# Do all SSRI contain fluoride?



## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

I read that most SSRI contain fluoride. I'm not really keen on getting extra fluoride. I read that fluoride affects the will of a person and makes them less critical and easier to control, which doesn't really sound good to me. I don't want to turn into a zombie. 
Do you know if there are also SSRI or SNRI which don't contain fluoride? I'm already thinking about what options I have if citalopram shouldn't work and in this case I'd like a med which doesn't have fluoride.


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## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

That's not true about fluoride. Millions of people get fluoride in food and water. It is a natural mineral that is in many wells. 

None actually have fluoride - they have covalently bonded fluorines in their structure.
Several also have cyano groups, but it doesn't mean they have the same effect as hydrogen cyanide.

An early SSRI - zimeldine doesn't have any fluorine. It has bromine.


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## offbyone (May 5, 2010)

scarpia said:


> That's not true about fluoride. Millions of people get fluoride in food and water. It is a natural mineral that is in many wells.
> 
> None actually have fluoride - they have covalently bonded fluorines in their structure.
> Several also have cyano groups, but it doesn't mean they have the same effect as hydrogen cyanide.
> ...


Expanding on what you've said. Flouride is an element. Most pharmaceuticals are a chemical ( a molecule) that has some beneficial effect. A molecule is a group of elements.

Here is the chemical structure of prozac:









The F in that picture is the flouride. Someone with a better chemistry background than I have will need to explain the mechanism behind how its processed by your body. But I'm pretty sure there isn't enough flouride in the pill to cause what you are worried about (which sounds a bit like a conspiracy theory, anyway).


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## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

offbyone said:


> Expanding on what you've said. Flouride is an element. Most pharmaceuticals are a chemical ( a molecule) that has some beneficial effect. A molecule is a group of elements.
> 
> Here is the chemical structure of prozac:
> 
> ...


Fluoride is not an element. It is the anion - a reduced form -of the element fluorine. They are very different. Covalenty bonded florine to carbon is very stable and that makes it difficult for your body to convert it into fluoride. I am a chemist.


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

So what does this mean now? Do all SSRI contain fluoride?
I worry about fluoride because I heard a lot of negative stuff about it for example that the nazis put it in the drinking water in the concentration camps to make the jews easier to control.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

scarpia said:


> Fluoride is not an element. It is the anion - a reduced form -of the element fluorine. They are very different. Covalenty bonded florine to carbon is very stable and that makes it difficult for your body to convert it into fluoride. I am a chemist.


This.

It's also worth noting the obvious that a compound doesn't necessarily inherit the properties of it's constituents unless the structure is such that those constituents are separated by some metabolic process.

In the case of fluoxetine at least, it's pretty obvious that the fluoride isn't going anywhere, eliminating any chance of fluorine release and related toxicity.

That's not to say that the presence of fluoride in an otherwise harmless compound couldn't render it toxic, but the toxicity would be caused by the compound as a whole and wouldn't be in any way related to that of fluorine.

Fluorine poisoning is possible with things like sodium fluoride, but the amount found in tap water is trivial, and if you're stupid enough to swallow ten tubes of toothpaste despite the big warning on the back that says 'CONTAINS SODIUM FLUORIDE - DO NOT SWALLOW', you've only yourself to blame if something bad happens.

(@scarpia: this is aimed at everyone, I'm not trying to school you on your own subject! )


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## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

norad said:


> So what does this mean now? Do all SSRI contain fluoride?
> I worry about fluoride because I heard a lot of negative stuff about it for example that the nazis put it in the drinking water in the concentration camps to make the jews easier to control.


I have never seen so much misinformation spread about anything close to what is out there about fluoride. That nazi story is total bunk but I see it cited all the time.

No SSRI contains fluoride. Many have fluorine atoms that are inert because they are strongly bonded to carbon. Your body will not convert the fluorine to fluoride. I don't know a better way to answer your question.


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## King Moonracer (Oct 12, 2010)

I dont know if they actually contain flouride or not...
But regardless... You will still feel lile a zombie from taking SSRIs.

I feel like a zombie right now. I feel like im not even here writing this. Im too busy worrying about my next class.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

scarpia said:


> I have never seen so much misinformation spread about anything close to what is out there about fluoride. That nazi story is total bunk but I see it cited all the time.


It's just the same old chemophobic crap spread by conspiracy theorists and perpetuated by the ignorant. Fluoride hysteria fits all criteria of a generic conspiracy theory, with it's slanted, politically charged reasoning, and an incomplete scientific basis that provides little more than illusory credibility.


