# Latest experiment chapter 2



## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

According to the new rules no dosing suggestions can be made with regards to illicit drugs, i will keep updating my results however cant provide the correct dosing information anymore.

I seem to have build a massive tolerance to AMT and GBL both witch provided a pretty damn improvement in my ocd symptons unfortionally because of running out of memantine months ago ive build a tolerance to pretty much everything except stimulants.

I'l be trying low doses of NAC, DXM, memantine, acamprosate and low bumps of ketamine to get my tolerance back to where it was, its a pretty extensive stack but it appeared to work succesfull for another guy that was having a massive tolerance to amphetamine on the mind and muscle forum.

Bringing tolerance back to baseline is the first priority here.

Also with regards to the new rules let me repeat that those things should only be tried by treatment resistant ppl.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

What do you mean with tolerance to GBL? The dose-response curve is very steep, so in my case 2ml always worked, 3ml and I would fall asleep. Of course the high I never got back. Is it that what you mean, no anxiolysis / euphoria or whatever you got from G anymore?


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

Seroquel? really? :afr
I hate the stuff but i literally have no other choice but to be on it for a few days
Long term its shocking stuff, unless you like gaining lots of weight, not being able to do anything but sleep and eat then sleep again and get bad migraines and lets not forget the dry mouth, lethargy and constant "dazed and confused" disposition

sorry but newboki u do sound like a Troll :hide


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

crazyMed IMHO is one of the most knowledgeable contributors to this forum, please stop the ridiculous attacks on everything he posts as all you are doing is de railing an otherwise very helpful discussion to others. Lets get back to what this thread is all about! 

I am still going strong with memantine at 20mg/day with none of the negative effects that I seemed to experience during my first trial. I am definitely noticing its effectiveness at keeping tolerance to dexedrine at bay as well as working nicely with low dose sertraline (for whatever reason this seems to be crucial to getting everything to work well for me consistently.) My current combo finally seems to have ADHD and general depressive symptoms under control, now I just need to figure out something that really works for SA to use on an as needed basis and at the same time hopefully avoid any dependency from developing. I'm considering cycling Klonopin and either Phenibut or Baclofen (haven't tried either of these yet so it depends on which of these two I find effective.)


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## millenniumman75 (Feb 4, 2005)

****Thread Lock Watch****
Please report the post - the exclamation mark at the bottom left portion of the post. Thanks.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Medline said:


> What do you mean with tolerance to GBL? The dose-response curve is very steep, so in my case 2ml always worked, 3ml and I would fall asleep. Of course the high I never got back. Is it that what you mean, no anxiolysis / euphoria or whatever you got from G anymore?


The high was allways there when i was taking it with memantine, after i stopped it slowly went away and never came back, im hoping my ant tolerance stack would work but i think that memantine was the most effective.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

KW5789 said:


> crazyMed IMHO is one of the most knowledgeable contributors to this forum, please stop the ridiculous attacks on everything he posts as all you are doing is de railing an otherwise very helpful discussion to others. Lets get back to what this thread is all about!
> 
> I am still going strong with memantine at 20mg/day with none of the negative effects that I seemed to experience during my first trial. I am definitely noticing its effectiveness at keeping tolerance to dexedrine at bay as well as working nicely with low dose sertraline (for whatever reason this seems to be crucial to getting everything to work well for me consistently.) My current combo finally seems to have ADHD and general depressive symptoms under control, now I just need to figure out something that really works for SA to use on an as needed basis and at the same time hopefully avoid any dependency from developing. I'm considering cycling Klonopin and either Phenibut or Baclofen (haven't tried either of these yet so it depends on which of these two I find effective.)


Memantine will also work for benzo tolerance and in my case GBL tolerance too, so cycling klonopin with baclofen/phenibut in addition to your combo should definatly help your SA, good luck and keep us updated.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

I probably shouldn't have listed the ml of GBL I used many years ago when it was still legal? The guidelines are very new, must get used to them. Mea culpa.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I have received 3FMC, 2FMC, MDPV, 4FA today, so will have some things to experiment with, i have a scale a small caps from the pharmacy to dose correctly.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

When I lost benefits from GBL I took low dose naltrexone before going to bed, helped getting at least some of the old feelings back.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Medline said:


> When I lost benefits from GBL I took low dose naltrexone before going to bed, helped getting at least some of the old feelings back.


That is interesting, ive been interested in ultra low dose naltrexone apperantly it abolishes craving and tolerance for heroin according to a anecdotal report and i beleive it may do the same for other drugs in doses that dont significantly antagonize the postsynaptic receptors.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

The elevation of endorphins GHB causes results in receptor downregulation. Using low doses of an opioid-antagonist at night upregulates them again.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Medline said:


> The elevation of endorphins GHB causes results in receptor downregulation. Using low doses of an opioid-antagonist at night upregulates them again.


The GHB releases endorphines, gaba and dopamine, the GHB receptor may get downregulated too, amisulpiride has been shown to upregulate it.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

Well, one would need a GHB antagonist at night, but they are not available and probably not safe.  The empathogenic features of GHB are much stronger when using Syntocinon-Spray at the same time. But I had just two of those and one needs really pretty much to feel it, but just about 1/4th with G.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Ami is a GHB agonist AFAIK that also upregulates it.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Adding MDPV to 2FMC didnt do much, probably will need to try it on its own, its a weaker version of desoxypipradol but still highly potent.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

crayzyMed said:


> Adding MDPV to 2FMC didnt do much, probably will need to try it on its own, its a weaker version of desoxypipradol but still highly potent.


The combo was indeed rubbish, retried it later, i will give it a trial on its own later with GBL.


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## JohnG (Sep 3, 2010)

crazyz, but if aMT (which i'm going to experiment soon too) worked so well, why do you not try to focus your attention on tolerance for that substance? So you can have a one/two substances regime. That looks more safe. Just my two cents, no critic, I respect you experimental work much, as always.


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

I will be able to give baclofen a try today and am hoping it will have adequate anxiolytic effects to cycle with Klonopin, if not Phenibut is the next substance I intend to try for this purpose. What would be a good schedule to avoid dependence to either of these substances, alternating weeks perhaps? My daily regimen currently consists of 50mg sertraline, 20mg memantine and 20-30mg Dexedrine IR as needed (with days off if I notice it losing effectiveness.)

Also just something I am curious about that I was hoping the experts on here might have some insight into: prior to starting Sertraline my ADHD meds (both Adderall and Dexedrine) had, for the most part completely lost effectiveness. I was finding that they did nothing beyond keeping my mood and energy levels up just enough (however seemingly only to where they were prior to ever starting medication for ADHD) to get through the day while days without resulted in an awful mood and overwhelming exhaustion. Shortly after adding sertraline I quickly found the effectiveness of both Adderall and Dexedrine restored to the point where I was finding I required half the dose as before to get therapeutic effects. This was a pleasant surprise to me as the reports I had read indicated that in most cases SSRIs tended to blunt the effects of these drugs. 

Also I am now finding Dexedrine far superior to Adderall, whereas before when I first tried Dexedrine I got nothing but negative peripheral side effects when I was still seeing some (however minimal) therapeutic effects from high doses of Adderall. Any thoughts on why a low dose SSRI seems to be critical for me to getting any sustainable benefit from Adderall/Dex? I would prefer to not be on an SSRI for the sake of keeping the number of different medications to a minimum but Sertraline seems to be a key component to my current regimen and I would like to understand why that may be. I should also mention that I noticed this before I started back on memantine.

Thanks!


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Working on AMT tolerance reversal is the same as with all the rest, its related to NMDA so it wouldnt make a difference if i focussed on AMT.


