# 20 year old dating a 17 year old



## Ali477 (May 7, 2012)

Do you see it as weird? I ask this because the girl I've been seeing for a few weeks now is in that exact age bracket. Everything feels natural between us but idk I just worry it might be a bit awkward when I meet her parents and tell them how old I actually am.


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## ilovejehovah777 (Apr 16, 2013)

it's not really weird but it is illegal but she's almost 18 anyway so I guess it's okay


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

Weird and wrong.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Perfectly fine.


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## Farideh (Nov 13, 2011)

I would never date a guy that young. I would not even want to date a guy that's one year younger than me. That's just me.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

What's weird, is that this question even needs to be asked.


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

It's not a big deal at all.


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## Diacetylmorphine (Mar 9, 2011)

I can't even tell the difference between a 17 and 20 year old for the most part. #Oldmanstories #yolo


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## prettyful (Mar 14, 2013)

theres nothing wrong with the age difference but i think it might be illegal


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## Jesuszilla (May 26, 2013)

By "that age bracket" do you mean she's like 15-16 but you're stretching the truth on her actual age? Or is she actually 17?

Anyway I think it's pushing it. As in if I were in your shoes I wouldn't date her.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

^good catch, bracket is a very strange word to use there.


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## wallenstein (Mar 27, 2013)

shiori said:


> To be honest, my personal gut feeling is that yes, it's a little weird. But I realize I also have some inherent bias there, and logically, there's really not much difference between a 20 year-old dating a 18 year-old and a 20 year-old dating a 17 year-old, even though the 17 year-old is considered a minor.


18 isn't the age of consent everywhere. Its 16 in Australia so it would be legal here.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

wallenstein said:


> 18 isn't the age of consent everywhere. Its 16 in Australia so it would be legal here.


Well legal doesn't always moral or ethical.


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## wallenstein (Mar 27, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> Weird and wrong.


Didn't you post that your ex was 26? That's not weird and wrong but this is. Right.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

wallenstein said:


> Didn't you post that your ex was 26? That's not weird and wrong but this is. Right.


Older than that, idk where you got that number from. But it's not about the gap, it's about her being 17.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Not weird and not wrong.


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## wallenstein (Mar 27, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> Older than that, idk where you got that number from. But it's not about the gap, it's about her being 17.


Is there a massive change in mental maturity from 17 to 18? I'm not advocating sex with minors. The age of consent is there for a reason. But in this case it isn't that weird because the guy is only 20. If he was 30 then yes it would definitely be wrong and immoral.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

wallenstein said:


> If he was 30 then yes it would definitely be wrong and immoral.


If the law says it's OK and they're both consenting adults, then there's nothing "wrong" or "immoral" about it, whether he's 20, 30, 40, 50, or 60+.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

wallenstein said:


> Is there a massive change in mental maturity from 17 to 18? I'm not advocating sex with minors. The age of consent is there for a reason. But in this case it isn't that weird because the guy is only 20. If he was 30 then yes it would definitely be wrong and immoral.


He's an adult, she's a child. If this is in america she's not even out of high school yet.

She's a *child*


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> If the law says it's OK and they're both consenting adults, then there's nothing "wrong" or "immoral" about it, whether he's 20, 30, 40, 50, or 60+.


Laws are not morals


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

Gwynevere said:


> Laws are not morals


If the consent is there, then the law is all that matters.

What business is it of yours what two legally consenting partners do?


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> If the law says it's OK and they're both consenting adults, then there's nothing "wrong" or "immoral" about it, whether he's 20, 30, 40, 50, or 60+.


The law is not a ethical code, and there could well be a problematic power imbalance between 17 and some of the ages you mentioned. I wouldn't want it banned (unless the older person was in a position of authority like a teacher), but I'd be cautious/sceptical....

However, a 17 year old young woman and a 20 year old man is actually a good match. Maturity-wise they would quite likely be about the same.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

TicklemeRingo said:


> The law is not a ethical code


Who decides what's ethical and what's not?


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> Who decides what's ethical and what's not?


The laws of the land are merely there because someone had the power to sign them into law.

The thread maker is asking for people's opinions - whether it is right or wrong. Obviously those opinions are going to differ from person to person. What matters is the argument/reasoning you make.


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## WillYouStopDave (Jul 14, 2013)

wallenstein said:


> Is there a massive change in mental maturity from 17 to 18? I'm not advocating sex with minors. The age of consent is there for a reason. But in this case it isn't that weird because the guy is only 20. If he was 30 then yes it would definitely be wrong and immoral.


 But 30 year old men (and older) date and marry 18 year old females all the time. People might point and make a big deal out of it but it isn't illegal and there's nothing they can do about it other than that.