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## Akane (Jan 2, 2008)

If you are worried about becoming a zombie I'd be much more concerned about the effects of SSRI than something like flouride being in it. Antidepressants and anxiolytics frequently make people feel like zombies with no emotion.


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## offbyone (May 5, 2010)

scarpia said:


> Fluoride is not an element. It is the anion - a reduced form -of the element fluorine. They are very different. Covalenty bonded florine to carbon is very stable and that makes it difficult for your body to convert it into fluoride. I am a chemist.





Duke of Prunes said:


> This.
> 
> It's also worth noting the obvious that a compound doesn't necessarily inherit the properties of it's constituents unless the structure is such that those constituents are separated by some metabolic process.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the corrections. I did terrible in chemistry and probably should have stayed out of it!


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

I read that SSRI reduce creativity, is this true?

I don't feel like a zombie. But if you had to choose between being totally depressed and being like a zombie wouldn't zombie be better?


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## scarpia (Nov 23, 2009)

I don't think there have been any studies about the effect of SSRIs on creativity. I question their efficacy for depression. From wiki:


> Two meta-analyses of clinical trials found that in mild and moderate depression, which constitute the vast majority of depression cases, the effect of SSRI is very small or none compared to placebo, while in very severe depression the effect of SSRIs is clinically significant.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2253608/?tool=pmcentrez


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## michael10364 (Feb 4, 2011)

i took prozac about a year ago and it did reduce my creativity. before i took it i was very creative in making up quotes that i would post on facebook, and many people seemed to like them. but about 2 weeks after starting the prozac, i became unable to be inspired/creative enough to make up quotes anymore.
SSRI and SNRI antidepressants just take my life away from me.


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

That's not good. 
What if you need to be creative? 

And if it's not even sure if SSRI help against depression then this is also depressing.


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## SDJake (Nov 20, 2011)

*Citalopram hydrobromide*

Does Citalopram (Celexa) contain bromide? I've got it into my head that is does, but I'm not a chemist. 
Scarpia mentioned being a chemist. Can you help, Scarpia?
So I've thought about asking my doctor to switch me to Lexapro so I don't get the bromide.
Main side effect I dislike with Celexa is delayed ejaculation (can I mention that here?)
I associate this with bromide. Ever hear the story about the British Army putting potassium bromide in tea to quell sexual arousal!
From what I've read about Lexapro, it doesn't seem much better than Celexa.
Any thoughts?
Thanks,
Jake


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## michael10364 (Feb 4, 2011)

I have also been reading about fluoride lately, and it is classified as a drug when used to treat oral health. and then the government decides this "drug" should be added to the water to treat our teeth. and apparently in the united states it is against the law to give someone medical treatment without their consent. it would seem that it would be against the law to add the drug fluoride to water, even if it is for the best of intentions.


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## michael10364 (Feb 4, 2011)

Mike Adams
Natural News
June 2, 2010

Municipalities all across America are currently dripping fluoride chemicals into their public water supply, dosing over a hundred million Americans with a chemical that they claim "prevents cavities."

What's interesting here is that this biological effect of "preventing cavities" is a medical claim, according to the FDA. And as such, making this claim instantly and automatically transforms fluoride into a "drug" under currently FDA regulations.

This means that cities and towns all across America are now practicing medicine without a license by dripping liquid medication into the public water supply without the consent of those who are swallowing the medication.

If you or I did this, we would be arrested and tried as either terrorists (because contaminating the water supply is an act of terrorism) or felons practicing medicine without a license. So what allows cities and towns to get away with these very same crimes?
Cities openly violate state and federal law

Keep in mind that a medication can only be legally prescribed to someone after they have been diagnosed with a medical need. In other words, a doctor can't legally prescribe you some pharmaceutical unless he examines you and determines you actually need it. But fluoride is medicating everyone whether they need it or not, without any medical diagnosis whatsoever.

And that means those children or adults who already have high exposure to fluoride (from swallowing toothpaste or drinking fluoridated bottled water, for example) may now be exposed to too much fluoride from the added amounts in the tap water. Excess fluoride can cause serious health problems such as bone fractures and dark spots appearing on your teeth (dental fluorosis).

Why the fluoridation of public water supplies is illegal 100210banner1

This does not appear to concern the proponents of fluoride - people who believe they alone have the right to practice mass medicine without a license by dripping an unapproved drug chemical into the public water supply without the knowledge or consent of those who are being medicated by that chemical.