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## newboki (Sep 13, 2009)

Arisa1536 said:


> Seroquel? really? :afr
> I hate the stuff but i literally have no other choice but to be on it for a few days
> Long term its shocking stuff, unless you like gaining lots of weight, not being able to do anything but sleep and eat then sleep again and get bad migraines and lets not forget the dry mouth, lethargy and constant "dazed and confused" disposition
> 
> sorry but newboki u do sound like a Troll :hide


I take seroquel and have none of the side effects i only sleep for 9 hours a day no sleepines over the day. I am in a good mood. And it took at least 3 months for full effects with my other meds. And to tell you Arisa i am suprised you are not dead already from seroquel because of the dangerous side effects you have. I think you should go to emergency and see if they have antidote for seroquel.


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

> I will be able to give baclofen a try today and am hoping it will have adequate anxiolytic effects to cycle with Klonopin, if not Phenibut is the next substance I intend to try for this purpose. What would be a good schedule to avoid dependence to either of these substances, alternating weeks perhaps? My daily regimen currently consists of 50mg sertraline, 20mg memantine and 20-30mg Dexedrine IR as needed (with days off if I notice it losing effectiveness.)
> 
> Also just something I am curious about that I was hoping the experts on here might have some insight into: prior to starting Sertraline my ADHD meds (both Adderall and Dexedrine) had, for the most part completely lost effectiveness. I was finding that they did nothing beyond keeping my mood and energy levels up just enough (however seemingly only to where they were prior to ever starting medication for ADHD) to get through the day while days without resulted in an awful mood and overwhelming exhaustion. Shortly after adding sertraline I quickly found the effectiveness of both Adderall and Dexedrine restored to the point where I was finding I required half the dose as before to get therapeutic effects. This was a pleasant surprise to me as the reports I had read indicated that in most cases SSRIs tended to blunt the effects of these drugs.
> 
> ...


I hate to do this but this post I made yesterday ended up being one of my posts that randomly required moderator approval and therefore didn't appear until a long while after I actually posted it (on the previous page) so I doubt anyone saw it. Any input is appreciated!

Baclofen is quite an interesting substance, I found it surprisingly effective for SA and rather euphoric at times as well. It had a very unique anxiolytic effect unlike anything I have experienced before and I can't quite put my finger on what specifically was so different about it yet, but it did undoubtedly have a positive effect. On the negative side I found it at times to randomly cause a slightly ill, light headed dizzy feeling. I will continue to experiment with this one, my first impression is promising!


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

:yes:blank:um :yes:blank:um 
:yes:blank:um :yes(lol!)

Still reading *****. (Had to edit out due to insane new policies)

'Negative symptoms' makes for an interesting pubmed search.


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

A worthy read for those with academic interests in ketamine:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21319044


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

I've decided to continue my medication quest with assistance from a psychiatrist. This is due to my potential susceptibility to psychosis and perhaps latent:
>DSM code 295.6/ICD code F20.5
>ICD code F20.4

The positive symptoms I am aware of are of mild paranoid and disorganized nature. Only (non-medication induced) hallucinations I experience are of an auditory nature as is described in 'exploding head syndromes' (occuring only at night on verge of sleeping or while asleep).

The potential of 'negative symptoms' masquerading as MDD, since positive symptoms are extremely rare for me. Note that NO (as in ZERO) professional MDs or counselors ever picked any of this up, in spite of having numerous visits for 'professional' guidance. In other words I was likely MISDIAGNOSED by 'highly trained' medical professionals. 

Based on my first visit I can't see why this wasn't picked up, at the time I was doing stuff like this/ my to-do list at the time looked very similar to this picture, but not quite as severe:


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

Sniffin glue with Elmer's
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eglumegad
Love the names they come up with for chemicals :yes


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Today i'm on 3x DXM, 3x Acamprosate, 600mg NAC, Baclofen, Gabapentin, diazepam, wellbutrin and GBL.
Ran out of acamprosate unfortionally and want my memantine and stimulants back.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

For glutamate modulation NAC should be higher dosed (e.g. 1800-2400mg daily). At least it was done so in the clinical trials.

What's the rationale for taking so many different GABAergics?


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

KW5789 said:


> Baclofen is quite an interesting substance, I found it surprisingly effective for SA and rather euphoric at times as well. It had a very unique anxiolytic effect unlike anything I have experienced before and I can't quite put my finger on what specifically was so different about it yet, but it did undoubtedly have a positive effect. On the negative side I found it at times to randomly cause a slightly ill, light headed dizzy feeling. I will continue to experiment with this one, my first impression is promising!


Keep in mind that baclofen must not be stopped abruptly after chronic daily use.


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

If that were my routine, and I were going to add memantine back into the fold, I would be sure to phase out the DXM... will you really need that much overlap Crayzy?


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

For memantine _my_ absolute max would be 5-10mg daily (and would take the place of acamprosate, DXM), 600NAC but maybe add glycine or something instead of jacking up my NAC dosage, Bac(meh...), Gabap(meh...), GBL(meh...), diaz(meh... can my body really handle all this?), bupropion, lisdexamfetamine in moderation (to help avoid binging tendencies).

That would be an ok routine for me in my alternate universe. Lisdex always seemed an improvement, although I don't think amphs are up my alley anymore.. you have to experience it to know you definitely don't want to be there, D2 agonism and NMDA antagonism are both things I plan on avoiding to the max.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Vilazodone said:


> If that were my routine, and I were going to add memantine back into the fold, I would be sure to phase out the DXM... will you really need that much overlap Crayzy?


Most of those things are for my addictive personality, i dont want DXM anymore if i have memantine, actually no need for the diaz, just gonna keep it around just in case i need it.


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> Today i'm on 3x DXM, 3x Acamprosate, 600mg NAC, Baclofen, Gabapentin, diazepam, wellbutrin and GBL.
> Ran out of acamprosate unfortionally and want my memantine and stimulants back.


that is a terrible combination..


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## Rasputin_1 (Oct 27, 2008)

bben said:


> that is a terrible combination..


SOOOOOOOOOOOO much stuff lol. Theres no way to know how it all could interact.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

bben said:


> that is a terrible combination..


I dont see anything that would interact.

I'm leaving out the baclofen and the diazepam tomorrow, i want to replace DXM with memantine and add in oxcarbazepine.


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## zodiac55 (Mar 12, 2010)

Medline said:


> When I lost benefits from GBL I took low dose naltrexone before going to bed, helped getting at least some of the old feelings back.


Interesting. Still wondering about LDN + amph, personally... but may be able to update on this myself, after discussing with GP. :]


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## zodiac55 (Mar 12, 2010)

Also, three cheers for the thread continuation, and best hopes for ya crayzy... keep it sane, keep it responsible. :}

/subbed


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## zodiac55 (Mar 12, 2010)

crayzyMed said:


> Today i'm on 3x DXM, 3x Acamprosate, 600mg NAC, Baclofen, Gabapentin, diazepam, wellbutrin and GBL.
> Ran out of acamprosate unfortionally and want my memantine and stimulants back.


Why so many gabaergics? ; D


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

zodiac55 said:


> Why so many gabaergics? ; D


Those are all substances that can help addiction, i want to see how it will effect my amphetamine intake.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Today i'm on 3x 60 mg DXM, 600mg NAC, 50mg Baclofen, 800mg x3 Gabapentin, 450 mg wellbutrin, 50 mg amislulpiride and GBL.
Ive just got several grams of street amphetamine, i'm capping it and then take my caps and see how many i need wich would be equavalent to 10mg of dextroamphetamine.

