# Official NBA Thread



## eyeguess

- NBA
- NBA at ESPN
- NBA at Yahoo
- NBA at CBS
- NBA at FOX
- NBA at Sports Illustrated
- NBA at Sporting News
- NBA at Pro Sports Daily
- NBA at Fanhouse
- Draft Express
- RealGM

News, rumors, scores, highlights, draft, etc...


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## Mr. SandMan

baksetball is the ****...

the rockets got a good scouting report...i dont know about the whole 'city thunder' or whatever, but baksetball is always good to watch...kobe will have a huge chip on his shoulder this season, i can bet he will be very mad when playoff time comes...and the grizzlies got pau gasols brother or somethin...the nba is crazy, i just want the playoffs to come...


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## eyeguess

Yeah I really like the Rockets this year and on paper they look like a team with a shot of winning it all, but you know injuries will inevitably occur to this team at the worst time, so who knows how things will end up for them? But I'm still keeping an eye out for Houston and Philly as my 'unlikely' picks to play in the finals.



Aside from that it's amazing the numbers some of these late draft picks are putting up! Granted it's just one game but...

Mario Chalmers.....17pts, 8ast, 7reb
Darrell Arthur.....11pts, 15rebs, 2blk
Jason Thompson.....18pts, 10rebs in 22 minutes off the bench!


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## n1kkuh

This just in A.I. has been moved to detroit for chauncy, Mcdyess, and some other dude, u guys think this will make them a championship team or a worse team? I personally think it will make them a better team as A.I.'s scoring is better than Chancy's, but then again Chauncy was the controller of their offence, so it'll be interesting.


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## eyeguess

I think Detroit mostly did this trade to go after a big free agent next year or in 2010 since AI's contract will be coming off the books while Billups still has a few years left on his. It's tough to tell though, Iverson could be just the guy the Pistons need to get back into the finals. But if it doesn't work out, big deal, they just won't re-sign him and they'll pick up somebody else in the offseason. They've got Stuckey, Afflalo, and Bynum so it wouldn't surprise me if in 2010 they throw some money at guys like Dirk or Amare or even Boozer this offseason.

If anything I think it makes Denver a much better team. AI was expendable in their system with the all of the offense the team already provides and with Billups running the point, he should be able to set up the other guys better and provide them with much needed perimeter d

I got to say the last few moves Denver has made were questionable but I'm really liking this trade for them and Detroit.


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## n1kkuh

I've heard they made trade A.I. for possibly Chris Bosh or Lebron, which makes sense because Lebron is not gonna win a championship with the team he's got and hes contract is ending in the summer of 2010 and so is Bosh's I think, D-wade's is too for that matter. Oh and btw Bynum is on the lakers not the pistons. 

And I think I agree with you. This deal looks like a win win situation for the two of 'em, Denver gets a mature point guard, and Pistons get a strong consistent scorer, I look forward to watching both these teams play.


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## eyeguess

haha I shouldn't have mentioned him, I was talking about Will Bynum, the scrub point guard for Detroit. I watched him drive all over Charlotte Monday night but again the guy's a scrub and probably won't be with the team next year. Stuckey and Afflalo on the other hand are going to be great players.


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## hms

I'm a big basketball fan, but now I have no team to root for (No more Sonics). So I guess my team now is the Blazers since they are closest to me and also have one of my favorite players B-Roy. I've been watching him play since his days at Garfield High School in Seattle. Plus they've got a deep young team and one of my new favorite players Rudy Fernandez out of Spain.

I think it will be the Lakers vs the Celtics in the finals again this year, but with the Lakers winning this time. My sleeper team this year is the Hawks.


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## eyeguess

I know what you're talking about man, I was a huge Hornets fan before they jetted to the Big Easy. Admittedly, I tried to not follow them but it's really tough not to like Chris Paul. But the Blazers have a good team, Brandon Roy is very legit and I'm liking what I've seen from Rudy Fernandez so far, he is so good at creating his own shot, he's like Manu Jr.


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## Lateralus

The Cavs are going to be serious contenders this year. LeBron James is an inch taller and gained another 20 lbs. of muscle. In the games I have seen, he can't be stopped. He is too strong, too fast, and too big for just about everyone now. So the defense swarms him, leaving one or two guys wide open, and this year he has Mo Williams, Delonte West, Daniel Gibson, Anderson Varejao, and Z all shooting well for him. And now there are rumors the Cavs might get McDyess.


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## eyeguess

Yeah I heard he weighs like 275 now. Not sure how accurate that is but still that's 10lbs more than Dwight Howard! That's insane!


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## Buerhle

this years rookie class is impressing me. thats one thing I have to say for right now.

mayo, rose, beasley just for starters. chalmers, anthony morrow warrior guy??

fernandez - blazer.

the list goes on and on.


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## n1kkuh

DOnt forget Eric Gordon, he hasn't gotten too many minutes, but hopefully he won't get stuck on that dead end *** Clippers organization. If you ask me Dunleavy just does not do his players justice, hes got an athletic bunch, thorton, Davis, and Camby and a few others and he insists on doing that boring *** generic offence, he needs to speed it up mang, the Clippers got mad potential, but the organization keeps fckin up, and they end up chasing Brand away, STUPID.

You guys still think Lakers is #1 after that whooping by Detroit?


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## Mr. SandMan

the nuggets look good from what i saw, i dont know about the center position, but the only real centers are still rookies besides shaq...

and lol, did anyone see that sportscenter commercial with shaq playing scrabble...i forget what word he said, then they showed the board, and it had all these shaq words like 'shaq fu' lmao...that was very funny to me, then they asked how he got all the 'q's...it was very funny...

but yea, i really havent been watching, i saw some of the nuggets/celtics game, then the first quarter of the pistons/lakers game...i usually start getting more into it when the playoffs roll around...


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## Toad Licker

bignate said:


> i usually start getting more into it when the playoffs roll around...


Funny, that's when I lose interest since it's always the same teams that win the championship every year.


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## Mr. SandMan

playoff basketball is the best basketball, go big or go home...


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## Buerhle

i realize this is a lot of peoples sleeper team, but I think it would be cool if Portland upset the Lakers in the playoffs or something crazy like that. They are not my team, but I like Aldridge and the rest of that team to maybe pull an upset or two if they get in.


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## Toad Licker

Oden is looking good and he's not completely in game shape yet, when he gets there watch out. Roy is playing like an all-star. I really like Rudy the guy is all hustle. Batum is another one I really like, he's got some raw talent for such a young guy. I could go on and on the Blazers have a lot of talented young guys.


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## Kwtrader

during the "jail blazers" days i use to just ignore the blazers but now with oden, roy, rudy, batum, lamarcus etc... i have been following them a lot more closely now. They have so much talent and very humble - compared to damon stodamire (someone i know tried to talk to him but he just ignores you), rasheed, bonzi, randolph. I think 4-6 seed playoffs.

- a heck of a job by gm-kevin pritchard.


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## BrandonCA86

How about the NBA D-LEAGUE! Woo! Go Jam!

:stu

Anyone?


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## Mr. SandMan

the NBDL is cool, never really watch it, but people do get recruted...jay williams (jason), after his accedent tried to play in that league to make a comeback i think...

but no one saw that shaq commercial??


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## eyeguess

I saw it for the first time the other day "T.I.C. Shaqtastic...29 points" "uhh... how did you get so many Q's" hahaha Stuart Scott is the man


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## Mr. SandMan

lol, i know, that commercial had me rollin...


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## conscious

the only interesting thing in the nba this year will be to see how these young players develop in the league. with all these teams clearing cap space for potential free agents in '10, a lot of teams will be unwatchable and uncompetitive. I'm basically looking at a laker-celtic final again this year. The only obstacle for the lakers maybe the rockets or spurs with an outside shot the blazers and hornets. the pistons and cavs are threats to the celtics and maybe the hawks. but i'll guess we'll see.


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## Mr. SandMan

i really like the rockets this year...if yoa could just get big, i just want to see him start boom'n it and gettin mad, then he'll be an unstopable force...i just want to see them stay healthy throughout the playoffs...


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## n1kkuh

I predict an AS$ whooping coming for the Lakers ala Boston. Even though I'm a Lakers fan till I die, they're soft and they're playing like babies, Kobe Bryant is either proving that age is getting to him or that he's trying to save himself. Either way Lakers in general better pull it together or else gg for them.


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## eyeguess

Alright you guys are going to think I'm crazy but after Tuesday night's game against Chicago, I'm going to go as far as to say DJ Augustin is the fourth best player from this year's draft. In his 6 starts this season he's averaged 19pts and 7asts while shooting 59% from behind the arc. And on Tuesday night while coming off the bench, he dropped 29pts and 7asts on Derrick Rose who ended up with only 6pts and shot 3-16 from the field. The guy gets no love from the media.


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## n1kkuh

The guy's good, but he's on a scrub team, which is why he gets no love. I'm guessing your top 4 in order are: Rose, Mayo, Beasley, then Augustin? #5= wesstbrook, #6= Eric Gordon imo. There are some players who haven't been getting much time either, like Bayless for Portland. This years draft overall was pretty strong in the guard position.

WHat are your guy's prediction for Lakers VS. Boston come christmas day?


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## Mr. SandMan

eyeguess said:


> The guy gets no love from the media.


he must not be because i havent heard much about him at all, i also feel the same way about micheal redd, but half the time when watching him play he never takes over like he should...





^^
and there goes that shaq commercial...

i think lakers are getting kindof soft also, its like they just arent trying because they know they're good...


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## Mr. SandMan

ide have to say boston...


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## Toad Licker

Brandon Roy scored 52 points in the Blazer's win over the Suns tonight, second highest score posted by a player in the nba so far this season. Roy was the wests player of the week last week and I'd have to believe he will be again this week. 

@n1kkuh: I'd love to see Bayless get more time on the court he shows signs of being a great player when he gets a chance to play. 

I'll also go with the Celtics, they're looking unstoppable this season. Either way it should be a great game to watch.


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## Mr. SandMan

greg oden dissapoints me though...every time i watch him play he's always in foul trouble...


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## yi9

LOL @ OCK Thunder's 2-22 record.


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## Toad Licker

bignate said:


> greg oden dissapoints me though...every time i watch him play he's always in foul trouble...


Oden's still getting his game legs back after spending a year on the sidelines, that really hurt. He'd be better this season if he hadn't had all that down time, I think he's almost there though. As I remember Shaq spent his first season or two as the foul out leader of the league, so he'll grow out of it I'm sure.


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## Mr. SandMan

yea, he just doesnt know how to use his body right...i saw when he got his third foul last night, and shaq just had a look on his face that was kindof stale, kindof like he knew...


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## Mr. SandMan

great game with the heat and lakers last night...i really dont like kobes attitude after he missed that final shot, i would have been upset myself...kobes still a monster though, it just seems like the lakers really arent trying, and if they stay this way there is no way they will just 'turn it on' when its playoff time, i dont think they have enough great players on that team to do that, they remind me of the pistons from a few years back...


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## n1kkuh

bignate said:


> i really dont like kobes attitude after he missed that final shot, i would have been upset myself... i dont think they have enough great players on that team to do that, they remind me of the pistons from a few years back...


MAN **** the lakers right now. They just lost their second game in a row and it was against the magic. Your right I'm getting sick of Kobe's smiles after a loss, its like, where the ****in intensity man? They got plenty of talent on that team, its just that there is NO team that will win a championship with the attitude of "hey, everyone says we're a great team, so that means we don't have to prove ourselves on the court anymore." Bull ****, this is the NBA these ****** better recognize man.


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## n1kkuh

Oh and Bynum's proving to be a real Vag on the court gettin *****ed by Dwight like that.


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## Mr. SandMan

lol...

but if you think about it, that whole team is soft besides derek fisher and kobe, they're all soft...gasol is where it starts too, even lamar odom is soft, and bynum is like gasol...they just dont seem to have any heart...

if it comes out the same way, i really dont think they can compete with the celtics, cause garnett, pierce and allen all have heart...them three are like the perfect three you could think of, cause they all have something to prove, and none of them ever quit, and they are all sick of losing...and kobe has been winning, i dont even think he thinks he has something to prove...i mean ima lakers fan too, i want to see kobe win, but with his attitude i dont see it happening, he has no fire in his eyes...


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## n1kkuh

no doubt, I completely agree.
Just frustrated by my team, that's all. I just had to vent.


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## Tania

Whir said:


> i realize this is a lot of peoples sleeper team, but I think it would be cool if Portland upset the Lakers in the playoffs or something crazy like that. They are not my team, but I like Aldridge and the rest of that team to maybe pull an upset or two if they get in.


I went to Phoenix to see the Suns vs. Jazz game... was soooo much fun. Next stop: Portland! It's the nearest basketball city now that Seattle's team is gone


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## brimontz

bignate said:


> yea, he just doesnt know how to use his body right...i saw when he got his third foul last night, and shaq just had a look on his face that was kindof stale, kindof like he knew...


With Oden's health problems, he might actually have benefitted from another year in college, because his game might be that much better. But watching him at Ohio State, when he's healthy, he has the potential to be REALLY good. He needs time, though.


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## brimontz

I'm not that into the NBA on the whole (I prefer college football, NFL, and MLB), but the Cavs have been much more impressive this year. Yeah, they've beaten a lot of weak teams, but compared to how they played all last year, it's good they are maintaining their focus no matter who their opponents are. And they appear to have more depth now than when they went to the Finals a couple of years ago.

Things are going so well that LeBron is starting to indicate that he might be willing to sign an extension before becoming a free agent. That being said, I think all of it's just talk and marketing, the talk of him leaving, the talk of him staying. More people will buy your shoes and jerseys in other cities if they think their team has a chance to sign you. More people will buy your stuff in your hometown if they think you'll stay. He really doesn't need to leave Cleveland to become a bigger star, although ESPN and the rest of the national media have been trying to push him out of Cleveland since the day he was drafted. If he goes to NY, more of the national media based there will get to watch him play regularly. I don't think LBJ has any clue what he's going to do, although Cleveland definitely needs him more than NY or any other major market needs him.

Brian


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## Mr. SandMan

lebron is becoming better, he's actually developing a jumper...i really dont care where he lands, he's gonna get the same media attention anywhere else...

and i dont know whats wrong with new york, stephan marbury is retarded, he's the dumbest athlete in my mind besides micheal vick...why are you gonna go to your teams game, who didnt buy you a ticket, sit in the stands, and talk on the phone like you got something better to do, he is stupid, thats just idiotic to me...but that'd be tight to get a new york knicks jersey with james on the back...


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## Cypress

Celtics went down...awesome! :boogie


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## n1kkuh

"Anything is possiblllle ANYTHIIINNNG"


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## Toad Licker

Blazers beat Boston tonight without Roy in the lineup, a huge win for Portland. The Celtics are now 1-3 on they're west road trip.


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## S.T.A.T.

Celtics are imploding... 

On the positive side...Thunder are on the verge of becoming one of the worst teams in league history


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## S.T.A.T.

I like the NBA. It's one of my favorite things to watch on TV.

My favorite players include Tim Duncan, Amare Stoudemire, Shawn Marion, Chris Paul, Tony Parker, Tayshaun Prince, Ben Wallace, and Yi Jianlian.


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## eyeguess

So the starting lineups for the NBA All-Star game were announced today...

East
Dwight Howard
Kevin Garnett
LeBron James
Dwyne Wade
Allen Iverson

West
Yao Ming
Tim Duncan
Amare Stoudemire
Kobe Bryant
Chris Paul

...kind of what was expected. Personally if I could change it up I'd take out AI and replace him with someone more deserving like Joe Johnson or Devin Harris. I mean I believe the guy shouldn't even start for the Pistons much less the All-Star game. But then again, it is the All-Star game and it's really whatever the fans want to see, so I'm cool with whoever starts, I just hope the coaches get it right when they choose their backups. Hopefully players like Granger, Harris, and Johnson will get some recognition from whoever coaches the Eastern Conference.

But anyway in other news Monta Ellis will be making his season debut tonight against the Cavs, I loved watching this guy play over the last few seasons so I'm definitely looking forward to that. I believe, and I could be wrong, that NBA League Pass is free this week up until Sunday. So just a heads up if you didn't know already.


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## S.T.A.T.

Cavs and lakers are leading the east and west respectively.


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## n1kkuh

...kind of what was expected. Personally if I could change it up I'd take out AI and replace him with someone more deserving like Joe Johnson or Devin Harris. I mean I believe the guy shouldn't even start for the Pistons much less the All-Star game. But then again, it is the All-Star game and it's really whatever the fans want to see, so I'm cool with whoever starts, I just hope the coaches get it right when they choose their backups. Hopefully players like Granger, Harris, and Johnson will get some recognition from whoever coaches the Eastern Conference.

But anyway in other news Monta Ellis will be making his season debut tonight against the Cavs, I loved watching this guy play over the last few seasons so I'm definitely looking forward to that. I believe, and I could be wrong, that NBA League Pass is free this week up until Sunday. So just a heads up if you didn't know already.[/QUOTE]

West reserves are gonna be: Pau gasol, Shaq, Chauncy Billups, Brandon Roy, Deron Williams or Tony Parker, Dirk Nowitzke, and then Carmello.

East: Bosh, Joe Johnson, Derick Rose or Devin Harris, Mo' Williams, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, Granger

Thats how it should be IMO

The eastern starting lineup looks ridiculous right now, but who knows who's gonna win there's gonna be no defense anyway.

Van Gundy said something interesting the other day, they should just eliminate that played out dunk contest and replace it with a one on one battle.

Or, they should allow Kobe and Lebron to each pick a 5 man team, any one in the league. I thought that that would be pretty darn interesting to see if they had that.


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## eyeguess

Yeah they're going to announce the reserves tonight at seven. I'm actually looking forward to this way more than I usually do. I'll say over in the East, the most probable shoe-ins to me are Bosh, Granger, Harris, and Johnson. Which would then leave three spots open. I'll just take a shot in the dark and say Carter, Pierce, and Lee to wrap up that conference. And for the West, I'm actually having a tough time with this one. Roy and Nowitzki to me are really the only two definites. It's going be a battle between Parker, Billups, Williams, and Nash at the one spot with at least two of those guys not making it. Pau Gasol and Al Jefferson will fight for a spot in the big man rotation. And maybe even Shaq could make it on. I don't know, but anyway...

I like the idea of a one on one. That would definitely be something I would watch. Come to think of it, you know what could be better, a 3 on 3. How awesome would it be to see something like (Bosh - Bryant - Wade) VS (Amare - LeBron - Paul). That, to me, could be more fun to watch than the playoffs.


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## eyeguess

The reserves are going to be...

East
Chris Bosh
Danny Granger
Devin Harris
Paul Pierce
Joe Johnson
Jameer Nelson
Rashard Lewis

West
Dirk Nowitzki
Tony Parker
Shaquille O'Neal
Brandon Roy
Pau Gasol
Chauncey Billups
David West

...so the expected made it while a few curve balls were thrown in. I was a little shocked David West made the team again, honestly I've never really have been that impressed with the guy but then again the coaches did pick him two years in a row so what do I know. I guess I just feel Al Jefferson was maybe a little more deserving. The Lewis and Nelson selections were also very unexpected, you'd almost think Van Gundy was coaching the Eastern Conference this year. But I think if anything, I would question the Western Conference coach for not adding a single small forward to their roster. Which could maybe be a fault of the initial balloting system for not having the votes count towards the individual positions as opposed to just Centers, Forwards, and Guards. But none of that really matters anyway, it should be a fun game. Really I'm just glad Granger, Harris, and Johnson made the team even though I guess it was pretty obvious that they'd make it in.


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## n1kkuh

Hey I was pretty close, I forgot that Carmello was injured and I'm a little surprised by the fact that Mo didn't make it on the team, I thought he was gonna be on the team for sure. Carmello Anthony would have been the small forward, but he's injured. Its gonna be pretty predictable, I think the east is gonna win just because of the fact that they have Lebron and Dwight, probably the two most dominant players in the game right now, oh yeah and having Wade doesn't hurt either, but then again, all star games are pretty unpredictable. 

And of course, Lebron gets the MVP. God, they really should add a new event, No one concurs on the One on One's? Or the Lebron and Kobe team captains idea?


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## S.T.A.T.

Does anyone even care who wins the All Star game?

It's a showboat fest and not to mention the players selected (at least as starters) are for popularity reasons.

I always thought the NBA should add more players on the roster because there hasn't been a year when players who played great didn't make the team. I hear a lot experts and fans alike whining how so and so should have been on the squad.

increase the roster on each team from 12 to 18. 

Increase minutes per quarter from 12 to 20.

More time means more timeouts and commercials, More players getting to play, and more money since more advertisements will be shown.

I never understood why the NBA all star game was not big at all. The super bowl is a huge event and it's just 2 regular teams. The NBA all star game comprises the elite of the league. shouldn't it be *THE* game of the year? At least rivaling the Super Bowl?

Bah! Life's not fair and neither is sports. BOOYAH!


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## brimontz

I think it's a joke that Mo Williams didn't make it from Cleveland. His addition to the Cavaliers is the difference between Cleveland last year and Cleveland this year.

The All-Star Game is a joke. All All-Star games are jokes (the Pro Bowl being the worst of the lot), as none of the players REALLY care.

Brian


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## Toad Licker

7 straight wins for the sophomores over the rookies, it's time to go back to rookies only as this just isn't working. That's it for me I won't watch the same team win every year. It's time to go back to rookies only, the way it should've always been.


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## S.T.A.T.

i don't think it matters who wins these games.

It's all about watchin the players do their stuff they wouldn't dare to do without risking being benched.


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## S.T.A.T.

T-Mac is going to get surgery on his knee:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_y...pJ4?slug=ap-rockets-mcgrady&prov=ap&type=lgns


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## eyeguess

Yeah I hear he's out for the rest of the season, which sucks... but you kind of knew it was coming. I really think they should have traded him before the deadline, I just don't think it's the best idea to have two guys on your team that are that injury prone, especially when they are your two best players. And you know it's bad when every year you hear they're going to be so great this season "only if they can stay healthy". And without fail someone will go down when it matters. So maybe next year, Rockets... maybe next year...

Anyway speaking of trade deadlines, what a lousy past couple of days. You know it's lousy when the most noteworthy player that changed teams was Larry Hughes. But I guess that's what happens when more teams are now looking to clear space than to add anything. But anyway I'm going to say the biggest winners were Chicago and maybe NY. Losers were Sacramento and possibly Cleveland and Portland for not actually doing anything. Both had huge expirings they could have used to bring in some pretty decent talent but I guess they are just going to let them expire and try to do something in FA


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## goldengirl

Go Cavs!!!

DEtroit BASKETball - NOT!!!

goldengirl from Akron, Ohio


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## S.T.A.T.

Not too many NBA fans in here. lol...

Shawn Marion is traded again mid season.

Will the poor guy find a more permanent home?

his scoring average is lower due to not playing with Steve nash.


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## Brightpaperwarewolf

S.T.A.T. said:


> Not too many NBA fans in here. lol...
> 
> Shawn Marion is traded again mid season.
> 
> Will the poor guy find a more permanent home?
> 
> his scoring average is lower due to not playing with Steve nash.


He's a better fit in Toronto than Miami and fills a serious need and fits their system more than Jermaine did. I wouldn't be surprised if Toronto resigns him, but we'll see, but they been doing well since he arrived....


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## bballfan

I watch a lot of basketball, I watched the Raptors/Suns game last night and Shaq was playing great had 45 points


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## eyeguess

Yeah Toronto has nobody to battle with those kind of guys down low. Bargs has improved a lot this season but they still really need a solid big they can bring off the bench to provide some defense and rebounding. Shawn Marion was a great pick up for the Raptors, they easily had one of the worst wing rotations in the league and he actually brings them strong defense and rebounding at the SF position. Whether they resign him or not depends on how well he plays for the remainder of the season and how they how they see him fitting into their future plans. This season almost looks like a lost cause but they still need to build a solid team around Bosh if they want to keep him in 2010. But I think he's a good fit mainly for the reasons I just mentioned, I just hope he still doesn't believe he's worth a max contract. The going rate for a quality SF has been set sort of high lately with guys like Deng and Iggy signing massive contracts but there are still a lot of guys like Butler and Prince making around 10 million a year. And to be honest I'd take either of them over Marion any day of the week. If they're able to sign him to a decent contract and then sign a FA like Varejao in the off-season I really think they could be a very dangerous team. And I just keep rambling on and on I gotta keep my post shorter


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## S.T.A.T.

Tonight: Spurs and Mavs.


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## n1kkuh

Marbury on the Celitics? He just made their bench a whole lot stronger? He's plum loco, but he's instant offense? That team is gonna be a force with KG back???


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## Encore

Im glad they got Marbury out of NY. It was stupid not letting him play but having him on another team is better than paying him to have a front row seat.


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## S.T.A.T.

Too bad Marbury's attitude has not been something desirable. he is a talented player who could have been among the league's best PGs.


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## eyeguess

Wow... Dwyane Wade. What an amazing game. 

Totally killing it in the first four quarters, then come overtime... played solid D and made some nice passes but blows three straight free throws and the game winning layup. Then completely makes up for all of that by coming up with the last moment steal and hitting the game-winner running three at the buzzer. Definitely was a fun game and an awesome performance to watch.

And as a huge Charlotte fan this was also a great win for them in that they're now only a 1/2 game back from the 8th playoff seed with Chicago losing and all. Yeah. 1,000th post.


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## Under Pressure

The NBA is a complete joke!


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## S.T.A.T.

Thanks to David Stern's European style of ball! You see too many 7 footers shooting jumpers.


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## n1kkuh

silenced said:


> Blazers Win Again!!
> 
> Best win of the year...
> BLAZERS 111 LAKERS 94


I don't know where our D and offense was, but it aint happenin' again!


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## radiohead

That Laker game was atrocious......good thing Rudy is alright(Laker fan here whos dad shares season tix, w00t).

Didn't realize this forum had other threads........I like it.


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## Under Pressure

eyeguess said:


> Yeah? My roommates are sort of the same way. What's your reason, grossly overpaid players? The setup and the way the league is ran? You don't like basketball? You don't like black people? An NBA player once had an affair with your mother? Totally messing with you, though really, care to divulge any?


The 2006 NBA Finals is a great example of why I'm not a fan and it was that series that made me hate the NBA. Wade set a record for most free throw attempts in the Finals and also set the record for most free throws made in a single game in the Finals with 21. Wade shot as many free throws as all the Mavericks combined in game 5. The series was clearly fixed.

Here's what I think. After Dallas handled the Heat in the first 2 games, the NBA had the refs make calls that went in the Heat's favor. A commisioner's worst nightmare is having the Finals be decided in 4 or 5 games, which is what looked like what was going to happen after the first 2 games. So the NBA tried to make the series interesting again and bring the Finals tv ratings back up and to have Wade enter superstardom.

Here's a few other reasons why I hate the NBA. Consistent bad officiating, "Star Treatment", and the fact that no small market teams has won a title since David Stern came about in 1984.


----------



## Jerzy007

Top 5 players in the NBA...Paul, Wade, D Howard, Kobe, and Durant?? Open for discussion...from a humble Knicks Fan..hehe


----------



## redtogo72

I still love keeping track of NBA news, scores, and trades. However, watching a NBA game is just not very enjoyable. Superstar calls, inconsistent calls (some travels called, some ignored or some illegal D is called others ignored), flopping, and salary cap/guaranteed contracts just ruin the game.

Here's some highlights for me this season (joking): 








Also in a game Maggette, "scored 18 points on 1 made field goal and only 4 attempted he was 16-20 from the line in 30 minutes."

