place, and I think it'd be harder to get rid of than the weight.


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## angrychair (Oct 20, 2013)

Confidence also allows you more freedom to try new things and meet new people, ugly or not you can still enjoy life if you're confident. Anxiety on the other hand just holds you back, people may be interested in you on a physical level, but if you're too nervous to talk to them what's the point?


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## TheAceInTheHole (Jan 10, 2013)

angrychair said:


> Confidence also allows you more freedom to try new things and meet new people, ugly or not you can still enjoy life if you're confident. Anxiety on the other hand just holds you back, people may be interested in you on a physical level, but if you're too nervous to talk to them what's the point?


This.

Plus, if I was fat and confident, I would just start working out and lose all the weight. I would already have the motivation to start working out and I would be confident that I would lose the weight in no time.

So at the end of the day, I would be good looking and confident.

So I win!


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

likeaspacemonkey said:


> Exactly. I'm not sure what people are thinking. It's a pretty obvious choice. It's "look good and feel like ****" or "look like **** and feel good". Feel good, yeah, please, feel good. It's a dumb ****ing premise in the first place, but I'm amazed at the results.


Results are often the most reliable answer you can get.

After all the said and done, all the debates and how deep philosophically people can go in such issue, the result is the most reliable evidence to what you can get.

It seriously is always only just about the red pill or the blue pill (if you watch the matrix).

It's the same as how some people can go all round about how money is the root of all evil. But in the end, everyone wants money.

But let's not conclude the poll yet. few more days till the poll ends.


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## farfegnugen (Aug 16, 2010)

Fat and ugly with social anxiety. I like a good challenge.


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## Parsnip (Sep 5, 2013)

Flace said:


> Results are often the most reliable answer you can get.
> 
> After all the said and done, all the debates and how deep philosophically people can go in such issue, the result is the most reliable evidence to what you can get.
> 
> ...


Even more reliable is to look at the demographics of respondents, plus their expectations of what life would be like with their selected option. Even better would be to look into their perceptions of attractiveness, including the influences they've had in developing these perceptions.

Results alone are unreliable, numbers can be shown to represent anything from the fact society places a greater emphasis on physical attractiveness than contentment in your own skin to how people with low self esteem/who believe themselves to be unattractive desire to be attractive above anything else. However if you group the respondents explanation of their answer thematically, it could be very interesting indeed. Maybe it would still come up with how the majority value attractiveness over confidence, but you'd have a wealth of background knowledge upon which to base your conclusions, which is always fabulous.


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## Charmander (Sep 5, 2012)

Imbored21 said:


> If it didn't say *FAT*, I would chose ugly and confident. Too bad fat is just gross. I have to choose good looking+ anxiety. O wait I have that and it sucks. O well I'm better than a fat person.


At least you'd be able to lose the weight.

I'd rather be ugly and confident. Looks can fade anyway. I'd want to be happy and confident in myself.


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## zomgz (Aug 17, 2009)

I used to think this forum was about anxiety. I was so wrong.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

Will the tide turn?

More votes people! :clap


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## IAmDisappoint (Oct 9, 2013)

zomgz said:


> I used to think this forum was about anxiety. I was so wrong.


Just think of the Frustration and Frustration>Dating section as a different forum from SAS altogether. More than half the posts here are just the same people beating on the same dead topics in a vulgar manner.

I don't mind listening and lending an ear to someone's problems, but it's just lame when the thread is attacking a group of people in a toxic manner.


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## tehuti88 (Jun 19, 2005)

PaintItBlack said:


> Those people are probably attractive and they have no idea whats it like to be ugly, or they are one of those people who actually believe confidence is more important than looks lol.


You seem to like assuming what the people who disagree with your opinion are going through. This isn't the first post where you've done this. :| I guess you didn't see my response...



tehuti88 said:


> I chose fat, ugly, and full of confident (sic), because I'm already basically the first two and they don't cause me much trouble, but I could really do without the stupid anxiety (which I have worked on for years, and have gotten nothing but worse).


...where I basically negate the claim you just made about who chose option 1. And I'm not the only one.

I'm not making snap judgements/misassumptions about everyone who chose option 2. Though I could, if I _really_ wanted to (and if I was that rude).



Parsnip said:


> Either way, fat ugly and confident remains my favourite choice.
> 
> I'd rather be confident enough to tell people to go swivel if they feel my physical appearance undermines who I am as a person, than *so anxious it doesn't matter that I'm attractive because any perceived bonuses would be undermined by that anxiety*.
> 
> Personally I'm not sure there are any benefits to being attractive that are so great that I'd want to keep anxiety around. *My anxiety can be crippling, it prevents me from living, and regardless of how physically attractive people perceive me to be if I'm too anxious to live then any perceived ease I'd have as an attractive person is negated by the complications of trying to get through life without sitting in a corner crying*.





angrychair said:


> Confidence also allows you more freedom to try new things and meet new people, ugly or not you can still enjoy life if you're confident. *Anxiety on the other hand just holds you back, people may be interested in you on a physical level, but if you're too nervous to talk to them what's the point?*


Exactly (except I'm not attractive, but even if I were, in my case it wouldn't matter, *I'd be too miserable to make any use of it*).