I think my anti addiction regime is working, i feel no urge AT ALL to keep on redosing and feel satisfied on my current amphetamine dose, wich appears to be 2 caps. Lets see how the future goes, but im positive. I cant beleive i feel satisfied and dont want to get higher.

And i cant beleive it i feel a urge to get the things done i need to get done!!!


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## zodiac55 (Mar 12, 2010)

Hah.. awesome. Despite the amph substitution... maybe if it keeps workin out, you'll have the supply for the full time now..!


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

This is ****ing incredible, i dont even want amp, normally anti addictive things make it easier to say no but i still want it, on this combo i dont want my next pill, even tough it will make me higher, i'm on my therapeutic dose and dont want more.

I'm still a druggy, a clubber and a partyfreak, but only when its apropiate, i also still want my GBL now because i dont consider an issue for me, but TODAY it seems my prefrontal cortext instead of my nucleus accumbens is owning me.

But it may all be gone tomorrow, it will take weeks to make a conclusion.


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## zodiac55 (Mar 12, 2010)

True.. but don't forget that how well it lasts is still about 30% up to you and your willpower to stay on the right track and retain the changes ; ) It's always possible to make a wrong decision, even with all the chemistry factors working for you. So just do yer best..!


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

> So just do yer best..!


Thats what amazes me, i'm not, i wonna get high tonight but ive been home for 30 minutes now and feel to lazy to take my drugs, and i DIDNT want to take more amp when i was on my therapeutic amp dose, didnt have to do my best as i didnt want to, this is what makes me amazed.

But we will have to see in a few weeks, but you can understand why im excited.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Day2 addiction management:

I am sleep deprived tough, after my meds stopped working i suddenly took a high recreational dose of amphetamine wich i regretted after my anti addiction combo kicked in, after the recreational dose was over i still have the same effects, if i take a therapeutic dose of amphetamine i DONT WANT more, its not like its easier to say no i just dont want it.

Also my mental GBL addiction completely vanished and even tough it makes me feel good, i take it hours later as i'm to lazy, im just so indifferend for drugs its crazy, i have no addictive personality at all anymore (untill my drugs wear off).

Right now im pretty tired as amp has pretty much stopped working and i'm sitting here browing the internet without any craving whatsoever and can it for a while before i can motivate myself to take my drug, quite a change having to use your own motivation instead the reinforcing effects of drugs doing it for you.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I personally beleive that there is some synergy in my combination that completely hijacks the mechanisms mediating addiction, and would like others to try my combination.
I beleive the synergism is alpha3beta4 antagonism, NMDA antagonism, GABAB agonism and D3 antagonism, all are highly involved in addiction and i'm targetting them all togheter. mglur2 and 3 also play a role and are targetted by NAC, GABA agonism is helpfull too togheter with a decrease in glutamate caused by gabapentin.

I do personally beleive a combination targetting all major pathways is essential.

In other cases besides that treatment of an underlying disorder where an addiction is caused by self medication is essential, also anhedonia has to be releived for long term succes.

In my case that are my low doses of amphetamine wich abolish social anxiety and OCD, amisulpiride and wellbutrin help my ADHD alot, amisulpiride in low doses also abolishes anhedonia so if amphetamine is starting to wear off i sometimes wait quite some time before i redose, just because my addiction is gone.


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## JohnG (Sep 3, 2010)

alpha3beta4, is the only ****z that stops my alchool craving, I find it very useful too. I notice a change in the way to think as: " Alchool? Why do you want that poison? " that never happened before.

Also when mood is stable, the urge to take medications to calm down my self is near to zero. I usually used the worsted combo when angry or to try "cure" the emptiness feeling.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I only refer to amphetamine, i still take GHB but only for euphoria, atleast thats what i planned but i still didnt take any today, and it doesnt intrest me at all to take it, even tough i allways planned to keep on taking it.

You dont know how i overdosed on stims before, i compulsively took a massive dose every hour or something, now i just take a low therapeutic dose (with some euphoria i admit that) and i'm happy with that and DONT want more.

This is an incredible improvement for me.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I did started compulsively dosing again when my meds stiopped woring (sleep deprivation and morning) and that caused me to be on a recreational dose.

But i do know that we cant make any conclusions untill after a few weeks, i was ust excited about the drastic improvement, but we cant make any conclusions yet


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

> Keep in mind that baclofen must not be stopped abruptly after chronic daily use.


How many consecutive days do you suppose baclofen could be used daily before cycling with something else (in my case Klonopin) to avoid any dependency? I am finding baclofen and my regular dose of dexedrine to be an extremely pro social and anxiolytic combo...probably the closest I have come to feeling completely cured of SA. I haven't experienced any of the ill effects I reported from my initial trial, if anything there seems to be some slight brain fog when it is wearing off. crazyMed, I see you added baclofen to your regimen at one point. I'm curious what you think of it, how did it effect you?


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

We are speaking about weeks here (likely two or three doses daily). In this case abruptly stopping it can result in W/D symptoms. After months of chronic use those could be very serious (delirium, seizures...), even with relatively low doses like 10mg tid (some alcoholics take much more to get sober).


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Id like to apoligize for not replying to some private messages, EVERYONE is welcome to send me pm's to ask me questions or requist my msn for help, i just sometimes stall things and end up not replying i will do my best to avoid that in the past, wich i will as i feel better with my current regime, i just got back from england and have got a relationship now with the most awesome girl ever in the world


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

KW5789 said:


> How many consecutive days do you suppose baclofen could be used daily before cycling with something else (in my case Klonopin) to avoid any dependency? I am finding baclofen and my regular dose of dexedrine to be an extremely pro social and anxiolytic combo...probably the closest I have come to feeling completely cured of SA. I haven't experienced any of the ill effects I reported from my initial trial, if anything there seems to be some slight brain fog when it is wearing off. crazyMed, I see you added baclofen to your regimen at one point. I'm curious what you think of it, how did it effect you?


Baclofen seemed to inhibit amphetamine after a few days, and also for another member at and mind and muscle, id like to solve this as i loved the baclofen and amphetamine combo, altough i think amisulpiride may have potentiated it as combined GHB and GABAB agonism releases dopamine, gaba and opiates, is just felt a smooth very anxiolytic background feeling and amphetamine wore offsmoothly i couldnt even feel it stop working, it was awesome but then amphetamine was inhibited.

Can you tell me your dosing regime? How many times a day do your take amp and baclofen and what doses?

IMO baclofen seems like the perfect add on to amphetamine.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I highly recommend the addition of amisulpiride too, i think then you may be completely cured if you need an extra push, i found they syngized very well.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I'm curious wheter memantine would prevent baclofen addiction, it definatly prevented my GBL tolerance and i huge ammounts, i cant say about addiction as g addiction can be avoided itself by not using it for sleep.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Today im on 50mg solian, 450mg wellbutrin and 3x800mg gabapentin, amphetamine and GBL, didnt take anything of the first pharms yesterday as i was on vacation and they dont allow drugs without a paper that a docter prescribed it. One thing i noticed:


> I find that without baclofen my abuse is curbed down as well, something happened (everything is fine now) wich made me panic a bit an usually that makes me take massive overdoses of stimulants, i did take more then normal and am on recreational dose but i stopped after that, its a major difference.


I also notice that i'm much more hesistant to take GBL, i like think about taking a dose but only do it 30 minutes later or something.

Baclofen had a MAJOR effect on my GBL intake, it was like i know it makes me high but i didnt bother taking it lol untill maybe at the end one dose or something, its interesting how those drugs are so powerfull. but it seemed to inhibited amp so the last dose i took of that was the day before yesterday, i'm gonna add drugs one by one now and wait a few days to check the effects.

