# Amphetamines- THE only true solution



## GoldfishYum (Mar 16, 2011)

You psychiatrists that continuously prescribe these jokes such as SSRIs and the God-awful Benzos aren't doing us any good. Downers don't make us more inclined to be social, they make us more inclined to SLEEP. Nice solution; now we aren't even motivated to go out let alone practice social interaction.

Prescribe ADDERALL for social anxiety, PLEASE. I'm tired of having to buy it off friends when it should be medically approved for this disorder. Having said that, allow me to go into my argument:

When you put a person on amphetamine-based drugs, it stimulates the body and mind. Through that stimulation it becomes hard NOT to want to go out and be social. THrough all the self-medicating I've done this has proven to be the most effective solution to my extreme social anxiety. I do not have ADD/ADHD, so it makes the motivation and good feeling work so perfectly.

Guess what else is helpful? Yep, ladies and gentlemen we've just tied one POSITIVE trait to that "awful" drug known as crystal meth. This stuff is the ultimate motivator for everything one could ever hope to achieve but for whatever reason just can't seem to do on their own. I've never felt so free to talk openly to anyone in my life. I've had so many deep and meaningful conversations on this stuff that would have never existed without it. I use it occasionally - meaning not to get "high" for fun, but solely as a tool when I know I must be the sociable person that I naturally am not. I've gone to college classes on it, work on it; everywhere. It doesn't make you shake the way you'd be misled to believe once you learn to control it which is very simple. Put those ridiculous prescriptions in the garbage and try something new. If your social anxiety is as bad as mine, chances are you're already at the point where you'd literally try anything to experience life without fear, even if only for a few days. (Yeah, first few times you're not gonna sleep for at least 48+ hours even off a single line, don't get scared.)

That example is extreme to most, so I'd recommend trying to get ahold of normal amphetamine first. I HIGHLY recommend these types of drug if medication is what you're turning to for this problem. This is for people that have it BAD and I mean BAD like I do. When social anxiety affects your life to the point where its holding you back you do need something to help. You can't go on letting chances to succeed pass you by like not talking to the girl of your dreams or applying for a job, even being too nervous to walk in front of class to turn in an assignment that's late. Help yourself get motivated, not fall asleep and miss out even more.


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## JohnG (Sep 3, 2010)

I agree, apart some opioids, no other meds worked so good for SA/OCD/Dep. as amphetamine does.

Btw, SSRI in low doses, can be useful too.


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

well it is true that racemic and meth amphetamine are basically the same at lower doses, but still id avoid meth and stick with amp pills that are clean and uncut and legal...


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

I have never used amphetamines regularly, after leaving a big city. But I had a long affair with ephedra, which is a bit alike and available where I am now. It was stimulating and extremely pro-social, nice for parties. I gave it up because of severe hangovers (fatigue, depression etc), that eventually started to appear even after low doses. Stimulants may exhaust the reserves of catecholamines.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I agree that amphetamine is an excellent treatment for social anxiety, however it needs to be combined with something like memantine to counteract the tolerance issues, wich otherwise occur rapidly to the prosocial effects.


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## LALoner (Dec 3, 2008)

broflovski said:


> I have never used amphetamines regularly, after leaving a big city. But I had a long affair with ephedra, which is a bit alike and available where I am now. It was stimulating and extremely pro-social, nice for parties. I gave it up because of severe hangovers (fatigue, depression etc), that eventually started to appear even after low doses. Stimulants may exhaust the reserves of catecholamines.


Does ephedra cross the blood-brain barrier?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

broflovski said:


> Stimulants may exhaust the reserves of catecholamines.


Do they tough? Afaik monoamine depletion is a measure of neurotoxiticy.


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

LALoner said:


> Does ephedra cross the blood-brain barrier?


Ephedra alkaloids (ephedrine/pseudoephedrine, norephedrine etc) do cross it, but not nearly as efficient as their relatives without hydroxy-group in beta-position of chain (metamphetamine and amphetamine respectively). And they are not as effective in dopamine reuptake inhibition, being mostly noradrenergic.... But NE transporters capture also some dopamine (in prefrontal cortex as I remember), and this is the main reason why ephedra is slightly dopaminergic.


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

crayzyMed said:


> Do they tough? Afaik monoamine depletion is a measure of neurotoxiticy.