_I *could* sit here and claim that those who chose to be attractive with anxiety don't REALLY know what bad anxiety is like, surely their anxiety is minor and is nothing compared to mine, surely if they knew REAL anxiety they wouldn't choose to have it_...but I won't because I really can't know that, and it'd be rude, plus it's against site rules. And I honestly don't believe that anyway; I know how many people here struggle seriously and have dealt with lots of trouble due to their looks. So...why some people are judging those who chose to be ugly without anxiety, especially if we have experiences that back this decision up, I have no clue. The narrowmindedness on this site amazes me sometimes. I get the ironic feeling that we place more emphasis on looks than "normal" people do.

...

People on this site go on and on about how society places too much emphasis on looks and how shallow and wrong that is...but whenever those of us who _don't_ place all the value on looks bother to speak up, we're ridiculed and disbelieved. Why is that? :|


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## IAmDisappoint (Oct 9, 2013)

tehuti88 said:


> People on this site go on and on about how society places too much emphasis on looks and how shallow and wrong that is...but whenever those of us who _don't_ place all the value on looks bother to speak up, we're ridiculed and disbelieved. Why is that? :|


Because you're a heretic.

Burn her!


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## zomgz (Aug 17, 2009)

IAmDisappoint said:


> Because you're a heretic.
> 
> Burn her!


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## satyrinath (Jun 19, 2013)

If the fat and ugly person is confident they won't remain confident in the long run. Their self-esteem will be gradually beaten down by other people unless they change their physical appearance which is unlikely. Most people are too superficial for an ugly and fat person to remain confident.


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## tehuti88 (Jun 19, 2005)

IAmDisappoint said:


> Because you're a heretic.
> 
> Burn her!





zomgz said:


>


Oh you two. :b  :twisted


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## shycheese (Mar 15, 2013)

I choose fat, ugly and confident. I've been down the fat and ugly road, didn't affect me that much. All it takes is exercise and a bit of vanity to get over that hump. There's no magic cure for lack of confidence though. :blank


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## RelinquishedHell (Apr 10, 2012)

Ugly and confident. When you have a lot of confidence regardless of your looks, you can get pretty much whatever you want out of life. I've seen it.

I work with a guy who is overweight and unfortunate looking, but he is incredibly witty, funny, and overly confident. Everyone wants to be his friend and all the girls like him. He also has an extremely hot girlfriend.


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## Twelve Keyz (Aug 28, 2011)

it's actually a hard choice.


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## PaintItBlack (May 9, 2013)

+ biggest confidence in the world
or







+ SA

No idea who they are, just picked random pic from google.

Some people confuse average looking with ugly, It's not same, now tell me you would choose first option.
Yes you can workout and lose weight but you still have same ugly face, whats the point.

Im just sayin people will always treat you better if you are pretty, and you will get things easier, even with SA. 
If you truly are ugly, people will make sure they tell u that and show u that.
Also I know some people care about confidence, but truth is most of them dont, if they see that u r ugly, they wont even give u chance to show your personality.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

PaintItBlack said:


> + biggest confidence in the world
> or
> 
> 
> ...


I agree with you. Most people confused being average looking and ugliness. Most people aren't ugly anyway. Average at best.

I have been average... or rather a little ugly for most of the time in my life. And fat too. Trust me... there is zero hope in any of that. People don't go, hey fatty show me your personality or let's get to know this fatty. Rather than just leaving you alone, people would pick on you, showing you disdain and make fun of you infront of everybody (so to make themselves raise higher than you, in another word you are their stool for climbing up the ladder). While i have seen beautiful people who are shy... having people teasing them for being shy and then go on to invite them to all sorts of things which later on lead to them being not shy anymore and opened up.

Ask any psychologist or early childhood educators. Can a child grow up normally, be full of confident when he is fat and u ugly and teased all day long? Honestly up to 8/10 cases of fat and ugly people i observed in my life turn out to be exactly the type you would expect to be. Only 2/10 turn up to be the ugly and confident.

Yes maybe possible if you come from a rich family or a family with power in your neighbourhood. People don't mess with you and their kids don't. Or miraculously you have got an even uglier friend for the rest of the class to pick on rather than you.


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## Staticnz (Mar 25, 2013)

likeaspacemonkey said:


> The premise is broken.


Yup. Cos neither option really tells you what kind of person they are. What if they are fat and confident, but super obnoxious, annoying and unlikeable!?


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

Jesuszilla said:


> Good looking because anxiety can be worked on.


I'll take fat and ugly. Weight can be lost, and I hear that most guys don't look at a female's face, anyways.

Plus, confident people seem to think they're attractive regardless of how physically unattractive they may actually be.


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## DepressedOrange (Oct 3, 2013)

Somehow i always managed to make friends with the "Popular" or attractive then you get older  probably has to do something with me being a true stoner and everyone of them smokes..

Know a guy he makes ladies, he makes friends, adults love him (Im talking about mothers) hes phone is always ringing and he can get ***** if he want just by calling one time. Hes a very extroverted guy, but he always is on 110% everyday. Something i just couldn't live with, i need my own space to "recharge"

Point is im already chubby. So ugly and fat and full of confidence would be my choice, as i know people too who are much bigger than me, and who are full of confidence, yeah they get ladies and plenty of sex too. Those guys who can make a girl laugh and make fun of themself, that's the guys who will do best social.