Every city and town in America currently engaged in fluoridation of the water supply is committing felony crimes. Town leaders who approve of water fluoridation are criminals operating in clear violation of FDA regulations, state medical laws and federal laws.
How to fight back

If you happen to see one of these town leaders at a town meeting, make a citizens' arrest and put them in handcuffs, then turn them over to the local sheriff.

You may also wish to write a strong letter to your state medical board and complain that your city or town officials are "practicing medicine without a license" by dosing your city residents with an unapproved drug.

If they insist fluoride is not a drug, tell them to read the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (FD&C Act). (http://www.fda.gov/regulatoryinform&#8230;)

There, you will find that the Act states:

The term "drug" means&#8230; articles (other than food) intended to affect the structure or any function of the body of man or other animals.

Now, I don't personally agree with this definition of a "drug" but this is what the FDA claims it to be, and it clearly states that any item intended to "affect the structure" of the body is a drug.

Fluoride is intended to affect the structure of the teeth. That's the whole claimed purpose of dumping it into the water supply. Therefore, fluoride is a drug.

Furthermore, since it is a drug, it is ILLEGAL to dump it into the water supply, even if it were approved by the FDA to treat cavities (which it isn't).

Thus, every employee of every city or town that is currently dumping this chemical drug into the water supply is guilty of a felony crime and should be immediately arrested and prosecuted for contamination of the public water supplies as well as practicing medicine without a license.

Call your local police department and report these crimes. It's time to arrest these fluoro-terrorists who are illegally contaminating our public water supply with illegal drugs. Stop the fluoride madness.

"I am appalled at the prospect of using water as a vehicle for drugs. Fluoride is a corrosive poison that will produce serious effects on a long range basis. Any attempt to use water this way is deplorable." - Dr. Charles Gordon Heyd, Past President of the American Medical Association.

Other resources to check out:
Fluoride Action Network
www.FluorideAlert.org

Citizens for Safe Drinking Water
www.NoFluoride.com

what this person wrote may sound a bit like an alarmist, but, it is what it is.


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## hoodsurgeon (Sep 18, 2011)

SDJake said:


> Does Citalopram (Celexa) contain bromide? I've got it into my head that is does, but I'm not a chemist.
> Scarpia mentioned being a chemist. Can you help, Scarpia?
> So I've thought about asking my doctor to switch me to Lexapro so I don't get the bromide.
> Main side effect I dislike with Celexa is delayed ejaculation (can I mention that here?)
> ...


Celexa contains a fluoride group at the para position on one of the benzyl rings;








EDIT: Yes it does contain a Br- (bromide ion) when its in the form of the hydrobromide salt, but structurally there's no bromine in the structure, And as for the side effects im not sure you can put this down to the counter ion (bromide) as many other SSRI's have these side effects e.g sertraline hychloride, fluoxetine hydrochloride.....


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

So if fluoride is poisonous and if SSRI contain fluoride then this would mean SSRI = poison. That's just great. I already feel much better now. :mum


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## InterestinglyInteresting (May 7, 2010)

norad said:


> So if fluoride is poisonous and if SSRI contain fluoride then this would mean SSRI = poison. That's just great. I already feel much better now. :mum


apparently you skipped over the intelligent parts of fluoride being bonded to carbon so its inert.


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

InterestinglyInteresting said:


> apparently you skipped over the intelligent parts of fluoride being bonded to carbon so its inert.


Is this a fact? So this means that compared to fluoride in toothpaste it cannot be absorbed by the body and cause no harm?
But then why is it even in there?


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## Jericho187 (Jan 18, 2011)

To answer your question, no.

Sertraline (Zoloft) is the only SSRI that does not have a fluoride molecue in its structure.

As one poster previously stated, fluorinated drugs represent a different category of fluorine compounds called organofluorines (the fluorine is attached to a carbon atom). The fluorine compounds used in dentistry and water fluoridation are inorganic. But he/she failed to mention that *these organofluorine compounds can be metabolized (processed) in the liver and converted into inorganic fluorine *(the exact same stuff that the dentists use). Sevoflurane is a good example of this.

In medicine, some anesthetics that we use in surgeries (like methoxyflurane and sevoflurane) can increase the body's load of fluorine and damage the kidneys (thats why we check kidney function before each surgey), but as to your question about SSRIs doing this, there have been no studies done by anyone.

If you're worried about it, switch to Zoloft.


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## DubnRun (Oct 29, 2011)

Fluoride = poison, no exceptions. You really think pharmaceutical companies care for the well-being of the general public, certainly not. The whole medical industry is hugely flawed in my opinion, all under the guise of primarily bettering health, when its ultimately all about money and control.