I have rather vague picture of it. It may be about terminology. Neurotoxiticy is mostly cell death as I understand, that is irreversible damage. Depletion is exhaustion of something after abnormal forced release of it, that exceeds the short-term ability of synthesis/restoring function.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Yes, but in animal dosels when checking wheter a substance is neurotoxic they check wheter they cause monoamine depletion, if that occurs in non neurotoxic conditions, that would be a rather bad way to measure neurotoxiticy.


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

crayzyMed said:


> Yes, but in animal dosels when checking wheter a substance is neurotoxic they check wheter they cause monoamine depletion, if that occurs in non neurotoxic conditions, that would be a rather bad way to measure neurotoxiticy.


Do they check it long-term or short-term? Then, say, dopamine-producing cells die, it causes permanent "monoamine depletion" and it is certainly indicator of neurotoxicity. But they'd better measure it after some period. 
At the same time (maybe it's too arithmetical approach) we may always indicate that degree of wasting/releasing of something, that can't be immediately compensated with synthesis. There is nothing unimaginable in this kind of "depletion", but it is reversible as any exhaustion of reserves, and no cell death occurs.


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## Raidiant (Dec 14, 2009)

I am so SICK of hearing how well amphetamines work since there is no chance in helll I can get hold of it lol. In fact I am almost 100% sure they are awesome for SA.


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## Nogy (Feb 13, 2011)

Its interesting to hear how well amphetamines seem to work for you guys. Wish that was the case with me, but it isnt. The first time i took adderall i was in love with it, for the first few hours anyways. But after i come down i get even more anxiety than normal...and taking another dose after the first one just makes the anxiety worse, i can never get back that first rush of euphoria again


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Nogy said:


> Its interesting to hear how well amphetamines seem to work for you guys. Wish that was the case with me, but it isnt. The first time i took adderall i was in love with it, for the first few hours anyways. But after i come down i get even more anxiety than normal...and taking another dose after the first one just makes the anxiety worse, i can never get back that first rush of ephoria again


That is normal without a nmda antagonist, without memantine it only works for 2 hours, after that only increased anxiety or even depression.


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## FrenchGuy (Mar 17, 2011)

There is so no adderall in my country :/, there is only Ritalin and it works but its not perfect.


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## Noca (Jun 24, 2005)

Omg Addy ftw!


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## skylerx (Mar 17, 2011)

If you're an alcoholic, don't take amphetamines of any kind, or you WILL shake, and will drink more, to ease the shaking!


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## beaches09 (Feb 1, 2009)

Well done bro, well said, cheers


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## euphoria (Jan 21, 2009)

It can be hard to draw the line between treating social anxiety and/or anhedonia, and chasing a utopian, unnatural alpha-male personality fuelled by a constantly hypomanic mood. The latter is more hedonism/better-living-through-chemistry than legitimate mood disorder treatment, arguably, and anyway my experience = it's very hard to sustain euphoria/hypomania for longer than a month or so consistently.

/$0.02 from someone who's been there


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

euphoria said:


> It can be hard to draw the line between treating social anxiety and/or anhedonia, and chasing a utopian, unnatural alpha-male personality fuelled by a constantly hypomanic mood. The latter is more hedonism/better-living-through-chemistry than legitimate mood disorder treatment, arguably, and anyway my experience = it's very hard to sustain euphoria/hypomania for longer than a month or so consistently.
> 
> /$0.02 from someone who's been there


What? sustainable hypomania for more then a month? Dont that several times, gimme my 2 cents!:b


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## AussiePea (Mar 27, 2007)

Ssri and benzo helped me more or less overcome my sa.....


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## euphoria (Jan 21, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> What? sustainable hypomania for more then a month? Dont that several times, gimme my 2 cents!:b


That's why I said very hard, not impossible, ha. Antiglutamatergic agents can help this be possible, but getting the right regimen/dosing of those requires trial and error (not even leading to success for me...).


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## jimbo1 (Dec 26, 2010)

caffeine/ephedra combination works like a charm for my sa . Its been a cure-all , its lessens my anxiety ,gives me motivation , and it allows me to actually socialize. those prescription medications prescribed for sa is no match in comparison.


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## NikNak31 (Feb 25, 2011)

GoldfishYum said:


> You psychiatrists that continuously prescribe these jokes such as SSRIs and the God-awful Benzos aren't doing us any good. Downers don't make us more inclined to be social, they make us more inclined to SLEEP. Nice solution; now we aren't even motivated to go out let alone practice social interaction.
> 
> Prescribe ADDERALL for social anxiety, PLEASE. I'm tired of having to buy it off friends when it should be medically approved for this disorder. Having said that, allow me to go into my argument:
> 
> ...