I love making fun and getitng people to laugh it's just very rewarding, I don't mind making fun of myself, or find sonmething stupid to say because 99% of the time they laugh with me and not of me. Sometimes i had people come over to me and say "Arhh you're fine G just give a call" And i never call and they call me and say to come over and i get to learn new people  So fat and ugly. And confidence for me


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## tehuti88 (Jun 19, 2005)

PaintItBlack said:


> + biggest confidence in the world
> or
> 
> 
> ...


And I'm just saying that *some people, because of their different experiences, would choose differently from you*. What about that is so difficult to understand?

I have *severe SA*. So bad that I'm disabled, on government benefits, and cannot work. I can never look people in the eye, I can barely handle the phone, even replying to a simple short e-mail from a friend sends me into a panic. So no matter how frigging _good looking_ I would happen to be it would not matter. I'd still be *a hopeless helpless shut-in with no social or romantic life to speak of*. If I were good looking at least people would get to know my personality?--I really don't think so, considering I'd be *a shut-in with virtually no human contact*.

If I had confidence/no SA, hey, maybe guys still wouldn't give me any attention, maybe I'd get passed over for certain things in favor of the more good-looking person. _But at least I'd believe in myself enough to actually TRY succeeding at something._ And maybe I wouldn't, you know, wake up every day wishing I were dead. (Yeah--I have some considerably bigger problems than my looks and being a little bit shy.)

I'm speaking from personal experience. The past *25 years of utter misery and self-loathing and loneliness and wanting to die*. You'd so easily brush that off? Nice try, but not good enough.

If that girl at the top had the confidence and self-belief I so badly long for, then hell yeah would I choose to be her. And no, I'm not lying. Like I said--I have *25 years of misery and loneliness* to back me up. I'm pretty damn sure what I'd choose, and it's not what you would choose.

I'm not questioning the validity of your decision, what's so hard to believe about mine?

(PS--lady in the second pic is likely heavily airbrushed.)

God, it never fails to amaze me how people on forums argue against personal opinions/preferences like it's so damn difficult to believe anyone could think differently!


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## starsonfire (May 28, 2013)

Neither. I want someone inbetween the two extremes. Confident, but not full of herself. Doesn't have to be good-looking, but not ugly either. Why be in an undesirable relationship anyway? It's not going to make you happier.


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## Jesuszilla (May 26, 2013)

Raeden said:


> I'll take fat and ugly. Weight can be lost, and I hear that most guys don't look at a female's face, anyways.
> 
> Plus, confident people seem to think they're attractive regardless of how physically unattractive they may actually be.


Well this question is stupid then because both weight and anxiety can be worked on then.

I think people care more about the face than the body though


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## starsonfire (May 28, 2013)

likeaspacemonkey said:


> No. You *HAVE TO CHOOSE!*


I choose to be alone then.


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## milo001 (Nov 26, 2008)

Hard to choose but peoples who are fat and ugly usually had low self esteem issues as well. So I rather be the good looking one.


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## hammerfast (Mar 8, 2012)

pretty , lean , etc . etc.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

tehuti88 said:


> And I'm just saying that *some people, because of their different experiences, would choose differently from you*. What about that is so difficult to understand?
> 
> I have *severe SA*. So bad that I'm disabled, on government benefits, and cannot work. I can never look people in the eye, I can barely handle the phone, even replying to a simple short e-mail from a friend sends me into a panic. So no matter how frigging _good looking_ I would happen to be it would not matter. I'd still be *a hopeless helpless shut-in with no social or romantic life to speak of*. If I were good looking at least people would get to know my personality?--I really don't think so, considering I'd be *a shut-in with virtually no human contact*.
> 
> ...


You mentioned the pain and suffering for the past 25 years. May i ask... after so long, have you sort of realize what is the root of your SA? What is it that's causing your anxiety?


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## PaintItBlack (May 9, 2013)

tehuti88 said:


> And I'm just saying that *some people, because of their different experiences, would choose differently from you*. What about that is so difficult to understand?
> 
> I have *severe SA*. So bad that I'm disabled, on government benefits, and cannot work. I can never look people in the eye, I can barely handle the phone, even replying to a simple short e-mail from a friend sends me into a panic. So no matter how frigging _good looking_ I would happen to be it would not matter. I'd still be *a hopeless helpless shut-in with no social or romantic life to speak of*. If I were good looking at least people would get to know my personality?--I really don't think so, considering I'd be *a shut-in with virtually no human contact*.
> 
> ...


If you looked like girl in first pic and had biggest confidence in the world, you would still be bullied and made fun of, in school, street, anywhere u go.
People are mean, and if they think that you are ugly or dont fit in, they will make sure to tell you and show you that.
There is still chance you would have depression or maybe that you would get SA from all dat bullying . 
You could workout and lose weight but like I said you would still have ugly face.
People who look much much better than her get bullied and made fun of, you can only imagine whats is like for her then?

If person is really ugly (not bdd) then that person knows that in todays society there is no worse thing than being ugly, you will get treated worse, made fun on, bullied, and guess what when you are truly ugly (not average looking) people dont give a **** about your confidence or personality, they will bully you and make fun of you.
Like knowing that you are ugly and will have worse life is not enough, they have to make it even worse by showing you that every day and everywhere you go.