I'm not a big football fan but found the NFL playoffs to be much more enjoyable than any NBA game I've watched in years.


----------



## Jerzy007

I enjoy the more streetball aspect of the NBA, They play so hard nowadays that Walt Frazier was commenting on how most players where a football like girdle during the games due to the physical toughness the players taking shots on the court through screens and battling down low. Its so tight, for instance, my boy Al Harrington...who I played against in High School...Dunked for the go ahead 2 points vs. the Clippers in LA and was so hopped up that he smacked the backboard with two hands after wards costing his team the game. Forgetaboutit! I dont care that they lost, the intensity and heart is what amps me up!!


----------



## Jerzy007

HaHAHA...great clips, Coach K would be having a fundamental fit if those where his players..hehe


----------



## Jerzy007

Under Pressure said:


> The 2006 NBA Finals is a great example of why I'm not a fan and it was that series that made me hate the NBA. Wade set a record for most free throw attempts in the Finals and also set the record for most free throws made in a single game in the Finals with 21. Wade shot as many free throws as all the Mavericks combined in game 5. The series was clearly fixed.
> 
> Here's what I think. After Dallas handled the Heat in the first 2 games, the NBA had the refs make calls that went in the Heat's favor. A commisioner's worst nightmare is having the Finals be decided in 4 or 5 games, which is what looked like what was going to happen after the first 2 games. So the NBA tried to make the series interesting again and bring the Finals tv ratings back up and to have Wade enter superstardom.
> 
> Here's a few other reasons why I hate the NBA. Consistent bad officiating, "Star Treatment", and the fact that no small market teams has won a title since David Stern came about in 1984.


Remember that several refs were indicted for fixing games because of their gambling habits after that season.


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## n1kkuh

Hey, you played with Al Harrington in High school? That's tite, I just copped a pair of his shoes at the local K-mart. Best B-ball shoes I've ever bought under 40!!!


----------



## Mr. SandMan

i just bought some $159 jordans...i love how expensive they are...


----------



## Kwtrader

woot go blazers.


----------



## eyeguess

This tread is everywhere, haha I love it!

But yeah I'm definitely looking forward to this year's playoffs. There's so much stuff going on in other sports that it's hard to keep up everything. But here's my take on the first round, I'll try to keep it quick...

*Lakers(1) vs. Jazz(8th seed)*
The Jazz are one of my favorite teams to watch, but they're horrible on the road, and going up against the Lakers. LA in 5. I'm still pulling for Utah though, probably more so than any other team in it.

*Nuggets(2) vs. Hornets(7)*
Tough call, I think this series could very easily be taken to seven games, but I'm going with Denver. I just think they're the better team and they've got the advantage of having home court. I'm also pulling for Denver as well, but mostly just to root against the Hornets.

*Spurs(3) vs. Mavs(6)*
Even without Manu, I'm going with Spurs. Roger Mason has played very well this year and Parker is going to go nuts on Kidd or Terry or whoever the Mavs decide to put on him. But I like both teams, regardless of the outcome, I'm just hoping for a good series. Spurs take it in 6.

*Blazers(4) vs. Rockets(5)*
Grabbing home court advantage was huge for the Blazers. Rose Garden is a tough place to play for opposing teams and I can imagine it being one of the loudest arenas in this year's playoffs. I'd say the Blazers take it to seven with neither team winning on the road.

*Cavs(1) vs. Pistons(8th seed)*
The Pistons look bad, but I just can't see them rolling over and dying, I mean they've made it to the Eastern Conference Finals in each of the last 6 seasons. But then again they no longer have Chauncey Billups running the point and they're on the decline while the Cavs are on the up and up. Cavs in 5.

*Celtics(2) vs. Bulls(7)*
With or without KG, the Celtics are much better than the Bulls. And even tough they've been playing pretty well ever since robbing the Kings, they still suck on the road. Much like last year against the Hawks, Boston wins it in 7. But I'm pulling for the Bulls, I'm over the Celtics, Rose for ROY!

*Magic(3) vs. Sixers(6)*
The Sixers are my team but to be honest they're not very good. Most of the time they leave me wondering how they even made it into the playoffs. The Magic are just going to be too much for them. I'm expecting this series to be over in 5 without counting out the possibility of a sweep. But I'm still pulling for them.

*Hawks(4) vs. Heat(5) *
Probably the series I'm looking forward to the most, no joke. Hawks are one of my favorite teams to watch and the Heat always put on a good show. I'm going to say Atlanta in 6, JJ and Bibby are going to light it up.

And I'm going with the safe bet and say either the Lakers or the Cavs win it all. Having HCA all the way for Cleveland is really going to be a benefit for them since they're just so good at home. And LA still stands a very good shot as well, especially if Bynum is healthy. It's going to be interesting to see how everything plays out.


----------



## n1kkuh

As a Los Angeles native and as a Laker fan since I was a child I am extremely pissed that the celtics are probably not going to make it. I feel like we're being cheated out of playing them again. Not to say that L.A. has it locked down or anything like that, its just that if we do happen to win I have a feeling Boston is going to use the injured Garnett as an excuse as to why they didn't meet us in the finals. 

In any case, I'm hoping the Lakers don't see the blazers in the western finals, because they give us a tough time. And I hope Boston gets Garnett back before the eastern finals, if they make it that far that is. That way we can see a legit rematch of last year!


----------



## FairleighCalm

*Lebron James just made a 3 pointer to close out the first half. It was amazing. *


----------



## Harmon79

The Finals will be Lakers and the Cavs, it will be classic Lebron vs Kobe, I just dont know who I would root for, I like both teams but if I had to put money on it I would pick the Lakers because they have a deeper bench and the better coach


----------



## Stanley

Dear Mavs! Please kill the f*cking Spurs!!!


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## Harmon79

Stanley said:


> Dear Mavs! Please kill the f*cking Spurs!!!


Ditto


----------



## anonymid

The Lakers lose _again_ to a Rockets team sans T-Mac _and_ Yao? Unbelievable that this series is going to a seventh game. You have to think that LA is going to win that game at home, but boy, are they in for a rude awakening against Denver if this is how inconsistently they're going to play.


----------



## eyeguess

I have LA in 7 and the Cavs in 5.

I'm just hoping for a fun Western Conference Finals and am not really pulling for either side. I kind of would like to see Kobe win it all as the best player on a championship team while I kind of would like to see the Nuggets take them down all in the same. I'll probably end up pulling for whoever has the ball, like I was during the Celtics-Bulls series, so hopefully it'll be a close one.

As for the Eastern Conference Finals, I'm definitely pulling for the Cavs. Orlando is probably my second least favorite team in the NBA, after the Hornets, while I'm starting to like the Cavs/LeBron more and more.

After that I have the Cavs over LA in 6. I'm terrible at picking these though, all in all I just like to see a good series regardless of who wins. Kind of like any series the Boston Celtics were in over the last two years, whether you love them or hate them, they've made the postseason so much more interesting.


----------



## eyeguess

Also the NBA Draft Lottery is tonight!

I get so geeked up around the time of the NBA Draft so I'm really looking forward to tonight's lottery selection, probably more so than the actually game tonight.

I would like to see either Memphis, Minnesota, Oklahoma, or New Jersey winning the number one pick or at least getting in to the top three while I'd like to see New York, Sacramento, Golden State, and the LA Clippers either falling back or falling out of the top three altogether. The former teams I feel, depending on who they select and how they end up panning out, could rise to the level of the Blazers (or even surpass them) in terms of having a killer young core to build around. The thing is, I don't know if any of those team's brass is as smart as Portland's and can end up making the right decisions with the assets they have to build a championship caliber team.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Lakers all day...


----------



## eyeguess

I've got LA in 6.

I think Orlando's going to see the flip side of having a mismatch player like Rashard Lewis when they go up against LA. So far in the playoffs they have yet to deal with an offensive talent like Pau Gasol, who I believe should be able to score rather easily whenever guarded by Lewis. While I think Odom should be able to guard him much more effectively than anyone he's faced this far in the playoffs. And he may not be the best defender in the league but I think he'll matchup very well with Lewis (both 6-10 PFs who came into the league as a SFs) and has the athleticism to chase him around the perimeter.

I think LA, for the most part, have been struggling against talented PGs and physical players. While Rafer Alston might be easiest PG the Lakers have had to face and outside of Dwight Howard, I don't think the Magic are at all that much of a physical team. I'd say if they had a healthy Jameer Nelson I'd give the Magic a slight edge, but I don't see him coming back or making much of an impact. He's killed them during the regular season and would have probably killed them in the finals.

And I would love to see Bynum step his game up but he'll probably end up fouling out by mid-second quarter. Dwight Howard's going to have some monster games and I think the real key for the Lakers is that they need to play smart defense and really rotate and close out much better than the Cavs ever did.

Anyway... I wonder who Shaq is rooting for?


----------



## n1kkuh

He he I'm lookin' forward to wearing that Odom jersey and Laker cap as we dance through the streets of LA. The Lakers are absolutely gonna win this. I look forward to this win, its funny that they get Jameer Nelson back during this series, and I don't think he's going to have a serious impact on this series.

I wonder what Lebron James is doing right now, I'm kind of already looking forward into next year's season. It's gonna be interesting to see the aging Celtics's big 3 after their second year of being together. And will clippers **** up another good player?? It's all waiting to happen for us next season!

anyways, lets focus on right now and recognize that the Lakers are kicking *** and this is gonna make Kobe down in the books. This is really the Kobe show if you didn't know that... and Dwight Howard is now gonna be all over commercials, possibly taking over D-wade's t-mobile commercials, not to knock on d-wade, but come on, his team sucks.


----------



## eyeguess

Yeah last night's win was nice. I'm not really much of a Laker fan, to be honest, I just love seeing them take down the Magic rather convincingly. I think Orlando were not only a matchup nightmare for Cleveland but were also playing a little over their heads during that series (particularly guys like Pietrus and Alston) and are now coming back down to earth.

But the Lakers played great all around D last night, and that was huge for them. But I just don't see Dwight, Hedo, and Rashard shooting a combined 6 for 27 every game. Dwight's eventually going to get his and the rest of the team will eventually get hot from downtown so hopefully the Lakers won't become too complacent or overconfident from last night's win.


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## Toad Licker

I'll only be happy when a NEW team wins the nba championship, watching the same teams trade the title for nearly 30 years has gotten very old.


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## Mr. SandMan

^^^not for me...

i got LA in 5, or a sweap...i think the best chance Orlando had for a win was the first game to try to catch them off guard or somethin, Kobe seems very determined...


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## n1kkuh

Damnit, I'm pissed right now because I'm not able to attend the Laker's Parade, w/e though, D. Fish is the man!!


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## eyeguess

So if you were the Lakers and it came down to it, who would you rather resign - Odom or Ariza?


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## eyeguess

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4281291

Richard Jefferson has just been traded to the San Antonio Spurs.
Bruce Bowen, Kurt Thomas and Fabricio Oberto are in return heading to Milwaukee.

I'd say both teams made out pretty well, the Bucks finally unload Jefferson's contract and put themselves in a position financially to be able to resign either Villanueva or Sessions, or possibly even both. The Spurs consolidate and upgrade talent and should be better suited for the upcoming season. I think if they can sign another big this offseason like Rasheed or Gortat (or more affordably - Bass, Andersen, or Davis) then they could end up being a very dangerous team this year, or at least as long as that core is able to stay on the court.


----------



## bsd3355

So, yeah...


CAVS PICKED UP SHAQ!!!????!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?


----------



## eyeguess

Yeah deals have been going down everywhere this offseason and we're not even a month in.

*Cleveland *- I like the Shaq trade, he's an upgrade over Z and was brought in at great value, so good for them. But they still have more work to do. They need to get more athletic in the frontcourt.

*Orlando *- Apparently they don't give a **** about capspace or the future, but they will have a very solid team this year. They still need a backup everywhere, especially in the frontcourt. And I got to say I used to hate this team but I'm a huge Carter fan, have been since college, and I believe he'll be an upgrade over Hedo. The best play of any play from any player during the 2008-09 season was when the Nets were going up against Toronto in Toronto and after nailing the buzzer-beating three to send it into overtime, Carter reverse alley-oops the inbound pass from Simmons at the last second to win the game and just hangs on the rim with that look on his face as the arena stands in shock. Number one play of the year.

*Memphis *- Traded an expiring for Zach Randolph. Not sure if this has already been established, but the Grizzlies are officially the most incoherent team in the league, ever.

*Clippers *- They just became so much more respectable and they didn't even add a single player worth mentioning to their roster. Their lineup looks so much less disgusting now that Randolph is no longer part of it. I'm actually looking forward to watching them this season.

*Detroit *- Another dumb team. They just turned Chauncey Billups and Rasheed Wallace into Ben Gordon and Charlie V. I could somewhat understand them doing the AI trade at the time because I was under the assumption they'd make a big splash this offseason. Instead they just signed two guys that play zero defense and are very inconsistent to massive contracts. As of now they are just slightly better than they during the latter half of last season, but I'm sure they're not done making moves just yet.

*Portland *and *Toronto* are apparently going after Hedo and Ariza pretty hard. Supposedly the team that loses the bidding war for Hedo will get Ariza. Best case scenario would be Toronto landing Hedo (who could use his all-around skill and play making) and Portland landing Ariza (who could use his defense and three-point shooting more than Hedo's playing making and lack of defense).


----------



## Daylight

Lakers signed Ron Artest to a 3 year, 18 million dollar contract. He could of made 8 million a year for another team but chose to play for 6 million a year for a title contender. Lakers still might be able to re-sign Lamar Odom. 

Here's what the Lakers lineup might look like next season.

G-Derek Fisher
G-Kobe Bryant
F-Ron Artest
F-Pau Gasol
C-Andrew Bynum

6th man-Lamar Odom


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## eyeguess

If I were a Laker's fan I would be going nuts right now. I not only have them down as, far and away, the best team in the league this year, but also next year as well, and contenders 2+ years from now.

You have to expect naysayers wherever Artest goes, but I didn't expect there to be nearly this many. Clearly he's not your average guy, but he's not the disruptive force many claim him to be. I honestly thought he's proven that already and then totally put that rest last season when he led the Rockets the furthest they've been in the last 11 seasons.

Artest going to LA is more like Moss going to the Patriots than when Owens went to the Cowboys.

But I will say Ariza is a fairly good player and was a vital part for the Lakers success in this year's playoffs. Plus the guy is still young and has upside. But IMO Artest is essentially the kind of player (skill-wise) you'd hope for him to eventually become. I mean Ariza is a good defender, Artest is a great defender and I can't ever see Ariza become the offensive player that Artest is nor can I see him ever coming close to the level of toughness or physicality that Artest brings in his game.

Phil coming back was huge for them and he's dealt with crazy guys in the past with great success (Rodman). Next step for them is to bring Odom back and then they are set.

As of right now - my top five teams for the 09-10 season in order are:

1. LA Lakers
2. Boston Celtics
3. San Antonio Spurs
4. Cleveland Cavaliers
5. Orlando Magic

There really is no parity in the NBA.


----------



## hiimnotcool

I think Boston takes over the number 1 spot if they sign Rasheed. The Lakers definitely look solid but I don't think anybody would touch Boston with K.G. coming back and Rasheed on the floor. Can you imagine Rondo, Allen, Pierce, Garnett and Wallace on the floor at the same time? Ridiculous. I don't even like Boston either.

It's also being reported that Orlando is looking at Rasheed as well. If that happens then I see them moving into the top 3 for sure. This offseason is ridiculous.


With that said----I want the NFL season to hurry up and begin.


----------



## n1kkuh

Yeah, but you gotta think Boston is losing someone this season, I heard talk about them trading Ray Allen and Rondo or something like that? 

Artest adds another dimension to the Lakers, he's a badass and he's willing to intimidate the **** out of any one who ****s with his teamates. Ariza was starting to become a good shooter and he is a good slasher, something that Artest does not have. Artest is muscle, Ariza is speed, Artest is a wild card and he's dangerous, people aren't that initimidated by Ariza. If it wasn't for people doubling offa Ariza to guard kobe he wouldn't have had so many open shots, he's not gonna get that in Houston for sure.

If Orlando was to resign Turk then they would have been my favorittes in the east. Right now My fav. in the east would probably be Boston assuming they don't make any major changes. 

I'm surprised at how exciting this offseason has been for me (maybe because I'm an LA fan), just imagine how next year's big trades will pan out.


----------



## AceRimmer

This is the year of the superteams: Celtics, Lakers, Spurs, Magic, and Cavs. Everybody else should just enjoy the regular season.

Celtics aren't going to trade Jesus or Rondo unless they get someone *cough* CP3 *cough* back to put them over the top. That team is built to win now and if everyone is healthy, they are the favorites for the championship. That front court with the addition of Sheed is just going to maul everyone on defense. They still need a bench player to run the 2nd unit offense. A thug like Matt Barnes to chase Kobe around would help too.

Lakers have the best chance to win due to no key players' , other than Bynum, having injury issues. Spurs, like the Celtics, are heavily dependent on everybody's remaining healthy as the lineup of Timmy, Parker, Manu, and RJ are good enough to take the chip. Magic really need another move to shore up the interior for them and Superman really really needs to work on his offensive fundamentals. Vinsanity gives them someone who can create his own shot. Although he is better than Turkey Glue, this is a horizontal move if they lose Gortat. Cavs, like the Magic, still need another player to help with the interior. They're still waayyy too dependent on Lebron.


----------



## eyeguess

*Shawn Marion to Dallas*
While he's not going to put them over the top this was, nevertheless, a very smart move by the Mavs. He'll provide them with more defense, rebounding, and athleticism while being a very solid 3rd / 4th option on offense. I'm actually really starting to like this roster and with Gortat and Marion sending Dampier and Wright to the bench, I can definitely see them competing for homecourt advantage in the West.

*Antonio McDyess to San Antonio*
A very underrated move by the Spurs. Last season, McDyess averaged 11 pts & 10 rebs in the 25 games he started at PF and dropped 16 pts & 15 rebs in the 5 games he started at C. Even though he'll be 35 next season he's still got it and will be a clear upgrade over Kurt Thomas.

*Brandon Bass to Orlando*
Gortat was huge for them last year in the playoffs, especially during all of those times Dwight had to sit with foul trouble - he kept them in games. Being 6-8, Bass is not going to be able spot minutes at the 5, but he will be very solid backup at the 4 (and they needed depth in the front court in the worst way). He's the closest thing to a true PF they've had for a while and he'll give them the ability to run with a more traditional lineup whenever he comes off the bench. Good move by Orlando, they needed more toughness, rebounding, and scoring in the paint but they still need a backup C.

*Paul Millsap to Portland*
You knew this guy was going to get paid after totally beasting it when Boozer went down, but I wasn't expecting Portland to be the one giving him a 4 yr / 36 million dollar contract. I mean he will be a huge upgrade over Frye, Outlaw, and whoever else they were playing at backup PF last season (the guy nearly averaged 19 pts, 12 rebs, and 3 asts in the month of December) and he'll be a good fit for the team. But it is a bit of a head-scratcher for them to sign a backup PF to a massive contract while they still have a bunch of guys still playing on their rookie contracts (most notably Roy, Aldridge, Rudy, Oden) that they'll eventually need to resign and when their biggest needs are at the PG & SF positions. But you have to trust Pritchard knows what he's doing. Then again, I thought they dodged a huge bullet when Turkoglu bailed out on signing that huge contract they offered him.

*Hedo Turkoglu to Toronto*
I'm not exactly sure what they're trying to do. They just signed Turkoglu and Bargnani to some massive contracts and after throwing a bunch of money at Calderon last season - they're setting themselves up to be one helluva a soft team for several years to come, especially if Bosh bolts in 2010. But Turk is a very good player and will help them a lot this season even though signing him doesn't address any of their weaknesses (toughness / defense / rebounding). At best I see them being a 7th seed - first round exit.

*Mike Bibby staying in Atlanta*
I wasn't too thrilled when they traded for Crawford, even though they didn't give up very much for him in the first place, he always seems to end up hurting the team he's on more than actually helping them (he's like the Zach Randolph of combo guards) which really doesn't bode well for an Atlanta team that already has a Josh Smith causing disruptions and a below-mediocre coach in Mike Woodson managing the team. So resigning Bibby was huge for them, he was basically the catalyst for their recent success that turned them from being the joke of the league into a decent playoff team. Had they not resigned him, they could have easily been a lottery team this season, even with all the talent they have. But if all goes well, Crawford could provide them with that extra scoring option that they need for when Johnson gets doubled (or shut down like he was in the playoffs).


----------



## unusual condition

The rich get richer and the poor...well, they pretty much remain the same.


----------



## unusual condition

Anybody want to make a trade for Elton Brand? Pleassssse?!?


----------



## eyeguess

Yeah, you almost feel bad for the non-contending teams not being able to land any decent FAs unless they severely overpay for them (Detroit). That's one thing I'm not so crazy about in the NBA is the lack of parity, but hey if your a fan of any of the top teams, this should be a really interesting season for you.

But I'd hold on to Brand, his value couldn't be any more lower than it is now. He could be a hit or miss this season, I don't know, but you would think the Princeton offense would suit him a little more, they're just in need of another shooter or two (Kapono blows - he doesn't count). I'm just hoping they can sign-and-trade Miller for a decent PG with an outside jumper.


----------



## unusual condition

The more you wait, the older Brand gets and the more injury prone he becomes. I'm a little worried. Why is it that we always have major problems with big name stars?


----------



## Unlikely hero

It's cause we sign old inurjy prone stars. Chris Webber, Glen Robbinson, Now Elton Brand. We should of just tanked the season and waited until 2010.


----------



## mixolydian

With T-mac likely traded and Yao's career potentially over, where do you see H-town finishing next season? And more importantly whose jersey am I gonna spend $80 on? Ariza's?!


----------



## eyeguess

I'm still waiting to see if Houston actually does anything to address their need at the 5 spot before I make a true assessment of the team. As of right now I can't see them being any better than an 8th seed / first round exit this coming season, but then again they could go out and make a trade for a quality center and (even though it's unlikely) T-Mac could come back in decent form. But I'll get back to you on that come beginning of the season / whenever they make any moves.

Regarding the Portland Trailblazers grabbing Andre Miller, I'm torn on whether that was a good move by them or not. Last year, the Blazers were a great offensive team. I mean they were literally one of the best, if not the best offensive team in the league. Watching them you get the impression that they are really good on that end of the floor but the basic stats can be deceiving since they play at such a slow pace. I think if this team is trying to improve in any area of the game it should be on the the other side of the court. Oden's development could be huge for this team, but I think they should have kept a similar offensive game plan (shooters at the SF and PG spots) since it worked so well last season and then try to add some more defense / toughness. Miller absolutely cannot hit long range shots but he is a veteran and he can still find ways to score so maybe that will add a new dimension to their offense (whether it'll be for the better or for the worse) and he'll definitely be an upgrade on the defensive end over the guys they had playing there last season. Interesting to see how that turns out.


----------



## mixolydian

Well much to my delight the Rockets have added Australian centre David Andersen to their roster to fill in at the 5 in Yao's absence. I've only seen him play at the Olympics where he played mostly back up to Bogut but he should be a good fit for the Rockets. He has a good post game, a very good shooting touch, can shoot the 3 and importantly adds another 7 footer to the Rockets very short frontcourt. Apparently he lacks a bit on D, but in such a strong defensive team as the Rockets I don't think this will be a major issue. Even with this move and the possibility of T-Mac being back for the start of the season I think you're right in saying that a first round exit is probably the best case scenario. Nevertheless, I think they've got a great core and should return to being contenders the following season. Hopefully Andersen's signing will also result in more FTA coverage of Rocket's games in Australia


----------



## eyeguess

So the regular season is starting up this Tuesday... definitely could not be any more ready for this NBA season to begin.

Quick, meaningless, rundown of how I see things playing out...

East
Cleveland
Orlando
Boston
Atlanta
Washington
Chicago
Miami
Toronto

Philadelphia
Charlotte
Indiana
Detroit
New York
New Jersey
Milwaukee

West
LA Lakers
San Antonio
Portland
Denver
Dallas
New Orleans
Utah
Phoenix

LA Clippers
Houston
Golden State
Oklahoma City
Memphis
Sacramento
Minnesota


----------



## Toad Licker

The NBA is back :yay

Watching the Celtics and Caveliers game now, Cleveland started out strong but Boston is slowly climbing back into it.


----------



## bsd3355

Yeah, well, I'm from Ohio so you know who I'm rooting for!

Super pumped about this season! I still can't believe we got Shaq now! If the Cavs don't at least take the Eastern Conference Finals then I'm not sure if we'll ever have a chance, especially with the team we have this season.


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

BOOOOOOOO Cavs!!! I'm a Wizards fan so my hate is understandable 

Realistically tho, Lebron would carry the cavs to the ECF regardless if it works out with Shaq or not.


----------



## joejoe

wrong teams folks. you should be asking yourselves "what team can possibly beat the lakers in a 7 game series..." and the answer is inevitably no one.

though I'm not too happy with the artest signing, a kobe even a year older but a summer rested, a solid pau gasol, and the re-emergence of andrew bynum with odom leading the 2nd unit looks so delicous. I can't see anyone putting up much of a fight in a series.


----------



## utopian_grrl

with the Lakers throwing money at the best players they can find, it's no wonder they're always in contention for a championship. They don't have to work as hard to develop talent and strategically fit players together like some teams...

Anyways, the Cavs are off to a poor start, but they're coming around. In their crappy division, they're basically guaranteed a playoff spot (though I am a Bulls fan). So, when they fully begin to WORK HARD TO DEVELOP their talent, it'll be interesting to watch.


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

What talent does Cleveland have other than LBJ? Take Letravel away and they are a lottery team even with Shaq, who's going downhill.


----------



## Lateralus

Brightpaperwarewolf said:


> What talent does Cleveland have other than LBJ? Take Letravel away and they are a lottery team even with Shaq, who's going downhill.


For starters, let's not forget how often others like Kobe and D-Wade also get away with traveling. Also, "Letravel" is starting to get called a lot more for travelling and as a result he's becoming a better jump-shooter. More and more we're starting to see LBJ put on a shooting clinic. In fact they're talking about that right now on ESPN as I write this.

As for talent, let's start with Mo Williams who was 9/9 in the first half alone against the Magic tonight and is shooting 47% 3's. Then there's Anthony Parker who gets overlooked by almost everyone, he's a great all-around player and he's shooting 56% 3's. He's like a more mobile and athletic Wally Sczerbiak and less of a defensive liability. They also have Leon Powe who I think is going to do very well when he's back. If West gets all his drama straightened out he has proven to be a very solid player as well.

Shaq is going downhill, everyone knows that, and he has admitted that himself in gentler words, but that didn't stop him from containing Dwight Howard to only 11 pts and 7 boards and putting him in foul trouble early. That's exactly what the Cavs got him for.

They're a good team. Mike Brown is still tinkering with things and some of their losses are a result of that, but that's ok because they're setting up for playoffs this year. We already know from last year that a stellar reg. season performance doesn't really matter if one team can expose your weaknesses badly in the playoffs. This year they will hope to have improved upon those weak areas, and if tonight's game at Magic is any indication, they have.

Well that's my take anyway, of course I am biased since I'm of Cavs fan, but I like this year's team better than last year's despite the shaky start.