The street drug version works quite well but the come down is nasty. SO not a long term fix.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

euphoria said:


> That's why I said very hard, not impossible, ha. Antiglutamatergic agents can help this be possible, but getting the right regimen/dosing of those requires trial and error (not even leading to success for me...).


Yes its all trial and error, the agents i found succesfull long term hypomania with are GHB and 2CD, wich would be other substances for other ppl.


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## FrenchGuy (Mar 17, 2011)

The best drug is still cocaine I think. But it's so expensive...


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Never really liked cocaine tbh.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

Good luck getting decent purity coke anywhere outside of South America...


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

yeah and illegal, you would not wanna get caught with it, the fine is quite large
although in new zealand the drug *P* which is psuedaephidrine and ephedrine if its manufactured and produced in a lab but yeah its basically crystal meth its just called P here. Amphetamine psychosis does not sound nice at all, i also do not think stimulants like Ritain and Adderall help my SA and i would not risk it anyway since the ritalin had such bad effects on me and given the fact its also extremely addictive, its hard enough being on antidepressants that are impossible to withdraw from


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## InterestinglyInteresting (May 7, 2010)

i was thinking of trying amphetamine but i better wait. i think my ssri is actually causing me to be hypomanic but i dont know why this would be as it should be reducing dopamine :sus


another night with NO SLEEP lol


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

Arisa1536 said:


> yeah and illegal, you would not wanna get caught with it, the fine is quite large
> although in new zealand the drug *P* which is psuedaephidrine and ephedrine if its manufactured and produced in a lab but yeah its basically crystal meth its just called P here. Amphetamine psychosis does not sound nice at all, i also do not think stimulants like Ritain and Adderall help my SA and i would not risk it anyway since the ritalin had such bad effects on me and given the fact its also extremely addictive, its hard enough being on antidepressants that are impossible to withdraw from


If you're walking around with street stuff, it's pretty illegal yeah. I doubt most police are gonna care about somebody with a few prescription Dexies. Amphetamine psychosis is caused by a combination of sleep deprivation and extreme abuse, btw, not therapeutic doses.


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

Duke of Prunes said:


> If you're walking around with street stuff, it's pretty illegal yeah. I doubt most police are gonna care about somebody with a few prescription Dexies. Amphetamine psychosis is caused by a combination of sleep deprivation and extreme abuse, btw, not therapeutic doses.


okay cool thanks 
i don't know much about the stuff but i know psuedaephidrine was amazing for hayfever until they took it off the market here in new zealand and u cannot import it because its used to make "P" here :s its a pain though because it was so good for hay fever and gave u a boost of energy and social skills
got me through bad days at high school lol


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

Pseudoephedrine is just a precursor to meth, it's not that great itself.


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## FrenchGuy (Mar 17, 2011)

Duke of Prunes said:


> Good luck getting decent purity coke anywhere outside of South America...


There is no difference in effect, you just need to take more to feel the same. That's why I said it's expensive.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

You really don't want to be putting some of the cuts up your nose though.


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## dudinator (Mar 10, 2011)

Rasagiline + DLPA. Anxiolytic, intelligent, witty, charming... ya I'm "high" on that and life right now! Hopefully Memantine works for tolerance!


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## Recipe For Disaster (Jun 8, 2010)

i tried dexamphetamine last weekend and it certainly did wonders for making me want to talk to people. i still had anxiety but i was able to think of things to say so much more easily and conversation was enjoyable rather than a chore. i was awake 48 hours though. also, i feel bad about needing to be buzzed to socialize, it feels like cheating to me knowing i couldn't have done it without the drug. does anyone else feel this way? thats a major disadvantage of using meds for me. i'll never feel like i'm over social anxiety if i need to take drugs to talk to people, even if it works.

if youre gonna take drugs though, i think amphetamines and opiates both work pretty well. i like opiates a lot better but i am pretty sure opiate addiction doesn't lead to anything good, so i'm doing my best to keep them occasional.


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## Raidiant (Dec 14, 2009)

I know 100% what you mean on the few times i was on mephedrone I felt exactly the same way, even though I was the most prosocial douche I ever dreamed to be for a few hours, it never felt as rewarding as overcoming my fear of walking into a prada shop or something. 