Like someone already said most of people are average looking or attractive so they have no idea whats it like to be truly ugly, not have bdd but being truly ugly.
When someone with good looks or thats average makes post and says I was ugly and had no confidence no gf no anything, and now i got confidence and I'm attractive all of the sudden, well guess what you thought you are ugly, you were not really ugly, not same thing.
If you were really ugly and everybody told and show you that, then confidence wouldn't change a thing.
You can see a lot of confident ugly people and they still have ****ty lives and were bullied, so confidence wont change a thing.
I believe in God, but it annoys me when people say, nobody is ugly, God loves us all, God made u beautiful, well guess what, problem is not God, problem are people here on Earth.

If you looked like girl in second pic, yes you would have sa, but maybe you would have normal sa, not really bad sa, and your looks would help you a lot in life.
There is chance you would get rid of sa, because people would treat u better and always said nice things to you, how cute, pretty, hot or whatever you are.
You would realise that sa is your only problem, and work on it much more.
You would get treated much much better in school, street, job, and in life, even with sa.

Also when you are pretty and quiet, people assume you are shy and leave you alone, when you are ugly and quiet, people assume you are weird, and bully you or something, wont leave you alone.

I could type much more, but even this is typed now is enough or even too much so...


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

PaintItBlack said:


> If you looked like girl in first pic and had biggest confidence in the world, you would still be bullied and made fun of, in school, street, anywhere u go.
> People are mean, and if they think that you are ugly or dont fit in, they will make sure to tell you and show you that.
> There is still chance you would have depression or maybe that you would get SA from all dat bullying .
> You could workout and lose weight but like I said you would still have ugly face.
> ...


Spot on.

Anxiety often are usually connected to how one look, or rather how one perceive him or herself to be. Just look in this forum alone... how many thread do you see starts with "i am ugly... "?

We could take a look from another viewpoint... let's ask these people who are "ugly and confident..." ..... has they ever at some point of their confident life, wished they were good looking and everything would be perfect already?

The cold hard truth is, anxiety and confidence can be changed. But looks often, can't be altered. A confident and ugly person has nothing to do except just bite hard, and brave through everyday life being confident. Because being confident is his only way to survive in this world.

On the other hand, a good looking person with anxiety, can get his anxiety fixed one day and his looks is still there. And often good looking people get pass such obstacles easier because they could get what they want (Getting laid whatever) easily. But once if the ugly and confident slip, and lost his confidence, everything is over.

I used to know a girl... which later i got to know that she has anxiety too. But she gets the most rich and handsome boyfriends, without a lack of suitors... and guys that basically just buzz around her like flies. And these guys tend to always find ways to cheer her up through her unhappy days.

Tell me... on a bad day where an ugly and confident person become sad and emo... who will be there to cheer him or her up? Aside from family and friends.


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## green9206 (May 13, 2013)

The second one.


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## brittanyrl (Oct 16, 2013)

I'm extremely anxious all of the time so I need someone confident to balance that out for me!


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## tehuti88 (Jun 19, 2005)

Ugh, this will be long, and probably a waste of my time... :roll



Flace said:


> You mentioned the pain and suffering for the past 25 years. May i ask... after so long, have you sort of realize what is the root of your SA? What is it that's causing your anxiety?


Being shy and sensitive to start with, then dealing with years of repeated rejection/ignoring/criticism from my peers. I've been teased a little about my looks, but never seriously, so even though I'm unattractive that has relatively little to do with my anxiety. I have a far greater problem with feeling like expressing myself bores or annoys other people, since that's the reaction I've usually faced. Frequently people have reacted with boredom, irritation, or outright telling me to shut up when I tried expressing myself, so I learned to withdraw.

For the record, in case it's been misunderstood, I'm *not* saying looks never matter or that nobody really has problems with such a thing. After being on SAS long enough I know how difficult a subject it is for a lot of people. Just that _it's not the core issue for all of us_.

Thank you for being courteous in response to my rather snippy post. Though I see you've agreed with PaintItBlack's comments in the followup post. Does that mean that again, my personal experience isn't considered valid? :|



PaintItBlack said:


> If you looked like girl in first pic and had biggest confidence in the world, you would still be bullied and made fun of, in school, street, anywhere u go.
> People are mean, and if they think that you are ugly or dont fit in, they will make sure to tell you and show you that.


I look very little like the girl in the first picture. And I was STILL teased and mocked and rejected. My looks had very little to do with how poorly I was treated--yet I was treated poorly anyway. You don't have to look ugly to be treated like crap, by numerous people, for years. In fact, a lot of the poor treatment I've gotten has been online, where nobody knows what I even look like.

People are mean and if they can find ANY weakness in you, whether it be your looks or some part of your personality, your hobbies, how you present yourself, or even the fact that you're shy, they'll make sure to tell you and show you that.

*There is still chance you would have depression or maybe that you would get SA from all dat bullying .*

And I did.

*People who look much much better than her get bullied and made fun of, you can only imagine whats is like for her then?*

Actually, yes, I can.

You can't seem to imagine what it's like for me or people who are actually attractive, though. (Again, I'm not even attractive.)

*If person is really ugly (not bdd) then that person knows that in todays society there is no worse thing than being ugly, you will get treated worse, made fun on, bullied, and guess what when you are truly ugly (not average looking) people dont give a **** about your confidence or personality, they will bully you and make fun of you.*

That sort of thing happens to average and non-ugly people too. Perhaps not to the same extent, but it does happen...I'm living proof. So this argument doesn't hold much water, because even if there were 100 ugly people and only one attractive person being bullied, still, that's an attractive person who's being bullied. They don't count?