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

Ya, LBJ is finally getting travel calls after his famous crab dribble. But to understand where I come from, I'm a bitter Wizards fan where Cleveland stole the 2006 2nd round series from a non-call. So I will always hate Cleveland with a passion 

With that, Mo Williams is a decent player, but not one who should be a 2nd scorer, he's too inconsistent and lives and dies by the jumper. One game, he could light the place on fire, another game, he falls flat. Not a lot of consistency to his game. Anthony Parker is a good role player and a good defender, I give you that. West is a beast for them and Leon Powe is a maybe, we'll see how he responds to surgery. But this team minus LBJ would be a lottery team, no doubt about it, that's how good LeTravel is. 

In Howard vs Shaq part 1, it wasn't so much Shaq who was stopping Dwight as it was Vareajo and Illguaskas doubling him that contained him on offense, allowing him to make mistakes and Howard getting offensive fouls. Dwight scored 3-3 on field goals in straight up 1-1 situations vs Shaq. 

I can't see Cleveland going all the way. Although I do think they'll have rights over the Magic, I'm not all that high on the Magic this year because Turkglou was a big part of their success and Vince Carter isn't an ideal replacement in my mind. But Boston....man look out. Also Atlanta is a dark horse, Jamal Crawford has been lighting it up off the bench for them. They are going to be dangerous.


----------



## Lateralus

Yeah, Boston and LA scare me. 

You're right about Dwight going 3-3 when guarded only by Shaq, but I watched the game and there were a lot of times that Dwight simply didn't even get passed to because Shaq was in the way. He's their best player and only got 3 shots, I'll take that even if he makes all 3. By not having to double him when Shaq is in there they can defend the perimeter much more effectively which is where they got burned in the playoffs.

Two good road wins vs. Magic and Heat on back-to-back nights give me hope but Boston is a monster.


----------



## Toad Licker

The Blazers had a quick season, it's all over now with Greg Oden out again along with Travis Outlaw and Nicolas Batum also out with injuries I can't see them going anywhere now. Oh well maybe that'll give them a good draft pick they can add to the lineup for next season.


----------



## n1kkuh

Toad Licker said:


> The Blazers had a quick season, it's all over now with Greg Oden out again along with Travis Outlaw and Nicolas Batum also out with injuries I can't see them going anywhere now. Oh well maybe that'll give them a good draft pick they can add to the lineup for next season.


My heart really goes out to that kid, Oden. He's one of the few centers in the league who actually has a personality, he's a good dude. It's unfortunate that he truly is injury prone, I mean, this injury pretty much makes it official, and its really unfortunate because I feel that he does have a lot of talent, he just never really got the chance to prove it. With that being said Portland is done not only for the season, but for years to come, sorry P.O. fans.


----------



## MindOverMood

Raptors!!! :d


----------



## two8

brandon Jennings was fined $7500 for twitting at the wrong time! lol...

My fave team is the Denver Nugs. Carmelo = favorite baller.


----------



## ryobi

I played against Jason Terry in the 8th grade-yikes is all i'll say about that


----------



## ryobi

bball used to be ahuge part of my life
I don't really care much about it anymore


----------



## S.T.A.T.

ryobi said:


> I played against Jason Terry in the 8th grade-yikes is all i'll say about that


Did you also play against Donald Watts too? How about Doug Wrenn?


----------



## mixolydian

Bogut with a career game today, 31/18. He can really turn it on when he wants to. Is he a legit shot at being an all-star reserve this year? Only other center in the east would be Lopez I would think, presuming of course Howard gets the fan vote. Would love to see an Aussie in the all-star game.


----------



## redtogo72

You might just see Garnett, Bosh, Dwight, and Josh Smith get picked as the big men on the East. Bogut has a chance. A couple things hurting him: 1. he was injured earlier in the season and didn't play for about 10 games. 2. Milwaukee have only won 3 out of their last 10 games. If they continue to lose, he will have less of a chance to make the All Star game since team record plays a big factor in deciding the reserves.


----------



## S.T.A.T.

mixolydian said:


> Bogut with a career game today, 31/18. He can really turn it on when he wants to. Is he a legit shot at being an all-star reserve this year? Only other center in the east would be Lopez I would think, presuming of course Howard gets the fan vote. Would love to see an Aussie in the all-star game.


Would that make him the first Aussie to be all star?

I remember when the Bucks came to my hometown to play the Sonics. there was a small section of aussie boys next to me. They had flags waving and choreographed and improvised soccer songs incorporating Bogut's name. It was quite fun to see. When he fouled out of that game, they had bowed down and yelled BOoooOO gUuuut! anyways...


----------



## mixolydian

Yep, would make him the first aussie all-star ever. We've only produced about ten or so NBA players in total with best of the lot prior to Bogut being Luc Longley. It would be great for the game's popularity if he could make it.


----------



## S.T.A.T.

NBA on ABC on Xmas day!

I am excited to see Bos and Orl then CLE against the LAL.


----------



## S.T.A.T.

I actually slept through all the games.

denver lost


----------



## Toad Licker

It was a great nba day for me I got to watch the Lakers lose and the Blazers put on an awesome 4th quarter to beat the Nuggets. I missed most of the Magic vs. Celtics game and the Suns and Clippers we watched a movie which turned out to be the right thing to do since it was such a blowout.


----------



## mixolydian

I thought I'd fly the aussie flag again and acknowledge Portland's rookie point guard and indigenous Australian Patrick Mills who played his first NBA game this week after returning from a foot injury and after only two games in the d-league which he absolutely tore up. I think Patty is an ideal fit next to Brandon Roy and I reckon he'll have a longer future with the Blazers than either Andre Miller or Jerryd Bayless either as a backup or starter.


----------



## MindOverMood

MindOverMood said:


> Raptors!!! :d


They beat Orlando last night!


----------



## ryobi

mixolydian said:


> I thought I'd fly the aussie flag again and acknowledge Portland's rookie point guard and indigenous Australian Patrick Mills who played his first NBA game this week after returning from a foot injury and after only two games in the d-league which he absolutely tore up. I think Patty is an ideal fit next to Brandon Roy and I reckon he'll have a longer future with the Blazers than either Andre Miller or Jerryd Bayless either as a backup or starter.


Wow, the blazers drafted another gaurd? The Blazers probably have the best coach in the NBA, and I'm sure he knows what he is doing.

In college, I was impressed with how athletic Mills was, and what a good passer he was.

Athletically, he just seemed head over heels faster and quicker than the other players.

Do you know if he is aboriginee??? He kind of looks like it???


----------



## mixolydian

Yeah, I believe one of his parents is Torres-strait islander (indigenous people from a group of islands north of Queensland) and the other is aboriginal. The guy will have a long future in the NBA, always comes off as very grounded and mature and he's a very hard worker.


----------



## ryobi

That's an interesting combination. It's interesting how many different cultures there are in Aus. There were a lot of torress islanders where I was going to school.

offtopic: the toress islander thing reminded me of that show, Sunshine high, I think
and Tecua, I loved that character. That show was so funny...

On topic, kind of: I saw him play several times in college, Gonzaga is in the same league as saint mary's 

thanks for sending him over.


----------



## Game 7

I was bored a few weeks ago, late, like 11:00pm and was browsing the TV for something to watch. I have every sports package for every pro sport and some college/junior sports. I came across a Lakers game, can't recall who the other team was but it was in HD, and they were showing the game from the normal camera angle, with the announcers talking and whatever. But then they went to a different angle, with this camera that was sitting directly mid-court(on the sidelines) and all it did was go back and forth, whichever way the ball went...it was like having court-side seats. All you heard was the crowd and the sound of the game, no announcers...they left it like this for about 5 minutes, then went back to normal...WHY!?
That was awesome! If they showed every game this way, I'd watch every game, only in HD though. It felt real...


----------



## ryobi

Sometimes the announcers drive me crazy too. There is never a moment of silence, only a constant stream of dialogue


----------



## S.T.A.T.

The nuggs beat the Cavs without Melo!


----------



## TurningPoint

Raptors are playing well as of late, and the Lakers are struggling. I'm tired of all the Chris Bosh is leaving/staying rumours.


----------



## MindOverMood

TurningPoint said:


> Raptors are playing well as of late, and the Lakers are struggling. I'm tired of all the Chris Bosh is leaving/staying rumours.


They play D-Wade tomorrow, it should be a great game.


----------



## TurningPoint

I hate not having TSN2, and not being able to get those telecasts. They really need to fix that for next year's TV schedule *shakes head*


----------



## Atari82

How bout them MILWAUKEE BUCKS :clap:clap:boogie:boogie


----------



## trevor35th

How about Derrick Rose!! :boogie:boogie

First Bulls player to make the all-star game since Jordan. It'll be cool to see the game being played at the Cowboys stadium. There could be more than 85,000 fans there.. probably closer to 100,000.


----------



## TurningPoint

I'm very happy to see Derrick Rose make it. I really think they have the All-Star reserve selections right for both the East and West. Only debatable thing to me is maybe Josh Smith over Al Horford. I also think Andrea Bargnani should have got a bit more consideration, though maybe next year he has a legit chance at making it if he keeps up his overall progress.


----------



## Lateralus

Did anyone watch the cavs game tonight? I only saw the box score, but they had 44 FT attempts vs Indiana's 5. What happened? One sided officiating or was Cleveland always driving the paint and Indiana shooting only jumpers? 44 vs 5 FT's!!!!


----------



## TurningPoint

Lateralus said:


> Did anyone watch the cavs game tonight? I only saw the box score, but they had 44 FT attempts vs Indiana's 5. What happened? One sided officiating or was Cleveland always driving the paint and Indiana shooting only jumpers? 44 vs 5 FT's!!!!


That seems messed up. *tsk* at NBA officiating


----------



## redtogo72

NBA officiating seems so inconsistent and sloppy. I can't even watch the games much anymore. I just stick to the news, trade reports, and box scores of the games. Now, watching NFL games is much more enjoyable for me even though I love basketball.


----------



## TurningPoint

A lot of NBA can be seen as theatre due to the big personalities and how marketable the players are because basketball can be an individual sport in some respects. Personally, I enjoy the some of it like the counting to the NBA draft and trading deadlines. Yet some of it, like the Arenas incident and the recent showings of Greg Oden and George Hill are just downgrading the NBA as a product.


----------



## Atari82

Yea the Refs in the game are ****


----------



## mixolydian

Atari82 said:


> How bout them MILWAUKEE BUCKS :clap:clap:boogie:boogie


Followed a lot of their games because of Bogut and they've rapidly become one of my favourite teams. Skiles has them playing really good team basketball and has managed to bring out the best in Bogut's game. Salmons was a great pickup at the deadline, they look like a different team now they have a reliable scorer on the wing. They should definitely make the playoffs now and could even cause some trouble for some teams once they get there.


----------



## TurningPoint

I'm really going to hate Free Agency this year. It's going to be more exciting than the championship. And that's sad.


----------



## TurningPoint

mixolydian said:


> Followed a lot of their games because of Bogut and they've rapidly become one of my favourite teams. Skiles has them playing really good team basketball and has managed to bring out the best in Bogut's game. Salmons was a great pickup at the deadline, they look like a different team now they have a reliable scorer on the wing. They should definitely make the playoffs now and could even cause some trouble for some teams once they get there.


Skiles is one of the best coaches in the league for a while now. His teams always play hard and never quit on him. I didn't really like the Salmons pickup, but it's definitely paying off now. If they can get a nice power forward in the draft, they would have a really nice core in the east (Jennings, Bogut, Salmons). I've always liked Delfino, Mbah A Moute, and Ridnour too.


----------



## BetaBoy90

Bucks came out of nowhere, hope the Raps can hold em off for the fifth seed! (get well Bosh)


----------



## TurningPoint

I will cry if Chris Bosh leaves Toronto. It's going to feel empty to watch a 30-52 team.


----------



## n1kkuh

Lakers, I just don't know what to think of 'em right now, to be honest, I'm a little worried over here in LA. I don't know what the announcers are talking about saying that Lakers won a championship last year so they're still the team to beat. If you ask me, the MAVS are the team to beat. I think they're acquisition has made them fierce competitors in the west, and if they knock LA out, then they very well could beat the Cavs.


----------



## TurningPoint

n1kkuh said:


> Lakers, I just don't know what to think of 'em right now, to be honest, I'm a little worried over here in LA. I don't know what the announcers are talking about saying that Lakers won a championship last year so they're still the team to beat. If you ask me, the MAVS are the team to beat. I think they're acquisition has made them fierce competitors in the west, and if they knock LA out, then they very well could beat the Cavs.


I thought the Butler and Haywood acquisitions wouldn't put them over the Lakers and Nuggets. I'm wrong about that. The Mavericks are definitely a team that can match up against anyone. I think the Lakers, Nuggets, Mavericks are definitely the top three.

I couldn't sleep well last night after Kobe hit the game-winner. Chris Bosh made an incredible shot just before that.. and ugh. It didn't change the outcome of the game. Raptors played harder, and Kobe admitted it himself. I hope my Raptors can make it back to the 5th spot.


----------



## eyeguess

I can't believe I haven't made a single post in this thread since the beginning of the season! Anyway I thought I'd bump this for the playoffs.

Quick predictions that I'm sure are to go wrong...

Eastern Conference First Round
* Cleveland vs Chicago:* Cleveland in 5
* Boston vs Miami:* Boston in 7
* Orlando vs Charlotte:* Orlando in 7
* Atlanta vs Milwaukee:* Atlanta in 5

Eastern Conference Semifinals
* Cleveland vs Boston:* Cleveland in 6
* Orlando vs Atlanta:* Orlando in 7

Eastern Conference Finals
* Cleveland vs Orlando:* Cleveland in 5

Western Conference First Round
* Lakers vs Oklahoma City:* Lakers in 7
* Denver vs Utah:* Denver in 7
* Dallas vs San Antonio:* Dallas in 7
* Phoenix vs Portland:* Phoenix in 5

Western Conference Semifinals
* Lakers vs Denver:* Lakers in 7
* Dallas vs Phoenix:* Dallas in 6

Western Conference Finals
* Lakers vs Dallas:* Dallas in 6

Finals
* Cleveland vs Dallas:* Cleveland in 7


----------



## bsd3355

Well, of course, CLEVELAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!


...well they better:mum


----------



## 4realguy

its either going to be orlando or cleveland in the eastern conference in the western conference the teams are pretty close so its hard to say i am a nuggets fan so i am hoping them they have the talent to do it but i dont think they have the desire or mental toughness to do it they have no heart hopefully they will do something about that but i doubt that


----------



## n1kkuh

This year the West is just a big fat ????? I'm a Lakers fan, but admittedly, I have my doubts. Kobe doesn't look himself lately, his injuries are really affecting him and if you've watched him over the years you could tell he's not playing how he would normally. Without Kobe, the Lakers have no reliable offense from any of their other guards. At least last year Fisher was knocking down jumpers. 

And my thoughts on the San Antone Mavs series seem to be a little against the grain, but I feel San Antone might win it. With a healthy Ginobli and Duncan and George Hill AND Tony Parker, they're a dangerous team.

All bets are on Cleveland for the East, Orlando is truly the only team even remotely capable of an upset in the East, and that's all there is to it.


----------



## teejay

I don't think any team in the league can beat the lakers in a 7 gm series. Bynum needs to stay healthy though, he is key.


----------



## jp321

teejay said:


> I don't think any team in the league can beat the lakers in a 7 gm series. Bynum needs to stay healthy though, he is key.


1 down 15 to go.:wink






yikes, kob not himself.






oh yes, bynum. grown man move


----------



## redtogo72

eyeguess said:


> * Cleveland vs Orlando:* Cleveland in 5


I'm surprised you think that series will only go 5 games!

Your predictions looks pretty good to me. Though, I think it will be the Lakers and the Cavs in the Finals, but we'll see. 

Other news is that Garnett has been suspended for Game 2 because of this: 



.

This basket Rasheed makes is pretty funny (happened in the regular season): 



.


----------



## Toad Licker

Everyone has given up on the Blazers, including myself, seems no one told them they had no chance though as they were the only team to get a road win this weekend. I still think the Suns will take the series in the end but I like what I see in this Blazer team, now if only they could get healthy lol.


----------



## eyeguess

redtogo72 said:


> I'm surprised you think that series will only go 5 games!
> 
> Your predictions looks pretty good to me. Though, I think it will be the Lakers and the Cavs in the Finals, but we'll see.


Yeah, I didn't really feel like last season's Orlando Magic team had any more talent the Cleveland Cavaliers did; they just matched up very well with them, while also maybe overachieving a little. But going through some the moves each team has made since then, I really don't see Orlando holding that match up advantage like they did last season. I think the Cavs will come out with a chip on their shoulder and will have the series within 5 or 6 games.

I'm trying to be a little more bold with my predictions this year since I usually play it pretty safe and end up way off, so I've got that series going only to 5 games. Sort of the same with Mavs going to the finals. It was really tough coming up with any upsets without _really _going out there, especially in the East. It just seems like the Mavs were the healthiest team in the West (outside of OKC) and I really liked some of the moves they have made since last year. Besides, it's tough for any team to make it to the Finals three years in a row, especially after having won it the season before. I really wouldn't be surprised if either Denver or Dallas ends up taking them out.

However, neither Denver nor Dallas will end up winning it all. Both teams have a ton of talent but they're just simply not on the same level as Cleveland, Orlando, and LA. Neither team is good enough defensively or on the glass to be NBA Champions, but it would definitely not be out of their abilities to pull off an upset or make it to the finals. But what do I know? It should be a fun post-season, it just kind of blows that some of these teams are so banged up.


----------



## redtogo72

eyeguess said:


> Yeah, I didn't really feel like last season's Orlando Magic team had any more talent the Cleveland Cavaliers did; they just matched up very well with them, while also maybe overachieving a little. But going through some the moves each team has made since then, I really don't see Orlando holding that match up advantage like they did last season. I think the Cavs will come out with a chip on their shoulder and will have the series within 5 or 6 games.


I think it will be 6 or 7 games. Orlando is a tough opponent. And Orlando might beat the Cavs (if they end up meeting each other in the playoffs).



eyeguess said:


> However, neither Denver nor Dallas will end up winning it all. Both teams have a ton of talent but they're just simply not on the same level as Cleveland, Orlando, and LA. Neither team is good enough defensively or on the glass to be NBA Champions, but it would definitely not be out of their abilities to pull off an upset or make it to the finals. But what do I know? It should be a fun post-season, it just kind of blows that some of these teams are so banged up.


I'd like to see teams in the finals that haven't won in the last 25 years. Since 1984, only 7 teams (Pistons, Bulls, Lakers, Spurs, Celtics, Rockets, Heat) have won an NBA championship. While in the NFL since 2001, there's been 7 different superbowl winners.


----------



## BetaBoy90

I'm pulling for Lebron to get his first title. I just hope he wins multiple championships in his time because he is GOAT worthy and I know if he doesn't win a championship it will all be discredited.


----------



## TurningPoint

I think the Cavs are winning this year.

I thought it would be Cavs vs. Mavs this year, and I still think it will be.


----------



## Lateralus

It depends on bron's elbow now. I think even with his elbow healthy the Boston series will go 7 games, Cleveland with 4 home wins. If his elbow continues to get worse it will take a miracle.


----------



## TurningPoint

Looks like the Spurs came and won. I'm pretty glad for them. They're my favourite non-Raptor team in the past 10 years. I love their organization, system and their franchise player, Duncan. I thought they didn't have enough in the tank against Dallas and that Marion + Butler would be matchup problems. Glad I was wrong.


----------



## AliBaba

I'm just not seein anybody beating Orlando at the moment.


----------



## TurningPoint

After the completion of nearly 2 rounds, Orlando is the favourite. If Carter can play well, then they're unstoppable. Their inside-outside game is unmatched, they have the best bench in the league, they have the best shooters, they have the best defensive player, the have enough one-on-one guys, they just have an answer to everything. The team that can beat them is one that catches them on a bad shooting night, gets into Vince Carter's head, and is able to successfully defend Dwight Howard one on one. The Suns have no chance in my mind, the Lakers have the best chance because they have the size that will give them trouble and Kobe, the Cavaliers can only win if LeBron plays out of his mind in 4 games.


----------



## TurningPoint

StarryMessenger said:


> After the Suns's impressive sweep of Spurs, I actually believe they might beat the Lakers, possibly 4-2.
> 
> And Orlando had the benefit of easy opponents. The Bobcats and Hawks are rather weak opposition as compared to the other playoff teams. I think they will have trouble in later rounds.
> 
> I see Boston going through to the conference final against Orlando. Then it will be a tough fight. Orlando will be favourites but I see Boston going through 4-2 as well.


As much as I love Nash, the Lakers are a tough matchup for the Suns. Spurs played a three guard lineup with Jefferson/Duncan/McDyess for most of the series. Made it easier for Dudley and Hill to thwart them defensively.

Lamar Odom is going to be an insanely tough matchup for the Spurs. Dudley isn't big enough to guard him. Channing Frye or Amar'e Stoudemire isn't quick enough off the dribble. The Lakers have a premier one on one scorer in Kobe, where the best the Spurs had was Ginobili. The Lakers will be better with perimeter defense. I doubt Bynum will get much playing time in this series because the big men need to be able to guard on the perimeter.

I think the Magic win the Boston series. They have no answer for guarding Orlando's shooters. If they play like they did last year and let Rondo settle for jump shots, I think it will be a long series for Boston.


----------



## Whitney

I can't wait until this Cavs/Celtics series is over so I can see the dates for the conference finals... if it works out right I'll get to go to a game! Goooo Magic!!!


----------



## Whitney

Nah, Orlando can beat the Celtics...


----------



## AliBaba

So does LeBron play his final game as a Cavalier tonight?


----------



## TurningPoint

Call me crazy, but I think the Cavaliers are going to win the next two (or maybe stubborn because I picked them as the champs even though Orlando is much better than they are).


----------



## AliBaba

StarryMessenger said:


> Yay my prediction when the series was tied at 2-2 was right. Boston did indeed end up winning 4-2.


Excellent call. After the game last night I've come to the conclusion that I either seriously underestimated or flat out forgot about Boston. They may be an older team, but any club that plays Rasheed Wallace & Michael Finley 5 to 10 minutes a game is fairly talented/deep. Sure, LeBron had his elbow injury but Boston won game 5 by 32 in Cleveland for ****'s sake. I simply think the better team was victorious.

Orlando/Boston is now a toss up for me. I think if the C's find a way to somehow marginalize DHoward they win in 6 or 7 games(sorry Whitney). They will move on to meet a well rested Laker team(having swept the Suns) & Kobe will pull something out of his *** on his way to proving that Phil Jackson is the Most Valuable Team Asset(NVTA) in league history!!


----------



## BetaBoy90

Unfortunately for the fans, I feel as though the two upcoming series are going to be blowouts. I just think Orlando and LA are too strong for Boston and Phoenix. I hope I'm wrong but I see a repeat finals matchup this year.


----------



## Toad Licker

I was happy to see Boston beat the Cavs yesterday Shaq has enough freakin' rings and Lebron is young enough to still get plenty himself so...


----------



## Mr. SandMan

The only reason people slept on Boston is because of all the injuries they've had. Now they are healthy. They are pretty much the same team now as they were when they won the championship two years ago. If my NBA playoff instinct is telling me right, Boston may take it, cause I don't think the Lakers wanna see Boston in the Finals, and I damn well know that Orlando would have rather had the Cavs...


----------



## AstronautsGrapes

seeing lebron lose honestly made my day.
:yes


----------



## anonymid

I think the finals are going to be an Orlando-L.A. rematch, but go Celtics!


----------



## TurningPoint

BetaBoy90 said:


> Unfortunately for the fans, I feel as though the two upcoming series are going to be blowouts. I just think Orlando and LA are too strong for Boston and Phoenix. I hope I'm wrong but I see a repeat finals matchup this year.


I agree with this wise man's statement. Boston can't guard Orlando's shooters and aren't big enough on the perimeter. Jared Dudley and Grant Hill are going to be playing Artest and Odom / Kobe Bryant is better than any scorer on Portland / San Antonio. Also, there have been many blowout series this year, and the trend is likely to continue.

Also, I am still utterly disappointed in Cleveland. Cleveland should have won. Mike Brown kept playing Shaq too much. I don't think people realize how bad Shaq and Mo Williams were throughout the series. Varejao, Moon, and Hickson didn't get enough time on the floor, which was a big worry for me with the Jamison trade (having too many big men screwing up rotations).

For anyone who is interested in the saga of LeBron, Bill Simmons has a really interesting take on it in his latest column. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100514&sportCat=nba


----------



## redtogo72

I'm pleasantly surprised the Celtics won. The Cavs looked like they gave up during game 5, after halftime. I was so sick of hearing about Lebron's elbow and, "Where is Lebron going to play next season" while watching the games. I hope Lebron decides to stay in Cleveland. 

I thought Shaq was okay, and even in game 5 he was the leading scorer for the Cavs with 21 points. Jamison and Mo Williams did play poorly, whoever was guarding Rondo and Garnett. :/

With the western conference finals, I think it would be cool to see the Suns beat the Lakers. I didn't think the Suns would beat the Spurs especially that easily, so you never know. It might happen.


----------



## RyanJ

TurningPoint said:


> For anyone who is interested in the saga of LeBron, Bill Simmons has a really interesting take on it in his latest column. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100514&sportCat=nba


It's an interesting take on it. I guess I still don't completely understand what's wrong with the Cavs... Is it LeBron, as some people have suggested? Is it the people surrounding him (as we have heard for the past few seasons)? Is it Mike Brown? It just doesn't make sense how a team that good can keep running into a postseason wall - especially this year.

It almost seems poetic now, like Peyton Manning and the Colts failing to get it done in the playoffs (minus the 2006 season and the gift that was Rex Grossman). I admit in some perverse way it was satisfying to watch, but still it wasn't what I (or many other people) expected to happen and there doesn't seem to be a completely satisfactory answer for it. Who knows...maybe it was match-ups...maybe the Celtics really were THAT good...


----------



## AliBaba

Mike Brown sealed his fate as a head coach when he decided that down 9 with 1:09 left(in the season mind you) he decided it wasn't necessary to foul :blank


----------



## TurningPoint

RyanJ said:


> It's an interesting take on it. I guess I still don't completely understand what's wrong with the Cavs... Is it LeBron, as some people have suggested? Is it the people surrounding him (as we have heard for the past few seasons)? Is it Mike Brown? It just doesn't make sense how a team that good can keep running into a postseason wall - especially this year.
> 
> It almost seems poetic now, like Peyton Manning and the Colts failing to get it done in the playoffs (minus the 2006 season and the gift that was Rex Grossman). I admit in some perverse way it was satisfying to watch, but still it wasn't what I (or many other people) expected to happen and there doesn't seem to be a completely satisfactory answer for it. Who knows...maybe it was match-ups...maybe the Celtics really were THAT good...


Woj always delivers with his articles. I think it's a combination of everything. I think Simmons hit it the nail on the head when he said LeBron doens't have Jordan's DNA of being a ruthless competitor. There was much at stake right now for LeBron's legacy, and he didn't deliver. Mike Brown messed up his rotations and kept playing Shaq when he was terrible throughout the series. He should be fired for the terrible coaching job in this series when so much was on the line. I don't think Boston was that good. They may have caught fire at the right time (especially Rondo), but I think with good reason, this series was more about Cleveland disappointing than the turnaround of a season the Celtics is having, which is unfair to the Celtics.

I think the biggest factor though is that LeBron doesn't have another All-Star caliber player next to him. Jordan had Pippen. Bird had McHale, Parrish, DJ. Magic had Kareem, Worthy. Kobe and Wade had Shaq in their championship years. LeBron? He's had maybe some borderline all-stars (the best player he's ever played with is probably Jamison, who doesn't fit on this team), but never all-stars or Hall Of Fame talents in their prime.