I have a feeling the comedown is a big factor in not feeling great about it, as if you did it naturally you would never feel depressed and super antisocial, its just a much more natural feat.

I guess thats just life ain't it, people who don't have SA don't feel its an amazing feat to talk to people, well i'm sure your brain always balances it out somehow.

I just tend to have really positive feelings attached to the drug and yes it does feel like I cheated, even I remember how good it was.

Thats why in a way....I guess SSRIs are not as bad as people make them out to be, unlike a drug induced social high, when I achieved something social on SSRI I still felt the reward naturally. If that makes sense, of course because my awesome creativity is too important for my work, it will be a while before I go on an SSRI again. 

edit: and there is the issue of never enough, when you achieve something naturally its always "enough" you always know you have moved on step ahead (at least it feels that way anyway, in fact the truth is its so hard to move a step so every time you make a little one u feel great even u snap back to your old self instantly)

for example I recently take xanax on ocassions, now I realize removing my baseline anxiety is not enough, yet its also making the days I don't take it 400% worse even i'm just how I am anyways. I feel like I could also do with more, chasing this feeling is something I want but not all the time.


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## UltraShy (Nov 8, 2003)

Raidiant said:


> I am so SICK of hearing how well amphetamines work since there is no chance in helll I can get hold of it lol. In fact I am almost 100% sure they are awesome for SA.


If it cured SA I'd have left this board back in January 2010 when I started dextroamphetamine.

Helps: yes. Cure: not even close.


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## GummieBear (Nov 13, 2010)

*So True*



FrenchGuy said:


> The best drug is still cocaine I think. But it's so expensive...


*I believe coke is a god sent.....I do believe in self medicating through my own trial and errors . From the scrips I had that did absolutly nothing but keep me sleepy and incoherent..........Coke came in like a super hero and gave me life...I totally agree with the OP but at the same time for anyone reading this Coke and Crystal Meth has terrible come downs you will need it pretty much everyday or every other day to maintain that feeling.......and a lot of money*



Duke of Prunes said:


> You really don't want to be putting some of the cuts up your nose though.


*This also true due to all the crack downs in the columbian coca fields , they are distributing out coke that is already cut before it is shiped out of columbia. Most cuts are not usally dangerous they just mess up a perfect high but some or cutting their coke with *_*levamisole , in horses it metabolizes as speed but in humans this contaminant critically reduces a person's white blood cells, causing a condition known as agranulocytosis, where the affected person loses ability to fight infection. This is what they found in Dj AM's when he passed away..............*_


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## LALoner (Dec 3, 2008)

Assuming the OP is right I wonder if this means that epinephrine is the key to depersonalization related disorders. Obviously serotonin related meds help many with depression. Benzos are the best for anxiety. So maybe epinephrine is the transmitter important to problems like depersonalization and socializing problems apart from the anxiety which benzos deal with.


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

UltraShy said:


> If it cured SA I'd have left this board back in January 2010 when I started dextroamphetamine.
> 
> Helps: yes. Cure: not even close.


have opiates ever helped you out of curiousity?

also i kno you said dex gave you a mood boost and no increase in motivation at all which is atypical for sure. i myself have this reaction and have noticed the reaction in many people with predominately negative symptoms of schizophrenia.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

bben said:


> have opiates ever helped you out of curiousity?
> 
> also i kno you said dex gave you a mood boost and no increase in motivation at all which is atypical for sure. i myself have this reaction and have noticed the reaction in many people with predominately negative symptoms of schizophrenia.


Ive seen this often with poeple that have social anxiety too, interestingly they do get motivated of AMT wich also releases serotonine, altough the reports are very limited (mine and one of a friend).


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## bben (Oct 24, 2009)

crayzyMed said:


> Ive seen this often with poeple that have social anxiety too, interestingly they do get motivated of AMT wich also releases serotonine, altough the reports are very limited (mine and one of a friend).


yes i would like to try AMT i havent had any serotonin release since i dosed dex very high. im pretty sure opiates also induce some serotonin release at higher doses. get on chat wesley.


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## Think_For_Yourself (Dec 7, 2010)

How about this; L-Tryptophan.

This is the closest you'll get to having a simple cure without the horrendous side effects and withdrawal symptoms.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sophieness07 said:


> OP and many others on this thread- you are incredibly irresponsible. INCREDIBLY. Do what you want to yourself but I think it's BS to recommend others use speed for SA.