Im thinking wellbutrin alone would even be enough to prevent tolerance issues, i'm gonna leave out DXM for a bit, im still convinced alpha3beta4 antagonism prevents tolerance and is the reason why that anti smokine med upregulates dopamine.



> Methods Find Exp Clin Pharmacol. 2004 Oct;26(8):623-6.
> Protective effect of bupropion on morphine tolerance and dependence in mice.
> Joshi D, Singh A, Naidu PS, Kulkarni SK.
> 
> ...





> J Pharm Pharmacol. 2009 Apr;61(4):493-502.
> Effects of co-administration of bupropion and nicotine or D-amphetamine on the elevated plus maze test in mice.
> Biala G, Kruk M.
> 
> ...





> Reversal of Triazolam Tolerance and Withdrawal-Induced Hyperlocomotor Activity and Anxiety by Bupropion in Mice
> Dipesh Joshi, Pattipati S. Naidu, Amanpreet Singh, Shrinivas K. Kulkarni
> 
> Pharmacology Division, University Institute of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Panjab University, Chandigarh, India
> ...


Why am i less chaotic with drugs? perhaps one of the drugs i take is working for my impulsivity.

The best drug ever for is the girl i love tough:heart


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## martyboi (Sep 18, 2009)

damn. i'd love to see a study on how a memantine/wellbutrin combo would work to mitigate tolerance. crayzymed, have you tried this?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Nope, i dont have any money for memantine, ran out months ago, want it back tough. I wish it was insured here.

Im just using wellbutrin along for tolerance atm, well see how it works.


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

crayzyMed said:


> Baclofen seemed to inhibit amphetamine after a few days, and also for another member at and mind and muscle, id like to solve this as i loved the baclofen and amphetamine combo, altough i think amisulpiride may have potentiated it as combined GHB and GABAB agonism releases dopamine, gaba and opiates, is just felt a smooth very anxiolytic background feeling and amphetamine wore offsmoothly i couldnt even feel it stop working, it was awesome but then amphetamine was inhibited.
> 
> Can you tell me your dosing regime? How many times a day do your take amp and baclofen and what doses?
> 
> IMO baclofen seems like the perfect add on to amphetamine.


So are you saying that I am likely to notice a diminished effect from Dexedrine after a few days of combining the two? This isn't particularly good news as I am finding that baclofen on its own doesn't do much of anything positive for me unless it is co administered with dexedrine.

As for my dosing regimine I take dexedrine on most days (with the occasional day off...1 or 2 days a week) and baclofen I have only just started using but usually I take it just once in a day (more prn than anything) when I feel the need to be particularly social. Dosages of dexedrine vary depending on my day but it is generally anywhere from 25-40mg/day and I require 50mg of baclofen for the pro social, anxiolytic effects.

I am finding Baclofen to be far super to Klonopin in my case...there is definitely something about it that makes me connect much more easily with others and instead of just killing anxiety like most benzos it really pushes me to be pro social. It seems as if it has an effect on how approachable others find me as well...I am finding that others will often randomly strike up a conversation with me which is something totally new to me.



> I highly recommend the addition of amisulpiride too, i think then you may be completely cured if you need an extra push, i found they syngized very well.


What is amisulpiride likely to do for my regimen? I have never heard of it...time to do some research!

Thanks!


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

No, only some ppl have that issue, dont think about it if you dont.

Amisulpiride works great for anhedonia and theoretically ghb and gabab agonism togheter releases opiates, gaba and dopamine, it raises prolactin a ton tough.


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## newboki (Sep 13, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> No, only some ppl have that issue, dont think about it if you dont.
> 
> Amisulpiride works great for anhedonia and theoretically ghb and gabab agonism togheter releases opiates, gaba and dopamine, it raises prolactin a ton tough.


Amisulpiride , isn't that antipsychotic and does it have tardivia dyskenisia.

I am posting this because i know you are against antipsyhotics for sa crazymed.


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

Theoretically amisulpride can be used at low dose to treat MDD off-label or at higher dose for psychosis. 

My experience with Amisulpride is only at the lower / 50mg daily. It didn't really do much for me @ that dose, in spite of the literature backing 5-ht7 antagonism. Perhaps it was insufficient dosage. I don't know and atm don't care. It didn't have any negative side effects for me, although I still wouldn't suggest taking it without going through an MD first.


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## Medline (Sep 23, 2008)

The 50mg dose is right.


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## Vilazodone (Mar 22, 2010)

Medline said:


> The 50mg dose is right.


Depends on the individual and what you're using it for. Either way it felt pretty clean.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I apoligize for not replying to my private messages, ive had a pyschotic episode last weekend so some of my last posts could be complete jibberish. I tought ppl were talking dutch to me and remember something about being in a place that was selling carpets and other rubbish, really strange, so i can sympathise with vilazodone, this was the second psychotic episode i ever had.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I also had a tonic clonic seizure yesterday, i'm going in the same direction as rocknroll perhaps i should be a little more carefull with what i'm trying.


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## billyho (Apr 12, 2010)

crayzyMed said:


> I also had a tonic clonic seizure yesterday, i'm going in the same direction as rocknroll perhaps i should be a little more carefull with what i'm trying.


be careful dude, i vaguely remember what rocknroll did. would you be willing to post the combos you were on, (without dosages) so others can learn the dangers of these combos. that is of course if you are feeling up to it. kinda like a 'what not to mix' thread.

glad you're doing better :rub


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I was taking acamprosate, gabapentin umm im forgetting alot, amphetamine, that was the basic it most likely was gabapentin wich was associated with psychosis in clinical study's, offcourse as a response for psychosis i started taking recreational doses of amp, luckily without bad effects and took way more then 600mg tramadol time released one day, wich was just stupid and then got that seizure (i was also on 450mg wellbutrin).

Mostly just being stupid, the only message i can give never think your immume, even if it feels like it, but i doubt many would listen like me lol.


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your recent troubles crazyMed! I'm feeling I'm beginning to hit somewhat of a roadblock with my current regimen and am hoping I can get some input from those of you with far more pharmacological knowledge than myself. I am still on memantine (25mg/day) and Sertraline (50mg/day.) I am not noticing any negatives from either of these and the memantine does seem to be helping with tolerance somewhat so I intend to stick with these two for the time being. In addition I am taking Dexedrine nearly everyday for my ADD and have been jumping back and forth between klonopin and baclofen for SA. 

This regimen was working beautifully for quite some time but I am beginning to notice increasing depression, anhedonia, and tolerance slowly developing to my dexedrine again. Interestingly I have found that higher doses of baclofen really seemed to take care of the depression and anhedonia but I avoided taking this frequently as I don't want to develop a dependency to it. It is quite frustrating as just when I thought I had things figured out and everything was beginning to go very well for me it seems I am going to have to re - evaluate my regimen and suffer through another extended break from dexedrine to reset tolerance...at a time when I really feel I can't afford to do so!

Anyway I'm trying to figure out how I should adjust my current regimen. I actually just recently went through an extensive attentiveness/memory neuropsych test mostly to just confirm my ADD diagnosis and although I was pretty sure the test would confirm ADD I was a bit surprised to find out that I tested in the lowest 6% for attentiveness/ability to retain information, etc. Interestingly the neuropsychiatrist suggested that Nuvigil or Provigil might be a better fit for my ADD symptoms based on the test results and I'm certainly willing to give it a try...any thoughts on this one?