Mo Williams was a joke of a selection and a byproduct of a winning team. Put him on any other contender, his numbers are worse. Shaq is effective in the right matchups, but he's too proud to acknowledge that having Hickson on the court may be better for the team at most times. Jamison.. it's a tough one. He's 33 years old and he can't guard most power forwards. His numbers seem to be a byproduct of being on bad teams. With that being said, if they couldn't get Amar'e, then they had to get Jamison, especially at the ridiculously low price he went for.

What to do? I think he should stay in Cleveland. Finish what you started. Be like Tim Duncan and Steve Nash. Loyal. Be like Michael Jordan, Bill Russell, Kobe Bryant. Have your legacy known with only one team (I don't count the Wizards debacle for MJ). It's his hometown area. He's the most popular guy in the state. Of course he will definitely need more help if he stays in Cleveland. If he leaves, I will be saddened, unless of course he were to miraculously go to the Raptors


----------



## Whitney

Noooo Magic!!!! You need to win this game..... :bat

Edit: OMG so close... Proud of that come-back though, just a little late. It's just the first game, the Magic will dominate from here on out :yes


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

Has anyone heard of the rumor of Delonte West and Gloria James slept together and LeBron found out after game 4?


----------



## RyanJ

TurningPoint said:


> Woj always delivers with his articles. I think it's a combination of everything. I think Simmons hit it the nail on the head when he said LeBron doens't have Jordan's DNA of being a ruthless competitor. [...]
> 
> I think the biggest factor though is that LeBron doesn't have another All-Star caliber player next to him. [...]
> 
> What to do? I think he should stay in Cleveland. Finish what you started. Be like Tim Duncan and Steve Nash. Loyal. Be like Michael Jordan, Bill Russell, Kobe Bryant. Have your legacy known with only one team (I don't count the Wizards debacle for MJ). It's his hometown area. He's the most popular guy in the state. Of course he will definitely need more help if he stays in Cleveland. If he leaves, I will be saddened, unless of course he were to miraculously go to the Raptors


LOL on the last part. :b Nicely put overall. I think that explains the situation as best as anyone can...


----------



## redtogo72

Brightpaperwarewolf said:


> Has anyone heard of the rumor of Delonte West and Gloria James slept together and LeBron found out after game 4?


Yeah, that was funny even though it was just a rumor that I saw posted from a blog. I remember another silly rumor that was never proven, involving Shaq sleeping with Gilbert Arenas fiancee/GF.

Orlando lost today. :blank I like boston too though. Maybe Orlando had too long of a rest. During the 2001 NBA playoffs, I remember when the Lakers swept all their western conference opponents and had a long break before facing the 76ers in the finals. The Lakers lost the first game and then won 4 games in a row.


----------



## eyeguess

I think it's interesting how polarizing LeBron's free agency situation has become around the NBA and how divided everyone's stance is on loyalty and taking on opportunity. Personally, I think he should just give it time, well not quite Brett Favre 'let's wait till the last possible minute' -like, but enough to let the emotion of the playoffs subside and to see what everyone else does (who everyone drafts, trades, brings in, etc..) compared to what the Cavs end up doing, and then decide on the team that he feels would put him in the best position to win over the next few years.

So I guess I'm more on the 'jumping ship' side, in a way. The statement that Kevin Garnett made after game six kind of stuck with me, which was something to the effect that, he was loyal to Minnesota for the vast majority of his career and that he actually regrets spending his entire youth/prime on a team that never went anywhere and that if he could go back and do it all over again he would have done things much differently.

The way I see it, LeBron is a once-in-a-lifetime athlete that still has the potential to achieve so much and possibly even go down as the greatest player of all time, and if there is another team that would put him in a better position to maximize his full potential then I think he should go for it. However, I do get the arguments for why he should stay in Cleveland. The guy has unfinished business and was unable to win a title for Cleveland, and then there's the whole loyalty argument and the effects that he would have on the city of Cleveland if he were to leave. So I would totally get it if he were to stay in Cleveland. Nevertheless, I think the worst thing that he could do this offseason would be to sign with the New York Knicks. Even with another star, I just can't see them having enough talent to be contenders in the short-term, plus their coaching style/system is not really conducive to winning titles. I honestly think that it would say a lot about LeBron if he were to go to NY - that he's more concerned with the glamor and the money, as opposed to staying in Cleveland or going to another team and was more concerned with winning.


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## redtogo72

IMO, Michael Jordan will always be the best. 

Kevin Garnett was right in a way, but I can't really feel sorry for him. The Timberwolves went to the western conference finals in the 2003/2004 season. Kevin Garnett was being payed a ton of money (18 million a year) in Minnesota. They were paying Wally Szerbiak 10 million a year. I think the Timberwolves couldn't sign anyone except for the MLE. And most of their other players weren't tradable either due to their long contracts or because of their poor production.

Cleveland can pay Lebron the most money. Maybe he would make more money from endorsements by playing in Chicago or New York (IDK). I think Cleveland tried their best to make a good team for Lebron. And the Bulls, Heat, Knicks, and the Nets aren't better than the Cavs. I guess though we will need to see what other moves these teams make during the offseason.


----------



## TurningPoint

eyeguess said:


> So I guess I'm more on the 'jumping ship' side, in a way. The statement that Kevin Garnett made after game six kind of stuck with me, which was something to the effect that, he was loyal to Minnesota for the vast majority of his career and that he actually regrets spending his entire youth/prime on a team that never went anywhere and that if he could go back and do it all over again he would have done things much differently.
> 
> The way I see it, LeBron is a once-in-a-lifetime athlete that still has the potential to achieve so much and possibly even go down as the greatest player of all time, and if there is another team that would put him in a better position to maximize his full potential then I think he should go for it. However, I do get the arguments for why he should stay in Cleveland. The guy has unfinished business and was unable to win a title for Cleveland, and then there's the whole loyalty argument and the effects that he would have on the city of Cleveland if he were to leave. So I would totally get it if he were to stay in Cleveland. Nevertheless, I think the worst thing that he could do this offseason would be to sign with the New York Knicks. Even with another star, I just can't see them having enough talent to be contenders in the short-term, plus their coaching style/system is not really conducive to winning titles. I honestly think that it would say a lot about LeBron if he were to go to NY - that he's more concerned with the glamor and the money, as opposed to staying in Cleveland or going to another team and was more concerned with winning.


In Garnett's situation, Timberwolves' management was absolutely horrendous with the Joe Smith fiasco and bad trades. Cleveland management did make some bad moves, but they have been closer to getting to a championship more times than Garnett ever was in Minnesota.

The bigger difference is that Garnett is only, perhaps a top 30-40 player all time. LeBron has the chance to be in the top 5 of all time.

He needs to stay. The majority of best players to play in the NBA have made their legend known with only one team (I can think of Kareem, Wilt, Shaq as a few that haven't). Even NBA commissioner Stern said that he personally would want to see LeBron stay. The entire fanbase in Cleveland will go down the drain. I don't want to see that happen to the people of Cleveland, and I don't think LeBron wants to either.

If LeBron goes to he New York Knicks, I really will question if he will ever win a championship ring. That team is not built for a championship and has a worse roster than Cleveland.


----------



## JayDontCareEh

Time for the Kobe show... Go Lakers!


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## eyeguess

Yeah, Garnett was definitely not in the most ideal of situations and he really should have jumped on an opportunity to leave much earlier in his career. Had he moved on to a more successful team earlier on, I believe he could be ranked a lot more closer to where Tim Duncan is today.

With regards to the Caveliers, I'm just not seeing a whole lot of upside with this team and I feel that they have a ton of work to do in terms of restructuring their roster to become more competitive against the elite teams in the league. I mean, yeah, the ultimate situation for LeBron would be to stay in Cleveland and go on to win several championship rings, but with so many options available to him this offseason, does he have a more likely chance of winning over the next several seasons with another team?

I guess that's where the difference in opinions lie. I feel that with so much weight given to the number of championship rings a player has in determining their legacy, I think LeBron would build a stronger case if he were to earn more rings on another team than if he were to remain on the same team throughout his career and not win quite as many. I mean, if the Cavs pull off some amazing work this offseason and put together an attractive roster, then by all means, LeBron should stay put. Either way, regardless of what their front office ends up doing, I definitely do not think that staying in Cleveland would be a wrong choice, it would be totally understandable. Again, I just feel that he would be better off going with the team that would give him the greatest chance of winning, whether that's with the Cavs or not.


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## TurningPoint

Odom is and always has been a terrible matchup for the Suns. No one can guard him, and he's able to guard the perimeter, which negates any advantages Phoenix would have going small by playing Dudley or Hill at the 4, or having Frye at the three point line.

I would think that Orlando and the Lakers will meet again in the Finals.


----------



## redtogo72

I saw this on another forum, Grant Hill trying to guard Kobe: http://i41.tinypic.com/35l821x.jpg (3.7mb pic)


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## Brightpaperwarewolf

Damn, what a move. Let's hear it for King Kobe!


----------



## TurningPoint

StarryMessenger said:


> Boston just beat Orlando 95-92. It's 2-0 to Boston. Apparently, it's the first time Boston had opened the series with consecutive road wins in playoff history. Orlando has a mountain to climb now.
> 
> I think the easier opponents Orlando had (Charlotte and Atlanta) worked against them. They are better rested, but they have not found the groove of winning close games against stronger opponents, whereas Boston had tougher opponents (Miami and Cleveland).


Couldn't agree more. They pummeled an overmatched Charlotte team and beating a listless Atlanta team lowered their intensity. Even though Boston matches up better against Howard this year because Glen Davis and Rasheed Wallace are playing better against him, the Magic have Nelson and Carter who can penetrate into defenses and open things up for penetration. They need more pick and rolls involving Carter and Nelson. Dwight is having trouble one on one creating offense for his teammates, which was even evident against Kendrick Perkins last year.


----------



## eyeguess

Has there ever been a conference finals where both sides were sweeps?

I guess it's not that likely to happen, but it would be interesting to see. Anyway, I'm pulling for Boston for the rest of the way (as a Charlotte fan, I would love to see them win the next two games by 30+ points), however, I have LA winning it all.


----------



## Whitney

Even though most people have given up on them, I won't give up on my Magic!


----------



## eyeguess

So what is wrong with Orlando? What is holding them back? I mean, they looked promising - made it all the way to the finals last year, had a great regular season, and have looked great in the playoffs up until now, is Boston just really that good of a team or are they that much of a matchup problem for them? I know they went up against much lesser talent in the first two rounds, but did they peak too early, was it the break that killed them, is it the lack of leadership or whatever? What does this team need to do in order to win in the future?

I agree with some of the aforementioned points that this team needs to become more dynamic offensively. I mean, you hear that all of the time, but they really do shoot way too many three's and Dwight simply is just not skilled enough to be the only one scoring in the paint. We know Vince, Rashard, and Jameer are all more than capable of scoring in various ways, however, we don't see that happen nearly enough.

So besides internal development (Dwight developing more of an offensive game, players attacking the basket more often, etc..) I think the best option for this team is to bring in another PG. While I think Jameer is a very solid player, an efficient scorer, and actually not that bad of a defensive player, I think this team would benefit much more by having a true PG, a distributor, someone who can dissect opposing team's defenses and create easy scoring opportunities for others. IMO, you replace Jameer with someone like Rondo and this team wins multiple titles over the next few years. One stat I thought was interesting for this series, Nelson: 7 assists, 10 turnovers. Rondo: 28 assists, 8 turnovers.

Anyway, going into the playoffs I felt that Rashard Lewis was Orlando's X factor and he has been, without a doubt, their worst player this series. Granted, he has been going up against Kevin Garnet and that great Boston defense, but for 37.3 minutes a game, he's averaging 5 pts, 2 asts, and 5 rebs on .250 from the field and .077 from beyond the arc! That level of production is awful even for someone making a fifth of his contract.


----------



## eyeguess

So much for the Conference Finals sweeps. I missed the game last night, watched the series finale of LOST instead, but it looks like there was actually a competitive game. The Boston-Orlando game tonight has been closely fought as well, granted I haven't watched very much of it, but it looks like Orlando is finally pushing the tempo, penetrating into the lane, and there was actually a Brandon Bass sighting.

Anyway, I think most of us have already written off this series, but how interesting would it be if Orlando were to come back and win it? That type of a run would be completely unprecedented in the NBA and could change the way we look at future playoff series.

EDIT: I say that as Boston makes a strong run, cutting the lead down to 1.


----------



## Whitney

eyeguess said:


> Anyway, I think most of us have already written off this series, but how interesting would it be if Orlando were to come back win it?


That would be amazing! Go Magic!


----------



## Lateralus

FYI, an NBA team has never once come back from a 3-0 deficit to win a 7 game series. I know there's a first time for everything though.


----------



## TurningPoint

eyeguess said:


> So what is wrong with Orlando? What is holding them back? I mean, they looked promising - made it all the way to the finals last year, had a great regular season, and have looked great in the playoffs up until now, is Boston just really that good of a team or are they that much of a matchup problem for them? I know they went up against much lesser talent in the first two rounds, but did they peak too early, was it the break that killed them, is it the lack of leadership or whatever? What does this team need to do in order to win in the future?


It's a big matchup problem because Boston can guard Dwight Howard one on one, which doesn't allow the 3 point shooters to get open. Nelson and Carter don't penetrate as nearly enough as they should to create open looks of their teammates. Turkoglu always ran pick and rolls, which fit the offense well. This year's offense is struggling with that. Now that they don't have Turkoglu, perhaps someone like Devin Harris (who is a dribble drive creator) would be a better fit for this particular Magic team.

Despite the matchup problem, I still think on paper, Orlando is the better team. It's the intangibles stuff that Boston has that Orlando does not. Orlando doesn't have leaders on that team. Boston has more experience and heart. The homecourt advantage is much more favourable to Boston than Orlando because of the crowds.

If Orlando needs to change anything to get ready for next season, they need a leader other than Stan Van Gundy on the sidelines.


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## eyeguess

I kind of like the idea of Devin Harris teaming up with the Magic, and rejoining Carter. He seemed to have played at his best when they were together, and he would certainly add a new dynamic to that team. I'd like to see what they could do with a true floor general though. Someone like Jason Kidd, even at his age, would do wonders for that team, IMO.

Anyway, I've got Orlando winning the next one at home and then Boston sealing the deal in game 6. But I'm still pulling for the story of Orlando taking over the series.


----------



## AlwaysOnTheOutside

Suns surprised me tying the series at 2 games. I still think the Lakers will win, but they need to make some adjustments to handle the zone.


----------



## BetaBoy90

Nash is such a warrior, I think he is inspiring his team to pull through this series, I can see Phoenix winning it now, they have the momentum going.


----------



## TurningPoint

I can't even watch anymore. I just follow through internet articles.


----------



## Toad Licker

I hated to see the Lakers win since I hate them so much but even I have to admit that that was one hell of an ending lastnight.


----------



## AlwaysOnTheOutside

Redemption for Ron Artest!


----------



## Toad Licker

Celtics vs. Lakers in the finals, been there done that don't really care to see it again. I'll probably watch it anyway but it's gotten quite old watching the same small handful of teams trade the nba title back and forth for more than a quarter century now.


----------



## Fitzer

Celtics and Lakers playing in the finals again huh? Seems like an uninteresting match to me since the Lakers won last year and the celtics the year before that but I'll probably still watch some of it. 

Lakers in 6


----------



## AlwaysOnTheOutside

Fitzer said:


> Celtics and Lakers playing in the finals again huh? Seems like an uninteresting match to me since the Lakers won last year and the celtics the year before that but I'll probably still watch some of it.
> 
> Lakers in 6


Wow, for those same reasons I think it's a great matchup. You've got the 2 most recent champions and 2 most storied franchise battling it out. Also, I think this will be the most competitive and exciting Finals in a long time.

Lakers in 7.


----------



## eyeguess

Out of the four Conference Finals teams, I would have probably preferred the Orlando-Phoenix matchup the most, but the Boston-Lakers series is a close runner up. I really had no interest in seeing another Orlando-Lakers series and I don't really care for how Boston and Phoenix match up.

But I think it'll be a good series. The playoffs so far have been rather ho-hum and I think this could easily turn out to be the closest fought series of the postseason. Anyway, still pulling for Boston, still have LA winning... I'm going to say LA in 7.


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## TurningPoint

I'm actually watching the Finals right now. Ray Allen is insane. Best shooter of all time. Better than Bird, Miller, Nash.

In other news, an amazing article by Adrian Wojnarowski, and I fully agree with him. Any organization (sports or not) should be run by a management with a strong philosophy rather than beckoning to the wishes of your best employee. I still think he's going to come back to Cleveland, otherwise, I will view LeBron differently.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Aq_wCnL0GVqAr6nNMrWp_3S8vLYF?slug=aw-lebroninfluence060510


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## TurningPoint

This Finals is insane so far. Anyone up for watching Game 5 tonight?


----------



## Toad Licker

I'll check in on the game as I have the first 4, it's a must win for Boston if they lose I think it's all over I just can't imagine them winning the final two games back in L.A. .


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## anonymid

Go Celtics!!


----------



## BetaBoy90

I think the Lakers have this game in the bag, they better sit out Bynum though, he is just ruining team chemistry.


----------



## Toad Licker

Sadly I think the Lakers will do it tonight, like either team needs another championship.


----------



## anonymid

Ugh, the Celtics had a 13-point lead and couldn't close the deal. That was an ugly game all around. Exciting final minute with all those big threes on both sides, though.


----------



## kos

Yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh boiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii!!!!!!


----------



## Harbinger

What a shame... :|


----------



## matty

A shame indeedy


----------



## BetaBoy90

Was it a good game though?

Also **** KOBE!!!!


----------



## eyeguess

I thought it was a good game, it was gritty and down to the wire. I guess if you like defense and physical games, otherwise you probably hated it. I do think that the officiating could have been a little better. It seemed like at the beginning they were going to let the teams play, but for the most part there were a lot of ticky-tack calls and calls that probably should have been no calls, at least for a game 7 in the Finals. The way I see it, it's the absolute final game of the season and everything is on the line, they're going to play physical, let them go at it. The flow of the game would have been so much better for it.

Regardless, the better team won. It came down to the Lakers simply being the team that gave the most effort. They played great defense throughout all four quarters (unlike Boston) and they absolutely destroyed them on the glass.

Anyway, I enjoyed the Finals. It was close, unpredictable, and both teams put up a good fight. It was easily better than last year's, IMO.


----------



## rawrguy

Lakers 4ever <3
I smell a 3-peat coming


----------



## redtogo72

NBA Draft is on tomorrow (Thursday).


----------



## eyeguess

So quick thoughts on the draft last night. I'll just do one winner, one loser to keep it relatively short.

The winner, the Oklahoma City Thunder. I LOVE the trade that brought in Cole Aldrich. They did have to give up a solid chunk of their capspace in order to make make it happen, but I think it was well worth it and another very smart move by Presti. Defense and frontcourts win championships and this is a nice step in the right direction. I think OKC will really benefit from having a big defensive five anchoring the team's defense, while also putting up a double-double every night. They were ranked eighth last season in defensive efficiency and I think this will easily put them in the top-five next season.

They've still got a few more moves to make before being considered legit contenders, but I think having a quality center in place will make things much easier for them. They've got a great FO and a ton of assets, personally I don't have any doubts that this team will be in the talks of being Western Conference champs within a couple of years.

The loser, Utah Jazz. It's funny because I wasn't much of a Cole Aldrich fan about a month ago but the fact of the matter is, quality centers are hard to come by and the Jazz have needed one for years. Simply put, you're not winning a title with Okur as your starting center, unless you have a Tim Duncan-esque player in his prime manning the PF position. Like many other teams, they would have really benefited from having a solid, defensive minded center and I thought he had good value for the 9th overall pick.

Originally, I was under the impression that Hayward would turn out to be a bust in this league, but if there is any team that's able get the most out of him, it's probably under Sloan and next to a playmaker like Williams. Regardless, even if they're not taking Aldrich, they should have at least swung for the fences with this pick. They were playing with house money and they should have selected someone with some upside and some potential to be a stud in this league, or at least someone with a higher ceiling than Gordon Hayward. So for that, I'm calling it the worst selection of the draft.


----------



## TurningPoint

eyeguess said:


> So quick thoughts on the draft last night. I'll just do one winner, one loser to keep it relatively short.
> 
> The winner, the Oklahoma City Thunder. I LOVE the trade that brought in Cole Aldrich. They did have to give up a solid chunk of their capspace in order to make make it happen, but I think it was well worth it and another very smart move by Presti. Defense and frontcourts win championships and this is a nice step in the right direction. I think OKC will really benefit from having a big defensive five anchoring the team's defense, while also putting up a double-double every night. They were ranked eighth last season in defensive efficiency and I think this will easily put them in the top-five next season.
> 
> They've still got a few more moves to make before being considered legit contenders, but I think having a quality center in place will make things much easier for them. They've got a great FO and a ton of assets, personally I don't have any doubts that this team will be in the talks of being Western Conference champs within a couple of years.
> 
> The loser, Utah Jazz. It's funny because I wasn't much of a Cole Aldrich fan about a month ago but the fact of the matter is, quality centers are hard to come by and the Jazz have needed one for years. Simply put, you're not winning a title with Okur as your starting center, unless you have a Tim Duncan-esque player in his prime manning the PF position. Like many other teams, they would have really benefited from having a solid, defensive minded center and I thought he had good value for the 9th overall pick.
> 
> Originally, I was under the impression that Hayward would turn out to be a bust in this league, but if there is any team that's able get the most out of him, it's probably under Sloan and next to a playmaker like Williams. Regardless, even if they're not taking Aldrich, they should have at least swung for the fences with this pick. They were playing with house money and they should have selected someone with some upside and some potential to be a stud in this league, or at least someone with a higher ceiling than Gordon Hayward. So for that, I'm calling it the worst selection of the draft.


The big winner in the draft is obviously the Wizards with the selection of John Wall who is the best point guard prospect to come out of college since Jason Kidd, in my mind. Picking up a great rotation player in Hinrich and an extra draft pick with the extra cap space also is a coupe. The Thunder did very well, especially with the Bledsoe for a future pick trade. I hate to say that the Bulls won by clearing more cap space at only the cost of Hinrich and a mid-round pick.

Since July 1st, I absolutely dislike what is happening in the NBA marketplace. I understand that teams need to put their best foot forward since there is most likely going to be a lockout the following year, but that doesn't mean that there shouldn't be financial responsibility. The only two reasonable contracts that have been handed out so far are for John Salmons and Steve Blake. The rest of the contracts handed out show that the league is in a disaster. Rudy Gay - $80 million over 5 years? That makes him a nearly max player when he was only the second best player on a team that didn't make the playoffs last year. That doesn't make any sense. People are not paying to see Rudy Gay. Scenarios like this are the big picture. Not the LeBron Sweepstakes, which have taken control of the NBA since the beginning of last season. LeBron was formerly my favourite player, but the ridiculous amount of attention he's put on himself for something that can't be considered an achievement - it's... sad. Sad for the NBA. and for the good of the sport, I wish the lockout was this year rather than next.


----------



## eyeguess

Yeah, there has been a lot of terrible signings so far this offseason, but doesn't this seem to happen almost every year, more or less? I actually thought 2008 was a little worse in terms of the number and the size of irrational contracts being thrown around. But I have to agree with what you're saying though, I think it just continues to show the level of incompetency throughout some of the front offices in the NBA and hopefully the new CBA will help alleviate some of the damage these organizations do to their teams with these awful financial decisions. There's just too many bad contracts in the NBA and if the new CBA doesn't make any adjustments towards balancing this issue, the bottom rung GMs are just going to continue to hand out bad contracts year after year.

Anyway, I've been trying to make better sense of some of these signings and trying to see where these teams are coming from. In Amare's case, the guy was overpaid. With all of his shortcomings, he's not a max-level player. I actually don't think he's that much better than David Lee, however, he puts people in the seats. He will, without a doubt, sell way more jerseys and produce way more revenue and garner much more interest in the Knicks from the NYC area than David Lee ever possibly could. I don't think the Knicks got a 'deal' with Amare, but I don't think his contract is absurd either.

In Joe Johnson's case, I think it's unanimous among everybody that this guy is not a max-level player. But coming from Atlanta's perspective, had they not given him the max contract, another team like NY likely would have and if you take Johnson off Atlanta's roster and plug Jamal Crawford into the starting lineup, they are no longer a playoff team. They immediately become a late lottery team (which is the worst position to be in the NBA) and their attendance figures go from being middle-of-the-road back to being among the worst in the league. So I'm thinking it was kind-of worth the trade-off.

The Rudy Gay signing, on the other hand, was pretty absurd. The guy is still young so I'm sure they're banking on him taking his game to another level, but that's one hell of a risky move. For the reasons you already mentioned, it looks like a terrible decision by Memphis.

...going off Simmons' article from today, it is pretty crazy, though, that Darko Milicic, Channing Frye, Amir Johnson and Drew Gooden have all signed for a combined $114 million!

Anyway, I know it's been way over beaten so in my best attempt to keep the LeBron talk short, I'm getting the feeling that he stays in Cleveland, despite the rumored reports that he's going to Miami.


----------



## eyeguess

So LeBron just alienated a very large amount of people.

A lot of different thoughts on his decision, I still have to mull it over a little more and hear some other thoughts on it, but at the moment I pretty much share the same sentiment as this excerpt from Simmons' article:


> I think it's a cop-out. Any super-competitive person would rather beat Dwyane Wade than play with him. Don't you want to find the Ali to your Frazier and have that rival pull the greatness out of you? That's why I'm holding out hope that LeBron signs with New York or Chicago (or stays in Cleveland), because he'd be saying, "Fine. Kobe, Dwight and Melo all have their teams. Wade and Bosh have their team. The Celtics are still there. Durant's team is coming. I'm gonna go out and build MY team, and I'm kicking all their asses." That's what Jordan would have done. Hell, that's what Kobe would have done.
> 
> In May, after the Cavs were ousted in the conference semifinals, I wrote that LeBron was facing one of the greatest sports decisions ever: "winning (Chicago), loyalty (Cleveland) or a chance at immortality (New York)."
> 
> I never thought he would pick "HELP!"


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

LeCryBaby can't win by himself so he needs to play in Wade's shadow. No matter how many rings LeCryBaby has, Wade will have one more. 

I hope Kobe and the Lakers win a title again this year to rub it in his face. I'll admit I always hated LeCryBaby with a passion because of all those playoff battles the Cavs had with the Wizards, but to turn your back on your hometown and devastate the community and fans of Cleveland who supported him all those years on national television is disgusting. What an attention *****.


----------



## BetaBoy90

I don't blame Bron for going to South Beach. I mean I cannot criticize the man for not winning a title with the **** he's been playing with the past few years. It takes a special team to win a championship every year, not one supreme talent. As much as Jordan's titles are impressive, he had some great talents alongside himself in the 90's (Pippen- Hofer, Kukoc- good complimentary player, Ron Harper- solid veteran guy, Rodman- top 5 rebounder of all time)with alot of watered down teams playing against him as well. 

Sure the way the signings are going down sucks for the die hard fan to see. Everybody going to Miami just doesn't seem fair, but honestly can any of us really be surprised by this. The way professional sports leagues are run these days to see soo many superstars sign for soo much money on one team is almost expected to happen now.

I guess the big question isn't is it fair and right the way this offseason went down, but should I still be watching this game if this is what the league has become?