There is nothing irresponsible about this at all, you are also making the connection with speed (amphetamine abuse) wich has no relevance to therapeutic use of those meds (example is amphetamine for ADHD).


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sophieness07 said:


> no many on this thread are talking about street drugs like crystal and cocaine which are drugs of abuse. not to mention your numerous posts of various street drugs from a to z. Drugs which cause addiction even in people who are not taking them to get high, and which are not controlled by a doctor or pharmacy for dosing and which ruin people's lives and their minds. I've done drugs. I've done speed before, etc etc. I was a teenager. But to recommend it to other people who are trying to improve their lives and become healthier I think is absurd and yeah, totally irresponsible. It's like seeing people recommend heroin for headache problems. There is no black and white line between using drugs therapeutically and using them abusively. No one starts out as a drug addict.


I see it as giving them a ability for recovery, which gives them a chance to actually recover rather then stay in misery, besides that i never recommend stimulants without NMDA antagonists to prevent tolerance issues, dose escalation wich in turns leads to bad withdrawals when trying to stop etc.

What would you prefer? Something like happened to my mum, given antipsychotic under medical guidance so she now has a possible permanent movement disorder and can barely talk? And do you think ppl cant abuse meds when prescribed?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

> No one starts out as a drug addict.


Actually many do as a form of self medication.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Look, stimulants are highly beneficial for social anxiety and the only option for many, giving them acces to something that can help them is a good thing, addiction can accor, but would the risk be higher by allowing normal ppl to buy beer everywhere? Nope

Your acting like everyone here is gonna get hooked on my suggestions.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

sophieness07 said:


> OP and many others on this thread- you are incredibly irresponsible. INCREDIBLY. Do what you want to yourself but I think it's BS to recommend others use speed for SA.


So because people have found medications that work for them, they're irresponsible? Do you think people with ADHD are irresponsible? Some of them take big doses of "speed" every day without incident. Some even take meth (Desoxyn)!

There's nothing wrong with responsible self-medication when none of the commonly prescribed drugs work. Let's face it, 99% of people with SA are going to be offered SSRIs, and if they describe panic, perhaps PRN benzos on top of that. Nothing more. SSRIs show very little efficacy in SA and benzos aren't suitable for long-term use. MAOIs work for some, but most doctors will refuse to prescribe them, and for some the side-effects and restrictions are unacceptable.

So what else is there? There's plenty of evidence that dopaminergic dysfunction is a part of SA, so what do you take for that? Stimulants.

How do you even make the connection between illicit self-medication and drug abuse? Legality means nothing. There's loads of kids who get falsely diagnosed with ADHD because of bad parenting and get stuck on amphetamine, so why shouldn't people who actually benefit from it be allowed to use it?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Adding to that, stimulant treatment has actually been shown to reduce drug abuse in patients with dopaminergic dysfunctioning.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sophieness07 said:


> Whatever. If people want to become speed freaks and alcoholics that's their business. Speed is a nasty drug, it absolutely changes people's personalities for the worse over the long run, I am not going to go along with the crowd or let it be a totally positive conversation about how great crystal meth is when people lose their lives and custody of their children over it every day.


No doubt about that, speed abuse is a terrible thing.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

sophieness07 said:


> Whatever. If people want to become speed freaks and alcoholics that's their business. Alcohol helps SA too, that doesn't make it an appropriate treatment over the long run. Speed is a nasty drug, it absolutely changes people's personalities for the worse over the long run, I am not going to go along with the crowd or let it be a totally positive conversation about how great crystal meth is when people lose their lives and custody of their children over it every day.


Therapeutic use is not the same thing as abuse. As a nurse, you should know this. I'm sure you've given out morphine before for pain relief, does that make all your patients junkies and you a drug dealer? No.


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## euphoria (Jan 21, 2009)

bben said:


> have opiates ever helped you out of curiousity?
> 
> also i kno you said dex gave you a mood boost and no increase in motivation at all which is atypical for sure. i myself have this reaction and have noticed the reaction in many people with predominately negative symptoms of schizophrenia.


I have schizoid PD, and to some extent get this reaction. But forcing myself to do stuff becomes a lot easier.


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## Mr. SandMan (Aug 24, 2007)

I very much disagree. I have taken adderall for about a week straight at one time and it did not help my anxiety at all. I just did a lot more **** because I was speeding balls.