Also, you'd best be careful about saying who has it worst.

*Like knowing that you are ugly and will have worse life is not enough, they have to make it even worse by showing you that every day and everywhere you go.*

And again...that's exactly what I've dealt with. It had little to do with my looks, but people treated me that way anyway.

*Like someone already said most of people are average looking or attractive so they have no idea whats it like to be truly ugly, not have bdd but being truly ugly.*

I know it'll get me flak but I doubt most of the people here who claim they are the most hideous things on Earth are nearly as ugly as they believe. I'm not doubting they've been treated like crap--I believe they have--BUT I think the people who were telling them they were so ugly were just saying that as they realized it was a weak point, and they seized onto that, and made it their weapon to make those SASers feel like dirt. The way my own "bullies" knew exactly what weak points of mine to focus on to make me feel like dirt. That's how bullies are. If you're ugly but confident/don't care about your looks, bullies quickly realize they won't get to you that way. So they find something else to mock. Something that hits us hard.

Well, I believe that's what's going on with many SASers who've been mocked for being ugly. Because when they post their pictures I'm just not seeing it. I have yet to see anybody on this forum, with maybe one exception, who would come close to the definition of "ugly" as given by the photo of the first girl. I think many users here have a severely skewed view of themselves brought on by bullies targeting their weak points. I never comment on this since I know my assurances can't undo years of ridicule by others. But based on what I've seen, it's what I believe. I highly doubt anybody here is the God-awful hideous monster they depict themselves to be.

So when you start talking about "TRUE ugliness," whatever, I'm still not seeing it. And no, *I will not argue/debate this point further because it'll get nowhere*. I can't convince anybody here what they look like. So moving on.

*You can see a lot of confident ugly people and they still have ****ty lives and were bullied, so confidence wont change a thing.*

And I've seen, here on SAS, unconfident attractive people, they still have ****ty lives and were bullied, so good looks didn't change a thing.

We could go back and forth like this forever, you know. Everybody's experience is different, some people were mocked for their looks and some were mocked for something else; I'm trying hard not to be rude here but _what about that can't you understand_?

*I believe in God, but it annoys me when people say, nobody is ugly, God loves us all, God made u beautiful, well guess what, problem is not God, problem are people here on Earth.*

Agree, I suppose.

*If you looked like girl in second pic, yes you would have sa, but maybe you would have normal sa, not really bad sa, and your looks would help you a lot in life.*
*There is chance you would get rid of sa, because people would treat u better and always said nice things to you, how cute, pretty, hot or whatever you are.*

I already covered this in my other post but I'll cover it again. I'm not hideous. I don't look anywhere near like that girl, but I'm not attractive either. I've gotten a few snotty comments on my looks but not many at all. But guess what?..._I still have severe SA. *BAD SA.*_ And based on how I developed it, I KNOW that having good looks would not help me, because _my looks are not the basis of my SA_!

And even if I had good looks, yet still had severe SA, again, like I said, HOW am I going to get all those nice comments from people if I'm stuck in my house, afraid to step outside, every single day...? People can't treat me better if I never interact with people!

*You would realise that sa is your only problem, and work on it much more.*

That's pretty offensive, you know, to assume that if somebody has good looks, then surely SA--and not even severe SA, just "normal SA" (whatever that is)--is their "only problem." Most people here, even the good-looking ones, are dealing with a LOT more than "just SA." Depression, BDD, other comorbid disorders, financial difficulties, romantic difficulties, family difficulties, health problems, need I go on?

How do you know that with an attractive person with SA, that's their only problem...?

*You would get treated much much better in school, street, job, and in life, even with sa.*

Didn't happen with me. And I'm not going to sit here and assume that all the attractive people here on SAS must've been treated wonderfully, either, because obviously, they haven't been...otherwise why are they hanging out here?

*Also when you are pretty and quiet, people assume you are shy and leave you alone, when you are ugly and quiet, people assume you are weird, and bully you or something, wont leave you alone.*

You _do_ know that you can get SA from either outright bullying OR being ignored/rejected, right...?

Also, my own "bullies," when they perceived I was shy, started mocking me even more. Shyness itself is seen as a weakness a lot of the time. It was in my case. Shyness is what was seen as "ugly" about me.

...And there, I've just reiterated and expounded on everything I've already said. I'm not doubting the experiences of anyone who's been mocked for their unattractiveness. And I'm not questioning those who would choose to be attractive with SA. So again, why, *WHY*, are those of us whose experiences have been different, whose SA is NOT based on our looks, who would honestly choose to be ugly with confidence, _WHY is our own decision being doubted/argued against so very much_?

How much proof do we have to provide that we're being sincere and that we know what would benefit us most? You really think that after decades of dealing with this, we're _that_ misguided, or that we'd (I'd) be wasting all this time typing this up on some forum if we don't really believe it?