----------



## coldsorehighlighter

Will 1 championship for LeBron, on this team, be much different than 0 championships with Cleveland? They have to win multiple titles or else he gave up everything for nothing.
Can anyone think of 1 super-star player in the history of the NBA who has done this in his prime?
It's similar to Kevin Garnett going from Minnesota to Boston a few years ago, but he played 12 seasons in Minnesota and was into his 30's. 
Even if Miami and LeBron win a lot of titles, maybe 4 or 5, history will not forget that he gave up and took the easy route.


----------



## bsd3355

Being from Ohio I can say when he said he was going to Miami my heart sunk and it felt like I was cheated on by a girlfriend or something. That's how it felt. Cleveland went from one of the best teams in the NBA to one of the worst like that.


----------



## bsd3355

Eh, actually, I take that back. We still don't have the worst team.


----------



## millenniumman75

I guess LeBron's ego is Miami's problem now.


----------



## Toad Licker

I'm just glad the whole Lebron thing is over I'm sick of hearing about it.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

^^
haha @ millennium

Lebron James has just proved that he is not a champion. True champions love challenges. Never once in the history of the NBA has the proclaimed best player in the NBA left _his_ team to go play with two other all-stars on a different team to win a championship. It's quite frankly pathetic on his part.

He left Ohio, his home state, his team, to go to Miami for a better chance at winning. But even so, it isn't like it's a shoe in, because it's not like they have a deep bench or anything. And Lebron has already shown charactaristics of giving up when he feels there isn't a chance that his team can still win a game. Characteristics of which champions do not hold.

But all for all, I hope Lebron gets what he wants, and I hope David Stern isn't kicking himself in the *** over all the hype he has givin him to be the best thing to enter the NBA. Because making a move like this shows he is not the best in the league and he is afraid of a challenge.

And I think that people forget that nobody nicked-named him The King, he gave it to him himself.


----------



## bsd3355

bignate said:


> ^^
> haha @ millennium
> 
> Lebron James has just proved that he is not a champion. True champions love challenges. Never once in the history of the NBA has the proclaimed best player in the NBA left _his_ team to go play with two other all-stars on a different team to win a championship. It's quite frankly pathetic on his part.
> 
> He left Ohio, his home state, his team, to go to Miami for a better chance at winning. But even so, it isn't like it's a shoe in, because it's not like they have a deep bench or anything. And Lebron has already shown charactaristics of giving up when he feels there isn't a chance that his team can still win a game. Characteristics of which champions do not hold.
> 
> But all for all, I hope Lebron gets what he wants, and I hope David Stern isn't kicking himself in the *** over all the hype he has givin him to be the best thing to enter the NBA. Because making a move like this shows he is not the best in the league and he is afraid of a challenge.
> 
> And I think that people forget that nobody nicked-named him The King, he gave it to him himself.


:yes I'm having a hard time disagreeing with that


----------



## AlwaysOnTheOutside




----------



## jp321

WRONG TEAM LEBRON, nobody gives a damn about miami.

Rose
Deng
Lebron
Boozer
Noah

That is a nasty and scary lineup and alot more balanced then this garbage trio.

That team is tailor made for him, he would of been the man to.

Cant wait for next seasons playoffs when boston beats them


----------



## Mr. SandMan

That video is kindof hot.

But no matter how many championships they win or don't win, Lebron is going to be looked at like Kobe was looked at when he was with Shaq.

And with that being said, after Lebron's career, he will not be put in the catagory of a Micheal Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Larry Bird and Magic Johnson if Lebron can't win with his own team. It will always be a topic of discussion when Lebron's career is over. It's hard to put Kobe in the same class as Jordan and the others, but Kobe has made his team mates better over the past couple years. Lebron hasn't done that, and that's what great players do.

Now Lebron is on a team with players who are already to an allstar compasity, he doesn't need to work anymore. I don't hope this move bites him in the ***, but I'll laugh if it does.

But with Dwayne Wade I don't think there will be any lack of heart on this team.


----------



## utopian_grrl

With LeBron and Z gone, the Cavs aren't the worst team in the league. They are capable of making the playoffs if the younger players s can reach their potential.

It's really unfortunate because 5+ yrs ago, the Cavs of the last 2 seasons could have won the championship. This was when the Spurs swept the Cavs in the finals and the Detriot Pistons were champs. Timing just didn't line up. With the big 3 in Boston this season and the Orlando playoff disaster of 2 seasons ago, Cleveland didn't mature early enough. Now it's too late.

LBJ will never be in the same league as Jordan now. I don't care if he wins 6 rings before he retires. Miami is not his team. It was and is DWade's team. Being a true legend involves leading your team and its _supporting_ cast to championships by overcominig obstacles. Not creating a conspiratorial All-Star team to make the task easy.


----------



## MindOverMood

AlwaysOnTheOutside said:


>


----------



## bsd3355

Naw, LeBron will always be remembered as one of the best. Still, I think the part of leaving Cleveland so he can win a championship will never leave, but he still will be one of the greats.


----------



## eyeguess

Huge fan of the Ronnie Brewer signing for Chicago. Of course, they need all the shooters they can get, but they also really needed to add some defense to their backcourt. I totally believe that the underpinnings of a championship team is having a great defense and a great big man rotation and with their new coach and the pieces that they now have in place, I can definitely see them having a top-five defense along with a top-four PF/C rotation (likely behind Orlando, LA, and Dallas and contingent on how healthy Boston is).

They'll probably lack the overall talent next season to be legit contenders, but I would not be surprised to see this team make a deep run and perhaps even upset a team or two. Plus they sill have another eight million or so left to spend on another shooter and a backup center.

Anyway, yeah, I thought I'd spare you guys the 40-paragraph LeBron James spiel.


----------



## bsd3355

MindOverMood said:


>


Hahahah! Wow, tyhat was the funniest thing I've seen in a long time!

I especially laughed when I saw Delonte crawling up from the corner ...haha...and Dwyane Wade hits him! lololol


----------



## BetaBoy90

MindOverMood said:


>


I have to admit this is one kickass video, when I saw it without clicking on it I figured It'd be poorly done, but everything fits in so well and I love the Stephen Hawking voiceovers


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

bwidger85 said:


> Naw, LeBron will always be remembered as one of the best. Still, I think the part of leaving Cleveland so he can win a championship will never leave, but he still will be one of the greats.


It really depends on how many championships they win and on his play, if he delivers and goes Magic Johnson on us, he'll be remembered as one of the greats. But if they don't win, which I'll concede is highly unlikely they don't win at least one, he'll go down like Oscar Robinson. I'm pretty intrigued how the chemistry works out, it's a pretty sick team, it definitely piqued my interest for next season.


----------



## eyeguess

I think it's a little crass that Chris Paul is demanding a trade, but I can't say that I blame him for wanting out. A player can only take his team as far as the pieces their front office puts around them, and it has got to be an awful situation for Paul to be in, with the organization's financial troubles and their overriding concern with being under the luxury tax, rather than with winning.

At least in LeBron's case, Cleveland's front office tried and made the effort to do everything they could to win (even though most of the moves that they did make were not very good ones). Anyway, there are about 27-28 other teams that would absolutely love to have him on their roster, would make sure they put a winning team around him, and would have fans that would actually come out to support them.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

LMAO

You know what I find funny as hell? Funny as ****? Funny as a mua ****a?

On the cover of the new sports illustrated lebron james is behind dwayne wade lmao, then chris bosh is on the other side taller than lebron making lebron look like the third man. That **** was too damn funny when I seen it. All this hype and he couldn't handle a challenge, it's just pathetic to me. If you're lebron james that ****s jus pathetic...


----------



## eyeguess

Four way trade between New Orleans, Houston, Indiana, and New Jersey
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5455472

So the Pacers come out as the big winners. They get the best player in the deal and at really great value too. The Pacers have been stagnate for the last few years so it's nice to see them being aggressive (I also loved the George and Stephenson draft picks) and making moves. Collison will definitely bring a ton of talent to this team and he'll be a major upgrade at a position they've been trying to fill for years. They're also incredibly loaded on the wings now, so I'm sure they're going to shift some of that talent for some PF/C help (they're desperately in need for some help on the glass).

The Hornets are the losers in the deal, IMO. They could have got so much more value for Collison. Ariza might earn them a few extra wins this season but he's not going to put them over the top. They're still a borderline playoff team, at very best they'll sneak into the second round but they could just as easily miss the playoffs altogether. Just not the best move for a team trying to retain a superstar.

Solid deal for the Nets. Lee was expendable and this will open up minutes for Williams. Murphy will be a help on the boards and will open up the lane for Lopez and Harris. Plus, as an expiring he'll be a nice stopgap for Favors. Rockets downgrade slightly in talent but Ariza was expendable. They've got people to fill in for him and they'll end up saving a ton of money. Solid, but unspectacular deal for them.

It seems like the bottom rung teams in the East have gotten bit stronger this offseason. It'll be interesting to see which teams end up fighting for those last few playoffs spots.


----------



## TurningPoint

eyeguess said:


> Four way trade between New Orleans, Houston, Indiana, and New Jersey
> http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5455472
> 
> So the Pacers come out as the big winners. They get the best player in the deal and at really great value too. The Pacers have been stagnate for the last few years so it's nice to see them being aggressive (I also loved the George and Stephenson draft picks) and making moves. Collison will definitely bring a ton of talent to this team and he'll be a major upgrade at a position they've been trying to fill for years. They're also incredibly loaded on the wings now, so I'm sure they're going to shift some of that talent for some PF/C help (they're desperately in need for some help on the glass).
> 
> The Hornets are the losers in the deal, IMO. They could have got so much more value for Collison. Ariza might earn them a few extra wins this season but he's not going to put them over the top. They're still a borderline playoff team, at very best they'll sneak into the second round but they could just as easily miss the playoffs altogether. Just not the best move for a team trying to retain a superstar.
> 
> Solid deal for the Nets. Lee was expendable and this will open up minutes for Williams. Murphy will be a help on the boards and will open up the lane for Lopez and Harris. Plus, as an expiring he'll be a nice stopgap for Favors. Rockets downgrade slightly in talent but Ariza was expendable. They've got people to fill in for him and they'll end up saving a ton of money. Solid, but unspectacular deal for them.
> 
> It seems like the bottom rung teams in the East have gotten bit stronger this offseason. It'll be interesting to see which teams end up fighting for those last few playoffs spots.


I agree with your analysis of the deal, and that seems to be the consensus among many blogs and articles I've seen written about the trade.

The Pacers basically got their point guard of the future for an expiring contract + taking on 2 years of James Posey. Easy decision for a rebuilding team.

The Rockets will not miss Ariza (plenty of depth this year with Battier, Budinger, Jeffries), giving Courtney Lee enough time to make the transition to becoming the SG-SF swingman off the bench once Budinger starts the year after. The downgrade from Ariza to Lee for this year is not significant, especially considering the luxury tax implications.

The Nets did very well. Although Murphy sucks at defense, his offensive game meshes well with Brook Lopez's low post game, furthering his development. Once Favors is ready to start, Murphy can easily be moved to the bench/he'll be gone the year after. Lee was expendable with the acquisition of Morrow (I do think Terrence Williams fits best at small forward).

The Hornets did terrible. They basically traded Collison + James Posey for the James Posey they wished they signed. Collison is a starting caliber point guard, and is a better player than Ariza right now. It's stupid that the Hornets 'fix' their mistakes (signing the wrong free agent in James Posey) by making more mistakes (giving up your best value contract + tying yourself to another long-term deal, similar to the one they already gave out to Posey in the first place!). If anything, the team needed an Emeka Okafor replacement if they were to trade Collison. If it's consolation - I think they did extremely well in trading Julian Wright for Marco Belinelli.


----------



## BetaBoy90

Darren Collison is far too hyped up IMO, he may not crash and burn, but have fun trying to go anywhere with him as your starting PG, and Granger as your best player. In the NBA these days you either have to go big or go home. Don't collect moderately good players and expect to achieve greatness that way. Your whole plan should revolve around acquiring top guys, and if you don't achieve that, rip it all apart and start again, that is if you want to win anything.


----------



## redtogo72

I think it's a little odd that the Hornets traded Collison away so easily. He was really good last year. Although, it certainly makes me feel better, that the front office believes that Chris Paul wants to stay in New Orleans. If they were unsure about this, I doubt they would have traded Collison. I just hope that isn't a series of Cleveland-like moves to appease a star, when Paul would end up leaving after his contract anyway, leaving the Hornets with an older, gutted roster.

Hornets also traded Julian Wright to Toronto for guard Marco Belinelli. Their major weakness was the SF position. It's almost always been that case. Hornest haven't had a good athletic player for that position in a long time. Julian Wright never worked out for us. This offseason, he opted out of playing in the summer league, upsetting the new coach, so you can see how immature he can be. 

Now the Hornets need a backup PG lol.


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

If I was Chris Paul, I would be seething and demand a trade. That's just bad management. They could've gotten far more value for Collision, force them to include Chase Budlinger or throw the 2 future picks from NY.


----------



## redtogo72

Ariza to Y! on CP3 call: "(Paul) just calling me let me know he was comfortable where he is and with the steps the organization is taking."


----------



## mixolydian

Watched a lot of the Rockets and Ariza last year and he was awful, it was embarrassing to see him do his T-mac impersonation and throw up awful shots or get stripped when he tried to drive, the guy has just about the worst handle you will see from a small forward. I'm of the opinion that Collison has been overrated a bit, but you are definitely right in that they could have gotten a hell of a lot better than what they got for him.


----------



## BetaBoy90

I just wanted to say all Cleveland fans who were pissed that Lebron left, he gave the franchise 7 really amazing years of basketball. I don't remember him *****ing once about how management didn't bring anybody even halfway respectable (Mo Williams.....) and yet you expect him to resign...


----------



## matty

7 years? I had no idea, why did it take so long for him to get a name for himself?


----------



## BetaBoy90

matty said:


> 7 years? I had no idea, why did it take so long for him to get a name for himself?


Maybe he wasn't well known in Australia, but over here in North America, specifically Canada and the U.S, he's been big sports news since he was drafted 7 years ago.


----------



## mixolydian

I'm from Australia, NBA only returned to free to air tv in January last year, it's still only a minor sport over here really.

Lebron deserves all the hate he gets imo, I knew he was an egomaniac before 'the decision', i think most fans did as well, but the way he handled it was absolutely disgusting. He spat in the faces of all Cleveland fans by doing it, and it's probably destroyed his reputation in many fan's eyes, it certainly has mine.
In regards to the failures of Cleveland management to put a team around him, well all I can say is that it is a very difficult thing to do, look at how the Lakers struggled post-Shaq and before they lucked out in getting Gasol. Even the Bulls with Jordan had to wait six or seven years to get a guy like Pippen. 
Anyways, i see you're from Toronto, how do you feel about Bosh now out of interest?


----------



## Falcons84

Im a Pacer fan and SOOO happy we got COLLISON!!!


----------



## asdlkm

This video would make me much more excited to get Ariza if I was a Hornets fan:






I've heard this wasn't an isolated incident. Chemisty issues kill roleplayers, Ariza is going to be beyond happy playing with Paul.


----------



## BetaBoy90

mixolydian said:


> I'm from Australia, NBA only returned to free to air tv in January last year, it's still only a minor sport over here really.
> 
> Lebron deserves all the hate he gets imo, I knew he was an egomaniac before 'the decision', i think most fans did as well, but the way he handled it was absolutely disgusting. He spat in the faces of all Cleveland fans by doing it, and it's probably destroyed his reputation in many fan's eyes, it certainly has mine.
> In regards to the failures of Cleveland management to put a team around him, well all I can say is that it is a very difficult thing to do, look at how the Lakers struggled post-Shaq and before they lucked out in getting Gasol. Even the Bulls with Jordan had to wait six or seven years to get a guy like Pippen.
> Anyways, i see you're from Toronto, how do you feel about Bosh now out of interest?


It's understandable if you have no oppurtunites to pick up quality players to play alongside your superstar, but I felt they had numerous chances. Plus I just think the GM in Cleveland is pretty garbage, there is enough ways to get creative and get star quality guys on your team, whether it's from teams that want to rebuild, free agency, etc.

But anyways about Bosh, I am kind of happy he's left town. He isn't a number 1 guy, in fact he couldn't even squeeze into the playoffs last year, with a team I felt that was at least a 7 or 8 seed, in terms of talent wise. I also think he's become too cocky for his own good, and I didn't really want to cheer for him as a player anymore. Hopefully one day we get a true superstar in this city, only time will tell.


----------



## redtogo72

Cavs made a lot of trades to improve the team, also to make Lebron happy. They had traded for Shaq, Antwan Jamison, etc. Who should they have signed or traded for? Now that Lebron has left them, they are stuck with a lot of players that have big contracts. It'll take 2-3 years to clear them all if they plan to rebuild.

I thought the Cavs were a good team. They had 60+ winning seasons the last two years. Many had picked them to win the east or at least as contenders. In the playoffs, Boston beat Orlando even easier than they did Cleveland. Boston was just too good, and nearly beat the Lakers in the finals.


----------



## BetaBoy90

redtogo72 said:


> Cavs made a lot of trades to improve the team, also to make Lebron happy. They had traded for Shaq, Antwan Jamison, etc. Who should they have signed or traded for? Now that Lebron has left them, they are stuck with a lot of players that have big contracts. It'll take 2-3 years to clear them all if they plan to rebuild.
> 
> I thought the Cavs were a good team. They had 60+ winning seasons the last two years. Many had picked them to win the east or at least as contenders. In the playoffs, Boston beat Orlando even easier than they did Cleveland. Boston was just too good, and nearly beat the Lakers in the finals.


Shaq yes, and how old was he like 37? He was as good as done by the time he was with them, I'm not talking about a big name, I'm just talking about a top talent. As for Jamison, they waited last minute to get him and he didn't even come close to fitting their system. I just feel they could have done so much more with surrounding Lebron. I'm not a Lebron fan at all, but I don't blame him for leaving. Whether or not he did it in the right fashion, well I highly doubt the press conference was all his idea and he has like an army of management running stuff for him.


----------



## CWe

Miami and Boston


----------



## basketball is my drug

About Lebron leaving cleaveland all they had to do was trade j.j. hickson for A'mare stoudemire and they probably would have won the finals but instead they got jamison who has never proved anything in the playoffs, you can say they tried but the cavs never got the right players to help Lerbon.


----------



## matty

BetaBoy90 said:


> Maybe he wasn't well known in Australia, but over here in North America, specifically Canada and the U.S, he's been big sports news since he was drafted 7 years ago.


Interesting, he was on all the promo stuff on our sports channel. That has been the last 12 months, NBA isnt really picked up here. I enjoy watching the games when they are on tv. I like Boston, but they always seem to show cavs or lakers games.

I have no reason to like boston. Just like I like St Louis in the MLB. I just randomly see a team, like how they play and watch their games.


----------



## BetaBoy90

matty said:


> Interesting, he was on all the promo stuff on our sports channel. That has been the last 12 months, NBA isnt really picked up here. I enjoy watching the games when they are on tv. I like Boston, but they always seem to show cavs or lakers games.
> 
> I have no reason to like boston. Just like I like St Louis in the MLB. I just randomly see a team, like how they play and watch their games.


Don't want to clog up the basketball thread with an Australian sports theme, but do you guys have certain pro sports leagues you cheer for, like that are very big in your country.


----------



## matty

Um, biggest I would think is NRL (rugby league) we also have AFL which is another version of football. Pretty big. Our NBL (basketball league) is next to dead. A league (soccer) is bigger then our old national league but 10+ years away from being anything quality. 

Check out NRL, check youtube for state of origin. I think the finest display of the sport.


----------



## mixolydian

Sorry Matty, biggest is AFL, by quite some margin as well. NRL is pretty much limited to Queensland and New South Wales whereas aussie rules is number 1 everywhere else. Cricket is the biggest summer sport I would say, and probably has the most national appeal.

For the Americans, AFL is our national game, it isn't rugby, soccer or american football, it's a game that was invented here and has been played for about a hundred years. Youtube some highlights if you're interested, it'll be a bit confusing.


----------



## matty

I accept your apology. Thanks bud  AFL is big NRL is big. much of a muchness to me. But really does anywhere else count outside of QLD and NSW? Throw in VIC too if you want. Anything west of that is just dead land isnt it? :lol

And for bagging out Perth and Adelaide, I will admit that AFL is popular, on a state by state scale, but I want to kill myself for saying it


----------



## fonz

matty said:


> Um, biggest I would think is NRL (rugby league) we also have AFL which is another version of football. Pretty big. Our NBL (basketball league) is next to dead. A league (soccer) is bigger then our old national league but 10+ years away from being anything quality.
> 
> Check out NRL, check youtube for state of origin. I think the finest display of the sport.


I take it the Super 14 and ANZ trans-tasman netball league aren't very big there. Man,I wish there was a trans-tasman cricket league with like 2 or 3 of the best NZ state sides playing against all the Aussie state sides. Hopefully the Warriors make the playoffs in the NRL,but can't see them making a deep run...


----------



## redtogo72

A brawl breaks out during the Greece - Serbia basketball friendly match: 



. At one point, Nenad Krstic (OKC Thunder), who plays for Serbia, throws a chair at a group of players.


----------



## eyeguess

I thought this was a nice break down of USA's offense/defense during the Brazil game.


----------



## BetaBoy90

Thought this was pretty funny. This was supposed to be the original idea for Chris Bosh' Got Milk campaign...


----------



## eyeguess

-bump


----------



## eyeguess

I don't know about you guys, but I'm super excited about this upcoming season - which I guess is kind of odd considering the Heat will likely dominate and the team that I follow will likely blow. Just a few thoughts heading into the season (and by few, I mean a ****-ton of) so we can all look back and laugh at how off they are.

I have Miami as the best team in the league, followed by LA, Orlando, Boston, and then Dallas in that order. Believe me, I'm rooting against Miami and I've been trying to come up anything that will give me enough confidence to believe that this team will fall short in the end, but I've been completely unable to get past the ridiculous amount of talent that is on this team.

*Miami*
I think they'll be great offensively with most of their problems stemming from the defensive end. I don't think this is a top-ten defensive team at all on paper. However, for all of his shortcomings, Spoelstra is a damn good defensive coach and they'll likely end up in the fifth to eighth range in defensive efficiency. They'll have issues defending the paint which will prevent them from being an elite defensive team. But I've got them winning 66 games this season if the big-three remain healthy. I would have projected higher but, among many other factors, I think there's a lot less relevance in the regular season now with teams like LA and Boston coasting a bit during the regular season only to kill it in the postseason.

*Dallas*
I think most everyone has the same teams in the top four, just in a different order, and then after that it seems to vary quite a bit. Same could be said about the second team in the West. Maybe I'm still a sucker, but I've got Dallas in both cases. I think they have a ton of talent. I still believe 100% that Dirk is capable of being the best player on a championship team. I also think they have one of the best benches in the entire league, albeit not a very deep one, but in the post-season you really only need about three solid players to sub in. I also think that this is easily the best center rotation Dallas has had in the Dirk-era and that Tyson Chandler will patch up a major problem they've had in the past with defending the pick-and-roll and with overall help defense (recall Andre Miller dropping 52 on them last season). I'm also looking forward to watching Rodrigue Beaubois and I believe his improvement could be the difference between them being a second-round exit and a legitimate contender.

*Oklahoma City*
Who doesn't like this team? They made an amazing jump last season, but I think it will be interesting to see if they can make the jump into being one of the elite teams in the league, particularly one that's going to be knocking teams out of the playoffs. They lacked a defensive center and a legitimate second-option last season, so how much players like Harden and Aldrich produce will dictate how far this team will go. Rough guess - HCA/second round exit.

*Sacramento*
They're one of the main reasons why I'll be buying the NBA League Pass this season. I'm a huge fan of their new big man rotation - it's big, it's physical, it's got offense/defense/rebounding, and it's deep. Along with Tyreke Evans, they're a tough group of players able to draw quite a few mismatches. I think they'll surprise a few teams this year and perhaps even push for .500. They'll likely miss the playoffs due to lack of veteran leadership and defense on the wings. I guess what I'm trying to say is, they could really use Shane Battier (who couldn't?).

*Washington*
I think they could be a dysfunctional, yet fun team to watch. However, I think if everything goes right with this team, and they're healthy, and they click, and they overachieve (like Milwaukee last season, before the Bogut injury) then they might actually have a relatively high ceiling (6th seed even?) - but they're much more likely to miss the playoffs.

Some of the other teams I'm looking forward to watching this season:

- *Atlanta *-- (particularly the new motion offense & Jordan Crawford) 50 wins/second round exit (again)
- *Indiana *-- (particularly Roy Hibbert) -- 8th seed / swept in first round
- *New Jersey* -- (particularly Terrence Williams) -- 30 wins
- *Philadelphia *-- (particularly Holiday, Turner, and Doug Collins) -- 40 wins
- *Chicago *-- 52 wins / 2nd round exit (and the best rebounding team in the league)
- *LA Clippers* -- 41 wins
- *Houston *-- 50 wins / first round exit
- *Milwaukee *-- I've got no idea, anywhere from the 5th seed to 10th in the East


----------



## foe

^^^nothing on the Jazz? They got Al Jefferson during the offseason. He's definitely an upgrade compared to Boozer, who was an overrated injury-prone softy.

After the Lakers, the West is a toss up. You got young talented teams like Utah, OKC, Denver(if Melo remains there), Blazers and the Grizzlies. Yes, seriously watch out for the Grizzlies. They are legit in my opinion. Then you have old teams like Spurs, Mavs, Suns and Rockets that have a lot of experience.

The East is pretty much between Boston, Miami and Orlando. Bulls, Bucks and Hawks and Bobcats are the next tier but I don't think they can challenge the top 3.


----------



## redtogo72

I want to see my local team, the Hornets, play, and will try to watch some of the other big, important games. I'm just not that excited with the NBA anymore. When I feel that I can practically pick the NBA Finals before the season starts, things can be a little dull.  I hope there are some big surprise teams this year, and more exciting games. Last season, it seemed like so many games were basically over after the first quarter.

Also the NBA's poor, inconsistent officiating makes it much harder for me to enjoy watching games. Now the NBA wants to make the sport even less about basketball; they want to give out technical fouls for players that whine too much. Yes, it can be annoying when players complain excessively after a call they don't agree with, but it's more annoying seeing the refs interfere with the game even more. Fans don't want to see players shooting more free throws, stoppage of play, and more ejections.


----------



## eyeguess

Believe me, I left a lot of things off. But I do like the Al Jefferson pick up, especially when you consider age and their contracts, and that the guy is a beast down low on offense. I'd like to see how they adapt to his different style of offense though. They ran a lot of PnR/PnP with Boozer, who I think is one of the best in the game at it, and who is also a very underrated passer. My problem with Utah is that they didn't address their biggest need, a defensive center (unless you count Fesenko). Their frontline is still going get run over by other team's bigs in the playoffs. I thought the Raja Bell pick up was very underrated. He should provide a lot of veteran leadership that this team has been lacking, and of course some defense and off-the-ball shooting.

As a fan of the game, I don't mind the new complaining/tech rules. As a Bobcats fan, I think I'm going to hate it. We're notorious for complaining after every call (especially Stephen Jackson and Larry Brown - does this rule even apply to coaches?).


----------



## redtogo72

The new rules seems to only apply to players. Union upset with rule changes. The coaches have a new dress code though.

"Sources: N.Y. scout led improper workouts"
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-knicksdraft102610


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Miami Heat to tha finals. I already got 50 dollars on it so that's what's about to happen.