The depression and anhedonia are the most troubling symptoms I am dealing with right now...I considered increasing my Sertraline dosage for this but I am thinking of giving Curcumin a try instead. I ordered some "Life Extension Super Bio-curcumin" (400mg capsules) and figure I will give this a try first. I know many of you are using Curcumin with positive results, what sort of dosage should I be taking per day, and how long can I expect before seeing any results? Sorry for the long post, I'm just feeling a bit lost at the moment. Any input is greatly appreciated!


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Do you take amphetamine daily? To avoid tolerance its not enough to just take memantine on its own, but add in a 2 day break every weak or a week break every 3 weeks wich should be sufficient (if not combine both) on the break days use provigil as an alternative, wich would most likely be working fine for ADHD but not so much for social anxiety, since tolerance allready developped you may need a longer break.

For tolerance i'm gonna be combining memantine (30mg), DXM (30mg 3 times a day) and acamprosate (1 gram 3 times a day). Also i would advice taking atleast 500mg curcumin a day, but i would also experiment with higher doses to see what would be working best.

Its interesting baclofen helped your amp tolerance, it inhibited amp for me after 2 days.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Next regime:

Memantine 30mg /day
Acamprosate 3x 1 gram
Dextromethorphan 30mg 3x /day or AMT 7,5mg /day
Curcumin 2 gram /day
Resveratrol 2 gram /day
NAC 600mg 2x /day
Methylene blue
Wellbutrin 450mg /day
Amphetamine 20mg 3x /day
Modafinil on the amphetamine break days
Etizolam 1mg 3x /day
Phenibut / GBL

Well see how this one will work out.


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> Next regime:
> 
> Memantine 30mg /day
> Acamprosate 3x 1 gram
> ...


dude thats way too much. for one dxm can cause psychosis and memory impairment and its crap. you dont need phenibut or etizolam either.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

bben said:


> dude thats way too much. for one dxm can cause psychosis and memory impairment and its crap. you dont need phenibut or etizolam either.


DXM never caused psychosis for me, perhaps if your shizo wich im not. It may be crap for you, but it can be sexy for me. Memantine is alot better tough so i may just drop it. Yes i do need phenibut or etizolam to block amphetamine induced paranoia, altough DXM helps for that too but not very much.


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> DXM never caused psychosis for me, perhaps if your shizo wich im not. It may be crap for you, but it can be sexy for me. Memantine is alot better tough so i may just drop it. Yes i do need phenibut or etizolam to block amphetamine induced paranoia, altough DXM helps for that too but not very much.


DXM is crap for everyone and it will impair memory in everyone. Memantine is far superior to it. You need those compounds to block stim paranoia? Well normal people do not, sound schizo to me along with the multiple psychotic episodes, erratic behavior, and drug addiction. Then again maybe not, either way dxm sucks in any form but acutely on occasion.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Ive only had 3 psychotic episodes induced by stim overdoses (wich can induce psychosis in most people) besides our disorder may be related to psycho but i love disagreeing too much with you haha, you may be right about DXM buddy, but i do still have doubts about the shizo relation (altough i consider it a possibility).


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> Ive only had 3 psychotic episodes induced by stim overdoses (wich can induce psychosis in most people) besides our disorder may be related to psycho but i love disagreeing too much with you haha, you may be right about DXM buddy, but i do still have doubts about the shizo relation (altough i consider it a possibility).


Your ignoring my main point, which is that dxm is crap for chronic use.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

bben said:


> Your ignoring my main point, which is that dxm is crap for chronic use.


And what is the reason you consider it bad for chronic use?


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> And what is the reason you consider it bad for chronic use?


the same reason i would say any non-selective nmda antagonist is bad chronically... something like memantine is far different from dxm....


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

bben said:


> the same reason i would say any non-selective nmda antagonist is bad chronically... something like memantine is far different from dxm....


Why? Its other actions are actually pretty interesting too.


> Med Hypotheses. 2011 Feb 28. [Epub ahead of print]
> Dextromethorphan as a potential rapid-acting antidepressant.
> Lauterbach EC.
> 
> ...


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## Sapphiress (Jun 15, 2010)

omg.. dude.. dxm.. and all that other stuff? you're gonna tear yourself up. this is sick.. you need to lay off the drugs seriously. treatment resistant people? what treatments have you dedicated yourself to besides pills and snorting powders? oh my I seriously fear for you.. you're frying your brain and you are pretty far gone. you need to realize what you're doing is not cool at all

**woah ok that was just from your first post.. I was outraged...
then I see you said this



crayzyMed said:


> I apoligize for not replying to my private messages, ive had a pyschotic episode last weekend
> 
> I also had a tonic clonic seizure yesterday


this is seriously revolting and I think you need to wizen up as quickly as possible. also you shouldn't be allowed to post such things on this board cuz if you die you're putting them in jeopardy. omg plz get help and stop with the drugs. there are natural ways to better yourself and you need to hurry and get back before you go way too far


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Sapphiress said:


> what treatments have you dedicated yourself to besides pills and snorting powders?


Constant social exposure, building social skills and gaining confidence are a crucial part of recovery, if you think i live in a dilusion pills fix all then you are serieusly wrong, its a fact that only social wanting (being outside with ppl) can only be gained by constantly pushing yourself outside, its a mistake i often see, ppl take drugs and wait for the drug to do that for them wich, you know just wont happen.

I do understand your reply as you lack knowledge pharmacology wise and it does look like excess.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Snorting powders? lol thats not a treatment btw, thats a recreational activity besides taking other drugs including drinking alcohol or whatever else ppl do in weekends, no idea that i ever said snorting smothing was therapeutic.

But as ive said, exposure, exposure and more exposure, when i went out daily with my friends for several months after several weeks i went nuts if i stayed inside while they were outside, and often i was the guy calling everyone up to go outside, i wasnt on any drugs then, but even tough i felt extremely uncomfortable around them, there was major social wanting, i cant stress enough that pushing yourself in social situations is an essential thing, besides building confidence, but it can take weeks maybe months to fully induce confidence.

As an aside, wheter confidence and exposure therapy are enough is completely personally dependent, social anxiety can have differend causes.

The approuch i'm taking is differend pharmaceuticals in lower doses instead of one in a higher dose, as an example memantine, dxm and acamprosate can be replaced by a higher dose then memantine, however al 3 glutamate antagonist compliment eachother, doses should be lowered of all 3 tough (i may adjust the doses, i can only determine what the minimal needed is after experimentation) then it really isnt any worse then a higher dose of one compound.

Curcumin, resveratrol, NAC and methylene blue are basicly just normal supplement that provide neuroprotection and are only beneficial.

Then basicly the treatment itself:
Amphetamine combined with etizolam or phenibut or GBL or etizolam and gbl/phenibut only my experience will tell me whats best, likewise if i combine something the doses of 2 things would be lowered.


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## KW5789 (Jan 17, 2011)

> Do you take amphetamine daily? To avoid tolerance its not enough to just take memantine on its own, but add in a 2 day break every weak or a week break every 3 weeks wich should be sufficient (if not combine both) on the break days use provigil as an alternative, wich would most likely be working fine for ADHD but not so much for social anxiety, since tolerance allready developped you may need a longer break.
> 
> For tolerance i'm gonna be combining memantine (30mg), DXM (30mg 3 times a day) and acamprosate (1 gram 3 times a day). Also i would advice taking atleast 500mg curcumin a day, but i would also experiment with higher doses to see what would be working best.
> 
> Its interesting baclofen helped your amp tolerance, it inhibited amp for me after 2 days.