Benzodiazipines are probably the best drug I have ever taken in my life. They suit me very well and help my problems.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Ok, but for many people only stimulants work well for social anxiety, like they work for ADHD, whats wrong with treating SA patients while it would be fine for ADHD?

Yes there is a reason for that, the D4 receptor highly involved in ADHD doesnt downregulate and treatment would work long term, while with social anxiety it is mostly D2 and D3 involved wich do downregulate, thus tolerance will keep growing and growing with bad end results.

Thats where memantine comes in, it prevents this downregulation making the treatment possible, while this is all new, and not mainstream keep in mind the treatment resistance for this disorder.


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## euphoria (Jan 21, 2009)

sophieness07 said:


> OP and many others on this thread- you are incredibly irresponsible. INCREDIBLY. Do what you want to yourself but I think it's BS to recommend others use speed for SA.


That's just a knee-jerk reaction to the mention of taboo drugs. Fact is, many people on here have debilitating SA/other psych disorders that if untreated can make life a living hell, and sometimes lead to suicide. As someone in medicine you must be familiar with weighing risk against benefit. The risks of someone being prescribed stimulants in therapeutic ranges for severe SA (as a last resort, not for average anxious Joe) are pretty much the same as the risks in an ADHD patient. Obviously someone smart thought it was worth the risk in that disorder. If it can work for SA, what is the difference?

But that's about amphetamine in pill form. Hard to justify smoking meth or snorting cocaine for anything other than the buzz - these routes of admin are highly addictive for these things and unnecessary for medical use if a pill form is available.


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## CopadoMexicano (Aug 21, 2004)

Stimimulants I doubt would help my hallucinations


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

Recreational use of stimulants can certainly cause anxiety, yes. MDMA, LSD and weed is debatable. I've found MDMA, weed and shrooms (though not LSD as I've never found any) to be beneficial in the short-term and haven't had any negative effects in the long-term. Irresponsible use of any substance carries risks, but there's such a thing as responsible recreational use regardless of what anti-drug loonies tell you. Everybody reacts differently to substances, though. I know people who can't tolerate any weed.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

In my case mdma was dramatically beneficial in the long run, but thats because of the social interactions during the experience and the day after, i know sophieness07 will comment, but what can i say? Its weird what things do wonders for ppl, while they can destroy others.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Actually recommending amphetamine is imo a very important thing that can help a ton of people, you know why they desperately want help? Because they are treatment resistant, and letting them try a stimulant doesnt make them addicted at all, some could get addicted yes but most will just stay with low dosages, enough to fix their disorder.

Or did you forget about ppl that start self medicating with alcohol because they werent able to get a proper treatment?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sophieness07 said:


> yes I forgot about all the wonderful things that happen when people self medicate with alcohol. /end sarcasm


ok


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sophieness07 said:


> there are POSITIVE things in life that can help people feel better you don't need to call them down into the mud. I've known many people on the up and up and many people in a downward spiral and guess which ones were speed users and which ones weren't? no it is not that black and white but by and large they fall into the second category.


Well, thats why i allways said taking stimulants for sa without memantine is stupid.


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## Raidiant (Dec 14, 2009)

Rant time

Sorry to budge in here, but honestly the people who are glad they took mdma, smoked weed, did acid far far far FAR outnumber the people that didn't. I am sorry but you are in the minority.

I can't use alcohol because it makes me red and sick with no benefits, but does that mean I should be on a mission to stop other people using it to socialise. Obviously not.

Besides alchohol and tobacco are waaaayy more widespread and dangerous than any other drugs, my dad has managed to take nearly every drug recreationally and quit, and can't quit smoking, recently he had a heart problem from smoking and he still can't quit.

I know people who need to drink under the table just to feel okay. My friends who are on drinking and smoking are way worse than any of my friends or used to be friends who does ketamine, mdma etc etc.

the MAJORITY of people using amphetamines DON'T die. Thousands of college graduates in rich parts of north America use this drug to get good grades, whilst I somebody who could genuinely use it to get out and live a half decent life is denied it because of some stupid idiot on the top decided they didn't like giving a drug that worked too damn well.

Note with the internet and all most people taking these things are now fully aware of what they are getting into, I doubt people go into it without exhausting every other option,

I've said it before and i'll say it again "NOBODY WANTS TO RELY ON DRUGS" . The internet is far more informative about the negative effects of drugs due to selection bias, than any doctor will admit. Everybody knows the dependency issues and withdrawal issues and so on.