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## AceEmoKid (Apr 27, 2012)

Age of consent varies within the states, falling between 16 to 18 years. Double check the laws for the state you live in. 

Personally, I see nothing wrong so long as both parties consent. Jeez, I was in university communicating with upperclassmen (20-23 years) by the time I was 17. Age is but a number, and should be used as a reference rather than absolute denotation of emotional maturity and ability to consent.


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## wallenstein (Mar 27, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> He's an adult, she's a child. If this is in america she's not even out of high school yet.
> 
> She's a *child*


I get the point you're trying to make. But you can't be so black and white about an issue like this.


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## Steinerz (Jul 15, 2013)

Don't really see it as an issue.


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## donzen (May 13, 2014)

Not wrong and not weird.


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## Ntln (Apr 27, 2012)

Gwynevere said:


> He's an adult, she's a child. If this is in america she's not even out of high school yet.
> 
> She's a *child*


By that logic, an 18 year old dating a 17 year old a couple of months younger than him/her would be wrong.

Personally, I don't think it's anything terrible. As others have said, if she was 18, no one would think twice. It's kind of pushing it I guess, I mean, I do think 20 something year olds dating 15-16 year olds is wrong for the most part. But at the end of the day, it's only a 3 year difference and a 17 year old should bbe responsible enough to know who she's dating.


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

I'm dating a 16 year old.


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

likeaspacemonkey said:


> You... MONSTER!


rawr ';..;'


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## sad vlad (Nov 9, 2013)

Nothing wrong there. She will turn 18 soon, anyway. I see people worrying you will take advantage of the poor girl. Unless she has serious mental issues and can't think for herself, that should not be an issue. Whether she wants sex before turning 18 or not is her choice entirely. What about all those girls that are having sex from 14 years old, most of the time with teenagers under 18 years old? That is not taking advantage, but if the guy is barely over 18, it is. Sometimes a 15 years old guy may be more of a '' sexual threat'' than a 25 years old. Also, based on this logic, are girls/women over 18 immune to being taken advantage, simply cause they are over a certain age? Besides, the age of consent can even go under 16 in some countries. 

My mom was 16 while my dad 24 when they started dating. They are still married after over 36 years.


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## Glass Child (Feb 28, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> Well legal doesn't always moral or ethical.


Both of which are subjective. Your definition of right/wrong will not be the same as others, basic common sense.

There's a lot of controversy with age gaps. I suppose I may be biased since my boyfriend happens to be 22, but I don't see the problem. As long as both parties are mature, communicate well and abide to the law, what is the overall harm?

It is also not uncommon for 18 year-olds to date those far above their age. Why is it that a number draws the line between who we can or cannot favor for a partner? I thought humans were more complicated than that.


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## Ali477 (May 7, 2012)

Jesuszilla said:


> By "that age bracket" do you mean she's like 15-16 but you're stretching the truth on her actual age? Or is she actually 17?
> 
> Anyway I think it's pushing it. As in if I were in your shoes I wouldn't date her.


I mean she is 17, maybe I should have made it more clear in the OP. But yea the legal age 16 here in Taiwan unlike 18 in the US.


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## Alone75 (Jul 29, 2013)

Lots of 16 - 17 year old girls in my year at school and after at college were dating 18 - 25 year old guys. It only pissed me off because I felt jealous that no girls wanted me. Not that I ever tried to ask any out anyway. Lucky you, her parents may not mind so much, it's not as if you're 30+.


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## probably offline (Oct 8, 2012)

It's 3 years. There's no problem.

edit:



TicklemeRingo said:


> The law is not a ethical code, and there could well be a problematic power imbalance between 17 and some of the ages you mentioned. I wouldn't want it banned (unless the older person was in a position of authority like a teacher), but I'd be cautious/sceptical....
> 
> However, a 17 year old young woman and a 20 year old man is actually a good match. Maturity-wise they would quite likely be about the same.


I agree with this, though. Just because something is legal doesn't automatically make it "right".


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## Putin (May 21, 2013)

nothing wrong with that


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## Jesuszilla (May 26, 2013)

Jaax said:


> I mean she is 17, maybe I should have made it more clear in the OP. But yea the legal age 16 here in Taiwan unlike 18 in the US.


My personal feelings aside, you're good then.


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## Ntln (Apr 27, 2012)

AceP said:


> Lots of 16 - 17 year old girls in my year at school and after at college were dating 18 - 25 year old guys. It only pissed me off because I felt jealous that no girls wanted me. Not that I ever tried to ask any out anyway. Lucky you, her parents may not mind so much, it's not as if you're 30+.


It seems to be the new norm. I know of more girls in my year who are dating 20+ year old university guys than guys their age. I guess you could argue right or wrong either way, but it definitely seems to be statistically normal.