Other than that, my favorite is still tha Lakers.


----------



## CWe

Miami and Celtics!
2 more hours!


----------



## foe

redtogo72 said:


> I want to see my local team, the Hornets, play, and will try to watch some of the other big, important games. I'm just not that excited with the NBA anymore. When I feel that I can practically pick the NBA Finals before the season starts, things can be a little dull.  I hope there are some big surprise teams this year, and more exciting games. Last season, it seemed like so many games were basically over after the first quarter.
> 
> Also the NBA's poor, inconsistent officiating makes it much harder for me to enjoy watching games. Now the NBA wants to make the sport even less about basketball; they want to give out technical fouls for players that whine too much. Yes, it can be annoying when players complain excessively after a call they don't agree with, but it's more annoying seeing the refs interfere with the game even more. Fans don't want to see players shooting more free throws, stoppage of play, and more ejections.


I totally agree with the bad officiating in the league. They don't allow the players to get physical anymore, a major disadvantage for defensive minded players.

But I'm still excited about this season though. Usually, I get excited in March because of the NCAA tournament and the tail end of NBA season but this season is different with Miami Heat. Like any non-Miami fans, I think we all want to see them fail.


----------



## uffie

^^ and they did fail tonight hahaha


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

I want King Kobe to wipe that smirk off LeBron's face when he wins his sixth championship. Or better yet, Kevin Durant showing this year that he is the far superior, more well-rounded, humble player.


----------



## asdlkm

I didn't think anyone had a chance in the world to stop the Heat from the finals, but apparently I forgot how ridiculously good Rajon Rondo is.

Heat going to slaughter anyone that isn't Orlando or Boston in the east though.

And I like the Rockets. A lot. Like top4 seed.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Loved watching the Heat lose yesterday. Any Bucks fans here?


----------



## redtogo72

StevenGlansberg said:


> Loved watching the Heat lose yesterday. Any Bucks fans here?


Bucks play the Hornets tonight. This means war! :b

Core Maggette had this statline against the Timberwolves in preseason: 0-2 FG, 17-20FT, 17 points. I hope he doesn't repeat that, although he's had similar games (statwise) in the regular season too. Is John Salmons out for the Bucks?

I think you guys might win tonight, because the Hornets' coaches and players are still trying to figure out their team. We have a lot of new guys, and not enough playing time or chemistry yet. Oops, also meant to say that the Bucks are a good team. They will probably be anywhere from a 4th-6th seed in the east.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Pfft. First game of the season. That aint ****.

You'll see me when tha playoffs roll around.


----------



## MindOverMood

Come on


----------



## redtogo72

StevenGlansberg said:


> Loved watching the Heat lose yesterday. Any Bucks fans here?


Good game.  Hornets looked better that I expected them to be in their first game. I noticed Okafor didn't take one shot the whole game. lol We play the Bucks again soon, on Nov 6th.. so maybe you guys will get your revenge. 

Even though the Hornets bench players lost the lead in the 2nd quarter, I liked that they had a lot of points at the end of the game. 5 of them shot free throws too.

The poor play by the Bucks bench seemed to be their main problem tonight. Only Maggette was effective, and he'd start for a lot of teams, including the Bucks. I think he's better on the bench, because the Bucks need a player that can create his own offense and draw fouls while most of the starters rest. Delfino can start and hit some 3s since he will be left open sometimes.

Hornets really needed this win, because our opening schedule is brutal; we play the Nuggets, Spurs, Rockets, Heat, and then the Bucks (again). Our schedule doesn't look that much easier after that.


----------



## NoDirectionHome

Full of Empty said:


> ^^^nothing on the Jazz? They got Al Jefferson during the offseason. He's definitely an upgrade compared to Boozer, who was an overrated injury-prone softy.


As much as I'm a fan of his, Jefferson is pretty injury-prone himself and not the most athletic defender. Agreed that Jefferson > Boozer, but I don't think it's a significant upgrade necessarily.


----------



## NoDirectionHome

asdlkm said:


> And I like the Rockets. A lot. Like top4 seed.


Hope you're right about my Rockets.  Probably not going to get enough out of Yao, though, IMO.


----------



## fonz

What do you make of Kobe this season? My opinion is that Gasol is beginning to take over as the most valuable member of the Lakers. Without Bryant,they're still a playoff team,a top 4 team. But without Gasol,they're rubbish. It was Gasol that turned the team around and made them championship contenders again,after several years of average performances after the departure of Shaq...


----------



## NoDirectionHome

fonz said:


> What do you make of Kobe this season? My opinion is that Gasol is beginning to take over as the most valuable member of the Lakers. Without Bryant,they're still a playoff team,a top 4 team. But without Gasol,they're rubbish. It was Gasol that turned the team around and made them championship contenders again,after several years of average performances after the departure of Shaq...


I was having a conversation yesterday with a friend about the Bryant/Gasol thing. We both came to the same conclusion as you. Gasol is really underrated, the dude is poetry in motion in the offensive post.

Kobe has been altering his game subtly the past few years to make up for his bad knees. He's worked out with Hakeem Olajuwon (!) to develop a post game and has taken a lot more long-range shots than he did in his athletic prime. So, I think Kobe is going to adapt and continue to be a great player, but you're right that Gasol is key. I'd throw in Andrew Bynum's health as being key to a Lakers championship; imagine if the Heat get to the finals, only to have to face a Bynum-Gasol frontcourt. They'd get crushed by that kind of size.


----------



## redtogo72

Paul to Okafor http://www.nba.com/video/games/hornets/2010/11/05/0021000075_mia_noh_play1.nba/


----------



## foe

My Utah Jazz just defeated the Heat trio in Miami. :boogie

Paul Millsap dropped a career-high 46 points including 3-for-3 from downtown. Insane, he's only made two 3's in his career.

Fact that Utah is a terrible road team makes Miami officially overrated!!!!!


----------



## Lateralus

Another Cavs win and Heat loss. Lovin it, even if it doesn't last.


----------



## Toad Licker

Back to back comebacks from behind by the Jazz, I missed them against the Heat but watched lastnight and it was pretty damn impressive.


----------



## MindOverMood

Raptors 1-7


----------



## Lateralus

^lol


----------



## redtogo72

MindOverMood said:


> Raptors 1-7


They are doing better than I expected. :wink They also get to play Orlando and Miami next.

Tonight, the Celtics vs Miami game should be fun to watch! Both teams have lost their last game. Who will go on a 2 game losing streak?


----------



## fonz

Ray Allen - 35 points including 7/9 from 3 point range to help the Celtics beat the Heat 112-107,their second win over the Heat this season. The Heat fall to an underwhelming 5-4 record. Phil Jackson said he thought the Heat would win 70 games. Go 65-8 from now? I doubt it...


----------



## coldsorehighlighter

The Raptors need to bottom out and attain high draft picks for the next 3-4 years. There is a base there, they just need some potential superstar draft picks. Like, #1 overall.


----------



## Robot the Human

Lateralus said:


> Another Cavs win and Heat loss. Lovin it, even if it doesn't last.


I think the Cavs can beat the Heat! I knew they'd still have a great team after that one guy left. :b

Teamwork > Hype


----------



## fonz

silenced said:


> best player in the game


Wait,LBJ is playing for the Lakers?

Well,he has won MVP the past 2 seasons. That makes him the best...

Depends on whether the Lakers can get home court advantage in the finals again. The Celtics would have won last season if they had home court advantage - they should have won anyway,up by like 13 in game 7...


----------



## foe

Just finished watching the OKC-Utah game tonight and can't believe the bulls--t officiating. OKC had 22 free throws attempts in the first half, Utah only 8. Then later on Durant(OKC) gave CJ Miles(Utah) a nasty should trust into the ribs. Yet they called a foul on Miles. 

Durant also went to the line 16 times while shooting mid-range jumpers all night. I hate the Lakers but Phil Jackson was right about how the refs favor Durant and give him dozens of free throw shots a game.


----------



## MindOverMood

MindOverMood said:


> Raptors 1-7


5-9 now and they play 76ers tomorrow. They also picked up Peja Stojakovic and Guard Jerryd Bayless. Ed Davis who was selected 13th in the first round of the 2010 draft will be playing in the D-League to see where he is at physically before coming back to the Raptors.


----------



## fonz

The Heat have fallen to a 9-8 record now after losing to the Mavs for the 13th straight time in the regular season. Even the Heat last year without Bosh and James were 10-7 through 17 games. You have to wonder how the organization is feeling - most teams wouldn't be worrying too much yet with that record,but this team has such big egos,such high expectations. It will be interesting to see what happens with them the rest of the season...


----------



## MindOverMood

Anyone else get the chills?


----------



## lepoo7

GAH! DA Blazers blew another win!


----------



## MindOverMood




----------



## orbit55

Anyone else juiced up for the Heat to roll over the Cavs??? :boogie

I know the Heat will win this game because it will mean a lot to LeBron but I will say as a Heat fan I am disappointed with their play. LeBron led this trio to Miami, so I wish he played more like he played in Cleveland. I don't care if he wants to be a ball-hog and muscle it in the paint all night long but this crap where he is kind of playing PG to get Wade action is just annoying. I think LeBron has way more natural talent than Wade but Wade thinks he needs to get his 20 points a night.

The Heat need to get the ball to LeBron as much as possible. Wade needs to act as a secondary threat and Bosh needs to focus on rebounds.


----------



## foe

^^^I'll be watching. I think Cavs have a chance if LeBron and Heat settle for iso's and jumpers. 

(On a side note, how about them Utah Jazz? Already with a winning record on the road)


----------



## orbit55

Full of Empty said:


> ^^^I'll be watching. I think Cavs have a chance if LeBron and Heat settle for iso's and jumpers.
> 
> (On a side note, how about them Utah Jazz? Already with a winning record on the road)


If it were a normal game, the Cavs would not have a chance but when 20,000 start yelling and badgering LeBron, it could get ugly.

I really wish we had a true PG.

Why such a big Jazz fan from MA?


----------



## orbit55

Prediction... King James 25 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists


----------



## foe

orbit55 said:


> Why such a big Jazz fan from MA?


Well, I grew up in the 90's and was a fan of Stockton, Malone and Hornacek. Plus, they've always been competitive after Stockton and Malone, with Kirilenko, Deron Williams, Boozer and now Al Jefferson.

Though, I do like the Celtics when they play the Lakers. Both fanbase hate LA. :b


----------



## foe

LOL...that was over fast. I'd be pissed at the Cav players more than LeBron if I was a Cleveland fan. They showed no heart, no passion at all.


----------



## MindOverMood

orbit55 said:


> Prediction... King James 25 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists


He's at 38-8-5 with8 mins left in the 4th.


----------



## orbit55

Full of Empty said:


> Well, I grew up in the 90's and was a fan of Stockton, Malone and Hornacek. Plus, they've always been competitive after Stockton and Malone, with Kirilenko, Deron Williams, Boozer and now Al Jefferson.
> 
> Though, I do like the Celtics when they play the Lakers. Both fanbase hate LA. :b


Kirilenko :teeth Talk about an athlete who had no intention of playing in Salt Lake. I saw him at the Vegas airport waiting for a Southwest flight and playing $0.25 slots lol



MindOverMood said:


> He's at 38-8-5 with8 mins left in the 4th.


What a game! :boogieI wanted LeBron to shove it in their faces so bad... I'm glad he still did his chalk ritual but some kind of taunt to the fans would have been great.


----------



## orbit55

Anyone watching the Heat crush the Bucks tonight?

I think if LeBron gets 25 and Wade allows himself to be the second attacking option, the Heat will win. I would almost want Bosh to be the second attacking option but I think the team needs him to focus on rebounds. Wade is great at drawing the foul but his jumper is kind of flat. It's amazing he's the only one with a ring.


----------



## fonz

I think Boston are the best at the moment,with their All-Star starting 5 and quality bench...


----------



## orbit55

fonz said:


> I think Boston are the best at the moment,with their All-Star starting 5 and quality bench...


Its like comparing apples to oranges.

Boston has the slight edge because they have Rondo. Rondo is a true PG and highlights the talent of others. If the Heat had a better PG they would be crushing teams.


----------



## orbit55

Heat vs Jazz Pt II Tonight!

Going to be a tough home crowd but LeBron has shown he can win under pressure during the Cavs game. The key tonight is defense, getting a hand in the face vs the 3 and for LeBron to get over 20.


----------



## foe

orbit55 said:


> Heat vs Jazz Pt II Tonight!
> 
> Going to be a tough home crowd but LeBron has shown he can win under pressure during the Cavs game. The key tonight is defense, getting a hand in the face vs the 3 and for LeBron to get over 20.


Great game by Wade and LeBron. LeBron totally destroyed Kirilenko tonight. Haven't seen such disgusting display of defense by him this season til tonight. :bah

Utah should have fed the ball down in the post more to Jefferson in the 2nd half. Not sure why they didn't go to Jefferson in the 3rd and 4th Quarter.

Missing dozens of wide open 3-pointers didn't help either.


----------



## fonz

Damn Lakers edged past the Clippers 87-86 on the buzzer. Got me thinking,when was the last time the Clippers beat the Lakers. Any ideas?
EDIT: Nah found it - it was only last year,2 wins each for the Clippers and Lakers last season. For some reason,I thought the Clippers had a really long drought against them. I found another surprising fact: since the Charlotte Bobcats have been around,since the 2004-2005 season,they have played the Lakers 12 times and the Bobcats have won 7 of those matches.


----------



## orbit55

Full of Empty said:


> Missing dozens of wide open 3-pointers didn't help either.


Yep, just call me Pat Riley :boogie


----------



## fonz

Stoudemire for 3. No wait! Geez,in the days before video replays the Knicks would have won that...


----------



## redtogo72

fonz said:


> (youtube clip - Amare Stoudemire 0.4 Second Buzzer-Beater Against Boston Celtics)
> 
> Stoudemire for 3. No wait! Geez,in the days before video replays the Knicks would have won that...


It was a good game since the Celtics won.  lol at Spike Lee celebrating/taunting, before the refs discounted Amare's buzzer beater.


----------



## foe

I watched that Celtics-Knicks game and it was one of the worse defensive games I've ever seen but it was also one of the best games(thanks to the offense).

I expected no defense from a Mike D'Antoni team but where was Boston's great defense?


----------



## orbit55

silenced said:


> As the Christmas Day showdown looms, the Lakers are looking good after that little bump in the road (the 4 game losing streak). With Bynum back they will be tough to beat, look for them to take over the #1 record in the league soon.
> 
> Props to the Heat, I know its early but they got it rolling now after a rough start. I was very critical of them but now it looks like things might be coming together. Even though I still pick the Lakers to win on Christmas, at least now its looking like it will be a fun game.
> 
> Spurs and Mavs are impressing me, especially the Spurs, they just find ways to win even though they are an old team, 21-3 is amazing.


Kobe can be beat when you have another team with THREE Kobe's on the floor :boogie


----------



## fonz

What's so great about Bynum anyway? The guy is overhyped. Gasol and Odom have been doing a great job without him,but apparently he will be starting again soon...


----------



## orbit55

Heat crush the Knicks!!! Anyone surprised? I'm not


----------



## fonz

orbit55 said:


> Heat crush the Knicks!!! Anyone surprised? I'm not


No - not surprising. I'd pick them to beat the Lakers on Christmas. Cos I mean,think back to the games the Lakers have played this season. They've hardly played any high-calibre teams. What's the best team they've beaten this season? Chicago maybe. And even then,they got their revenge when the Lakers visited them. Over half the teams they've lost to have losing records. Heat by 12.


----------



## MindOverMood

Raps won tonight but will play the Lakers on Sunday =S


----------



## redtogo72

Wow, Orland Magic making some big trades! Sources: Vince Carter dealt to Suns. They may acquire Arenas in a separate trade involving Rashard Lewis.


----------



## orbit55

MindOverMood said:


> Raps won tonight but will play the Lakers on Sunday =S


OH MY BOSH!!!

-Heat Fan


----------



## foe

redtogo72 said:


> Wow, Orland Magic making some big trades! Sources: Vince Carter dealt to Suns. They may acquire Arenas in a separate trade involving Rashard Lewis.


Turkoglo back to Orlando. Nice! He seems like a better fit there than Carter. 
Not sure who starts at the one-guard, Arenas or Nelson.

Brandon Bass will be starting at the PF then for Orlando. I'm gonna pick him up for my fantasy basketball team.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-arenastradetalks121810
Arenas goes to Orlando as well, while Rashard is going to D.C. to rot. LOL


----------



## orbit55

Full of Empty said:


> Turkoglo back to Orlando. Nice! He seems like a better fit there than Carter.
> Not sure who starts at the one-guard, Arenas or Nelson.
> 
> Brandon Bass will be starting at the PF then for Orlando. I'm gonna pick him up for my fantasy basketball team.
> 
> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-arenastradetalks121810
> Arenas goes to Orlando as well, while Rashard is going to D.C. to rot. LOL


Sounds like Orlando is getting a little worried haha:boogie


----------



## asdlkm

Knicks Celtics Heat Thunder Warriors 5teamer parlay today lets win some money to pay my phone billll.


----------



## fonz

asdlkm said:


> Knicks Celtics Heat Thunder Warriors 5teamer parlay today lets win some money to pay my phone billll.


Got 2 have the skills 2 pay the bills...


----------



## fonz

Where are the Lakers at at the moment? Back to back thumpings by the Bucks and the Heat,and unless they improve vastly they will lose to the Spurs as well. I know everyone says it's only December - the Lakers pull it together come playoff time. But the problem is,the past 2 years,they've had the ability to pull it together because they've been the top seed and had home court advantage - this year,they might only have the 5th or 6th best record in the league. They're lucky they're in a weak division. They're not beating the top teams - the highest calibre team they've beaten all season is the Chicago Bulls,and they're hardly contenders...


----------



## asdlkm

fonz said:


> Got 2 have the skills 2 pay the bills...


i have skills apparently.. Just too greedy. Was debating putting the Celtics on there then said goforit ;/

the lakers will be fine skillwise, as in theyll pull it together, but if they meet boston in the finals without homecourt they're going to lose. Think they could take everyone else on the road (miamis crowd is laughable).


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Miami is going to the finals.

It will be Miami Heat against the Los Angeles Lakers. It is pretty much cut and dry, yall will see.


----------



## bsd3355

I never thought I'd be rooting for the Lakers to win but after seeing what LeBron did, I hope he lands right on his face.


----------



## asdlkm

Dunno about that. Boston is ridiculously loaded. If they're healthy (which is admittedly a big if) their advantage at every position aside from starting SG and SF, including the bench especially, is way huger than the problems Lebron/Wade create. Boston's weakest spot is center and their 3rd string center could start for Miami. They're just so deep. KG (whos playing great this year)/Davis/Perkins/Oneal/Oneal is old as Hell, but still way better than Bosh/Damp/Z/Anthony. Pierce is in his best shape in years, and its showing. Allen is still Allen. Rondo is amazing. West would easily start for Miami. Even Erden, who will be on Bos' inactive list, would make Mia's center rotation. Id be surprised if a healthy Boston didnt beat Miami.
Though I must say, this years Boston, Miami and LA teams are all really good. Theyd all easily win the title if they were dropped into any year from 02-08. And id make them favorites against any post-Jordan team. Cant wait for the playoffs this year.


----------



## foe

asdlkm said:


> Dunno about that. Boston is ridiculously loaded. If they're healthy (which is admittedly a big if) *their advantage at every position aside from starting SG and SF*, including the bench especially, is way huger than the problems Lebron/Wade create. Boston's weakest spot is center and their 3rd string center could start for Miami. They're just so deep. KG (whos playing great this year)/Davis/Perkins/Oneal/Oneal is old as Hell, but still way better than Bosh/Damp/Z/Anthony. Pierce is in his best shape in years, and its showing. Allen is still Allen. Rondo is amazing. West would easily start for Miami. Even Erden, who will be on Bos' inactive list, would make Mia's center rotation. Id be surprised if a healthy Boston didnt beat Miami.
> Though I must say, this years Boston, Miami and LA teams are all really good. Theyd all easily win the title if they were dropped into any year from 02-08. And id make them favorites against any post-Jordan team. Cant wait for the playoffs this year.


I agree with everything but I think the SG and SF match up is actually closer than it looks on paper.

I know LeBron is the better player but Pierce has always defended LeBron well in the playoffs so that match up is closer and contested like it has the last 3 post-season meetings. Ray Allen is always on the move and he's showed twice already that Wade isn't as effective when he is chasing Allen around all game long.

Also, keep in mind that Miami is clicking right on an up-tempo style of play but in the playoffs, we know teams like Boston, LA and Orlando like to slow the pace down and I'm not sure if Miami have much of a half-court game. It'll be interesting to see how they play in the post-season.


----------



## asdlkm

Yeah, I completely agree. Was just stating that there is an advantae period, dont think it's a big one by any means, for the reasons you listed.

Really hope Boston stays injury free for our (the fans) sake, as another year of age and an offseason for Miami to add more pieces and I feel it wont be nearly as competitive.

Also hope Orlando gels, and Arenas can get back to 3/4 of what he was. Think theyd be fun to watch against Miami. Actually think they might try to run/have a shootout with them. Dont think they can beat either of the other 2 in a series though.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Dwayne and LeBron is the best due the NBA has ever had. If Bosh stays healthy they're going to tha finals. That's all I pretty much got to say.


----------



## Sadaiyappan

Oh it's definitely going to be Lakers vs Heat finals. It is going to be one of the better finals to watch. I just hope the Lakers don't get destroyed. They barely beat the Celtics last year and the Heat are a better team talent wise but may not play as well together yet.


----------



## Cejay

DeeeeeTroit BasketBaaaallll!!!

I know we currently suck but give me a break aaight....


----------



## astrophysics

spurs/celtics for finals


----------



## OtherGlove

Cejay said:


> DeeeeeTroit BasketBaaaallll!!!
> 
> I know we currently suck but give me a break aaight....


Always love seeing a good Celtics/Pistons game. Dont know why, just takes me back in time, when they still played with passion.


----------



## foe

The LeBron-less Cavs broke the losing streak record at 24.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=Au458s05xo.GnbMpmxT3qru8vLYF?gid=2011020505

I'm too disappointed in my team to even feel sorry for them.


----------



## foe

Long-time Utah Jazz head coach Jerry Sloan steps down after 23-years. 

Rumors have it that Utah's star point guard Deron Williams "forced" him out.

Players these days have so much power. Stockton, Malone and now Sloan. End of an ERA.


----------



## purplefruit

Full of Empty said:


> Long-time Utah Jazz head coach Jerry Sloan steps down after 23-years.
> 
> Rumors have it that Utah's star point guard Deron Williams "forced" him out.
> 
> Players these days have so much power. Stockton, Malone and now Sloan. End of an ERA.


Sad day for the NBA and basketball in general. One of the greats, a HOF coach who would have 2 rings if not for Jordan. I'm guessing Sloan was simply fed up with the organization bending over for Deron - pretty difficult for a coach to be effective when he's handcuffed by the higher-ups. Good chance Deron bolts after 2012 anyway, the way things are going he'll probably demand a trade to NY, NJ/Brooklyn, MIA or LAL, just like every other star in the league :roll.

I agree that star players and their entertainment-focused agents are changing the NBA. Without players there wouldn't even _be_ an NBA - but there's still something unsettling about how things are going right now with players trying to run things. Mind you, I say this as a jilted Raptors fan (you're a Cavs fan oh - you know how it is) Who knows what'll happen with the upcoming CBA negotioations. It could get ugly.


----------



## Vip3r

Full of Empty said:


> Long-time Utah Jazz head coach Jerry Sloan steps down after 23-years.
> 
> Rumors have it that Utah's star point guard Deron Williams "forced" him out.
> 
> Players these days have so much power. Stockton, Malone and now Sloan. End of an ERA.


:eek wow unbelievable. I never would of seen this coming.


----------



## MindOverMood

If this doesn't give you chills, I don't know what to tell you! Of course his best moments were in Toronto:b


----------



## Mr. SandMan

The Miami Heat is really concerning me atm


----------



## purplefruit

MindOverMood said:


> If this doesn't give you chills, I don't know what to tell you! Of course his best moments were in Toronto:b


Can't watch. It'll bring tears to my eyes


----------



## purplefruit

Looks like Melo has been traded to the knicks

..and my raptors are even more SOL if that's even possible.


----------



## i just want luv

Eliza said:


> Can't watch. It'll bring tears to my eyes


Thats my favorite player till the day I die!

Holy crackamollies. Melos A City boy


----------



## RyanJ

But will it blend - that is the question...the Melo man and Amare?


----------



## BetaBoy90

The Knicks look like possible second rounders currently, but they better hope that they can add more pieces to the puzzle in the next 1-2 years because Amare and Melo aren't youngings like they used to be.


----------



## RyanJ

Carmelo Anthony - Immortalized on Rye Bread


----------



## fonz

BetaBoy90 said:


> The Knicks look like possible second rounders currently, but they better hope that they can add more pieces to the puzzle in the next 1-2 years because Amare and Melo aren't youngings like they used to be.


Yeah,in current standings the Knicks would play the Bulls in the playoffs who they are 2-0 against this season already,so even without Carmelo they might have facied their chances...


----------



## The Ones

I've been a Nuggets fan for life, and I have to say that I am glad that Melo is gone. He is sooooo egotistical that it makes me sick. The entire team was sick of Melo, it was obvious in how they played. It got to the point that Melo was actually saying things in interviews like "I have to take my hat off to myself for playing good through all of this," (very similar to that at least). Also, Melo plays NO defense at all and holds the ball on offense too much. It was nice to watch the Nuggets the other night and actually see them pass the ball and play defense with energy. It won't be long before the Knicks fans get upset over Melo too.


----------



## purplefruit

RyanJ said:


> Carmelo Anthony - Immortalized on Rye Bread


what is this i don't even

And Deron to the Nets. The raps move farther off the map in the atlantic division :sus

Can't wait to see the new knicks play, I'm curious to see how they fare with two stars who don't play much defense (and i'm a melo fan). I don't think a big-two will cut it in the east, the knicks are another 1 or 2 good-great players away from going deep into the playoffs. IMO. Though I'm sure CP3 will join them in a few years, with other ring-chasing players signing on as well.


----------



## Brightpaperwarewolf

Yeah I want to see Amare and Carmelo. But oh man did Mutant Mark Cuban pimp out the Knicks big time. First to drive the price up for the Carmelo trade, then turn around and get D-Will for less. Great negotiator. 

Definitely exciting times in the NBA right now. It would be dumb for them to have a lockout when buzz couldn't be higher.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

This is very funny.

But, the Heat very much concern me. If LeBron just had a jumper he'd be the best basketball player ever. When the Heat play good they are fun to watch, but it's hard being a fan of this team, they have been losing too many close games. I still have faith, but they concern me atm.


----------



## purplefruit

bignate said:


> This is very funny.
> 
> But, the Heat very much concern me. If LeBron just had a jumper he'd be the best basketball player ever. *When the Heat play good they are fun to watch, but it's hard being a fan of this team, they have been losing too many close games. *I still have faith, but they concern me atm.


KLove is funny. I like his "give me your coats" video.

Heat fan eh






Nah j/k I'm just bitter. Honesty you guys don't have anything to worry about. You are essentially describing every team in the NBA there. Are you kidding me? Guys like Lebron and Wade turn it up in the playoffs. Bosh might be a question (try to ignore my Raptor bias for a sec), he tends to get banged up toward the end of the year and hasn't had much playoff experience. But I think you guys will be fine.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

haha

I saw that last night. You do have to act though, I'v done it pleanty of times.