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

DubnRun said:


> Fluoride = poison, no exceptions. You really think pharmaceutical companies care for the well-being of the general public, certainly not. The whole medical industry is hugely flawed in my opinion, all under the guise of primarily bettering health, when its ultimately all about money and control.


I think so, too. 
I don't know what to do now. If all SSRI contain fluoride then this means I either have to accept it or get off them. But then what else could I take against anxiety and depression? Or maybe I should take nothing at all and try to deal with it without drugs. I worry that starting a career as guinea pig and going from one antidepressant to the other could only make my situation worse. 

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/fluoride.htm

This is highly concerning.


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## SDJake (Nov 20, 2011)

Hoodsurgeon, thank you for responding and explaining the question I had about bromide.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

norad said:


> Is this a fact? So this means that compared to fluoride in toothpaste it cannot be absorbed by the body and cause no harm?
> But then why is it even in there?


No, it can't be absorbed. It's never, ever going to be freed by any metabolic process. It's not an added ingredient like a binder, it's in the structure of the drug, and it's there because it makes for either the best (most effective, least toxic) or the only possible configuration of the compound.



DubnRun said:


> Fluoride = poison, no exceptions. You really think pharmaceutical companies care for the well-being of the general public, certainly not. The whole medical industry is hugely flawed in my opinion, all under the guise of primarily bettering health, when its ultimately all about money and control.


:teeth

If you'd actually read the rest of the thread (and comprehended the simple explanations of concepts that are covered by GCSE-level chemistry), you'd actually understand why your fluoride hysteria is in no way applicable to SSRIs.

Or do you know better than every chemist and pharmacologist in the world who will attest to the fact that trifluoromethyl (the 'fluoride' in fluoxetine) is metabolically stable and generally inert?

Or has everybody in the world who has the means to disprove this well-established science been bribed or brainwashed by THE EVIL CORPORATIONS? IT'S ALL A BIG CONSPIRACY, MAN! HERPITY DERP :roll


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## DubnRun (Oct 29, 2011)

Duke of Prunes said:


> No, it can't be absorbed. It's never, ever going to be freed by any metabolic process. It's not an added ingredient like a binder, it's in the structure of the drug, and it's there because it makes for either the best (most effective, least toxic) or the only possible configuration of the compound.
> 
> :teeth
> 
> ...


Think what you like we all have our beliefs, I don't trust the medical industry period


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## DubnRun (Oct 29, 2011)

try meditation, NLP or natural supplements. They personally all helped me more than any SSRI did.


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## michael10364 (Feb 4, 2011)

DubnRun said:


> Fluoride = poison, no exceptions. You really think pharmaceutical companies care for the well-being of the general public, certainly not. The whole medical industry is hugely flawed in my opinion, all under the guise of primarily bettering health, when its ultimately all about money and control.


you speak the truth


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## InterestinglyInteresting (May 7, 2010)

michael10364 said:


> you speak the truth


I suggest you stop eating salt since it is made from poisonous compounds. oh wait...my logic is flawed


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## michael10364 (Feb 4, 2011)

InterestinglyInteresting said:


> I suggest you stop eating salt since it is made from poisonous compounds. oh wait...my logic is flawed


i was referring more to what he said about pharmaceutical companies, i dont know a whole lot about flouride, but have read bad things about it, but thanks for the suggestion!


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## baranok (Nov 17, 2011)

fluoride is also in tap water, i think i am overdosed


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## norad (Oct 24, 2011)

Do normal antidepressants, not SSRI type, also contain fluoride?
Does wellbutrin also contain fluoride?


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## lifeisjustaride (Feb 22, 2012)

*This thread is sad...*



InterestinglyInteresting said:


> apparently you skipped over the intelligent parts of fluoride being bonded to carbon so its inert.


I love how the "chemists" on this board are simultaneously shills for the status quo, as if the integrity of their profession depends vitally on defending the addition of rat poison to our water supply! It's absolutely absurd.

Apparently the "intelligent" response to the realization that the toxic fluorine molecule is a constituent of SSRIs is to simply parrot the idea that it's "inert" without questioning why the hell they would put it in the drug if it was inert! What, you really think they ONLY add the fluorine as a structural element? Please, where did you study chemistry...DeVry university online?

The truth about chemistry is not that some molecules attach and are just "inert" but rather that their is a synergistic interaction between different atoms of a given molecule. Just like sodium and chlorine have a synergistic overall property of being table salt--so too will Fluorine _definitely_ have a given synergistic effect if it is added to the molecular ring of an antidepressant...