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## anomnomnom (May 28, 2013)

Really? 3 years? 

who the hell cares

I'd go out with a 17 year old if I was 20...wouldnt see a problem with it at all, perhaps with our age of consent being 16 here I see a 17 year old differently to americans would. 

Also yeah, whos younger, the girl? a 17yr old girls is probably equally if not more mature than a 20yr old guy anyway! 

Some people are weird, you think the 17 yr old is going to magically change into an adult once they hit 18 and all of sudden everything is fine? :sus

Oh yeah, at my old work place a 17 year old was going out with a 27 year old and the other 17 year old got dumped, so she went and got shacked up with the 31yr old colleague, see now that I can understand raised eyebrows but still, they seemed happy enough..


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## persona non grata (Jul 13, 2011)

At 20 I would not have felt comfortable dating a 17 year old.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

TicklemeRingo said:


> The laws of the land are merely there because someone had the power to sign them into law.


I'd say the law sets a pretty damn good standard.



TicklemeRingo said:


> The thread maker is asking for people's opinions - whether it is right or wrong. Obviously those opinions are going to differ from person to person. What matters is the argument/reasoning you make.


If you think it's wrong despite what the law says, what are you going to do about it? And what business is it of yours to say anything to two legally consenting partners?

Other arguments don't really matter, since the law is about all that counts.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> I'd say the law sets a pretty damn good standard. .


Again, laws exist only because people temporally have had the power to make them. Whether they are ethically/morally right or wrong is always up for debate, which is what we are having here: A debate/discussion about right and wrong.

For example: Do you think laws banning gay marriage are right or wrong?

Does the mere fact that those laws are in place make them ethical/moral?



Just Lurking said:


> If you think it's wrong despite what the law says, what are you going to do about it? .


Uh....nothing. :um Why would I do anything about it? :con



Just Lurking said:


> And what business is it of yours to say anything to two legally consenting partners?.


The thread maker did ask for opinions. I gave mine, as did others. As did you.



Just Lurking said:


> Other arguments don't really matter, since the law is about all that counts.


Can you not think of examples of laws that you think are immoral and/or unethical (past, present or future)?


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> I'd say the law sets a pretty damn good standard.


The age of consent in most states is 16 or 17, very few states are 18. So unless they live in Arizona, California, Delaware, Florida, Idaho, North Dakota, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Utah, Virginia, or Wisconsin, it's perfectly legal.

Having a relationship with a minor is legal. Having sex with a minor below the age of consent is generally illegal.


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## Just Lurking (Feb 8, 2007)

TicklemeRingo said:


> Does the mere fact that those laws are in place make them ethical/moral?


We seem to be going on here about wordage which, looking back on it, probably could have been better~



Just Lurking said:


> If the law says it's OK and they're both consenting adults, then there's nothing "wrong" or "immoral" about it, whether he's 20, 30, 40, 50, or 60+.


* If the law says it's OK, then it's not "wrong".
* If they are both consenting adults, then it's not "immoral", nor should it be anyone else's business.

Laws are obviously fully capable of being 'immoral', as in those countries where you can hook up with a 12-year-old without consequence.

This business about a 20-year-old and 17-year-old, though - everyone just needs to shut the f*** up and pull the sticks out of their asses.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> This business about a 20-year-old and 17-year-old, though - everyone just needs to shut the f*** up and pull the sticks out of their asses.


Most people (myself included) are saying it's fine and he should go for it.

Given that the OP asked for people's opinions, it's a bit unreasonable to expect them to shut up. :|


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

Just Lurking said:


> adults


This is where we disagree. 17 is a child.


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## caelle (Sep 9, 2008)

That is not a big age difference at all. So I don't think it's weird.

And since when is it illegal to date? In some places it's illegal to have sex with a minor. The age in the states varies though. 

But seriously, not weird. She's less than one year away from being 18. Big deal.


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## StrangePeaches (Sep 8, 2012)

its only 3 years


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## caelle (Sep 9, 2008)

Gwynevere said:


> This is where we disagree. 17 is a child.


What makes a 17 year old a child? Because the law says so?


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## StrangePeaches (Sep 8, 2012)

Gwynevere said:


> This is where we disagree. 17 is a child.


I was living on my own hundreds of miles away from family at 17. 
You cannot pinpoint the mental capacity of someone you do not know based on age alone.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

The terminology is not so important, it's the age/maturity/power difference that matters.

A 17yo is not the same as a 10yo, but the term "child" can technically apply to both.

A 20yo is not the same as a 50yo, but the term "adult" applies to both.



The age/maturity/power difference in this case is most likely perfectly fine.


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## LGriff (Apr 23, 2014)

Haha. This is definitely not a big deal. Things don't have to be so black and white. The law doesn't have anything to do with someone being a child. You don't suddenly become an adult in one day.