(Ugh, I have to continue the post. Dammit. ;_; )


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## aGenericUsername (Apr 7, 2013)

tehuti88 said:


> Exactly (except I'm not attractive, but even if I were, in my case it wouldn't matter, *I'd be too miserable to make any use of it*).
> 
> _I *could* sit here and claim that those who chose to be attractive with anxiety don't REALLY know what bad anxiety is like, surely their anxiety is minor and is nothing compared to mine, surely if they knew REAL anxiety they wouldn't choose to have it_...but I won't because I really can't know that, and it'd be rude, plus it's against site rules. And I honestly don't believe that anyway; I know how many people here struggle seriously and have dealt with lots of trouble due to their looks. So...why some people are judging those who chose to be ugly without anxiety, especially if we have experiences that back this decision up, I have no clue. The narrowmindedness on this site amazes me sometimes. I get the ironic feeling that we place more emphasis on looks than "normal" people do.
> 
> ...


People have a bias towards ugly people. Ugly children are more likely to be disciplined. People laugh at people's jokes simply because they are good looking. An ugly person could make the same joke and would be seen as annoying. Your first impression is how you look. I have had really awful anxiety and paranoia my whole life TRUST ME but I'd rather be better looking and be viewed as shy and mysterious rather than ugly and asocial. I'm not exactly the ugliest person in the world and I'm not fat either, but if I was better looking people would like me more (at least initially).

I could see how you'd pick the first, though


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## tehuti88 (Jun 19, 2005)

(Cont.)

Wasn't going to reply to this post but may as well...



Flace said:


> Anxiety often are usually connected to how one look, or rather how one perceive him or herself to be. Just look in this forum alone... how many thread do you see starts with "i am ugly... "?


Look through my own posting history and you'll see a LOT of references to coming across as boring, annoying, longwinded, being told to shut up, being ignored, etc. Just because the "Am I ugly?" threads stand out so much doesn't mean they're the only or even the primary cause of SA for all of us. Look at all the threads having to do with making conversation, talking on the phone, trying to befriend people, getting a blank mind, hanging out in a group, being lonely, etc. etc. etc....those have nothing to do with looks. And those threads combined probably outnumber the "ugly" threads.

*We could take a look from another viewpoint... let's ask these people who are "ugly and confident..." ..... has they ever at some point of their confident life, wished they were good looking and everything would be perfect already?*

You're changing the argument. :no Nobody ever said ugly confident people have NO problems and have never wished to be better looking. The original point is which would we choose, to be attractive with SA, or ugly without? So that's what people here have answered.

*The cold hard truth is, anxiety and confidence can be changed. But looks often, can't be altered. A confident and ugly person has nothing to do except just bite hard, and brave through everyday life being confident. Because being confident is his only way to survive in this world.*

*On the other hand, a good looking person with anxiety, can get his anxiety fixed one day and his looks is still there. And often good looking people get pass such obstacles easier because they could get what they want (Getting laid whatever) easily. But once if the ugly and confident slip, and lost his confidence, everything is over.*

It's an unpopular view here with some of the more positive people on SAS, but anxiety can't always be changed. Here I am, living proof. Years of therapy both as a teenager and an adult, three psychologists, three psychiatrists, at least eight meds. No better. In fact, even worse. For some reason some people are just treatment resistant. So that there is a big part of the reason why I would choose to be that ugly confident girl, because nothing else in my life has helped with my SA, _so I KNOW having good looks wouldn't help me_. If I knew I would have confidence again, yes, I'd choose that ugly girl. Yes, yes, a million times yes. That's how painful this is, how desperate I am.

And again...an attractive person won't get those lucky breaks in life...if they're shut inside their house away from the world every day of their lives. How do you get sex, get a job, if you never leave the house?? And even if they do manage to get out, and somebody gives them some attention, guess what?...they'll probably have an anxiety attack, and blow the chance. I've seen it happen here on SAS, numerous times.

*I used to know a girl... which later i got to know that she has anxiety too. But she gets the most rich and handsome boyfriends, without a lack of suitors... and guys that basically just buzz around her like flies. And these guys tend to always find ways to cheer her up through her unhappy days.*

*Tell me... on a bad day where an ugly and confident person become sad and emo... who will be there to cheer him or her up? Aside from family and friends.*

I'm not a hideous monster, but I don't have a support network, and I haven't had one in years. Again, an attractive person won't have a support network either, if they never leave their house. Plus, I knew rather ugly but confident people in school who, because of their personality, had strong support networks of friends who were always there for them, whereas I, shy overly sensitive SAer that I am, for the most part went unnoticed.

I even knew an ugly confident guy who was often mocked. But guess what?--he didn't care, he was confident, so other people's opinion of him didn't bother him. God do I wish I felt that way. He annoyed me, but *I envied him*.

"You used to know a girl"--I knew people too. All of us have known people who back up our assertions. Again, we could go back and forth forever...

I really don't know how much clearer I can make it. Some of us have SA directly related to our looks, so choosing to be attractive with SA is their decision. And some of us have SA not related to our looks, so choosing to be ugly without SA is our decision. Cripes, *if it's so impossible to believe that anyone could choose differently, why is this even a poll/question??* :|

ETA:



aGenericUsername said:


> People have a bias towards ugly people. Ugly children are more likely to be disciplined. People laugh at people's jokes simply because they are good looking. An ugly person could make the same joke and would be seen as annoying. Your first impression is how you look. I have had really awful anxiety and paranoia my whole life TRUST ME but I'd rather be better looking and be viewed as shy and mysterious rather than ugly and asocial. I'm not exactly the ugliest person in the world and I'm not fat either, but if I was better looking people would like me more (at least initially).