So people want to find out what works, not that they should avoid looking at something that could change their lives.

And if something works for a few years before tolerance happens then so what, it may never happen for some drugs and some people. Then you know what in those few years maybe they are going to have a life they would never have had, made friends, got out of depression and so on.

I love this link :http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2010/09/22/a_life_like_other_peoples_alan_bennett

Alan Bennetts parents lived their whole LIVES with SA (genetic shyness) and killed themselves. ITs heartbreaking story but true, back then there was no meds, no internet, would you rather have it like this?

Now SA is like a tiny insect compared to all the other much much worse illness out there, but I trust people can make the right decisions for themselves, people need to give the resources for them to move on, not deny them information.

Rant off...


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

> Anyone who needs speed to get good grades is an idiot.


Well i couldnt follow the easiest things in school, so must be one of the most idiotic members of sas.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

So you're implying that people with ADHD are idiots, despite the fact that it doesn't have anything to do with intelligence, *sophieness07*?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

What makes them idiots? If they want to live that way, let them, they atleast study.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Well, i'm doing what i beleive is the right thing, and no-one will stop me


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

sophieness07 said:


> no I'm saying people who use it illegally so they can party and then stay up for three nights in a row to finish their schoolwork are idiots.


So what's the difference between treating ADHD with amphetamine and treating SA with amphetamine, in your eyes?


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

I'm addicted to amphetamine myself (tough only have it ocasionaly) i'm aware of the dangers.

Yes we have free spreech, and your allways free to add a warning in relevant discussions.


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## belfort (May 3, 2009)

amphetamines are not a cure to SA...they do however work very well for a short amount of time.they also have a few side effects that i dislike, the crash, increased irritability, sweats....of course these side effects can be remedied by taking benzos or meantine but those drugs also carry their own set of side effects...so you are constantly fighting a battle of optimizing the good and minimizing the bad by taking more drugs usually..i find it very hard to believe that using these drug cocktails is going to work long term as in 10-20 years down the road..then again, it might but are there any anecdotal reports that this is the way to beat these social disorders??im sure the folks doing these cocktails are not going to go around bragging about it either so its really hard to say..

i have accomplished many positive things on amphetamines...they are very powerful when it comes to promoting pro-social effects in me...i have also suffered from many crashes and 'down times' after they wear off...i have never taken memantine so maybe that would be the secret solution to making amps work without side effects im not sure..

it is true though that many ssris and other scribed SA drugs just simply dont work for many people...the problem is, stimulants seem to be the only thing that truly helps these people so who am i or you to say they shouldnt be able to take them??as long as they know the risks i say let them experiment..if they can get a few hours of SA-free moments from a stimulant that they cant seem to get from any other drug or therapy session, then i say go for it...


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

sophieness07 said:


> in my eyes...if people want to take amphetamine for adhd that's their business. but like I said, I don't think it's a healthy drug and I wouldn't give it to my own kids if my kids had adhd. anecdotal evidence means nothing except to someone on a personal level, *but the one guy I dated who had taken amphetamines for most of his life for adhd was pretty much a sociopath and I think the amphetamines played a big role.*


I hope you also realise this is just a wild gues.


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## Duke of Prunes (Jul 20, 2009)

Drugs don't change people, they just exaggerate certain characteristics that are already there. Stimulants tend to bring out violence in violent people.


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## belfort (May 3, 2009)

oh and stimulants arent the ultimate SA relief imo..that title would go to GHb  in my humble opinion of course..


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## belfort (May 3, 2009)

^^oh please, for those 2 examples i could give you hundreds of positive ones...with every drug comes risks, its up to that individual to decide whether its worth it or not..ghb has probably been the most stigmatized drug in history...


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

Haha, in the us they keep rambling about "the date rape drug".


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## T-Bone (Oct 1, 2010)

i totally disagree about amphetamines being helpful for SA. i mean i know everyones different, but speeds make 100 times more phobic about everything. and theyre just annoying. some people say they get some euphoria from speeds, but its always been extreme dysphoria for me. lying in bed staring at the ceiling struggling to sleep does nothing to calm me down. and my heart racing when im around people doesnt help either. it just takes my SA and magnifies it. the only one cure for me is a very large dose of opiates. this is one of the reasons i became a heroin addict at a younger age. first it was out of curiosity, but i then noticed and TOTAL elimination of SA and a WANTING to engage in social activity. and although benzos are no miracle drug i think theyd work FOR ME way better than any speed.