There is *no hard science* supporting fluorides effect at preventing cavities. You'll note that almost all the studies the government uses in support of fluoridation are decades old *epidemiological studies*, which merely look for correlations between sets of population data. For instance--ice cream sales and murder rates are strongly positively correlated during the summer months. An epidemiological survey would support and has supported such data. You wouldn't therefore conclude that ice cream CAUSES murders though, as that would be absurd. Not only that, but the epidemiological studies supposedly in support of fluoridation, if you *actually look at the data* clearly demonstrate that the effect of fluoridation is NOT statistically significant! What we're actually seeing in the data is effects on the level of people having a HALF LESS CAVITY in their lifetime. Sorry, this does not hold up.

Alternatively, Jennifer Luke's scientific study which actually manipulated variables under controlled conditions found that fluoride definitely accumulates in the pineal gland of biological organisms and disrupts its hormonal activity.

We're supposed to call the poison control center for swallowing a pea sized amount--yet, in states such as new york where I live, the same amount of sodium fluoride in that amount of toothpaste is found in an eight ounce glass of water?! This is absurd...we need to wake up. The pharmaceutical industry is bought and paid for by the money changers who are printing money that's backed by less than your average roll of toilet paper---fluoride is poison--period.

Food for thought (a former fluoride advocate explains why he changed his mind):

http://www.fluoride-journal.com/98-31-2/312103.htm


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## lifeisjustaride (Feb 22, 2012)

A quote from that article I linked, by New Zealander scientist John Colquhoun:

"I now realize that what my colleagues and I were doing was what the history of science shows all professionals do when their pet theory is confronted by disconcerting new evidence: they bend over backwards to explain away the new evidence. They try very hard to keep their theory intact..."


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## duckie (Apr 30, 2012)

Duke of Prunes said:


> Fluorine poisoning is possible with things like sodium fluoride, *but the amount found in tap water is trivial*, and if you're stupid enough to swallow ten tubes of toothpaste despite the big warning on the back that says 'CONTAINS SODIUM FLUORIDE - DO NOT SWALLOW', you've only yourself to blame if something bad happens.


i'm not certain where you are located but in the U.S. many cities add sodium fluoride to the drinking water. this is a nuclear waste byproduct and it has devastating health effects.

you shouldn't intake any sodium fluoride. zero! in most cities that dump this in the water supply 8oz. of water contains about the same as a pea size amount of toothpaste. every tube of toothpaste warns you to call poison control if swallowed more than a pea size amount.

sodium fluoride causes brain damage and is linked to depression. numerous other horrifying health problems related to sodium fluoride.


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## beachmick (Feb 12, 2006)

lifeisjustaride said:


> We're supposed to call the poison control center for swallowing a pea sized amount--yet, in states such as new york where I live, the same amount of sodium fluoride in that amount of toothpaste is found in an eight ounce glass of water?! This is absurd...we need to wake up. http://www.fluoride-journal.com/98-31-2/312103.htm


So then, why is it that the billions of people in the world who drink that single glass of water, let alone, the thousands they consume during their life, don't ever seem to end up needing to call poison control ?


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## Zack (Apr 20, 2013)

lifeisjustaride said:


> I love how the "chemists" on this board are simultaneously shills for the status quo, as if the integrity of their profession depends vitally on defending the addition of rat poison to our water supply! It's absolutely absurd.
> 
> Apparently the "intelligent" response to the realization that the toxic fluorine molecule is a constituent of SSRIs is to simply parrot the idea that it's "inert" without questioning why the hell they would put it in the drug if it was inert! What, you really think they ONLY add the fluorine as a structural element? Please, where did you study chemistry...DeVry university online?
> 
> ...


LOL

Are you a comedian?


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## Spungo (Jul 30, 2012)

norad said:


> I read that most SSRI contain fluoride. I'm not really keen on getting extra fluoride. I read that fluoride affects the will of a person and makes them less critical and easier to control, which doesn't really sound good to me. I don't want to turn into a zombie.


Actually, fluorine on a molecule is generally a good thing. I can't remember the exact details, but this was something I read on Bluelight. If a drug contains chlorine or bromine atoms, it's relatively easy to break them off the drug and create some nasty metabolites. Fluorine is better because it has such a crazy strong attraction that it doesn't let go of carbon atoms. It stays together through metabolism and it stays together when the drugs leave your system. 
Someone feel free to tell me I'm wrong. I don't want to be passing on bad information.


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## swim (Apr 4, 2011)

as far as I know, zoloft doesn't contain fluoride and so all the older TCAs.


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