I've already addressed this in my more recent posts, please see those. I wasn't downplaying the role looks play for some people, I was addressing how others are downplaying those of us who had a different experience. You'd choose to be good looking; fine, I believe you. But I'd choose differently, myself. And for some reason, a lot of users here can't believe/understand that. And that's frustrating.

If people still can't understand why some of us have bad anxiety NOT related to looks, then...I just do not know how to make it any clearer. I really don't. And I don't understand why people here can't seem to get this.

(PS--see how many words I used in these posts? THAT there is a huge part of where my SA comes from, why people have treated me like crap for the past 25 years. *That's where my SA comes from.* Believe it or not. And now that I've typed all this my anxiety is really kicking in about how stupid I must look. So I hope somebody enjoyed how lame I'm being.)


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

Jesuszilla said:


> Well this question is stupid then because both weight and anxiety can be worked on then.


I'll agree on this.



Jesuszilla said:


> I think people care more about the face than the body though


I think a lot of people care more about the body than the face, but it doesn't really matter.


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## WillYouStopDave (Jul 14, 2013)

Flace said:


> 1. Ugly, fat and confident!
> 2. Pretty, Handsome, Good Looking, Attractive... and full of anxiety.


1.

I haven't tried it but I can't imagine trying to maintain a real relationship with someone who doesn't believe they're worthy of my devotion to them.

The interesting part is, though, that true ugliness is most often in the person's character and not really their looks. I can usually find something that is attractive about a given woman if I like her as a person.


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## AlchemyFire (Mar 4, 2013)

I'd rather be good looking, at least you can hide anxiety or work on it. Plus being good looking can give you confidence.


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## PaintItBlack (May 9, 2013)

aGenericUsername said:


> People have a bias towards ugly people. Ugly children are more likely to be disciplined. People laugh at people's jokes simply because they are good looking. An ugly person could make the same joke and would be seen as annoying. Your first impression is how you look. I have had really awful anxiety and paranoia my whole life TRUST ME but I'd rather be better looking and be viewed as shy and mysterious rather than ugly and asocial. I'm not exactly the ugliest person in the world and I'm not fat either, but if I was better looking people would like me more (at least initially).


True.

*@tehuti88*, I honestly don't even care, I read it all, but don't feel like making long post to reply to it so I will respond only to this part:



> That's pretty offensive, you know, to assume that if somebody has good looks, then surely SA--and not even severe SA, just "normal SA" (whatever that is)--is their "only problem." Most people here, even the good-looking ones, are dealing with a LOT more than "just SA." Depression, BDD, other comorbid disorders, financial difficulties, romantic difficulties, family difficulties, health problems, need I go on?
> 
> How do you know that with an attractive person with SA, that's their only problem...?


What I mean by that is ugly person has to deal with weight, ugly face, and other people making fun of them or bullying them, while pretty person has sa (option was pretty with sa, not pretty with bdd, depression or something else), but she will not be laughed at on streets, school or idk where else, so sa is only problem, idk how to explain it really.
I maybe wrote it wrong, but i never meant they have no problems at all, they just dont have a much problems as ugly person who has to worry about weight, their face or bullies.
I didnt say they dont have to worry about life at all, about job, rent or anything like that.
Anyway, bye, I'm done.


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## Parsnip (Sep 5, 2013)

People are aware that not every person they consider ugly goes through life being humiliated, bullied and lonely, right? I mean, people do know that there are people who experience minimal bullying and just get on with their lives, some of them even managing to enjoy them?

The poor girl selected for the ugly part of your argument... she's not what I consider ugly. Unattractive? Sure, to the majority. But she's hardly abnormal in terms of appearance, I can look around me at work and spy great numbers of people who look like her or share similar elements to their appearance. Some of them were terribly bullied, some of them were not. Believe it or not being ugly is not the worst thing in the world, it does not condemn you to a life of misery, and it is not a one way ticket to loneliness. 

Would anyone believe the confident, ugly person who said they were happy with their appearance? No. No they would not. All of these "cold hard truths" people spout sometimes make me want to weep... it's not the cold hard truth, it's a mixture of personal projection and bits of information mined from other sources which may infer but rarely (if based on actual research) make concrete claims about attractiveness and quality of life. They infer things, just as I infer that life is made much, much harder for people who obsess over that which they can not change or persistently view the world in a "grass is greener" way.

If we're going to assume that you may have "normal" anxiety, then why should we not assume that on the scale of ugly we're actually not that bad? That girl posted as ugly is not actually terribly ugly, I would not mind looking like her if it meant I had confidence in myself, the confidence to see that people who obsess over MY looks have far too much time on their hands, and the confidence to actually order food in the staff canteen rather than skulking off to the canal to watch the gaggle of Canadian geese get all hissy about me sitting on the bench. 

I must ask, if someone is, as you put it "really ugly", and their experience contradicts the scenario wherein being ugly is the worst thing in the world because people are ultimately shallow dicks who will treat you like crap because you're ugly, are they not "really ugly"?. In the grand spectrum of ugliness is their experience of less worth because in your mind it indicates they are not worthy of holding the title of supreme ugly? Do people who claim to know what it's like to feel all of these things understand that they themselves are most likely just average, that how other people interact with you is not the best gauge of how ugly you are because some people really are just dicks?