Thanks for the reply crazyMed, I was usually taking a 1 day break every week and evidently that was not sufficient. I just took 2 days off but found the depressed mood and total loss of ability to do much of anything over this time unacceptable to go through every week so I am going to need to figure something out for the depressive symptoms (or perhaps Provigil will prove effective to cycle with dexedrine.) The 2 day break was indeed sufficient to bring my dexedrine's effectiveness back though as it is working fine today.

The curcumin I purchased comes in 400mg capsules so I think I will start at 800mg/day...does it make a difference what time of day I take it at? My current routine is 10mg memantine + 50mg sertraline in the morning, 15mg memantine late afternoon and supplements before bed (B complex, multivitamin,Vitamin C, D3, and fish oil.) I am torn between trying just adding curcumin or also increasing my sertraline dose but I think I will just add curcumin for now. Also I didn't find Baclofen to have any effect on tolerance to Dexedrine, but it does seem to consistently be very effective for depression and anhedonia in my case.


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## sdf (May 3, 2011)

I'm having trouble keeping up with what you're taking but many of the things you're taking lower the seizure threshold by quite a bit, especially if you're not taking any of the AEDs or GABAergics.

I believe methylene blue is a (reversible?) MAOI which would make it unsafe with DXM's affinity for SERT as well as interacting with both AMP and and modafinil at the doses you're using).

You're asking for excitotoxicity here..



crayzyMed said:


> Next regime:
> 
> Memantine 30mg /day
> Acamprosate 3x 1 gram
> ...


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

This is my ultimate combo:

2 gram revgenetics curcumin
*1200 mg NAC*
*Creatine*
40 mg Memantine
*3x 333mg Acamprosate*
*3x 60 mg Dextromethorphan *cycled with 7,5 mg alpha methyl tryptamine
3x 20mg Racemic amphetamine cycled with other stimulants and small regular tolerance breaks.
Etizolam cycled with GBL

The bold is what im on now, ran out of mem for a few days, and out of stimulants again. The *******s at customs started screwing around in my curcumin while leaving trough my benzo's and meds. Now got to fill in some papers or some ****.

This is more minimal then the above, and should be sustainable and work long term, too much stuff is throwing away money anyway.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sdf said:


> I'm having trouble keeping up with what you're taking but many of the things you're taking lower the seizure threshold by quite a bit, especially if you're not taking any of the AEDs or GABAergics.
> 
> I believe methylene blue is a (reversible?) MAOI which would make it unsafe with DXM's affinity for SERT as well as interacting with both AMP and and modafinil at the doses you're using).
> 
> You're asking for excitotoxicity here..


Methylene blue is a neglible maoi, acamprosate, memantine, curcumin all protect against exctioxiticy, etizolam lowers the seizure treshold, but my latest plan is more minimal.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Received a bunch of supplements to play around with:


Doctor's Best, High Absorption Magnesium, 100 mg, 120 Tablets(DRB-00025)

Now Foods, EGCg Green Tea Extract, 400 mg, 90 Vcaps(NOW-04704)

MRM, Relax - All, with Phenibut, 60 Veggie Caps(MRM-31017)

Doctor's Best, Suntheanine L-Theanine, 150 mg, 90 Veggie Caps(DRB-00197)

Nutricology, FibroBoost, 75 Veggie Caps(ARG-55910)

Paradise Herbs, Astragalus, 60 Veggie Caps(PAR-77727)

Jarrow Formulas, Curcumin 95, 500 mg, 60 Capsules(JRW-14004)

Now Foods, Gotu Kola, 450 mg, 100 Capsules(NOW-04700)

D aspartic acid

I quite like phenibut, unfortionally its a complete disaster due to the tolerance and withdrawal issues, but im gonna test memantine's effectiveness here in combatting those issues.

Dont have any GBL atm, so far phenibut is working well for anhedonia and it reduces my anxiety, i only took 1 cap of that relax all stuff wich is 500mg, took 3 more later wich should still kick in, as 2 grams seemed to be a typical dose, i'm curious.

Also going on valproic acid tomorrow hopefully, i'm damn sick of going manic on amp everytime, and it should also help amp anxiety due to its gabaergic effects (and theoretically my supplements should potentiate that, i'l see so i know what and how much of what to take soon.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Currently i'm following this protocol, im only gonna follow this for a month after wich i'm gonna try supplements on their own, or smaller combinations or something entirely differend, basicly i'm gonna cycle every month, im quite skeptical of excessive combination of supplements as they could cancel eachother benefits out or even worse cause negative effects. I do beleive that they might synergize thats why sometimes id combine most things for a month like im gonna do now.

A few hours before i wake up i take MRM relax wich contains phenibut combined with other stuff, i take 2 grams each morning.

This makes me quite dopey and sleepy, not really pleasant to try and stay awake on, however after i wake up i take the following:
Memantine 20mg
Magnesium 100mg
Curcumin 500mg
Ecklonia cava 3600mg
EGCG 500mg
Gotu kola 1 gram
L theanine 300mg
D aspartic acid 3 gram
DXM 60mg
Aniracetam 500mg

After those kick in i feel a good ammount of energy togheter with the positive effects of phenibut.

At the evening i take:
Memantine 20mg
Curcumin 500mg
Ecklonia cava 3600mg
EGCG 500mg
Gotu kola 1 gram
L theanine 300mg
D aspartic acid 3 gram
Nac 1200mg
DXM 60mg
Astragalus extract 750mg
Aniracetam 500mg

The phenibut seems to feel nearly identical to low dose amisulpiride, atleast in this combination and i cant exactly pinpoint what is phenibut but the majority of the anti anhedonic, anxiolytic and mood boosting effects _most likely_ come from that. It makes sense it feels simular to a low dose as amisulpiride as the presynaptic gabab receptors wich phenibut most likely acts on (as opposed to the postsynaptics) disinhibit dopamine release like presynaptic dopamine antagonism.

This does make me curious how it would synergize with amisulpiride.

Also the big question:
*Can tolerance be prevented to phenibut?*

Time will tell.

As a note i do NOT encourage combining so many supplements, but i want to give it a try for a month after wich i'm gonna cycle one or a couple of individual supplements everytime.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Ibogaine tolerance report:


> For Swim, stoping use of GHB for about one week and use small amount of Iboga root (about one gram each morning) give the effects back.
> Swim was initiate to high dose of Iboga earlier.
> I don't know if it works if you 're not be initiate to Iboga.
> (it works for all drugs for swim, iboga root reinitialize receptors)
> ...





> It works for swim.
> I will research for source on the "reinitialisation" of receptors.
> It works great for withdrawal too.
> When swim made his initiation it was in very bad shape, very addict to GHB (40g/24h) and all withdrawal symptoms disapears with the first spoon of Iboga roots (approximatively 5g).
> ...


Ive been stalling on trying it, wonna try it in daily low doses soon, its interesting that guy said it reversed gbl tolerance, memantine did that for a part for me but not really fully, it might still get better tough, ive just got back from my girlfriend in england, i chucked away my gbl here as this one i had has a horrible taste, rather avoid that impure garbage, gonna get other good gbl and meanwhile trying some phenibut. I took a break of gbl for a couple of weeks some time ago to see how that would affect tolerance, when i restarted gbl i also started memantine and then i had partional tolerance reversal.

I wonder wheter ibogaine could have mood stabilising effects, as it seemed to act on simular pathways as valproic? (could be wrong).

Ive settled on 2 grams of phenibut, this is the 4th day i'm taking it, still waiting for it to kick in, didnt notice any development of tolerance yet but its still to early to tell, hopefully my tolerance experiment would be succesfull as phenibut aint too bad, i'm curious how it would synergize with stims or GBL, oh an it would definatly be interesting with AMT imo, need to give that another try.