But everyone turns in on in the playoffs, that's why NBA basketball is so beautiful. But their record against above 500 teams is not good, and I'm pretty sure that the Celtics would have home court against them in the playoffs. It's hard to predict playoffs with this team because they never went, I just don't wanna lose 50 dollars.


----------



## i just want luv

Vince Carter is playing like he is 22 tonight. Wouldnt you know its against the Raptors.


----------



## anonymid

Blake Griffin :eek


----------



## i just want luv

anonymid said:


> Blake Griffin :eek


Was crazy


----------



## TurningPoint

Raptors - Mavericks tonight. Be there.

Thoughts on the NBA trade deadline:

I thought the James Johnson for a first round pick was useless. The Raptors are starting him, and other than his good defense (which is a product of Chicago's coaching), he's not even an upgrade over Sonny Weems. True that he has more potential than any wings currently on the Raptors other than DeMar DeRozan, but in terms of value - he was not worth it.

Carmelo Anthony to the Knicks was obviously a good move for them. The only thing I worry about is that they potentially have to change their style of basketball. Chauncey Billups doesn't move up and down the floor like he used to, and Carmelo isn't the greatest freelancing offensive player. He needs halfcourt sets run for him to thrive. Also, the Corey Brewer acquisition is weird because he's an above average defender, yet he can't shoot a lick. In time, I think this will be a good thing, because they need to get stops and play more of a slower style in the playoffs. 

In return, Denver gets a slew of players who don't fit in with them long-term, with possibly the exception of Danilo Gallinari. Ty Lawson needs to run the show, and while Raymond Felton and Lawson make a really speedy and dangerous backcourt combo, they need to give time to Aaron Afflalo, not to mention J.R. Smith. Wilson Chandler is probably not staying after the likely qualify him over the summer, and he'll probably leave the team then. It sucks that that's all they got for Carmelo. I'll give this team props because they were exciting to watch against the Celtics and will still likely make the playoffs due to Utah's predictable decline, and I still think they're better than Phoenix.

Speaking of the Celtics. It's weird because they made an amazing value trade, yet they might be on the losing end. They trade Nate Robinson, who was useless to them this year since Delonte West is better. He serves no real purpose unless Rondo gets hurt again. They trade Kendrick Perkins, who will probably command a multi-year deal starting at $10 million. While he is probably worth the money, I think that they don't need his skills to win the East. They'll only need his post presence against Dwight Howard, and the Celtics can beat the Magic without him. 

In return they received, Nenad Krstic, Jeff Green, and the Clippers top 10 lottery protected pick until 2016. Krstic is a good fit with the team because he gives the Celtics a center that can play in the high post. He's a nice center complement to Shaquille O'Neal. I'm concerned with Jeff Green. He's not going to get a lot of minutes playing behind Paul Pierce and he's basically there to fill the need of backup small forward. That drastically kills his value as a player because he has to focus on being a good defender and hitting open shots, which are two things he hasn't historically done well. If Green can change his game to fit the role he's supposed to play, then the Celtics will greatly have benefitted. But that's a big if. Also, the lottery pick that the Celtics will receive will be nice since it will allow then to get a future Ray Allen or Perkins replacement in the draft.

The last trade I'll comment on is the Deron Williams trade. I think I'm in the minority that believes that Utah made a really good deal, and that they won the trade. I'll start off with value. New Jersey gave up Devin Harris, who I believe will average about 17 points and 8 assists in Utah. That's basically 75% of Williams' production. They got two likely lottery picks in the Nets first rounder next year, and one via Golden State. They drafted well historically, and will likely get at least one good starter from those picks, hopefully to replace Raja Bell. 

The big win for them is that they got Derick Favors. Derick Favors is going to be a multiple time all-star. He has the NBA body, he's got good basketball IQ, he has a great rebounding percentage as a rookie, he's a decent defender for a rookie. The only problems at this stage is that he needs to learn new post moves (which can be done through good coaching. Utah needs to bring someone in to work with him), and that he fouls too much. The fouling, hopefully gets better with experience. To put it into perspective, even Dwight Howard still has foul problems at this stage of his career and he's the second best player in the league behind LeBron James. If you look at it from a deductive standpoint, Derick Favors will be a multiple time all-star barring injury, if one believes for him to be an all-star talent. Derick Favors is only 19. Most of the dominant power forwards in the league are in their primes already. Chris Bosh, and Amare Stoudemire are in their late 20s. The older generation of Nowitzki, Garnett have 2 more years left of stardom. The only challengers currently in the league right now as being dominant power forward in 7-8 years from now will be Al Horford, Kevin Love, Blake Griffin, Greg Monroe and LaMarcus Aldridge. Favors has an excellent chance of being part of that group for many years. I honestly can't see a scenario where Favors isn't at least Chris Bosh level good.


----------



## purplefruit

i just want luv said:


> Vince Carter is playing like he is 22 tonight. Wouldnt you know its against the Raptors.


T-mac killed us earlier in the season too.
Former players just get pumped up to play the raps...:roll


----------



## i just want luv

Vince and Tmac gave Toronto basketball birth, and Toronto gave them fame, respect. I can see why they'd get hyped.

Bosh just doesnt like the crowd calling him Rupal lol.


----------



## BetaBoy90

That Miami/New York game on Sunday was amazing, I'm not ashamed to admit I hope CP3 signs with New York, that'd be entertainment!


----------



## Mr. SandMan

If any team gave T-Mac notoriety it was the Orlando Magic, or even the Rockets. The Toronto Raptors are good for NBA basketball, but come on now...

Anyways.. The Heat ****in suck. I don't know if anyone was watching that game, but Lebron is not making it happen. I don't know how else to put it. He has no jumper. I can tell this because he never resorts to a jumper. He only resorts to a drive to the basket. This may work on a college level, but he has been playing on an NBA level his whole career. I don't understand how he doesn't understand this yet. I hate watching him shoot or do anything for that matter when the game is on the line. Amare just said no. You could tell how salty Lebron was when he was at the other end on the freethrow line. Then Lebron and Wade come to the press conference with them Abercrombie and Fitch tight colorful sweaters, what the hell type of **** is that? Wearin them ****ed up glasses. At least they don't act like the Orlando Magic, Dwight Howard has been mad and I do not blame him. They put way too much hype on Lebron. He can't score when he needs too. My honest opinion is that the Heat will not do **** this post season. How are the Heat going to lose to a brand new team that hasent even played together for a week? It's like Lebron is out to prove why he is so hyped. From what I see, he is just a Scottie Pippen on steriods, if you think about it. I don't even know how to put it. I'm very dissapointed in the Miami Heat. I'm glad the Knicks beat them. The Knicks handed them that game, as in it was the Heats game to win.


----------



## i just want luv

lol. The knicks may be new but the players seem to fit their spots well. If you think about it the knicks have everything they need to compete except for a center. (same as miami)

Lebron has a jumpshot its just not on point all the time. Ive seen it to many times.
They win more when they get Wade off first. Wade means too much to them for them to play (watch Lebron pose at the top of the key) ball.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Well yea, but Lebron doesn't look for his jumper when the game is on the line. He's not confident in his jumper. You cannot be a champion if you have no confidence in your ability, and driving to the basket relentlessly will not win you games on an NBA level. I really don't know what to say about Lebron, he was just way overhyped, it's kindof sad in a way.

But, I guess there's still time on the clock so to speak.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

bignate said:


> and driving to the basket relentlessly will not win you games on an NBA level.


----------



## i just want luv

LOl yeh I have more respect for Wades game. 
I notice Lebron always passes the ball like its hot when the games on the line sometimes, Or he will drive and dive (literally dive) into somebody hoping for a foul.
When I see Kobe, Wade, Carmelo its like everything comes hard for them but they still produce at the highest level. 

Then I see LeBron its like watching a replay of the rules being abused over and over.
Like he will run in a (stiff) straight line and run you over and get freethrows. Its really boring and predictable watching him alot of days. But it works so why not keep doing it I guess.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Why would you put a picture of Dwayne Wade up? Are you saying Dwayne won a championship by driving to the basket, cause if that is the case, he never needed Shaq. If anyone believes that teams can win by driving to the basket, and driving to the basket as your bail out play, you either watch way too much college, or not enough NBA basketball. There is no scorer in the league that has brought their team a championship by strickly taking it to the basket, things have to be incorperated, these are elementry school run downs. Every highlight of Jordan, every highlight of Kobe, every highlight of any champion scorer, besides a big man, resorted to a jumper to win a game. Even big men had hook shots and little baby hooks. The lucky scorers had big men to throw the ball to. No player can win games when his or her bail out play is a drive to the basket. Players need that jumper. Look at Pierce, Allen, KG, Mr. Bigshot himself, Rip Hamilton, Rasheed Wallace. All champions, all shooters. D-Wade, shooter/scorer. LBJ is just not a shooter, it's sad to watch, considering the hype. With out the hype he's just a regular great player.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Because Wade averaged about 20 FTs a game against the Mavs in the finals. Was mostly a joke.


----------



## Vip3r

Orlando vs Miami tonight
Who is going to win?
I am saying Orlando but I am biased. Dwight has been playing MVP basketball for over a month and I don't think Miami is going to have any chance the way he has been playing.


----------



## i just want luv

Vip3r said:


> Orlando vs Miami tonight
> Who is going to win?
> I am saying Orlando but I am biased. Dwight has been playing MVP basketball for over a month and I don't think Miami is going to have any chance the way he has been playing.


*ORRRRRLLLLLAAANNNDOOOOOOOO*
*MAAAAAAAGGGIIIIICCCC**echos* magic magic magic!

Dwight for 36pts on 70% and 13 rbs, 8blks / Meer- 24pts 5-3pt/ Bass for 22

Wade 34pts 47% / LeBron 30pts 42% / Bosh 16pts 36%

Make it happen.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

What happened in '06 never happened before, and will never happen again.


----------



## RyanJ

Another happy ending in Miami... :teeth


----------



## Vip3r

RyanJ said:


> Another happy ending in Miami... :teeth


 The Magic just took their talent to South Beach


----------



## BetaBoy90

I just feel like Bosh is a career loser, and no matter who he's teamed with he'll never win anything significant. I don't like to be so biased like that, and would be pleasantly surprised if proving wrong, but I feel he really ****s up any chance for Miami to win the big prize.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

No **** ^

It's strange. I'm starting to believe that Lebron is not a winner. I heard an analysis say after the game on sports center how Lebron is afraid of the last shot, and he is. He does not want the last shot. It actually felt good to see Dwayne shoot a three towards the end, then he got no look. Miami has serious ego issues, mainly Lebron and Bosh imo. I cannot see them winning. They have consistently blown games over. How do you blow a 24 point game to the Magic? Lakers did it to Dallas way back when, which I was mad about btw. But, Maimi just sucks.


----------



## fonz

Today,a double header on TV. Bulls/Magic and Spurs/Heat. How will these go? I say the Magic and Spurs win,but they could easily go the other way...


----------



## Mr. SandMan

They need to deal Bosh and get a point, or a center. Dampier is trash, Bibby I can't say yet, Z is trash, Mike Miller can't be the only person making shots. Eddy House is trash, Chalmers is trash, Lebron, trash.

I'm tired of this team and Lebrons attitude. Is anyone else seeing the type of **** he is wearing to his games? I want to know what he is telling himself when he puts those clothes on to go to work. I am seeing glimpses of him back in Cleveland. He curls up and folds when things don't go his way. It's like he has no competitiveness because he never really needed it, he always had excuses. With the team he has now, there is no excuse. With all the endorsements, there really is no excuse. It's embarassing to be a fan of this team. Now I'ma end up paying 50 dollars.

What's even more funny, is that he is both a football player and basketball player, and he chose basketball. What makes this funny, is there are a lot of football players I've known who have tried to play ball, but they can't. Because they literally try to do what Lebron James does, get to the basket, make layups and use their body. But basketball players have on thing that football players I've played with have never had, besides like one. That one thing, obviously, is a jumpshot. Football players learn quick, most of them, a few have game. But for the most part they learn quick from what I've seen. Lebron James just looks like a lost football player.

That game was embarassing. Teams I've played for have gottin their *** beat, and I feel more embarassed watching the Heat than I ever did getting beat. Watching Lebron James lack of competitiveness is sickning.


----------



## i just want luv

Give Wade the last shot for once. Or Bosh. They should take turns every time one misses. Its crazy but Bosh really has the best mid-range on the team and gets the least shots.



NOOOOOOOOOO CP3!!
Get up!!


----------



## Mr. SandMan

They need an established scorer who takes the last shot.

I'm not even as conserned anymore because I made a double or nothing bet that the Lakers will win the championship. So my concern has now shifted to the Lakers.

But the Heat got some issues.


----------



## fonz

bignate said:


> the Lakers will win the championship.


Noooo - please. Anyone but them.


----------



## MindOverMood




----------



## Mr. SandMan

I still want the Heat to make it to the finals. I don't see why people are "happy" they lose. Lebron isn't that malicious, he just wants to win more than he wants respect from what I've seen. Which is not very respectable ha

Btw, that video was slick.


----------



## i just want luv

Idk why west coast just bores the hell out of me. Their colors are too bright, bland or something.


----------



## uffie

bignate said:


> I still want the Heat to make it to the finals. I don't see why people are "happy" they lose. Lebron isn't that malicious, he just wants to win more than he wants respect from what I've seen. Which is not very respectable ha
> 
> Btw, that video was slick.


The fact lebron had a special called the decision makes him an automatic douche bag


----------



## Mr. SandMan

He is a beast though. Everyone wanted to know where he was going.


----------



## i just want luv

Oh my Dayumn!!...............


----------



## fonz

The Bulls and Celtics now tied for first in the East a few games ahead of the Heat. Does it matter what positions the top 3 are in? Probably not,but the winner of the East would be hoping to get a better record than the Lakers. We don't want a repeat of last year...


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Kobe is that man. My money is on the Lakers.


----------



## i just want luv




----------



## Sadaiyappan

fonz said:


> The Bulls and Celtics now tied for first in the East a few games ahead of the Heat. Does it matter what positions the top 3 are in? Probably not,but the winner of the East would be hoping to get a better record than the Lakers. We don't want a repeat of last year...


I'm amazed that the Bulls swept the Heat. I think Finals east will be bulls celtics and finals west will be lakers spurs. Lakers win again this year.


----------



## fonz

Sadaiyappan said:


> Lakers win again this year.


Yeah - it's starting to look more and more like that every day - unfortunately


----------



## Mr. SandMan

hold up, nvm...

But, my bet has changed again. Now it's 50 I got on the Heat going to the finals, and 50 on the Lakers winning the NBA Finals. This is the first time I've ever bet money on anything for real, money like this. I'ma **** around and get addicted.


----------



## derrickrose

bulls fan here 
It would be great if the 2011 finals is Bulls vs Lakers

Think about it, phil's last finals is against the team he become a legend in. And a repeat of 1991 finals where he got his first ring, but now he's on the other side.

That would be ironiclly-sad epic!


----------



## i just want luv

My upsets say*: Hornets , Phily*
Out the West *: Thunder*
Out the East *: Chicago*
*Rose wins 2010-11 chip.*

I'm still pulling for Orlando, but the system needs to go.. Its gonna be hard as hell to win 20 feet away from the basket.


----------



## i just want luv

there trying to screw Orlando so hard.


----------



## Vip3r

yeah they just got screwed. They should of definetly called a foul on Anthony when he pulled Jrich down. that was bull **** :mum


----------



## i just want luv

Dwight is like a scape goat for the refs when they dont know what to call. Why cant refs be finned?

And whats funny is when they re-send the fouls and techs after the game. When its too late and the team already lost because of it.:no


----------



## Mr. SandMan

That's basketball, it'll keep changing it's rules though. 

Dwight is a lot like Shaq was, he's a big guy, so fouls get called. Teams really don't allow him to play offense much. I'd say atleast 40% of the time he gets the ball in scoring position he gets fouled. He is the defenition of an NBA big man. So he get's frustrated, and when you can't call your own fouls it becomse more frustrating. I can't even think of another player close to his level anymore, who still plays the center position. He's real good.


----------



## Vip3r

Cleveland beat Miami


----------



## Mr. SandMan

As soon as college with their retarded tournament came on it seems like the NBA has just vanished, and baseball coming back. I need NBA TV or somethin. Can't wait for the playoffs.


----------



## MindOverMood

Raps beat the Magic without Calderon and Bargnani. Maybe they get a win over NY too


----------



## fonz

Great game winner for Kobe at the buzzer vs. Utah!!! If he hadn't of fumbled the ball away...


----------



## Spreewell

Miami is gonna win it all. They're the only team capable of beating the Lakers. They beat them twice this season with ease and they were close games but you can tell Miami had the advantage cause they had a slight lead for the entire game, so it wasn't a fluke. It's not like they blew them out early. They hung around and beat the lakers in half-court basketball.

And Boston screwed themselves over by getting rid of Perkins who is valuable in the playoffs in stopping penetration from Derrick Rose, D Wade, and Lebron. And Bulls won't get past Miami because Derrick Rose cannot do it alone.


----------



## fm5827

I'm hoping the Heat do pretty well in the playoffs, but the Bulls really are going well and did beat Miami twice this season?? I cant remember..


----------



## fonz

fm5827 said:


> I'm hoping the Heat do pretty well in the playoffs, but the Bulls really are going well and did beat Miami twice this season?? I cant remember..


3x


----------



## mixolydian

Miami are gonna fail epically in the playoffs and I'll be laughing all the while


----------



## i just want luv

I just dont get why Jarryd Bayless isnt starting in Toronto. He's young and better then Cal. Let him grow with Darozen. They could become very special.


----------



## mixolydian

Pretty hard to play a backcourt with zero outside shooting like that. Derozan really needs to find a 3 point shot if he wants to become great, he's got some talent.


----------



## i just want luv

Bayless can shoot. People slip on him he just needs start insted of having to come off the bench to drop 28n3, 23n8, 19n5. 
Caldaron is not gonna get them on top. Caldaron had like 7 years not being what they needed. Time to let the young guys run.


----------



## mixolydian

He's also not much of a playmaker, he's much more of an undersized sg than a true point. Bayless and Derozan are not good fits together. There's a reason Bayless has bounced around so many teams, he's a sixth man at best.


----------



## astrophysics

i thought bayless was off-and-on great in portland. he lacks a lot of consistency to be a relied-upon shooter.


----------



## i just want luv

He'll never get any better if he never gets the oppertunity. Look at Rondo.


----------



## Mr. SandMan

Lakers vs. Heat. Lakers in 7.


----------



## josephisaverb

Bulls vs. Thunder. A man can hope, right?


----------



## Mr. SandMan

When Kobe leaves the west will be WIDE open. I wouldn't be surprised if the Thunder started running off with championships, if Durant stays.

This is only a thought, but I was thinking about how Dwight is having problems with the Magic. Durant is the new scorer of the league. After Kobe leaves, the Lakers will need a scorer. The Lakers obviously have money, they could give Durant the life. If he went to the Lakers he would have the most fantisized NBA life style a player could dream of. Then if they could get Dwight, it would be crazy. It seems a little farfetched, but the way the cookie is crumbling so to speak, it would not surprise me. But Durant likes OKC, and he has Westbrook and Perkins, and some pretty good pieces, ****, Dwight could go to the Thunder, and the Thunder could run off some ships for sure. I can see Dwight either going to the Lakers, Thunder, Heat or the Bulls. Imo, where ever Dwight goes is where the championships are going to go. A very bold prediction, maybe premature, but, it's a theory.


----------



## i just want luv

Dwight wont leave anywhere without Jameer. 
Never know Kobe might retire after this year. He's in the same situation as MJ was. Phil leaving 3peat 6 rings n all. Not to mention the lockout, KB would be 35 I think.

Alot of players I grew up idolizing will probably retire after this year. Im going to enjoy every second of the time they got left. Its a sad year for me.


----------



## Dolfan483

Bulls and Lakers in finals. Bulls in 6.


----------



## fonz

Dolfan483 said:


> Bulls and Lakers in finals. Bulls in 6.


That would be so awesome


----------



## i just want luv

We need some NBA Playoffs in the chatroom


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Dolfan483 said:


> Pacers and Lakers in finals. Pacers in 4.


Fixed.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Good lord, what a comeback.


----------



## i just want luv

I have very high hopes for every underdog in these playoffs excluding Atlanta.(Magics my team). Rose isn't normal, it's like he has the matrix on his side. 
LETS GO PHILLY!!


----------



## Sadaiyappan

Where can I get torrents of the playoff games? When I was in the US I would watch direct streaming feeds (but since I'm in India now the games are on at weird times here and I don't think the net is fast enough to stream video properly here).


----------



## i just want luv

Damnit Melo


----------



## mixolydian

Knicks should have chased Deron harder instead of getting Melo. Him and Amare are terrible fits.


----------



## lepoo7

Still can't get over the HORRIBLE officiating in the 4th quarter of the Blazers v. Mavs game 1. Blazers in 6.


----------



## foe

What a crazy weekend of Game 1's over the weekend! If the Pacers didn't choked away their game then there would have three Game 1 upsets.


----------



## Sadaiyappan

Orlando lost to the scrub Atlanta team.


----------



## Vip3r

Sadaiyappan said:


> Orlando lost to the scrub Atlanta team.


I know I was there :cry. It turns out if only two players score in double figures you are probably going to lose :no


----------



## i just want luv

I just cant bring myself to worry about Atlanta. Maybe they uped it up a notch, Al Horford's damn near shooting 3s now. If Bass gets his stuff together I'll merry Orlando's chances of winnin....

Dont want to rub it in *(*lying*)* but..............Where my laker fans at =p.
Chris Paul v.s Fisher match-up has a 80% chance of being the death of yall.
Untill Paul Gasol gets his stuff together.


----------



## fonz

i just want luv said:


> I just cant bring myself to worry about Atlanta. Maybe they uped it up a notch, Al Horford's damn near shooting 3s now. If Bass gets his stuff together I'll merry Orlando's chances of winnin....
> 
> Dont want to rub it in *(*lying*)* but..............Where my laker fans at =p.
> Chris Paul v.s Fisher match-up has a 80% chance of being the death of yall.
> Untill Paul Gasol gets his stuff together.


I hate the Lakers as much as the next guy,but c'mon - they've still got an 80% chance of winning the series against the NOH let's face it...


----------



## i just want luv

*I dont hate the Lakers. I got love 4 Kobe. I h8 their height advantage wins*

Yeh I just gotta take advantage of this while I can.
On real, if Gasol doesnt show up and if they cant contain Cp3..And Cp3 out produces Kobe in points like game 1....I like New Orleans chances. But I think LA will advance soly cuz of their height.


----------



## Dolfan483

Bulls have just squeaked past the Pacers the last 2 games, But they are bringing EVERYTHING they have to the Bulls and still cannot win. This is the playoffs, No games will be easy. I still see the Bulls winning it all.


----------



## Daylight

Just bought a ticket for the Bulls/Pacers game for thursday night. It's gonna be a crazy atmosphere with 5,000 Bulls fans mixed into the crowd.


----------



## Dolfan483

Awesome, Hope you have a great time.


----------



## Daylight

Got to see some of the Bulls players before I went to the game tonight.


----------



## libertad

DROSE and the Bulls taking the crown


----------



## mixolydian

Great pics, Joakim has some sexy hair


----------



## fonz

LOL - they're all rocking massive headphones


----------



## foe

Great photos, Daylight.

Scottie Pippen still looks very young for a 45-year-old.


----------



## i just want luv

What Brandon Roy did today just shows that anything is possible to overcome.
That was the best show I ever witnessed in my life. And he shouldnt even be playing.


----------



## fonz

i just want luv said:


> What Brandon Roy did today just shows that anything is possible to overcome.
> That was the best show I ever witnessed in my life. And he shouldnt even be playing.


Best playoff comeback since the Celtics v Lakers in the 2008 finals. Portland in 7


----------



## lepoo7

The best comeback I've ever seen! Brandon Roy is my hero! :boogie


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Holy crap Memphis...Up 16!


----------



## Mr. SandMan

The Spurs aint gonna go away easy. Chris Paul was scaring me haha, that boy can play. GO LAKERS!!


----------



## fonz

Yes! Dallas 2-0 Lakers

BEAT LA! BEAT LA! BEAT LA!


----------



## i just want luv

Im mixed on how I feel about Lakers potentially going home.
Its like, I want them to lose but I want them to stay in the playoffs losing for eternity.
I like Kobe but I feel happy seeing a big upset which is everyday against LA. 

also Ron better get suspended after how the league did Orlando in with Richardson.


----------



## i just want luv

Mavericks going for the sweep!!


----------



## foe

lol at the Lakers possibly being swept.

Anybody watching Game 3 of the Heat-Celtics series? Rondo dislocated his elbow but is still in the game playing with one freakin' arm.


----------



## foe

Thank you Dirk and Dallas for humiliating the Lakers for all of us Laker haters out there.


----------



## melissa75

^haha the Lakers are doing a pretty good job of humiliating themselves. Completely classless what Bynum just did.


----------



## foe

^ yeah and that Bynum elbow on Barea was even worst. What a bunch of sore losers the Lakers are!!!

Funny gif I'm seeing on the sports/basketball forums. LOL


----------



## fonz

What a BEATDOWN. Bet Kobe feels like a fool now:


----------



## Ironpain

Andrew Bynum and Lamor Odom knew exactly what they were doing they purposely set that up,that was classless and disgusting, I bet next season Bynum will start serving a 4 game suspension if not worse. I guess it's okay to act like a punk when your being out played. Not only did they embarrass themselves you can see they embarrassed any fans they had there and Phil Jackson. So much for that epic match up between Kobe and Lebron.


----------



## i just want luv

feels wierd watching the Playoffs without Kobe.


----------



## General Shy Guy

Anyone else stoked to have a finals this year without the Celtics or Lakers? Finally, something different.


----------



## RyanJ

General Shy Guy said:


> Anyone else stoked to have a finals this year without the Celtics or Lakers? Finally, something different.


Not if it means Heat / Mavs. :teeth


----------



## mixolydian

Grizz out, fairytale over. Kinda sucks, but they got a bright future. Hoping for a Bulls/Mavs finals now.


----------



## RyanJ

I have to say I was kind of disappointed last night to see Brian Scalabrine in a suit on the sidelines. That man is pure greatness.


----------



## eyeguess

General Shy Guy said:


> Anyone else stoked to have a finals this year without the Celtics or Lakers? Finally, something different.


I am. This will be the first time the Finals will be without Kobe, Shaq, or Duncan since 1998. Definitely a nice change of pace.



mixolydian said:


> Grizz out, fairytale over. Kinda sucks, but they got a bright future. Hoping for a Bulls/Mavs finals now.


I think they need to trade Gay in the offseason. They're clearly a team with some talent, but for the last two years they've been in a situation where the sum of the parts were less than the whole, where they have too many guys in their lineup that need the ball in their hands and that really don't play much defense. I think the surge that we saw in the playoffs is what happens when you balance their roster out by replacing one of those guys with a defensive-minded role player. If I were the Grizz, I'd trade Gay and do everything I can to resign Gasol. They'll totally have a bright future if they play things right.


----------



## eyeguess

I really like OKC, but they're just too young and inexperienced to make it this year. Their top three scoring threats are all 22 and under, meaning they have fresh legs but not an ounce of savvy or guile to pull out close games. I like Russell Westbrook and I really like his potential, but I'm not sure if he's the best fit for this team. Right now, he iso's and overhandles way too often and he's really not that much of a table setter. I think going forward, they're better off either playing him at the two in a role similar to Wade's with a Fisher/Kidd type manning the point or working a deal out with NOH where they can swap Westbrook for Paul.