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## crayzyMed (Nov 2, 2006)

SomebodyWakeME said:


> i totally disagree about amphetamines being helpful for SA. i mean i know everyones different, but speeds make 100 times more phobic about everything. and theyre just annoying. some people say they get some euphoria from speeds, but its always been extreme dysphoria for me. lying in bed staring at the ceiling struggling to sleep does nothing to calm me down. and my heart racing when im around people doesnt help either. it just takes my SA and magnifies it. the only one cure for me is a very large dose of opiates. this is one of the reasons i became a heroin addict at a younger age. first it was out of curiosity, but i then noticed and TOTAL elimination of SA and a WANTING to engage in social activity. and although benzos are no miracle drug i think theyd work FOR ME way better than any speed.


Indeed, differend ppl respond to differend things.


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

^^ Agreed
For me, benzos work better too for SA, i get very antisocial on anything that speeds me up as it increases my anxiety. Amphetamines are not the solution to Social Anxiety BUT they do help some people and people with severe ADHD benefit from Adderal and Ritalin, yeah i know its not direct amphetamine but it still speeds you up and heightens alertness 

SomebodyWakeME: have u asked or considered trying benzos for your SA?


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## T-Bone (Oct 1, 2010)

Arisa1536 said:


> ^^ Agreed
> For me, benzos work better too for SA, i get very antisocial on anything that speeds me up as it increases my anxiety. Amphetamines are not the solution to Social Anxiety BUT they do help some people and people with severe ADHD benefit from Adderal and Ritalin, yeah i know its not direct amphetamine but it still speeds you up and heightens alertness
> 
> SomebodyWakeME: have u asked or considered trying benzos for your SA?


yes ive been taking klonopin for a little over a month now..after going to countless doctors before i found one who would perscribe. i used to do adderall, adipex, coke/crack, meth, ritilin and all of that when i was a teen. the anxiety didnt seem to bother me as much back then. but i grew more anti social and secluded , and found opiates, my cure i thought, after that simulants got me into a panik just thinking about them.


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## Arisa1536 (Dec 8, 2009)

Thanks for sharing your experiences *SomebodyWakeME* because i have only tried prescription medication (not always obtained it legally) but i have not tried the drugs you have and i see that the anxiety was not a big issue when you were a teenager so perhaps the SA is worse as you entered adulthood? for me it was the reverse so my SA started improving as i entered my late teens, early twenties but i had meds since the age of 17 and pain killers since 15 for sleep and anxiety but they did nothing for SA

I am glad benzos work for you and they are a safer option than coke/meth and heroin lol obviously and they hopefully will be all you will need to ease your anxiety and stop the SA, cloanzepam i was told, is given to people coming off or who have been on more hardcore drugs as its a longer lasting more potent benzodiazipine than lorazepam and diazepam and its longer lasting than its twin Xanax because even though they have the same high potency, Xanax leaves your system to quickly whereas Klonopin can last up to 50 hours. All the best 

I was on them for a year and a half, i wish my doctor did not abruptly stop and start me on them and then stop me cold turkey because i have serious issues now and need to go to a drug rehabilitation centre once a week for diazepam but hey its better than going cold turkey and trying to kill myself or someone else


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## jimmythekid (Apr 26, 2010)

A lot of people do meth to be productive or something like that but those people don't get any less addicted than the ones who just do it to get high.


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## broflovski (Feb 1, 2011)

crayzyMed said:


> Do they tough? Afaik monoamine depletion is a measure of neurotoxiticy.


Tachyphylaxis has appeared to be the thing that I mean. Something more close to desensitization, not to neurotoxiticy.


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## michael10364 (Feb 4, 2011)

*cyproheptadine*

i want someone else to try cyproheptadine for adderall tolerance.. it worked amazingly for me! and i wanna hear about it when it helps you! write me!


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## David L (Jan 22, 2012)

Nogy said:


> Its interesting to hear how well amphetamines seem to work for you guys. Wish that was the case with me, but it isnt. The first time i took adderall i was in love with it, for the first few hours anyways. But after i come down i get even more anxiety than normal...and taking another dose after the first one just makes the anxiety worse, i can never get back that first rush of euphoria again


I had the same problem. I also found it hard to not overdo them...skipping a night, increased anxiety...


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