And lets hope phenibut wont be the first substance i get physically addicted to lol, altough that may be the perfect time for a ibogaine trial haha.

This mrm relax mix makes me really dopey, however my other supplements give me a big energy boost, they seem to be working synergetically, so far im happy with the results, but yeah really need to give all this a try with a stim or something.


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

crayzyMed said:


> The phenibut seems to feel nearly identical to low dose amisulpiride, atleast in this combination and i cant exactly pinpoint what is phenibut but the majority of the anti anhedonic, anxiolytic and mood boosting effects _most likely_ come from that. It makes sense it feels simular to a low dose as amisulpiride as the presynaptic gabab receptors wich phenibut most likely acts on (as opposed to the postsynaptics) disinhibit dopamine release like presynaptic dopamine antagonism.
> 
> This does make me curious how it would synergize with amisulpiride.
> 
> ...


Interestingly, that they have recently included in information sheets to phenibut (which is sold as drug, not supplement in Russia), indication of extremely low doses (like 40-50 mg) for asthenia. In analogy to amisulpiride, it is that low doses that must be presynaptically selective. 
The story is likely to be similar to that of baclofen, there low doses are selective for GABA-ergic inhibitory neurons, thus disinhibiting dopamine, and high doses affect dopaminergic neurons of VTA. But what doses are considered to be 'low'?

I think you overestimate tolerance issues with phenibut. I'be been taking it for years, not every day, but quite often, every weekend or so (last several months). It doesn't seem to loose the magic (there were never real magic lol), but effects are still here. Week-or-so breaks are enough for me.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

^^I agree that it may likely keep working if you take it that way, was mostly referring to daily use, wich is impossible with phenibut, unless perhaps i can prevent tolerance haha.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

> But what doses are considered to be 'low'?


Ive read 2mg of baclofen was dopaminergic for someone, who gives it a try? lol


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

Have you taken kratom crazy med? How did you find it?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Arisa1536 said:


> Have you taken kratom crazy med? How did you find it?


I only tried kratom once i think but didnt notice anything of it, but then again, there's no opiate that works for me on its own without a stimulant for some reason. It seems like a good herb tough but it has tolerance issues.


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

Yeah tolerance issues are there with kratom but not as bad as benzos IMO but the taste of resin is like vomit and the leaves are not great although the effects are worth it but you do need a lot of it to achieve the desired effect. its very short acting though, only lasting 6 hours, so its actually an opiate?

question, can you still obtain opium poppies? or are they off the market so to speak?
i know of a girl in the west coast which in new zealand is a barren farm town, who has opium poppies and she says they are amazingly good. So yeah curious


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

You can still get them yes, you can even get dried poppy pods in flower stores but be warned for addiction tough, id only take them in combination with memantine or something and regular breaks, altough for some people they can work long term, many get addicted to opiates.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I received my MCT curcumin, bag with micronized resveratrol and aniracetam today, i got enough supplements for a pretty long time now lol.

Added in the aniracetam and resveratrol today


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Just drank some tobacco tea (opened up a marlboro cigarette, but the contents in one of those teathings you can put something up and then i let it soak with lemon tea for a bit in water, taste's good with some sugar.
Notice decreased anhedonia, and more alertness perhaps less adhd but need to give it a good trial.


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## 49erJT (Oct 18, 2010)

crayzyMed said:


> Just drank some tobacco tea (opened up a marlboro cigarette, but the contents in one of those teathings you can put something up and then i let it soak with lemon tea for a bit in water, taste's good with some sugar.
> Notice decreased anhedonia, and more alertness perhaps less adhd but need to give it a good trial.


That had to taste like **** :b


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Actually it was tasting nice, but i added lemon tea in my first cup and strawberry tea in my second cup with loads of sugar and some milk, not bad at all haha!


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Nature has provided us with the best herbal products for depression and other disorder ever:

Combine low doses of iboga root bark with some tea of poppy pods.

Herbal products do work!


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

crayzyMed said:


> Nature has provided us with the best herbal products for depression and other disorder ever:
> 
> Combine low doses of iboga root bark with some tea of poppy pods.
> 
> Herbal products do work!


Yeah, kratom among them. It's not only an opioid, but 5HT2 antagonist and alpha2-antagonist as well.

Tobacco tea - bright idea


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

broflovski said:


> Yeah, kratom among them. It's not only an opioid, but 5HT2 antagonist and alpha2-antagonist as well.
> 
> Tobacco tea - bright idea


Indeed 
Herbal products are legal too, we ordered some poppy seeds in new zealand are planting them so we should have lots of poppy pods ready by the spring time  Since its winter over here and thats the best time to plant (late autumn or late winter) add kratom to it and its a legal sedative with no nasty side effects

although tolerance and addiction is an issue, there is heaps of it to spare so its not an issue


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Just got amp!

Well see how it works with my supplements, i was 100% tolerant to stimulants before i started my regime, i think ive been on a break and on my regime for a week now.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Extremely interesting results on my supplement stack, amp feels highly therapeutic, works great for social anxiety, adds in motivation, works for ADHD while i seem to avoid mania and other **** at this dose, normally even at low doses amp causes mania and makes me act crazy (i was pretty sick of that wanted to be able to use amp more therapeutically).

I ran out of phenibut tough, so cant see how it stacks up with amp, the last few days didnt notice any tolerance to it but only took it daily for a week.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Im feeling productive, motivated, sa is gone while i still act normal, i'm very very impressed never had such therapeutic response to amp, normally it really causes way too much euphoria and makes me go crazy, i'm very pleased hopefully those results continue.

Also no urge to abuse it.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Didnt notice any cognitive impairment at all from adding a benzo today and earlier from going up to 40mg of memantine, some stuff in my supplement regime seems to be very powerfull cognitively enhancing.

Also great effect on my acne, my grandparents also saw the difference, probably related to gotu kola as its been shown to have positive effects on skin, but again there are many confounding factors other supplements can contribute too.



> god i love this stuff.
> 
> In no way is this weak herbal crap. As far as psychotropic effects ive tried most known and hyped herbs out there and ive found them either completely dissapointing or just too weak to bother with.
> 
> ...


This guy on bluelight loves gotu kola lol, again cant really tell with all my sups but i wonder wheter this is what keeps me so damn stable, ive never experienced this before, my mood is really damn stable, its awesome, didnt notice this effect when i tried most of the other supplements in the past.


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## CD700 (Apr 22, 2010)

gotu kola lol
Going to see if i can get it in a local herbal shop today
Apparently native to Northern Australia so fingers crosses


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

blakeyz said:


> gotu kola lol
> Going to see if i can get it in a local herbal shop today
> Apparently native to Northern Australia so fingers crosses


In a human study they used a 12 gram dose, so you may need a higher dose then the bottle says, altough i currently take 2 grams a day gonna get a cheaper extract and then go to 12.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=570811&highlight=gotu+kola

Those 2 guys seem to love it for opiate withdrawal.


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## CD700 (Apr 22, 2010)

crayzyMed said:


> In a human study they used a 12 gram dose, so you may need a higher dose then the bottle says, altough i currently take 2 grams a day gonna get a cheaper extract and then go to 12.


Gotu Kola (200g)
$14.45
The herbal shop I went to were out of it so I just got some online for much cheaper anyway.......cant wait to give it a try
Hope it doesnt mess with Parnate:afr


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

It should be fine with parnate, my top 3 of supplements is curcumin, nac and gotu kola.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

The other top of anxiolytic herbs that really work:
Magnolia bark
Mulungu

Most other things are ****.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Gotta stock up on phenazepam, im immume to acting wierd or blackouts on benzo's so i can use it safely, for nearly everyone else 90% of the time it ends in a trainwreck haha.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Received my AMT and MPA today.