Since Durant likes to play off the ball so much, I think he would be better off playing in an offense with more movement and more passing, so I'm kind of leaning more towards OKC moving him for a PG that plays more in the flow of things. But he's still young, I don't want to discount his upside too much.


----------



## dyingtolive

^ - agree


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Scott Brooks is not a good coach.


----------



## josh23

Dirk is da ****in man.


----------



## CWe

Dallas Mavericks are who i've been going for in the Playoffs
and there pretty close to getting that trophy!


----------



## RyanJ

I think the Grizz beating the Spurs in the first round was probably the most interesting moment of the playoffs. It's all been downhill since. Now I have to hope the Mavs win in the finals...thanks a lot Bulls.


----------



## melissa75

josh23 said:


> Dirk is da ****in man.


Yeah, he is :yes

MAVS are in the finals, and we have another championship series/game coming to Dallas this season! :banana


----------



## ATCQ

I pray and hope that the MAVs are going to take the championship this year from the Miami Cheat... Dirk Nowitzki is going to beast it all the way.


----------



## fonz

RUNITSTIM said:


> I pray and hope that the MAVs are going to take the championship this year from the Miami Cheat... Dirk Nowitzki is going to beast it all the way.


Hope so - Miami will have their time,they'll win a few times the next 5-6 years,but this might be the last chance most of those Dallas players have of winning a championship...


----------



## i just want luv

we all knew this was gonna happen when 2 mvps and 1of the best current PFs joined the same team with a bunch of shooters.


----------



## josh23

Miami will win.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

ROFL at that non travel call


----------



## RyanJ

josh23 said:


> Miami will win.


Somehow it feels like that has already happened. I have a feeling this is going to be a short series - hope I'm wrong...


----------



## fonz

RyanJ said:


> Somehow it feels like that has already happened. I have a feeling this is going to be a short series - hope I'm wrong...


The Mavs REALLY need to win game 2,otherwise this will be one of those really boring finals series like Lakers-Magic '09 or Spurs-Cavs '07 where the result is inevitable and every match becomes dull. Dirk needs more help,the Heat bench outscored the Mavs bench,which shouldn't happen...


----------



## anonymid

It's a series! Incredible comeback by the Mavs.


----------



## melissa75

Whew!!!! So glad the Mavs are coming home to play the next 3 games. Here's hoping they go much smoother!


----------



## i just want luv

Man I want Dallas to win this so bad, not a fan but they didn't need
2 and a half MVP's to get here.

Or at the very least for Wade to get finals m.v.p when Miami wins. Buuuuuuuuuht
Either Lebron gets it, or they'll get Co m.v.p.


----------



## Toad Licker

I can't root for either team but it was nice to see the Mavs tie up the series maybe that means it'll be a good one.


----------



## Winds

Dirk Nowitzki is having one of the best post seasons in recent memory. That comeback was unbelievable. Lebron, Wade, and Bosh are great players but for the last six minutes of the game Dirk was the best player on the court hands down. I think that game is one that will change the momentum of the series for good.


----------



## fonz

Game 2 was must win for Dallas,game 3 is must win as well - if they lose,all the momentum will be back with the Heat. It was great to get game 2 on the road,but they need to win at home the next game. Just like in tennis,it's always great for a player to break serve but it's meaningless if they get broken back in the next game...


----------



## fm5827

I don't really care who wins but I would like to see a 7 game series which is why I kinda wanted Dallas to win game 2.


----------



## mixolydian

Realgm was hilarious reading after that win, some brilliant gifs and pictures. Here's hoping the Mavs can seal the series at home, Miami are gonna be baying for blood though.


----------



## i just want luv

haha.
Am I the only one who misses the giant trophy in the middle of the floor? Like old times.































It looks so un-finals without it


----------



## mixolydian

Like this one too


----------



## Popularity

Pleeeeease Dallas. Clutch time.


----------



## CreamCheese

That was really close though. Great game.


----------



## josh23

That game was amazing....like 90s basketball. I like it. Best, most competitive game of basketball I've seen in awhile.


----------



## Daylight

Me at Conseco Fieldhouse!


----------



## mixolydian

Nice form, make the shot?


----------



## fonz

Good win by Dallas - but now they MUST do it again in game 5...


----------



## RyanJ

fonz said:


> Good win by Dallas - but now they MUST do it again in game 5...


I would agree on both points. The Celtics were up 3-2 leaving home last year and lost two straight so it's certainly easy to imagine Dallas losing two on the road after winning game 5. However, if they lose game 5, the odds seem very slim that they could win two straight away from home against *that* team.


----------



## fm5827

Lebron played really badly and you do feel like the next one is a must win for Mavs. I cant see them winning two in Miami.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

Missed the game and saw Lebron scored 8. rofl


----------



## General Shy Guy

fonz said:


> Good win by Dallas - but now they MUST do it again in game 5...


Game 5 is definitely a must win. I wouldn't say Game 4 was a good win. Much needed, but not good.

Dallas played an ugly game. Lots of jumpshots, and lots of misses. And if they don't crash the boards, they will lose the series. Yes they were only -3, but they can't afford to give up second chance points to such a good defensive team. It was painful to see Dwyane Wade repeatedly sky over 7 footers for the offensive boards last night.


----------



## eyeguess

LeBron totally deserves all the criticism after game four. However, a lot of people are bringing up his past performances in Cleveland and I can't really criticize him for that. One-man offenses really don't fly that deep into the postseason.

On one hand, I have to admit it was smart team basketball for him to defer early on in that game when his shot wasn't falling and Bosh and Wade's were (he did make some hellacious passes) you know instead of just forcing the issue. However, that clearly became a problem later in the game when they desperately needed a bucket out of him.

Major credit to Dallas, their defense has been great on LeBron. Maybe they’ve got something figured out, even during the regular season they’ve held him to 30.6% from the field, way lower than any other team.

Anyway, I have been pulling for Dallas. I would love to see Dirk and Kidd win a ring. I've been defending Dirk for years when he was receiving a ton of unnecessary flack from seemingly every direction. It’s nice to see him prove people wrong. Miami will be outright scary over the next few years anyway. They’re like a young budding superstar in their rookie season. The talent is there, you just know once they figure everything out and learn to play off each other's strengths, they’re going to be nearly automatic on the offensive end.


----------



## CopadoMexicano

Go Dallas!


----------



## fonz

MavenMI6Agent009 said:


> Go Dallas!


I hope they do it in game 6 - don't want a repeat of last year. The good thing is,at least we know the Mavs won't get blown out by 22 in game 6 like the Celtics were last year,not with the way this series has been going...


----------



## mixolydian

Beat the CHeat!!!


----------



## heyJude

^lol


----------



## eyeguess

With the media spotlight all over the Heat, what about the Mavs?

Rick Carlisle has been great this series, totally winning the chess match with Spoelstra, making all of the right adjustments and running and executing all of the right plays to exploit the very few shortcomings in a typically tight defense. There's also very little acknowledgment of the Mavs defense for taking LeBron pretty much out of the equation. Their collective defense, not just Marion, has totally taken him out of his element, all while limiting the foul calls. Yeah, the guy is an easy target for having zero common sense for his public image, but to be fair, the guy was dominate in the first three series and had he faced LA or any other team, the Finals would be over and he would have easily been named Finals MVP. Again, major credit to Dallas for doing what no other team has been able to do.

Obviously Dirk has been great, Shawn Marion is making a very Favre-esque turnaround, and Simmons wrote something in his most recent article likening Chandler's impact in the playoffs to a 2008 Kevin Garnett without a jump shot, and I agree. I mean the Dallas Mavericks just look like a team that was built in the SE Division three years after the big-three formed. They match up so well with them and that's why this series has been so great.


----------



## Mystik

A casual Triple-Double for my boy Lebron in game five. Game six and seven he's gonna hit fifth gear and get himself a lil ring ;]


----------



## S.T.A.T.

Those Illuminati puppets cannot win.

Go Dallas!


----------



## eyeguess

> _Brian Windhorst (Notes on Game 6)_
> 
> - Dirk averaging 10.4 points in 4Qs, most in Finals since Shaq averaged 11.5 points in 2000.
> 
> - If Mavs win title & Dirk wins Finals MVP, he'd be 11th player all-time to have 10+ All-Star games, reg season MVP, Finals MVP...Others are Kareem, Magic, Jordan, Bird, Moses Malone, Wilt, Hakeem, Duncan, Shaq & Kobe. 7 in Hall of Fame, other 3 active/just retired.
> 
> - LeBron has played 40+ minutes in 18 straight playoff games. Tied for 2nd longest streak ever behind Iverson w/22 in '01.
> 
> - Wade has scored 30+ in last 4 elimination games. Only 2 players have done that in last 30 yrs: Olajuwon (4 in '95) & Nowitzki (6 '01-04).
> 
> - Rick Carlisle is 10-3 (.769) close out games as coach. Tied with Tom Heinsohn for the highest winning percentage (min. 10 games).


On top of that, Dirk in close out games since 2006: 28 points, 10 rebounds, on 63 FG%, and has won six straight.

Lebron when facing elimination: 31 points, 10 rebounds, 7.5 assists, and is 2-5.


----------



## FairleighCalm

Go Mavs! Lebron can suck it.


----------



## i just want luv

Do iittttt!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## i just want luv

Wwwwooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo


----------



## RyanJ

Yeeeeeeesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## redtogo72

Go Peja! Finals MVP!


----------



## coldsorehighlighter

If you had to bet money on which teams fan bases are happiest tonight, would you go with the Mavericks, or the Cleveland Cavaliers?


----------



## mixolydian

Congrats Mavs!!! Great series, good triumphs over evil.


----------



## StevenGlansberg

redtogo72 said:


> Go Peja! Finals MVP!


lol

Wooo! Would not have been able to handle a Miami win.


----------



## mixolydian

Best photoshop job of the playoffs


----------



## CreamCheese

Yay dallas!


----------



## anonymid

It was awesome, just awesome, how quiet that arena was when the game ended.


----------



## crimsoncora

Woooo mavericks! Dirk really put it on em, kidd killed em half his age !!!!!


----------



## RyanJ

mixolydian said:


> Best photoshop job of the playoffs


:rofl


----------



## FairleighCalm

Schadenfreude! Lebron is a fraud.


----------



## melissa75

Woohoooooo!!!! So stunned and excited that the Mavs won! It has been a long time coming for sure! I was in a Dallas sports bar last night watching the game, and man, it was so much fun seeing how happy everyone was about the victory! People were seriously flipping out...grown men crying, hugging, etc. Just awesome .


----------



## jtb3485

I'm not a fan of either team but I'm so happy Dallas won the title. Maybe the Heat thought they had won it all after they beat Boston. They sure celebrated like it. But they didn't realize they still had two more series to play!


----------



## bsd3355

Ohio celebrates with Texas on this one!


----------



## merryk

The Mavs-Heat series was awesome--all those runs and close games, what excitement  I'll admit I was a bit misty-eyed when Bill Russell presented the finals MVP trophy to Dirk Nowitzki. Dirk's style of play, low-key demeanor, commitment to improving his game etc...I've long admired him and am so happy for the Mavs!


----------



## i just want luv

Wish the media didn't focus on Bron so much. Showing us how many twitter followers he has and what not.
If they gave the WNBA half the attention he gets it would become waaaay more popular. 
I mean I didn't even know their season started already, I cant even catch a game because I cant find the channel or the time they play.


----------



## mixolydian

If you've ever watched an NBA game, it's impossible to watch a WNBA one. It's ridiculously poor, high school games are more entertaining.


----------



## iamwalrus

Miami fans accuse people of just joining the bandwagon. I've been a victim of that, I have this college colleague/facebook friend who is crazy about the Heat. He knows that I'm not rooting for dallas in the beginning of the playoffs. But during the finals I was rooting hard for dallas, writing stuff in my wall on facebook, taunting miami. Can't help it man I just hate Miami! Then he wrote a status on his wall taking shots at dallas fans and even wrote on my wall accusing me of just joining the bandwagon and shifting teams because dallas was winning. Clearly upset by dallas fans and haters opposing his team lol. I told him I hate his pathetic team more than I love dallas LOL

It's funny how people resort to irrational and cynical thoughts when overwhelmed with negativity

heck I would have pulled for any other team even the ones that stink like maybe the cavs or the t-wolves if they face miami


----------



## iamwalrus

bwidger85 said:


> Ohio celebrates with Texas on this one!


CAVS FOR MAVS!

Be sure to give the mavs the standing o next season when they visit the Q


----------



## iamwalrus

melissa75 said:


> Woohoooooo!!!! So stunned and excited that the Mavs won! It has been a long time coming for sure! I was in a Dallas sports bar last night watching the game, and man, it was so much fun seeing how happy everyone was about the victory! People were seriously flipping out...grown men crying, hugging, etc. Just awesome .


The beauty of sports, not scripted but real emotion


----------



## fonz

Why is it that the big 3 in Miami copped so much more flak this year than when the big 3 came together a few years ago in Boston and won straight away?


----------



## FairleighCalm

Go Cavericks! Go Mavaliers!


----------



## coldsorehighlighter

fonz said:


> Why is it that the big 3 in Miami copped so much more flak this year than when the big 3 came together a few years ago in Boston and won straight away?


I think two reasons, those being that Garnett and Allen were trades and not free agent signings, and neither Garnett or Allen were in their prime when the trades happened. 
I imagine if, back in the early part of the 2000's, if Garnett and Allen had gotten together in the summer and conspired to sign contracts that would allow them to leave Minnesota and Seattle together a few years later in order to sign in Boston with Paul Pierce, people would have looked at it differently.

The Celtics didn't give up much of anything to get Garnett and people did make a big deal about that, I remember. But to get Allen, they gave up the #5 overall pick in the upcoming draft, after missing out on possibly getting Kevin Durant.

Also, when your potential is "best player ever", you just don't do what LeBron did. He could have turned the Cavs into what Jordan turned the Bulls into...imagine if Jordan had signed a short contract with the Bulls, with the intention of getting out of there so Larry Bird or Magic could help him win titles.


----------



## i just want luv

WNBA ls tight man. Some of them girls better the NBA players.
Diana Turrasi is on some Kobe, Legend type stuff.


----------



## coldsorehighlighter

i just want luv said:


> WNBA ls tight man. Some of them girls better the NBA players.
> Diana Turrasi is on some Kobe, Legend type stuff.


I'll quote Norm MacDonald here...the next time I see a WNBA game will be the first time I see a WNBA game. 
I saw highlights once, if you wanna call it that...some girl pushed another girl, who then threw the basketball at her...they tried to fight, and got separated and the one girl had to use all her energy to not start crying.
It was like a car-wreck, where you don't want to watch but you slow down anyway and do that anyway...


----------



## mixolydian

If you truly think that any WNBA player is as good as even the worst NBA player (let's say Scalabrine), then you have no clue

And @Iamwalrus, lol at any Miami fan accusing anyone of bandwagoning, that's rich


----------



## i just want luv

you don got a clue dont call me out bruh.
theres more then one woman better Scal hes not even better then Highschool players. Theres some college woman players one in particular I know better then some NBA players.





Dont sleep on them just cuz they women. No pun intended
Video dont do justice. She definitly got more heart and leadership then enough NBA players.^^^^


----------



## maninthebox

the cheat said:


> Also, when your potential is "best player ever", you just don't do what LeBron did. He could have turned the Cavs into what Jordan turned the Bulls into...imagine if Jordan had signed a short contract with the Bulls, with the intention of getting out of there so Larry Bird or Magic could help him win titles.


Oddly Dallas was supposedly one of the 6 or 8 teams Lebron was considering signing with.

I agree , though, why doesn't Lebron sign with the Lakers and bring Dwight Howard and Derek Rose with him. Though, to be fair to Lebron, the Cavs were the worst team when he left. When Jordan left, his team still made to semi finals.

Also, Lebron has a tatoo that says "The chosen one". Dirk does not, and in fact I have never seen him boast. Great guy, deserves that ring.


----------



## mixolydian

Scalabrine not better than highschool players?! are you on crack? Only the absolute elite high school players, future NBA all-star type prospects like Anthony Davis would be able to compete on his level right now. The NBA is the best basketball league in the world, teams don't pay millions of dollars (Scal made $1.2million last season) to guys who are worse than women and high school players.

I'm not bagging women's basketball in general, I watch it during the olympics and can enjoy it on a certain level, but the level of competition is miles below low level men's college level let alone NBA level. FYI, here's Scal's college profile http://www.usctrojans.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/scalabrine_brian00.html, the guy was a beast then, he may be a scrub at NBA level but put him in the WNBA and he's the equivalent of Dirk Nowitzki and Shaq rolled into one.

Here's a question for you, what position would Griner be playing if she was at NBA level? She's listed as a centre and is 6'8 and 175lbs, her weight is less than the weight of an average NBA point guard, I'd love to see her try and play post defense on a NBA centre.


----------



## i just want luv

Scal is cold trash, thats why he's benched his whole career. Same with Sheldon Williams. Let me ask you with a serious question. Do you believe just cus their in the NBA that they are the best?

Maybe he wasn't as trash when he came in wich I dont know how he even made it in, he must of had connections. Serious he's not a baller straight up. He can shoot a little bit. Garentee you if he was put in a highschool game with some ballers he'd get ripped, rejected every wich way possible.

They are women.... You can say that about everything. 
man will always have strength over women.
Dont change the fact that some WNBA players are better at basketball then some NBA players-- that shouldnt be in the league.

Aaron Brooks, Nate Rob, Will Bynum, Mugsy Buggs, Earl Boynkins, T.J Ford ect. are all small and lack weight would you say Scal is a better basketball player then any of them?
I'd like to ask if you are on crack my good sir.

That's y Scal doesn't compete on this level, he watches it.
edit: looked at your page he averaged 16-17.5 points in college in 1995/97. 1995/97, I'm talking about the present days. we're on the wrong page.


----------



## mixolydian

Dude I just linked you Scal's college stats, he was putting up 18 points a game while shooting 50% from the floor and 40% from 3, he got drafted pick 34 because of this. I can admit that he's probably had a longer career than his NBA production would suggest, no doubt because he's a great teammate and locker room presence, but the fact remains that he is still an excellent basketball player. Anyone who makes the league has done so because they have produced at a high level in lower leagues. The fact that a lot of players fail in the NBA despite being dominant in high school and college only proves the fact that it is such an enormous step up. Think Kwame Brown putting up 40 points a game in High school yet never cracking 10 in his NBA career.

Strength is a huge part of basketball, there's plenty of 6'10, 270lb guys who have made a great career out of just being big. If all you're saying is that some women have better handles or shots than the least skilled bigmen in the NBA, then I can probably agree, I'd imagine Taurasi has a far nice shooting touch than Ben Wallace for example. But don't kid yourself into thinking that any female player would come close to being anything but a complete liability on an NBA team.


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## i just want luv

I doubt that sincerly, and to get it out I'm not trynna start any fuses here. unless you come to my house then I'll bring the sparks but here I stay level headed. If you feel me. it's all good.

I sincerly doubt it still. Like I put up, Sheldon Williams would dominate on a 5 foot 5 squad. Dont mean he's a better basketball player then them.
And they'd dominate him right back.

I know Scal he was on my squad in the Nets days.


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## mixolydian

All I'll say is you'd be in for a rude shock if a female player was ever given a chance in the NBA.


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## i just want luv

I dont expect it B, but I'll stand by what I say.
It's why the NBA is a tall peoples game but there are tons not in the NBA who can hold their own better then some in it.
n thx for that debate, I dont like going to sleep till late lol.


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## cousin corona

Skip Bayless(and that other guy forgot his name) of !st and 10 were asked their opinion on the top 5 players right now.

None of them had bron on their list.I mean...I personally don't like the guy but I would have to at least put him top 5 from a completely un-bias standpoint


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## Godless1

Here are the complete top 5's:

Skip Bayless:

1. Dwyane Wade
2. Dirk Nowitzki
3. Kobe Bryant
4. Kevin Durant
5. Carmelo Anthony

Rob Parker:

1. Dirk Nowitzki
2. Dwyane Wade
3. Derrick Rose
4. Kevin Durant
5. Zach Randolph

Neither list has LeBron, Chris Paul, or Dwight Howard; therefore, neither of this clowns should ever be allowed to talk about basketball again.


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## fonz

For me,the top 5 is:
Dirk
Dwight
LBJ
D-Wade
D-Rose


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## i just want luv

Ima have to say

*2011 NBA Season ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Edit 7/7/11 Overall Best*
1.Dwight,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 1.LeBron 
2.LeBron ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,2.DWade
3.Dwade ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,3.Dwight
4.Rose ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,4.Dirk
5.Carmelo ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,5.Carmelo
6.Dirk ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,6.Rose
7.Kobe ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 7.Kobe
8.Durant,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 8.Chris Pual
9. Amare Stoudemire ,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 9. Durant
10. Chris Pual,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,10. Amare Stat


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## Godless1

i just want luv said:


> Ima have to say
> 
> *2011 NBA Season ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,If People stayed on their own team*
> 1.Dwight,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 1.LeBron
> 2.LeBron ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,2.DWade
> 3.Dwade ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,3.Dwight
> 4.Rose ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,4.D Rose
> 5.Carmelo ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,5.Carmelo
> 6.Dirk ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,6.Dirk
> 7.Kobe ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 7.Kobe
> 8.Durant,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 8.Durant
> 9. Amare Stoudemire ,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 9. Amare Stoudemire
> 10. Chris Pual,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,10. Chris Pual


Derrick Rose is not better than Chris Paul and Carmelo is not better than Dirk, and, despite his finals performance, LeBron is still #1. Not bad lists, though.


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## i just want luv

IM Dyyyyyyyyyyyyyiiiiinnnnnnggggg of boredommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


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## cousin corona

Guess I have to shake things up.

melo>>kevin durant


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## i just want luv

thats true. Defense is the only reason Melo is the odd man out for best player.


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## i just want luv

lmfao!!


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## josh23

Top 5

1. Lebron
2. Dwight
3. Dirk
4. Wade
5. D-rose


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## ATCQ

My Top 5:

1. Dirk Nowitzki
2. Kevin Durant
3. Derrick Rose
4. Kobe Bryant
5. Carmelo Anthony


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## Godless1

I know D. Rose won the MVP, but would you really take him over Chris Paul?

FTR, my top 5:

1. LeBron
2. Dwight Howard
3. Dirk Nowitzki
4. Chris Paul
5. Dwayne Wade

Honorable mention- Kevin Durant, Derrick Rose, and Kobe.


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## Toad Licker

Lockout! :cry


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## thespider

top 10

1. bron
2. dwight
3. wade
4. dirk
5 kobe
6 cp3
7 dwillams
8 rose
9 melo
10 durant


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## Mr. SandMan

Tha f**kkk..

Dirk is that man. S**tted all over the Heat.

My prediction was completely wrong btw..

But nobody can guard Dirk, and he has a bench though. Dirk's a shooter. Shooters don't always bang nine out of ten every half. But true superstars show up when they need to. and DIRK DID THAT EVERY TIME. To say Lebron is the best in the league is incorrect. The playoffs spoke for themselves.

Lebron couldn't shoot his way out of a wet paper bag wide open. He showed some signs. But as soon as the big show rolled around, he didn't do anything superstar-esq.

Dirk is that man. He's the best in the league. NOBODY can guard him. To add insult to injury, they had Jason Kidd guarding Lebron James. Jason is listed as 6'5, he may or may not be, but that team had confidence to him on James. James is not a superstar. Superstars show up when they need to, no superstar says, this is from the press conference after the loss of the finals. "Well sometimes they go in and sometimes they don't." No, superstars in the NBA find a way to put the ball in the hole when they HAVE to, it's never, 'oh, sometimes they go sometimes they don't.' Superstars find a way to win. Dirk showed up in the fourth, that's all he needed to do. He has role players, bench players. The Heat don't.

I actually have mixed feelings about Lebron and David Stern tbh. Stern marketed the NBA around Lebron James. I almost feel bad for him. He's been MARKETED as the best player in the league. This is about to be his 9th year, and he still doesn't have a ring. And the way the offseason talk has been, the East isn't going to do anything but get deeper with better teams. The West does what they do.

But Lebron is a dissapointment. His go to move is drive to the basket. That is every third graders go to move. He is a grown man. The boy has talent, but his jumper is completely broke. He needs a go to shot, like Dirk, like Jordan, like Kobe, like Bird .. I mean the list goes on. Unless he developes a consistant jumper and confidence to pull it when he NEEDS to, he'll never be the player he is marketed to be.

GO MAVS, GREAT WHITE HOPE.


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## Mr. SandMan

dirk
dwight
rose
durant
kobe​


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## fm5827

Godless1 said:


> Here are the complete top 5's:
> 
> Skip Bayless:
> 
> 1. Dwyane Wade
> 2. Dirk Nowitzki
> 3. Kobe Bryant
> 4. Kevin Durant
> 5. Carmelo Anthony
> 
> Rob Parker:
> 
> 1. Dirk Nowitzki
> 2. Dwyane Wade
> 3. Derrick Rose
> 4. Kevin Durant
> 5. Zach Randolph
> 
> Neither list has LeBron, Chris Paul, or Dwight Howard; therefore, neither of this clowns should ever be allowed to talk about basketball again.


Yeah that is completely ridiculous, I like Zbo but come on top 5?? I dont know about that. It also kills me the amount of people that think Rose is better than Chris Paul.


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## fm5827

Godless1 said:


> I know D. Rose won the MVP, but would you really take him over Chris Paul?
> 
> FTR, my top 5:
> 
> 1. LeBron
> 2. Dwight Howard
> 3. Dirk Nowitzki
> 4. Chris Paul
> 5. Dwayne Wade
> 
> Honorable mention- Kevin Durant, Derrick Rose, and Kobe.


I can't argue with that at all, I think you've got it spot on.


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## purplefruit

Yao is retiring...what a shame


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## foe

Eliza said:


> Yao is retiring...what a shame


Sad to see him retire so early but it was expected after missing the last 2 seasons. And when he was putting 22-25 points a game he only played half of those seasons.

His foot couldn't handle his giant body.


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## Vip3r

Very sad . I was hoping he would be able to make a comeback.


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## General Shy Guy

Sad to see Yao retire. With health, he would have had a good 5-6 seasons of quality basketball left in him. Shame he never got passed the semis.


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## mixolydian

Good luck in retirement Yao, one of my favourite ever players. 

I hope the strain he's put on his body over the years doesn't give him too much grief post-basketball.


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## S.T.A.T.

The lockout's been on since over 1 week from this post.

What's up with Deron going to Turkey?

What are your thoughts on the lockout?

Random thoughts from me:

I always thought the downfall of the league was that it had too many teams with mediocre getting paid way more that they deserve.

I hated the concept of the draft. It's so socialistic and paradoxically the NBA is in America, which is a capitalistic country. Getting the number 1 pick and eventually letting that player go.

Truth is players should be allowed to play with any team they want. There is no such thing as the NCAA draft.


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## mixolydian

Then you'd get what happens in European soccer and have the championship be competed for by about three teams while everyone else battles mediocrity. 

The lockout sucks because I miss basketball but if it helps fix the league then so be it. 

It's cool that Deron is going to Turkey, I'm sure plenty of others will join him in Europe, will make a decent substitute during the lockout. It may also teach some Americans that their league isn't as far ahead of others as they may think.


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