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## 000XXX000 (Dec 1, 2013)

wait till she is 18, and then the argument is moot. unless people still want to say an 18 year old is a child. 

think about this though, when you turn 21, you will be able to drink and she won't. that could be awkward when going out with friends and you want to invite her along.


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## Glass Child (Feb 28, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> This is where we disagree. 17 is a child.


Please identify the difference between 17(child), and 18(adult).


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

Glass Child said:


> Please identify the difference between 17(child), and 18(adult).


Education, opportunities, legal status and legal capacity.


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## mezzoforte (May 16, 2010)

Sacrieur said:


> I'm dating a 16 year old.


I KNEW you two were going to date! I called it like 398398 months ago.


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## Ntln (Apr 27, 2012)

Gwynevere said:


> Education, opportunities, legal status and legal capacity.


Education- 17 is like last year or second to last year of high school. 20 is maybe second year of college. Not that big of a difference

Opportunities- fair enough, but that is not linked to how ethical it is or isn't to date someone

I was 17 a month ago. Literally the biggest difference I've noticed is that my parents can't access my bank account :blank. You're only 19, are you honestly going to tell me THAT much has changed since you were 17?


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

likeaspacemonkey said:


> I asked this to someone on this forum not long ago and didn't get an answer. What is this "power difference" thing _exactly_? Honest question.


Well for example if he was a teacher or someone in a position of power/authority over her. Or some cultural position of power. Or if he were very wealthy and she very poor. If she had no family or support network to look out for her....

Basically, anything that would raise the chance of exploitation/manipulation.

That's what I meant anyway. Same goes with gender roles reversed of course.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Gwynevere said:


> Education, opportunities, legal status and legal capacity.


You seem caught up in labeling 17 year olds as a child and attaching that specific definition of child onto something that it doesn't belong on. Well legally, a 17 year old child can have sex with someone over 18 in a large number of US states and other countries. It's the same logic people use to try and label them as pedophiles, when they are far from prepubescent children.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

scooby said:


> You seem caught up in labeling 17 year olds as a child and attaching that specific definition of child onto something that it doesn't belong on. Well legally, a 17 year old child can have sex with someone over 18 in a large number of US states and other countries.


And I'm saying that's wrong, that should be illegal.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Gwynevere said:


> And I'm saying that's wrong, that should be illegal.


Why is it wrong? Biologically they wouldn't be children.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

scooby said:


> Why is it wrong? Biologically they wouldn't be children.


You quoted my post where I gave the reasons that it's wrong...


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Gwynevere said:


> You quoted my post where I gave the reasons that it's wrong...


Those reasons are silly.


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## TicklemeRingo (Jan 11, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> And I'm saying that's wrong, that should be illegal.


A 17 year old sleeping with an 18 year old?

One day before the younger partner's 18th birthday you'd still want to lay charges against an 18 and-one-day old?


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

TicklemeRingo said:


> A 17 year old sleeping with an 18 year old?
> 
> One day before the younger partner's 18th birthday you'd still want to lay charges against an 18 and-one-day old?


A lot of the laws have exceptions for close in age + were dating before the older partner turned 18, I would agree with those exceptions. An 18 year old college student going out seeking younger high school students to bang, I would have serious issue with though.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Gwynevere said:


> A lot of the laws have exceptions for close in age + were dating before the older partner turned 18, I would agree with those exceptions. An 18 year old college student going out seeking younger high school students to bang, I would have serious issue with though.


Why is an 18 year old college student different from a partner that just turned 18?


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

scooby said:


> Why is an 18 year old college student different from a partner that just turned 18?


That they were dating before, there wasn't the power issue in coercing the younger partner into it.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Gwynevere said:


> That they were dating before, there wasn't the power issue in coercing the younger partner into it.


What possible power could an 18 year old college student have over a 17 year old? They have no power.


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## Gwynevere (Oct 6, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> Education, opportunities, legal status and legal capacity.





scooby said:


> What possible power could an 18 year old college student have over a 17 year old? They have no power.


.


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## scooby (Jun 24, 2009)

Damn, that is some immense power. If only I knew of it back when I was 18. I could have threatened 17 year olds that I would vote for the republicans if they didn't sleep with me, and scare them with my big college words.


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## Raeden (Feb 8, 2013)

Gwynevere said:


> This is where we disagree. 17 is a child.


Yes, my maturity levels just rose dramatically on the day of my 18th birthday.


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## Sacrieur (Jan 14, 2013)

mezzoforte said:


> I KNEW you two were going to date! I called it like 398398 months ago.


:p


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## Aeolian (Jan 1, 2014)

You're fine. 20/2 + 7 = 17.










If she were 16 or 27, it would be creepy.


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