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## CD700 (Apr 22, 2010)

crayzyMed said:


> Received my AMT and MPA today.


What is AMT and MPA short for ?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

blakeyz said:


> What is AMT and MPA short for ?


Alpha methyl tryptamine, mpa dont remember in my head, warning this **** is for crazy ppl like me lol.


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## feelalone (May 1, 2010)

Is Gotu Kola supposed to take effects soon after you first start to take it, or has to build up in your bloodstream?


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## CD700 (Apr 22, 2010)

Got some of this today
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melissa_officinalis
just had a cup before and don't really notice anything


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

Took some a Ilex_guayusa today, not as strong as kratom but was good and very safe  gave a calming and alert sensation that i have not felt since effexor first started kicking in. Its not the same as an opiate based high but its subtle and lasted a while too, and probably legal in most places.

On a kratom high at the moment, hubby and i have been since the afternoon
Tea is bitter though, we prefer just munching the leaves with cans of pepsi on hand
:cup

very nice for euphoria, sleep and relaxation
The only side effect is itching
does anyone else here get the opiate itch?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

My list of essential antidepressants, if your depressed and treatment resistant these agents can be a proper alternative, doing some more reading on toxiticy and effiacy is recommend to asses the risks.

Ketamine
Low daily dose ibogaine
Memantine
DXM
Addition of a low dose opiate to ibogaine
AMT
Salvia afterglow
Buprenorphine

Those agents adress a broad spectrum of pathways wich can have effiacy in depression, due to the role of other neurotransmitters besides serotonine, there's a high possibility that results are achieved far outreaching those of traditional antidepressants.

Theoretical effiacy or effiacy in rodent models:
Candesartan
Curcumin
Cerebrolysin
Testosterone

Personal reviews of exotic stuff will be apreciated as this can help other individuals.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

The next substance il put some work is gonna be ibogaine, while memantine is excellent for tolerance related issues, there are still some issues left untreated namely addiction, withdrawals and mental addiction with certain substances, ibogaine may have some very interesting potential here, its more known for curing heroin addicts, but you gotta trip on it wich may limit its potenial, however less well known it can also be used in daily small doses for (intermittent) periods.

Such therapeutic possibility's have undeniably a tremendous therapeutic potential, collecting all documentation and making it more known is thus warranted.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Cut back on doses and supplements i was taking excess is never good currently:

Amphetamine 3 times a day
Etizolam 3 times a day
Phenibut
memantine twice a day
D aspartic acid twice a day
Aniracetam twice a day
1800 mg NAC in the evening

Will add in 2 and a half mg of lexapro

Still take gbl for recreation but lost intrest in it a bit due to anti addictive property's of certain things i take amp euphoria is blunted too wich makes it more productive

Im hoping memantine prevents benzo and phenibut addiction otherwise i have to add in ibogaine


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Didnt visit this site for a long time my apologiez email your msn if anyone has questions.

My current regime is
2,5mg lexapro

40mg time released ritalin (i think i actually prefer this therapeutically with lexapro)
0,5mg risperdal in a dose that prevents the horrid side effects seen when given without stimulants, atleast need more confirmation for this.

It blocks abusing stimulants wich was a issue of me

1,8mg NAC 3 times a day and 500mg curcumin

I stopped GBL will be replaced with either tiagabine or phenibut (in case tolerance to it stays on issue on nac and curcumin i will add in ibogaine or cycle with tiagabine).


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

My latest regime looks quite differend from my others but i basicly messed myself up last year in october with overdoses of several things (unrelated to anything experimental)

That besides i concluded too much euphoria doesnt help me even tough the mood boost of a normal amp dose is no issue for others.
One thing can be said everyone's brain is complex and ive been on some very interesting regime's wich i'm sure can benefit ppl knowing the positives downsides and dangers.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Im still having a hard time reading text i want to read like a full text or something and still quite hyperactive on my regime ritalin with the other stuff excellent for sa and motivation but bad for focus and staying calm wich amp worked for.

So back to amp! Cant abuse it anyway on that risperdal dose.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Same regime today but with amphetamine;

2,5mg lexapro
Curcumin
NAC
Half a mg risperdal
Amphetamine
Phenibut

Amphetamine euphoria abolished and still feel motivated on amp probably because of the combo of risperdal and lexapro added to it, at first i still craved amp while not being able to get high on it this is now gone too i suspect due to phenibut (baclofen wich supresses dopamine is anti craving, phenibut that raises it isnt) however due to the risperdal the dopamine release of phenibut is blunted making it possible the anti craving effects of gabab come true.

Could have stayed up all night and taken loads of amp but didnt even feel like it yesterday just my therapeutic dose wich fixed me up and decided to go sleep early as i'm in london now had to get out of bed soon.

Hopefully my regime keeps working succesfully.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Im gonna replace risperdal with minocycline wich abolishes amp abuse and euphoria while keeping the beneficial effects, togheter with my new strategy ( amonth in with major succes).

Im basing my regime around glutamate activation, a few compounds:
Nac
Piracetam
Lysine
Glycine
Amphetamine
Risperdal wich indirectly modulates glutamate.

As i beleive i got dysregulated glutamate simular to the prepsychotic phase of something in the shizo spectrum, i only have negative symptons, and still have emotions, to test this hypothesis i tried a regime around that.

Risperdal currently abolishes amp euphoria, while togheter with the rest shifts balance to the pfc, mino abolishes reward related dopamine release and makes amp more of a glutamate releaser.


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## ntdc (Jun 29, 2011)

Buprenorphine and DXM combo didnt work? i am surprised i would imagine you would get quite a good high from this because of the effect of DXM to potentiate opiates


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I never tried that and it would probably work but i dont like opiates.

Being high constantly was damn easy homeostasis is beat in a notebeat, but getting high the whole time was no cure for my life, now i am nearly completely cured with something that works long term.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

My current regime is:

5mg lexapro
100mg minocycline
3x 1200mg nac
10 gram piracetam
10 gram fish oil
40mg time released ritalin in the morning for all day or racemic amphetamine
10mg baclofen still noticed some paranoia on stims, baclofen abolishes this while improving cognition and releasing glutamate in several brainarea's at presynaptic doses.

Nicotine patch, but actually seemed overkill sometimes with the other stuff may leave this one out.
1mg Methylcobalin

My biggest improvement is sa reduction, talkativeness and complete abolishement of anhedonia without stimulants, i cant feel amp wear off i feel like i'm on it without it allready.

Im glad i trashed risperdal, seems like another recycled byproduct of some synth for plummer.

Final adjustments nearly done, have had consistent succes for a month on this regime and its gonna be a keeper.


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## newboki (Sep 13, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> My current regime is:
> 
> 5mg lexapro
> 100mg minocycline
> ...


I trust nothing we will see how it works in a year or two.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

newboki said:


> I trust nothing we will see how it works in a year or two.


The longer the more evidence it works indeed haha.


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## freud (Sep 21, 2011)

Your sure about Minocycline? The adverse effects sound like a horrorstory.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

freud said:


> Your sure about Minocycline? The adverse effects sound like a horrorstory.


Its essential for blunting amp euphoria and abolishing cravings for everything, it also helps tolerance and aids in a few other things, its very neurotrophic, pretty good stuff actually despite some side effects.


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## QuietBoy99 (Sep 7, 2010)

There is strong evidence that these drugs do indeed cause major harmful side effects.


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## F1X3R (Jul 20, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> The longer the more evidence it works indeed haha.


So how has it worked?


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