I've seen women far, far uglier than the one you selected. They go through life with their confidence, and the confidence they have helps them. It helps them because people try to bully them, they try to make them targets, they try to get the reaction they want, and instead they get someone who is quiet happy to accept that they're ugly but not that their life must follow the set path of unhappiness just because people seem to assume being ugly is a social death sentence.

MY anxiety would not be eased if I were attractive. MY anxiety would be ten times worse if it meant people actually approached me, made sexual advances on a more frequent basis, actually touched me, all of that. I am socially anxious, not because of my appearance (that's an entirely different issue) but because the prospect of people interacting with me is terrifying. It terrifies me, and to be attractive and have the scenario die hard "why be ugly when you could be attractive" enthusiasts depict would be a living hell. I don't want to be brought drinks in bars, I don't want suitors coming out of my ears, I don't want people constantly complimenting me, or doing me favours because I'm attractive. What I want is to go through life without being anxious, I want to walk through my life without turning a worm cast into a mountain. I want to be able to walk down the street without running in the opposite direction when I spy someone who may or may not decide to talk to me.

My appearance? Psht. My father has made fun of my appearance for so many years I really couldn't care less what other people think. I may hate myself, but everyone else can jog on since they have the choice of either being so petty that they simply must concentrate on what I look like in order to get their kicks (or, you know, to tell the truth and remind me that I'm not worth a pile of dog poo) or just getting on with their lives in the knowledge that at least they're not as unattractive as I. Just because I obsess about my flaws and being ugly does not mean I should give two hoots as to whether someone else does.

I'd also think the number of attractive, but socially anxious, individuals who ARE bullied about their appearance because people know it affects them, and in turn lead miserable lives believing they're ugly and/or commit suicide because they can't face being so ugly that people will actively persecute them against it, indicates that if you have a weakness people will be dicks about it. To the point where even a very attractive individual finds it difficult to reap the rewards of that attractiveness.

But I know, I know. The grass is greener, exceptions are exceptions, everyone would rather be attractive and anyone who says otherwise is either not really ugly, a liar, or both.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

tehuti88 said:


> (Cont.)
> 
> Wasn't going to reply to this post but may as well...
> 
> Look through my own posting history and you'll see a LOT of references to ............


Hi tehui88, that's alot to digest and i thank you for sharing your life stories. From these i can know how much you have went through thus having such a thinking regarding this matter.

Firstly, i am not trying to change your mind about anything. So i'm just going to reply to the part about being dissed even online.

There is a term in Psychology study about how people are actually more truthful, more real online that in real. Because online people can show what they are truly, inside, without worrying about their identity being found out.

Thus it is a common thing for our comments to be dissed online. This is so normal i don't care anymore. Look past my threads... i've been dissed/disagreed upon more than i was agreed with. This thread so far has proven this fact.

The most important part is this,

If you want to be agreed upon, just be political correct. Just throw your real opinions away and follow the crowd. Even in real life, this is how our society works now. The truths no longer matters, it is what sounds correct, without inciting anyone's hurt that will gain you popularity. Take this thread for example, i am sure 90% of those who voted ugly and confidence are those who are hurt somewhere inside them by those who chose otherwise because they "don't understand the real pain of being this and that". It's the same as what i mentioned the other thread, people who often says looks doesn't matter and everyone is beautiful are people who sub-consciously believe they doesn't fit the bill. If they were to agree with the point they would be slapping themselves, and taking hopes away from themselves.

If you want to get away from the dissings... just stay political correct and stay on the safe path of every topics. This will help you in getting less dissing online. Examples... going into every thread and says things like "hey that's good.. keep up the good work" ...things like that. Sounds too familiar? Yes it happens everywhere online.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

Parsnip said:


> People are aware that not every person they consider ugly goes through life being humiliated, bullied and lonely, right? I mean, people do know that there are people who experience minimal bullying and just get on with their lives, some of them even managing to enjoy them?
> 
> The poor girl selected for the ugly part of your argument... she's not what I consider ugly. Unattractive? Sure, to the majority. But she's hardly abnormal in terms of appearance, I can look around me at work and spy great numbers of people who look like her or share similar elements to their appearance. Some of them were terribly bullied, some of them were not. Believe it or not being ugly is not the worst thing in the world, it does not condemn you to a life of misery, and it is not a one way ticket to loneliness.
> 
> ...


But in the end... we got more than 50% of those who voted ugly and confident on pretty and anxious.

Maybe those who voted on pretty anxious are shallow and stupid people (like myself) :clap

And those who voted ugly and confident are deep and matured people :roll


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## Elad (Dec 6, 2009)

choose for what?

we playing pokemon?

dibs on nurse joy. hnnnngh.










my pokeballs are ready.


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## namebn (Mar 12, 2013)

i'm already fat and ugly, so having confidence would be nice for a change. at least then i'd feel better about my self. where's if i was good looking, i'd be exactly the same and only notice the difference when i look in the mirror, which i rarely do anyway.


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## Flace (Oct 7, 2013)

Yea~ poll concluded!


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## Persephone The Dread (Aug 28, 2010)

Can't I just look how I do now and get rid of the anxiety? I'm not that great looking but I'm not overweight. That's right, I choose option number 3, haggle


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## joked35 (Oct 13, 2013)

I CHOOSE YOU, CHARIZARD!:haha

Sorry... I'll get my coat...:lurk

t


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